Jesus Christ

Quoted from Sandford1981

Is the following excerpt from a post by BAWBA accurate in your view DB?

and Josephus probably didn't witness anything that Jesus did. It is generally regarded that Jesus, if he did indeed exist, was crucified somewhere between 30 AD and 36 AD. Josephus was born in 37 or 38 AD, so by the time he started writing about the life of Jesus, he had already been dead for at least 20 years.

What’s your view then DB?

Quoted from kafunanapar140909

Saw a link from one of the football threads to this and felt like I had to get involved. I love these kinds of discussion and, as I think somebody has already mentioned, this is The Fishy at its finest (i.e. a discussion about one of the most controversial issues but conducted in a kind, respectful manner).


I have two questions/observations:
1) how do you think children should be brought up? Dawkins writes well on this point, that there should be no such thing as a “Christian child” or a “Muslim child” or a “Hindu child” or, yes, an “atheist child”, just a secular upbringing until they are old enough to decide for themselves (how this could ever actually be done I don’t know, but it’s interesting all the same).  

Good post.

I think Dawkins should not bring secular into it. There's more to this universe than his almost certain view that something started from nothing. Children for me should be brought up thinking that science doesnt have all the answers .Key for me is the view that good will always prevail over the bad.

Quoted from kafunanapar140909

2) How do Christians feel towards other religions? If you think they are hokum, on what grounds? And then how do you justify your own belief in the likely event that the same charges you put to another religion could probably just as easily be applied to Christianity?

P.S. I am a passionate believer in religious freedom, I am just interested in believers’ views on this.

I try to take each of these in turn and offer my view.

All  the main religions( Hinduism. Judaism, Christianity ,Islam, Sikhism) loosely have the same ideals. A belief in the divine.

Hinduism the oldest of the big 5  . Ancient mans attempt to understand it all. I agree with Hindus  in that a divine presence is reflected in all things eg creation. However where I struggle to believe  is their belief in reincarnation.

Judaism. The oldest religion based on the belief in one God. I admire Abraham the original patriarch of the Abrahamic faiths in trying to understand it all and pose a belief in one God .I think he didnt fully capture it though . I dont think God spoke to him as its claimed in the bible .Its more his mindset trying to understand something beyond all of us.

Christianity. Jesus for me was influenced by Judaism growing up .  Maybe not the son of God in a literal sense but certainly in a symbolic sense. He tried to get to the essence of God  and largely bypassed a lot of the Jewish traditions at the time of his birth hence why he was crucified.

Islam. Muhammad reminds me of Abraham the patriarch of the Jews. Trying to understand something beyond anyone's grasp. He was affected by the evil in his day and tried to understand it all through his mediations in the cave near Mecca. Whilst I don't think an angel from God gave him the Quran  it was his own consciousness trying to understand and redefine what he felt were problems with the Jewish/Christian take on things. His idea in one God carries a lot of weight though.

Sikhism. Guru Nanak the founder of Sikhism  is someone I deeply admire. Tried to makes sense of things at a time where there were a lot of strife between Hindus/Muslims. Like Abraham/Jesus/Muhammed before him tried to get to the essence of it all. Where I fail to agree on is again the issue of reincarnation of which he was probably shaped by his  Hindu background in childhood. For me it doesn't ring true in the literal sense eg you die and come back in another life form until you are pure enough to meet your maker.

As noted I would say Iam very religious and take something good from all religions. Its like differing paths to the same source .All carry weight though none like science can fully ever get it spot on.  The mystery's of our universe will be to much for any mind to fully grasp it all.  

Quoted from Sandford1981

What’s your view then DB?

Can you be more specific

Quoted from DB

2/ Depends upon your definition of being a Christian. Do you mean a person who believes in the teachings of Jesus, or someone who belongs to or is an organisation religion or otherwise that purports to using the name Christian

See I'm still not massively clear on how you are splitting "being a Christian" and "believing the teachings of Jesus". I'm unsure on how you can be one but not the other?

I just wondered what Christian believers' opinions are on those who follow the teachings of Allah (Islam) or Brahma/Vishnu/Shive (Hinduism), etc. In my experience (which I know doesn't necessarily equate to anybody on here), people are quick to denounce other religions but then take umbrage with those who, in a similar way, then denounce their own religion. It comes across as a bit of a double-standard, if you see what I mean?

Quoted from kafunanapar140909

1) how do you think children should be brought up? Dawkins writes well on this point, that there should be no such thing as a “Christian child” or a “Muslim child” or a “Hindu child” or, yes, an “atheist child”, just a secular upbringing until they are old enough to decide for themselves (how this could ever actually be done I don’t know, but it’s interesting all the same).  

I didn't have my daughter baptised so she could make up her own mind when she was older (following the same principle that I was never confirmed through my own personal choice). I would be very happy if she were to choose to be baptised or adopt some other faith of her choice. I have even encouraged her to do so on one or two occasions, and we sometimes discuss parables and so on (I have knowledge of the scriptures but no faith), but she has never been interested.

Quoted from kafunanapar140909

See I'm still not massively clear on how you are splitting "being a Christian" and "believing the teachings of Jesus". I'm unsure on how you can be one but not the other?

I just wondered what Christian believers' opinions are on those who follow the teachings of Allah (Islam) or Brahma/Vishnu/Shive (Hinduism), etc. In my experience (which I know doesn't necessarily equate to anybody on here), people are quick to denounce other religions but then take umbrage with those who, in a similar way, then denounce their own religion. It comes across as a bit of a double-standard, if you see what I mean?

Isn't it a bit like supporting another football club? If there was only one football club it would be a bit pointless. The first two commandments basically state there is only one god and you have to worship him alone, so right from day one the existence of other rival faiths are baked into the regions built upon the Old Testament. If there really only was one religion I think people would argue about differences and still more or less invent different factions as has happened with all of the Abrahamic faiths. Just like we all support Town but all argue about everything (including Town!)

Quoted from DB

Can you be more specific

Is the following excerpt from a post by BAWBA accurate in your view DB?

and Josephus probably didn't witness anything that Jesus did. It is generally regarded that Jesus, if he did indeed exist, was crucified somewhere between 30 AD and 36 AD. Josephus was born in 37 or 38 AD, so by the time he started writing about the life of Jesus, he had already been dead for at least 20 years.

A question I would like the believers to answer please.

What are your views on god.

1,  killing innocent babies on the night of the passover.

2. Killing everybody apart from Noah and his family in the flood.

Not everybody was evil.

Quoted from grimsby pete

A question I would like the believers to answer please.

What are your views on god.

1,  killing innocent babies on the night of the passover.

2. Killing everybody apart from Noah and his family in the flood.

Not everybody was evil.

There just storys embellished by man Pete over probable events that did happen due to natural causes eg the flood. Gods place in history particulary with the Jewish/Christian one was  constant change as man developed new ideas on what the divine represented.

Quoted from Rick12

There just storys embellished by man Pete over probable events that did happen due to natural causes eg the flood. Gods place in history particulary with the Jewish/Christian one was  constant change as man developed new ideas on what the divine represented.

Seriously question do you think it’s time then that the bible comes with a disclaimer informing the reader that these stories are in fact fictitious, because there are millions of people who still believe the book is the words of God.