7 points lost from winning position in 5 matches

This is becoming a habit. Throwing away points. And other than the Glennon red card avoidance substitution we’ve surrendered this points without making any changes despite the opposition bringing on fresh legs in all 3 of those matches.

Modern football is a squad game. I don’t think you can get away with waiting until the 88th minute to make a substitute anymore.

Hurst gives the impression he’s happy with the squad he’s assembled, so why is he so reluctant to use what available to him on the bench?

Negative post.
1 win but only 1 lose in 5 games against 5 teams who were tipped to do well. I wasn't happy with today's first half performance going forward but it was much improved 2nd half.

Against mainly the top teams. We must have had one of the hardest set of opening games. Jam today is best but jam tomorrow is better than no jam at all.

I'm not a fan of Hurst's sub phobia either or his lack of desire to change anything unless he has to because we are getting destroyed or an injury but you're whining over nothing. It's not like we are getting tonked every game or even losing, apart from the Notts County game we have not conceded more than one goal either. Our form is the same as Wrexham with much less goals conceded (and scored).

Yes, work needs to be done but a lot of football to be played and it could be much, much worse like being Doncaster lol. I'd be joining in the complaining if we'd started our season losing at home to Harrogate and getting twonked by the mighty Newport.

Why are all the teams we play classed as top teams. After spending approx 1 mill other teams should be saying that about us. I don't believe for one minute it's all the players fault and there is one common denominator in this.. Hurst about time he went

Quoted from denni266

Why are all the teams we play classed as top teams. After spending approx 1 mill other teams should be saying that about us. I don't believe for one minute it's all the players fault and there is one common denominator in this.. Hurst about time he went

How do you know what we’ve spent, or anyone else for that matter? Unless we win every week you’ll bleat anyway.

Like it or not, this is a hurst trait. He’s a percentage manager and in fairness to him it’s worked in the main so far in his career when he’s given the time. He trusts/believes in his plan and is adverse to changing it without extreme provocation. It does mean more draws than wins but also more draws than losses.

Quoted from denni266

Why are all the teams we play classed as top teams. After spending approx 1 mill other teams should be saying that about us. I don't believe for one minute it's all the players fault and there is one common denominator in this.. Hurst about time he went

What absolute twaddle

There’s a good few people on here need to get a sense of perspective. We’ve got pretty much a new team and have started reasonably well. Guess what though, that new team will take time to gel. Tuckman would say we are approaching the “Norming” phase of team development, I’d agree. We will do some things well but others not so much, as we develop further this balance will change for the positive. Just gotta be a bit more Lasso.

Quoted from denni266

Why are all the teams we play classed as top teams. After spending approx 1 mill other teams should be saying that about us. I don't believe for one minute it's all the players fault and there is one common denominator in this.. Hurst about time he went

Rob definitely needs to bring in some sort of anti-bot detection tool on this site (not a reference to Morris’ Minors 😊😊😊😊).

Denni could spend all week trying to find the traffic lights to prove he’s not a robot. It’d be like watching a cat with a ball of string, who then has a shït, sniffs it, thinks, ‘I’ll have a piece of that’ and chows it down like a perineum panna cotta.

Are you sure you’re not the fourth draft of ChatGPT? The one that got away. The one that took AI, and thought, fück this, humans are too stupid for artificial intelligence. The one where you can filter the output based on:

Bėll end ✔️
Thick ✔️
Impatient ✔️
Annoying as fück ✔️

ChatGPT isn't as stupid.

Just a troll. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't feed the trolls!

Made me laugh the other week when Hurst was being interviewed and bemoaning the other managers in the EFL not voting in favour of increasing the number of subs on the bench from 7 to 9. Why's Paul so fussed about having another two available substitutes he won't bring on?

I’m a pretty patient supporter and accept that when a lot of new players come in they need time to gel. However, I’m still not sure what formation we are trying to play and it seems that Conteh is often isolated in midfield. Doesn’t he rate Khouri as barely seems to give the lad a chance to show he can do a decent job in our midfield.

Will miss next week’s home game but hopefully he will get the lads to perform as we did against them last year.

4141 is what we are playing.
I do think it needs tweaking slightly and someone needs to be further forward to support Rose at all times.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

Rob definitely needs to bring in some sort of anti-bot detection tool on this site (not a reference to Morris’ Minors 😊😊😊😊).

