Can we all agree now VAR was a good idea?

After it's initial teething problems can we all agree it was a good idea, I don't see many complaining about it now.

I was all for it from day one but many were against.

Same camp as you promotion plaice. Always thought VAR was a good idea.

Some of the heartache football fans have witnessed over the years particularly in the world cup the greatest tournament on earth due to poor decisions should be minimised now.

Nope, still hate it. Goal line yes, but VAR no.

Like anything new introduced, there is going to be teething problems, some fear and resentment.  People generally do not like change.  After improvements to the system,  VAR was always likely to benefit the game.  Even if some spontaneity was lost.

Teething problems are always a big deal.  Certainly with babies.

I can see what it's trying to add to the game but, call me old fashioned, I still can't get over the fact that you can score a last-minute winner, celebrate like mad, and then have that moment taken away from you - even if it's the correct decision.

So even a correct decision feels like it's somehow taking joy away from the game.

I can't criticise any governing body that tries to achieve 100% correct decisions. However, VAR will never be infallible due to the fact that it's operated by humans who, you know, make mistakes. Even when using technology.

When it comes down to it, I ask myself: as someone who loves going to matches in person, would I want VAR at Town games? While I appreciate everything that it offers, the answer is still 'no'.

Never wanted it. Still don’t. It’s not going anywhere so I’ll just have to lump it!

Quoted from RichMariner

I can see what it's trying to add to the game but, call me old fashioned, I still can't get over the fact that you can score a last-minute winner, celebrate like mad, and then have that moment taken away from you - even if it's the correct decision.

So even a correct decision feels like it's somehow taking joy away from the game.

I can't criticise any governing body that tries to achieve 100% correct decisions. However, VAR will never be infallible due to the fact that it's operated by humans who, you know, make mistakes. Even when using technology.

When it comes down to it, I ask myself: as someone who loves going to matches in person, would I want VAR at Town games? While I appreciate everything that it offers, the answer is still 'no'.

As a concept I’m fine with it provided it’s used sparingly for genuine clear and obvious errors. If used correctly, it shouldn’t affect the spontaneity of celebrations, which was clearly an issue in its early execution in the Premier League.

Look at it in a Town context. Had it been present in those games, Scott Neilson doesn’t get sent off at Gateshead and Will Puddy does get sent off for Bristol Rovers at Wembley. Our history, and our present,  could have been very different.

I’m sure we’ve benefited from bad refereeing decisions, though they’re less memorable the other way round, but I can’t think of any of the magnitude of those two in the play-offs.

It’s had its flaws, but it’s improving and it’s probably right to stick with it so long as we’re sensible.

Whilst it's overseen by humans there will always remain inconsistencies and some benefit, some not.

I'm sure one day VAR will have some sort of AI element that can immediately determine offsides and other binary decisions, which will address most of the concerns about spontaneity.  Some may not like the idea of the game being partially refereed by a robot, but it's coming.  I was unsure about VAR at first but I like the fact that I now rarely finish watching a Premier League game feeling like the wrong team won due a refereeing howler.  

World Cup 2022 is the rumour for AIVAR.

I’m not sure what it really adds to the game and it’s literally just proven the sheer disparity in the game.

Whilst I understand that the money sits at the very top of the game, hence why it is only afforded by the very top clubs but it once again indicates that the feeling is, only that level matters.

It was introduced to ensure ‘wrong decisions’ were minimised or eradicated…I’m not sure this is entirely the case and as a purist, I don’t see how that sanitisation adds to the game, even if it means a glaring mistakes hinders or indeed helps your team…

Personally, I think it was introduced becauee of the vast sums of cash and as we know, the rich like to stay rich…it always seemed to be pundits or some of the select few of ex players clamouring for it rather than managers and current players.

They were discussing the company who did goal line technology and their ability to detect offside without the need for human interaction…but it was less accurate than the current system…the two ex players on the wireless were dead against it, as Trevor Sinclair pointed out, why introduce a new system that’s actually not as good as the current one, simply because ‘it’s quicker’…as he said, quicker May be, but possibly not right…

I don’t like it, I’m all for moving the game forward but to be honest, introducing VAR simply took attention away from the real issues in the game, it’s here to stay and for the most part, the select few that have it will probably claim it works, as a fan, I don’t see the point nor do I like. I’ve been in stadiums where it’s been used both in this country and abroad, it didn’t enhance my experience or improve the games…

The discussion used to be about it being “a yard offside” now it’s about a millimetre offside.  Same discussion different dimensions.
It’s hard to argue about the logic but anything that detracts from the emotion and spontaneity in the game has to be considered very, very carefully.

