Our Midfield

Who's Jones the right winger Pete?

Quoted from grimsby pete

I know I did not see the game yesterday,

BUT

I think our problem is the midfield that's why Marcus  played the formation he did,

If our bids for players are successful I think we will be winning more games,

So if we go with                                      Henderson

                         Davies or Mills      Gunning        Collins      Andrew

                                       Jones       Comley      Osbourne    Chambers

                                                                  Yasuff      Bogle

We have a more balance team and a very strong bench .  

I know he divides opinion on here but Vose is a starter for me every week.

Interestingly in Gunning's interview he claims to be able to play centre midfield.
Although a defender, he might at least add a bit of quality where we need it.
Also not sure what Pearson's done recently to not make the team?

Quoted from chaos33

Who's Jones the right winger Pete?

A fascist from the Valleys in Wales?

Quoted from AussieMariner

Interestingly in Gunning's interview he claims to be able to play centre midfield.
Although a defender, he might at least add a bit of quality where we need it.
Also not sure what Pearson's done recently to not make the team?

He's started the last 5 games!

I'm talking about Grimsby Pete's suggested team at the top of this thread!

Pearson has to start in any team for me until he makes any errors or loses form, as far as I am concerned we looked more vulnerable second half without him, Vose has to start or at least make an appearance earlier in the game behind the two strikers, and daft as it may seem we missed the drive from midfield of Summerfield.

I think Gunning has a reputation as being able to play, on the basis of 45 minutes on Saturday he's massively behind the rest of the group in terms of fitness & condition.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

I know he divides opinion on here but [/b]Vose is a starter for me every week.[b]

I agree, we need someone who can pass the ball along the ground, playing Omar & Adi in with that killer pass, for them to run onto.

Omar & Adi with the ball at the their feet, running at pace at defenders, is so much more difficult to defend against, then the ball lump up to them, with their backs to goal. The opposition defenders 9 times of 10 win the high ball and none our midfielders win the loose ball, so we are on the back foot again.

Well Gunning shouldn't be too far behind in fitness and conditioning when he's been playing games in the Scottish Championship

Quoted from grimsby pete

I know I did not see the game yesterday,

BUT

I think our problem is the midfield that's why Marcus  played the formation he did,

If our bids for players are successful I think we will be winning more games,

So if we go with                                      Henderson

                         Davies or Mills      Gunning        Collins      Andrew

                                       Jones       Comley      Osbourne    Chambers

                                                                  Yasuff      Bogle

We have a more balance team and a very strong bench .  

100% agree that our problem is in midfield, it has been for the past 10 years. It's encouraging to see that MB seems to be the first manager we've had who recognises this.

However, I think you're being far too premature assuming these players will be signing for us, my info from a couple of weeks ago is that there is no chance Jones will be joining us.

You didn't mention Disley, is that idea now killed off since he returned to the team? I hope so, 'cos there's no way he's the answer. We need a midfield consisting of players with pace, energy, mobility and some with vision if possible.

UTM

Quoted from Garth

Pearson has to start in any team for me until he makes any errors or loses form, as far as I am concerned we looked more vulnerable second half without him, Vose has to start or at least make an appearance earlier in the game behind the two strikers, and daft as it may seem we missed the drive from midfield of Summerfield.

That what Marcus is hoping the likes of Osborne and Jones will bring to the team. Technical ability on the ball and that drive  from midfield. We need someone arriving mate in the box and picking up those second balls. What Disley used to do a couple of years ago!

Both Osbourne and Jones have terrific goal scoring records from midfield too.

Henderson

Mills
Pearson
Collins
Andrew

New winger
Comley
New centre mid
New winger

Vose

Bogle

Quoted from HertsGTFC

I think Gunning has a reputation as being able to play, on the basis of 45 minutes on Saturday he's massively behind the rest of the group in terms of fitness & condition.

I don't think fitness is an issue as he's pretty much played all season, I think that's just his style of play.

Aside from one incident where he mistimed a challenge and his man got away from him I actually thought he looked very good. A couple of his floated passes from deep over the top for Omar and Adi were superb. You can see he's a very confident, intelligent player and extremely comfortable with the ball at his feet to.  Once he got used to his fellow defenders and the system Marcus wants to play I think he'll prove to be a magnificent signing!

I think from what we saw on Saturday  Gunning shows a fair bit of class. He distributed the ball pretty well and showed composure on and off the ball . Don't forget he hasn't been with his team mates more than a few days but got one or two passes through the channels to the forwards. He also went on one dribbling run and in the short time I have seen him he impressed me. I could easily see him in our midfield adding a bit of needed bite instead of having to watch opposing midfields just shrugging off our lightweights. If we get Bignots wants we will have a midfield other teams will fear-just get him to the required fitness and he will do for me. As for not making a tackle and anybody blaming him for their third goal look again at the replay and see what our other players are doing-absolute balderdash.

