Paul Hurst mk II - some statistics

All League matches…

Played 127
Won 47 (37.0%)
Drew 34
Lost 46
Goals for 150
Goals against 152
Points 175 (1.38 PPG = 63 Pts over 46 matches)

League 2 matches only…

Played 83
Won 24 (28.9%)
Drew 26
Lost 33
Goals for 82
Goals against 106
Points 98 (1.18 PPG = 54 Pts over 46 matches)

By amazing coincidence Ian Holloway also has a 28.9% win percentage in League 2 matches as Town manager.

Come on these facts and figures mean little in the grand scheme of things.

What we really want to know is how the club are progressing their B-Corp status?

All be sorted when we get the new training ground.

Out of interest, what would those stats be without the relegation season? I'm not saying those results don't count and Hurst is absolved of any responsibility, but it's fairer to judge over the last season in a bit when he had full pre seasons and stability.

Quoted from Mariner93er

Out of interest, what would those stats be without the relegation season? I'm not saying those results don't count and Hurst is absolved of any responsibility, but it's fairer to judge over the last season in a bit when he had full pre seasons and stability.

Just exclude the matches we lost that will look better

Quoted from male private Nale

Come on these facts and figures mean little in the grand scheme of things.

What we really want to know is how the club are progressing their B-Corp status?

You’re gonna have to let it go sometime soon Nick. Fenty is gone and so are you.

First Team Manager - Paul Hurst - Ex DEFENDER
Assistant Manager - Chris Doig - Ex DEFENDER
First Team Coach - Ben Davis - Ex DEFENDER
Coach - Shaun Pearson - Ex DEFENDER

Who coaches the Forwards (And Midfielders) ?

Saying that last night why did we have a Right Back playing Left Back. A player who played the majority of last season playing Left Back at Center Back. And our best Center Back playing Right Back. Answers on a Post Card to PH, The Office under the stairs, Main Stand, Blundell Park.  Cleethorpes.

Muggle or Wizard ?

PH has overseen something like 500 Town games how many stand out as entertaining?

Here’s some stats about our performance in L2 by ownership…

Fenty 2004-10…

P 276
W 86 (31.16%)
D 77
L 113
GF 323
GA 375
Pts 335 (1.21 PPG)

Fenty 2016-21…

P 221
W 68 (30.77%)
D 55
L 98
GF 228
GA 305
Pts 259 (1.17 PPG)

1877 Partners 2022-present…

P 58
W 19 (32.76%)
D 18
L 21
GF 63
GA 72
Pts 75 (1.29 PPG)

So given Fenty is the anti-Christ and 1878 walk on water…

Did Fenty overachieve or are 1878 underachieving as owners of GTFC?

I’m asking that question because the up turn in resources (money, facilities, staff) doesn’t appear to have given us much of an increase in results on the pitch.

It won’t as we have retained the same useless manager. This is as good as it will get with Hurst

Notwithstanding the fact that Ben Davies was a goal-scoring midfielder for the bulk of his career (he was 35 when he arrived here), for me our defensive shortcomings have been more prominent than our offensive ones. We have conceded 6 more goals than we had at the same point last season - an increase of 60%. That has to be statistically significant. Our “goals for” is identical, incidentally.

Anecdotally, results have been sub-par and there hasn’t been sufficient evidence in the accompanying performances to offer confidence that we are on the brink of clicking into a run of significant form. In mitigation, I still don’t think it’s unreasonable to point out that we’ve had a tougher run than average, playing 7 out of the current top 9 in our opening 12, plus, by the time Saturday arrives, 11, 12, 13 and 14.

Ultimately though, that has to even out eventually and with it has to come an upturn in results and performances. I said previously that the end of October seemed like a fair line in the sand to take stock of where we are. A trip to rapidly improving and second-placed Stockport a week-on-Saturday changes the complexion of this month somewhat, and so I’d be tempted to extend that period to, but not beyond, the 18th November by which time we’ll have played the entire current bottom 5.

Nostalgia doesn’t get you 3 points on a Saturday, but in Hurst we have a manager who has delivered great things, great memories, in recent times and who, more often than not, tends to turn around poor runs of form. That doesn’t give him an endless leash, but I think it should afford him additional time to right the team’s current glaring deficiencies. I believe he’s earned the right to that.

It’s impossible to argue that the start to the season has been good enough or close to expectations, even with those mitigating factors on board. And it’s impossible to argue that our summer recruitment looks faultless or fully rounded. But calm is needed; I don’t think for one second we are in grave danger - I do think things will become much clearer in the month or so ahead.

Quoted from Poojah

Notwithstanding the fact that Ben Davies was a goal-scoring midfielder for the bulk of his career (he was 35 when he arrived here), for me our defensive shortcomings have been more prominent than our offensive ones. We have conceded 6 more goals than we had at the same point last season - an increase of 60%. That has to be statistically significant. Our “goals for” is identical, incidentally.

Anecdotally, results have been sub-par and there hasn’t been sufficient evidence in the accompanying performances to offer confidence that we are on the brink of clicking into a run of significant form. In mitigation, I still don’t think it’s unreasonable to point out that we’ve had a tougher run than average, playing 7 out of the current top 9 in our opening 12, plus, by the time Saturday arrives, 11, 12, 13 and 14.

Ultimately though, that has to even out eventually and with it has to come an upturn in results and performances. I said previously that the end of October seemed like a fair line in the sand to take stock of where we are. A trip to rapidly improving and second-placed Stockport a week-on-Saturday changes the complexion of this month somewhat, and so I’d be tempted to extend that period to, but not beyond, the 18th November by which time we’ll have played the entire current bottom 5.

Nostalgia doesn’t get you 3 points on a Saturday, but in Hurst we have a manager who has delivered great things, great memories, in recent times and who, more often than not, tends to turn around poor runs of form. That doesn’t give him an endless leash, but I think it should afford him additional time to right the team’s current glaring deficiencies. I believe he’s earned the right to that.

It’s impossible to argue that the start to the season has been good enough or close to expectations, even with those mitigating factors on board. And it’s impossible to argue that our summer recruitment looks faultless or fully rounded. But calm is needed; I don’t think for one second we are in grave danger - I do think things will become much clearer in the month or so ahead.

Nice post… but I have a question…

Results (winning and drawing) and performances (overall team and individual players winning their battles with the player they line up opposite) are important, but do you find the football we are being subjected to entertaining?

Because I don’t. I find it negative.

I travel to BP with my dad and son. I woke up the morning of the Crawley game and I really didn’t want to go to the game.

For me winning and success are a bonus. Being entertained is a non-negotiable though.

Just for balance a few months ago he got us our highest league finish for 16 years and our first FA Cup quarter final in 84 years, so he’s still got a fair amount of credit with me.

