FULL STEAM AHEAD...

...FREEMO....as Tom Shutes....and misses...

A very big step forward for us!

I hope the Telewag is not a miss print and they mean 35 years (rather than the 3-5 years printed).

Always suspected there was little substance to the Shute-led takeover.

Quoted from marinerdazza

Always suspected there was little substance to the Shute-led takeover.

Same here, it was clear to me at least that he didn't have a pot to urine in right from the start. As usual though there was a mass celebration / melt down over-reaction on here when his interest was first mentioned and anyone voicing an opinion against it was slaughtered.

Quoted from marinerdazza

Always suspected there was little substance to the Shute-led takeover.

Eats, Shutes & Leaves?

So 3-5 years to deliver the new stadium, so we should expect to see artist impressions and miniature models etc this year at some point.

All being well we could be starting 23-24 or 24-25, 25-26 season in the Fentydome!

Quoted from Ipswin

Same here, it was clear to me at least that he didn't have a pot to urine in right from the start. As usual though there was a mass celebration / melt down over-reaction on here when his interest was first mentioned and anyone voicing an opinion against it was slaughtered.

A Fishy balloon rarely needs to be pricked, just let it deflate of its own accord.

Quoted from TownSNAFU5

A very big step forward for us!

I hope the Telewag is not a miss print and they mean 35 years (rather than the 3-5 years printed).

I hope it is a big step forward but unless and until we get news of finance, detailed drawings and foundations in the ground I will reserve judgement.

I am hoping an upturn in playing fortunes and the Ollie effect might get things moving but I hope Fenty has had some confirmation from national and local governments that funding will be available or despite good intentions it will be another false dawn.

Same question as always. Where is the money coming from?

Quoted from fishboyUTM

Same question as always. Where is the money coming from?

A fair amount should come from regeneration funds and other grants. Community stadiums are able to draw from a number of pots.

It does seem that the "ducks are in a row" with this one. Politically for once. I doubt there'll ever be a better opportunity.

I think it's fair to assume that some money will need to be borrowed, hopefully at a low interest rate and hopefully not too problematic to pay off when in the new stadium.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

I hope it is a big step forward but unless and until we get news of finance, detailed drawings and foundations in the ground I will reserve judgement.

I am hoping an upturn in playing fortunes and the Ollie effect might get things moving but I hope Fenty has had some confirmation from national and local governments that funding will be available or despite good intentions it will be another false dawn.

I would imagine that the  drawings from the original proposal will be resurrected with the a few tweeks to take into account the change in location.

I did a scale model in play dough of the new ground with 4 seating stands and standing in each of the 4 corners. I was hoping to let JSF have it to save money but the dog pssed on it and all 4 stands dissolved. The model was gratefully accepted by JSF but it now means that the ground will be standing only

Quoted from fishboyUTM

Same question as always. Where is the money coming from?

How do you buy a house? You get a mortgage for the difference between the sale price of the house and funds you have available to you. You then repay that mortgage over X amount of years.

Quoted from rancido

I would imagine that the  drawings from the original proposal will be resurrected with the a few tweeks to take into account the change in location.

Let's hope those tweaks don't include "squeaky's" penchant for cost cutting which leaves us with a Glanford park lookalike.

This is once in a lifetime event so let's get it right.

If it does ever get built there it would be emotional moment for many like me who spent their formative years in and around Freeman street.

No doubt a significant amount of borrowing will be needed, which is why it is important to get it right. Build a stadium that is user friendly, provides a good facility for sport but wider conference facilities and so on.

All I read in to the comments is Schutes wasn’t prepared to answer questions and had a different idea for the location of the ground. Fenty disagrees, and now with Holloway on board the club are pursuing freemo.

I’m sure those Roy of the rovers images will reappear now but I, like many will not hold our breath or get excited...when the first brick goes in the ground then may be it will be time to get excited.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

How do you buy a house? You get a mortgage for the difference between the sale price of the house and funds you have available to you. You then repay that mortgage over X amount of years.

Ok then, now we just need to find a bank who’ll loan £20m+ to a company who are technically insolvent and have only turned a profit a handful of times in the last twenty years.

Just listened to Fenty’s chat with Burns, typically light on any detail & nice to see the blame has moved to Tom Shutes this month - looks like the council, De Freitas, NIMBYs, great crested newts, Henry Boot, B&Q and grieving relatives at the Crem can all breathe a sigh of relief.

It’s the same position as I mentioned last month and lots of people got a tiit-lip over, he’s proposing to use public funds to pay for a 10 hectare monument to a bloke with twenty million quid sat in the bank.

The idea that there are just endless pots of money sat around waiting for people to dip into and build modern day coliseums just isn’t the case. The country’s just walked away from €1bn a year that came from the European Regional Development Fund and European Social Fund, good luck replacing that.

He’s been banging on about “community” facilities for the best part of a decade now, but I can’t recall a single example of what this would constitute and how these are going to bring in any significant amount of money.  

Like I said a while back, the best hope is Boris’ Bread & Circuses fund. There could be a tie-in with the renewables sector but then where’s the community element?

Eloquently put and absolutely spot on as usual

Without sinking into a pro versus anti EU mammary for tat we have always put in more than we get back with the odd regeneration fund monument attempting to keep us plebs fooled that we getting something from all the money we chucking away.

