National League Title / Promotion race

Don't know about you but I still keep an eye on what's going on in the National League, especially the fight for promotion with some big ex league clubs down there and only two promotion spots available, poor beggars.

No surprise who the top three are...

(Notts County, Wrexham & Chesterfield when posted)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/national-league/table

I look because I have Wrexham in my lucky 15 to win the league. Clearly to be 20 points ahead of 8th is incredible really. I hope Wrexham win the league and county come up via play offs

I've just sat and watched our 3 play off game highlights back to back.
Absolutely fantastic.

Quoted from lukeo

I look because I have Wrexham in my lucky 15 to win the league. Clearly to be 20 points ahead of 8th is incredible really. I hope Wrexham win the league and county come up via play offs

Stuff Wrexham

I just want Notts or anyone other than Wrexham to win the league. Interesting to see Barnet & Woking in play off spots.

If my other teams don't come in then Wrexham can do one

Quoted from TAGG

I've just sat and watched our 3 play off game highlights back to back.
Absolutely fantastic.

Yes and absolutely thank feck for it, this season it's even more ruthless down there. The top half is the big three and then southern-dominated. The southern tinpot teams with any sort of reasonable budget have a much bigger pool of players to choose from than we would. Solihull have kept their squad together and are only just scraping into the play-offs places, Halifax are further back after a poor start and losing players to us and Barrow and I thought York would be an outside challenger for play-off spot but they've struggled a bit recently.

Top 2 sides on course for 100 points or more if they carry on their form until the end of the season.

Looks like one of those two will go up automatically but then the other is in the lottery of the playoffs and going up won’t be anything like guaranteed as the margins become so fine.

Any two of Wrexham, Southend, Notts County and Chesterfield and I’m happy. Be great if we can get rid of Harrogate and Crawley in this League as well, get it looking more like the “Football League” again and get shot of these non-league sides, replace them with proper clubs.

Quoted from Mariner_09

Looks like one of those two will go up automatically but then the other is in the lottery of the playoffs and going up won’t be anything like guaranteed as the margins become so fine.

Any two of Wrexham, Southend, Notts County and Chesterfield and I’m happy. Be great if we can get rid of Harrogate and Crawley in this League as well, get it looking more like the “Football League” again and get shot of these non-league sides, replace them with proper clubs.

I know it’s unlikely but I’d prefer to lose a pointless club like Stevenage along with Crawley rather than Harrogate, mainly because Harrogate is significantly nearer to us.

If county go up automatically I don’t fancy Wrexham. As they proved last year, there’s so much pressure and with ‘get at them’ dinosaur Parkinson I think they’d be found out again.

Just watchedTorquay lose to Oldham with our player Wearne doing nothing and being subbed.on that performance they can keep him imo.

Yes, a tough time in NL.  So pleased we are out of the fight.  York have played Wrexham and Notts County at home.  They were impressed with County as a footballing side.  thought Wrexham were more direct and played  less football.  Nothing much changes then?

The top teams are still strengthening. The fight gets tougher still to escape.

Borehamwood  had a very successful FAC run, making a lot of money.  But they are struggling this season, such is the competition.

York have slipped to just above the bottom 4.  They won away yesterday under a new manager.  The Shop scored a lat goal.

Quoted from grimsby pete

Just watchedTorquay lose to Oldham with our player Wearne doing nothing and being subbed.on that performance they can keep him imo.

Wearne is one of a few that need to go in the window simply because the manager doesn’t seem to ever want to pick them. It’s irrelevant what we think but if Hursty doesn’t think they’re worth a starting spot, what’s the point of keeping them?

And then there's  Scunthorpe ....  😁

One good thing about the NL is the TV Coverage

Quoted from BraStrap

One good thing about the NL is the TV Coverage

Adam Summertom is an excellent commentator, he knows absolutely loads about the non league game and I’m sure it won’t be too long before he’s doing some bigger games.

For those  with Twitter have a look at his profile page

https://twitter.com/adamsummerton?s=21&t=Ty2f8tqGqxiUMSsJJKKXSA

I think his header pic is quite interesting.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Wearne is one of a few that need to go in the window simply because the manager doesn’t seem to ever want to pick them. It’s irrelevant what we think but if Hursty doesn’t think they’re worth a starting spot, what’s the point of keeping them?

Why don't we just get rid of any player that doesn't get a start and have a squad of 18?

I don't follow your logic here. He's been signed with a view to development and he may make it and he may not. Not all players are signed as first choice starters and not every signing is a success.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

Adam Summertom is an excellent commentator, he knows absolutely loads about the non league game and I’m sure it won’t be too long before he’s doing some bigger games.

For those  with Twitter have a look at his profile page

https://twitter.com/adamsummerton?s=21&t=Ty2f8tqGqxiUMSsJJKKXSA

I think his header pic is quite interesting.

