Let fenty run the fishy

Lets face it if anyone questions him or the way the club is run theres a major fishy outcry and for that matter if anyone dare question the trust theres a massive fishy outcry aswell... This forum stopped being a open debate many moons ago

FFS

whatever ffs its true and everyone knows it

So what your saying is you should be able to criticise Fenty or the Trust, and no one is allowed to disagree or put across a different point of view?

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

Lets face it if anyone questions him or the way the club is run theres a major fishy outcry and for that matter if anyone dare question the trust theres a massive fishy outcry aswell... This forum stopped being a open debate many moons ago

I've openly critised JF on here and given a reasoned debate to back up my feelings.  However, he is the only one putting his money were his mouth is and I for one would rather have money available than money promised if this or that are demanded.

The trust may be naive or calculating but again the people who make up the trust have got off their rear ends and done their best to take this club forward.

Every cloud has a silver lining, try looking for that instead of the thunder.

Quoted from scrumble

So what your saying is you should be able to criticise Fenty or the Trust, and no one is allowed to disagree or put across a different point of view?

Not at all, im saying all views should be put forward without ridicule

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

Not at all, im saying all views should be put forward without ridicule

Reasoned views, views with the correct facts and honest views not personal vendetta's.

I would think the pro Fenty posters are outnumbered by the anti Fenty mob on here,

Otherwise,

Why did he resign from being chairman ?

I have both praised the man and called him,

BUT

I am glad we have still got him.

Quoted from Marinerz93

Reasoned views, views with the correct facts and honest views not personal vendetta's.

I agree fully

Quoted from 672[b

]I would think the pro Fenty posters are outnumbered by the anti Fenty mob on here,[/b]Otherwise,

Why did he resign from being chairman ?

I have both praised the man and called him,

BUT

I am glad we have still got him.

Disagree Pete, its just that the anti`s are more vocal,  the pro Fentys IMO are satisfied with the staus quo

Quoted from Garth

Disagree Pete, its just that the anti`s are more vocal,  the pro Fentys IMO are satisfied with the staus quo

See what Garth did then folks ?

He disagreed with my comment BUT  did not find the need to abuse me,

Thanks mate, thats how it should be.

Quoted from grimsby pete

See what Garth did then folks ?

He disagreed with my comment BUT  did not find the need to abuse me,

Thanks mate, thats how it should be.

FFS, I should buy shares in Vaseline.  The rate you lot are going with your love in it'll be uphill gardening en-masse before the footy season starts.

Quoted from ExLeightonMariner

FFS, I should buy shares in Vaseline.  The rate you lot are going with your love in it'll be uphill gardening en-masse before the footy season starts.

I agree with this comment but wish to call you a ba5tard, is everyone OK with this ?

You only have to look at the public votes. Fenty has been backed by shareholders and the trust overwhelmingly. The hardcore anty-Fenty brigade are a vocal minority, they have to accept that although of course they are free to try and convince others. Nobody on here is stopping them but they'll have to accept that there's going to be wide disagreement with their views.

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

Not at all, im saying all views should be put forward without ridicule

I'd like to ridicule this....  

Quoted from GrimRob

You only have to look at the public votes. Fenty has been backed by shareholders and the trust overwhelmingly. The hardcore anty-Fenty brigade are a vocal minority, they have to accept that although of course they are free to try and convince others. Nobody on here is stopping them but they'll have to accept that there's going to be wide disagreement with their views.

To be fair, you only have to ask some of the once die-hard fans why they do not attend anymore and their answer is nearly always the JF reason.
Maybe its because of the downfall of the club since he became involved.
I neither know nor care nowadays and just take each game as it comes.
Pre-season has been good so far and I'm going to Lincoln tomorrow.
UTM.

Quoted from gary_elton

I'd like to ridicule this....  

Dont be ridicules

so you think ten years of fenty has been good for gtfc? i for one think it has been a complete disaster and i refer you to the position we are in and as at the end of last season we are in the lowest ever position in our history. but hey you might as well slag me off for telling the truth. that is the truth you find difficult to swallow, so just carry on with the usual abuse because i disagree with your holy than thou views.

Quoted from realityman

so you think ten years of fenty has been good for gtfc? i for one think it has been a complete disaster and i refer you to the position we are in and as at the end of last season we are in the lowest ever position in our history. but hey you might as well slag me off for telling the truth. that is the truth you find difficult to swallow, so just carry on with the usual abuse because i disagree with your holy than thou views.

We actually did better last season than the one before it (we finished 11th both times but got 8 more points last season), so you could say we are on the up! I bet we finish higher than 11th this season as well. I can't be bothered to trot out the old arguments to refute your "truth", but you have to accept that your views are an opinion (as are mine) and that a lot of people don't agree with them (hence my comments about the votes). I respect your opinion (and understand your frustration that everyone doesn't think that way) and you are entitled to it, but I'm very unlikely to ever agree with it.

