Are 1878 Any Good

Quoted from Simon

Impressed off the pitch with the infrastructure improvements and new personnel in and around the building but on the pitch are we any better really, i don't think so. Queue the well this time last year comments, yes i appreciate we pulled off the impossible in bouncing back at the first attempt and on the three playoff games no one can say we didn't deserve to go up BUT lets not lose sight of the fact we finished 17pts behind Stockport in 6th place and so far this season we have been average at best

I've seen a few of the 'on the pitch' arguments. Pre-November I don't believe that was as valid an argument, we were doing rather well but this recent run of league results has changed that picture a little bit. I don't think there's a fan out there who wouldn't love us to be playing Man City style football week in and bossing the league, but realism has to come into it somewhere when the bigger picture is considered.

Few predicted we'd come back up first time of asking and we did so the hard way, which suggests to me we did it through grit, guts and determination - the hallmarks of a PH squad - rather than style and unrivalled quality in the league. We've improved the squad over the summer and in a lot of games our performance hasn't been poor, just that final product and is not really a discussion that needs to be had in terms of what we hope to see in January.

My point though is whether it's better to have the playing side in advance of the 'behind the scenes' or the other way around. I'm sure people will have a multitude of views but for me, if you were running a marathon and sprinted the first mile how will you cope with the final 25? Might seem a daft analogy and probably is really but we've seen clubs like Burton, Plymouth, Scunthorpe, Yeovil, Doncaster, Colchester hit the Championship and then come crashing back down to L2 and below in relatively swift fashion. I accept the size of the Clubs doesn't lend itself to a sustained period at that level, but does the 'behind the scenes' impact on the inability to maintain consistency at the high end of L1?

Do we have the training facilities that afford the manager the ability to conduct his job in every way he deems necessary. Do we have the medical facility and knowledge to keep players fitter for longer with quicker recovery times? Do we have the scouting networks/systems to keep identifying players that provide quality? Do we have the analysis that enables the management team to spot trends in players to catch injury/fatigue early and make decisions to gain micro-advantages? Do we have administrative staff that can generate the commercial activity to keep us constantly improving our reach and investment desirability?

If we had a meteoric rise and these things aren't in place then eventually the star would burn out and the fall can be just as dramatic as the rise when things start going wrong as we ourselves know. There is a balance to be met, we do need a team that fans will continue to get behind and make visiting BP worthwhile but I genuinely think we need to be patient and try to build success on and off the pitch at a similar rate rather than chasing shortcuts that risk being short-lived.

My worry is that those who keep citing the perceived lack of improvement on the pitch are the ones who will begin the wave of negativity that historically always engulfs and takes hold of us, losing sight of the fact we have owners who want to be successful but know their financial limits, know the need to have everything in balance and ultimately know it will take time.

For me, I think the last 6 games have only proven that this is a tough league and that it isn't going to be easy. I predicted us to just in or around the play-offs and I'm wondering if I've been too ambitious but we bounced back after an awful run last season so I refuse to rule anything out with us. What I do believe is that any success we have won't be short lived under 1878, whenever that might happen. Hopefully we keep those gates high and help get all the ducks in a row to help moving us forward on and off the pitch over the next 5 years.

Quoted from gtfc_chris

I've seen a few of the 'on the pitch' arguments. Pre-November I don't believe that was as valid an argument, we were doing rather well but this recent run of league results has changed that picture a little bit. I don't think there's a fan out there who wouldn't love us to be playing Man City style football week in and bossing the league, but realism has to come into it somewhere when the bigger picture is considered.

Few predicted we'd come back up first time of asking and we did so the hard way, which suggests to me we did it through grit, guts and determination - the hallmarks of a PH squad - rather than style and unrivalled quality in the league. We've improved the squad over the summer and in a lot of games our performance hasn't been poor, just that final product and is not really a discussion that needs to be had in terms of what we hope to see in January.

My point though is whether it's better to have the playing side in advance of the 'behind the scenes' or the other way around. I'm sure people will have a multitude of views but for me, if you were running a marathon and sprinted the first mile how will you cope with the final 25? Might seem a daft analogy and probably is really but we've seen clubs like Burton, Plymouth, Scunthorpe, Yeovil, Doncaster, Colchester hit the Championship and then come crashing back down to L2 and below in relatively swift fashion. I accept the size of the Clubs doesn't lend itself to a sustained period at that level, but does the 'behind the scenes' impact on the inability to maintain consistency at the high end of L1?

Do we have the training facilities that afford the manager the ability to conduct his job in every way he deems necessary. Do we have the medical facility and knowledge to keep players fitter for longer with quicker recovery times? Do we have the scouting networks/systems to keep identifying players that provide quality? Do we have the analysis that enables the management team to spot trends in players to catch injury/fatigue early and make decisions to gain micro-advantages? Do we have administrative staff that can generate the commercial activity to keep us constantly improving our reach and investment desirability?