Quoted from ska face

Ok then, now we just need to find a bank who’ll loan £20m+ to a company who are technically insolvent and have only turned a profit a handful of times in the last twenty years.

Just listened to Fenty’s chat with Burns, typically light on any detail & nice to see the blame has moved to Tom Shutes this month - looks like the council, De Freitas, NIMBYs, great crested newts, Henry Boot, B&Q and grieving relatives at the Crem can all breathe a sigh of relief.

It’s the same position as I mentioned last month and lots of people got a t[i]i[\i]t-lip over, he’s proposing to use public funds to pay for a 10 hectare monument to a bloke with twenty million quid sat in the bank.

The idea that there are just endless pots of money sat around waiting for people to dip into and build modern day coliseums just isn’t the case. The country’s just walked away from €1bn a year that came from the European Regional Development Fund and European Social Fund, good luck replacing that.

He’s been banging on about “community” facilities for the best part of a decade now, but I can’t recall a single example of what this would constitute and how these are going to bring in any significant amount of money.  

Like I said a while back, the best hope is Boris’ Bread & Circuses fund. There could be a tie-in with the renewables sector but then where’s the community element?

I don't want to make this into a political thread, but if we've walked away from €1b, who is putting that money in in the first place?  Is it all coming from Germany?  Or were we, as a nation, putting in more than we ever got out by propping up former communist nations, plus Ireland, Greece, Portugal etc.?  The money isn't just printed by the EU and dished out to the UK from a magic money pot as a gift!

^Snap.

Now back to the local matters in hand before this descends in another one of those threads!

😬🙊😩

It’s impossible to not end up talking politically when we’re talking about the sums of money involved.

So far the club have really buggered the whole ground thing up...at those morning events at BP a few years ago, members of our bird couldn’t even fully interpret the plans for their own proposal, and the least said about the presentation the better.

For me, the club really need this to be water tight and professional. I have zero faith in the club to deliver anything, let alone project this size but I, along with many a fan does see the need to develop and move in to a modern facility.

Funding will forever be an issue and whilst I don’t expect Fenty or anyone else to sling large amounts of their own cash in to the project, members of the community which are vehemently opposed will need some convincing as to why public cash should be wasted, as they’d see it, on a stadium.

Locally there are large shortfalls in funding in some key areas, of someone’s ploughing 7 figures in to a project you could see why some wouldn’t support it spent on the Fenty dome.

FT are massively anti-Brexit and Project Fear personified.

Quoted from Rik e B

FT are massively anti-Brexit and Project Fear personified.

I see you’ve taken the time to read the piece then.

The stadium will be paid for in positive thinking and blitz spirit. Nice one.

I've read plenty of the years and non of the scaremongering has come true

But the article isn’t scaremongering...but anyway...

Back to the original post, there’s still a couple of fundamental questions; funding and where it will come from because  simply getting a mortgage isn’t that easy.

Will it be project managed properly, will events prior to the build actually focus on important things like sponsorship, community relevance, legacy planning...not just balderdash about having a chip shop or can Nigel take his flask in...

Quoted from Rik e B

I've read plenty of the years and non of the scaremongering has come true

Nothing will change until December.

The FT is regarded as being pretty neutral. Probably the only one left.

Interesting show with Jeremy vine on radio 2 earlier. Seems we're not the only club that had issues with 'locals'. People complaining of light pollution causing an influx of insects! Seems we were lucky with the lesser spotted newt in great Coates

Just before the usual suspects start bealing, that article is just an example of how hard it is to access any kind of public regeneration funding, not a love letter to the EU.

Like I said a while back - expect significant opposition if you’re going to be using council funds to plonk a vanity project in the middle of one of the most deprived wards in the country.

These are issues I’d expect the portfolio holder for regeneration to have a bit more of a grasp on tbh.

A key difficulty when developments like this begin to take shape is that fundamentally, only a small percentage of a local area directly use the stadium and many can’t see the wider picture of support and projects football clubs offer.

I’ve met several people that claim that GTFC have no impact on their lives etc yet their children or grandchildren are impacted directly but the great work GTSET do and so on.

You also find that in towns like Grimsby, people are often very obtuse when it comes to redevelopment.

I don't know about 'full steam ahead' more like 'slow ahead' but an improvement on 'full astern' I suppose

How long before 'finished with engines' (through lack of funds) I wonder?

3 to 5 years? Good grief we'll be in the Premiership by then 14000 won't be anywhere near enough

I just hope that it's not just your usual single tier stadium that seems to be the norm. Something a bit different would be nice (though I guess it's all down to the ££££)

Something like stadio Luigi ferraris or
StadeAugusta delaine would be nice. Though, very unlikely I would think

Quoted from Ipswin

3 to 5 years? Good grief we'll be in the Premiership by then 14000 won't be anywhere near enough

I know that was probably partially tongue in cheek but my thoughts to a degree (maybe not quite the Prem or capacity part!), five years will have likely missed Ollie's 'ploughing' through the divisions and I'm sure he planning on get one in the bag before three!

Quoted from aldi_01

A key difficulty when developments like this begin to take shape is that fundamentally, only a small percentage of a local area directly use the stadium and many can’t see the wider picture of support and projects football clubs offer.

I’ve met several people that claim that GTFC have no impact on their lives etc yet their children or grandchildren are impacted directly but the great work GTSET do and so on.

You also find that in towns like Grimsby, people are often very obtuse when it comes to redevelopment.