I really hope we see some reinforcements this week, in particular centre midfield as this is by far our weakest area. Every single game I've seen this season, and in all competitions I've seen 23 so far this season, in all those 23 games, regardless of the score, regardless of opposition we have lost the midfield battle, even against Newport they edged us in central midfield

All our midfielders offer something, Disley offers an experienced calm head, maybe he's better in away games than home games, Comley covers a lot of ground and puts in a tackle, Summerfield for all his faults you can't argue he does offer some energy and again he covers a lot of ground, Berrett well I don't know what he offers, McAllister offers experience and know how (when fit)

but for all that none of them are physical, none of them offers an attacking threat, somebody to set the tempo of games, somebody to carry the ball forward and turn defence into attack.

I have noticed that off the ball we lack movement. When the defenders have the ball there is very little movement ahead of them, meaning they have to hoof it and hope for the best, even at throw ins, everybody is standing still, if we can add this midfielder (Osborne from Solihull from what I've heard ticks all the boxes" that would make us more of a threat in midfield and certainly offers a creative influence in there and hopefully he can inspire some movement off the ball.

Quoted from Davec

I really hope we see some reinforcements this week, in particular centre midfield as this is by far our weakest area. Every single game I've seen this season, and in all competitions I've seen 23 so far this season, in all those 23 games, regardless of the score, regardless of opposition we have lost the midfield battle, even against Newport they edged us in central midfield

All our midfielders offer something, Disley offers an experienced calm head, maybe he's better in away games than home games, Comley covers a lot of ground and puts in a tackle, Summerfield for all his faults you can't argue he does offer some energy and again he covers a lot of ground, Berrett well I don't know what he offers, McAllister offers experience and know how (when fit)

but for all that none of them are physical, none of them offers an attacking threat, somebody to set the tempo of games, somebody to carry the ball forward and turn defence into attack.

I have noticed that off the ball we lack movement. When the defenders have the ball there is very little movement ahead of them, meaning they have to hoof it and hope for the best, even at throw ins, everybody is standing still, if we can add this midfielder (Osborne from Solihull from what I've heard ticks all the boxes" that would make us more of a threat in midfield and certainly offers a creative influence in there and hopefully he can inspire some movement off the ball.

disagree with that, our midfield is poor but all 23 is very OTT, we wouldnt beat a team 5-2 by having no midfield, our away wins at hard-to-go places have been helped by our midfield, but yes we do need something different as we lack any creativity at all

Quoted from Garth

Pearson has to start in any team for me until he makes any errors or loses form, as far as I am concerned we looked more vulnerable second half without him, Vose has to start or at least make an appearance earlier in the game behind the two strikers, and daft as it may seem we missed the drive from midfield of Summerfield.

I thought a large part of that vulnerability came because of the sacrifice of Comley. Not that I'm advocating Pearson being dropped. He's been outstanding these past few games.

Quoted from Mighty_Mariner

I don't think fitness is an issue as he's pretty much played all season, I think that's just his style of play.

Aside from one incident where he mistimed a challenge and his man got away from him I actually thought he looked very good. A couple of his floated passes from deep over the top for Omar and Adi were superb. You can see he's a very confident, intelligent player and extremely comfortable with the ball at his feet to.  Once he got used to his fellow defenders and the system Marcus wants to play I think he'll prove to be a magnificent signing!

I think he'll be fine as long as he remembers his first priority is to stop the opposition scoring, I like that he can pass but would like it even more if there where more willing mid field players to take the ball from him.

Our midfield is dogged enough but needs some flair Osborne would appear to offer this. McAllister, Comley and Osborne would be ideal of you ask me, sadly Dis looked off the pace on Saturday. Great servant but will be released at the end of the season probably.

No hiding from the fact that Saturday was shite, genuinely one of the worst performances I can remember in a long time.
But before we starting ripping up the team and the formation, that's the same side that picked up maximum points in the last two games with the wingback system and 10 from 12 in the previous four games overall.

We could play any formation, any tactic and with as many new faces as we like, but if the individual performances dip to that standard it won't make a jot of difference.

In terms of tactics I thought we really lacked a driving force from the centre of midfield.  Instead we had three guys trying to do it but failing badly and then also putting in sub-standard performances too.  A midfielder driving forward would have provided the support needed for the front two and completely changed the game.

Quoted from diehardmariner

No hiding from the fact that Saturday was shite, genuinely one of the worst performances I can remember in a long time.
But before we starting ripping up the team and the formation, that's the same side that picked up maximum points in the last two games with the wingback system and 10 from 12 in the previous four games overall.

We could play any formation, any tactic and with as many new faces as we like, but if the individual performances dip to that standard it won't make a jot of difference.