I think it's good for goal line decisions. However, the offside decisions because a players finger, toe, or knee makes him offside seem ridiculous.

It takes away the goal and celebration, jubilation for the fans, because a little fingernail was poking out 20 yards down the pitch 10 seconds earlier.

Not interested as it only benefits the greedy premiership teams

Stll not a fan.  It shouldn't be used for offsides.  How can a player judge if they're onside when making a run when it's going to be judged by technology not available to the player.  Either that or the offside rule needs to change.  As for other decisions (fouls etc), most of them are still down to the official's own interpretation and different officials will still give different decisions.  So no, I will not agree VAR is a good idea.  

It’s excrement.

It's seems better this season, probably because it's used less. I think it will be a good idea when it's used 0 times a season.

Quoted from promotion plaice

After it's initial teething problems can we all agree it was a good idea, I don't see many complaining about it now.

I was all for it from day one but many were against.

      Can you imagine if VAR was operational what the mental anguish it would cause to the Very Poor referees (and thats 99% of them) that are in the system.

Nah cant stand it

Quoted from Poojah

Look at it in a Town context. Had it been present in those games, Scott Neilson doesn’t get sent off at Gateshead and Will Puddy does get sent off for Bristol Rovers at Wembley. Our history, and our present,  could have been very different

It’s had its flaws, but it’s improving and it’s probably right to stick with it so long as we’re sensible.

Not just history that could of been different for Grimsby either if VAR and goal line technology had been around. I know Spain fans that were gutted that they didn't get through to the semi finals of the world cup in 2002 when Morientes goal should of stood. Dreams of many dashed by human error.

I get it for line calls but it should be quicker.

As for subjective issues like the difference between a yellow and red card tackle, surely it should be down to the onfield referee and the context of the game?

Ah well, we'll just have to kick around the lower leagues having fun.......

As long it’s used for the most marginal of decisions, it’s male masturbation.
The buzzer system for goal lines is fine as it’s very discrete and quick.
If you have to wait a minute to see if Harry Kane’s left bollock was in an offside position, then it’s just pantomime stuff.

My only bugbear with it now is the offside at goals, minutes after everyone has celebrated the goal can then be ruled out, which is infuriating. Granted they have improved the margin of error problem - not had many toe nail incidents this season.

However i think the tech that Hawk-eye are looking to introduce, at the World Cup, would solve that issue. Real time (think they said it'd be 2 seconds behind play) monitoring of offsides sent straight to the linesman meaning it'll take a tiny fraction of the time.

Would also like the fans to be able to hear the discussions, similar to rugby/cricket, as i think that'd clear a lot of confusion which leads to anger over decisions.

We can all dislike it, but it's here and here to stay and there's nothing we can do about that I'm afraid. So as long as they continue to improve, no issue from me. English football has been miles behind how it has been used in Europe and elsewhere where it has run a lot smoother - key example of that is the World Cup and Euros which were pretty good.

Go back to original offsides, easy for lino to see, use VAR  for penalty claims . For corners shirt pulling player wrestling  doesn't need VAR to sort Ref sees it and let's it go every week.

No we can't all agree.

It's a excrement idea that's changing the whole context of the beautiful game.

Injustice is a huge part of football.  The was it/wasn't it issue with Geoff Hurst's goal against West Germany in 1966 kept the conversation going for decades about would we really have won without.  In modern terms, the injustice for Frank Lampard's goal against Germany in 2010 allowed people to have deluded belief that we would have turned it round in the second half had the goal counted.

Had Willy Puddy walked at Wembley in 2015 we might not have had Operation Promotion and with it the potential to sell-on Omar Bogle for a huge profit 18 months later (and subsequently waste it).  

It shapes conversations after the game and then for weeks and weeks after.   Football is a game played by humans, who are fallible.  Why remove that from the game? Be it a slight mistake or a huge one, it's part of the game.

If VAR had been at BP last Saturday and somehow 'discovered' an infringement that meant County's winner had to be chalked off, don't get me wrong, I'd have cheered and felt a great sense of delight.

But I still don't want it at Town games.

And we have particularly crap refs at this level. Even their ineptitude isn't enough to change my mind on this.

Goal-line technology is great. That's a black and white thing. It's either in or it's not, and there are no arguments.

That's as far as I'd take technology in football. I can live with all the other indiscretions.

It’s just a mirror into society that exists now of the it’s not fair brigade if something goes against you .
Referee mistakes are/were an integral part of the game that created the joy or pain if you ask me . With that taken away it’s just not the same .

Quoted from promotion plaice

After it's initial teething problems can we all agree it was a good idea, I don't see many complaining about it now.

I was all for it from day one but many were against.