Incorparate a GTFC social club with its own pool, snooker and darts teams, get someone like Dock Beers involved.
With the right version, they is plenty of opportunity to generate revenue, seven days a week.
Sort out the match day catering - have a mini catering area with local businesses selling local produced grub - Youngs selling Mariners pies - Turners selling proper bacon/Lincolnshire buns, Ocean Bar selling fish & Chips, Bar-B-Que etc with a family fans zone.
Look how theYanks do it, American football lasts in total 60 minutes, but everyone is there for hours, spending money.

Quoted from The Yard Dog

Incorparate a GTFC social club with its own pool, snooker and darts teams, get someone like Dock Beers involved.
With the right version, they is plenty of opportunity to generate revenue, seven days a week.
Sort out the match day catering - have a mini catering area with local businesses selling local produced grub - Youngs selling Mariners pies - Turners selling proper bacon/Lincolnshire buns, Ocean Bar selling fish & Chips, Bar-B-Que etc with a family fans zone.
Look how theYanks do it, American football lasts in total 60 minutes, but everyone is there for hours, spending money.

I have been saying for ages that the catering for pies, burgers etc should be taken in house and use local suppliers, such as Turners, to provide the food.

China has built a new hospital in just 8 days.

Assuming the new stadium takes double the forecast time, 10 years.  If we built stadiums at the same rate as the Chinese built hospitals, we could have 456 new stadiums in 10 years!

That would reduce any HT queues for the toilets, beer and food! 😀

Quoted from rancido

I have been saying for ages that the catering for pies, burgers etc should be taken in house and use local suppliers, such as Turners, to provide the food.

The easier or lazy option is currently in operation , charge someone to operate the catering inside Blundell Park, job done.

The problem with that is, GTFC have no control over the product or pricing.  I doubt even if GTFC get any extra revenue on matchday when they increase in match attentances.

Were as GTFC operated the catering, they would have control over product and pricing.  When there are higher attendances, GTFC would benefit from increased takings.

Look at Kidderminster to see what can be achieve, First consideration to go watch Town, the other Brian's pies

The fundamentals are far more important at this stage. Worrying about food outlets or social clubs or whatever folk won’t is not even worth the time at the moment.

Assembling a project team with a vision and clear strategy is what is needed. Ensuring infrastructure including public transport and the likes are more important, exploring ways to ensure the stadium is eco friendly, self sufficient as far as possible, understanding what is necessary in terms of medical facilities, press facilities and so on needs addressing before we start looking at where we get sausage rolls or who supplies the booze.

Someone mentioned about design...again, that will naturally come down to funding. A single tier stadium would be plenty good enough. The amount of clubs at championship and below who have two tier stands and the second tiers are closed should suggest aingle tier is more than adequate.

If we look to the continent, a smaller version of Schalke would work. Frosinone have just built a new stadium, that’s very good as is Juve (minus the second tier we wouldn’t need and the mafia building crew). Samp is a good stadium that can create a good atmosphere (away end is atrocious) but it’s old now and is definitely not a design template seemingly used anymore.

Orlando have a great set up, but again, would we look that further afield (although they spent a year trawling across Europe looking at different stadia).

Maybe the new stadium will allow card payments to buy food.

Just as an aside, it struck me just now how much the renders pulled together by the Freemen resemble Stadion Miejski, a stadium I visited whilst visiting the city of Tychy in Poland on a work trip last year. It's a 15,000 seater and cost about £25m to build (albeit in Poland where I expect it's cheaper to do so). Probably nothing in it, but it does a pretty uncanny resemblance.

[img]https://i2-prod.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/incoming/article2515264.ece/ALTERNATES/s1227b/0_Freemen-vision.jpg[/img]
[img]https://www.mostostal.waw.pl/files/mostostal/MEDIA/Stadion%20Miejski%20Tychy/Stadion_Tychy%20%2853%29.jpg[/img]
[img]https://www.mostostal.waw.pl/files/mostostal/MEDIA/Stadion%20Miejski%20Tychy/Stadion_Tychy%20%2870%29.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/ZQhatCV.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/TejlkDs.png[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/o3OlUBN.png[/img]
Cracking stadium by the way. By far the best I've been to that's sub 20,000 in capacity.

Quoted from aldi_01

The fundamentals are far more important at this stage. Worrying about food outlets or social clubs or whatever folk won’t is not even worth the time at the moment.

Assembling a project team with a vision and clear strategy is what is needed. Ensuring infrastructure including public transport and the likes are more important, exploring ways to ensure the stadium is eco friendly, self sufficient as far as possible, understanding what is necessary in terms of medical facilities, press facilities and so on needs addressing before we start looking at where we get sausage rolls or who supplies the booze.

Someone mentioned about design...again, that will naturally come down to funding. A single tier stadium would be plenty good enough. The amount of clubs at championship and below who have two tier stands and the second tiers are closed should suggest aingle tier is more than adequate.

If we look to the continent, a smaller version of Schalke would work. Frosinone have just built a new stadium, that’s very good as is Juve (minus the second tier we wouldn’t need and the mafia building crew). Samp is a good stadium that can create a good atmosphere (away end is atrocious) but it’s old now and is definitely not a design template seemingly used anymore.

Orlando have a great set up, but again, would we look that further afield (although they spent a year trawling across Europe looking at different stadia).

