Man Utd v Liverpool

The Premier League clash between Manchester United and Liverpool scheduled to kick-off at 4:30 has been delayed.

About 200 Manchester United fans have entered Old Trafford and stormed the pitch in protest of the ownership of the club by the Glazer family.

Good. Hope other teams follow suit, as long as it's peaceful.

It's time the fans of football tried to take back our game from foreign owners. We should be following the German model of 51% fan ownership.

I'm really enjoying it - can't beat a bit of "stick it to The Man" action.

Not sure what it will achieve though - money basically doesn't give a feck...but right now this feels like it needs a wider organised campaign..  As ginnnywings says, hopefully the start of something bigger.

Great effort.
Funny how Sky’s mood has changed from 2 weeks ago when they were more than happy to whip up this anger.

Didnt see Man Utd fans protesting against the formation of the Premier League and the Champions League revisions that have helped them finance all their success in the 90's & 00's and ensuring their club has a leg up on the rest of domestic football in England, which made them so attractive to foreign ownership in the first place.

Not to mention of course all the other influence they have had in the game to help cement their position.

chuck them both out the leagues .......and no relegation this season  

Fair play to the real Man U fans

As long as everything is peaceful and there’s no trouble then I support there sentiments, perhaps they feel this is the only way they can voice their disapproval of the way the club is being run, as the owners live in Florida and I assume have probably only ever spoken to the prawn sandwich type supporter. Perhaps if when we were relegated to the conference the first time, we had staged demonstrations against our owner then who knows if things may have worked out differently.

Game now postponed.

Quoted from moosey_club

Didnt see Man Utd fans protesting against the formation of the Premier League and the Champions League revisions that have helped them finance all their success in the 90's & 00's and ensuring their club has a leg up on the rest of domestic football in England, which made them so attractive to foreign ownership in the first place.

Not to mention of course all the other influence they have had in the game to help cement their position.

I don't understand this opinion. You should be on the same as the United fans, all football fans need to be together on this. What would your reaction have been if the fans of the big 6 were all behind it I wonder.

Neville is right. If anything is taken from today it should be that fans of all clubs should unite and reform club ownership in this country.

Also: it was amazing how quick the media turned the gushing praise back on for the big 6 clubs in Europe this week after the previous week.

So game now cancelled, how do Man U ever get a home game played when they have a 75 thousand fans there.

Quoted from LH

Neville is right. If anything is taken from today it should be that fans of all clubs should unite and reform club ownership in this country.

Also: it was amazing how quick the media turned the gushing praise back on for the big 6 clubs in Europe this week after the previous week.

Also Sky whipping up anger against the super league then disrespecting supporters who protest against parasite owners.
Along with Grahame Souness who seems to have no idea of the actual takeover details ??

Well done Jamie Carragher for sticking up for the majority of peaceful fans. The press always concentrate on the few idiots and no doubt that will be the headlines tomorrow.

Quoted from LH

Neville is right. If anything is taken from today it should be that fans of all clubs should unite and reform club ownership in this country.

Also: it was amazing how quick the media turned the gushing praise back on for the big 6 clubs in Europe this week after the previous week.

Sky are critical of it when they are paying for the rights and earning money in subscriptions but when DAZN had the rights for the ESL it was an absolute disgrace.

Interesting.

Man U owners are under pressure to sell.

JF is rumoured to have business interests in Manchester.

Expect a statement on May 6th. No longer a conflict of interests.

Let’s face it. Under JF ownership you could guarantee they’d never be part of a ESL 😉

Quoted from Stadium

Also Sky whipping up anger against the super league then disrespecting supporters who protest against parasite owners.
Along with Grahame Souness who seems to have no idea of the actual takeover details ??

Souness just doesn't get the fans. Worked for The Sun after Hillsborough.

Quoted from Stadium

Along with Grahame Souness who seems to have no idea of the actual takeover details ??

Souness wasn’t trying to pin the pitch protest on Paul Pogba was he?

Quoted from jamesgtfc

Sky are critical of it when they are paying for the rights and earning money in subscriptions but when DAZN had the rights for the ESL it was an absolute disgrace.

One of them - Keane or Neville said that fans as well as everybody have a right to protest peacefully.

Maybe they'd better check with Priti Patel before they come out with statements like that!

And Sky will say absolutely anything to gain more subscribers, even if it contradicts what they said yesterday.

A Murdoch company is all about making money and supporting anything that gives Murdoch (and family) power whilst reducing his tax bill.

