Harry Clifton

With the Newport match thread and Just Back both generating discussion on Clifton's role/place in the team, thought I'd
start a thread on the subject.

Around a year ago I offered the opinion on here that his best position might be right-back.

He's trusted to play left-back when required, so it's reasonable to assume he could perform on his "natural" side.
Tenacious, mobile, and with the energy to get up and down the pitch all match. Ticks a fair few boxes.

Doubtful he could put in worse crosses than Mullarkey yesterday - though I admit that's a pretty low bar.
(Was listening on RH and after a couple of Mullarkey's attempts there was a slight pause in commentary, and  I felt sure
that both commentator and analyst were racking their brains..."what's a polite way of saying "sh1t cross"...   )

Can't imagine he's the sort of player the ExtraSpecialOne wants in his midfield, but it would be a shame to lose Harry's energy
and enthusiasm.

'Jack of all trades, master of none'.  Is that the type of player we need in the first eleven?  We need round pegs in round holes therefore I think he would be better off on the bench where his 'versatility' would be more useful.  And I agree with others that he is not the player he was, and maybe should be let go at the end of the season.

Quoted from 137

With the Newport match thread and Just Back both generating discussion on Clifton's role/place in the team, thought I'd
start a thread on the subject.

Around a year ago I offered the opinion on here that his best position might be right-back.

He's trusted to play left-back when required, so it's reasonable to assume he could perform on his "natural" side.
Tenacious, mobile, and with the energy to get up and down the pitch all match. Ticks a fair few boxes.

Doubtful he could put in worse crosses than Mullarkey yesterday - though I admit that's a pretty low bar.
(Was listening on RH and after a couple of Mullarkey's attempts there was a slight pause in commentary, and  I felt sure
that both commentator and analyst were racking their brains..."what's a polite way of saying "sh1t cross"...   )

Can't imagine he's the sort of player the ExtraSpecialOne wants in his midfield, but it would be a shame to lose Harry's energy
and enthusiasm.

I agree right back for me using his strengths would be a good thing for the team. To be honest his career hasn’t panned out how I thought it would  

Quoted from 137

With the Newport match thread and Just Back both generating discussion on Clifton's role/place in the team, thought I'd
start a thread on the subject.

Around a year ago I offered the opinion on here that his best position might be right-back.

He's trusted to play left-back when required, so it's reasonable to assume he could perform on his "natural" side.
Tenacious, mobile, and with the energy to get up and down the pitch all match. Ticks a fair few boxes.

Doubtful he could put in worse crosses than Mullarkey yesterday - though I admit that's a pretty low bar.
(Was listening on RH and after a couple of Mullarkey's attempts there was a slight pause in commentary, and  I felt sure
that both commentator and analyst were racking their brains..."what's a polite way of saying "sh1t cross"...   )

Can't imagine he's the sort of player the ExtraSpecialOne wants in his midfield, but it would be a shame to lose Harry's energy
and enthusiasm.

Good call that. I think it is accepted he would not be first choice in midfield in a footballing side, but he might excel at right back with a more limited range of options in front of him and he has the energy to get up and down.

Mullarkey has been a bit hit and miss so it might be something to consider.

Nothing wrong with his performance yesterday.

We’ve got two right backs who are more than good enough. Efete was playing well till his injury.

Don’t need a midfielder putting there.

Get one of there's 'Harry' thread every season.
Some people can't wait to have a dig.

Quoted from 137

With the Newport match thread and Just Back both generating discussion on Clifton's role/place in the team, thought I'd
start a thread on the subject.

Around a year ago I offered the opinion on here that his best position might be right-back.

He's trusted to play left-back when required, so it's reasonable to assume he could perform on his "natural" side.
Tenacious, mobile, and with the energy to get up and down the pitch all match. Ticks a fair few boxes.

Doubtful he could put in worse crosses than Mullarkey yesterday - though I admit that's a pretty low bar.
(Was listening on RH and after a couple of Mullarkey's attempts there was a slight pause in commentary, and  I felt sure
that both commentator and analyst were racking their brains..."what's a polite way of saying "sh1t cross"...   )

Can't imagine he's the sort of player the ExtraSpecialOne wants in his midfield, but it would be a shame to lose Harry's energy
and enthusiasm.