Just thinking about what I put previously, Yes, the ground is still going to have a capacity of 12k/14k but, would prefer at least 2 stands not to be single tier. It's just a preference on my side really.

The frosinone (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadio_Benito_Stirpe) is one of the grounds I was thinking of but for some reason i confus d it with a French rugby ground

Frosinone is unique too, they adopted a similar process to Juve, minus the mafia. Build it smaller than their previous one, essentially making it more full, for more of the time. They also are one of a handful of teams in Italy that own their own ground.

I like Juve’s ground, and the seats are certainly unique but I’m not sure we’d need essentially a stand of corporate seats like them haha.

I think it would be worth getting out and about and seeing the different stadiums and designs. It worked for Orlando, and funnily enough, it was built in an area of Orlando that is similar to freemo...it’s done wonders for the community and the local area...

Ill do the ground work and tour Europe and America on the lash.

look at grounds I mean

It's just not going to happen. Never.
Why would anyone think it will? What evidence do you have to suggest it will? How is this any different to any of the other failed attempts during the last 25 years?
Whilst Fenty is at the helm it simply will not happen. The man is a fool of epic proportions. There is nothing to prove otherwise. The fact he is deputy head of the council and head of regeneration beggars belief. What has he ever delivered, that he said he would deliver, for GTFC.
To have the audacity to suggest Shutes is to blame for any delay in the stadium is outrageous! Fenty was still banging on about Peake's Parkway as his preferred option last year.
As others have said we simply do not have the money and we never will as long as squeeky is in charge. Take off your rose tainted glasses. Step away from the Holloway merry go round for a short while. Now take a deep breath. Return to the present moment and see the harsh reality of our predicament. Without a change of owner who has
a substantial amount of cash to spend this simply cannot happen. I want a new stadium as much as the next person. But it's time to accept the reality of the situation. We are a cash strapped club run by a bunch of deluded failures. Come on, how many of you honestly believe Mr "shut up" has the vision, drive, knowledge, people skills   to make this happen. There is not one iota of evidence to suggest otherwise. I'm just sick and tired of this merry go round of bulsh!t. Fenty out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quoted from heppy88

It's just not going to happen. Never.
Why would anyone think it will? What evidence do you have to suggest it will? How is this any different to any of the other failed attempts during the last 25 years?
Whilst Fenty is at the helm it simply will not happen. The man is a fool of epic proportions. There is nothing to prove otherwise. The fact he is deputy head of the council and head of regeneration beggars belief. What has he ever delivered, that he said he would deliver, for GTFC.
To have the audacity to suggest Shutes is to blame for any delay in the stadium is outrageous! Fenty was still banging on about Peake's Parkway as his preferred option last year.
As others have said we simply do not have the money and we never will as long as squeeky is in charge. Take off your rose tainted glasses. Step away from the Holloway merry go round for a short while. Now take a deep breath. Return to the present moment and see the harsh reality of our predicament. Without a change of owner who has
a substantial amount of cash to spend this simply cannot happen. I want a new stadium as much as the next person. But it's time to accept the reality of the situation. We are a cash strapped club run by a bunch of deluded failures. Come on, how many of you honestly believe Mr "shut up" has the vision, drive, knowledge, people skills   to make this happen. There is not one iota of evidence to suggest otherwise. I'm just sick and tired of this merry go round of bulsh!t. Fenty out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am nodding in agreement but am holding out for a miracle.

Something will have to kick start Freeman street, and architects and designers who know what they are doing will work with all parties so I am clutching at the last available straws that it could,might possibly happen somehow.

Well if it does happen I hope they give the contract to build the stadium to that Chinese company who built a hospital from scratch in under 2 weeks.

They will have in finished in less than a month.

Just out of interest what's supposed to be happening to the old Ramsden's site?

I can see it ending up like the old Bunnys/bowling alley/bingo hall site in Cleethorpes.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

I am nodding in agreement but am holding out for a miracle.

Something will have to kick start Freeman street, and architects and designers who know what they are doing will work with all parties so I am clutching at the last available straws that it could,might possibly happen somehow.

The sad reality is NE Linc's council is 100 million in debt. A fact admitted by the council last year. The club have no money, the council have no money. No one has any money. It's time for everyone to accept this inevitable truth and start putting some serious investment into BP. Anything else is madness!

Quoted from promotion plaice

Just out of interest what's supposed to be happening to the old Ramsden's site?

I can see it ending up like the old Bunnys/bowling alley/bingo hall site in Cleethorpes.

This is the reason why so many people are sceptical - nothing ever seems to come to fruition whether private or council lead.

I have lost count of how many times Grimsby has had artists impressions of town centre improvements but very little has transpired.

Quoted from heppy88

The sad reality is NE Linc's council is 100 million in debt. A fact admitted by the council last year. The club have no money, the council have no money. No one has any money. It's time for everyone to accept this inevitable truth and start putting some serious investment into BP. Anything else is madness!

Why do you think councillor Fenty keeps ploughing on then?

He must know something we don't surely otherwise it will soon become apparent it is all a pipe dream and he will have Ollie to answer to!

[img]https://i.imgur.com/rRw61pT.jpg[/img]

And get the right director 😉

No wonder this town has become a backwater if some of the negativity voiced in the last two pages of this thread is anything to go by. It is a fact that we need a new ground for the survival of the club. The club want it, JF wants it, the Council want it and the fans (with the the exception of a few naysayer doom and gloom experts on here) want it. Forget false dawns and be hopeful and adopt a Mr Micawber attitude. The past is the past and that's where BP sadly belongs.