Get the lot of em turfed out or arrested for trespass and get on with the game, blooming prols, its going to have a massive affect on my fantasy team this week.

Quoted from Knut Anders Fosters Voles

Souness wasn’t trying to pin the pitch protest on Paul Pogba was he?

He's bound to be asking where Paul Pogba was in all this!

This is why they try to fill the ground with prawn sandwich brigade keep the commoners out so this sort of stuff doesn't happen

Quoted from Madeleymariner

Get the lot of em turfed out or arrested for trespass and get on with the game, blooming prols, its going to have a massive affect on my fantasy team this week.

I’ve only got Bruno, with 10 pts from Ward-Prowse coming off the bench for him. Hopefully not rearranged for this gameweek.

Quoted from louth_in_the_south

Fair play to the real Man U fans

Yes. What division are they in now? National League North or NPL?

be interesting to see what punishment Man utd   get for their fans  invading the pitch and  then causing the  club not to  fulfill  a league fixture. If it was Town we know big fine and points deduction, for start of next season.

All over this...town fans should’ve done this months/years ago

Quoted from MarinerMal

I don't understand this opinion. You should be on the same as the United fans, all football fans need to be together on this. What would your reaction have been if the fans of the big 6 were all behind it I wonder.

Every single team in the Premier League pulled the ladder up , the money the perceived wealth has ruined many a club trying to get there or who have got there and found it impossible to compete because of the accumulated wealth of the established teams. Those at the top end are worse , just look at Arsenal .....played for top 4 every year to qualify for the Champions League, probably the original team to completely disrespect the League Cup by playing the reserves in it to protect their "charge to  4th place".
The uproar the Super League has caused in the general top flight has nothing to do with the little guys , its all about themselves , they are in uproar because they know the chosen six would have an even bigger advantage money wise and also if they did get thrown out of the P.L then Sky may cut funding.  They dont look at or recognise themselves as also being part of the problem in the game lower down , just self interest.

Hate it all, pure greed.

Those doing what they did today again just have an axe to grind with the Glaziers , they arent bothered about Grimsby Town and the pyramid, they just hate their owners and its convenient to have a pop now. They will still be voting themselves payrises in any Sky TV deals, ensuring massive parachute payments in order to allow them a quick return should they finish bottom,  keeping all the gate receipts, hoovering up kids from all the acadamies for nothing...etc etc.

Quoted from BobbyCummingsTackle

And Sky will say absolutely anything to gain more subscribers, even if it contradicts what they said yesterday.

A Murdoch company is all about making money and supporting anything that gives Murdoch (and family) power whilst reducing his tax bill.

21st Century Fox sold their stake in Sky to Comcast in 2018. Murdoch therefore no longer controls or has a stake in Sky and Sky Sports.

Quoted from MarinerMal

I don't understand this opinion. You should be on the same as the United fans, all football fans need to be together on this. What would your reaction have been if the fans of the big 6 were all behind it I wonder.

The formation of The Premiersh*t was the catalyst that attracted all these overseas owners in the first place. The "big first division clubs" weren't content with some of the money generated from TV viewings, they wanted all of it and total control of the TV companies showing matches. They had no regard for how a lot of the money, up until that point, supported all grass roots and lower league football. The fans of these clubs were as much to blame as all they could see was the extra money their clubs would get to fund more expensive/better players. It was inevitable that all that money sloshing around would attract the wrong sort of club owners, those with no interest in football but ego inflated businessmen with deep pockets and scant regard for the fans. Well, you need a long spoon to sup with the devil, as all these clubs fans are discovering. But the genie is out the bottle now and there is no way he's going back. The tragic thing is that everyone who watches Premiersh*t football on tv or supports one of these clubs as a "second" team or even bought one of their shirts has helped to create this corporate monster. Sadly though these self same people can't see it.

Quoted from rancido

The formation of The Premiersh*t was the catalyst that attracted all these overseas owners in the first place. The "big first division clubs" weren't content with some of the money generated from TV viewings, they wanted all of it and total control of the TV companies showing matches. They had no regard for how a lot of the money, up until that point, supported all grass roots and lower league football. The fans of these clubs were as much to blame as all they could see was the extra money their clubs would get to fund more expensive/better players. It was inevitable that all that money sloshing around would attract the wrong sort of club owners, those with no interest in football but ego inflated businessmen with deep pockets and scant regard for the fans. Well, you need a long spoon to sup with the devil, as all these clubs fans are discovering. But the genie is out the bottle now and there is no way he's going back. The tragic thing is that everyone who watches Premiersh*t football on tv or supports one of these clubs as a "second" team or even bought one of their shirts has helped to create this corporate monster. Sadly though these self same people can't see it.