Denni could spend all week trying to find the traffic lights to prove he’s not a robot. It’d be like watching a cat with a ball of string, who then has a shït, sniffs it, thinks, ‘I’ll have a piece of that’ and chows it down like a perineum panna cotta.

Are you sure you’re not the fourth draft of ChatGPT? The one that got away. The one that took AI, and thought, fück this, humans are too stupid for artificial intelligence. The one where you can filter the output based on:

Bėll end ✔️
Thick ✔️
Impatient ✔️
Annoying as fück ✔️

I can asure you i am only 1 of the above     Impatient... Too many people are up Hurst`s rear end and he is serving them all a nice dollop of crap and they are loving it.  I hope many on here dont start up in business because accepting poor to average products wont last long.. People dont like the truith as it hurts we are crap and borrrring nearly every game. Give me something to cheer about and i will be as loud as the rest.. Give me crap and i will give crap back   And at the moment  well most of the time with hurst we are crap  So suck it up buttercups we need change or we go backwards

Quoted from lukeo

4141 is what we are playing.
I do think it needs tweaking slightly and someone needs to be further forward to support Rose at all times.

In the 2nd half we did. 1st half it was the dreaded 4-2-3-1 with Clifton as the “numbed 10” again.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

In the 2nd half we did. 1st half it was the dreaded 4-2-3-1 with Clifton as the “numbed 10” again.

Could have fooled me. It looked the same.. second half we just pushed a couple players higher up the field.
I'd like to see Eisa and 1 other (not Vernam) pushed further forward out wide and someone sat behind Rose. Always have 3 or 4 really going forward. Worst case scenario if we lose the ball we should have minimum 5 behind it with Conteh sat deap.

First half Holohan was sat deeper next to Conteh and Clifton was playing in the number 10 role.

Second half Conteh was alone as the deeper midfielder and Holohan played right side and Clifton left side as the more advanced pairing in central midfield.

And re: already dropping 7 points from winning positions after just 5 league games… Leyton Orient only dropped 14 points from winning positions in the whole of last season.

Really I see Rose as more of a 10 so I’d like to see another forward plying centrally and close to him. Eisa cutting in from wide positions is a threat and we have Clifton and Gav running forward from deeper positions. Clifton is not a 10. You can see that PH is persevering with Vernam as he should be much more of an attacking threat but that’s not working, hence the need for something different.

We had everything going for us in pre season. A bit more money to spend, early signings but I'm not sure what we use training for but we are playing with one striker who is badly isolated and has been for every game so far. We create very few chances and in the games I've seen I can't remember one golden opportunity not taken.

Surely the whole management team can see the shortcomings with Rose isolated? Repeating the idea that the wide players should get closer to him is not working, nor are the midfield players running beyond him.

Eisa has been the one bright spot, but without his screamers and goals we wouldn't be in a good place at all.

There is a hell of a lot to work on and hopefully a big striker this week to help Rose.

Always think a good barometer for if a manager should be sacked is what the reaction of other clubs fans and the wider football world would be, ie people removed from the club.

And i think if we were to sack Hurst, people would think we were batshit crazy.

Mentally hard to do but imagine the manager isn't Paul Hurst for a minute but consider the below in isolation,

Best budget a manager has had in a long time.
Full pre season to rest , prep. Plan
Business done early and key targets seemingly acquired.
Full pre season completed.
League Results 1 win, 3 draws, 1 loss.
Leads given up. (7 points as identified earlier)
1 goal per game average.
Scoring opportunities minimal.
We are joint 14th in the scoring charts
Entertainment value pretty low across the games so far.

Regardless of the manager the above doesnt make scintillating reading. If you are creating minimal chances and taking only 1 of them on average then you need to be absolutely watertight and hope you don't get an over officious ref who gifts the opposition something, both of which unlikely over 90 mins at League 2 level.

The current squad certainly seems to have alot of the right attributes for this League but personally would like to see them used a little more adventurously....and that is where Hurst and i think his staff are falling short.

Quoted from sam gy

Always think a good barometer for if a manager should be sacked is what the reaction of other clubs fans and the wider football world would be, ie people removed from the club.