Quoted from heppy88

The sad reality is NE Linc's council is 100 million in debt. A fact admitted by the council last year. The club have no money, the council have no money. No one has any money. It's time for everyone to accept this inevitable truth and start putting some serious investment into BP. Anything else is madness!

At least I have my red conco cap, was hoping they would have done the same for Peakes Parkway, now I am dreaming of a Fremo Cap.

Squeaky must know more than he letting on, especially to get Mr & Mrs Holloway to up sticks and move to the area, Squeaky would have told Mr Holloway his vision and plans for the future, to lure Mr Holloway here.

Mr Holloway is no fool, he knew all about the players, so I guess he was fully aware of the stadium saga.

Try to look forward, I know its hard, but this is the era of a brave new Britian.

UTMM

Quoted from heppy88

The sad reality is NE Linc's council is 100 million in debt. A fact admitted by the council last year. The club have no money, the council have no money. No one has any money. It's time for everyone to accept this inevitable truth and start putting some serious investment into BP. Anything else is madness!

All well and good but in what form would this serious investment be and where would it go? If the club has no money then where are these funds coming  from to paper over all of BP's shortcomings? You are more likely to attract outside investment on a new purpose built stadium than you are on tarting up a depreciating out of date football ground, parts of which  are reminiscent of late Victoria football edifices. I'm the first to admit to very little knowledge of the world of finance and my only experience of borrowing for property is on house mortgaging. My first home, which I bought in 1972, cost me £4,200. I secured a 5% 30 year mortgage which entailed a £210 deposit. I also seem to recall that the interest rate then was between 4 to 5 %. The proposed cost of town's new ground is £20 million so a pro rata deal similar to to the one I got all those years ago would involve a deposit of £1 million. This would be within the club's reach using the value of BP and also some naming rights etc. Now I know this is a very simplistic approach but I'm sure it demonstrates that it is within the the realms of possibility to go down a similar financial route.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=.....uOcCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAD

Take a look at this Stadium. I played in that Stadium last year holds 12,080  it's even in our colours. Beautiful both inside and out.
Looking at that poll, it seems the Dutch are never happy.

And inside stadium

https://upload.wikimedia.org/w.....Heracles_Stadion.PNG


     

With 200k a year profit we could pay for it all in ten if Squeaky kept his fingers out the pie 🙄😂.

Plus we'd get some funding so wouldn't need the full amount anyway and one would have thought we'd bring in a lot more once moved in!

Quoted from Rik e B

With 200k a year profit we could pay for it all in ten if Squeaky kept his fingers out the pie 🙄😂.

Plus we'd get some funding so wouldn't need the full amount anyway and one would have thought we'd bring in a lot more once moved in!

You need 100 years at 200k to get 20 million  

Quoted from Rik e B

With 200k a year profit we could pay for it all in ten if Squeaky kept his fingers out the pie 🙄😂.

Plus we'd get some funding so wouldn't need the full amount anyway and one would have thought we'd bring in a lot more once moved in!

Now I'm note brill at maths but 200k a year for 10 years equates to £2 million which is only a tenth of the cost. Shurely some mistake!

Quoted from Grimal

https://www.google.com/url?sa=.....uOcCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAD

Take a look at this Stadium. I played in that Stadium last year holds 12,080  it's even in our colours. Beautiful both inside and out.
Looking at that poll, it seems the Dutch are never happy.

And inside stadium

https://upload.wikimedia.org/w.....Heracles_Stadion.PNG

That design would be perfect for us - just add rail seats at the docks (Pontoon) end, that will increase the capacity to about 14k, and we are sorted.


     

Why can't we just design flats into the actual build to reduce the cost?

20m sounds a lot but it's not a secondary school costs 20-40m depending on its size. Maybe that's a possibility, incorporate a primary school within one of the stands.


The funding gap necessitates innovation so let's  be innovative

Quoted from Swansea_Mariner

Why can't we just design flats into the actual build to reduce the cost?

20m sounds a lot but it's not a secondary school costs 20-40m depending on its size. Maybe that's a possibility, incorporate a primary school within one of the stands.


The funding gap necessitates innovation so let's  be innovative

Those are great ideas but according to Philip Day we haven't sorted out who even owns the land. If we get that sorted there are "lots of things to sort out" prior to any planning application and then the planning process is fraught with problems.

It might be a while but at least they can explore ideas like yours if we ever get that far.

If Philip Day or JF was reading this I would say explore the design  build options in parallel with sorting out the land issue. Litteraly it could be anything a library, a school, day care centre, indoor athlete facilities (60m track), health spa, flats, hotel etc. (Inc. Combinations of)

Project like this needs a proper 5 case model business case, with a series of long list options you could have dozens of potential different partners for a True community stadium. If the stadium is different things then the money can come from a variety of sources.

None of this would be aborted costs if Freeman street land couldn't be sorted you'd just reevaluate which options were viable for another site.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

You need 100 years at 200k to get 20 million  

That's just you being negative. If everybody starts being a bit more positive then maybe 200,000 ×10 might be 20,000,000.

Quoted from ska face

Just before the usual suspects start bealing, that article is just an example of how hard it is to access any kind of public regeneration funding, not a love letter to the EU.