Why would you drop a specialist defender to play a player who in his natural position isn’t a great passer of the ball? If you were at MK you’ll have seen that his delivery is not something where he’d add value.

DA & the coaches just need to help Mularky improve that part if his game surely?

I think Harry would make a good RB. However, I have the feeling he hasn't fully realised his potential as a midfielder yet.  We've seen flashes of his abilities.  I feel that a a really good coach could get more out of him.

Quoted from TAGG

Get one of there's 'Harry' thread every season.
Some people can't wait to have a dig.

I think we all want him to do well and if anything he’ s been let off lightly considering some of the regular scapegoats get slaughtered for playing sh!t he seems to get a pass when he’s been equally poor.

And yet he is a regular under successive managers and was wanted by other teams before signing his new contract.

Maybe managers see what fans don't, and you need all types of player to make a balanced side.

He was our top scorer last season  and I think the goals will start to come again if he stays as a regular in this team with it's more attacking mindset.

He may well give the ball away  but they all do and he hardly ever does it in really dangerous areas. If his passing was as good as the rest of his game  he wouldn't be here probably.

SO WE HAVE GOT TO TWENTY MANAGERS TO flipping MANY

I've thought for a long time right back or right wing back might well be his best position.

I think that Harry needs to be allowed to run at the opposition midfielders and defenders to get space for the likes of Hunt to have more time for forward seeking passes.

I like the idea of all of the squad having to raise their game to their full potentials to get into the side under Artell, and using training sessions to improve any required skills that will benefit the team.

Harry is no different to any other player - get in the side and then make it hard for the manager to drop you.

Better players using better skills = better results and happier fans and management.

No names ., but I can think of 5 players who could improve certain skills by only 10 % to make a a far better team effort.

We also need to have players who don't drop out to continual niggles.

Is there any conditioning work needed for these players, whose skill attributes would be useful if more available?

Quoted from acko338

I think that Harry needs to be allowed to run at the opposition midfielders and defenders to get space for the likes of Hunt to have more time for forward seeking passes.

Not sure that’s really his strength. Doesn’t have the pace to roast someone nor the technical ability to beat someone one-on-one with a trick or guile. Once he gets beyond the defender, he’s very one footed and lacks end product. Wouldn’t be surprised to see him get offered 12 months in January but think we need better.

Help me (not Qualified  or A pundit) .!!!! if i was a "Town " Manager / Head Coach
But you have to love him he does put in a shift on the pitch
GRIMSBY born and bred  -Yes  sells stories etc
In the new thinking  of DA  i say keep him defence / midfield
Supporting  strikers .
YES He's one of our own
UTM

The fact that anyone wants to even debate this is outrageous.

He's been such a good player for us since getting into the team, he sweats blood for the club and he deserves us being patient if he's searching for form.

Artell should be working with him to get the best out of him for the team.

Quoted from BobbyCummingsTackle

The fact that anyone wants to even debate this is outrageous.

He's been such a good player for us since getting into the team, he sweats blood for the club and he deserves us being patient if he's searching for form.

Artell should be working with him to get the best out of him for the team.

For several seasons, Harry has been the best of a bad bunch. Recent games have shown that we’ve got more gifted players who might suit how DA wants to play. Our midfield needs a balance between attacking threat and defensive cover, maybe Harry provides both.

Comfortably our best player last year. What he lacks technically he makes up for in athleticism and attitude.

He's our only player that is capable of getting up and down into both boxes and is completely different to our other options.

When he leaves he will be missed and he will eventually play higher up, but hopefully that is with us.  

He had a good game yesterday, the best of the 3 starting midfielders and he created the best chance of the day for Holohan.
He's absolutely tireless and if you watch him he's always trying to do the right thing, not the easy thing.  
I genuinely think he'll thrive under Artell.

Quoted from The Caterham Mariner

Help me (not Qualified  or A pundit) .!!!! if i was a "Town " Manager / Head Coach
But you have to love him he does put in a shift on the pitch
GRIMSBY born and bred  -Yes  sells stories etc
In the new thinking  of DA  i say keep him defence / midfield
Supporting  strikers .
YES He's one of our own
UTM

That doesn't even rhyme.

