Wrexham spending again…..!!

They have now got a midfielder from Lincoln who played most games last season……
Division 1 to non league……proves it can be done!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58321179

Regardless, it doesn't matter how much they spend or how many players they sign, they can only play 11 players at once and even then, they have to play as a unit which doesn't always happen.

Quoted Text

"Stepping down to the National League was something I had to consider, "Jones said.

"But because of the ambition of the club, and the project, and the manager and chairmen's plans going forward it's an exciting prospect to be part of, trying to get into the Football League and beyond.

And here was cynical old me thinking it must have been all about the money…

Quoted from Epworth Mariner

They have now got a midfielder from Lincoln who played most games last season……
Division 1 to non league……proves it can be done!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58321179

It can be done with a ridiculous amount of money.  The problem with that is if / when these owners get bored, the club won’t have sustainable finances.  The 1878 approach may take longer but it is more likely to mean we still have a club in 20’years time.

Quoted from LondonMariner43

It can be done with a ridiculous amount of money.  The problem with that is if / when these owners get bored, the club won’t have sustainable finances.  The 1878 approach may take longer but it is more likely to mean we still have a club in 20’years time.

Wrexham are determined so they will just outbid anyone who tries to compete.

Just let them get on with it. There are a few teams chucking a lot of cash at it but only 2 teams will go up. Just throwing money at it doesn't guarantee success, they have to play together as a team.

3yr deal too...........hope it works out for them as well as our last 3yr deal.

I'd love to hear a player just come out and say "they offered me loads more money than I'm on". That'd be fair enough, most of us would do the same.

Fucking 'project', fuck off  

Quoted from Abdul19

I'd love to hear a player just come out and say "they offered me loads more money than I'm on". That'd be fair enough, most of us would do the same.

Fucking 'project', fuck off  

But that would go for our players too that say this lol

How much did Sutton spend to get promoted?

I honestly hope that Wrexham do get promoted ( unless they're playing us in the playoff final! ). They are a good club with a long proud history and a decent fan base who have been down in Division 5 for far too long. I recall that a few years ago they got over 90 points, finished 2nd and did not go up through the playoffs. That must have been hard to take for all concerned. If the rest of us are competing for the other spot then so be it. Hopefully Town will be better than the rest. Looking forward to Saturday. Up the Mariners!

There's only 1 position I would spend big on and that's a striker.

Time and time again we've seen average teams score loads of goals because of one quality striker.

Yes ita about the whole team, but a good striker makes the biggest impact in my opinion, especially in the non league when games tend to be a bit more scrappy

I'd happily spend big in a proven goal scorer

Wrexham have done exactly that .

Quoted from TonySmith

I honestly hope that Wrexham do get promoted ( unless they're playing us in the playoff final! ). They are a good club with a long proud history and a decent fan base who have been down in Division 5 for far too long. I recall that a few years ago they got over 90 points, finished 2nd and did not go up through the playoffs. That must have been hard to take for all concerned. If the rest of us are competing for the other spot then so be it. Hopefully Town will be better than the rest. Looking forward to Saturday. Up the Mariners!

Couldn't agree more.

Quoted from TonySmith

I honestly hope that Wrexham do get promoted ( unless they're playing us in the playoff final! ). They are a good club with a long proud history and a decent fan base who have been down in Division 5 for far too long. I recall that a few years ago they got over 90 points, finished 2nd and did not go up through the playoffs. That must have been hard to take for all concerned. If the rest of us are competing for the other spot then so be it. Hopefully Town will be better than the rest. Looking forward to Saturday. Up the Mariners!

Nope I don't. I hope they fail. Not because I dislike the club but because I'd rather a club staying within a sensible budget be rewarded with promotion.


[quote] But because of the ambition of the club, and the project, and the manager and chairmen's plans going forward it's an exciting prospect to be part of, trying to get into the Football League and beyond.[quote]
That's a long winded way of saying I was offered alot of money.

They’ve new owners, their new owners are famous. It’s a selling point and they’ve thrown cash at it. Will it work? Who knows?

The fans are embracing their new found interest and why not but if it doesn’t work or starts to derail a tad the gimmicks don’t save you.