Quoted from GrimRob

We actually did better last season than the one before it (we finished 11th both times but got 8 more points last season), so you could say we are on the up! I bet we finish higher than 11th this season as well. I can't be bothered to trot out the old arguments to refute your "truth", but you have to accept that your views are an opinion (as are mine) and that a lot of people don't agree with them (hence my comments about the votes). I respect your opinion and you are entitled to it, but I'm very unlikely to ever agree with it.

we may be on the up but we shouldnt be were we are in the first place john fenty is either a crap chairman or a bloody jinx

i like how everyone seemsto think the last 10 years have been on the down hill since fenty took over BUT we were nearly promoted in 2006 which is less than ten years ago AND fenty was at the helm then. nice to know that that particular point (one of the highest in a long time) is glossed over

Quoted from STB

To be fair, you only have to ask some of the once die-hard fans why they do not attend anymore and their answer is nearly always the JF reason.
Maybe its because of the downfall of the club since he became involved.
I neither know nor care nowadays and just take each game as it comes.
Pre-season has been good so far and I'm going to Lincoln tomorrow.
UTM.

Hypothetically, if we were to become a decent team again, do you think they'd return even if JF was still involved?

Quoted from mariner91

Hypothetically, if we were to become a decent team again, do you think they'd return even if JF was still involved?

Absolutely yes x 1000,GTFC fans want success, many are loyal fans who would support any regime, but equally many are fickle who would  support GTFC when they are on the 'up' and d'ont care a toss about  who is in charge, look at Bournemouth the season before we finally got relegated, Fenty was carried shoulder high as the saviour  of the club by GTFC fans- i am Grimsby born and bred and proud of it, but we do have a high percentage of fickle supporters IMO.

Quoted from mariner91

Hypothetically, if we were to become a decent team again, do you think they'd return even if JF was still involved?

I hope they would but many have found other things to do instead of watching town.
I have only watched 5 competitive games since Burton. I'm hoping my town mojo has returned for this season but my worry is that even if we regain our league status, none of the business issues at the club will have been resolved. I'm just living in the vain hope that we find a new owner with a vision of creating a viable long term solution to our financial problems.
UTM

Quoted from petethemariner

, look at Bournemouth the season before we finally got relegated, Fenty was carried shoulder high as the saviour  of the club by GTFC fans

Yes, that was quite the most pitiful thing I have ever seen  on a football pitch!  To call town fans fickle when they have been completely sh1t for over a decade is fucktardery of the highest order.  many of the potential fans of the last decade have never seen a decent side. . . Fickle? Muppet!

Wouldn't trust him to run a bath. The man's a @***

Quoted from SlouchyMetal

i like how everyone seemsto think the last 10 years have been on the down hill since fenty took over BUT we were nearly promoted in 2006 which is less than ten years ago AND fenty was at the helm then. nice to know that that particular point (one of the highest in a long time) is glossed over

You're right, that glorious nearly promotion was magnificent and offsets our slide into non-league football. I just ignore it because I know that to mention it is to acknowledge what an unqualified success Mr Fenty's reign has been.

Quoted from petethemariner

Absolutely yes x 1000,GTFC fans want success, many are loyal fans who would support any regime, but equally many are fickle who would  support GTFC when they are on the 'up' and d'ont care a toss about  who is in charge, look at Bournemouth the season before we finally got relegated, Fenty was carried shoulder high as the saviour  of the club by GTFC fans- i am Grimsby born and bred and proud of it, but we do have a high percentage of fickle supporters IMO.

I guess the vast majority of football fans want success and it's nothing new anywhere in the world of football for crowds to drop when teams are not doing well. A quick look at the stats for Town's attendances over the last forty years prove that. What we have here though is a STEADY decline with the brief exception of 2005/06 over the last ten years. Town historically have never spent very long in each decision so ups and downs have usually come in quick succession. They have enjoyed prolonged periods of momentum on the up BUT as soon as they've stagnated in which ever league attendances have dropped. (I remember watching Town play Port Vale at home in the 90's under Buckley (1st. spell) with less than 4000 fans in the ground). This didn't give time for disillusioned fans to fall so out of "love" for the club that they gave up altogether. It is my view that it will be very difficult to attract back people who stopped going anything more than half a dozen years ago. These people will have found other things to do and the cost of watching pro football these days is simply beyond the means of a lot of people.
I know some people tend to blame John Fenty and although I don't necessarily agree with everything said I can understand it. It is however a very easy thing to say "I don't go because of JF"- and may in a lot of cases mask other less easy to admit reasons.
Pete: I wish you hadn't used the example of JF being carried shoulder high at Bournemouth. That was the most bile creating episode I've endured in over 40 years of supporting the Mariners from all aspects.

