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 diehardmariner |
| October 23, 2023, 10:42am |
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We are not in a relegation battle as some like to say, because there is too much time and too many games left.
But at what point are we in a relegation battle? I've always backed Hurst but I'm genuinely struggling to see how he turns it round here. His best asset will always be his ability to get the best out of his dressing room and organise them to within an inch of their life. I'm not seeing that now. The players don't look like they know what they're doing, it's just a collective mess. If I could see the light at the end of the tunnel then he probably has got the credit in the bank to get time to turn it around. But I really don't think he can, I don't want to go as far as the 'he's lost the dressing room' but I don't think he can get a tune out of them anymore, not a decent one anyway. The smart move, surely, is to make the change so you give the new guy plenty of time to turn it around. Trying to turn it around when you're actually in the scrap is really hard (as Hurst found out 3 years ago). Even on the most basic level, recruiting a new guy could easily take a few weeks, then he needs good time to assess his squad, identify where he wants to make improvements, figure out where he can improve and with whom....I don't want us doing all of that whilst the transfer window is going on. |
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| Azimuth |
| October 23, 2023, 10:58am |
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That’s the proverbial vote of confidence then
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/jun/08/taking-the-emotion-out-of-decisions-is-the-way-forward-at-a-football-club
Speaks a lot of mumbo jumbo. |
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 Mappers |
| October 23, 2023, 11:02am |
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Champagne Drinker  Posts: 2,355
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I am pretty level headed when it comes to managerial change
Ideally we would have started well and it would have been a non issue , maybe even with an average start .
But my mind's made up and wonder how many others is in that they are 'past the point of no return ' in fully supporting Hurst again .
Barring a long winning streak ,which has happened once in 10 years I am very much off the fence in that I think it's time for a change even if he scrambles a few scrappy results together (a mixture of draws & wins was typical in the past ) .
His time is done IMO: good manager ,here at the right time, beneficial to both parties ; I wish him well I really do and I'm thankful for his contribution but time to go before irreparable damage is done both to our near to medium term future and his good managerial reputation.
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| ska face |
| October 23, 2023, 11:07am |
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I don't remember anyone said Crawley at the time, as they were performing quite well. Accrington are in the play-offs. The amount of disrespect I've seen of them on here, yet they are a team that's been in league 1 last year. We are a team that just over a year ago was a conference team, and just over 2 years ago, got relegated from league 2. Whether we like to admit it or not, are a team we need to earn the right to be promoted. We aren't a championship team any more. We cannot just rock up and print out our 3 points. We have to prove we are better. After the last 15 years or so, I fail to see how we're so entitled to just walk league 2 teams. We all want to be in league 1, but we have to build a basis and earn our right to it. Cannot just fire a manager and because we're Grimsby Town, walk into it.
Why do people always jump to this exaggeration, assuming that fans expect us to just turn up and win because of our league position 20 years ago? It’s a ridiculous position to try and defend. I’m more concerned with the immediate context, where Hurst has had pretty much everything he’s ever asked for - recruitment staff, scouting team, fitness coach, data analysts, much improved budget, biggest gates in years, big improvements at the training ground, 6-figure investment in the playing surface, overnight stays for away games, license to spend fees and hand out 3-year deals, overseas training camps - and we’re evidently going backwards. This run of games starting with Crawley were all teams below or around us. Crawley, bookies’ favourite for the drop, absolute basket case club who’d spent the summer recruiting players from the Ithsmian league, were 4 ahead of us without an away win and shipping goals. Accrington are in the playoffs now but we would have gone above them with a win, they’d kept 2 clean sheets all season. Typically they walked away with 3pts and a clean sheet. It’s the same story every match for us, and there’s always an excuse - missed chances, poor ref, bad pitch - but the fundamental issues remain the same. |
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| Mappers |
| October 23, 2023, 11:36am |