At last , People are starting to see what i see. For some reason the players are not doing it for hurst or hurst is not doing it for them whatever it is its not working is it.  Despite what people think i do not like to see anyone out of work  but lets face it he is not going to have to go bargain hunting through the cheap out of date food in bargain corer for many years to come is he. But i do think that fans make sacrifices so they can go to their fav fix . And an old age saying that if you continue to do the same you will get the same outcome every time . I dont know like most on here if a change of manager will make a difference but we cannot keep going on like we are as we are going down a slippery slope at the moment .. Stockwood and petitt  need to get their heads out of the papers and old buildings and start looking at what the product looks like that they are trying to sell, fans are already starting to slip away and will keep doing so if things stay as they are  

It’s all very frustrating.
I’m sure everyone will be trying their best. Nobody likes failing.
Just can’t work out what they need to do differently to succeed.

First half v Bradford they were great.
Demolished in form Gillingham
Stuffed Salford

What was different about those two and a half games?

Quoted from GollyGTFC

Nice post… but I have a question…

Results (winning and drawing) and performances (overall team and individual players winning their battles with the player they line up opposite) are important, but do you find the football we are being subjected to entertaining?

Because I don’t. I find it negative.

I travel to BP with my dad and son. I woke up the morning of the Crawley game and I really didn’t want to go to the game.

For me winning and success are a bonus. Being entertained is a non-negotiable though.

Honest answer? I enjoyed the Gillingham game - I thought we played well and were generally entertaining in that. Beyond that, I have to go back a long way, particularly if we’re talking home league games, where I can recall coming away feeling genuinely enthralled by what I had seen.

So you’re right, things haven’t been greatly entertaining, in the league at least, for a sustained period of time. At the same time, I don’t think there’s anything new and surprising about that.

Hurst sides are generally a decent watch when they’re frequently winning, and turgid as fúck when they’re not. The start to our 21/22 season was greatly entertaining. As was the end - you can’t describe those play-off games as anything but incredible. The middle part of that season, when we were losing game after game, was, by and large, awful to watch.

And so it goes. For the most part we were awful at home last season. The complexion of our home record last season was improved somewhat by wins at the tail end which were to all intents and purposes, dead rubbers. Quickly forgotten.

This season, we’ve not been able to string a decent set of results together and so performances haven’t been great either. Either the results come, and with it we see a meaningful elevation of performances, or we don’t and the conversation is no longer about how Hurst turns things around, but rather who does.

I’d like to think we won’t get to that point, but it has to be considered a real possibility that it might.

It’s just possible that the reason all the teams we’ve played are in the top 9 is that they’ve played us. Every 3 points is key at this stage of the season

Quoted from buckstown

It’s just possible that the reason all the teams we’ve played are in the top 9 is that they’ve played us. Every 3 points is key at this stage of the season

Each of them has won an additional 4 to 7 matches, so you can probably draw the conclusion that it’s not just that.

6 of those 9 likely will be right up there with the biggest spenders in the division, so that might be a factor worth considering.

Quoted from male private Johnson

Just for balance a few months ago he got us our highest league finish for 16 years and our first FA Cup quarter final in 84 years, so he’s still got a fair amount of credit with me.

He was manager for 10 of those 16 seasons and I find it difficult to give him to much credit for the FA cup run when the standout player in that was Orsi who he only gave 5 League starts to because he didn’t rate him

Quoted from IlkleyMariner

It’s all very frustrating.
I’m sure everyone will be trying their best. Nobody likes failing.
Just can’t work out what they need to do differently to succeed.

First half v Bradford they were great.
Demolished in form Gillingham
Stuffed Salford

What was different about those two and a half games?

Last 30 mins or so at Swindon.

What is entertainment though?

The Buckley Mark I side was entertaining and successful. I was young but I remember the brilliance of that team, both in the flesh and reminiscing on YouTube - the clips look like a Benny Hill sketch, with all of the fast flicks and feints. Lovely stuff.

However, when Buckley left for WBA (spit), Laws changed the style. We were more direct and we definitely had more players in the box. There were a lot of fans near where I sat (Main Stand!), who were glad Buckley had left because they had become bored and were vocal on the lack of ‘entertainment’ from his indirect approach.

I was 14 when Buckley returned. As well as Town, I’d grown up watching a lot of foreign football - mostly Serie A. I never imagined my team - a provincial, little Town on the Humber could play the sort of cerebral, continental, possession based football that I saw in Italy.

I was very entertained. It was successful. It was also pragmatic. Even in his first stint, Buckley had become increasingly structured in style; partially due to the effects of the introduction of the back pass rule.

I don’t believe the likes of Denni would have found that Buckley MKII side entertaining.

They may have found it entertaining in 97/98 because we were promoted and won the AW Shield.

Even in 97/98, I remember abuse of Buckley and the team but throughout the whole spell I would here:

‘We’re reliant on Jack to win us a penalty’
‘We’re reliant on Donovan - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’, or later…
‘We’re reliant on Groves - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’
‘Why did we sign Nogan? He runs like a camel fleeing a dentist surgery and he couldn’t even finish a Blockbuster video’
‘I’m fed up with this tippy-tappy, chess football’
‘We don’t create anything, don’t get players in the box. It’s Anti-Football - get John Beck in’
‘Buckley has short arms and long pockets’
‘Why does Gally keep cutting inside. He’s got no right foot. Sack him and play Fickling’
‘Stacy Coldicott - what does he do. Trots around like a bald geisha’
‘I’ve never liked Buckley. Should never have let him come crawling back after betraying us. Scab’


Then Lennie Lawrence arrived and again, a lot of fans were happy Buckley had gone and we were playing a more attacking brand of football.

To me, entertaining is knowing that the team are trying their best and are competitive. I’m realistic to know we can’t win 6-0 every match and we will lose at some point.

We are clearly in transition. Hurst is trying to implement a more possession based approach with a higher defensive line. The injuries to Rose and, in particular, Maher haven’t helped with this.

I do understand the frustration. There have been sensible posts, from both sides of the middle ground. It’s just the utter rubbish the odd (in both senses of the word) few posters make that riles me more than our current performances.

Quoted from HerveJosse

He was manager for 10 of those 16 seasons and I find it difficult to give him to much credit for the FA cup run when the standout player in that was Orsi who he only gave 5 League starts to because he didn’t rate him

So, Hurst doesn't achieve anything and, if he does, it wasn't anything to do with him?

The fact that he signed Orsi doesn't count, because he didn't play him often enough?

Not sure that I follow the logic.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

I don’t believe the likes of Denni would have found that Buckley MKII side entertaining.

They may have found it entertaining in 97/98 because we were promoted and won the AW Shield.