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

Not at all, im saying all views should be put forward without ridicule

That's ridiculous

Quoted from STB

To be fair, you only have to ask some of the once die-hard fans why they do not attend anymore and their answer is nearly always the JF reason.
Maybe its because of the downfall of the club since he became involved.
I neither know nor care nowadays and just take each game as it comes.
Pre-season has been good so far and I'm going to Lincoln tomorrow.
UTM.

The answer is always fenty imo

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

The answer is always fenty imo

Unless the question is 'name a successful chairman?'

Quoted from SlouchyMetal

i like how everyone seemsto think the last 10 years have been on the down hill since fenty took over BUT we were nearly promoted in 2006 which is less than ten years ago AND fenty was at the helm then. nice to know that that particular point (one of the highest in a long time) is glossed over

But we didn't get promoted and JF caused the departure of the man (Slade) who did look like taking the club forward.

Quoted from STB

To be fair, you only have to ask some of the once die-hard fans why they do not attend anymore and their answer is nearly always the JF reason.
Maybe its because of the downfall of the club since he became involved.
I neither know nor care nowadays and just take each game as it comes.
Pre-season has been good so far and I'm going to Lincoln tomorrow.
UTM.

As a former die-hard, there are a number of reasons and I guess the main one is finding something better to do with my 'leisure pound' than going to watch an over-priced product.

Yes, Fenty has pi$$ed me off with several things that he has done during his time as chair but his time has coincided with the biggest recession this country has known and probably the biggest change in the demographic of football (TV money). You can speculate on how qualified (or otherwise) he is/was to deal with that & I only hope that now the club has started to turn the corner. Blundell Park & its' facilities are clearly not commercially viable and a new stadium will attract fans back to the club in the short-term and will continue to in the longer term if there is some on-pitch success.

My hopes are that on-field prosperity together with a solid plan for the future bring me & others back to the fold sooner rather than later.

Fenty has made mistakes and they have all been in the public eye,

I wonder how the moaners on here would react if we all went to watch them work,

Then put in on the internet how shite at thier job they are,

Plus you get paid to do your job, Fenty has put his own money into a thankless task.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

As a former die-hard, there are a number of reasons and I guess the main one is finding something better to do with my 'leisure pound' than going to watch an over-priced product.

Yes, Fenty has pi$$ed me off with several things that he has done during his time as chair but his time has coincided with the biggest recession this country has known and probably the biggest change in the demographic of football (TV money). You can speculate on how qualified (or otherwise) he is/was to deal with that & I only hope that now the club has started to turn the corner. Blundell Park & its' facilities are clearly not commercially viable and a new stadium will attract fans back to the club in the short-term and will continue to in the longer term if there is some on-pitch success.

My hopes are that on-field prosperity together with a solid plan for the future bring me & others back to the fold sooner rather than later.

Good Post

Quoted from grimsby pete

Fenty has made mistakes and they have all been in the public eye,

I wonder how the moaners on here would react if we all went to watch them work,

Then put in on the internet how shite at thier job they are,

Plus you get paid to do your job, Fenty has put his own money into a thankless task.

Whilst I accept part of your point Pete, it was Fenty who put himself in this position and has always enjoyed promoting himself wherever possible (shoulder high at Bournemouth is a notable landmark!)

Quoted from MuddyWaters

As a former die-hard, there are a number of reasons and I guess the main one is finding something better to do with my 'leisure pound' than going to watch an over-priced product.

Yes, Fenty has pi$$ed me off with several things that he has done during his time as chair but his time has coincided with the biggest recession this country has known and probably the biggest change in the demographic of football (TV money). You can speculate on how qualified (or otherwise) he is/was to deal with that & I only hope that now the club has started to turn the corner. Blundell Park & its' facilities are clearly not commercially viable and a new stadium will attract fans back to the club in the short-term and will continue to in the longer term if there is some on-pitch success.

My hopes are that on-field prosperity together with a solid plan for the future bring me & others back to the fold sooner rather than later.

Well said that man.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

As a former die-hard, there are a number of reasons and I guess the main one is finding something better to do with my 'leisure pound' than going to watch an over-priced product.

Yes, Fenty has pi$$ed me off with several things that he has done during his time as chair but his time has coincided with the biggest recession this country has known and probably the biggest change in the demographic of football (TV money). You can speculate on how qualified (or otherwise) he is/was to deal with that & I only hope that now the club has started to turn the corner. Blundell Park & its' facilities are clearly not commercially viable and a new stadium will attract fans back to the club in the short-term and will continue to in the longer term if there is some on-pitch success.

My hopes are that on-field prosperity together with a solid plan for the future bring me & others back to the fold sooner rather than later.

And in other news chesterfield, rovrum,york shortly have got new stadiums obviously the recession as passed them by, not helpfull the economic climate but i cant see the ground ever coming under the present controll

to think getting 8 points more but still finishing 11th is better is really clutching at straws. people on here care about their club in their own way but you can not hide from the fact that we are still a failing club. this season in my opinion will be the biggest in the history of the club. anything short of promotion will be a complete disaster. the reasoning behind that statement is the fact that the extra monies from bennett etc will have gone and the following seasons budget will be halved. now that will be a worry unless the sale of another player or two can keep us going but that will then diminish our chances further on the field. lets hope for a good one this year.