Quoted from headingly_mariner

Comfortably our best player last year. What he lacks technically he makes up for in athleticism and attitude.

He's our only player that is capable of getting up and down into both boxes and is completely different to our other options.

When he leaves he will be missed and he will eventually play higher up, but hopefully that is with us.  

He had a good game yesterday, the best of the 3 starting midfielders and he created the best chance of the day for Holohan.
He's absolutely tireless and if you watch him he's always trying to do the right thing, not the easy thing.  
I genuinely think he'll thrive under Artell.

Fully agree with this. Ok Harry may not have been at his best for some of this season, but nothing wrong with his past two performances. He wasn't kept on yesterday with both Hunt and Conteh subbed for no reason. As others have also said, we need a balance in midfield. Looks like we are sticking with three central midfielders so important we have a bit of everything. You can't play with three Hunt types, it's not going to work. He hasn't been first choice under Jolley, Holloway and Hurst for no reason. Everytime he has been written off, he has come back better. And I also think Artell will improve him. Put it simply- are we a better team with Harry in it? With the current squad I would say 100% yes.

Quoted from ska face

Not sure that’s really his strength. Doesn’t have the pace to roast someone nor the technical ability to beat someone one-on-one with a trick or guile. Once he gets beyond the defender, he’s very one footed and lacks end product. Wouldn’t be surprised to see him get offered 12 months in January but think we need better.

Unless I’ve read the stats for last season incorrectly Harry Clifton had 14 goals and assists in the league and FA cup and that put him in top spot. That would suggest he does not lack end product. Like virtually everyone else he has struggled this season but since the arrival of Artell his performances have improved and I expect Artell will continue to help him further.

His weakest  area has always been his passing and we know that well enough by now to not call it a bad day when he gets some of his passes wrong. I wouldn't even call myself his biggest fan but I think every team needs a player with that energy and drive. As the local lad he's the one who has to play for the shirt and lead by example, which I think he's done plenty, never gives up or stops putting a shift in even when things aren't going our way. His shooting hasn't been great lately but he has bagged goals in the past so if Artell can get a tune out of him again on that front then he could contribute even more to a game.

I think he's one of those players you won't miss until he's gone or realise what he brings to the table until it's not there. He's no Steve Gerrard where he's a super technically gifted local lad leading the line with goals and assists but he has the same amount of heart playing for his home team.

The problem with Harry he's one of those players you only realise how good/important he is when he isn't playing  .You take his legs and energy and replace it with a better passer and you soon start getting over run in midfield. He had a great scoring season last year and it hasn't been repeated yet he is far from his best but for me were better with him in the side.

If he’s so poor it’s remarkable that he keeps getting picked by managers who might know a bit more than us on the Fishy.

I am very confused by Mullarkey's poor crossing, I remember when we signed him and the general consensus from Rochdale and Altrincham fans was that he has an excellent cross on him, I seem to recall him delivering several good balls for Rochdale when playing against us, and he put in a terrific cross for Rose at Bradford, but otherwise his crossing ability for us seems to have deserted him! Why

Quoted from Davec

I am very confused by Mullarkey's poor crossing, I remember when we signed him and the general consensus from Rochdale and Altrincham fans was that he has an excellent cross on him, I seem to recall him delivering several good balls for Rochdale when playing against us, and he put in a terrific cross for Rose at Bradford, but otherwise his crossing ability for us seems to have deserted him! Why

I’m not sure recent pitch conditions have been terribly helpful.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

I’m not sure recent pitch conditions have been terribly helpful.

Yes, I've noticed that his balance is less sure on greasy pitches and fails to adjust when striking the ball. Certainly needs more practice and variation in types of cross. Sometimes he should just look down at the ball and whip it across trusting that others are busting a gut to get on the end of it.

Harrys such a good professional and if he doesnt suit artells playing style right now, he'll adapt so that he does, he had a great season last year and its great to see a grimsby lad go and make 200+ appearances for the club hopefully many more to come

I wonder if Harry's dip in form is because he expects to leave in the January window? As far as I recall he didn't sign an improved contract offer with us and is therefore a free agent in the summer. Perhaps someone will pay a small fee in Jan. If so I think we'll miss him more than some on here think.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

I’m not sure recent pitch conditions have been terribly helpful.