In terms of tactics I thought we really lacked a driving force from the centre of midfield.  Instead we had three guys trying to do it but failing badly and then also putting in sub-standard performances too.  A midfielder driving forward would have provided the support needed for the front two and completely changed the game.

I agree with you there. We were just poor and second best all over the field, but it happens like that sometimes.Decent players don't become bad overnight.

I don't understand why there isn't much more bite and enthusiasm in the team from the kick off. Two great away wins, good home crowd, positive manager and yet we don't start with any aggression or bite and let the opposition get into their stride, at least in the home games.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

I agree with you there. We were just poor and second best all over the field, but it happens like that sometimes.Decent players don't become bad overnight.

I don't understand why there isn't much more bite and enthusiasm in the team from the kick off. Two great away wins, good home crowd, positive manager and yet we don't start with any aggression or bite and let the opposition get into their stride, at least in the home games.

lack of tempo worries me, but that's not something new. I don't mind shape changes etc.. in fact 3 - 5 - 2 can produce some great football but we need a mad dog in mid field who can win and get it passed quickly and then press the opposition when required. To sit next to this mad dog (or just in front of him) we need an artisan who can go forward, pick a pass, switch play and score goals. Lets see what we can bring in over the next 3 weeks if nothing happens there we need to utilise Vose & McAllister starting games in the side I reckon.    

without sounding too flippant....we havnt had a "midfield" for a very long time now, something Hurst never quite managed to fathom out neither did the previous two or maybe three managers before that.  We have had some shocking centre midfielders over the last 10 plus years with only a couple of decent individuals that i think there would be some sort of majority acceptance of being decent.
With regards to a decent centre mid partnership then anyone under 20 would probably struggle to name one.

Quoted from diehardmariner

No hiding from the fact that Saturday was shite, genuinely one of the worst performances I can remember in a long time.
But before we starting ripping up the team and the formation, that's the same side that picked up maximum points in the last two games with the wingback system and 10 from 12 in the previous four games overall.

We could play any formation, any tactic and with as many new faces as we like, but if the individual performances dip to that standard it won't make a jot of difference.

In terms of tactics I thought we really lacked a driving force from the centre of midfield.  Instead we had three guys trying to do it but failing badly and then also putting in sub-standard performances too.  A midfielder driving forward would have provided the support needed for the front two and completely changed the game.

Saturday was definitely a " poor day at the office " but from my point of view there were certainly one or two things that contributed to this. I think Boyce was very poor and seemed very reluctant to attempt to bring the ball out of defence or even to make a quick pass. If you play three across the back than IMO those players need to be comfortable on the ball and Boyce certainly wasn't. It was ok playing Comley as a screen/playmaker in front of the back three but the combination of Mills and Disley alongside him is all wrong. To complement Comley you need  a " yard dog " and a good playmaker ( eg Vose ) alongside him. To me, it seemed like one of the tactics advocated by Bignot on Saturday was to have Andrews and Davies break as wide as possible when we had possession coming out of defense but very rarely was this utilised. I lost count of the number of times Andrews was wide and no opposition within 30 yards of him but Comley didn't play out wide. The whole point of 5 across midfield is to utilise the full width of the pitch when attacking but this rarely happened.
I like Disley and still feel he has a lot to offer but not in the role he was given on Saturday. He could play the role that Comley was given but where do you then play Comley? I also think that Mills can play the wingback role better than Davies and I think I'm right in remembering that Davies has played a lot of games in midfield for his previous clubs.
Bignot certainly has a lot to do to find the right blend of players to make us effective but I'm sure he knows this. He has inherited a squad not of his own making and with many on 2 year deals he doesn't have a lot of room for manoeuvre unless he can off-load some of them.

I think Dis and Clay were a good combination in midfield, Nolan was a good midfielder but would need to be in a three as he tended to go awol and leave us exposed, he would be perfect to play in our current formation, as would Toto on the right of the three.

Quoted from Mariner_09

I think Dis and Clay were a good combination in midfield, Nolan was a good midfielder but would need to be in a three as he tended to go awol and leave us exposed, he would be perfect to play in our current formation, as would Toto on the right of the three.

Yeah but three of those don't play for us anymore and we have a different manager too and let's not forget, we're in a different league. The past is the past.

Marcus has at least tried all the players we have and in some cases in different roles. Possibly why we have been a bit inconsistent. He has been thorough in seeing what he has inherited. Clearly likes Comley in the middle otherwise he would just let him go back to QPR. It will be Mcallister's turn soon to show what he can do in there too. Seems to me there is a lot of evaluating going on just now. Andrew looks a good wing back and can cross better than any of the other so called wingers. Davies too hits a good cross and Mills gets up and down very well.