Quoted from realityman

to think getting 8 points more but still finishing 11th is better is really clutching at straws. people on here care about their club in their own way but you can not hide from the fact that we are still a failing club. this season in my opinion will be the biggest in the history of the club. anything short of promotion will be a complete disaster. the reasoning behind that statement is the fact that the extra monies from bennett etc will have gone and the following seasons budget will be halved. now that will be a worry unless the sale of another player or two can keep us going but that will then diminish our chances further on the field. lets hope for a good one this year.

How is it clutching at straws? It's CLEARLY better. Tangibly better. Measurably better. What I agree with you though is it is not good enough. Last year was the first year for the managers and a rebuilding period. They now have their own full squad. This season is the year to judge them.
I suppose we just need a giant Scandinavian goalkeeper to make it all click into place eh....  

Quoted from Biccys

How is it clutching at straws? It's CLEARLY better. Tangibly better. Measurably better. What I agree with you though is it is not good enough. Last year was the first year for the managers and a rebuilding period. They now have their own full squad. This season is the year to judge them.
I suppose we just need a giant Scandinavian goalkeeper to make it all click into place eh....  

there were still 10 better teams than us, so it is not an improvement!

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

And in other news chesterfield, rovrum,york shortly have got new stadiums obviously the recession as passed them by, not helpfull the economic climate but i cant see the ground ever coming under the present controll

You don't get it do you? Other clubs have had longer term plans than us, you've just made my point for me!

Quoted from headingly_mariner

there were still 10 better teams than us, so it is not an improvement!

Yes but that's not US is it... That's 10 other teams and different ones from last year. I see your point but we are looking at our own performance and we did better by 8 points. OK the position wasn't better, but the overall result was, if you get my point!

Quoted from SlouchyMetal

i like how everyone seemsto think the last 10 years have been on the down hill since fenty took over BUT we were nearly promoted in 2006 which is less than ten years ago AND fenty was at the helm then. nice to know that that particular point (one of the highest in a long time) is glossed over

I love your sarcasm I wish I had thought of it. I havnt laughed so much for a long time. Fookin classic      

Quoted from Biccys

Yes but that's not US is it... That's 10 other teams and different ones from last year. I see your point but we are looking at our own performance and we did better by 8 points. OK the position wasn't better, but the overall result was, if you get my point!

Statistically, it's an improvement, aesthetically it isn't. Did I see enough in the few games that I went to last season to get me back to BP on a regular basis - no I didn't. On-field maybe things were slightly better but it was marginal, off-field we still look like a club that's struggling to cope with commercial & economic reality and a major fall from grace.

Quoted from Biccys

Yes but that's not US is it... That's 10 other teams and different ones from last year. I see your point but we are looking at our own performance and we did better by 8 points. OK the position wasn't better, but the overall result was, if you get my point!

The position is the overall result. If we get the same points as this years team in 5th and finish 6th we will still not make the playoffs. It is all about position. The fact that we had 8 points more than the previous season probably means the bottom half of the division was quite weaker than the previous season. When S+H came in results for the rest of that season got worse which is something worth think about when comparing the two seasons also.

All this talk about having a better season because we had 8 more points but still finished in the same position,

Well how about this,

Season A     Say  We finsh 2nd  and have 88pts but lose the play off,

Season B     We have 87pts but finish top and get promoted,

Which is the best season. ?

Just a thought  

We are unbelievably rich compared to a lot of the clubs in this league. Woking had to release a lot of the players that got them promoted in the summer because they couldn't pay them enough to make the step up to a national league which means missing more time away from their other job. Woking have to live within their means but they don't average that much less than Town (around 2000 last season, could be 3000 this one). Without Fenty or someone else's money we'd have to go part time probably and I doubt we could afford hardly any of the players we have now. The chances of promotion would be miniscule.

Be thankful for what he have and don't for a moment dream that we'd be better off without it.

Quoted from GrimRob

You only have to look at the public votes. Fenty has been backed by shareholders and the trust overwhelmingly. The hardcore anty-Fenty brigade are a vocal minority, they have to accept that although of course they are free to try and convince others. Nobody on here is stopping them but they'll have to accept that there's going to be wide disagreement with their views.

THE BEST POST OF THE DAY, AGREE WITH YOU 100% JOHN FENTY TAKES A LOT OF STICK ON HERE, IF HE WAS NOT AT THE CLUB WHERE WOULD WE BE.