My personal view is that the model to follow when wanting to get out of this cesspit we find ourselves in…again (you really are a waste of spunk John), is a hybrid of the Lincoln and Donnie model. The latter have had issues but their route out was a sensible way with root and branch development of the club. Lincoln very much the same.

Quoted from aldi_01

They’ve new owners, their new owners are famous. It’s a selling point and they’ve thrown cash at it. Will it work? Who knows?

The fans are embracing their new found interest and why not but if it doesn’t work or starts to derail a tad the gimmicks don’t save you.

My personal view is that the model to follow when wanting to get out of this cesspit we find ourselves in…again (you really are a waste of spunk John), is a hybrid of the Lincoln and Donnie model. The latter have had issues but their route out was a sensible way with root and branch development of the club. Lincoln very much the same.

I don't think Lincoln threw an awful lot of money at getting out. Cowley made wholesale changes and got them playing for one another but the cup run brought the city together and it was that money plus the additional gate receipts that enabled them to spend big the following season.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I don't think Lincoln threw an awful lot of money at getting out. Cowley made wholesale changes and got them playing for one another but the cup run brought the city together and it was that money plus the additional gate receipts that enabled them to spend big the following season.

That’s my point, they did it in a sustained way that got everyone interested, only once they found success did they invest more cash…with that came further outside investment…

Quoted from Abdul19

I'd love to hear a player just come out and say "they offered me loads more money than I'm on". That'd be fair enough, most of us would do the same.

Fucking 'project', fuck off  

I think Pereira said something along these lines when he left West Brom to go to the Middle East.

“How could you possibly drop from the top of end League 1 to the conference based on ‘the project’?”

“Let’s just say it moved me….TO A BIGGER HOUSE”

Quoted from aldi_01

That’s my point, they did it in a sustained way that got everyone interested, only once they found success did they invest more cash…with that came further outside investment…

I think the key bit is what a club does after promotion and that is where we went wrong. Summerfield and Berrett were downgrades on Clay and Nolan. Jackson and Tuton were downgrades on Amond but we were up there when Hurst left.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I think the key bit is what a club does after promotion and that is where we went wrong. Summerfield and Berrett were downgrades on Clay and Nolan. Jackson and Tuton were downgrades on Amond but we were up there when Hurst left.

Exactly this. If we had managed to keep the majority of that squad together and added in a few key areas I think we could of gone on to be up there again. The same way in which Bristol Rovers did after beating us in the final, didn't they have back-to-back promotions?

Quoted from aldi_01

That’s my point, they did it in a sustained way that got everyone interested, only once they found success did they invest more cash…with that came further outside investment…

Lincoln City losses:
17/18 - £1.09m
18/19 - £2.24m
19/20 - £889k

Is that really sustained? £4m losses in 3 years. There's also a £1m compensation for the Cowley's in there, which makes 19/20 look a lot better.

I'm not saying they're a badly run club, or one that I expect to end up in trouble any time soon. But their salary expenditure is 100% of income whilst things are the best they've been in decades. A slip in form, which may be happening this season, and things could get tight.

Quoted from pen penfras

Lincoln City losses:
17/18 - £1.09m
18/19 - £2.24m
19/20 - £889k

Is that really sustained? £4m losses in 3 years. There's also a £1m compensation for the Cowley's in there, which makes 19/20 look a lot better.

I'm not saying they're a badly run club, or one that I expect to end up in trouble any time soon. But their salary expenditure is 100% of income whilst things are the best they've been in decades. A slip in form, which may be happening this season, and things could get tight.

Quoted Text

Lincoln City Football Club release financial results for the year ended 31 May 2017.

The figures have been released and headline Figures include

Pre Tax Profit of £1.3m
FA Cup Commercial Revenue after Costs £2m
Historic debts Cleared
96% rise in expenditure
Turnover increased by over £3m

The 17/18 loss is explained by the 16/17 profit. I imagine they also took a financial hit when they built their new training facility.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I think the key bit is what a club does after promotion and that is where we went wrong. Summerfield and Berrett were downgrades on Clay and Nolan. Jackson and Tuton were downgrades on Amond but we were up there when Hurst left.

Two problems with that though.

