Foreign players

Quoted from Wedidntdidwe

lets not forget we,ve since had Covid and War in Ukraine also causing price increases. A ship that blocked Suez didn't help either.

The rest of Europe hasn't had Covid, Ukraine or the Suez Canal blockage to contend with then I take it?

Ah go on then, here's some direct quotes from BBC news - let the red crosses commence!

Looking at a range of food and drink, he says UK prices are typically 7% below the EU average - with bread, meat and fish in particular relatively cheap. He says the UK's competitive supermarket sector plays a role in keeping prices down.

By contrast, he says that prior to 2015, on average groceries were more expensive in the UK than in the EU - partly reflecting the relatively small influence of the lower cost retailers such as Aldi and Lidl at that point.  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65632019

The graph above shows the overall difference in price for the 23 products we looked at added together. Germany is the cheapest, £20 less than France which is way out in front. Our shop is third cheapest in this league table, fairly similar, in fact, with Italy, Spain and the Netherlands.

Andrew Opie from the British Retail Consortium (BRC) said: "This research confirms UK consumers benefit from a highly competitive market, delivering some of the cheapest groceries in Europe.

"We believe it underestimates the savings British consumers are making when buying staple food items, including fresh produce, as well as the value consumers can find by shopping around, another benefit of the strong competition in the UK market."

Food price inflation, the rate at which prices are changing, is affecting every European country.

Mr Roy said in recent weeks inflation had been easing in Germany, the Netherlands and Spain, where prices rose earlier than the UK. He expects the UK will follow suit over the next few months.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65833619

France is more expensive, not my words but the words of top gear magazine

Rancido, I used the word deluded advisedly. I think your beliefs about leaving the EU (and not wanting to join in the first place) don't make sense. We're a small island with few natural resources worth anything any longer. We've not been a major manufacturer of anything other than weapons for many decades now after Thatcherism saw most major industry closed down and sold off.

Any strength in our economy was from the services sector (including financial services, however distasteful some of their behaviour may be) and Brexit has removed easy access to our biggest market. As the rest of the economy weakens, the services sector will inevitably weaken further. You can't sell a service to somebody who doesn't have a job which can keep them off the breadline.

Voting to leave the EU was a vote to make the country poorer. Joining the EU was a choice which made us wealthier.

Your lack of pragmatism or care about what happens to the economy following Brexit is what leads me to think you are deluded. Enjoy your holiday, by the way!

Pen Penfras is incorrect in saying that it will be particularly difficult to tell whether Brexit or other reasons have the negative impacts on the economy. We'll be able to see the Brexit impacts as our economy declines in relation to other EU members. They are affected by global issues in the same way we are so divergence will mostly be due to access to the single market (and government policy, of course).

Unfortunately, Pen is himself deluded if he really thinks we're going to get better trade deals than the EU. Trade deals are agreed depending on economic power and we're like a bit dropped off the EU (because we are). We might be able to agree deals which are a tiny bit better in minor areas with smaller countries, but it will dwarf what we lose out on through single market membership.

Quoted from Heisenberg

There are some on here who will slag you off, but honestly I wish I could have written that so well, because it’s exactly how I feel.

I agree.

'France is more expensive, not my words but the words of top gear magazine'

Ah yes, whenever I'm looking for reliable, unbiased deep analysis of the current European economic system I reach for Top Gear magazine.

Quoted from rancido

In 1984 Britain was 95% self sufficient in indigenous foods. Changing food tastes mean we import more of the types of food that we cannot grow competitively compared to the warmer southern EU countries.

Can't wait to eat nothing but turnips in the winter.

Quoted from Maringer

Rancido, I used the word deluded advisedly. I think your beliefs about leaving the EU (and not wanting to join in the first place) don't make sense. We're a small island with few natural resources worth anything any longer. We've not been a major manufacturer of anything other than weapons for many decades now after Thatcherism saw most major industry closed down and sold off.

Any strength in our economy was from the services sector (including financial services, however distasteful some of their behaviour may be) and Brexit has removed easy access to our biggest market. As the rest of the economy weakens, the services sector will inevitably weaken further. You can't sell a service to somebody who doesn't have a job which can keep them off the breadline.

Voting to leave the EU was a vote to make the country poorer. Joining the EU was a choice which made us wealthier.

Your lack of pragmatism or care about what happens to the economy following Brexit is what leads me to think you are deluded. Enjoy your holiday, by the way!