WHO ELSE HAS COME FORWARD TO INJECT MONEY IN THE CLUB,NOBODY

I WILL NOW WAIT FOR THE FLACK.
DAVE BOYLEN NEWFOOTBALLER

I suppose it boils down to whether you think your glass is half full or half empty. I always think positive thinking breeds positivity and negative thinking breeds negativity. I look at the table and as I said before, it's not enough BUT the points total being higher than last year is a positive, so in my head, we made progress.

Quoted from newfootballer

THE BEST POST OF THE DAY, AGREE WITH YOU 100% JOHN FENTY TAKES A LOT OF STICK ON HERE, IF HE WAS NOT AT THE CLUB WHERE WOULD WE BE.

WHO ELSE HAS COME FORWARD TO INJECT MONEY IN THE CLUB,NOBODY

I WILL NOW WAIT FOR THE FLACK.
DAVE BOYLEN NEWFOOTBALLER

KEYBOARD STILL BROKEN DAVE?

Quoted from newfootballer

THE BEST POST OF THE DAY, AGREE WITH YOU 100% JOHN FENTY TAKES A LOT OF STICK ON HERE, IF HE WAS NOT AT THE CLUB WHERE WOULD WE BE.

WHO ELSE HAS COME FORWARD TO INJECT MONEY IN THE CLUB,NOBODY

I WILL NOW WAIT FOR THE FLACK.
DAVE BOYLEN NEWFOOTBALLER

The point is a simple one. By doing what he has done with the finances of the club, Mr Fenty has ring-fenced his position as the sole arbitor of power within GTFC. Nobody has come forward because no -one wants to take on the debts & loans that Mr Fenty has accumulated.

Where would we be without him?

Who knows, because he's not prepared to let us find out.

i used to be positive and would not hear any comments against town but after ten years of failure and now in the non league i have lost all hope. only a change will get us out of this. more of the same will bring more of the same. i want success! there has been enough failue.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

The point is a simple one. By doing what he has done with the finances of the club, Mr Fenty has ring-fenced his position as the sole arbitor of power within GTFC. Nobody has come forward because no -one wants to take on the debts & loans that Mr Fenty has accumulated.

Where would we be without him?

Who knows, because he's not prepared to let us find out.

Brilliant post, lets not forget that the only other person with money involved in the club recently could not work with the current board. Parker put £1.25 mill into the club, there are people with money interested in the club, it is just not viable to take it on when one man has saddled it with debt to himself. £4million for an unfashionable club on its bottom?

Robs point about polls and shareholders is fine but i don't think it is fair to say that people are happy with the way the club is run. People are scared of change and the club is in a perilous position, are they gonna vote him out? unlikely. Do they think he is any good at running a football club? unlikely

I think people are aware of my views on they way the club has been run, but you cant really argue with the catastrophic decline!

Quoted from headingly_mariner

Brilliant post, lets not forget that the only other person with money involved in the club recently could not work with the current board. Parker put £1.25 mill into the club, there are people with money interested in the club, it is just not viable to take it on when one man has saddled it with debt to himself. £4million for an unfashionable club on its bottom?

Robs point about polls and shareholders is fine but i don't think it is fair to say that people are happy with the way the club is run. People are scared of change and the club is in a perilous position, are they gonna vote him out? unlikely. Do they think he is any good at running a football club? unlikely

I think people are aware of my views on they way the club has been run, but you cant really argue with the catastrophic decline!

The pro-Fenty argument is that it's better to have a club than no club at all - my question is, how do you know whether or not someone would take over? The current JF rationale appears to be 'It's my ball and if you don't let me play, I'll take it home'

England (and Scotland now!!) have many clubs where new people take over. A lot of these clubs are in debt and the first task for the new people is to pay off all or at least some of the existing debt-not all clubs take the admin. route. We apparently only owe money to J.F. Are people saying that new people would only come in if the club was debt free?

As someone who has loaned GTFC money Mr Fenty is surely entitled to get some if not all of this money back.

The evidence suggests that such investors do not exist in this area. I'll have a couple of quid on the Euromillions tonight. If I win I promise to sort out GTFC.

Quoted from barralad

England (and Scotland now!!) have many clubs where new people take over. A lot of these clubs are in debt and the first task for the new people is to pay off all or at least some of the existing debt-not all clubs take the admin. route. We apparently only owe money to J.F. Are people saying that new people would only come in if the club was debt free?

As someone who has loaned GTFC money Mr Fenty is surely entitled to get some if not all of this money back.

The evidence suggests that such investors do not exist in this area. I'll have a couple of quid on the Euromillions tonight. If I win I promise to sort out GTFC.

It's highly unlikely that someone who has the money to take over would do so with the current levels of debt. Even if we looked commercially viable, which we don't whilst we remain at BP, a new investor would surely be looking for Mr Fenty to write off some of his debts/loans.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

It's highly unlikely that someone who has the money to take over would do so with the current levels of debt. Even if we looked commercially viable, which we don't whilst we remain at BP, a new investor would surely be looking for Mr Fenty to write off some of his debts/loans.