Christ on a bike, he's a professional footballer in the 4th division. If he can only cross the ball in August and April we shouldn't have signed him.

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

If he’s so poor it’s remarkable that he keeps getting picked by managers who might know a bit more than us on the Fishy.

Are there managers who know more than us?

Quoted from BobbyCummingsTackle

Are there managers who know more than us?

I mean know one know more about anything ever than the Fishy Cognoscenti, but I’ll bow to Artells and Hursts on this one.

Quoted from TAGG

Get one of there's 'Harry' thread every season.
Some people can't wait to have a dig.

And the timing of it..

Best he's played for a good while on Saturday. Definitely the most energetic player on the pitch. And if you don't think a footballing side need hardworking runners like Harry to enable a passing game, then I don't think you understand the game of football tbh. Several times he broke into good positions in the box when our "footballers" didn't or couldn't pick him out with a pass..

I'm pretty relaxed with how things are going, probably like most on here, but there's always one or two that seem to want to dig a player out from nowhere. And to pick a position out like right back to improve is just insane at this time..

In January I expect we'll bring a centre half in out of necessity, and maybe bring one or two in that Artell specifically wants if they're available, not because he needs them. We'll probably watch Artell assessing the whole squad until the summer.. Harry will mostly start, and won't play a single game at right back..

He's just out of form and with that probably lacking a little bit of belief in himself.  

That's it.  

You don't become a bad player overnight.   Problem for the lad is that he never gets a proper rest.  Even on the back of his recent injury/strain, he came back into the squad and played the final 30 minutes against Sutton.  Then straight into a full game against MK Dons on the following Tuesday.

I know the lad is an athlete and I'm sure he's not the type to go into the manager saying 'I need a rest'.  But he probably needs a proper one.   You can't always play yourself back into form.

I thought he was good on Saturday and looked dangerous. Picked up the ball well on the half turn and drove forward. A couple of things didn’t quite come off but would rather him be playing for us than against us.

Quoted from davmariner

I thought he was good on Saturday and looked dangerous. Picked up the ball well on the half turn and drove forward. A couple of things didn’t quite come off but would rather him be playing for us than against us.

Absolutely.

Follows on from the point that we miss him more when he doesn't play.  

Quoted from diehardmariner

He's just out of form and with that probably lacking a little bit of belief in himself.  

That's it.  

You don't become a bad player overnight.   Problem for the lad is that he never gets a proper rest.  Even on the back of his recent injury/strain, he came back into the squad and played the final 30 minutes against Sutton.  Then straight into a full game against MK Dons on the following Tuesday.

I know the lad is an athlete and I'm sure he's not the type to go into the manager saying 'I need a rest'.  But he probably needs a proper one.   You can't always play yourself back into form.

He looked in form on Saturday..

Quoted from Hagrid

We’ve got two right backs who are more than good enough. Efete was playing well till his injury.

Don’t need a midfielder putting there.

Was he ?

Quoted from DaleH

Was he ?

Had several good games at left back, a couple of good ones at right back and a shocker at Slough when he was playing through injury. When he gets his chance under Artell, I expect him to flourish with new instructions.. There's a higher ceiling to work with than Mullarkey due to physical attributes. If Artell can get him confident and playing with shackles truly off then we might have the right back that played so well against Plymouth and Southampton every week. I'm definitely interested to see what Artell can do with Michee. Might turn out to be an absolute monster or he may not.. time will tell..

Quoted from Bigdog

He looked in form on Saturday..

I thought he looked back to his industrious self, but not quite at his overall levels of last season.  His end product was still quite poor.  Last season and the back end of the promotion season he had a belief about himself, of course he wasn't putting every chance away or every cross inch perfect.  But on Saturday it just felt like he a lacked a bit of conviction when in the position to shoot/cross .  Like so many this campaign he's looked devoid of confidence and playing a little within.

Hunt, Glennon, Mullarkey, even Conteh are all benefiting from a shot in the arm with the old confidence booster.  Fingers crossed it works for Harry too.