Quite possibly the best thing to ever happen to football, since the abolishment of goalkeepers being able to pick the ball up, or handle it, from a direct pass from their own player. In other words, what most people call the back pass law, which is a stupid thing to call it, because it doesn't only apply to back passes.

VAR is superb, and it is an improvement this season on the previous one.

I still think the offside law can at times make even VAR decisions difficult. I prefer the old law, where there has to be clear daylight between attacker and defender. All of this measuring toe nails is a bit stupid, but that's not VAR's fault, that it the offside law.

Good idea, still don't think its being used as well as it could

I watched a game yesterday and it took 2 minutes 40 seconds to find out if it was a goal or not ,  far too long.

We tried years ago that there should be daylight between the attacker and last defender which I thought worked well but it was reversed after the short trial.

We should not have to wait more than a few seconds to see if a goal stands or not.

Goal line technology has been a success and VAR could still be if they can get the waiting time down to say 10 seconds longer than that just go with the refs decision.

My only experience of VAR at a Town game was the Cup tie at Selhurst Park, where Andrew Fox got sent off, and it remains one of only 2 occasions where I've had to resort to Twitter (whilst being at the game) to get confirmed what the heck had occurred.    Unfortunate end to Fox's GTFC career.   Also, I didn't like Andros Townsend chasing the ref demanding he revert to VAR.

Of course had we been drawn at home in the Cup, VAR wouldn't have been available.

And the other occasion was the Bapaga second yellow at Altrincham this season. But that was just standard urine-poor refereeing which VAR would presumably have upheld?!

VAR, in addition to diving, rubbish punditry, and the big clubs hoovering up all the best players, is a factor in the Match of the Day and thus the Premiership losing its appeal for me.

One of the things I loved about football was that (quality apart) in principle it was the same game on Bradley pitches as it was at BP and Old Trafford. The same in the FA Cup as it was in the World Cup.

VAR has changed this and now it's even different in the same competition used at some ties in the FA and EFL cups but not others, though I know it's inevitable these differences don't sit well with me.

I was o.k. with goal line technology as that's pretty black and white as long as all of the ball is over the line but I still think there is room for interpretation with VAR and I thought that was one of the things it was meant to eradicate.  

What I would be delighted to see is the replacement of "assistant referees" with robots that kept up with play, called off side correctly and can see who the ball last touched before it went out when they are stood 3 yards away.  

Quoted from ex-merseymariner

And the other occasion was the Bapaga second yellow at Altrincham this season. But that was just standard urine-poor refereeing which VAR would presumably have upheld?!

VAR, in addition to diving,

Aye, VAR doesn't look at second yellows.

And on diving, when the VAR overturns a penalty decision, why is the bloke they've just spotted diving not booked for diving?

My view when it was introduced is that we'll wonder in years to come how we managed without it, and that hasn't changed. There's so much cheating in football we have to help referees to get the big decisions right and it can't be acceptable that a cheat gets away with a dive or handball to win a game
It's still too slow and I would give them 20 seconds to decide, if it's not clear and obvious after 20 seconds somebody gets the benefit of the doubt. They also need to enhance communication with the crowd so everyone knows what's going on.

For those of you who enjoy cricket, I like the fact that technology still affords 'umpire's call' on LBWs.

I can see how VAR has tried to introduce this to football, so that the referee on the pitch retains ultimate responsibility on either sticking to or overturning a big decision.

That's the element I like, but it hasn't advanced or added to the game.

One week a player gets the slightest tap to their thigh and they go down. Ref points to the spot. Technically, he got touched, defender didn't win the ball, it's soft, but VAR isn't going to overturn it as it isn't a clear and obvious error.

Same day but in a game elsewhere, same thing happens only this time the ref waves the appeals away. No penalty, and VAR won't overturn it because the ref didn't think it was strong enough contact and a bit soft.

This is football's equivalent of umpire's call. Nice idea, but doesn't add anything because it's referee's call and they are inconsistent from one game to the next.

VAR will continue to be bad whilst the idiots that referee games in this country continue to get away with sub-par performances.

I thought it was excellent in the Euros and diabolical in the PL. Its got slightly better this year but I wince at the thought of the useless pillocks in this division operating it.

Goal line technology yes, VAR no.

In the cup game at Palace we spent 5 minutes looking at each other wondering what was holding up the game. VAR overturned a referees decision to book our player for a poor tackle - which he’d clearly seen and decided on the severity of punishment. Yellow replaced with red, 5 minutes in to the game and the match was ruined for the magnificent 7000 travelling mariners.

If the ref points to the centre spot having given a goal I want the celebration to be spontaneous, not have to pause for a VAR check.