He already does a lot of bigger games, commentates on a lot for BT 👍

Quoted from ginnywings

Why don't we just get rid of any player that doesn't get a start and have a squad of 18?

I don't follow your logic here. He's been signed with a view to development and he may make it and he may not. Not all players are signed as first choice starters and not every signing is a success.

That’s not my point and I’m sure you know that. Very few of our summer signings have cut the mustard, particularly in the attacking areas and we need better options. We need to be signing players that improve the 18 and the 11. Of course we need more than 18 but we need the 7 on the bench to be able to change the game and I just don’t see, beyond Hunt maybe, anyone on our bench who’s going to do that.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

That’s not my point and I’m sure you know that. Very few of our summer signings have cut the mustard, particularly in the attacking areas and we need better options. We need to be signing players that improve the 18 and the 11. Of course we need more than 18 but we need the 7 on the bench to be able to change the game and I just don’t see, beyond Hunt maybe, anyone on our bench who’s going to do that.

For various reasons (not all form based) I can’t recall many of our summer signings getting half a dozen games on the bang. Until that happens I’m not sure you can judge a player. Khan & Kiernan are starting on a more consistent basis and starting to make a difference.

Players need minutes before you can judge them especially ones still in development. It’s a squad game, this time last year who’d have thought Cropper & Mani would have had such a role in a successful play off campaign?

Just trust the manager, he’s quite good at his job.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

For various reasons (not all form based) I can’t recall many of our summer signings getting half a dozen games on the bang. Until that happens I’m not sure you can judge a player. Khan & Kiernan are starting on a more consistent basis and starting to make a difference.

Players need minutes before you can judge them especially ones still in development. It’s a squad game, this time last year who’d have thought Cropper & Mani would have had such a role in a successful play off campaign?

Just trust the manager, he’s quite good at his job.

Not sure what Cropper and Mani have to do with it. I just look at Pepple, Orsi, Wearne, Richardson and Simmonds and their appearances and think we need better. Is ambition wrong?

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Not sure what Cropper and Mani have to do with it. I just look at Pepple, Orsi, Wearne, Richardson and Simmonds and their appearances and think we need better. Is ambition wrong?

No it’s not but it needs to be based upon the achievable.

The point about Cropper and Mani is that they were brought in as cover when they got bit parts they looked average, given a bit more time they made a difference.

You must be a great judge of a player if you can judge these lads on what you’ve seen at BP. I know you’ll come back with they can’t be good as Hurst doesn’t pick them as you’ve been saying that all along. He doesn’t pick them as they’re behind Taylor (when fit) McAtee, Kiernan and Khan in the pecking order.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

No it’s not but it needs to be based upon the achievable.

The point about Cropper and Mani is that they were brought in as cover when they got bit parts they looked average, given a bit more time they made a difference.

You must be a great judge of a player if you can judge these lads on what you’ve seen at BP. I know you’ll come back with they can’t be good as Hurst doesn’t pick them as you’ve been saying that all along. He doesn’t pick them as they’re behind Taylor (when fit) McAtee, Kiernan and Khan in the pecking order.

And they’ll also be behind a fit Scannell. I like the fact that Hurst says he likes players of similar quality fighting for positions. We need the same with our strikers. And you’re right, if they were good enough, he’d pick one of them as the striker with McAtee in his natural position.

Quoted from Mariner_09

Looks like one of those two will go up automatically but then the other is in the lottery of the playoffs and going up won’t be anything like guaranteed as the margins become so fine.

Any two of Wrexham, Southend, Notts County and Chesterfield and I’m happy. Be great if we can get rid of Harrogate and Crawley in this League as well, get it looking more like the “Football League” again and get shot of these non-league sides, replace them with proper clubs.

There's also the massive mental blow of being the team that didn't seal the automatic place after being a leader all season, I think that does generally have an impact on their play-off form too.  So glad we're back in the league!

Wrexham should walk it this year, and fair enough, hope their fans have a decent season after how they treated us following the PO semi. Surprised Notts are going so well after being perennial underachievers for so long, maybe the spreadsheet man knows what he’s doing after all?

County have the one vital component in their side, a goal scorer who's on fire. That makes a big difference  

If only Hurst could work his magic and find one like Hearn for example.

Wrexham signed NL superstar Andy Cannon last week from Hull so expect them to go up another gear again. He was on loan at Stockport last season. Unbelievable really, who knows what their squad will look like at the end of January. Hopefully Notts can keep pace though and Chesterfield can pip Wrexham in the play-offs.

It doesn’t bother a lot of people and that’s fine, but personally I find it hard to stomach what they are doing in the NL. It doesn’t come down to jealousy and I admire their fans for the help they gave us last year, but I just like competition. You could argue they are still only competitive and not running away with things, but that’s only because of Parkinson holding them back playing for throw-ins. A decent coach would be well clear of second.