Like I said a while back - expect significant opposition if you’re going to be using council funds to plonk a vanity project in the middle of one of the most deprived wards in the country.

These are issues I’d expect the portfolio holder for regeneration to have a bit more of a grasp on tbh.

Interesting and fair points Ska, just out of interest how much EU money has gone into regeneration of Grimsby from us being in the EU up to today, genuine question and not politically motivated, thank you  

Quoted from Marinerz93

Interesting and fair points Ska, just out of interest how much EU money has gone into regeneration of Grimsby from us being in the EU up to today, genuine question and not politically motivated, thank you  

Honestly couldn’t say, although this website is worth a look (not just at NE Lincs) as it shows where some funding has gone in the recent past & how much is spent annually across broad themes - https://www.myeu.uk/

What’s clear from that map is that a lot of money is put into supporting some of the “softer” areas that support long term regeneration - skills, training, R&D, etc. - not just the bells & whistles. If Fenty really is serious about this being a transformational project for the area, it will need the support of all sectors of the local economy and won’t survive if it’s just a ground, a Burger King & a Harvester.

The govt's “shared prosperity fund”, which is supposedly being introduced to replace this funding is disappearing slowly into the ether, but as mentioned in the FT article, it’s looking like it may be harder for certain areas to access this type of money and if the “Fair Funding” proposals for ahead, NE Lincs council are going to lose an extra £2.1m a year which will be heading to Surrey and Bucks.

Oops don't put me in charge of administration or finance 😬🙈

Quoted from Marinerz93

Interesting and fair points Ska, just out of interest how much EU money has gone into regeneration of Grimsby from us being in the EU up to today, genuine question and not politically motivated, thank you  

The EU should build us a stadium, for destroying our fishing industry, which lead to the decline of Freemo.

Was watching the news yesterday about the EU still wants to fish our waters, as part of the deal to leave the EU. They was a interview with a dutch fisherman, fearing for his livelihood, now we are out of the EU. The EU did not give a f__k about our families livelihoods and our TOWN.

Quoted from The Yard Dog

The EU should build us a stadium, for destroying our fishing industry, which lead to the decline of Freemo.

Was watching the news yesterday about the EU still wants to fish our waters, as part of the deal to leave the EU. They was a interview with a dutch fisherman, fearing for his livelihood, now we are out of the EU. The EU did not give a f__k about our families livelihoods and our TOWN.

40 years worth of British governments were part of the EU - sat at the top table too - so everything you say of the EU abandoning the town, destroying the community and ruining an industry is 100% applicable to British governments.

Its all moot we are not in the EU. How about we talk about funding routes that actually exist.

The cost of the stadium will be considerably more than 20 million if its to be the iconic stadium we all want it to be. On the 1st November 2017 the Telegraph stated the cost of the stadium alone at Peaks Parkway was 55 million (That does not include any of the other proposed developments). Now that was over 2 years ago. So what will 20 or 30 million get us in 3 - 5 years time?

Quoted from The Yard Dog

The EU should build us a stadium, for destroying our fishing industry, which lead to the decline of Freemo.

Was watching the news yesterday about the EU still wants to fish our waters, as part of the deal to leave the EU. They was a interview with a dutch fisherman, fearing for his livelihood, now we are out of the EU. The EU did not give a f__k about our families livelihoods and our TOWN.

Sadly Brexit isn't going to give us a clean sweep of getting our fishing grounds back as I said in an earlier post we will still have to deal with EU, Norway and Faroe Islands, licencing should be the way forward and as others have said our fishing grounds could still be used a  bargaining chip for other more attractive deals.

The problem with the EU is that some UK government departments and government of the time were complicit in part of us being sold out however, when the UK has opposed parts of CFP, it was out voted by minority countries with an under representative vote, in other words they were given an unfair amount of EU MPs per population.

Why not redevelop BP one side at a time. Lets say 1 side per year for 4 years? Reach an agreement with Ramsdens for the old supermarket site for a transport / parking hub. Develop the nearby train station. With a little imagination, organisation and care everything you could want out of a new build can be achieved at BP. That area can then be regenerated.
Look, I’m all for a new state of the art, all singing, all dancing stadium. A real icon for the Town. Over the years I have written in the GT and on the fishy supporting proposed moves to Great Coates, then Peaks Parkway. But why move, accepting second best, just for the sake of it? To do it right a new stadium we can all be proud of will cost much, much more than £20 million. If an opportunity arose that we had 50 million to spend on a stadium then great. But unfortunately, we don’t.
It doesn’t matter if all links in the chain are coloured blue for the first time in the Towns history. It would only matter if we had the money.
A few people have commented that Ollie “must know something that we don’t” otherwise he would never had agreed to come. Seriously? We honestly believe the man knows of someone willing to splash tens of millions of pounds in Grimsby. The guy just wanted to get back into football management with a bigger stake in the running of a club. Not necessarily ours. Shortly before coming to us he was turned down by Bristol Rovers. There is no great conspiracy here.
I’m not being negative just for the sake of being negative. I’m just adding some realism and hopefully common sense to the debate. As I’ve written previously, we have all been here before. If we are not careful and start to make serious changes to BP, then we may end up with no stadium at all!

No.

Who’s fault will it be when the potential redevelopment funding gets swallowed up by further austerity cuts?