Even in 97/98, I remember abuse of Buckley and the team but throughout the whole spell I would here:

‘We’re reliant on Jack to win us a penalty’
‘We’re reliant on Donovan - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’, or later…
‘We’re reliant on Groves - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’
‘Why did we sign Nogan? He runs like a camel fleeing a dentist surgery and he couldn’t even finish a Blockbuster video’
‘I’m fed up with this tippy-tappy, chess football’
‘We don’t create anything, don’t get players in the box. It’s Anti-Football - get John Beck in’
‘Buckley has short arms and long pockets’
‘Why does Gally keep cutting inside. He’s got no right foot. Sack him and play Fickling’
‘Stacy Coldicott - what does he do. Trots around like a bald geisha’
‘I’ve never liked Buckley. Should never have let him come crawling back after betraying us. Scab’

I remember all of that well. I don't think anything has changed over the years as far as people constantly moaning unless we win the league/playoffs/beat a big team in the cup. Buckley Mk II had a lot of issues but people view the past with a different lens now as we are no longer a team that is punching above our weight or treading water in what is now the Championship, we probably wouldn't get there on our budget today as it's a much different league (basically a mini PL as far as budgets) but the nostalgia exists. Stacy Coldicott is viewed as a good player these days and many put him on lists of best players but a lot of people wanted rid of him and thought he was useless when he actually played for us, most didn't care about what he does well as it didn't involve creating chances or putting the ball in the net. It's funny how time changes things but the one sure thing that will never change is some people like to moan about the manager we do have.

Buckley v Hurst keeps cropping up and some similarities in how the fanbase viewed them are correct. I need Golly to help here but in the EFL how many times did a Buckley team score 3 or more at home versus Hurst ,I'd be amazed if Hurst got half an many goals?

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

What is entertainment though?

Entertainment is probably walking out of BP or an away ground thinking you’ve had value for money.

I don’t think it’s about playing neat, tippy tippy football.

Wrexham 4-5 Grimsby was entertaining but their was very little in the way of quality about the match apart from McAtee’s goal.

Coincidentally one game that springs to mind about being entertained was a game between the same 2 sides in the 2012/13 season I think. It was a Friday night game (possibly on TV) at BP and 2 really good sides went at each other for 90 minutes with Town winning 1-0 thanks to a late Ross Hannah goal. I definitely walked out of BP after that game feeling like I’d seen a great game and been well entertained.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

Entertainment is probably walking out of BP or an away ground thinking you’ve had value for money.

I don’t think it’s about playing neat, tippy tippy football.

Wrexham 4-5 Grimsby was entertaining but their was very little in the way of quality about the match apart from McAtee’s goal.

Coincidentally one game that springs to mind about being entertained was a game between the same 2 sides in the 2012/13 season I think. It was a Friday night game (possibly on TV) at BP and 2 really good sides went at each other for 90 minutes with Town winning 1-0 thanks to a late Ross Hannah goal. I definitely walked out of BP after that game feeling like I’d seen a great game and been well entertained.

Taylor's goal was superb from start to finish. Perfect long ball by Crocombe, delightful chest control by Taylor to McAtee who put a delicious cross in and wonderfully finished by Taylor.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

Entertainment is probably walking out of BP or an away ground thinking you’ve had value for money.

I don’t think it’s about playing neat, tippy tippy football.

Wrexham 4-5 Grimsby was entertaining but their was very little in the way of quality about the match apart from McAtee’s goal.

Coincidentally one game that springs to mind about being entertained was a game between the same 2 sides in the 2012/13 season I think. It was a Friday night game (possibly on TV) at BP and 2 really good sides went at each other for 90 minutes with Town winning 1-0 thanks to a late Ross Hannah goal. I definitely walked out of BP after that game feeling like I’d seen a great game and been well entertained.

I don’t attend many home matches but it’s rare I’ve left an away match since Hurst returned and not enjoyed it, or something about it.

Swindon (a) last season was one certainly ***. I was on holiday for Wrexham (a) this season so can’t comment.

With our defensive work, from all of the 10 players behind Rose (Rose generally works like a double shifted nurse, so he’s exempt from this criticism), in the past few games, Town matches can’t be anything other than entertaining at the moment. 😊

***although, I am definitely in the minority here, but I sometimes quite enjoy being the victim of a damn good thrashing. It’s the little details. I remember seeing a dead deer on the side of the A40 after that Swindon mauling and it made me think of Andy Smith.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

I sometimes quite enjoy being the victim of a damn good thrashing

And the lady that does it for you appreciates the money but what about football?

To quote as above

playing 7 out of the current top 9 in our opening 12.

Surely that is not an excuse, if we are, ambitious in make the play offs, we should be beating a few of them.

I was very fortunate to have a season ticket in Buckley days.
Apart from Laurie Mc and Bill Shankley we are unlikely to have witnessed anything like BuckleyTown.

It’s unfair to compare current times with the three previous named managers either in terms of performance or entertainment.

A top half in League one would do me for now…..

Only 2 managers have won a league title.

That's the amazing thing to me. As good as the football was played by those Buckley sides, we didn't get close to winning the title in any of our promotion seasons when he was in charge!

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

What is entertainment though?

The Buckley Mark I side was entertaining and successful. I was young but I remember the brilliance of that team, both in the flesh and reminiscing on YouTube - the clips look like a Benny Hill sketch, with all of the fast flicks and feints. Lovely stuff.

However, when Buckley left for WBA (spit), Laws changed the style. We were more direct and we definitely had more players in the box. There were a lot of fans near where I sat (Main Stand!), who were glad Buckley had left because they had become bored and were vocal on the lack of ‘entertainment’ from his indirect approach.

I was 14 when Buckley returned. As well as Town, I’d grown up watching a lot of foreign football - mostly Serie A. I never imagined my team - a provincial, little Town on the Humber could play the sort of cerebral, continental, possession based football that I saw in Italy.

I was very entertained. It was successful. It was also pragmatic. Even in his first stint, Buckley had become increasingly structured in style; partially due to the effects of the introduction of the back pass rule.

I don’t believe the likes of Denni would have found that Buckley MKII side entertaining.

They may have found it entertaining in 97/98 because we were promoted and won the AW Shield.

Even in 97/98, I remember abuse of Buckley and the team but throughout the whole spell I would here:

‘We’re reliant on Jack to win us a penalty’
‘We’re reliant on Donovan - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’, or later…
‘We’re reliant on Groves - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’
‘Why did we sign Nogan? He runs like a camel fleeing a dentist surgery and he couldn’t even finish a Blockbuster video’
‘I’m fed up with this tippy-tappy, chess football’
‘We don’t create anything, don’t get players in the box. It’s Anti-Football - get John Beck in’
‘Buckley has short arms and long pockets’
‘Why does Gally keep cutting inside. He’s got no right foot. Sack him and play Fickling’
‘Stacy Coldicott - what does he do. Trots around like a bald geisha’
‘I’ve never liked Buckley. Should never have let him come crawling back after betraying us. Scab’


Then Lennie Lawrence arrived and again, a lot of fans were happy Buckley had gone and we were playing a more attacking brand of football.