Firstly, we limped over the line. We were poor for the second half of that season and the team looked nothing like capable of competing in a division above.

Secondly, several of our best players wanted to move for non financial reasons. Toto wanted to go because he wasn't happy. Nolan wanted to play at a higher level, and we couldn't compete with Chesterfield on money anyway, so he was definitely going. Tait wanted to move to Scotland. Arnold was deemed not good enough for L2, which happened again at Lincoln, so there's a consistent opinion on that one.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

The 17/18 loss is explained by the 16/17 profit. I imagine they also took a financial hit when they built their new training facility.

That's still £3m loss over 4 years and they have 100% of turnover on salary. That's not sustainable.

Quoted from pen penfras

Two problems with that though.

Firstly, we limped over the line. We were poor for the second half of that season and the team looked nothing like capable of competing in a division above.

Secondly, several of our best players wanted to move for non financial reasons. Toto wanted to go because he wasn't happy. Nolan wanted to play at a higher level, and we couldn't compete with Chesterfield on money anyway, so he was definitely going. Tait wanted to move to Scotland. Arnold was deemed not good enough for L2, which happened again at Lincoln, so there's a consistent opinion on that one.

I accept that players move on but some of the replacements were nowhere near the standard of those that left.

Hurst did make some good signings after promotion though, notably Danny Andrew but on the whole our first squad back in the league was weaker than a squad that many say limped over the line in the National League.

Quoted from pen penfras

That's still £3m loss over 4 years and they have 100% of turnover on salary. That's not sustainable.

Long-term you are right, that's not sustainable but they sustainably got out of this league.

It looks like Lincoln are now signing younger players rather than the likes of Bostwick, Frecklington and Shackell on big money at the tail end of their career. They may be paying those younger players well but if successful they should become a saleable asset. At that point, wages shouldn't be 100% of turnover.

Quoted from pen penfras

That's still £3m loss over 4 years and they have 100% of turnover on salary. That's not sustainable.

Made a loss for their last year (up to June 2020) of £889,000 and a loss in 2019 of £2.24m. Now have a loss being carried forward of £7.99m which is propped up by their share capital of £7.1m. Wage bill is over £4m per year so getting less sustainable by the year.

Lincoln's model is now one of signing players to make a profit and that will take a little while to bear fruit. We have just sold Grant to Peterborough, but have turned down large bids for Edun Tayo from Peterborough and Luton - Peterborough said we had priced them out of the move.. The lad we have just signed from Spurs will make money too when we eventually sell and that is what we will do - But that does cost - I hear we are paying him 400k a year.- Appleton has already said we will lose players this year it is just the model we use now, and where we realise we are - We can then do that to lower league clubs - This does allow us to buy players though and we are have bid 200k for a player from Scotland and have bid for a striker from Bristol Rovers.

Whilst we have lost money - We are a well established League 1 club, and have great training facilities and our pitch has been completed redone this year at a huge cost - upwards of 500k. The Stacey West is having an extra tier added - Hence the temporary stand whilst the roof is taken off - Plus there have been huge renovations to the changing rooms, seats and the installation of digital Advertsing around the pitch.

I know Pen Penfras would like to revel at us making a loss but the reality is we are moving in the right direction - We have also just had a huge investment from an American consrtium led by Landon Donavan - I am fairly certain we are in the right hands - Though this year will be tough we will not get relegated - Unfortuantely losing 3 loanees has hurt but we have 2 bids in, so I am sure will be okay.

Quoted from nealeardleyscrossing

Lincoln's model is now one of signing players to make a profit and that will take a little while to bear fruit. We have just sold Grant to Peterborough, but have turned down large bids for Edun Tayo from Peterborough and Luton - Peterborough said we had priced them out of the move.. The lad we have just signed from Spurs will make money too when we eventually sell and that is what we will do - But that does cost - I hear we are paying him 400k a year.- Appleton has already said we will lose players this year it is just the model we use now, and where we realise we are - We can then do that to lower league clubs - This does allow us to buy players though and we are have bid 200k for a player from Scotland and have bid for a striker from Bristol Rovers.

