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Brexit

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KingstonMariner
September 5, 2019, 11:11pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Maringer


I just hope we end up with some kind of proper electoral reform so we can have a grown up electoral system like most of the rest of the world.


Were you spying on my texts last night to my unhinged Brexiteer friend? (He's a nice bloke, heart of gold and I love him to bits, but he comes up with some odd things now and again).

The funny side of it is, it's been the rabid Brexiteers nemesis the Lib-Dems arguing for electoral reform for decades.


Through the door there came familiar laughter,
I saw your face and heard you call my name.
Oh my friend we're older but no wiser,
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
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Marinerz93
September 6, 2019, 9:37am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Maringer


Kinnock's dream is to be Blair Mk. II. Parachuted into a safe seat through patronage (no previous involvement in British politics as he'd been living in Europe for years). Calculating, untrustworthy and he was desperate for his own party to do badly in 2017 as he was expecting to be given a leg up in the aftermath. Pretty hilarious to see his reaction when the exit polls showed it was unlikely that there would be a Tory majority. Here's his wife (former Danish PM) giving him a bollocking telling him to get it together immediately before he went on air for an interview:

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/everything-learned-stephen-kinnock-politics-13931165

Like something from The Thick of It.

I certainly wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.


Thanks for the info, thought I'd ask as I didn't know much about him before I saw him speaking the other evening in parliament and thought he came across very well. The last thing we need is Blairites getting back in control of the labour party.


Supporting the Mighty Mariners for over 30 years, home town club is were the heart and soul is and it's great to be a part of it.

Jesus’ disciple Peter, picked up a fish to get the tribute money from it, Jesus left his thumb print on the fish, bless'ed is the Haddock.
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GollyGTFC
September 6, 2019, 9:57am Report to Moderator

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It's funny. If BoJo is so confident he'll win a majority at an election why is he touring Conservative held marginals and not touring target seats. Gives the impression they think it's a battle to cling on to seats rather than win additional ones.
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Marinerz93
September 6, 2019, 10:06am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from GollyGTFC


No one is disputing that the Tories will be the biggest party, but they only have the DUP (Max 10 MPs) to prop them up. The stop the Tories coalition that could prop up Labour can call on Lib Dem (15 +MPs), SNP (35+ MPs), PC (4+ MPs) & Greens (min 1 MP).

Being the biggest party is irrelevant if you can’t command a majority in the House of Commons.


If there was a general election on the 18th October, Farage would put candidates in all seats and if the EU elections are anything to go by, Labour in the north stand to lose out to them if that were to happen. I saw on Question time the other night that the Conservatives won't join with the Brexit party but if the Brexit party stands and wins a fair few seats what is the odds that they would change their view to become a majority and stop a Labour / Lib Dem/ greens, and SNP coalition. The welsh in the main voted to leave so maybe Plaid Cymru will take a hit too.

For democracy to work, the losers have to consent and they never have, they may say they have but their actions say otherwise. We will not leave on 31st October and we are putting the EU back in charge for when we leave if Boris is forced to ask for an extension, that's if they agree to an extension but it could come with a caveat that it will be for x amount of extra years at x amount of millions. Why should MP's ask for an extension, they have already had over 2 years.

Personally I want a deal that allows us as a sovereign nation to make our own laws, regulations and buy goods and services from anywhere in the world without someone in Brussels saying no if it effects their members.

Corbyn has been asking for a general election for months and now Boris has said ok, lets have won, the Labour party is no where to be seen. If Corbyn has so much conviction in what he is opposing, why doesn't he demand a general election and then if he wins he can over turn the 17.4 million decision to leave and tell the EU we are remaining.

Plenty more twists and turns to come, the main loser so far is democracy, and we'll never see people vote in the numbers they did in the referendum, no matter what they voted for again. Both leave and remain voters have had enough, our politicians are grossly incompetent and do not deserve the £79,468 a year they leech from us.


Supporting the Mighty Mariners for over 30 years, home town club is were the heart and soul is and it's great to be a part of it.

Jesus’ disciple Peter, picked up a fish to get the tribute money from it, Jesus left his thumb print on the fish, bless'ed is the Haddock.
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GollyGTFC
September 6, 2019, 10:27am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Marinerz93


If there was a general election on the 18th October, Farage would put candidates in all seats and if the EU elections are anything to go by, Labour in the north stand to lose out to them if that were to happen. I saw on Question time the other night that the Conservatives won't join with the Brexit party but if the Brexit party stands and wins a fair few seats what is the odds that they would change their view to become a majority and stop a Labour / Lib Dem/ greens, and SNP coalition. The welsh in the main voted to leave so maybe Plaid Cymru will take a hit too.