Completely agree.

One of the original architects of the movement that led to the premier league was Spurs chairman Irving Scholar. Don’t know why I remember him out of the original Big Four/Five/Six or whatever it was then.

That group included Everton in those days but certainly not Chelsea or Man City. I think Villa might have been another one.

Quoted from 4055

be interesting to see what punishment Man utd   get for their fans  invading the pitch and  then causing the  club not to  fulfill  a league fixture. If it was Town we know big fine and points deduction, for start of next season.

Exactly this ... protesting about their owners, yet singing "Oil Shitty fcuk off home" as they smashed a door down and broke in.

From the bloke in the pantomime zebra pants, the kid swinging on the goal post taking a selfie (Tartan Army style), to the guy chucking the Sky Sports Manfrotto tripod on the pitch ..... yeah that'll show em'  

Quoted from NorfolkImp

Exactly this ... protesting about their owners, yet singing "Oil Shitty fcuk off home" as they smashed a door down and broke in.

From the bloke in the pantomime zebra pants, the kid swinging on the goal post taking a selfie (Tartan Army style), to the guy chucking the Sky Sports Manfrotto tripod on the pitch ..... yeah that'll show em'  

Were did it say they "smashed a door down" to gain access?
Failure from the club & police to control probably around 1500 fans.
But your probably reading the report from the daily mail to be fair.

Maybe Nick Dale was in charge of security and forgot to close the gates again! 😆

Quoted from Chrisblor

21st Century Fox sold their stake in Sky to Comcast in 2018. Murdoch therefore no longer controls or has a stake in Sky and Sky Sports.

James Murdoch is a non-exec director of Sky 'Corporate'

Quoted from Stadium

Were did it say they "smashed a door down" to gain access?
Failure from the club & police to control probably around 1500 fans.
But your probably reading the report from the daily mail to be fair.

Sky's live reporting of the game suggested that security was very lax at several entrances and the fans just walked in.

Quoted from Stadium

Were did it say they "smashed a door down" to gain access?
Failure from the club & police to control probably around 1500 fans.
But your probably reading the report from the daily mail to be fair.

There is no mention of a door being "smashed down" in the Daily Mail. It says " it is believed that fans forced open a door, that is used as access for medical staff". However it is does mention two police officers being injured, one of whom was attacked with a bottle and suffered a significant slash wound to his face ". So much for" a peaceful protest ".

Yes, Grimsby would be penalised severely for similar offences.  We would generate less bad and widespread publicity as well.  

Man United (they dropped the FC years ago) will probably be given extra points.

Quoted from rancido

There is no mention of a door being "smashed down" in the Daily Mail. It says " it is believed that fans forced open a door, that is used as access for medical staff". However it is does mention two police officers being injured, one of whom was attacked with a bottle and suffered a significant slash wound to his face ". So much for" a peaceful protest ".

The daily mail,you do have to.laugh.
Obviously no one wants to see any person's injured.
They obviously didnt report the lad on the floor been punched by the police?

Quoted from BobbyCummingsTackle

Sky's live reporting of the game suggested that security was very lax at several entrances and the fans just walked in.

Yes this was widely reported.
What a surprise the media "invented" a story against football fans.

Premier League statement on yesterday’s events:

“Fans have many channels by which to make their views known, but the actions of a minority seen today have no justification”.

Do they?

Ticket prices, PL and FA do fûck all
Racism, PL and FA do fûck all
Exorbitant cost of watching football, PL and FA do fûck all
Agents leaching money from the game, PL and FA do fûck all
Failure of fit and proper test, PL and FA do fûck all
Football club owners introducing convicted fraudsters to clubs, PL and FA do fûck all
Big clubs hoarding footballers, PL and FA do fûck all
Qatar World Cup, PL and FA do fûck all
Geoff Broome fiddling with kids, PL and FA do fûck all

Quoted from Stadium

The daily mail,you do have to.laugh.
Obviously no one wants to see any person's injured.
They obviously didnt report the lad on the floor been punched by the police?

Wrong! They published a picture of a thirty something male (hardly a lad) on the floor with two police officers stood over him. But then you have to ask what led up to that situation. One wonders if you are one of those people who think that Joe Public can behave however they like towards the police but when the police try to do something in response then they are wrong. Obviously we view things differently as I am more concerned about a police officer being glassed for just doing his job, whereas you try to draw attention to somebody on the floor who is part of a violent protest, including illegal entry into a building.