But that is my point. When other clubs owe money to other people (other than the previous chairman) say for unpaid bills or, even worse the taxman do they expect that person to only want part of what they are owed? (Unless of course they go into admin. and get a CVA)

Quoted from barralad

But that is my point. When other clubs owe money to other people (other than the previous chairman) say for unpaid bills or, even worse the taxman do they expect that person to only want part of what they are owed? (Unless of course they go into admin. and get a CVA)

The money the club owes Mr Fenty is due to the fact that the club is run way beyond its means. The budget is set by Mr Fenty and Mr Fenty runs the football club. Effectively, the worse the club is run, the more beholden the club is to him.

Quoted from Rodley Mariner

The money the club owes Mr Fenty is due to the fact that the club is run way beyond its means. The budget is set by Mr Fenty and Mr Fenty runs the football club. Effectively, the worse the club is run, the more beholden the club is to him.

I'm not in the position to know the ins and outs of the club's finances so have no idea whether the club IS run way beyond it's means. I believe and am sure that even J.F. would accept some of the financial decisions around the engagement of playing staff have not been sound. Allegedly a lot of clubs are run "beyond their means". The only difference appears to be that at GTFC only one person is putting up the money-HIS money. I'd be interested in seeing the reaction if all of a sudden J.F. decided that he needed to cut his cloth better and we went part time. I suspect it would be akin to the situation at other single benefactor clubs where there have been problems.

Quoted from barralad

I'm not in the position to know the ins and outs of the club's finances so have no idea whether the club IS run way beyond it's means. I believe and am sure that even J.F. would accept some of the financial decisions around the engagement of playing staff have not been sound. Allegedly a lot of clubs are run "beyond their means". The only difference appears to be that at GTFC only one person is putting up the money-HIS money. I'd be interested in seeing the reaction if all of a sudden J.F. decided that he needed to cut his cloth better and we went part time. I suspect it would be akin to the situation at other single benefactor clubs where there have been problems.

And there's the deal - the more money Fenty puts in, the greater his debt, therefore less of a chance of removing/replacing him etc. He has got the club over a barrel - how much he wanted this is open to question, but the facts remain that GTFC is unsellable, uncommercial and a very unattractive investment opportunity as the current balance sheet stands.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

You don't get it do you? Other clubs have had longer term plans than us, you've just made my point for me!

Thats bolloxx rovrums plan was announced 15 months ago then by magic a new stadium appeared

Quoted from MuddyWaters

And there's the deal - the more money Fenty puts in, the greater his debt, therefore less of a chance of removing/replacing him etc. He has got the club over a barrel - how much he wanted this is open to question, but the facts remain that GTFC is unsellable, uncommercial and a very unattractive investment opportunity as the current balance sheet stands.

Are you saying that it's a conscious attempt to keep control at all costs (literally!!)? IF the club is to continue to function-whether beyond it's means or not then surely until someone else comes in he has to increase his contribution-unless of course you are saying that drastic pruning should begin now with the associated down grading in ambition etc. I'm not actually saying that it isn't a valid view and can see a lot to commend taking the hit now rather than later.

Quoted from barralad

England (and Scotland now!!) have many clubs where new people take over. A lot of these clubs are in debt and the first task for the new people is to pay off all or at least some of the existing debt-not all clubs take the admin. route. We apparently only owe money to J.F. Are people saying that new people would only come in if the club was debt free?

As someone who has loaned GTFC money Mr Fenty is surely entitled to get some if not all of this money back.

The evidence suggests that such investors do not exist in this area. I'll have a couple of quid on the Euromillions tonight. If I win I promise to sort out GTFC.

That would be an absolute travesty. Loan the club the money so that you can strangle it to death.

Quoted from barralad

I'm not in the position to know the ins and outs of the club's finances so have no idea whether the club IS run way beyond it's means. I believe and am sure that even J.F. would accept some of the financial decisions around the engagement of playing staff have not been sound. Allegedly a lot of clubs are run "beyond their means". The only difference appears to be that at GTFC only one person is putting up the money-HIS money. I'd be interested in seeing the reaction if all of a sudden J.F. decided that he needed to cut his cloth better and we went part time. I suspect it would be akin to the situation at other single benefactor clubs where there have been problems.

If we don't get back in the league soon how long can he keep loaning the club money? every season of expensive failure the club is getting closer to oblivion. He has been gambling with the future of the club for years and it has cost the club millions.

Quoted from headingly_mariner

If we don't get back in the league soon how long can he keep loaning the club money? every season of expensive failure the club is getting closer to oblivion. He has been gambling with the future of the club for years and it has cost the club millions.

The above is spot on

Quoted from headingly_mariner

That would be an absolute travesty. Loan the club the money so that you can strangle it to death.

Where is the evidence that he is making a conscious attempt to strangle it to death? If you mean that he should simply give his money to Town then perhaps he is not in the position financially to do that. What he appears to be doing is finding a middle way-the club get the money and he-at some point may get some of it back.