Quoted from rancido

I also think that Mills can play the wingback role better than Davies and I think I'm right in remembering that Davies has played a lot of games in midfield for his previous clubs.  

I thought Davies was awful when he went into midfield.  Fair enough he hasn't played that role for a fair few years but he looked lost to me.  Mills at least tried to run with the ball on a few occasions in the first half.  

I thought the thinking behind the Davies/Mills switch was down to the fact Mills has younger legs to stretch Exeter in wide areas.  Dunno though.

Quoted from rancido

Saturday was definitely a " poor day at the office " but from my point of view there were certainly one or two things that contributed to this. I think Boyce was very poor and seemed very reluctant to attempt to bring the ball out of defence or even to make a quick pass. If you play three across the back than IMO those players need to be comfortable on the ball and Boyce certainly wasn't. It was ok playing Comley as a screen/playmaker in front of the back three but the combination of Mills and Disley alongside him is all wrong. To complement Comley you need  a " yard dog " and a good playmaker ( eg Vose ) alongside him. To me, it seemed like one of the tactics advocated by Bignot on Saturday was to have Andrews and Davies break as wide as possible when we had possession coming out of defense but very rarely was this utilised. I lost count of the number of times Andrews was wide and no opposition within 30 yards of him but Comley didn't play out wide. The whole point of 5 across midfield is to utilise the full width of the pitch when attacking but this rarely happened.
I like Disley and still feel he has a lot to offer but not in the role he was given on Saturday. He could play the role that Comley was given but where do you then play Comley? I also think that Mills can play the wingback role better than Davies and I think I'm right in remembering that Davies has played a lot of games in midfield for his previous clubs.
Bignot certainly has a lot to do to find the right blend of players to make us effective but I'm sure he knows this. He has inherited a squad not of his own making and with many on 2 year deals he doesn't have a lot of room for manoeuvre unless he can off-load some of them.

From a defensive point of view I thought Boyce did o.k. but was massively out of his comfort zone having to advance with the ball in his possession, you can see why we have brought Gunning into the squad. It was made even harder for him as the mid field where so static.

I like the intention to play out from the back as it strongly suggests that we are going to get the ball down and pass it but we need mid fielders who are moving into space and demanding the ball to give the CBs and other  mid field players options. I think Andrew and Davies get it but and are comfortable with their roles but getting the right mix of the central 3 is the key and I sense we are a few games away from it yet but it will come.

Once we have that sorted the next challenge will be getting the front two into positions where they can benefit from the formation and pose a dangerous threat which again looks like another fairly "big work in progress" it will happen but we need to be fortunate with injuries for a bit and bring some balance & enthusiasm into the middle either by signings, getting McAllister back and/or giving Venney a go.

Never thought I would type these words - WE MISSED SUMMERFIELD ON SATURDAY - Davies and Disley seemed devoid of energy and, for all his passes go astray, Summerfield does try and get the ball forward at pace.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

I think he'll be fine as long as he remembers his first priority is to stop the opposition scoring, I like that he can pass but would like it even more if there where more willing mid field players to take the ball from him.

Agree Herts, This applies to all our defenders who hoof it forward. They have no choice. They need midfield players moving into space to receive the ball.

I'm starting to think that we should probably be playing 4-3-1-2 or 4-4-2 for most home games until MB can get the players he wants and introduce his preferred system(s) - seems a fairly plausible learning point from Saturday given the lessons learned on technical ability and players understanding their positions and the overall shape of the team.

Vose should play in the 4-3-1-2 shape as he's the most technically adept player and possibly the only one capable of getting 'beyond and behind' if you like. We are blatantly short of a technically good winger on either side though so Chambers should probably play when fit for his energy and mobility. It must now be clear to the staff that there are a substantial number in the squad they'd like to replace with better - a tricky situation and process to manage and one that needs to be acknowledged by supporters.

For me, Mills needs to be restored to right back in either system and let's see what Mcallister can do. Ditto Venney IMO. Comley is the centrepiece for now until we can sign the midfielders we really need to move onwards and upwards.

3-5-2 has obviously worked very well for us away recently. Wondering if confidence in that is now a bit shot after Saturday which really was poor in so many aspects.

Quoted from moosey_club

without sounding too flippant....we havnt had a "midfield" for a very long time now, something Hurst never quite managed to fathom out neither did the previous two or maybe three managers before that.  We have had some shocking centre midfielders over the last 10 plus years with only a couple of decent individuals that i think there would be some sort of majority acceptance of being decent.
With regards to a decent centre mid partnership then anyone under 20 would probably struggle to name one.

IF as many claim, we haven't had a decent midfield for years then how have we finished in the top half for the last 5 seasons? Must have been above average for the league we were in or was it solely down to the defence & strikers?