Quoted from diehardmariner

I thought he looked back to his industrious self, but not quite at his overall levels of last season.  His end product was still quite poor.  Last season and the back end of the promotion season he had a belief about himself, of course he wasn't putting every chance away or every cross inch perfect.  But on Saturday it just felt like he a lacked a bit of conviction when in the position to shoot/cross .  Like so many this campaign he's looked devoid of confidence and playing a little within.

Hunt, Glennon, Mullarkey, even Conteh are all benefiting from a shot in the arm with the old confidence booster.  Fingers crossed it works for Harry too.

Harry looked a bit different to last season. Better in some ways. More playing on the half turn etc. Looked confident and definitely got into the same positions as he did last year without being picked out with a pass. His improvement was the biggest thing I took out of the game. I think Newport deserve some credit for our passing play not coming off rather than looking at our players individually..

Quoted from Bigdog

Had several good games at left back, a couple of good ones at right back and a shocker at Slough when he was playing through injury. When he gets his chance under Artell, I expect him to flourish with new instructions.. There's a higher ceiling to work with than Mullarkey due to physical attributes. If Artell can get him confident and playing with shackles truly off then we might have the right back that played so well against Plymouth and Southampton every week. I'm definitely interested to see what Artell can do with Michee. Might turn out to be an absolute monster or he may not.. time will tell..

I'm not so convinced that Efete will somehow suddenly flourish under Artell. Defensively, I think he's solid, as his pace, strength and height mean that he's rarely beaten at the back and he often wins free-kicks as has his fouled when he drives forward with the ball after winning possession. However, his crossing is flipping terrible. Always has been and I'm of the view that, if you can't cross a ball very well by your mid-20s, you probably never will. Defensively, I think he's a bit better than Mullarkey but I'm not convinced he'll ever win back the position from him. A very useful player to have on the bench, however. I suspect he could probably fill in at centre-back or play in a back three if required.

Quoted from Maringer

I'm not so convinced that Efete will somehow suddenly flourish under Artell. Defensively, I think he's solid, as his pace, strength and height mean that he's rarely beaten at the back and he often wins free-kicks as has his fouled when he drives forward with the ball after winning possession. However, his crossing is flipping terrible. Always has been and I'm of the view that, if you can't cross a ball very well by your mid-20s, you probably never will. Defensively, I think he's a bit better than Mullarkey but I'm not convinced he'll ever win back the position from him. A very useful player to have on the bench, however. I suspect he could probably fill in at centre-back or play in a back three if required.

There’s certainly an argument his best position is on the right of a back three. He did well there a few times last season and was particularly excellent against Southampton.

Efete is very frustrating to watch.  He often doubles back when in good attacking positions. Defensively his sense of danger is not as good as it should be.  He can be caught out of position as well.

He is a talented player but does not make the most of his abilities.  

Holohan did well with his interchange, run and cross.
I had no idea he had so much pace.

More of the same please Gav

Quoted from TownSNAFU5

Efete is very frustrating to watch.  He often doubles back when in good attacking positions. Defensively his sense of danger is not as good as it should be.  He can be caught out of position as well.

He is a talented player but does not make the most of his abilities.  

Sorry but I don't even think he's that talented. Very athletic but not much else.

I'll answer the last few comments re Efete together.

Out of the 50 or so full backs in League Two last season, in a mixed season for him, he came fourth highest in goals and assists.

He's quicker, stronger and better in the air than Mullarkey, a better one on one defender, more of an aerial asset in the box in both defending and attacking.

We're all ok with the improvement Mullarkey has made under Artell. He's twenty eight, a couple of years older than Efete. Footballers never stop learning, every training session and game until they retire. It's the body that lets them down in the end.

I understand the frustration re Efete checking back last season, but weren't we all moaning about our inability to get bodies in the box too. I'm not too sure whether it was Hurst or his own head that held Michee back at times, but I'm fairly sure Artell will see him as a decent work in progress proposition, he's got a lot of attributes to work with. Confidence, crossing technique and concentration can easily be worked on by a manager like Artell. I've included crossing, although he's put in some cracking balls in his time at the club, but consistency does need to be better.

Michee will be a slower burner than Mullarkey, but at some stage I expect him to be our first choice, maybe not even this season, but sometime in the future once Artell has spent some time with him..

