Artell Out  (triple merged)

Quoted from FishySmithy

So your just making stuff up, not to worry 👏🏻👏🏻

That's par for the course on this forum mate.

Quoted from ginnywings

So, I have to ask, is it going to take a complete change of philosophy and playing style to crack this particular nut and is Artell the man to finally drag us kicking and screaming into the 21st century? It may be that we have to dismantle everything, and try a new approach, which is going down like a sh1t sandwich at the moment with some fans, and it seems some of the players too, although I have no idea if tales of unrest are true.

Maybe this is what it is going to take to finally become an established league side pushing for promotion in the future, but it's going to be a bumpy ride along the way. I hope so, because our continued struggles are getting really tedious now.

I'm hoping that this is the case also; a wholesale change that will mean some very wide-of-the-mark performances whilst we build something fundamentally different which embeds our place in the league.

It's a gamble - like many, I thought it was time for a change from Hurst, although it has to be said, performances weren't particularly bad under Hurst even if we were having a bad run of results. Stockport away, other than the opening 10, was a good performance against a very good side and they won it on an offside goal from a non-foul given as a free kick. Similarly Doncaster away, the performance was not dire. It wasn't good enough, but it wasn't like what Saturday sounds like it was.

I don't think we'd have gone down under Hurst. Historically, even in his successful seasons, we've had rough patches. But it definitely wasn't clicking, and I think we would have lingered in an uninspiring lower-mid table positions, whilst serving up fairly dull matches and not getting the full potential out of the squad.

But I do wonder whether we've taken a big gamble: lower-table finish and uninspiring games are obviously unappealing, but it's more appealing than potentially risking a free-fall if the complete overhaul of approach doesn't go to plan.

Any talk of 'Artell out' is frankly, ridiculous. It would create more instability and would just create a chaotic environment and come across as incredibly rash. Of course the jury is still out on whether he's the right man to turn the tide over the long-term, but he needs a chance to try and do so.

Not to mention, that if Artell was out and we got a new boss in, we'd be paying the salaries of 3 managers at once and 1/2 assistants. Money that we need to invest in the squad, as the owners have already said, 1 out, 1 in, so would this take away from a salary for a new player we need?

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

Not to mention, that if Artell was out and we got a new boss in, we'd be paying the salaries of 3 managers at once and 1/2 assistants. Money that we need to invest in the squad, as the owners have already said, 1 out, 1 in, so would this take away from a salary for a new player we need?

This supposed lack of money is a massive worry for me and a huge handicap to the Club in terms of progress. Back to back record season ticket sales,the fa cup run and Mcatee and Conteh sales should be ample to cover what we look to have spent? Are we really skint and if so why,I could understand it when we were still paying Fenty off but why now?

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

Not to mention, that if Artell was out and we got a new boss in, we'd be paying the salaries of 3 managers at once and 1/2 assistants. Money that we need to invest in the squad, as the owners have already said, 1 out, 1 in, so would this take away from a salary for a new player we need?

We won't be paying PH anything now as he is now in employment. I'm sure someone said he was fully paid off however.

Quoted from 1mickylyons

This supposed lack of money is a massive worry for me and a huge handicap to the Club in terms of progress. Back to back record season ticket sales,the fa cup run and Mcatee and Conteh sales should be ample to cover what we look to have spent? Are we really skint and if so why,I could understand it when we were still paying Fenty off but why now?

What lack of money? We have a fairly large squad, of which many you could imagine are on decent money. We have just paid a fee for a centre back on a three year deal and paid fees for several players in the summer.

It's probably not the same as your Wrexham's, Stockport's and County's because we recognise it has to be sustainable, but I honestly do not understand this 'lack of money' narrative that pops up every time there's an issue. That's just on the field aswell, there's plenty of investment off it aswell.