Quoted from Cloudy

IF as many claim, we haven't had a decent midfield for years then how have we finished in the top half for the last 5 seasons? Must have been above average for the league we were in or was it solely down to the defence & strikers?

We have had a team based on a solid defence for that time, and a midfield that was there for containing, if we had some ooomphh in that centre at any point in that 5 yrs i think we would have been in the league for a couple of seasons already....we have had 20 goal strikers and a tight defence which has got us through but in alot of games already this season it shows what we have all known for long enough....our centre mid isnt dynamic enough.
For every Disley there are a plenty of forgettable ones...  look away now if you are squeamish...   .Leary, Hudson, Paddy, Brown, Kerr, Robinson, Pell, Wilson, Church, Mcarthy, Wright, Panther, Thompson, Henderson. .....i rest my case.

I know it's not a popular view but maybe we got what we could afford at the time, though looking at that list if that's the case we must really skint!

Out of the present squad the first midfielder I would put on the teamsheet is the person most posters have a go at --our friend Sommerfield. He is a none stop player,not afraid to tackle nor to shoot[even though he might hit the corner flag more times than the goal] He doesn't hide and gives you his all for 90 minutes. He TRIES to do things instead of 5yard sideward passes.. He tries to create which very few of the present team achieve.

Quoted from golfer

Out of the present squad the first midfielder I would put on the teamsheet is the person most posters have a go at --our friend Sommerfield. He is a none stop player,not afraid to tackle nor to shoot[even though he might hit the corner flag more times than the goal] He doesn't hide and gives you his all for 90 minutes. He TRIES to do things instead of 5yard sideward passes.. He tries to create which very few of the present team achieve.

Don't disagree with you Golfer. He offers a lot more than putting Disley or Davies in that role out of the present squad. The cold hard fact is that Summerfield has just ONE assist to his name all season. An extremely poor return for our supposed creative midfielder.

We desperately need at least one if not two upgrades on the whole lot of them..

Quoted from moosey_club

We have had a team based on a solid defence for that time, and a midfield that was there for containing, if we had some ooomphh in that centre at any point in that 5 yrs i think we would have been in the league for a couple of seasons already....we have had 20 goal strikers and a tight defence which has got us through but in alot of games already this season it shows what we have all known for long enough....our centre mid isnt dynamic enough.
For every Disley there are a plenty of forgettable ones...  look away now if you are squeamish...   .Leary, Hudson, Paddy, Brown, Kerr, Robinson, Pell, Wilson, Church, Mcarthy, Wright, Panther, Thompson, Henderson. .....i rest my case.

20 goal strikers get their passes from somewhere or were they all route one from the defenders??

Quoted from Cloudy

20 goal strikers get their passes from somewhere or were they all route one from the defenders??

from the wings  

Is now gonna be LOTS better...hopefully
UTM

Agree with Codger and golfer's posts on Summerfield. Think he would've given us something on Saturday and think he cops far more stick than he should.

Since them two male private heads directed abuse at him on Twitter he's actually been alright when he's played (not much I know).

Quoted from LH

Since them two male private heads directed abuse at him on Twitter he's actually been alright when he's played (not much I know).

He has been good all season, but one or two high profile mistakes have gone against him.

A few more than one or two! He gives energy to the midfield but is calamitously complacent at times. Not the answer by any means for me. However I understand that if we are already behind, so don't have a drawing/winning position to hold on to he could be worth the risk. Should never be starting tho, makes Toto look risk free.

I think summerfield would be suited to the system we're playing at the minute. With Comley the holding midfielder, summerfield can use his energy higher up the pitch alongside Osbourne. Could be a good midfield 3.

I think we need to rein in our expectations for Osborne a little. There are 3 or 4 others playing in midfield and it's unlikely that one player will improve things overnight, we still need better midfield players alongside him before we can expect see the real improvements needed.

UTM

Summerfield could get some game time on Sat if fit. Probably at the expense of Diz. May start with Osbourne coming on later.

It's amazing how some players improve when they don't play.

I think some of you are guilty of forgetting how poor Summerfield can be. He's probably provided more assists for the opposition than he has for his own team this season.

Ahh the good old Summerfield debate again

Summerfield can be alright, he's just hit and miss, on a good day he's very good, on a bad day he's absolutely terrible, but I certainly prefer him to Berrett

I think somebody else mentioned summerfield having only 1 assist to his name this season - well I can think of two he has had for the opposition off the top of my head! And he has done it a couple more times but been saved by last ditch tackles from teammates. Think he flatters to deceive goin forward, appears more effective than he is. But is dangerous for his own team when in possession in his own half. For me definitely one of those players who improves in people's eyes when he isn't in the team! Still maybe MB can coach some of his weaknesses out of him?