Pen Penfras is incorrect in saying that it will be particularly difficult to tell whether Brexit or other reasons have the negative impacts on the economy. We'll be able to see the Brexit impacts as our economy declines in relation to other EU members. They are affected by global issues in the same way we are so divergence will mostly be due to access to the single market (and government policy, of course).

Unfortunately, Pen is himself deluded if he really thinks we're going to get better trade deals than the EU. Trade deals are agreed depending on economic power and we're like a bit dropped off the EU (because we are). We might be able to agree deals which are a tiny bit better in minor areas with smaller countries, but it will dwarf what we lose out on through single market membership.

Last word from me on this subject. Iceland is a very small island country and does not want to join the EU. Norway is a small country and not part of the EU. If it would benefit these two small countries by joining the EU then why haven't they? Maybe these countries are run and populated by deluded fools or maybe they want to control their own destiny without the diktats of a non-accountable organisation.

Norway, a sparsely-populated country with vast fossil fuel wealth which the Norwegian government has invested into one of the world's largest sovereign wealth funds.

Iceland, a tiny nation whose geography means it is at the centre of vast fishing grounds which it exploits effectively. If they joined the EU, they would have to share their fishing grounds.

In comparison, we are a small, extremely-densely populated country with no natural resources to exploit (no wealth fund set up by Thatcher for the North Sea oil and gas).

Notable that Norway and Iceland are part of the Schengen zone so they have freedom of movement in the EU. They also pay to have access to the single market as members of the EEA! You probably couldn't have picked two worse examples to explain your aversion to the EU. They quite literally have almost all of the benefits of EU membership!

I'd be delighted if we could be members of the EEA and still have access to the single market. During the run up to the referendum, many of the Brexiteers even insinuated this is what we would have. Probably not feasible, unfortunately, because our economy is probably big enough that we wouldn't be admitted to the EEA and the xenophobes hate freedknof movement with a passion even though we obvious need and benefit from it.

Quoted from Maringer

Norway, a sparsely-populated country with vast fossil fuel wealth which the Norwegian government has invested into one of the world's largest sovereign wealth funds.

Iceland, a tiny nation whose geography means it is at the centre of vast fishing grounds which it exploits effectively. If they joined the EU, they would have to share their fishing grounds.

In comparison, we are a small, extremely-densely populated country with no natural resources to exploit (no wealth fund set up by Thatcher for the North Sea oil and gas).

Notable that Norway and Iceland are part of the Schengen zone so they have freedom of movement in the EU. They also pay to have access to the single market as members of the EEA! You probably couldn't have picked two worse examples to explain your aversion to the EU. They quite literally have almost all of the benefits of EU membership!

I'd be delighted if we could be members of the EEA and still have access to the single market. During the run up to the referendum, many of the Brexiteers even insinuated this is what we would have. Probably not feasible, unfortunately, because our economy is probably big enough that we wouldn't be admitted to the EEA and the xenophobes hate freedknof movement with a passion even though we obvious need and benefit from it.

As someone who voted to leave I firmly believed we would end up with a Norway style model and could reinstate our exclusive fishing zone. The deal sold the fishing industry down the river and leaving the single market was economic madness.
I would vote to rejoin if their was another referendum but cannot see that happening in the foreseeable.
I am writing this from my home in Greece which I never expected at the time of the referendum either, leaving the single market has massively affected the time I can stay here and the queues to get passports stamped on entry and leaving are also annoying

It's a result of the problem that the Leave campaign(s) were financed and led by such dodgy characters/chancers. A complete lack of discussion about what 'Brexit' would actually mean and incompetence from Cameron in the wording of the referendum meant that the Leave campaigns could promise everybody everything they wanted and nothing they didn't without the possibility of much of it actually occurring when reality hit.

A better-informed populace would have been nice, but the likes of the Telegraph, Express and Mail had been printing lies and distortions for decades so this was never going to be possible. They still lie and people still lap it up.

Unlike Iceland, the fishing industry is a tiny part of our economy and was always going to be the first thing to be dropped when serious negotiations with the EU began. Didn't stop the cakeism from the leading Brexiteers. That said, a lot of them weren't the brightest bunch, so perhaps some of them actually believed their own claims and it was only some who were being dishonest. Farage knew it was all bullshit when he was leading a flotilla up the Thames in another publicity stunt, but the media were still happy to report it, genereally uncritically.