To me, entertaining is knowing that the team are trying their best and are competitive. I’m realistic to know we can’t win 6-0 every match and we will lose at some point.

We are clearly in transition. Hurst is trying to implement a more possession based approach with a higher defensive line. The injuries to Rose and, in particular, Maher haven’t helped with this.

I do understand the frustration. There have been sensible posts, from both sides of the middle ground. It’s just the utter rubbish the odd (in both senses of the word) few posters make that riles me more than our current performances.

Entertainment is like an Elephant difficult to describe but you know when you see one .
One up front with a small back to the goal harrier and hoping for bits and pieces doesn’t make for great entertainment very often

Quoted from IlkleyMariner

I was very fortunate to have a season ticket in Buckley days.
Apart from Laurie Mc and Bill Shankley we are unlikely to have witnessed anything like BuckleyTown.

It’s unfair to compare current times with the three previous named managers either in terms of performance or entertainment.

A top half in League one would do me for now…..

George Kerrs ( now ) first division winning side was up there with those two

Shankly, Mcmenemy and Kerr were all big ebullient personalities and their teams reflected that .

When Jason and Andrew took over they said it's a long term project not a quick fix.

Although we got out the conference quite quickly .

Slowly slowly catch thee monkey.

Quoted from HerveJosse

He was manager for 10 of those 16 seasons and I find it difficult to give him to much credit for the FA cup run when the standout player in that was Orsi who he only gave 5 League starts to because he didn’t rate him

What a load of utter bullshit that is. Orsi didnt play in the first 3 rounds ffs. But no of course the players did all the work, no credit to PH at all. Just like when its not going great guns, its not the players, its all PH.

This is what pisses me off about this entire argument, some, i repeat some, will fire crap at Hurst no matter what, becsuse he cupped his ear, because he told the offended few a few home truths, because he’s a “ boring yorkie”. Its absolutely embarrassing the way he still gets treated by some of you. He’s given us some of the best memories we’ll ever have, and deserves a lot more credit than he gets. There will be a time he moves on, there will be a time when we part ways, We all know that, Paul will know that, but lack of respect he gets really pisses me off

Quoted from Hagrid

What a load of utter bullshit that is. Orsi didnt play in the first 3 rounds ffs. But no of course the players did all the work, no credit to PH at all. Just like when its not going great guns, its not the players, its all PH.

This is what pisses me off about this entire argument, some, i repeat some, will fire crap at Hurst no matter what, becsuse he cupped his ear, because he told the offended few a few home truths, because he’s a “ boring yorkie”. Its absolutely embarrassing the way he still gets treated by some of you. He’s given us some of the best memories we’ll ever have, and deserves a lot more credit than he gets. There will be a time he moves on, there will be a time when we part ways, We all know that, Paul will know that, but lack of respect he gets really pisses me off

Issue is though, people use the things you’ve said (that are very few & far between) as a thing to deflect from genuine criticism of Hurst.

I’m not in the Hurst out camp just yet but I’m in the ‘very concerned’ camp. I feel like most the stuff on The Fishy this time round has been reasoned and relatively fair, but some of those opinions get shot down as anti Hurst negativity instead as a way for some people to drown out the noise.

The results are poor, performances are boring, we concede easy goals and struggle to score them. The excuses for those 4 things are starting to wear extremely thin but I think the fan base has still been relatively patient with it all.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

What is entertainment though?

The Buckley Mark I side was entertaining and successful. I was young but I remember the brilliance of that team, both in the flesh and reminiscing on YouTube - the clips look like a Benny Hill sketch, with all of the fast flicks and feints. Lovely stuff.

However, when Buckley left for WBA (spit), Laws changed the style. We were more direct and we definitely had more players in the box. There were a lot of fans near where I sat (Main Stand!), who were glad Buckley had left because they had become bored and were vocal on the lack of ‘entertainment’ from his indirect approach.

I was 14 when Buckley returned. As well as Town, I’d grown up watching a lot of foreign football - mostly Serie A. I never imagined my team - a provincial, little Town on the Humber could play the sort of cerebral, continental, possession based football that I saw in Italy.

I was very entertained. It was successful. It was also pragmatic. Even in his first stint, Buckley had become increasingly structured in style; partially due to the effects of the introduction of the back pass rule.

I don’t believe the likes of Denni would have found that Buckley MKII side entertaining.

They may have found it entertaining in 97/98 because we were promoted and won the AW Shield.

Even in 97/98, I remember abuse of Buckley and the team but throughout the whole spell I would here:

‘We’re reliant on Jack to win us a penalty’
‘We’re reliant on Donovan - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’, or later…
‘We’re reliant on Groves - if we didn’t have him we’d be in the relegation zone’
‘Why did we sign Nogan? He runs like a camel fleeing a dentist surgery and he couldn’t even finish a Blockbuster video’
‘I’m fed up with this tippy-tappy, chess football’
‘We don’t create anything, don’t get players in the box. It’s Anti-Football - get John Beck in’
‘Buckley has short arms and long pockets’
‘Why does Gally keep cutting inside. He’s got no right foot. Sack him and play Fickling’
‘Stacy Coldicott - what does he do. Trots around like a bald geisha’
‘I’ve never liked Buckley. Should never have let him come crawling back after betraying us. Scab’


Then Lennie Lawrence arrived and again, a lot of fans were happy Buckley had gone and we were playing a more attacking brand of football.

To me, entertaining is knowing that the team are trying their best and are competitive. I’m realistic to know we can’t win 6-0 every match and we will lose at some point.

We are clearly in transition. Hurst is trying to implement a more possession based approach with a higher defensive line. The injuries to Rose and, in particular, Maher haven’t helped with this.

I do understand the frustration. There have been sensible posts, from both sides of the middle ground. It’s just the utter rubbish the odd (in both senses of the word) few posters make that riles me more than our current performances.

Yeah I remember those Buckleys days part 1 and 2 prime spot in the main was always good fun as a kid and some great days .

Some did hate the Buckley  style(or got bored with it) 'bloody useless,get it forward !' Was one of the regular vocal calls .

Laws took over and 'bloody useless ,keep it on floor !'
Was a regular gripe then from some of our regulars .

Not sure sometimes , anyone can win .

[quote=872]

Issue is though, people use the things you’ve said (that are very few & far between) as a thing to deflect from genuine criticism of Hurst.

I’m not in the Hurst out camp just yet but I’m in the ‘very concerned’ camp. I feel like most the stuff on The Fishy this time round has been reasoned and relatively fair, but some of those opinions get shot down as anti Hurst negativity instead as a way for some people to drown out the noise.