The establishment and various no mark ‘experts’ all jumping in the ‘let’s have a go at the fans’ argument...

Souness can get to intercourse the self righteous girl private, the guy caused a riot many years ago or has he forgot that? All in the idea that it would score him points with the fans...

The simple fact is, naturally there’s the odd male private, that’s always likely to happen but it’s when they keep saying it was merely a 100😂😂😂absolute nonsense.

I’m not a Utd fan by any stretch but it’s impossible not to understand their frustrations. There were genuine Utd fans in there, not hooligans or folk looking for a scrap, people in there looking to take a stand against the urine poor ownership of their club.

They’ve argued; they being the no mark Sky folk that had Utd been top etc they wouldn’t have done it...nonsense. They’ve protested in various ways since the Glazers took over, even when winning titles. This was just a turning point and with the super league nonsense still hanging around it was the right time for them to make their mark.

Lax security or a fire door accidentally left open, ya know, like it was purely accidental the telegraph had a photographer outside BP on a random home game just as a fraudster was entering the ground?

Quoted from rancido

Wrong! They published a picture of a thirty something male (hardly a lad) on the floor with two police officers stood over him. But then you have to ask what led up to that situation. One wonders if you are one of those people who think that Joe Public can behave however they like towards the police but when the police try to do something in response then they are wrong. Obviously we view things differently as I am more concerned about a police officer being glassed for just doing his job, whereas you try to draw attention to somebody on the floor who is part of a violent protest, including illegal entry into a building.

Trying reading the post again.
Were did i state that person's can behave however they like again the police?
Nobody wants to see any injuries to anybody in a protest.
However there was also police aggression to protesters too which as per usual hasn't been reported.
Try researching a little better and there are several items around this.
One supporter pushed over & another punched on the ground by around six policemen.
By the way you won't find it in your favourite "newspaper'

Quoted from aldi_01

The establishment and various no mark ‘experts’ all jumping in the ‘let’s have a go at the fans’ argument...

Souness can get to intercourse the self righteous girl private, the guy caused a riot many years ago or has he forgot that? All in the idea that it would score him points with the fans...

The simple fact is, naturally there’s the odd male private, that’s always likely to happen but it’s when they keep saying it was merely a 100😂😂😂absolute nonsense.

I’m not a Utd fan by any stretch but it’s impossible not to understand their frustrations. There were genuine Utd fans in there, not hooligans or folk looking for a scrap, people in there looking to take a stand against the urine poor ownership of their club.

They’ve argued; they being the no mark Sky folk that had Utd been top etc they wouldn’t have done it...nonsense. They’ve protested in various ways since the Glazers took over, even when winning titles. This was just a turning point and with the super league nonsense still hanging around it was the right time for them to make their mark.

Lax security or a fire door accidentally left open, ya know, like it was purely accidental the telegraph had a photographer outside BP on a random home game just as a fraudster was entering the ground?

A fair summary.
Interesting change of stance from Sky two weeks.
Souness was an absolute embarrassment,didn't even know the timeline or details of the actual takeover.
Neville's silence on that said it all.

Quoted from Stadium

Were did it say they "smashed a door down" to gain access?
Failure from the club & police to control probably around 1500 fans.
But your probably reading the report from the daily mail to be fair.

One of the clowns filmed it on his phone and put it on Twitter ... the guy who threw the SS Tripod later on had a few attempts at the door and failed, but another succeeded and in they all went.

Quoted from NorfolkImp

One of the clowns filmed it on his phone and put it on Twitter ... the guy who threw the SS Tripod later on had a few attempts at the door and failed, but another succeeded and in they all went.

Thanks for the confirmation.
Please post the link.

Around 200 protesters were able to gain entry to the stadium through an entrance used by away fans, with unconfirmed suggestions the access route was left open, with no visible damage to the gate used by the fans.

Quoted from Stadium

Trying reading the post again.
Were did i state that person's can behave however they like again the police?
Nobody wants to see any injuries to anybody in a protest.
However there wad also police aggression to protesters too which as per usual hasn't been reported.
Try researching a little better and there are several items around this.
One supporter pushed over & another punched on the ground by around six policemen.
By the way you won't find it in your favourite "newspaper'

Did you find it in your favourite" newspaper "? Every reporting medium will put their own slant on this depending on their political bias. The fact remains that a true protest would have demonstrated outside the ground and no violence would be involved. But, as any intelligent person would realise, there is a moronic element, no matter how small, will use these situations just for a "rumble" especially when they have had a few sherberts.