I honestly don't know what I'd have done in his shoes at the start of this....

Quoted from barralad

Where is the evidence that he is making a conscious attempt to strangle it to death? If you mean that he should simply give his money to Town then perhaps he is not in the position financially to do that. What he appears to be doing is finding a middle way-the club get the money and he-at some point may get some of it back.

I honestly don't know what I'd have done in his shoes at the start of this....

I am not saying he set out to fail, i worded that wrong, he has however clearly done a bad job with the clubs finances. Of course he should not be loaning the club money to pay for his mistakes, if he wants to gamble for success he should be using his own money outright and not saddling the club with debt. If he is not in the position to put money in he should be running the club better. Nobody made him take the club on and i wish he never had.

Quoted from headingly_mariner

If we don't get back in the league soon how long can he keep loaning the club money? every season of expensive failure the club is getting closer to oblivion. He has been gambling with the future of the club for years and it has cost the club millions.

Firstly I'm not sure getting back into the league will solve this issue. It certainly isn't a panacea for the clubs problems. Running a football club is an expensive business I guess. In my original post I stated that I believed that mistakes, especially with playing staff had been made but surely the point is that even if you get the playing staff right football gives you no assurances. For the past two seasons we have been up against REAL money men. Faced with this do you try to spend or do you accept second best and make the best of what you have? The former can be construed as a gamble but the pressure from the fan base is such that they EXPECT us to compete with the best which costs money. Vicious circle...Not saying it's ideal but what now is the alternative

Quoted from headingly_mariner

I am not saying he set out to fail, i worded that wrong, he has however clearly done a bad job with the clubs finances. Of course he should not be loaning the club money to pay for his mistakes, if he wants to gamble for success he should be using his own money outright and not saddling the club with debt. If he is not in the position to put money in he should be running the club better. Nobody made him take the club on and i wish he never had.

I genuinely appreciate your view whilst not agreeing with it in it's entirety. I wouldn't argue about the waste of money we have seen but in the real world I suspect that he won't be sharing your view about the responsibility he should shoulder to pay out his own money. That is the nuts and bolts of the argument. He is willing to loan money-no-one else for whatever reason is putting in-and no-one can tell him with any authority how to spend his brass. Not ideal but what is the viable alternative?

Good reasoned debate though...**pats self on back**

Quoted from costa del cleethorpes

Lets face it if anyone questions him or the way the club is run theres a major fishy outcry and for that matter if anyone dare question the trust theres a massive fishy outcry aswell... This forum stopped being a open debate many moons ago

I think the five pages of open debate following your comment disprove your assertion. The problem is that debate by definition requires two (at least) opposing sides who usually fundamentally disagree. Nobody who has ever been associated with GTFC in my 40+ years of watching them has ever split opinion quite like Mr J.S. Fenty.....

Quoted from barralad

Firstly I'm not sure getting back into the league will solve this issue. It certainly isn't a panacea for the clubs problems. Running a football club is an expensive business I guess. In my original post I stated that I believed that mistakes, especially with playing staff had been made but surely the point is that even if you get the playing staff right football gives you no assurances. For the past two seasons we have been up against REAL money men. Faced with this do you try to spend or do you accept second best and make the best of what you have? The former can be construed as a gamble but the pressure from the fan base is such that they EXPECT us to compete with the best which costs money. Vicious circle...Not saying it's ideal but what now is the alternative

We would certainly be better off in the league, but this is such a hard league to get out of. Of course there are no assurances in football but poorly run clubs will show decline and well run clubs will show success over time. He must only spend if he is willing to write off the debt he creates, he must not saddle the club with any more debt. The trust have strengthened his free reign on the decision making at the club and i think they should have been concentrating on trying to build membership and lobby to reduce the club debt.

I don't get my ticket money back if we lose, why should fenty?

Quoted from barralad

I genuinely appreciate your view whilst not agreeing with it in it's entirety. I wouldn't argue about the waste of money we have seen but in the real world I suspect that he won't be sharing your view about the responsibility he should shoulder to pay out his own money. That is the nuts and bolts of the argument. He is willing to loan money-no-one else for whatever reason is putting in-and no-one can tell him with any authority how to spend his brass. Not ideal but what is the viable alternative?

Good reasoned debate though...**pats self on back**

I think the viable alternative is supporter ownership and looking down the line i can see the club having to reform as i don't see a way out of the massive debt without a drastic improvement on the pitch (i really hope that we see this improvemnt).

I reckon everyone knows my stance on the current regime   I am quite happy to debate it with those who are fully entitled to disagree

Even if they are wrong  

Quoted from SlouchyMetal

i like how everyone seemsto think the last 10 years have been on the down hill since fenty took over BUT we were nearly promoted in 2006 which is less than ten years ago AND fenty was at the helm then. nice to know that that particular point (one of the highest in a long time) is glossed over

I think people can be forgiven for forgetting about a failed promotion attempt, in amongst the rest of the dross his tenure has served up...