The results are poor, performances are boring, we concede easy goals and struggle to score them. The excuses for those 4 things are starting to wear extremely thin but I think the fan base has still been relatively patient with it all.[/quote]


The bit highlighted...
The patience is getting really tested though, there locals are getting restless, the disdain is getting louder whilst the atmosphere is virtually like a morgue at BP now.
Even the die hard Hurst fans I sit with in the pontoon have had enough. In seasons gone he's turned the bad runs around by having a truly gritty, seige mentality within the group, I'm not seeing that this year, whether that's due to the new players, existing players or they've just not gelled and the characters aren't quite clicking.
My biggest concern is the win percentage is dropping, the goals against are increasing, while goals for are stagnant, that to me is not mid table stability, attendances are falling (home and away btw) and there's a backwards trend developing.

Quoted from Northbank Mariner

[quote=872]
My biggest concern is the win percentage is dropping, the goals against are increasing, while goals for are stagnant,

Except the goals for aren’t stagnant.

We’ve scored 7 in 4 league matches.

If you extrapolate that small sample it’s over 80 goals per season, which is very good

It’s the defending of the whole team (bar Rose) and squad that’s the current problem.

Hopefully, if Maher remains fit, this will improve and our defensive line will be higher, and the midfield and wide forwards will be closer to Rose.

Quoted from Hagrid

What a load of utter bullshit that is. Orsi didnt play in the first 3 rounds ffs. But no of course the players did all the work, no credit to PH at all. Just like when its not going great guns, its not the players, its all PH.

This is what pisses me off about this entire argument, some, i repeat some, will fire crap at Hurst no matter what, becsuse he cupped his ear, because he told the offended few a few home truths, because he’s a “ boring yorkie”. Its absolutely embarrassing the way he still gets treated by some of you. He’s given us some of the best memories we’ll ever have, and deserves a lot more credit than he gets. There will be a time he moves on, there will be a time when we part ways, We all know that, Paul will know that, but lack of respect he gets really pisses me off

Spot on,

Quoted from Poojah

Notwithstanding the fact that Ben Davies was a goal-scoring midfielder for the bulk of his career (he was 35 when he arrived here), for me our defensive shortcomings have been more prominent than our offensive ones. We have conceded 6 more goals than we had at the same point last season - an increase of 60%. That has to be statistically significant. Our “goals for” is identical, incidentally.

Anecdotally, results have been sub-par and there hasn’t been sufficient evidence in the accompanying performances to offer confidence that we are on the brink of clicking into a run of significant form. In mitigation, I still don’t think it’s unreasonable to point out that we’ve had a tougher run than average, playing 7 out of the current top 9 in our opening 12, plus, by the time Saturday arrives, 11, 12, 13 and 14.

Ultimately though, that has to even out eventually and with it has to come an upturn in results and performances. I said previously that the end of October seemed like a fair line in the sand to take stock of where we are. A trip to rapidly improving and second-placed Stockport a week-on-Saturday changes the complexion of this month somewhat, and so I’d be tempted to extend that period to, but not beyond, the 18th November by which time we’ll have played the entire current bottom 5.

Nostalgia doesn’t get you 3 points on a Saturday, but in Hurst we have a manager who has delivered great things, great memories, in recent times and who, more often than not, tends to turn around poor runs of form. That doesn’t give him an endless leash, but I think it should afford him additional time to right the team’s current glaring deficiencies. I believe he’s earned the right to that.

It’s impossible to argue that the start to the season has been good enough or close to expectations, even with those mitigating factors on board. And it’s impossible to argue that our summer recruitment looks faultless or fully rounded. But calm is needed; I don’t think for one second we are in grave danger - I do think things will become much clearer in the month or so ahead.

The main thing that's lacking at the minute is a bit of patience. We've all been frothing at the mouth with the anticipation of a tilt at promotion. A win on Saturday gives us an even start against predominantly top half teams, and we've had significant injuries to cope with alongside Hurst still figuring out his best eleven and formation. Player for player I think we're a lot stronger and quicker than last season. Have we gelled yet? Not in the slightest, but there are signs there.

From a personal point of view, I'd like him to stick with Hunt and Conteh as a midfield pairing. Whenever Hunt plays it's noticeable that he moves the ball quicker than the rest and the players around him need to adjust to his pace of thought over a number of games. And I also miss the rampaging chaos of Efete down the right. The last few games he's been at least as proficient as Mullarkey in defending, so why not? And finally.. Maher has been a big miss for us, it's no coincidence that our goals against column has been stacking up while he's been out the team.

So I'd suggest.. stick with the team for as long as you can.. building up negative sentiment and bad blood won't get us three points on a Saturday..

Expectations, expectations, & expectations.

Everyone has a different one!


But..........

............I expect to be looking forward to the next match, and I am not at the present time.

Quoted from Hagrid

What a load of utter bullshit that is. Orsi didnt play in the first 3 rounds ffs. But no of course the players did all the work, no credit to PH at all. Just like when its not going great guns, its not the players, its all PH.

This is what pisses me off about this entire argument, some, i repeat some, will fire crap at Hurst no matter what, becsuse he cupped his ear, because he told the offended few a few home truths, because he’s a “ boring yorkie”. Its absolutely embarrassing the way he still gets treated by some of you. He’s given us some of the best memories we’ll ever have, and deserves a lot more credit than he gets. There will be a time he moves on, there will be a time when we part ways, We all know that, Paul will know that, but lack of respect he gets really pisses me off

I think most recognise the part Hurst played in our promotion , cup run and relatively steady first season so kudos to him for that .

I'm unconcerned about the daft cup games and barely look at the result in truth .

I have stated many times on here I like Hurst as a manager , and he's a safe pair of hands .

Past - he's done well for us in the main so probably does deserve trust and longer to try and make hay - the massive contradiction is managers are getting sacked all over the place for doing better in many cases ; maybe it's just the way the game has gone , but I do believe managers have a shelf life to some degree - just look at Slade & Holloway for us even .

Present - doing ok in the league but style of play not to a lot of peoples liking ; with a seemingly scattergun approach to selection & formation -- is that just a case of failure to find the right blend or more worryingly the players not being good enough to play how he want's them to ? I'm not sure .

Future - Think he deserves more time based on the above , but my amount of time is probably less than some ,more than others ; depending on results .

It's all about opinions and results isn't it , we don't know ultimately what the boards expectations are , but suspect we will probably find out in the next few months . It's all a reasonable debate though whether you are pro or anti Hurst , or like me at this point leaning towards the latter but not by much .

I liked the ear cupping Hurst though , he seemed a bit more prickly and rigid back then and seemingly made the narative of it's 'everyone against me and my team,fans including (at times )' very effective . He comes over more now as a nice bloke who has not created that same togetherness as yet with this group of players .

Let's hope for 3 points on Saturday against Accrington Stanley exactly .

Quoted from NorthseaMariner

All be sorted when we get the new training ground.