Quoted from rancido

Did you find it in your favourite" newspaper "? Every reporting medium will put their own slant on this depending on their political bias. The fact remains that a true protest would have demonstrated outside the ground and no violence would be involved. But, as any intelligent person would realise, there is a moronic element, no matter how small, will use these situations just for a "rumble" especially when they have had a few sherberts.

And the vast majority did.
How many people were arrested?

Quoted from Stadium

Thanks for the confirmation.
Please post the link.

Around 200 protesters were able to gain entry to the stadium through an entrance used by away fans, with unconfirmed suggestions the access route was left open, with no visible damage to the gate used by the fans.

Apologies, I didn't save or copy the link .... but I'm sure its still out there, if you can be bothered to search for it.

Quoted from NorfolkImp

Apologies, I didn't save or copy the link .... but I'm sure its still out there, if you can be bothered to search for it.

How strange,you would have thought the media would be all over it?

It looks as if MUN-LIV will be rearranged to 15/16th, with the WBA-LIV match being moved to 12th to accommodate.

I still haven’t forgiven West Brom for stealing my first love in ‘94 but why should West Brom alter their preparations for these two ‘kin big six turds.

Quoted from rancido

There is no mention of a door being "smashed down" in the Daily Mail. It says " it is believed that fans forced open a door, that is used as access for medical staff". However it is does mention two police officers being injured, one of whom was attacked with a bottle and suffered a significant slash wound to his face ". So much for" a peaceful protest ".

I kind of feel for the police in situations like this  . Tough job in todays day and age. You need law and order as otherwise you get anarchy .Yes some police are better than others  but it must be hard when you get some so called "fan" admittedly minority  chucking a beer bottle at you. Any of us if we were doing the polices job would be wound up.

Quoted from Rick12

I kind of feel for the police in situations like this  . Tough job in todays day and age. You need law and order as otherwise you get anarchy .Yes some police are better than others  but it must be hard when you get some so called "fan" admittedly minority  chucking a beer bottle at you. Any of us if we were doing the polices job would be wound up.

At last - a common sense approach to what will always be a tricky situation ie protests.

I don’t trust the accounts from the police or the media in these situations. Both have a track record of lying about football fans and protesters. If any police got injured, it’s as likely to be as a result of being heavy handed with people as random acts of assault by protesters.

As for the claim that ‘peaceful protesters would have protested outside the ground’.......what an naive statement. Everyone with any common sense would know that that would have achieved nothing and they would have still been pilloried by the media and manhandled by the police.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

I don’t trust the accounts from the police or the media in these situations. Both have a track record of lying about football fans and protesters. If any police got injured, it’s as likely to be as a result of being heavy handed with people as random acts of assault by protesters.

As for the claim that ‘peaceful protesters would have protested outside the ground’.......what an naive statement. Everyone with any common sense would know that that would have achieved nothing and they would have still been pilloried by the media and manhandled by the police.

Good common sense post.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

As for the claim that ‘peaceful protesters would have protested outside the ground’.......what an naive statement. Everyone with any common sense would know that that would have achieved nothing and they would have still been pilloried by the media and manhandled by the police.

Not all police Kingston. I personally know some people in the police and also the army and some are brilliant people who would never abuse their power.

Quoted from Stadium

[/b]

Good common sense post.

... and it's the continued support of that kind of attitude that leads to confrontation and problems.

Quoted from NorfolkImp

One of the clowns filmed it on his phone and put it on Twitter ... the guy who threw the SS Tripod later on had a few attempts at the door and failed, but another succeeded and in they all went.

I saw that too, I get and agree with the protest bit, to a degree (though I don't personally agree) I also get the protesters trying to get in the ground. The bit that is beyond me is kicking in a door and then destroying property like camera kit that I would imagine doesn't belong to MUFC.

The other footage I saw on the news and Sky looked like there was a large proportion of spotty millennials who no doubt had been whipped into a frenzy by social media to jump on a bandwagon rather than dyed in the wool longstanding supporters who have had enough, I can't say that is a fact but that's what it appeared to be.

I'm not advocating what appeared on the face of it to be criminal activity but overall I'm behind their protest as despite the stupidity of some individuals as the Glaziers (and many other owners) see the game as a product rather than a sport.  

As usual, the debate is about the 1% of fans that go too far and not about the main issue. All footy fans are scumbags as far as the establishment are concerned.

Quoted from ginnywings

As usual, the debate is about the 1% of fans that go too far and not about the main issue. All footy fans are scumbags as far as the establishment are concerned.