If you watch him more carefully, when he doesn't play a square ball across the back 4, he tends to keep the ball well and actually be really composed on the ball and energetic with ot without it. Has everything in the locker, a good engine, good passing range, can put his foot in, can score from distance but also has a monumental balls up there. If he could eradicate that he wouldn't be playing at this level.

Summerfield has a great attitude and always tries to play at tempo which sometimes can be his downfall as he becomes careless with the ball and gives it away. He has got a good range of passing though and does not mind putting in a shift.

I actually think he could make a much bigger impact with a more stable mid field around him that means he can just focus on getting us up the park.

Quoted from MarinerMal

It's amazing how some players improve when they don't play.

I think some of you are guilty of forgetting how poor Summerfield can be. He's probably provided more assists for the opposition than he has for his own team this season.

Or maybe, when he doesn't play, you see what he gives you that Disley/Mills don't.

Yes there has been a few times this season where a poor pass in our own half has given the opposition a chance to counter attack us. But at least that comes from him constantly wanting to get on the ball and pass it progressively. Even in those games he still doesn't hide after it and still always wants the ball which shows a bit of mental strength.

He has a bit of energy and helps us press fairly well.
He always looks to receive the ball on the half-turn and get us going forward as quickly as possible. (Can be another slight downfall of his at times though as he sometimes does this without checking behind him).

He looks to play passes that break lines and get the ball into the feet of the strikers.

Overall he's nowhere near as bad as some claim.
He's a decent enough League 2 player and I'd be happy for him to stay as part of the squad.
I think some people use the fact that he's gifted a few chances to opposition as justification for a lazy observation that he always gives the ball away - which he doesn't.

I actually think he's been involved in the build up of quite a few goals of ours without getting the "assist" state for bring the last one to touch the ball before the scorer. I remember a few good through balls he's played to an overlapping Andrew who has then crossed, directly or indirectly leading to goals.

And I think as someone else has said, it may help him playing  in a three too.

To be fair to him, despite his mistakes, he's never shown an unwillingness to receive the ball.

The lad from Mansfield on signing today. Good spot by the fishy detective!  B-)

Quotes

Summerfield has a great attitude and always tries to play at tempo

He has a bit of energy and helps us press fairly well.

He always looks to receive the ball on the half-turn and get us going forward as quickly as possible

He looks to play passes that break lines and get the ball into the feet of the strikers.

I actually think he's been involved in the build up of quite a few goals of ours without getting the "assist"

Where is this genius, go get him Marcus------Oh wait

So far MB has done a good job in getting new players on board. If he can get Chris Clements to put in the effort he too looks useful.

However, we don't have any potency out wide. Ashley Chambers puts in a good shift, but doesn't get wide and put in telling crosses.

If we put Yusuf out wide he will be missed up front, and was not effective for Crawley out wide.

Jackson (if he stays) has lost confidence, and Browne is out on loan.

Maybe its time for Bolly to come to the party. I can't see that JF will allow money to be spent much more after the 5 signings and resigning of Conley.

Quoted from IlkleyMariner

So far MB has done a good job in getting new players on board. If he can get Chris Clements to put in the effort he too looks useful.

However, we don't have any potency out wide. Ashley Chambers puts in a good shift, but doesn't get wide and put in telling crosses.

If we put Yusuf out wide he will be missed up front, and was not effective for Crawley out wide.

Jackson (if he stays) has lost confidence, and Browne is out on loan.

Maybe its time for Bolly to come to the party. I can't see that JF will allow money to be spent much more after the 5 signings and resigning of Conley.

I don't get " I can't see that JF will allow money to be spent much more after the 5 signings and resigning of Conley" ??? Maybe we have spent what is available and the budget has been used up? I am sure we are not sat on a pot of money just earning interest the club are doing everything they can to get players in.

Quoted from Garth

Quotes

Summerfield has a great attitude and always tries to play at tempo

He has a bit of energy and helps us press fairly well.

He always looks to receive the ball on the half-turn and get us going forward as quickly as possible

He looks to play passes that break lines and get the ball into the feet of the strikers.

I actually think he's been involved in the build up of quite a few goals of ours without getting the "assist"

Where is this genius, go get him Marcus------Oh wait

Selective quotes there Garth.

I gave a balanced opinion of him which did include negatives.

Quoted from Tommy

Selective quotes there Garth.

I gave a balanced opinion of him which did include negatives.

So we now have a completely new midfield in Osborne, McAllister and Clements (if he signs)

MB has said he doesn't mind players giving the ball away if they are trying to be positive with a pass. You see every week on MOTD, players with far more talent giving away goal scoring chances by playing out from the back. Sometimes a player can look bad because of those around him not being on the same wavelength and taking risks to get forward. A ball is played to where the man in possession thinks his team mate should be but isn't because he is naturally defensive minded. You see this every week at BP and it is what makes us disjointed. Pass and move football needs the move to make the pass effective. It takes a long time on the training pitch to get this fluid movement to come naturally. I think Summerfield could be a far more effective player in a more progressive, forward thinking side. Clements possibly suffers the same criticisms by Mansfield fans. It's easy to play the safe option and is why we struggle to break teams down.