Quoted from heppy88

Why not redevelop BP one side at a time. Lets say 1 side per year for 4 years? Reach an agreement with Ramsdens for the old supermarket site for a transport / parking hub. Develop the nearby train station. With a little imagination, organisation and care everything you could want out of a new build can be achieved at BP. That area can then be regenerated.
Look, I’m all for a new state of the art, all singing, all dancing stadium. A real icon for the Town. Over the years I have written in the GT and on the fishy supporting proposed moves to Great Coates, then Peaks Parkway. But why move, accepting second best, just for the sake of it? To do it right a new stadium we can all be proud of will cost much, much more than £20 million. If an opportunity arose that we had 50 million to spend on a stadium then great. But unfortunately, we don’t.
It doesn’t matter if all links in the chain are coloured blue for the first time in the Towns history. It would only matter if we had the money.
A few people have commented that Ollie “must know something that we don’t” otherwise he would never had agreed to come. Seriously? We honestly believe the man knows of someone willing to splash tens of millions of pounds in Grimsby. The guy just wanted to get back into football management with a bigger stake in the running of a club. Not necessarily ours. Shortly before coming to us he was turned down by Bristol Rovers. There is no great conspiracy here.
I’m not being negative just for the sake of being negative. I’m just adding some realism and hopefully common sense to the debate. As I’ve written previously, we have all been here before. If we are not careful and start to make serious changes to BP, then we may end up with no stadium at all!

Because of the housing around all sides of BP, I don’t believe it can be redeveloped anywhere near as well as building a new ground at Freemo. Surely everyone can see that building one at Freemo would be incredible for the area?

Redeveloping BP been gone over endlessly and its unfeasible. Freemo represents an incredible opportunity.

Quoted from Heisenberg

Because of the housing around all sides of BP, I don’t believe it can be redeveloped anywhere near as well as building a new ground at Freemo. Surely everyone can see that building one at Freemo would be incredible for the area?

I can see it, but how can we afford it? The redevelopment of BP will not produce the same results as a new stadium. But I'm sure we have a better chance of financing the redevelopment of BP than finding 30 -50 million needed for a new stadium. I'm sure many of us have been to some of the recently built stadia and found them soulless and without character. And let's not forget the bottom line is the football. As impressive as it is, Chesterfields swanky ground hasn't been working any miracles for them. I really hope I'm wrong on this. I really hope the powers that be can pull this off. But who honestly thinks they can?

Quoted from Rik e B

Redeveloping BP been gone over endlessly and its unfeasible. Freemo represents an incredible opportunity.

Yes it does. But how?

Quoted from Rik e B

Redeveloping BP been gone over endlessly and its unfeasible. Freemo represents an incredible opportunity.

As did Great Coates and Peaks Parkway.

Anyone know how much of the regeneration money can be put towards the new stadium, nowt I would imagine.

No enabling development as well as far as I can see so dead duck again if you ask me unfortunately.

Quoted from heppy88

Why not redevelop BP one side at a time. Lets say 1 side per year for 4 years? Reach an agreement with Ramsdens for the old supermarket site for a transport / parking hub. Develop the nearby train station. With a little imagination, organisation and care everything you could want out of a new build can be achieved at BP. That area can then be regenerated.
Look, I’m all for a new state of the art, all singing, all dancing stadium. A real icon for the Town. Over the years I have written in the GT and on the fishy supporting proposed moves to Great Coates, then Peaks Parkway. But why move, accepting second best, just for the sake of it? To do it right a new stadium we can all be proud of will cost much, much more than £20 million. If an opportunity arose that we had 50 million to spend on a stadium then great. But unfortunately, we don’t.
It doesn’t matter if all links in the chain are coloured blue for the first time in the Towns history. It would only matter if we had the money.
A few people have commented that Ollie “must know something that we don’t” otherwise he would never had agreed to come. Seriously? We honestly believe the man knows of someone willing to splash tens of millions of pounds in Grimsby. The guy just wanted to get back into football management with a bigger stake in the running of a club. Not necessarily ours. Shortly before coming to us he was turned down by Bristol Rovers. There is no great conspiracy here.
I’m not being negative just for the sake of being negative. I’m just adding some realism and hopefully common sense to the debate. As I’ve written previously, we have all been here before. If we are not careful and start to make serious changes to BP, then we may end up with no stadium at all!

So many holes in this approach.
Why would Ramsden sell his site to the club when he was instrumental in nearly ruining us not that long ago?
Why spend money developing a nearby station (I assume you mean New Clee) which is would only be used for 23 occasions a year and is owned by Network Rail?
Wherever does the money come from to demolish existing stands and build new ones?
There is no guarantee that planning permission would be granted to upgrade BP. You forget that when a new ground was first proposed, many years ago it was because the club originally approached the Council about developing BP and they said that it would would be better if the club moved. There would be a string of objections as long as your arm from residents of neighboring streets to any development, especially if a move of the ground was an alternative.
There is still the problem of car parking and all the match day problems that causes.
A new ground is the only viable option and I'm sure it could be achieved with a £20 million budget. If this wasn't possible then surely the club/JF wouldn't pursue this option?

Without going through all the pages of this thread that has no doubt turn into politics, are the majority happy?