If we had a meteoric rise and these things aren't in place then eventually the star would burn out and the fall can be just as dramatic as the rise when things start going wrong as we ourselves know. There is a balance to be met, we do need a team that fans will continue to get behind and make visiting BP worthwhile but I genuinely think we need to be patient and try to build success on and off the pitch at a similar rate rather than chasing shortcuts that risk being short-lived.

My worry is that those who keep citing the perceived lack of improvement on the pitch are the ones who will begin the wave of negativity that historically always engulfs and takes hold of us, losing sight of the fact we have owners who want to be successful but know their financial limits, know the need to have everything in balance and ultimately know it will take time.

For me, I think the last 6 games have only proven that this is a tough league and that it isn't going to be easy. I predicted us to just in or around the play-offs and I'm wondering if I've been too ambitious but we bounced back after an awful run last season so I refuse to rule anything out with us. What I do believe is that any success we have won't be short lived under 1878, whenever that might happen. Hopefully we keep those gates high and help get all the ducks in a row to help moving us forward on and off the pitch over the next 5 years.

I don’t disagree with a lot of that but people look at stats like one home league win all season, no league win since mid October etc.

Regards the squad, I beg to differ. Our striking options are fewer and weaker and we are massively missing Ben Fox. We were by no means a one man team last season but I very much doubt we would have got to League Two without him.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

On the training ground, they've acknowledged it's a problem and are working on a new one; it's just taking longer than some people hoped for it to progress.

On the ground, Jason keeps saying we aren't selling out when you can't buy tickets together meaning I have minimal chance of taking my kids.

The economic situation would undoubtedly hamper ground development but I'd like them to at least admit we need to find a way of accommodating more fans. I'm not expecting to load This is Grimsby and see Jason and Andrew stood on Freeman Street with a spade, we've had similar and got nowhere.

I thought it was an open secret they were interested in Barretts Rec for a training ground.  Don't the council own that?

Stockwood and Pettit were not living in a cave prior to taking over.  They must know BP is an embarrassment compared to modern post-Taylor stadia.  They should realise there are not likely to be sell-outs for every home game because the facilities are so poor.

Have they spoken to the Freemen and LHP?  If a Freemo stadium is just a dream with no funding, then Grimsby West is an obvious enabling development.

Quoted from White_shorts

I thought it was an open secret they were interested in Barretts Rec for a training ground.  Don't the council own that?

Stockwood and Pettit were not living in a cave prior to taking over.  They must know BP is an embarrassment compared to modern post-Taylor stadia.  They should realise there are not likely to be sell-outs for every home game because the facilities are so poor.

Have they spoken to the Freemen and LHP?  If a Freemo stadium is just a dream with no funding, then Grimsby West is an obvious enabling development.

Not a justification but BP is no more an embarrassment than pretty much 50% of grounds across the 4/5 main divisions…

Quoted from White_shorts

I thought it was an open secret they were interested in Barretts Rec for a training ground.  Don't the council own that?

Stockwood and Pettit were not living in a cave prior to taking over.  They must know BP is an embarrassment compared to modern post-Taylor stadia.  They should realise there are not likely to be sell-outs for every home game because the facilities are so poor.

Have they spoken to the Freemen and LHP?  If a Freemo stadium is just a dream with no funding, then Grimsby West is an obvious enabling development.

My understanding is that it won't be Barratts, so not really the open secret you say it is.

1878 Has stated that they want the new training ground to be in Grimsby, which has certainly limited their choices. Barretts appears to be the unconfirmed location but we were told some weeks ago that there is a problem with the owners of the preferred choice location. If it is Barretts then NELC is the owner as far as I know, so what is the problem?

There has been no plans submitted so it's not the design, nor access or the neighbours. The land has/is used for sports use so it's not a change of use. 1878 presumably want to own the land so I wondered if their is a covenant in the deeds that states the land cannot be sold to private ownership?

Whilst I can fully understand why 1878 do want openly discuss this I sincerely hope they have plan B.

Stop assuming it's Barratts would answer some of your questions.

Quoted from ginnywings

Stop assuming it's Barratts would answer some of your questions.

I believe the assumption of Barratts came from a RH interview , Matt Dean I think, with 1878 ( can't remember which one) and Barretts was suggested. It was not denied as the location, which led to more speculation that it is the preferred site.

As you mentioned you didn't believe it was Barratts, where do you believe it might be?

What about Hardys Rec although I wouldn’t propose it as the road is awful due to lorries.

Are 1878 Any Good

We still have a League Club.
Would we still have a club under the last bloke- imo no.

The plan seems to be steady away and that will do for me so yes 1878 is good for GTFC, the Town and its fans.