The news on the new training ground seems to have disappeared into the distant past. We are now 2 years into the project, which has gone up to £6million+ and not turf has been cut.

I am not ante JS & AP, but if this had been Fenty then the keyboard warriors would be out in force. So any news on this anybody?

Quoted from DB

The news on the new training ground seems to have disappeared into the distant past. We are now 2 years into the project, which has gone up to £6million+ and not turf has been cut.

I am not ante JS & AP, but if this had been Fenty then the keyboard warriors would be out in force. So any news on this anybody?

I wouldn't really compare the two to be honest. Fenty took 15 years to not deliver a new ground despite god knows how much time and money spent on trying to do so and regularly making big promises about it.

I dont get why the fans of Grimsby Town have such low expectations these days and are content with us being so average, unentertaining and just dull, for me the name of the game is to win but I am satisfied if we at least lose whilst trying to win, no succesful teamor manager ever has been happy or content to draw, or see a draw as  a success.

Quoted from Azimuth

…no succesful teamor manager ever has been happy or content to draw, or see a draw as  a success.

Really? Any manager, anywhere, ever?

I could name you hundreds, if so.

Lots of draws with PH, especially at home. Last season we drew 43% of our home games.

Stats stats stats.....quote all the stats you like to prove disprove anything you want....

My eyes tell me we are largely boring to watch, my brain is dulled by the approach employed.

Do we have some better technical players , likely,  do we appear better off for it right now ?  

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

Really? Any manager, anywhere, ever?

I could name you hundreds, if so.

Go on then, name them, and bare in mind I said succesful team or manager.

Quoted from Azimuth

Go on then, name them, and bear in mind I said succesful team or manager.

Virtually any Italian side from the past 60 years - that takes me past 100 already

D.Simeone
Mourinho
Benitez
Herrera
Ancelotti
Parreira
Deschamps
Emery
Ferguson post-2000

I could go on…

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

Virtually any Italian side from the past 60 years - that takes me past 100 already

D.Simeone
Mourinho
Benitez
Herrera
Ancelotti
Parreira
Deschamps
Emery
Ferguson post-2000

I could go on…

…Buckley (the greatest Town manager of my lifetime but the master of the pragmatic draw)

Quoted from Mappers

I think most recognise the part Hurst played in our promotion , cup run and relatively steady first season so kudos to him for that .

I'm unconcerned about the daft cup games and barely look at the result in truth .

I have stated many times on here I like Hurst as a manager , and he's a safe pair of hands .

Past - he's done well for us in the main so probably does deserve trust and longer to try and make hay - the massive contradiction is managers are getting sacked all over the place for doing better in many cases ; maybe it's just the way the game has gone , but I do believe managers have a shelf life to some degree - just look at Slade & Holloway for us even .

Present - doing ok in the league but style of play not to a lot of peoples liking ; with a seemingly scattergun approach to selection & formation -- is that just a case of failure to find the right blend or more worryingly the players not being good enough to play how he want's them to ? I'm not sure .

Future - Think he deserves more time based on the above , but my amount of time is probably less than some ,more than others ; depending on results .

It's all about opinions and results isn't it , we don't know ultimately what the boards expectations are , but suspect we will probably find out in the next few months . It's all a reasonable debate though whether you are pro or anti Hurst , or like me at this point leaning towards the latter but not by much .

I liked the ear cupping Hurst though , he seemed a bit more prickly and rigid back then and seemingly made the narative of it's 'everyone against me and my team,fans including (at times )' very effective . He comes over more now as a nice bloke who has not created that same togetherness as yet with this group of players .

Let's hope for 3 points on Saturday against Accrington Stanley exactly .

I was surprised I gave you the first tick on that. A good pragmatic post.

I think the training ground is going to be more important than folk realise.

Imagine you play for a premier league youth team, going to work every day in impressive facilities on very nice fields with good equipment. Then your contract is coming up for renewal. You look around a few places, and wind up moving to Grimsby, and go to work every day, to train on a shoddy pitch, getting changed in a shed, working with dilapidated gear. How motivated are you really going to feel about that?

Going to work should be motivating. It should feel like you're representing something important. With pride, comes effort. Feeling good and proud that you represent Grimsby Town. The players see the training ground 5 times a week, and BP 23 (and a big extra) times per season.

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

I think the training ground is going to be more important than folk realise.

Imagine you play for a premier league youth team, going to work every day in impressive facilities on very nice fields with good equipment. Then your contract is coming up for renewal. You look around a few places, and wind up moving to Grimsby, and go to work every day, to train on a shoddy pitch, getting changed in a shed, working with dilapidated gear. How motivated are you really going to feel about that?

Going to work should be motivating. It should feel like you're representing something important. With pride, comes effort. Feeling good and proud that you represent Grimsby Town. The players see the training ground 5 times a week, and BP 23 (and a big extra) times per season.

While I agree with you that porta cabins do not make ideal buildings, I believe you are wrong on other aspects. The playing surface at Cheapside has been upgraded, twice I believe, and new gym equipment purchased. However, as posted previously, I would like to know more about the replacement training ground.

Come on…..it’s just not a true reality to suppose that the current squad use dilapidated training facilities and get changed in a shed. So much of the discussion around our current situation dwells in areas of crass overstatement, over simplification and a notion that things are simple and black or white (no pun intended). There are clubs in L2 with worse facilities than ours - training, home stadium, poxy support. Let’s have it right. We might be sub par right now in terms of some shared theoretical sense of how we feel we should be doing, relatively speaking, but there’s such a prevalence of straw man arguments on here.

I did exaggerate to make the point, and I don't know the exact standard of the facilities at present. However, if our facilities are far below premier league/championship clubs, players are going to feel pretty underwhelmed by it when they come into that environment, and it is important.

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

I think the training ground is going to be more important than folk realise.

Imagine you play for a premier league youth team, going to work every day in impressive facilities on very nice fields with good equipment. Then your contract is coming up for renewal. You look around a few places, and wind up moving to Grimsby, and go to work every day, to train on a shoddy pitch, getting changed in a shed, working with dilapidated gear. How motivated are you really going to feel about that?

Going to work should be motivating. It should feel like you're representing something important. With pride, comes effort. Feeling good and proud that you represent Grimsby Town. The players see the training ground 5 times a week, and BP 23 (and a big extra) times per season.

I thought it had been seriously improved, better changing areas, better equipment and better pitch and I don't know if you have ever been but on the outskirts of Waltham surrounded in the main by countryside.

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

I did exaggerate to make the point, and I don't know the exact standard of the facilities at present. However, if our facilities are far below premier league/championship clubs, players are going to feel pretty underwhelmed by it when they come into that environment, and it is important.

For frigs sake.............are you expecting a team that has spent 7 of the last 13 years in Non League to have the facilities of a Premiership or Championship club?