And i think if we were to sack Hurst, people would think we were batshit crazy.

There is zero chance of Hurst being sacked if we were bottom with no goals no points and no chances.

No one is asking for that at all, apart from a couple of firebrand on Twitter but many are questioning several things regarding how we play, and if we are making the most of what we've got, and who we can possibly bring in.

Quoted from moosey_club

Mentally hard to do but imagine the manager isn't Paul Hurst for a minute but consider the below in isolation,

Best budget a manager has had in a long time.
Full pre season to rest , prep. Plan
Business done early and key targets seemingly acquired.
Full pre season completed.
League Results 1 win, 3 draws, 1 loss.
Leads given up. (7 points as identified earlier)
1 goal per game average.
Scoring opportunities minimal.
We are joint 14th in the scoring charts
Entertainment value pretty low across the games so far.

But we’re FIVE games in!

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

There is zero chance of Hurst being sacked if we were bottom with no goals no points and no chances.

No one is asking for that at all, apart from a couple of firebrand on Twitter but many are questioning several things regarding how we play, and if we are making the most of what we've got, and who we can possibly bring in.

Someone on this thread was calling for him to go, that’s what my post was aimed at.

No problem with questioning things at all, or suggesting it could improve….of course it could.

Just don’t think our start is that bad considering the teams we’ve played…been a bit bland and uninspiring but we seem relatively solid at the same time. Good base to build on as our players get more time to gel (we have a lot of new players especially attackers) and we get some important players but to full fitness/back from injury. As I said, we’re five games in.

Quoted from sam gy

But we’re FIVE games in!

Yes...but its indicative of the style and approach ......49 goals scored last season ?
Danny Rose yesterday had probably one true strikers chance in the game. I think he is more than capable of scoring the goals but needs more than 1 chance.

Quoted from denni266

Why are all the teams we play classed as top teams. After spending approx 1 mill other teams should be saying that about us. I don't believe for one minute it's all the players fault and there is one common denominator in this.. Hurst about time he went

What did Hurst ever do to you?  You never miss an opportunity to slag him off.

5 matches into a 46 game season and the doomers are chatting away already  

Quoted from moosey_club

Yes...but its indicative of the style and approach ......49 goals scored last season ?
Danny Rose yesterday had probably one true strikers chance in the game. I think he is more than capable of scoring the goals but needs more than 1 chance.

Not a bad season though, huh?

This is definitely a recurring theme.

We don't set the world on fire, fans get disgruntled, and the more vociferous want Hurst's head on a pike.

He then usually turns around our fortunes and we go on a run of sorts, winning games we thought not possible and getting us promoted, or taking us on a mega cup run. He also manages to get us to our highest league position in a couple of decades, all the while with a squad that most thought wasn't capable of those things. There were relegation fears last season from some don't forget, and many calls for change.

Am I sticking up for Hurst? Yes I am, even though I'm not, and never have been his biggest fan. I've waited, along with many others to see a team that looks capable of challenging at the right end of league 2 since Russel Slade Mk 1. That's 2 decades now isn't it?

It's worth noting that it was Slade's second season in league 2 when that happened, and it was also the much vaunted Lincoln for whom the second season was the charm.

I've said this before and it's worth repeating, that it takes at least 10 or 12 games for the league to settle down, and we have had a particularly difficult start with our fixtures, in what is a much improved league overall. PH teams very rarely get rinsed, and don't need to improve much to turn narrow losses into draws, and draws into wins.

I think PH deserves our backing, because he has earned it. He is dogged and determined and usually finds a way, even if it is mostly a dull journey getting there, but having said all that, I realise a lot of fans want a bit more excitement along the way; myself included. I wouldn't be crying if the owners decided it was time to change direction and manager, but we know that is not going to happen anytime soon.

I will do what I always do, which is to see how the season pans out over time and hope it's a good one.

The money needs to come out this week for a new left back and a player who can score goals to play with Rose . I still can’t believe we haven’t addressed all this with the money and time we’ve had . If we finish below 10 th this season hurst should be sacked

Quoted from It Bites

The money needs to come out this week for a new left back and a player who can score goals to play with Rose . I still can’t believe we haven’t addressed all this with the money and time we’ve had . If we finish below 10 th this season hurst should be sacked

Eisa has 4 in 5.