Quoted from headingly_mariner

We would certainly be better off in the league, but this is such a hard league to get out of. Of course there are no assurances in football but poorly run clubs will show decline and well run clubs will show success over time. He must only spend if he is willing to write off the debt he creates, he must not saddle the club with any more debt. The trust have strengthened his free reign on the decision making at the club and i think they should have been concentrating on trying to build membership and lobby to reduce the club debt.

I don't get my ticket money back if we lose, why should fenty?

Sorry Headingley but I don't think that well run clubs necessarily show "success over time". That maxim was removed by the advent of the ridiculous amounts of money floating around the pro. game. Secondly "success" means different things to different people. Town fans were notoriously unhappy about us treading water in the now Championship. Morecambe fans could build a cogent argument to say that they simply by staying in the league are  successful. Would that be enough for Town fans? I doubt it!! I suspect Mr Fenty once saw himself as the knight in shining armour riding to the aid of the club he has supported since childhood. Let's face it a lot of us would have liked to be able to do what he has done. Undoubtedly in my view it went pear-shaped some years ago. I wouldn't dream of trying to suggest what is going through his mind but I reckon hindsight may be considered a wonderful thing from his perpsective. Money now plays such a large part in the pro game that big money cn be found-as we know from the last two seasons even at this level.

Quoted from 1054

Yes, that was quite the most pitiful thing I have ever seen  on a football pitch!  To call town fans fickle when they have been completely sh1t for over a decade is fucktardery of the highest order.  many of the potential fans of the last decade have never seen a decent side. . . Fickle? Muppet!

Listen , if you cannot debate without abuse just d'ont debate, you wouldn't verbally abuse me to my face and get away with it i can assure you - i have had to read the absolute drivel you post for years and haven't found the need to be offensive to you - i have supported this club for 4 decades and i am entitled to my opinion about the 'loyalty'or fickleness or not of some of  our fans, chairing off a Chairman who has presided over the 10 years of  the non success you mention, after the majority of them had spent the previous months slagging him off (fairly or unfairly) i would consider to be a bit fickle, my opinion, whether you care to agree with it or not..

You seem to have made a niche for yourself  on this boards as an obnoxious poster

Quoted from barralad

Sorry Headingley but I don't think that well run clubs necessarily show "success over time". That maxim was removed by the advent of the ridiculous amounts of money floating around the pro. game. Secondly "success" means different things to different people. Town fans were notoriously unhappy about us treading water in the now Championship. Morecambe fans could build a cogent argument to say that they simply by staying in the league are  successful. Would that be enough for Town fans? I doubt it!! I suspect Mr Fenty once saw himself as the knight in shining armour riding to the aid of the club he has supported since childhood. Let's face it a lot of us would have liked to be able to do what he has done. Undoubtedly in my view it went pear-shaped some years ago. I wouldn't dream of trying to suggest what is going through his mind but I reckon hindsight may be considered a wonderful thing from his perpsective. Money now plays such a large part in the pro game that big money cn be found-as we know from the last two seasons even at this level.

look at the fortunes of scunny, they have had their best ever spell and are still punching above their weight. Their chairman has been accused of being tight, in mind he has run the club excellently and responsibly. He has been patient with managers, he has allowed managers to reinvest some of the money they have made through player sales and they have made an excellent reputation as a club that can progress players. I hate that the our two nearest rivals who have lived in are shadow are light years ahead of us.

By the way, despite my Bournemouth comment  IMO we have some of the greatest away supporters in the country, just d'ont think that could always be said of our home support, except for  in the big derby matches.

Quoted from headingly_mariner

look at the fortunes of scunny, they have had their best ever spell and are still punching above their weight. Their chairman has been accused of being tight, in mind he has run the club excellently and responsibly. He has been patient with managers, he has allowed managers to reinvest some of the money they have made through player sales and they have made an excellent reputation as a club that can progress players. I hate that the our two nearest rivals who have lived in are shadow are light years ahead of us.

Wouldn't argue with that but the Scunny fans were up in arms when he wouldn't spend to keep them in the Championship. Imagine the reaction here. Their player conveyor belt was short-lived and they may struggle this coming season. If they get relegated the case for maybe taking a risk when they could may become compelling but in hindsight.
Who are the others? Obviously not Lincoln (incidentally a salutory lesson in the running of a club by a Trust ) If you mean Hull the two situations don't bear fair comparison

Quoted from barralad

I think the five pages of open debate following your comment disprove your assertion. The problem is that debate by definition requires two (at least) opposing sides who usually fundamentally disagree. Nobody who has ever been associated with GTFC in my 40+ years of watching them has ever split opinion quite like Mr J.S. Fenty.....

Debate not bullying or trolling was what i was after nothing more