Whilst we have lost money - We are a well established League 1 club, and have great training facilities and our pitch has been completed redone this year at a huge cost - upwards of 500k. The Stacey West is having an extra tier added - Hence the temporary stand whilst the roof is taken off - Plus there have been huge renovations to the changing rooms, seats and the installation of digital Advertsing around the pitch.

I know Pen Penfras would like to revel at us making a loss but the reality is we are moving in the right direction - We have also just had a huge investment from an American consrtium led by Landon Donavan - I am fairly certain we are in the right hands - Though this year will be tough we will not get relegated - Unfortuantely losing 3 loanees has hurt but we have 2 bids in, so I am sure will be okay.

Ignore Pen, he’s still coming to terms with his mate being exposed as a mahusive girl private that ruined a club.

I’ve friends who are Lincoln through and through so talk to them about it. Looking at numbers means intercourse all in truth…just look at us…technically turned a profit, at what cost.

Lincoln’s is a long term plan and that will initially mean losses but longer term you’d imagine it’ll stabilise and be profitable. You’ve also had a flurry of new investors…people don’t do that on a whim.

Each club needs its own model but taking ideas from others makes total sense…

Also one thing Lincoln did do with all of the fa cup cash was build a brand new training ground which cost 1.3 million...which obviously helped with the progression

Quoted from Gilbertswand

Also one thing Lincoln did do with all of the fa cup cash was build a brand new training ground which cost 1.3 million...which obviously helped with the progression

Arguably the best thing they did…

Quoted from nealeardleyscrossing

Lincoln's model is now one of signing players to make a profit and that will take a little while to bear fruit. We have just sold Grant to Peterborough, but have turned down large bids for Edun Tayo from Peterborough and Luton - Peterborough said we had priced them out of the move.. The lad we have just signed from Spurs will make money too when we eventually sell and that is what we will do - But that does cost - I hear we are paying him 400k a year.- Appleton has already said we will lose players this year it is just the model we use now, and where we realise we are - We can then do that to lower league clubs - This does allow us to buy players though and we are have bid 200k for a player from Scotland and have bid for a striker from Bristol Rovers.

Whilst we have lost money - We are a well established League 1 club, and have great training facilities and our pitch has been completed redone this year at a huge cost - upwards of 500k. The Stacey West is having an extra tier added - Hence the temporary stand whilst the roof is taken off - Plus there have been huge renovations to the changing rooms, seats and the installation of digital Advertsing around the pitch.

I know Pen Penfras would like to revel at us making a loss but the reality is we are moving in the right direction - We have also just had a huge investment from an American consrtium led by Landon Donavan - I am fairly certain we are in the right hands - Though this year will be tough we will not get relegated - Unfortuantely losing 3 loanees has hurt but we have 2 bids in, so I am sure will be okay.

the stacey west still the away end? is the additional tier for home or away?

i bear no malice towards lincoln, they did what we failed to do

Quoted from Hagrid

the stacey west still the away end? is the additional tier for home or away?

i bear no malice towards lincoln, they did what we failed to do

I am not sure to be honest - They have put a temporary stand next to it (Like a bus stop) - I belive they are taking the top off and then extending it - will take capacity to about 13ish I think.

https://www.weareimps.com/news/2020/february/200214-agreedplanning/

Quoted from nealeardleyscrossing

Lincoln's model is now one of signing players to make a profit and that will take a little while to bear fruit. We have just sold Grant to Peterborough, but have turned down large bids for Edun Tayo from Peterborough and Luton - Peterborough said we had priced them out of the move.. The lad we have just signed from Spurs will make money too when we eventually sell and that is what we will do - But that does cost - I hear we are paying him 400k a year.- Appleton has already said we will lose players this year it is just the model we use now, and where we realise we are - We can then do that to lower league clubs - This does allow us to buy players though and we are have bid 200k for a player from Scotland and have bid for a striker from Bristol Rovers.

Whilst we have lost money -[/b] We are a well established League 1 club, [b]and have great training facilities and our pitch has been completed redone this year at a huge cost - upwards of 500k. The Stacey West is having an extra tier added - Hence the temporary stand whilst the roof is taken off - Plus there have been huge renovations to the changing rooms, seats and the installation of digital Advertsing around the pitch.