Mind you, they don't count as they were all lucky ones.

Quoted from ginnywings

This is definitely a recurring theme.

We don't set the world on fire, fans get disgruntled, and the more vociferous want Hurst's head on a pike.

He then usually turns around our fortunes and we go on a run of sorts, winning games we thought not possible and getting us promoted, or taking us on a mega cup run. He also manages to get us to our highest league position in a couple of decades, all the while with a squad that most thought wasn't capable of those things. There were relegation fears last season from some don't forget, and many calls for change.

Am I sticking up for Hurst? Yes I am, even though I'm not, and never have been his biggest fan. I've waited, along with many others to see a team that looks capable of challenging at the right end of league 2 since Russel Slade Mk 1. That's 2 decades now isn't it?

It's worth noting that it was Slade's second season in league 2 when that happened, and it was also the much vaunted Lincoln for whom the second season was the charm.

I've said this before and it's worth repeating, that it takes at least 10 or 12 games for the league to settle down, and we have had a particularly difficult start with our fixtures, in what is a much improved league overall. PH teams very rarely get rinsed, and don't need to improve much to turn narrow losses into draws, and draws into wins.

I think PH deserves our backing, because he has earned it. He is dogged and determined and usually finds a way, even if it is mostly a dull journey getting there, but having said all that, I realise a lot of fans want a bit more excitement along the way; myself included. I wouldn't be crying if the owners decided it was time to change direction and manager, but we know that is not going to happen anytime soon.

I will do what I always do, which is to see how the season pans out over time and hope it's a good one.

Whilst I tend to agree with the sentiment, the frustration remains that we always seem to start slowly. Surely he knows by now that the way to get the crowd up is to get on the front foot?

We’re told that we’ve got a better squad and, whilst football isn’t played on paper, it would seem that’s true. And don’t get me started on subs. He says he wanted nine man benches but rarely, if ever, does he use the five he’s allowed.

Quoted from It Bites

The money needs to come out this week for a new left back and a player who can score goals to play with Rose . I still can’t believe we haven’t addressed all this with the money and time we’ve had . If we finish below 10 th this season hurst should be sacked

Sacked for finishing below 10th? You are insane. You dont get anywhere chopping and changing and flipping about. PH is steady and he will guarantee you continuous improvement.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Whilst I tend to agree with the sentiment, the frustration remains that we always seem to start slowly. Surely he knows by now that the way to get the crowd up is to get on the front foot?

We’re told that we’ve got a better squad and, whilst football isn’t played on paper, it would seem that’s true. And don’t get me started on subs. He says he wanted nine man benches but rarely, if ever, does he use the five he’s allowed.

The point I'm trying to make is that it's pretty pointless criticising everything that PH does. He picks the team and the tactics because that is what his job is. Every fan has an opinion as to who should be playing, where they should be playing, and when they they should be substituted. This whole running saga about lack of substitutions and him having favourites is a complete red herring for me. Most fans think it's as simple as changing things and it will have a positive effect, when it could just as easily have a negative impact. Do you think he deliberately sets out to have a slow start to the season? Of course not, and It's not true anyway. We started like a train in our last non league season if I remember correctly.

He's the manager, he gets paid to make those decisions, and he stands and falls by them. That is my stance on it, and I try not to get worked up about the whys and wherefores.

It's normal for fans to have a chunter, I get that, but we are not going to win every game every week, and no amount of post match analysis is going to change the result. Hurst is our manager and one day he won't be, but that isn't going to happen at least for this season I would imagine; not unless we have a disastrous run and are in danger of relegation. Can't see that happening, so we have to take what comes or stop attending.

Yes, have a moan, have an opinion, but frothing at the mouth and calling for a change of manager after an away draw is just madness, especially given the fact that we are five games into the season and have lost one game by one goal.

Whether you like Hurst or not, I think everyone can understand the frustration with some of the decision making.

Yesterday was a prime example. No substitutes to freshen it up when 1-0 up and when they did equalise he waits 7 minutes to make a change. And it wasn’t even like we were creating lots of good chances. It was a scrappy game in the final third for both teams.