Correct.

Quoted from ginnywings

As usual, the debate is about the 1% of fans that go too far and not about the main issue. All footy fans are scumbags as far as the establishment are concerned.

Agreed Ginnywings but the 1% get noticed and reported on. Also, as far as a large part of society is concerned, it's guilt by association plus "if you fly with crows then you expect to be shot at". This is not my personal view but it is an opinion held by many.

So all these fans protesting about their owners, but are they protesting because they don’t agree with the European Super League or because they don’t like their owners. Think you’ll find it’s mainly because they don’t like their owners, if you’d asked the majority at Old Trafford yesterday if they think Man U should receive less money each year so that the “ football family” could survive I think they would have said “ who are Grimsby Town” . What have Man U won in the last 8 seasons, not much whereas their noisy neighbours from across the city are winning Premierships and competing in Champions League semis.

Quoted from BobbyCummingsTackle

James Murdoch is a non-exec director of Sky 'Corporate'

I don't know what you mean by Sky 'Corporate' - the Murdoch family aren't involved at all with Sky any more. As I stated 21st Century Fox sold the company to Comcast and James Murdoch left the board at that time - https://news.sky.com/story/james-murdoch-quits-sky-as-comcast-takes-control-11522135

Anyway it's not like James Murdoch would be following any orders from his dad even if he was still involved with Sky (which he categorically isn't). They fell out last year and James left News Corp as a result - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53617966

Quoted from Rick12

I kind of feel for the police in situations like this  . Tough job in todays day and age. You need law and order as otherwise you get anarchy .Yes some police are better than others  but it must be hard when you get some so called "fan" admittedly minority  chucking a beer bottle at you. Any of us if we were doing the polices job would be wound up.

I still can’t believe he deference some of you hold towards this group of organised bullies.

https://mobile.twitter.com/oli_v3r/status/1388941842075590659

Quoted from ska face

I still can’t believe he deference some of you hold towards this group of organised bullies.

https://mobile.twitter.com/oli_v3r/status/1388941842075590659

Yes that policeman was a bit overzealous but you cant generalize. Not all of them act like that.

Quoted from ska face

I still can’t believe he deference some of you hold towards this group of organised bullies.

https://mobile.twitter.com/oli_v3r/status/1388941842075590659

So what's are you objecting to? The police per se, the police as they are structured, the people who the police recruit or the whole concept of a police force?

According to the Manchester Evening News, Man Utd had a fan base of over 1 billion worldwide, and another source says over 140 million social media followers. I think these sort of numbers put the few that entered the ground into insignificance as % of fans.

Herts said 'Glaziers (and many other owners) see the game as a product'. I would go further and say that to these people the game is not a product but a means of increasing their bank accounts regardless of what true fans want or think. All this type of owners wants is easy money and that is what football gives them.

They are not bothered about the debt of the club as long as it can be serviced (and not by them) and that they can continue to get their cut. Once problems start to occur with servicing the debt then these owners will bail out, selling to the highest bidder without a thought for the true fans, the club, or the survival of the club.

Glaziers and Co make Fenty look like an amateur in football terms, which of course he is.

As far as they are concerned $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ rule OK.

I always wonder why fans who cause a bit of trouble are unfailingly referred to as 'so called fans'. That police fella above isn't a 'so called policeman'.

If I go to 46 games a season and lob a plastic chair every now and again, I'm still a fan.




Disclaimer: I've never actually lobbed a plastic chair.

I hope they get the idiot that caused the facial injury to this policeman, he could have lost an eye.

[img]https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article24025892.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/0_SDC_MDG_-Police-face-slashed_20802JPG.jpg[/img]

Quoted from promotion plaice

I hope they get the idiot that caused the facial injury to this policeman, he could have lost an eye.

[img]https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article24025892.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/0_SDC_MDG_-Police-face-slashed_20802JPG.jpg[/img]

A bit worse than lobbing the occasional chair but correct, the guy is an idiot and should be locked up even if he is is a "true fan". Amazingly this was recorded by The Daily Mirror and not the Right Wing press.

Quoted from Abdul19

I always wonder why fans who cause a bit of trouble are unfailingly referred to as 'so called fans'. That police fella above isn't a 'so called policeman'.

If I go to 46 games a season and lob a plastic chair every now and again, I'm still a fan.




Disclaimer: I've never actually lobbed a plastic chair.

If you could have gone to our last 46 games and lobbed a plastic chair at Fenty you'd be called FANtastic!