I am, no point in delaying and delaying, just get it done, stop being negative about everything!
If it was all perfect for everyone, it would be boring

Redeveloping BP is like smearing savlon on herpes. It needs more than a redevelopment. It needs restructuring massively. The transport infrastructure is terrible and the area is blocked in by housing that would negate anything resembling adequate. Unless all the properties around were purchased there is not enough space. Then, you have to think about that extra cost.

Quoted from promotion plaice

Anyone know how much of the regeneration money can be put towards the new stadium, nowt I would imagine.

No enabling development as well as far as I can see so dead duck again if you ask me unfortunately.

For a private company maybe none but for a community stadium maybe lots depending on what the build encompasses. Build social housing into the actual stadium and we could unlock public monies for elements of the build + it reduces the overall site costs as there would be one site office, security, admin, project management that could be spread across the whole scheme not just the housing elements.

Same for building a primary school into the structure or a library, or social work family support facilities  etc. Would there be a primary school that's close to end of life nearby that could be included in the development for example?

Quoted from Jarmo.Is.God

Without going through all the pages of this thread that has no doubt turn into politics, are the majority happy?

I am, no point in delaying and delaying, just get it done, stop being negative about everything!
If it was all perfect for everyone, it would be boring

The majority are on board. The vast majority would love it to happen. What we need is proof from the club that to coin a phrase have all their ducks in a row.

Councillor Fenty saying he wants to relocate to Freeman street is just the starting gun. It seems they are not sure who even owns the land and finance and planning arrangements will be battles ahead.

I think the new stadium will continue to be a pipe dream myself but I hope I am wrong.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

The majority are on board. The vast majority would love it to happen. What we need is proof from the club that to coin a phrase have all their ducks in a row.

Councillor Fenty saying he wants to relocate to Freeman street is just the starting gun. It seems they are not sure who even owns the land and finance and planning arrangements will be battles ahead.

I think the new stadium will continue to be a pipe dream myself but I hope I am wrong.

This bit is unreal to me.  How can a load of demolition happen if they don't know who owns the land the buildings were once sat on?!! I can't get my head around that.

Quoted from arryarryarry

As did Great Coates and Peaks Parkway.

Great Coates would have indeed been great.  Not everyone was on board with that, and so much time has gone by that nowadays out of town stadiums are not looked on with so much envy, but at the time it would have been incredible.  Alas, it was not to be.  However, Freemo would tick miles more boxes than GC ever did.

Peaks Parkway was a strange one, but would still have worked in it's own way.  Freemo, though, blows it's socks off.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

The majority are on board. The vast majority would love it to happen. What we need is proof from the club that to coin a phrase have all their ducks in a row.

Do we even have any ducks?

Maybe someone needs to speak to cherry valley

Quoted from Heisenberg

This bit is unreal to me.  How can a load of demolition happen if they don't know who owns the land the buildings were once sat on?!! I can't get my head around that.

I think that is what Philip Day said the other day. It struck me as bizarre and put doubt in my mind that there had been any serious investigation to whether the site was viable.

Nothing would surprise me but I cannot understand why the club has set themselves up for another fall if they weren't certain it could be delivered.  And that is not even thinking about finance and planning difficulties.

If a stadium was ever built, what are the council plans for the rest of Freeman street?

Probably best just to keep supporting the team and see if any progress has been made in a year's time.

Quoted from heppy88

I can see it, but how can we afford it? The redevelopment of BP will not produce the same results as a new stadium. But I'm sure we have a better chance of financing the redevelopment of BP than finding 30 -50 million needed for a new stadium. I'm sure many of us have been to some of the recently built stadia and found them soulless and without character. And let's not forget the bottom line is the football. As impressive as it is, Chesterfields swanky ground hasn't been working any miracles for them. I really hope I'm wrong on this. I really hope the powers that be can pull this off. But who honestly thinks they can?

Regarding the financing, I'm with you all the way, Heppy.  I've asked the same questions too and we're no closer to an answer to that one.

I think the club HAVE to keep us fans on board here with regular updates.  It's the not knowing that irritates people the most.  If the Telegraph didn't get wind of the Shutes thing, even now I don't think the club would have told us a thing about it.  Some will say there the club would be justified as there was nothing to tell, but now at least the club realised that such a prospect got people talking and genuinely excited.

I think from now on we should get a monthly update from the club as to where this is at.  If there is no news, tell us there is no news, BUT with the caveat that we can than ask "why is there no news?".  Someone needs to be held accountable for their action or inaction.  This is how you get things done, being given targets and sticking to them.  If you don't achieve them, you have to explain why.  It's not about hanging someone out to dry, it's more about giving the fans a point of contact regarding the stadium and keeping us all posted.  If the club have an action that is needed but it hasn't been achieved, then we need telling.  If the club have done all they can and now it's with the council, we know we need an answer from the council etc.....

What's clear to me is that Blundell Park has had it, and we need to move on.  The club need to find a way of achieving this, preferably before most of us on here are all dead!

I suspect that monthly update will be rather dull...

The idea of building a school in or around the site is interesting but nigh on impossible, complex and not something that can just happen.

Community based projects etc can work and be incorporated but it’s clear that those questions haven’t really been looked at given they still actually haven’t figured out how to pay for it and fund it.

I think in the last god knows how many years there’s been more detailed discussions about what bloody pies it’ll sell rather than important discussion around funding, wider community impact and ensuring the stadium is designed effectively and what is needed from that...

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Who’s fault will it be when the potential redevelopment funding gets swallowed up by further austerity cuts?

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