It amazing to think Paul Hurst was so annoyed that L1 & L2 clubs voted down having 9 subs to choose from like is already the case in the Championship.

Mooney (comments above) you could also have mentioned our brilliant FAC run last season.  Unprecedented.  Just saying.

Sorry, meant to type “Moosey”.  The name was changed.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

Whether you like Hurst or not, I think everyone can understand the frustration with some of the decision making.

Yesterday was a prime example. No substitutes to freshen it up when 1-0 up and when they did equalise he waits 7 minutes to make a change. And it wasn’t even like we were creating lots of good chances. It was a scrappy game in the final third for both teams.

It amazing to think Paul Hurst was so annoyed that L1 & L2 clubs voted down having 9 subs to choose from like is already the case in the Championship.

But that makes an assumption that changes would have made a positive difference.

If he'd made changes and we went on to lose the game, he'd be crucified, and suddenly bringing on subs would make him a cretin. The Parslow point.

Quoted from ginnywings

The point I'm trying to make is that it's pretty pointless criticising everything that PH does. He picks the team and the tactics because that is what his job is. Every fan has an opinion as to who should be playing, where they should be playing, and when they they should be substituted. This whole running saga about lack of substitutions and him having favourites is a complete red herring for me. Most fans think it's as simple as changing things and it will have a positive effect, when it could just as easily have a negative impact. Do you think he deliberately sets out to have a slow start to the season? Of course not, and It's not true anyway. We started like a train in our last non league season if I remember correctly.

He's the manager, he gets paid to make those decisions, and he stands and falls by them. That is my stance on it, and I try not to get worked up about the whys and wherefores.

It's normal for fans to have a chunter, I get that, but we are not going to win every game every week, and no amount of post match analysis is going to change the result. Hurst is our manager and one day he won't be, but that isn't going to happen at least for this season I would imagine; not unless we have a disastrous run and are in danger of relegation. Can't see that happening, so we have to take what comes or stop attending.

Yes, have a moan, have an opinion, but frothing at the mouth and calling for a change of manager after an away draw is just madness, especially given the fact that we are five games into the season and have lost one game by one goal.

I'm 'moaning', as you put it, about our slow start to games not the season. I'm well aware that we had a potentially tricky start in terms of fixtures but it's PH that moans about the slow start to games and has done for some time.

He's the manager and will be for some time it seems.

We have Wilson and Khan to come back. Wilson and Rose upfront and drop Vernam to the bench for now. Khan on the bench as well - showed he was decent finisher when he got chances last season.

They’ve both played a lot at League 2 level and at 26 and 27 plenty of years left in their legs, may even be yet to peak, we’ll see.

We’d all like to sign someone like Luke Armstrong but it won’t happen. TBH as said elsewhere - probably the ideal signing to play with Rose would be McAtee…

Quoted from It Bites

The money needs to come out this week for a new left back and a player who can score goals to play with Rose . I still can’t believe we haven’t addressed all this with the money and time we’ve had . If we finish below 10 th this season hurst should be sacked

Is everything in your life that simplistic or do you just save that for on here?

I’m happy for the old ten games and see routine but what gets me is the lack of scoring chances .
I can accept lots of dull football if we’re winning , it’s harder to accept when we’re not

The Salford, Mansfield and Notts County games weren’t dull. This is now sounding like a received idea mostly peddled by moaning twits who probably didn’t even watch them.

7 points from losing positions but we didn't deserve anything from the Notts and Mansfield matches so it only really feels like 2 dropped for me. The frustrating thing about yesterday was the inevitability of it all. Failure to kill matches off continues as a problem into this season, but as someone alluded to further up that's the nature of the way Hurst plays. On the one hand it's steady and safe, but on the other you can argue it's really not as our fate often hinges on a defensive error or a missed/taken chance because we're constantly working with a single goal margin.

Quoted from moosey_club

Yes...but its indicative of the style and approach ......49 goals scored last season ?
Danny Rose yesterday had probably one true strikers chance in the game. I think he is more than capable of scoring the goals but needs more than 1 chance.

Ok - so I take it you weren’t too happy with how we played last season.

So we try and change it/improve things by buying a load of new players, but you’re not willing to give them time to gel and what’s more are judging the manager and team on last season’s output still? Even though more than half the starting 11 has changed and we signed like 10 players?