Quoted from DB

If you could have gone to our last 46 games and lobbed a plastic chair at Fenty you'd be called FANtastic!

Day’s the chair man

Fenty’s the barstool

Quoted from rancido

So what's are you objecting to? The police per se, the police as they are structured, the people who the police recruit or the whole concept of a police force?

Well on this specific occasion it’s the officers dragging a member of public out of view so their colleague could punch him 7 or 8 times while he was held down. In general it’s the fact that they uphold, by force, an abstract social order predicated on wage labour and private property. Is that ok with you?

Quoted from Rick12

Yes that policeman was a bit overzealous but you cant generalize. Not all of them act like that.

‘Overzealous’ is a euphemism in this case for ‘violent, cowardly thuggery’. Repeatedly punching someone while he is held in the ground? Hardly self-defence or the use of necessary force is it?

Then they chase the cameraman away because they are trying to hide their crime. Disgusting behaviour.

I bet he doesn’t get disciplined. There’ll be some sort of lie put out as an excuse.

Quoted from ska face

Well on this specific occasion it’s the officers dragging a member of public out of view so their colleague could punch him 7 or 8 times while he was held down. In general it’s the fact that they uphold, by force, an abstract social order predicated on wage labour and private property. Is that ok with you?

Of course members of the public never attack solitary policemen without provocation or gang up on the police when they are trying to control violence? It's an answer which leads to another question. What kind of structure would you propose to keep order in a modern society? Would you protect yourself or your property as an individual without including some kind of police structure? If a member of your family was assaulted, robbed or raped would you sort it out yourself or use an "abstract" social order. Maybe vigilantes are your solution or kangaroo courts to mete out punishment/justice.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

‘Overzealous’ is a euphemism in this case for ‘violent, cowardly thuggery’. Repeatedly punching someone while he is held in the ground? Hardly self-defence or the use of necessary force is it?

Then they chase the cameraman away because they are trying to hide their crime. Disgusting behaviour.

I bet he doesn’t get disciplined. There’ll be some sort of lie put out as an excuse.

So what justification is there for somebody attacking a policeman with a bottle or was he defending himself against a horde of police officers just out to cause trouble.

Quoted from rancido

Of course members of the public never attack solitary policemen without provocation or gang up on the police when they are trying to control violence? It's an answer which leads to another question. What kind of structure would you propose to keep order in a modern society? Would you protect yourself or your property as an individual without including some kind of police structure? If a member of your family was assaulted, robbed or raped would you sort it out yourself or use an "abstract" social order. Maybe vigilantes are your solution or kangaroo courts to mete out punishment/justice.

You’ve just watched a video of a person being dragged off the street, held down and punches repeatedly, and you’re insinuating that it’s OTHER PEOPLE who may be the vigilantes meting out punishment? Incredible.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

‘Overzealous’ is a euphemism in this case for ‘violent, cowardly thuggery’. Repeatedly punching someone while he is held in the ground? Hardly self-defence or the use of necessary force is it?

Then they chase the cameraman away because they are trying to hide their crime. Disgusting behaviour.

I bet he doesn’t get disciplined. There’ll be some sort of lie put out as an excuse.

Police are lot more accountable than they once were which is right .In this case that policeman went over the top and hope he gets reprimanded to some degree and can change his ways .

You need to realize the pressures of the job though.Some police will slip by the wayside in terms of standards. Put yourself in the polices shoes for a year and you may have a better understanding of what they face. In the main dealing with lawbreakers and a lot of stress and confrontation not to mention the shift work. I always remember someone who I use to work with had a sister who said was a lovely person before joining the police. Once in the uniform the constant in his words "fighting " a majority of the time with lawbreakers changed her to a differing persona. She lost a lot of the niceness she once had.The job wore her down.

Quoted from ska face

Well on this specific occasion it’s the officers dragging a member of public out of view so their colleague could punch him 7 or 8 times while he was held down. In general it’s the fact that they uphold, by force, an abstract social order predicated on wage labour and private property. Is that ok with you?