For democracy to work, the losers have to consent and they never have, they may say they have but their actions say otherwise. We will not leave on 31st October and we are putting the EU back in charge for when we leave if Boris is forced to ask for an extension, that's if they agree to an extension but it could come with a under a caveat that it will be for x amount of extra years at x amount of millions. Why should MP's ask for an extension, they have already had over 2 years.

Personally I want a deal that allows us as a sovereign nation to make our own laws, regulations and buy goods and services from anywhere in the world without someone in Brussels saying no if it effects their members.

Corbyn has been asking for a general election for months and now Boris has said ok, lets have won, the Labour party is no where to be seen. If Corbyn has so much conviction in what he is opposing, why doesn't he demand a general election and then if he wins he can over turn the 17.4 million decision to leave and tell the EU we are remaining.

Plenty more twists and turns to come, the main loser so far is democracy, and we'll never see people vote in the numbers they did in the referendum, no matter what they voted for again. Both leave and remain voters have had enough, our politicians are grossly incompetent and do not deserve the £79,468 a year they leech from us.


Oh please. Really. The Brexit party will win ZERO seats at an election.

And for all Corbyn's faults Labour (and the Lib Dems & SNP) are putting the country first ahead of his party in rejecting an election at this moment in time. Johnson has proved time and time again he is a liar and that he can't be trusted.

I have a theory how this all might play out. Personally I think we'll end up with an election on either 28th November or 5th December after Johnson has failed to get a deal and an extension is forced by parliament.
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Rodley Mariner
September 6, 2019, 10:53am Report to Moderator
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Johnson is going to position the purged Tory party as the Brexit party which might mitigate their threat but if they split the vote it could get Lab/Libs in. Think non-rabid right-wingers are going to need to vote as tactically as possible.
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Maringer
September 6, 2019, 1:03pm Report to Moderator
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The biggest surprise so far is just how inept Johnson's speeches and appearances in the HoC have been. Bad enough that it makes me wonder if it's some kind of an act. Obviously, Johnson has always been a congenital liar, but he's always been pretty slick with it (the bumbling buffoonery was mostly an act). Is he actually cracking up under the pressure of the job and the corner he's been persuaded to paint himself into or is he just trying to present the facade of doing so to try and tempt Labour to agree to an early election?

Possibly a bit too Machiavellian for him as he's a excrement, but I wouldn't have ever said he was a particularly devious excrement. I suppose you never know.
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Marinerz93
September 6, 2019, 1:22pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from GollyGTFC


Oh please. Really. The Brexit party will win ZERO seats at an election.

And for all Corbyn's faults Labour (and the Lib Dems & SNP) are putting the country first ahead of his party in rejecting an election at this moment in time. Johnson has proved time and time again he is a liar and that he can't be trusted.

I have a theory how this all might play out. Personally I think we'll end up with an election on either 28th November or 5th December after Johnson has failed to get a deal and an extension is forced by parliament.


The EU elections say otherwise from a party formed just 6 weeks before the EU election to wipe out most of the political parties, and if they do put candidates up they will win seats in the north and most likely Boston. There are liars on both sides for example Emily Thornberry was ridiculed for what she has said in the past and what she plans to do, and LBC host Iain Dale asked if Thornberry had 'no shame' after revealing Labour's Brexit policy.

Your theory might not be far off the mark, if the surrender Bill is passed and also if the EU accept to extend and what would that extension look like as it will be the EU to dictate terms. Should we see what the terms are before opting for a general election?


Supporting the Mighty Mariners for over 30 years, home town club is were the heart and soul is and it's great to be a part of it.

Jesus’ disciple Peter, picked up a fish to get the tribute money from it, Jesus left his thumb print on the fish, bless'ed is the Haddock.
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GollyGTFC
September 6, 2019, 1:25pm Report to Moderator

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The "rebel alliance" have confirmed they will not back a GE until after the EU council meeting on Thursday 17th October.

Election date likely to be 28th November or 5th December depending whether Boris obeys the instruction to seek an extension once he fails miserably to agree a deal with the EU.
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FishOutOfWater
September 6, 2019, 1:35pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from GollyGTFC
The "rebel alliance" have confirmed they will not back a GE until after the EU council meeting on Thursday 17th October.

Election date likely to be 28th November or 5th December depending whether Boris obeys the instruction to seek an extension once he fails miserably to agree a deal with the EU.


So if he is obliged to ask for an extension, is there any timescale?

Does he go to the EU "cap-in-hand" and say please we need more time and then they decide how much added time there will be or will he have specific instructions from parliament requesting another 3, 6 months or longer, which they will then either need to agree to or not?

I know he's said he rather be "dead in a ditch" but does he have any get out if parliament tells him as our PM, he has to go?

I'm genuinely confused as to what stance he would take......  


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