And how many Premiership/Championship players are you expecting us to sign?

Quoted from arryarryarry

For frigs sake.............are you expecting a team that has spent 7 of the last 13 years in Non League to have the facilities of a Premiership or Championship club?

And how many Premiership/Championship players are you expecting us to sign?

No. Are you expecting us to act like a non-league or football league club?

Conteh - Middlesborough. Glennon - Burnley. Lots more if you include loans: Andrews - West Brom. Most L2 players start higher up, and clubs lower down are battling to sign these players when they are released, or don't get offered a new contract.

Are you new to football? You think players bubble up from Sunday league?

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

No. Are you expecting us to act like a non-league or football league club?

Conteh - Middlesborough. Glennon - Burnley. Lots more if you include loans: Andrews - West Brom. Most L2 players start higher up, and clubs lower down are battling to sign these players when they are released, or don't get offered a new contract.

Are you new to football? You think players bubble up from Sunday league?

Doh................those players signed so they can't have thought our training facilities were as crap as you said. Plus I doubt very much any of them troubled the person who writes out the first team team sheets.

Quoted from AncientExiledMariner

No. Are you expecting us to act like a non-league or football league club?

Conteh - Middlesborough. Glennon - Burnley. Lots more if you include loans: Andrews - West Brom. Most L2 players start higher up, and clubs lower down are battling to sign these players when they are released, or don't get offered a new contract.

Are you new to football? You think players bubble up from Sunday league?

Glennon had already been with us! We’ve signed loads of players from bigger clubs before now, long before the training ground was improved.

The pitch surface at Cheapside looked like a billiard table the last time I saw it.

Quoted from HerveJosse

The pitch surface at Cheapside looked like a billiard table the last time I saw it.

Loads of holes in it, then?

Quoted from Maringer

Loads of holes in it, then?

Yes but only round the edges

Quoted from DB

The news on the new training ground seems to have disappeared into the distant past. We are now 2 years into the project, which has gone up to £6million+ and not turf has been cut.

I am not ante JS & AP, but if this had been Fenty then the keyboard warriors would be out in force. So any news on this anybody?

Genuine question, where has this £6million figure come from?

Cheapside was much improved in the new owners first pre season. This I know because I was offered the job of the renovations whilst working on the fanzone, but I turned it down because it was too big a job for me in the timescale.

I did do some remedial repairs there however and there was loads of improvements done to the buildings and the pitch, and I'm sure further improvements have been ongoing since.

It's not Carrington, but it's not the ploggers either.

Quoted from ginnywings

Cheapside was much improved in the new owners first pre season. This I know because I was offered the job of the renovations whilst working on the fanzone, but I turned it down because it was too big a job for me in the timescale.

I did do some remedial repairs there however and there was loads of improvements done to the buildings and the pitch, and I'm sure further improvements have been ongoing since.

It's not Carrington, but it's not the ploggers either.

I agree, the improvements to Cheapside have been very dramatic. I would still like some news on the proposed new training ground though.

Quoted from DB

I agree, the improvements to Cheapside have been very dramatic. I would still like some news on the proposed new training ground though.

With a reasonably adequate training ground why on earth would you spend £6m on a new one. I suspect the project is being quietly dropped

Quoted from Hagrid

What a load of utter bullshit that is. Orsi didnt play in the first 3 rounds ffs. But no of course the players did all the work, no credit to PH at all. Just like when its not going great guns, its not the players, its all PH.

This is what pisses me off about this entire argument, some, i repeat some, will fire crap at Hurst no matter what, becsuse he cupped his ear, because he told the offended few a few home truths, because he’s a “ boring yorkie”. Its absolutely embarrassing the way he still gets treated by some of you. He’s given us some of the best memories we’ll ever have, and deserves a lot more credit than he gets. There will be a time he moves on, there will be a time when we part ways, We all know that, Paul will know that, but lack of respect he gets really pisses me off

100% agree, well said.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

Virtually any Italian side from the past 60 years - that takes me past 100 already

D.Simeone
Mourinho
Benitez
Herrera
Ancelotti
Parreira
Deschamps
Emery
Ferguson post-2000

I could go on…

Succesful italian sides?
Come on you made a bold statement, hindreds, yet you have named nine managers some of whom I would question if they were ever satisfied with a draw,
Look at the most succesful teams worldwide or closer to home and you see a winning mentality in mamagment and players, positivity and most of all belief!
This doesnt just apply to football but to all sports.

Quoted from Azimuth

Succesful italian sides?
Come on you made a bold statement, hindreds, yet you have named nine managers some of whom I would question if they were ever satisfied with a draw,
Look at the most succesful teams worldwide or closer to home and you see a winning mentality in mamagment and players, positivity and most of all belief!
This doesnt just apply to football but to all sports.

Sacchi
Sperone
Bagnoli
Capello
Conte
Puricelli
Kuttik
Bernardini
Il Trap
Rocco
Krankl
Castellazi
Rehhagel
Czeizler
Bigato
Scala
Zoff
Felsner
Maldini
Viani
Sekularac
Bearzot
Lippi
Peruchetti
Jacquet
Aragones
Branko Stankovic
Pozzo
Allegri
Bersellini
Radice
Schaffer
Foni
Carcano
Vasovic
Ferrero
Sarosi
Brocic
Parola
Pesaola
Maestrelli
Bigon

I could go on…

Quoted from Azimuth

Succesful italian sides?
Come on you made a bold statement, hindreds, yet you have named nine managers some of whom I would question if they were ever satisfied with a draw,
Look at the most succesful teams worldwide or closer to home and you see a winning mentality in mamagment and players, positivity and most of all belief!
This doesnt just apply to football but to all sports.

Which of those 9 do you think wouldn’t be satisfied with a draw?

Ferguson (post-2000) sent many a team out in Europe and the Premier League to play for a draw. Some of Man Utd’s performances against the likes of Arsenal and Barcelona were as anti-football as you could get.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

Which of those 9 do you think wouldn’t be satisfied with a draw?

Ferguson (post-2000) sent many a team out in Europe and the Premier League to play for a draw. Some of Man Utd’s performances against the likes of Arsenal and Barcelona were as anti-football as you could get.

The difference being Fergie would no accept a draw or set up for a draw week after week which is why he was succesful, he had belief in himself and instilled that belief in  his teams which is why they were winners.
I dont believe Fergie was ever truely happy with a draw and certainly showed his passion when things where not going to plan or hos team were giving anything less than 100% on the pitch.
Same for most of the managers you name above.

Quoted from Azimuth

The difference being Fergie would no accept a draw or set up for a draw week after week which is why he was succesful, he had belief in himself and instilled that belief in  his teams which is why they were winners.
I dont believe Fergie was ever truely happy with a draw and certainly showed his passion when things where not going to plan or hos team were giving anything less than 100% on the pitch.
Same for most of the managers you name above.