Law and order has mostly always existed  though . Without it you need to realize what happens. Just to recap police went on strike in Canada in the late 1960s:

"As a young teenager in proudly peaceable Canada during the romantic 1960s, I was a true believer in Bakunin’s anarchism. I laughed off my parents’ argument that if the government ever laid down its arms all hell would break loose. Our competing predictions were put to the test at 8:00 a.m. on October 7, 1969, when the Montreal police went on strike. By 11:20 am, the first bank was robbed. By noon, most of the downtown stores were closed because of looting. Within a few more hours, taxi drivers burned down the garage of a limousine service that competed with them for airport customers, a rooftop sniper killed a provincial police officer, rioters broke into several hotels and restaurants, and a doctor slew a burglar in his suburban home. By the end of the day, six banks had been robbed, a hundred shops had been looted, twelve fires had been set, forty carloads of storefront glass had been broken, and three million dollars in property damage had been inflicted, before city authorities had to call in the army and, of course, the police to restore order. This decisive empirical test left my politics in tatters (and offered a foretaste of life as a scientist).”

Pinker, Steven (2003). The Blank Slate. Penguin Books. p. 285.

Quoted from ska face

You’ve just watched a video of a person being dragged off the street, held down and punches repeatedly, and you’re insinuating that it’s OTHER PEOPLE who may be the vigilantes meting out punishment? Incredible.

What is incredible is that you never answered my question - what do you propose as a means of policing society. I never insinuated that the OTHER PEOPLE may be vigilantes. I pointed out that without some structure of policing then vigilantiism would be the norm and is that what you would want.

[url]https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/man-utd-glazer-protests-liverpool-24025136[/url]

is this what people mean? sorry if I have the wrong incident but this was quite easy to find

Quoted from Stadium

How strange,you would have thought the media would be all over it?

https://twitter.com/durbs1976/status/1388911774917877761?s=21

Quoted from NorfolkImp

https://twitter.com/durbs1976/status/1388911774917877761?s=21

Thank you for that.
Can never condone criminal behaviour.

Quoted from rancido

So what justification is there for somebody attacking a policeman with a bottle or was he defending himself against a horde of police officers just out to cause trouble.

I’m not justifying anything. What I said was that that copper beating the person on the ground was a cowardly thug. Earlier I said that I don’t trust the police’s accounts in these situations. We’ve seen so many occasions over the years when they’ve lied, and bullied and beaten people.

You either believe in the rule of law or you don’t. Police are paid to uphold the law. Let them get away with criminal behaviour and the rule of law is gone.

Quoted from Rick12

Police are lot more accountable than they once were which is right .In this case that policeman went over the top and hope he gets reprimanded to some degree and can change his ways .

You need to realize the pressures of the job though.Some police will slip by the wayside in terms of standards. Put yourself in the polices shoes for a year and you may have a better understanding of what they face. In the main dealing with lawbreakers and a lot of stress and confrontation not to mention the shift work. I always remember someone who I use to work with had a sister who said was a lovely person before joining the police. Once in the uniform the constant in his words "fighting " a majority of the time with lawbreakers changed her to a differing persona. She lost a lot of the niceness she once had.The job wore her down.

Law and order has mostly always existed  though . Without it you need to realize what happens. Just to recap police went on strike in Canada in the late 1960s:

"As a young teenager in proudly peaceable Canada during the romantic 1960s, I was a true believer in Bakunin’s anarchism. I laughed off my parents’ argument that if the government ever laid down its arms all hell would break loose. Our competing predictions were put to the test at 8:00 a.m. on October 7, 1969, when the Montreal police went on strike. By 11:20 am, the first bank was robbed. By noon, most of the downtown stores were closed because of looting. Within a few more hours, taxi drivers burned down the garage of a limousine service that competed with them for airport customers, a rooftop sniper killed a provincial police officer, rioters broke into several hotels and restaurants, and a doctor slew a burglar in his suburban home. By the end of the day, six banks had been robbed, a hundred shops had been looted, twelve fires had been set, forty carloads of storefront glass had been broken, and three million dollars in property damage had been inflicted, before city authorities had to call in the army and, of course, the police to restore order. This decisive empirical test left my politics in tatters (and offered a foretaste of life as a scientist).”

Pinker, Steven (2003). The Blank Slate. Penguin Books. p. 285.

With respect what has that quote got to do with anything I said? I never said owt about doing without police. I just said I don’t trust them in these situations.

I’m sure it’s a stressful job at times, but some of them have got the wrong attitude fullstop. They can be unnecessarily provocative and escalate situations.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

I’m not justifying anything. What I said was that that copper beating the person on the ground was a cowardly thug. Earlier I said that I don’t trust the police’s accounts in these situations. We’ve seen so many occasions over the years when they’ve lied, and bullied and beaten people.

You either believe in the rule of law or you don’t. Police are paid to uphold the law. Let them get away with criminal behaviour and the rule of law is gone.

Don't worry it'll be fully investigated.
Oh hold on......

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-55251366