I know Pen Penfras would like to revel at us making a loss but the reality is we are moving in the right direction - We have also just had a huge investment from an American consrtium led by Landon Donavan - I am fairly certain we are in the right hands - Though this year will be tough we will not get relegated - Unfortuantely losing 3 loanees has hurt but we have 2 bids in, so I am sure will be okay.

Well established league 1 club is pushing a bit

Wrexham have just had a £120.000 bid for cheltenhams ben tozer turned down according to the gloucetershire  press  on twitter

Quoted from meggietown

Wrexham have just had a £120.000 bid for cheltenhams ben tozer turned down according to the gloucetershire  press  on twitter

They’ve now got him. £180,000 rumoured price.

Quoted from Civvy at last

They’ve now got him. £180,000 rumoured price.

Yeah I heard £200,000. Plus a 3-year deal which I'm guessing at £3,000 to tempt him away from League One?
£150,000 per annum for next 3 years £450,000 plus £200,000 fee for a National League player... WOW.

Quoted from GtfcGarner

Yeah I heard £200,000. Plus a 3-year deal which I'm guessing at £3,000 to tempt him away from League One?
£150,000 per annum for next 3 years £450,000 plus £200,000 fee for a National League player... WOW.

Just need to let them get on with it. Parkinson doesn't have the greatest reputation and he's got the very difficult job of keeping these players happy. Assuming they want to play games that is.

What you have to remember with Wrexham is they’re owned by a couple of blokes with absolutely no idea about football, they’ve given the keys to Shaun Harvey and his mates who have run not only football clubs into the ground previously, but our entire football pyramid.

I like Wrexham, I hope for their fans they get some level of success but I’m extremely concerned for them, it has all the hallmarks of disaster.

male masturbators. i also Like wrexham, but the spending is going to make them extremely disliked

The old sayings of a Deck of Cards and House Built on Sand come to mind. I'm not envious or jealous and hope it works out for them, especially the fans.

All I can see is 2 very wealthy owners, with no football knowledge, having an open cheque book. Americans have a reputation for moving on if something doesn't work for them (Afghanistan at the moment comes to mind). So all I can ultimately see are the cards falling down and the sand washed away.

As for the fans, they'll be left with the mess of bad owners to sort out, and we all know that experience. I hope for the sake of the fans I am wrong.

Thing is that Reynolds is wealthy enough that he can afford to lose several million quid without blinking an eye, so I tend to doubt he'll be trying to screw the club over or leave them in the lurch if they don't win promotion immediately. Having a Sugar Daddy owner isn't an ideal way of doing things, but it does work if they are wealthy enough and persistent enough to keep on chucking money away if things don't work out well at the start. See FGR and various others for examples.

They have sold over 5000 season tickets though don't forget so a good chunk of the money they are spending could well be coming from that.

Paying 200k for a 31 year old centre back is crackers. As is committing  to a 3 year deal on league 1 money.

I think the financial backing from sponsors (TikTok). Season ticket sales and the documentary have helped them in alot of regards to getting these players. However the best team on paper doesn't guarantee success, I don't really rate Parkinson as a manager either.

For the sort of squad you need to win this league you have to look down A46 - they've won it twice (Only team to win it twice?). Be the fittest, play pressure cooker football, wind up the opposition, play the ref well and feed off mistakes, which are inevitable at this level. Getting a par in the head to heads against the other top teams can be good enough if you get the best points return against the bottom-half teams.

Quoted from Les Brechin

They have sold over 5000 season tickets though don't forget so a good chunk of the money they are spending could well be coming from that.

5000 at say £300 ave is £1.5m.

Mullin alone on 9k a week, so that’s nearly £470k just on his wages.

The league’s absolutely copulated this year. Was reading how Chesterfield are financing their spending yesterday, apparently they’ve an insurance policy which covers them for any loss of income because of Covid, and they won a high court battle forcing them to pay out.

So basically their insurance covers all their lost attendances last year, lost sponsorship and commercial revenue, then they furloughed their squad on top of that.

Quoted from ska face

5000 at say £300 ave is £1.5m.

Mullin alone on 9k a week, so that’s nearly £470k just on his wages.