Quoted from Geordie Mariner 66

Goal line technology yes, VAR no.

In the cup game at Palace we spent 5 minutes looking at each other wondering what was holding up the game. VAR overturned a referees decision to book our player for a poor tackle - which he’d clearly seen and decided on the severity of punishment. Yellow replaced with red, 5 minutes in to the game and the match was ruined for the magnificent 7000 travelling mariners.

I don’t think Moss realised how high Fox caught Townsend. Into a planted leg.

The controversy of whether VAR should be used in some FA Cup matches in the same round but not others is valid. I agree with that. It was a definite red though.

Saying VAR is necessary Becauee someone thinks the refereeing isn’t very good is ridiculous. Standard of refereeing in this country is no different to any other; you get some that have good games, some have bad. Much like players…

VAR adds little to the game and just gives managers/players another thing to beat referees with. It’s not without risk of bad decisions and is still ultimately someone’s opinion. The way we adopted it in this country is like everything else, we wanted it but we’re never going to look what others did and adapt that to our game…take the monitors for instance, Mike Riley (actually one of the issues in refereeing at that level) didn’t want referees using them, yet when we saw them being used in the World Cup and in Europe it did work…English arrogance and a ‘we know best’ mentality meant the VAR roll out here was shite…

The application of VAR is convoluted and as I say, doesn’t really improve the game as far as I can see…we still get controversy and Riley (him again) made a big deal of referees ‘missing’ decisions…decisions nobody in the games involved called for or moaned weren’t given…

It’s here to stay but as far as I can see, it’s been brought in to appease the money men and some jumped up ex footballers in a studio…it separates what was an ‘equal’ game, as someone pointed it, quality aside, football was the same technically be it on ploggers or Wembley…it’s not anymore…

Only time I care or it affects me is if one of my FPL players scores and VAR disallows it etc.

Quoted from lukeo

Only time I care or it affects me is if one of my FPL players scores and VAR disallows it etc.

Love that game . Only thing with that though is you need to get your captain right or you can loose your place in the league standings.  Just the other week I didn't captain Salah and he scored 3 against Manchester United 😔😉🙂.

I must say, I'm not a fan.  Some of the goals given offside are ridiculous and have ruined the game.  A shirt's width or something or other. I've also seen obvious dives been given as penalties and penalties not given and you wonder who is watching the footage - the tea lady?  Also, if we have to have it, then we all should have it.  Was it Palace V Town where we were hard done by but there was no VAR there?  In other Cup games there were.  I'd prefer an appeal system like cricket, if it were used.

Quoted from Mayaman

I must say, I'm not a fan.  Some of the goals given offside are ridiculous and have ruined the game.  A shirt's width or something or other.  

Goals that are offside being given as offside is ridiculous?

Quoted from Rick12

Love that game . Only thing with that though is you need to get your captain right or you can loose your place in the league standings.  Just the other week I didn't captain Salah and he scored 3 against Manchester United 😔😉🙂.

Me to!
13 of us put £70 into a pot (first time iive done it) and you win money for Manager of the month and then overall top 3.. I'm useless and 9th but somehow got MOTM for September 😂
Oh and I also chickened out and took captaincy off salah for the United game!!

Quoted from lukeo

Me to!
13 of us put £70 into a pot (first time iive done it) and you win money for Manager of the month and then overall top 3.. I'm useless and 9th but somehow got MOTM for September 😂
Oh and I also chickened out and took captaincy off salah for the United game!!

I do that as well but not £70 only £ 20😉. I don't know if it happened to you but not that long ago I was doing well in my fantasy league. I was pushing for top spot but near the end I stopped captaining Alexi Sanchez when he was at Arsenal and actually dropped him. Cost me the league and some money 😔. Learnt my lesson now though. Captains make all the difference.

Something had to be done to correct obvious errors. The Henry handling incident against Eire, the Maradonna 'hand of god' against England, the Lampard 'goal' against Germany, and countless others.

However, any such system must be applied sensibly. Last seasons stop-start fiasco's badly interrupted the flow of games, and every time a goal was scored you were never quite sure if it would stand.

This season it seems the system is being used more selectively. I still think Cricket has it about right. If each team has a limited number if appeals, say 1 per game, they could challenge where they have reasonable  grounds. That could still be abused by teams using up their allocation of appeals late in the game, but at least it might restrict the delays and might catch the glaring errors. .    

Quoted from diehardmariner

Had Willy Puddy walked at Wembley in 2015 we might not have had Operation Promotion and with it the potential to sell-on Omar Bogle for a huge profit 18 months later (and subsequently waste it).  

I've seen odd arguments against VAR, but I think this one takes the biscuit!