My point was that, even the most successful teams and managers sometimes set themselves up for a draw and perceive a draw to be a good result.

I accept your point that those managers didn’t do that every match. But I don’t think Hurst does that either.

I say we call this a draw (you can win on pens)


I was thinking of you in bed last night actually. There’s an owl at the bottom of our garden, which inevitably made me switch my attention to Roy Hodgson.

I see a lot of parallels between Hodgson and Hurst (and not only with the Owls connection).

Roy is a hero in Switzerland, Sweden, SW6, Crystal Palace and is well respected in Europe and with the Inter flock.

Yet, he’s a laughing stock if you are a Blackburn, Liverpool or England fan.

Hodgson’s teams are extremely structured with players drilled into being in set positions. When players don’t buy into that philosophy, you get the likes of losing 2-1 to Iceland.

Although Hodgson’s sides are defensive and cautious, he has produced entertaining teams. The Swiss side, with mavericks like Alain Sutter, or his Ronaldo fronted Inter side, or the current Palace side with Eze and Olise. That Fulham team were great to watch at times too.

The general perception is that Hodgson struggles with ‘bigger teams’ and the expectation of fans to go out and win every match.

In respect of Grimsby’s Owl, where do GTFC sit in modern football?

Are we a ‘bigger’ club or should we temper expectations?

I went through the fixture list in early August and had us down for 59 pts. We’re currently two points behind that, due to the defeat to Crawley and the point away at Bradford (I predicted a defeat before the season started, although, in the week leading up to the match I had us down for a win, given Bradford’s injuries).

Maybe I’m just a small man, with a small club mentality. I don’t dream big (which is probably why I dreamt of you and Roy last night).

I just think we need some stability for a couple of years. I still believe Hurst will get us in the playoffs in the next couple of seasons. If it’s not working by then, I’m sure there will a parting of ways.

Who knows, Roy might fancy a new challenge by then and he can be the first Octogenarian to manage in L2.


Tonight’s dream: Newarkmariner sets up a Fight Club in Newark Castle keep

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

My point was that, even the most successful teams and managers sometimes set themselves up for a draw and perceive a draw to be a good result.

I accept your point that those managers didn’t do that every match. But I don’t think Hurst does that either.

I say we call this a draw (you can win on pens)


I was thinking of you in bed last night actually. There’s an owl at the bottom of our garden, which inevitably made me switch my atte[b][/b]ntion to Roy Hodgson.

I see a lot of parallels between Hodgson and Hurst (and not only with the Owls connection).

Roy is a hero in Switzerland, Sweden, SW6, Crystal Palace and is well respected in Europe and with the Inter flock.

Yet, he’s a laughing stock if you are a Blackburn, Liverpool or England fan.

Hodgson’s teams are extremely structured with players drilled into being in set positions. When players don’t buy into that philosophy, you get the likes of losing 2-1 to Iceland.

Although Hodgson’s sides are defensive and cautious, he has produced entertaining teams. The Swiss side, with mavericks like Alain Sutter, or his Ronaldo fronted Inter side, or the current Palace side with Eze and Olise. That Fulham team were great to watch at times too.

The general perception is that Hodgson struggles with ‘bigger teams’ and the expectation of fans to go out and win every match.

In respect of Grimsby’s Owl, where do GTFC sit in modern football?

Are we a ‘bigger’ club or should we temper expectations?

I went through the fixture list in early August and had us down for 59 pts. We’re currently two points behind that, due to the defeat to Crawley and the point away at Bradford (I predicted a defeat before the season started, although, in the week leading up to the match I had us down for a win, given Bradford’s injuries).

Maybe I’m just a small man, with a small club mentality. I don’t dream big (which is probably why I dreamt of you and Roy last night).

I just think we need some stability for a couple of years. I still believe Hurst will get us in the playoffs in the next couple of seasons. If it’s not working by then, I’m sure there will a parting of ways.

Who knows, Roy might fancy a new challenge by then and he can be the first Octogenarian to manage in L2.


Tonight’s dream: Newarkmariner sets up a Fight Club in Newark Castle keep

A good draw this one and gold star for you!

Actually a good discussion and you make some very good points, especially with Roy Hodgson, I actually really like him and Hurst is similar in a lot of ways, food for tbought.

Where do we sit in the modern game, I would say under achievers, I truely believe we could and should be a comfortable league one outfit and must set our collective sights to the next level.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

My point was that, even the most successful teams and managers sometimes set themselves up for a draw and perceive a draw to be a good result.

I accept your point that those managers didn’t do that every match. But I don’t think Hurst does that either.

I say we call this a draw (you can win on pens)


I was thinking of you in bed last night actually. There’s an owl at the bottom of our garden, which inevitably made me switch my attention to Roy Hodgson.

I see a lot of parallels between Hodgson and Hurst (and not only with the Owls connection).

Roy is a hero in Switzerland, Sweden, SW6, Crystal Palace and is well respected in Europe and with the Inter flock.

Yet, he’s a laughing stock if you are a Blackburn, Liverpool or England fan.

Hodgson’s teams are extremely structured with players drilled into being in set positions. When players don’t buy into that philosophy, you get the likes of losing 2-1 to Iceland.

Although Hodgson’s sides are defensive and cautious, he has produced entertaining teams. The Swiss side, with mavericks like Alain Sutter, or his Ronaldo fronted Inter side, or the current Palace side with Eze and Olise. That Fulham team were great to watch at times too.

The general perception is that Hodgson struggles with ‘bigger teams’ and the expectation of fans to go out and win every match.

In respect of Grimsby’s Owl, where do GTFC sit in modern football?

Are we a ‘bigger’ club or should we temper expectations?

I went through the fixture list in early August and had us down for 59 pts. We’re currently two points behind that, due to the defeat to Crawley and the point away at Bradford (I predicted a defeat before the season started, although, in the week leading up to the match I had us down for a win, given Bradford’s injuries).

Maybe I’m just a small man, with a small club mentality. I don’t dream big (which is probably why I dreamt of you and Roy last night).

I just think we need some stability for a couple of years. I still believe Hurst will get us in the playoffs in the next couple of seasons. If it’s not working by then, I’m sure there will a parting of ways.

Who knows, Roy might fancy a new challenge by then and he can be the first Octogenarian to manage in L2.


Tonight’s dream: Newarkmariner sets up a Fight Club in Newark Castle keep

This struck a chord with me. I think that I have small club mentality as well but I am at peace with it. Mid L2 does not break my heart,. Football is like a microcosm of life, there are winners and losers. I am happy enough to be an EFL team and as long as we compete well and give it our best I am OK with it. I work with two Chelsea fans and their entitled blubbering about their current position is pitiful. Better to be a Grimsby fan enjoy the good days and don't dwell on the bad ones. It is only a game....................I think
UTM