21st Group data analysis.

Interesting that they have 5 teams diown as automatic promotion when there are only 3 places.

Quoted from sam gy

Anytime data & technology has been discussed by the board and management they've made it abundantly clear it's just there to support/assist what they do, but sure lets have a go at them all and act like they're blindly being lead by the stuff.

Yeah lets. Because from my seat in the Main Stand, we look like eleven individuals who met down the pub on Thursday night after a kickabout.

And what, we’d be playing like Brazil if we didn’t use any data at all?

Quoted from sam gy

And what, we’d be playing like Brazil if we didn’t use any data at all?

Not really the point, is it?

I get that data plays a part but it's up to the management, staff and players to take advantage. At the minute, we look less cohesive than we did in pre season - that's surely a worry.

Quoted from HerveJosse

Interesting that they have 5 teams diown as automatic promotion when there are only 3 places.

I expect it would depend on the error bars of their calculation. They obviously know there are only 3 automatic promotion places and they have a load of clubs within the 'play-off' window in their calculation as well.

Notably, they don't list any clubs expected to be relegated, either, because it's too far out to say after a little over a quarter of the season.

Statistics really can be a sodomist to work out and I'd imagine they are using an extremely complicated model. How much relevance it can have to the real world at such an early stage of the season must be in doubt. After Christmas, the error bars are likely to have narrowed and you would expect that it will provide more accurate results. If the model is any good!

Sure it's a worry...but i doubt the use of data is to blame for that.

At the minute it just feels like people are clamouring to find anything and anyone for our poor form and it's just a bit daft....

Our coaches played in defence, our owner writes for the guardian, Steve Croudson shouts instructions, we're using more data..

Quoted from Tommy

Come on Lew, I agree with a lot of your recent posts but think you're misunderstanding how this whole data thing is being used.

Paul Hurst, more so than any other manager in the league I would say, would not sign a player purely from some stats or data. He has always made it clear that stats only tell you so much and he's always insisted on judging a player with his own eyes.

So there's no way we are signing players just based from data. The data might help us identify players to focus or target scouting resources at, and/or for Hurst to go out and watch himself. Hurst has made it known that a pair of eyes can tell you more about a player than some stats, so it will only be helping him and the recruitment team identify possible targets to then go out and scout.  Surely no-one would have an issue with that?

I am playing devil's advocate to a degree I admit.

But even in the example of scouting players you quote, what they may or may not have done in the past will bear no resemblance whatever to how they might perform here, for better or worse.

Its a different environment, different managers, different teammates, different standards. Everything is different. In the case of Pyke a different position.

Hunt would perhaps thrive at another club; I bet his stats are terrible which would rule him out if other clubs were looking for a playmaker. Or ironically, his stats might be good compared to players who play a lot of games.

If stats played any part in recruiting those players in the summer, did it take into account how they might play in a rigid, defensive set-up, with players who can't pass the ball to them or take a set piece? The answer is no, so just like a player being recommended it is just an educated guess, which brings me to the obvious thing - what is the bloody point?

The only answer seems to be that other clubs use it and there will still be some teams promoted and some relegated.

Quoted from Maringer

I expect it would depend on the error bars of their calculation. They obviously know there are only 3 automatic promotion places and they have a load of clubs within the 'play-off' window in their calculation as well.

Notably, they don't list any clubs expected to be relegated, either, because it's too far out to say after a little over a quarter of the season.

Statistics really can be a sodomist to work out and I'd imagine they are using an extremely complicated model. How much relevance it can have to the real world at such an early stage of the season must be in doubt. After Christmas, the error bars are likely to have narrowed and you would expect that it will provide more accurate results. If the model is any good!

Exactly! And funnily enough their "predictions" will be almost spot on by the end of April!

Quoted from sam gy

Loads of teams throughout the EFL will be using data & tech in a similar way to us - some will have crap seasons and some will have good seasons. It's still football.

Why not go the whole Hog. Just plug this into EA Sports FC24, and all Fans (Real Fans that is) can join in Via Zoom, singing their favourite songs. Just think of the carbon footprint we save, and No Drum beating or smell of Bovril. Oh what larks we shall have. No ground maintenance, we can have a Blundel Park Superdome on the Moon, Hursty can run it all from home (just like our Civil Service)

  Oh if only life solutions were that simple.     These Magic solutions always smell of Snake Oil to me.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Not really the point, is it?

I get that data plays a part but it's up to the management, staff and players to take advantage. At the minute, we look less cohesive than we did in pre season - that's surely a worry.

Perhaps we are applying Forecasting software designed for Premier Div in League 2, and GTFC players can't cope and hence play so disjointly. I mean, if you plug an F1 computer into a Disability Scooter something strange will happen.