Quoted from Tommy

Yes there has been a few times this season where a poor pass in our own half has given the opposition a chance to counter attack us. But at least that comes from him constantly wanting to get on the ball and pass it progressively. Even in those games he still doesn't hide after it and still always wants the ball which shows a bit of mental strength.]

In just about every home game I've seen him play in, he has gifted the opposition the ball and set up a counter attack and at least twice resulting in a goal for them. Once, twice maybe even 3 times could be forgiven but four, five, six... is a sign of a player who is a liability.

"Wanting to pass it progressively". Well it depends on how often that pass succeeds and I don't see him providing enough of this. Yes we need a player who can do that in the middle but we need a better player who can do that. Hopefully he will be one of the new signings.

Quoted from ginnywings

MB has said he doesn't mind players giving the ball away if they are trying to be positive with a pass. You see every week on MOTD, players with far more talent giving away goal scoring chances by playing out from the back. Sometimes a player can look bad because of those around him not being on the same wavelength and taking risks to get forward. A ball is played to where the man in possession thinks his team mate should be but isn't because he is naturally defensive minded. You see this every week at BP and it is what makes us disjointed. Pass and move football needs the move to make the pass effective. It takes a long time on the training pitch to get this fluid movement to come naturally. I think Summerfield could be a far more effective player in a more progressive, forward thinking side. Clements possibly suffers the same criticisms by Mansfield fans. It's easy to play the safe option and is why we struggle to break teams down.

Agree with this, also when we lose the ball the team has to win it back I'm not sure we have been as effective as we might be at this season to date.

I think Summerfield has shown enough to be given some leeway and see what he's got in a better balanced side. He looked very good at Bolton and in a couple of games at BP. If he can get some consistency and cut out the sloppy passes, then we could have a good player on our hands.

Disagree. I just don't think Summerfield is good enough, just my opinion. He has had the occasion decent game but nowhere near enough at this level. He may do okay at a lower level.

I think people desperate to see a creative type of midfield player at Town that they accept mediocrity as good. A similar thing happened with Nolan. We should be looking at players better than these.

Quoted from MarinerMal

Disagree. I just don't think Summerfield is good enough, just my opinion. He has had the occasion decent game but nowhere near enough at this level. He may do okay at a lower level.

I think people desperate to see a creative type of midfield player at Town that they accept mediocrity as good. A similar thing happened with Nolan. We should be looking at players better than these.

We have one - Vose! Sometimes you can only sign what's available and within your price range. I think we saw the value of Nolan when it counted - at Wembley! and also delivering the free kick for Omar to head home the winner in the semi at Braintree.  

As if Nolan was mediocre.

But maybe with a better midfielder than Nolan we wouldn't have fallen so far of the pace after his arrival and wouldn't have finished lower than Braintree in the League. Nolan's best game were when he had Disley and Clay alongside him to do the job he couldn't/wouldn't do. Nolan wasn't a bad player he just wasn't a good player. Mediocre.

Yes I would play Vose over Summerfield, he's a better more creative player.

You're not comparing apples with apples though vis a vis Summerfield and Vose.

Summerfield is an energetic, box-to-box midfielder who is a pretty good footballer but drops a clanger too often. Vose is one of the most naturally gifted players to grace "The BP" and can unpick a defence in seconds and beat a man with ease or deliver an inch perfect ball to a players feet but sadly lacks desire and can go missing in games. You could play both in a midfield of Comley, Summerfield and Vose but I'd personally like to see Comley, Summerfield and Osborne on Saturday.

Also I for one rate Summerfield quite highly. He was excellent at Notts County, Bolton and Plymouth and at home to Stevenage, and was also good at  home to Newport and at Luton, Mansfield and even Doncaster and I thought he played well until he got injured against Blackpool What that shows though is that by and large he is very good away but not so good at home. He was very ordinary against Morecambe, Crewe and Hartlepool and I can't remember him in any others.

Herts brought up Vose, I just said I thought Vose was the better more productive player.

No, I don't think Vose and Summerfield would make a very good pairing in midfield at all, the opposite in fact. In lieu of not seeing the new guys yet, I think Comely alongside Disley (for his experience alongside Comely) with Vose as the creative attacking midfielder behind the strikers, a much better midfield three.

I wouldn't say vose lacks desire I think he needs to be the conductor of the team with a summerfield and comley playing alongside him !!!

It's funny how most see Vose as a better player than Summerfield and would like to see him in a No10 role, yet both Hurst and Bignot gave way more game time to Summerfield and neither of them have tried Vose anywhere other than on the left. They are seeing something most fans are not.