The one in one out comment makes complete sense. Firstly, don't advertise you don't care about costs and squad sizes and secondly if you're bringing player in it’s sensible to move the others out that they are replacing if they aren't required. Otherwise you're paying money for players that aren't playing and won't get a look in - which is just a massive waste. It's like buying a new car and deciding to keep your old one taxed and insured just for the fun of it - you'd sell it.

Quoted from Hagrid

Have you ever thought that theres more to it.... I have said previously on this forum that Hunt has shown nothing to create the hoo hah some of you seem to have about him.

He went to Oldham, Did nothing, We signed him here, the man who signed him, barely played him, Artell came in, he was brought on in the first game, didnt start ( and did well) but has again vanished. Maybe just Maybe, he isnt that good!

Yes I have. I've also said that if Artell becomes the next manager to fail to get a tune out of him, then perhaps it's time to just accept he's going to be one of those that drifts out the game.  But then I've also seen with my own eyes what he can do when he's utilised properly at this level (MK Dons away, Crewe at home).  

Hurst didn't use him right.  He got away with playing him in a holding midfield role in the Conference because the standard was low enough for him to shine in a position that isn't his.

Artell quickly identified where his strengths lie. Sheff Wed recognised him as a more attack minded midfielder and that's where he played for their age groups, right up to the first team.  It's only Hurst that used him in that deep lying role, that didn't suit him at all.  As for why he put him there, you would have to ask Hurst himself.  If you get the opportunity maybe ask why he signed him to start with him only to then bemoan his lack of height, it's not like he shrunk four inches once he signed a permanent deal is it?

I think it's slightly harsh to judge anyone on their time at Oldham in that period, such was the basket case nature of the club.  Plus we've long established not to judge anyone on a short spell at any club haven't we?  McAtee at Scunny, Nolan at Lincoln....

Am I saying that Hunt is the second coming of the Messiah?  No.  I think he's got flaws in his game that he really needs to address if he's going to make it in the professional game.   But I can't get my head round that he's not capable of offering something different to what that current midfield is offering.  Those 4 on Saturday contributed to one of the weakest and uninspiring midfield displays I've seen in over 30 years of watching Town.  

Same with Holohan.  He's not perfect, but I like to think he would give more than the total sum of zero.  With the now absence of Conteh, the midfield is in danger of looking incredibly meh, to use Artell's own phrase.  Toilers toiling away to no avail.  Hunt has something in his locker, as does Holohan.  Andrews, Green, Clifton...hmm, not so sure.

The next 3 days are probably some of the most important in the clubs history,we need the owners to invest money to secure our future in the Football League. We will soon find out,if they are serious about being football club owners or just playing at it. Over to you Jason and Andrew.

Quoted from 1mickylyons

This supposed lack of money is a massive worry for me and a huge handicap to the Club in terms of progress. Back to back record season ticket sales,the fa cup run and Mcatee and Conteh sales should be ample to cover what we look to have spent? Are we really skint and if so why,I could understand it when we were still paying Fenty off but why now?

I think they're trying to run the club sustainably, rather than at a loss, and unfortunately, a lot of clubs don't.

We have also has significant outlay in terms of ground maintenance, training facilities etc. Ultimately that money is either spent on managers salaries, players salaries, transfer fees or other club costs.

I'm sure someone said the roofing work and other stuff at the ground needed £1m, and if that's so, that's a huge sum of money for a club at our level.

Quoted from LocalLadGTFC

We won't be paying PH anything now as he is now in employment. I'm sure someone said he was fully paid off however.

Town had a contract. He could have sat back and got paid to play golf. If he was paid off in full, it doesn't mean we didn't have to pay, we just paid our obligations to him sooner. If we have agreed to pay him salary until x date, we owe him that money unless we strike up a deal to say we can pay upfront if you accept a bit less, but I cannot imagine it's that much less. Who doesn't want a holiday?

Unless town have a magic money tree, I'm assuming it came out of the company accounts, the same ones that covers salaries, transfer fees and ground costs, and it'll be same if we bump off another manager.