Do not get that, at all.

September looks quite a tough month on paper as well. If we've only lost one game by the end of that month we''ll have done quite well. Scoring goals from distance by one player isn't a tactic that's likely to bear fruit for long though.

Big issue in first few matches is lack of decent chances created
Mainly down to poor delivery from out wide - whether that be Mullarkey/Amos or Eisa/Vernam
Added to which you will not get many killer passes from Clifton and Holohan; you get 100% fitness, stamina, workrate commitment etc but not craft and composure

Harry is often asked to do things beyond his ability IMO - he should be our defensive midfielder who keeps things simple with 5/10-yard passes and let's the other front 5 (whoever that may be) be the outlets for skill/craft/composure

We had 65% possession yesterday but created two shots on target one of which was a wonder strike; we need bread an butter chances cos we can't rely on worldies

Hunt and Vernam should/could be great sources for final balls etc but the former is played too deep and the latter just rarely produces

I don't think it's not having a regular 20-goal a season striker it's more a case of creating chances on a regular basis

And as many have alluded to - I never ever feels safe at 1-0 up cos of reasons stated above

It's going to be huge problem in L2 - it needs solving if we are to move up and challenge the play off positions

Quoted from TownSNAFU5

Sorry, meant to type “Moosey”.  The name was changed.

Here and now...not last season.....and if anything those games just add to the conundrum, bright positive front foot approach and unrecognisable from the League games.

Quoted from sam gy

Ok - so I take it you weren’t too happy with how we played last season.

So we try and change it/improve things by buying a load of new players, but you’re not willing to give them time to gel and what’s more are judging the manager and team on last season’s output still? Even though more than half the starting 11 has changed and we signed like 10 players?

Do not get that, at all.

I am not too happy with how we played last season by and large.
Hurst has his positives no doubt ....but his style doesn't over please me.
Nicking a 1 goal win by percentage inhibited  football isn't my cup of tea, don't get me wrong it can be great if it's in the last minute....but its not a season long plan that I subscribe to.
It is early season, it is a new squad, there are injuries but there are Hurst career long traits showing and I don't honestly believe right now, that  even after 10-15 games the prognosis will be much different.

Hopefully something clicks.

Quoted from SheepGTFC

5 matches into a 46 game season and the doomers are chatting away already  

Me i will wait till after Christmas, then i start to think /Worry what are we playing at ?
Being an optimist looking for positive light  at the end of the tunnel , before we give Sarina Wiegman a call !!
UTM 2023--24

We do need to ensure we have competition at left back  not sure why Glennon has lost form so much.

Up front, we need all of the strikers fit, but we are missing what Lloyd gave us last season - harassing, chasing, and  with a few goals also thrown in.

I know he is recovering from injury, but certainly worth a loan if he gets back to full fitness quickly.

Eisa will soon be a marked man, so options are needed.

Will Hurst look for a younger loan striker option before the window closes?

Most just filled places without tearing up any trees, Richardson perhaps was an exception before his injury.

Is there already a bid out waiting for other players to move in / out to clear a chain?

Fun being a fan, isn't it ??

Quoted from devs

Harry is often asked to do things beyond his ability IMO - he should be our defensive midfielder who keeps things simple with 5/10-yard passes and let's the other front 5 (whoever that may be) be the outlets for skill/craft/composure

Absolutely not - doing that negates the good things in his game - the getting all over the pitch, the driving forward with the ball, getting in the box to score, etc.

Plus hevwould give too many fouls away outside the box for free kicks.

He can play defensive midfielder, like he can play just about anywhere, but that shouldn't be the position he is played in.

Plus conteh is excellent in that position anyway.

Lloyd is not the answer. He is an ex-lover, let him go

I said this on another thread:

19th August 2021 - Mansfield are 3rd in the league having W2, D1, L0.
05th October 2021 - Mansfield are 22nd in the league having W2, D3, L5.
Final League Position: 7th.

I also had a wonder about something more recent so will add this:

23rd August 2022 - Stockport are 21st in the league having W1, D0, L4, GF6, GA 9
Final League Position; 4th.

I know the information can't be considered as comparable until the end of the season, where it will either prove that our start was simply indifferent before we found a rhythm at some point, or that we started as we finished and end mid-table.