I honestly don't think Vose is as good as some like to think he is.

Quoted from MarinerMal

But maybe with a better midfielder than Nolan we wouldn't have fallen so far of the pace after his arrival and wouldn't have finished lower than Braintree in the League. Nolan's best game were when he had Disley and Clay alongside him to do the job he couldn't/wouldn't do. Nolan wasn't a bad player he just wasn't a good player. Mediocre.

Yes I would play Vose over Summerfield, he's a better more creative player.

We where off the pace when he arrived to be honest. Who cares where we finished we got up, at that level Nolan was better than mediocre maybe not  world beater I agree.

Agree with Mariner93er about Vose

Occasionally he is outstanding, but every other game he's just a steady 6.5, maybe touching a 7, not enough goals or assists for me.

Quoted from MarinerMal

Herts brought up Vose, I just said I thought Vose was the better more productive player.

No, I don't think Vose and Summerfield would make a very good pairing in midfield at all, the opposite in fact. In lieu of not seeing the new guys yet, I think Comely alongside Disley (for his experience alongside Comely) with Vose as the creative attacking midfielder behind the strikers, a much better midfield three.

I would have liked to have judged Vose season to date if he had a run in mid field with the likes of McAlister doing so0me of the scrapping and pressing............. I just think he see's things that others in our squad don't and actually has the ability to execute what he sees.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

We where off the pace when he arrived to be honest. Who cares where we finished we got up, at that level Nolan was better than mediocre maybe not  world beater I agree.

He had a nice touch but most home games in which i saw him he didn't create much.
He gave the ball away a lot and left big holes in the midfield.
He played well at Wembley though but that was with Disley and Clay.

Quoted from ginnywings

It's funny how most see Vose as a better player than Summerfield and would like to see him in a No10 role, yet both Hurst and Bignot gave way more game time to Summerfield and neither of them have tried Vose anywhere other than on the left. They are seeing something most fans are not.

Vose is better than Summerfield, technically and at the job for which some on here claim Summerfield is used for. That is creating opportunities. Summerfield does have a better engine which will always get you into Hurst side above technique and Bignot favours players who can press the opposition.

But for what we were discussing, about a creative attacking midfielder Vose has more ability than Summerfield.

Quoted from Davec

Agree with Mariner93er about Vose

Occasionally he is outstanding, but every other game he's just a steady 6.5, maybe touching a 7, not enough goals or assists for me.

because he isnt playing aaron! give him a run in the team and he will be our main man, there must be something behidn the scenes as to why he isnt getting a chance

I have noticed that Vose in the last couple of matches has shown a more energetic purpose about his play, if he could win a tackle he would be a better all round player.
He is the most technical player we have,  and at times is too far ahead in his thinking and playing for the rest of his team mates, which is not good going forward resulting in what looks like wasted passes.

Quoted from MarinerMal

Vose is better than Summerfield, technically and at the job for which some on here claim Summerfield is used for. That is creating opportunities. Summerfield does have a better engine which will always get you into Hurst side above technique and Bignot favours players who can press the opposition.

But for what we were discussing, about a creative attacking midfielder Vose has more ability than Summerfield.

Bold statement. Technically, no argument, but it's a team game and two managers who have spent their whole lives in professional football obviously disagree that Vose is better for the team than Summerfield. I think Vose will be one of those players that never achieves what his talent should enable him to. Managers will keep trying to get it out of him but i doubt they will IMO.

Quoted from Hagrid

because he isnt playing aaron! give him a run in the team and he will be our main man, there must be something behidn the scenes as to why he isnt getting a chance

How do you know that? Surely the fact that he isn't starting suggests he's not as good as we believe. I similar sentiment was displayed towards Browne at one point, with people saying he should be playing. But it's all based on a belief that he could be the player we need with no evidence to actually substantiate it.

Quoted from ginnywings

Bold statement. Technically, no argument, but it's a team game and two managers who have spent their whole lives in professional football obviously disagree that Vose is better for the team than Summerfield. I think Vose will be one of those players that never achieves what his talent should enable him to. Managers will keep trying to get it out of him but i doubt they will IMO.

Ofc course it's a team game and it's about how to get the best out of your team. So the fact that Summerfield gets chosen over Vose doesn't mean Vose isn't better than Summerfield, just that the manager thinks it suits his team/system better.

Although, I do agree Vose is one of those players unlikely to achieve his potential. Still, IMO, he is the best of his type we have. Without having seen any of the new signings.

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i dont know it, but im entitled to think it, when he is on form vose is without a doubt the most creative member of our team, even on saturday, he did try take his man on, and linked up with Omar, we have nothing else in our midfield similar to vose, would always be on my teamsheet