Quoted from Bigdog

I'll answer the last few comments re Efete together.

Out of the 50 or so full backs in League Two last season, in a mixed season for him, he came fourth highest in goals and assists.

He's quicker, stronger and better in the air than Mullarkey, a better one on one defender, more of an aerial asset in the box in both defending and attacking.

We're all ok with the improvement Mullarkey has made under Artell. He's twenty eight, a couple of years older than Efete. Footballers never stop learning, every training session and game until they retire. It's the body that lets them down in the end.

I understand the frustration re Efete checking back last season, but weren't we all moaning about our inability to get bodies in the box too. I'm not too sure whether it was Hurst or his own head that held Michee back at times, but I'm fairly sure Artell will see him as a decent work in progress proposition, he's got a lot of attributes to work with. Confidence, crossing technique and concentration can easily be worked on by a manager like Artell. I've included crossing, although he's put in some cracking balls in his time at the club, but consistency does need to be better.

Michee will be a slower burner than Mullarkey, but at some stage I expect him to be our first choice, maybe not even this season, but sometime in the future once Artell has spent some time with him..

I suspect that efete is too poor in ball control, passing and calmness under pressure to fit in well with an Artell team that knocks it about directly in front of their own goal personally. On the other hand maybe Artell will get hold of him and improve him in those areas. No doubt he is an incredible athlete and a very good 1 on 1 defender.

Does anyone else think Harry's role would be best just set in behind a striker(s). Either in a 4-3-2-1 or a 4-3-1-2. Think Harry has a guy for goal and the energy to link midfield and attack. Think he would be wasted at full back and as said above we more than covered at RB

Quoted from Stew0_0

Does anyone else think Harry's role would be best just set in behind a striker(s). Either in a 4-3-2-1 or a 4-3-1-2. Think Harry has a guy for goal and the energy to link midfield and attack. Think he would be wasted at full back and as said above we more than covered at RB

I agree, that's where he got most of his goals last season when playing more advanced when McAtee was injured.

Quoted from toontown

I suspect that efete is too poor in ball control, passing and calmness under pressure to fit in well with an Artell team that knocks it about directly in front of their own goal personally. On the other hand maybe Artell will get hold of him and improve him in those areas. No doubt he is an incredible athlete and a very good 1 on 1 defender.

Michee was at Norwich for 7 years, whose set up could be compared to a bigger version of Crewe's, and play a similar way. There's no way that Michee could do 7 years there without having good basic football skills. And remember ,if the stories are true, he's received v. little 'coaching' in the last 3 years

One thing I'd say is that there's a difference between having the skills to pay the bills in training and doing the same on the field of play. Once the adrenaline gets pumping and you've got opponents piling in to make tackles, it's hard to keep a lid on things and play calmly. There's a reason why the very best players always look as cool as cucumber, even when surrounded by opponents trying to get the ball off them.

I've seen anything in Efete's time at the club which indicates he's a good ball player who is very capable of keeping possession under pressure, unfortunately. In fact, he is at his best driving forward with the ball rather than playing short-range passes around at the back.

Quoted from Maringer

One thing I'd say is that there's a difference between having the skills to pay the bills in training and doing the same on the field of play. Once the adrenaline gets pumping and you've got opponents piling in to make tackles, it's hard to keep a lid on things and play calmly. There's a reason why the very best players always look as cool as cucumber, even when surrounded by opponents trying to get the ball off them.

I've seen anything in Efete's time at the club which indicates he's a good ball player who is very capable of keeping possession under pressure, unfortunately. In fact, he is at his best driving forward with the ball rather than playing short-range passes around at the back.

There is the reason he hasn't improved, right there. Spending too much time in training paying his bills instead of practicing.

I really like Clifton, I feel the role for the team he plays both on and off the pitch is very important. The only thing I think he can improve on is goal contributions. This season so far he's got 1 goal and 1 assist from 23 appearances. That's just nitpicking though, it's not his primary role.

I was quite surprised Harry didn't move to a club higher up in the summer when there were rumours of interest.

Does anyone else think that he agreed to stay in the summer because Hursty promised him a central role?

It seems strange to me that Hursty didn't play him on the left this season when he was so effective there last season, even when he was struggling to get results at the end.