General election

Quoted from Manchester Mariner

Good to see that across the board it is universally agreed that Theresa May's campaign has been urine-poor.

That's why she wasn't on TV last night. Crosby has decided that she is a liability in front of the press and is keeping her away from the camera. They are hoping they sail into office without her having to do much at all as she is the opposite of strong and stable and the hierarchy know it.

Quoted from ginnywings

The simple fact of the matter is that the rich are getting richer and the poor poorer, this is indisputable and the Tories will not address that problem because they don't want to.

This is the kind of delusional statement we get from the hypocritical Labour supporters, Ginny can you tell me a time throughout history when we didn't have income equality because I would love to know?

Also can you tell me how the Labour Party got on with bridging the gap between rich and poor during there last term in office?🤔

Well, New Labour didn't try to deal with inequality, did they? Thatcher reportedly said that her greatest achievement was Tony Blair and New Labour.

Now, they did at least try to do something to help the poorest in society and, indeed poverty decreased among children and the old. However, as the rich continued to take an ever bigger slice, this didn't affect inequality.

Why should we dislike inequality? Well, the OECD seems to think that it hurts economic growth:

http://www.oecd.org/newsroom/inequality-hurts-economic-growth.htm

Now, Grim, you may perhaps be lucky enough to be among the top 5 or 10 percent of earners whose pockets are being filled by Tory policies at the direct expense of the poorest but, if not, why are you so eager to see people struggling to make ends meet? Who suffers most when the poorest have their income cut? The answer is obviously their children.

Surely, lower inequality with everybody getting a better share (but for the very richest) would be better for the country as a whole? The alternative is, quite literally, children suffering. I think that's a bad thing.

Here's a good article by Ha-Joon Chang:

https://www.theguardian.com/co.....nomy-britain-welfare

Mention of the benefits of government investment which, as I noted earlier, the IFS doesn't take into account when doing their scoring of the manifestos.

It's not impossible to do - the US Congressional Budget Office score everything based on both micro and macroeconomics as do various other countrys' CBO equivalents around the world. Obviously, it has been decided that it isn't within the IFS's remit by whoever funds them (and you've surely got to be a little suspicious of an organisation which won't tell you how they afford to run).

The OBR actually uses a (admittedly hopelessly optimistic) macro model to attempt to forecast the government's policies - just a pity that the government won't allow them to do the same with those of other parties. For Party political reasons, obviously, but surely the government of the day shouldn't be consciously removing a potential source of information for their electorate?

Quoted from grimsby pete

My point Ginny was if we got no deal we would not be able to buy their cars without a heavy tax put on them,

In my old age I do not explain myself very well,

BUT

I do know this mate,

Corbyn, Abbott and Macdonald will ruin this country if they got in,

If you keep hitting the company's and so called higher earners with more and more tax they will go elsewhere,

We will be back to high inflation and that is no good to nobody,

I did say on my last post that was my final word on the subject but I have replied to you because I respect your views.

I might be showing early  signs of losing my marbles and if that is the case I will see no problem in having to pay towards my care,

Unlike some on here who want everything for free.

Not true. Some of us would pay more income tax if Corbyn got in yet would still prefer that. Overall the country will benefit. Indirectly I will benefit.

I benefitted from the Welfare State. Free healthcare when needed. State-owned housing. Free university education. I was lucky because of when I was born. If I'd been born in the 90s or noughties I wouldn't have any of that apart from the health bit. With my family's income I would have lived in less healthy housing and would probably have had more ill-health because of it causing more of a strain on the state. I'd have spent less time at school and studying and the odds of going to uni would have worsened. I'd probably have ended up with a worse paid career and paid less tax.

Look at the countries with high tax. Look at Sweden. Look at Denmark and Finland. They're not barmy, bankrupt countries. They come out top or near the top in nearly every measure of successful countries. Things work properly there. That's worth paying for. What Labour is proposing is very mild by comparison.

Quoted from ginnywings

Fook Brexit, sick of hearing about it. There's more to an election than what happens to us post EU. Nobody is focusing on the NHS, schools, industry, poverty etc etc. It's all about Brexit as if that is the only problem we have.

The simple fact of the matter is that the rich are getting richer and the poor poorer, this is indisputable and the Tories will not address that problem because they don't want to.

The way things are going the middle class are getting poorer too. Look at the furore over young professionals being unable to afford to buy their own home. It would have been unthinkable when I was young. Thats a real reduction in their economic position.

The 'dementia tax' will mean that fewer young, middle class people will be able to get handouts from their parents unless they can tap in before Granny kicks the bucket.

I'm not delusional.

I'm not a hypocrite.

There has never been a time when there has been income equality and there probably never will be but the gap now is obscene. I'm not really interested in money other than what i need to live my life simply and would gladly pay more tax if it was distributed in a fair way to people. Other countries seem to manage to be prosperous and still treat their citizens with respect and care. Someone being wealthy doesn't bother me per se, it's the level of inequality that staggers me quite frankly. Why do these people need so much money; what are they going to do with it all? When you see bankers receiving massive bonuses on top of their massive salaries despite being mostly greedy incompetent illegitimates, while others are queuing at food banks, then something is gravely wrong with our society. Tories used to talk about trickle down but less and less is trickling downward. The Labour party may not be perfect but i genuinely believe that they have the interests of the many at heart and not just the few. We haven't had a true socialist in power for a long time because Tony Blair certainly wasn't one and i didn't and don't like the guy. Corbyn isn't even that extreme as socialists go, so i don't know why he gets so much bile chucked his way. Apart from the biased majority right wing press of course.

I really cannot understand how any working class bloke can think that the Tories are a good bet for them and why they would vote for such a privileged and uncaring bunch, who largely have had every advantage in life and then have the gall to tell us that it's not their fault that they are wealthy and the rest aren't. It's somehow the fault of the immigrants and the workshy. They sell you just enough of the dream to keep you hooked and believing that you too could be like them, only you can't because it's their club and they don't want you as a member.

You have every right to vote how you see fit but don't dare call me a delusional hypocrite because i don't happen to buy into their bullsh1t and don't want to chase wealth to the exclusion of all else. I will proudly vote Labour again in the knowledge that they will probably lose. I just hope they can cut the Tory majority enough to keep them in check, because if they get a big majority, with no EU work directives to hamper them, then god help us.

Im 21 working class and fairly well educated. The you g are brought up to not trust a single thing politicians say, but the votes of the young in this election will go to labour. Deservedly so. Tories dont give 2 felicitations about my future, my prospects, And in May, if she does get in power, we will not move forward as a country. I read the debates on here and value every opinion, but i again hope all polls and odds are wrong. I'd love to see the tories undone

As a life long Labour voter I can not see Corbyn winning because of how he handles himself and I don't care much for Melanie Onn either.

During the Brexit debate he was pretty non existent but even though I like a lot of Labours manifesto, it's his past dealings with Argentinian embassy and Sinn Féin, a vote for him would feel like getting into a soiled bed.

I agree with ginny on the Tories, the sort of illegitimates who'll intercourse you in the behind and not have the decency to give you a reach round.

I won't vote Lim Dem because I hate Tim "Gimpy McGimpface" Farron, his whinny voice just grates on me and I just want to punch him in the pie hole every time he opens his mouth.

The greens can suck my CO2 emmissions and UKIP are a bookmark in history.

Looking like I'll sit this one out unless Melanie posts some nudes.

Vote for policies, not personalities.