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Putting the emotion of being a fan to one side, it is simply too hard this far out to say we will be in a relegation battle in 4 months time. Previous history has got everybody twitchy and I understand that. Previous history also suggests that PH can get us out of a slump, but it's natural to concentrate on the negative when it is all we have known for so many years. The conundrum for me is why we are one of the best first half teams in the league, joint second with Stockport last time I looked, but our second half performances have us second bottom. That's a problem that needs to be addressed. 75% of our goals have come in the first half, but we can't seem to get over the line for some reason. Let me also say, for the benefit of doubt, that I'm not a massive PH fan as some might imagine, and if the board were to end his time here, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, but I think he has earned the right to be given a bit more time, and I'm trying to not let emotion, and previous bad times cloud my thinking. I'm also mindful of the clamour we had for his removal at least 4 or 5 times in his two stints as manager, and how he usually comes through in the end. In fact, I can remember people on this board saying they were wrong, and some even apologising for doubting him when he got us promoted. I genuinely think that we have some better players, but not yet enough to get us where we want to be, and we are sort of falling between 2 stools at the moment. He's trying to transition the team to a more possession based system, but hasn't yet cracked it with the incumbent personnel. People are saying to get in a new manager so he has time to assess and a window, but we could say that PH could also do that job in the next window, already knowing the squad and it's deficiences. I also think that the fans are jumping on the fact that the owners said they were trying to improve every window, and the early recruitment seemed to go down really well with the fans, who maybe got a bit carried away and thought we would and should be challenging for a play off spot at least. The fact that we haven't so far, with the emphasis on "so far", leads fans to feel that they have been somewhat duped and only a change of manager can get us back on track. I think the board will be looking to see what happens over the next few games, maybe until the end of November, and if we are still floundering, or god forbid, getting worse, there will be time to appoint a new man and he can have the window. Yeah, I know, I'm an idiot. 
I get your points But to have any sort of decent season now we would have to average something like 2ppg - can anyone really see that happening? I struggle to see us averaging 1.6 even. which would see us mid table , stranger things have happened but it seems a long way off . |
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| GrimPol |
| October 23, 2023, 11:49am |
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Speaks a lot of mumbo jumbo.
Do they know where Grimsby is? |
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| GrimPol |
| October 23, 2023, 11:58am |
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Depends what you mean by decent season. If you go into it expecting a promotion push, or at least a play off spot, then you are maybe setting yourself up for disappointment.
The league has got stronger and getting established in it may be more of a realistic goal for some. We don't know what the board are expecting, apart from long term plans and living within our means.
I'm as desperate for excitement and swashbuckling football as the next fan, but many years of watching Town have tempered my expectations somewhat. I hope for better, but expecting better leads to disappointment mostly.
If a Fairygodmother arrived at Blundell Park and offered Mariner Fans an A or B wish, how would you choose? A) Guaranteed this season mid-table mediocrity, with all the games puerile but no demotion or anywhere near playoffs. or B) Leave PH alone and let him fulfil his 30-month contract. No exceptions, or whatabouts, that's the stark choice. What would you take A or B? |
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| 123614 |
| October 23, 2023, 12:01pm |
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Well it's not going to happen, so irrelevant.
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| WayneBurnettsJockstrap |
| October 23, 2023, 12:02pm |
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I think if it comes to saying goodbye to Hurst, then what sort of manager do we go for?
Personally I think we should go for an experienced Manager who has managed at a higher level, who has contacts further up the pyramid, who could get players in who want to play for him.
I mean, for the hell of it, why not even offer him to buy into the club as a Shareholder, so he has a say on what's going on.......£50.........£500.........£50000........whatever he sees fit.
Oh hang on.............oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh excrement
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| DB |
| October 23, 2023, 12:12pm |
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Barley Wine Drinker  Posts: 18,857
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Quoted from 140625">I think if it comes to saying goodbye to Hurst, then what sort of manager do we go for?
Personally I think we should go for an experienced Manager who has managed at a higher level, who has contacts further up the pyramid, who could get players in who want to play for him.
I mean, for the hell of it, why not even offer him to buy into the club as a Shareholder, so he has a say on what's going on.......£50.........£500.........£50000........whatever he sees fit.
Oh hang on.............oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh excrement
I would hope that successful business men like JS & AP already have a contingency plan and list in place. |
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