The league’s absolutely copulated this year. Was reading how Chesterfield are financing their spending yesterday, apparently they’ve an insurance policy which covers them for any loss of income because of Covid, and they won a high court battle forcing them to pay out.

So basically their insurance covers all their lost attendances last year, lost sponsorship and commercial revenue, then they furloughed their squad on top of that.

Was that the article on the Derbyshre Times website? Read that too. It's absolutely crackers. Chesterfield are the ones I think are in the most trouble if they don't achieve promotion. Stockport's and Notts' spending appears to be accounted for (not sustainable, don't get me wrong) in some way, as does Wrexham's in an entirely less conventional way. Get the feeling that Chesterfield are looking at a 2 year shit or bust strategy though.

Was also interesting that Hurst alluded to smaller clubs in the division operating on bigger budgets than you'd imagine. Couple of clubs like Barnet, Alty and Dagneham seem to have made some decent signings that surprised me.

We're obviously gonna be operating on a loss this season, but it won't be anywhere near what some teams will be. I think we're playing it right, bide our time with a competitive yet not ludicrous budget and see which of these big spenders tank because I'd bet good money on one of them flopping. Non-league players on stupid money will look like an incredibly poor gamble once you lose 1-0 at home to Maidenhead in a one legged playoff match.

Who knows how Wrexham will get on this season but taking players down a couple of leagues but still paying them a good wage is risky.  If you've been used to playing in league 1 and could still play at that level and someone offers you more money to go down a couple of leagues, what's your motivation particularly if you are already in your 30s and sign a 2-3 year contract.  You go from playing the likes of Sheff Weds, Pompey etc to away days at Weymouth and Dover, getting kicked around on crappy pitches and getting changed in crappy facilities etc.  If everything goes great, the momentum will be great but if results go the wrong way, are these players really going to bust a gut to fight for Wrexham, or just happy to take their six figure salaries and go through the motions?

At the end of the day, 1 team will get automatic promotion and Sutton did not spend big. I think investing in a tissue company will reap dividends.

Hope wrexham do well good club having a good go , bit jealous but good luck

Quoted from DB

At the end of the day, 1 team will get automatic promotion and Sutton did not spend big. I think investing in a tissue company will reap dividends.

It’s not to be sniffed at

Quoted from DB

. I think investing in a tissue company will reap dividends.

Shouldn’t this be on the Jizz thread ?? 😉

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I don't think Lincoln threw an awful lot of money at getting out. Cowley made wholesale changes and got them playing for one another but the cup run brought the city together and it was that money plus the additional gate receipts that enabled them to spend big the following season.

They did Chuck substantial money at it, but they did the same to their infrastructure and that’s what will make things sustainable.

Quoted from Limerick Mariner

For the sort of squad you need to win this league you have to look down A46 - they've won it twice (Only team to win it twice?). Be the fittest, play pressure cooker football, wind up the opposition, play the ref well and feed off mistakes, which are inevitable at this level. Getting a par in the head to heads against the other top teams can be good enough if you get the best points return against the bottom-half teams.

The best post for ages well said sir

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

They did Chuck substantial money at it, but they did the same to their infrastructure and that’s what will make things sustainable.

Lincoln did chunk money to get out, would chat to Bradley Woods on the school run, he said that Lincoln had gambled on 2 years to get out.
All the players had to be living close to Lincoln, even Bradley who was living in Cleethorpes, moved to Lincoln, with Lincoln picking the cost.
So may have not spent big on the pitch, overall off the pitch they were incurring extra costs.
Luckily that same season they had that amazing in the FA cup, which bought in extra revenue.

Had they had not that amazing cup run and not got promoted, things would have been different, but the gamble played off.
They followed it up with promotion to League 1, spending money.
However this season they have cut their cloth investing in younger inexperienced players.
You cannot keep spending, look at what happened at Scunthorpe.

Scunthorpe were splashing the cash with Swan at the helm, brief spell in the Championship, established in League 1 for a few years, Mrs Swan cut the purse strings, now look at Scunthorpe.

Wrexham are doing the same spending big, its a gamble.

I would much prefer will follow the Peterboro or Brentford model as a way forward for GTFC