I also know the argument is not solely the result but how our performances potentially affect the outcome of the result, be that in terms of how we get at teams from the off, make defensive mistakes to lose points from a winning position or anything in between.

My point by referencing these scenarios is that even the first 10 games don't necessarily determine a teams final position, regardless of performance. We can make our own judgements based on what we like to see but I'd suggest that we often feel more favourably about a performance when we win, even if it's poor. It's easy for the result to provide a bias towards the positive or negative, especially when most games are quite close in their nature at this level.

The one thing I've read that I agree with is that the general manner of how we're playing is typical PH, and personally I've always been OK with it. If you could guarantee me the L2 Pep/De Zerbi equivalent then I'd probably take it, but we also discuss the 20 year history of the club and talk of how poor it has been. In the two full seasons we've had with PH we've had a promotion and an FA Cup Quarter Final run. Looking at things with the context of the previous 20 years the evidence is that the pragmatic approach he brings to the game has worked out OK.

My trust in his approach is based on continual improvement. He's a manager who typically achieves success as a result of incremental improvements and I think we've done that year on year since his return. I can understand why people would want to keep rolling the dice on managers coming in with a drastic change in playing style for entertainment, but as that has been our model for 20 years with nothing to show, I'll take a period of time to settle, get some solid foundations and make sure that any future changes can be made stepping off in a better place than we historically have.

Quoted from gtfc_chris

I said this on another thread:

19th August 2021 - Mansfield are 3rd in the league having W2, D1, L0.
05th October 2021 - Mansfield are 22nd in the league having W2, D3, L5.
Final League Position: 7th.

I also had a wonder about something more recent so will add this:

23rd August 2022 - Stockport are 21st in the league having W1, D0, L4, GF6, GA 9
Final League Position; 4th.

I know the information can't be considered as comparable until the end of the season, where it will either prove that our start was simply indifferent before we found a rhythm at some point, or that we started as we finished and end mid-table.

I also know the argument is not solely the result but how our performances potentially affect the outcome of the result, be that in terms of how we get at teams from the off, make defensive mistakes to lose points from a winning position or anything in between.

My point by referencing these scenarios is that even the first 10 games don't necessarily determine a teams final position, regardless of performance. We can make our own judgements based on what we like to see but I'd suggest that we often feel more favourably about a performance when we win, even if it's poor. It's easy for the result to provide a bias towards the positive or negative, especially when most games are quite close in their nature at this level.

The one thing I've read that I agree with is that the general manner of how we're playing is typical PH, and personally I've always been OK with it. If you could guarantee me the L2 Pep/De Zerbi equivalent then I'd probably take it, but we also discuss the 20 year history of the club and talk of how poor it has been. In the two full seasons we've had with PH we've had a promotion and an FA Cup Quarter Final run. Looking at things with the context of the previous 20 years the evidence is that the pragmatic approach he brings to the game has worked out OK.

My trust in his approach is based on continual improvement. He's a manager who typically achieves success as a result of incremental improvements and I think we've done that year on year since his return. I can understand why people would want to keep rolling the dice on managers coming in with a drastic change in playing style for entertainment, but as that has been our model for 20 years with nothing to show, I'll take a period of time to settle, get some solid foundations and make sure that any future changes can be made stepping off in a better place than we historically have.

That would be my view in a nutshell. Slow and steady wins the race.

Would like to see a few more goals mind.

Talking of goals still think harry produces more goal threat coming in off left wing making runs in behind , think playing centrally he in two minds stick or twist , he was brilliant tuesday i know we played 10 men but he gave us the desire needed , play the new lad in harrys central position & watch us create 🔥🔥

Even more points dropped from winning positions.  What needs to be done to stop this!

Quoted from Grantham_Mariner

Even more points dropped from winning positions.  What needs to be done to stop this!

Maybe we need a couple of Hollywood millionaires like Wrexham............oh wait, think they got stuffed today!

Quoted from fishcake63

Talking of goals still think harry produces more goal threat coming in off left wing making runs in behind , think playing centrally he in two minds stick or twist , he was brilliant tuesday i know we played 10 men but he gave us the desire needed , play the new lad in harrys central position & watch us create 🔥🔥

Tuesday!!