Quoted from quebec38

Wrexham signed NL superstar Andy Cannon last week from Hull so expect them to go up another gear again. He was on loan at Stockport last season. Unbelievable really, who knows what their squad will look like at the end of January. Hopefully Notts can keep pace though and Chesterfield can pip Wrexham in the play-offs.

It doesn’t bother a lot of people and that’s fine, but personally I find it hard to stomach what they are doing in the NL. It doesn’t come down to jealousy and I admire their fans for the help they gave us last year, but I just like competition. You could argue they are still only competitive and not running away with things, but that’s only because of Parkinson holding them back playing for throw-ins. A decent coach would be well clear of second.

There is still competition, they're not running away with it, which just goes to prove throwing enormous sums of money at it doesn't guarantee success. Despite their budget, nobody could say we didn't deserve to beat them. We had much more of the play in that game, and apart from long throws and corners they offered relatively little.

If I were them, I'd have sacked Parkinson and gone all out to get Ardley in from Solihull, but that's just me.

Quoted from quebec38

Wrexham signed NL superstar Andy Cannon last week from Hull so expect them to go up another gear again. He was on loan at Stockport last season. Unbelievable really, who knows what their squad will look like at the end of January. Hopefully Notts can keep pace though and Chesterfield can pip Wrexham in the play-offs.

It doesn’t bother a lot of people and that’s fine, but personally I find it hard to stomach what they are doing in the NL. It doesn’t come down to jealousy and I admire their fans for the help they gave us last year, but I just like competition. You could argue they are still only competitive and not running away with things, but that’s only because of Parkinson holding them back playing for throw-ins. A decent coach would be well clear of second.

not chesterfield, horrible club, they can rot down there

Ultimately, with the amount of money that Wrexham are spending, they would have to be completely utterly useless not to win promotion sooner rather than later. Parkinson may be a dinosaur, but he's competent enough at what he does and given enough money spent on enough good players, even he will get them promoted.

I know that Notts County haven't exactly been coy about spending money either, but I expect they will be overhauled in the New Year. No doubt, Wrexham will sign another League One player or two in January and the strength in depth should be enough to get them over the line. It is possible that Wrexham might suffer a few longer-term injuries amongst their main men with County continuing their excellent form, but it's more likely that attrition will wear down the team with fewer resources. Hopefully, will be a good battle for both sets of fans to enjoy/endure as appropriate!

If I was the producer of the Wrexham TV show, I'd be praying for the play-offs once again for the drama of it all...

Id prefer Notts County to win the title - the reality is that Wrexham will probably go straight up again once they get out the NL.

I totally sympathise with Wrexham fans who have been through the ringer even more than us and who were very good about helping fans tobthe PO final. A proper club, and they must have been both amazed and delighted when the eccentric millionaires that are Ryan and the other one decided to give them lots of money. However I am afraid I must support notts in the title race and anyone but Wrexham in the playoffs.

Once wrexham come up they will be claiming a promotion or playoff spot again no doubt and will be tougher rivals than any of the others. The figures that were mentioned for what they were now shifting in merchandise through their club shop were huge based on their new global appeal from the documentary. They will be loaded at league 2 level no doubt and also the level above that if they keep going and the documentary does too. A couple more failures might just smother it at birth though.

Also notts have the advantage of hooters and a great away day so there is that too!

Quoted from horsforthmariner

Id prefer Notts County to win the title - the reality is that Wrexham will probably go straight up again once they get out the NL.

Wasn't Stockport one of the favourites to go up this season in league 2, mid table and play-offs at best as it stands.

League 2 is a big step up from the National League.

tough league and shows when the bottom 8 clubs are all ex league clubs.  
Best not to gloat like some did when town went down. scunny fans gloated and now karmas laughing at them.

Quoted from toontown

I totally sympathise with Wrexham fans who have been through the ringer even more than us and who were very good about helping fans tobthe PO final. A proper club, and they must have been both amazed and delighted when the eccentric millionaires that are Ryan and the other one decided to give them lots of money. However I am afraid I must support notts in the title race and anyone but Wrexham in the playoffs.

Once wrexham come up they will be claiming a promotion or playoff spot again no doubt and will be tougher rivals than any of the others. The figures that were mentioned for what they were now shifting in merchandise through their club shop were huge based on their new global appeal from the documentary. They will be loaded at league 2 level no doubt and also the level above that if they keep going and the documentary does too. A couple more failures might just smother it at birth though.

Also notts have the advantage of hooters and a great away day so there is that too!

Everyone said the same about Stockport but ultimately, money isn’t everything. Wrexham still have the dinosaur and could still miss out on promotion again.

Their chance, in my opinion was last year. They arguably had the easier of the two teams to play in the playoffs and they copulated it. For several reasons I guess but either way, they copulated it.

I’d happily see them come up over playing someone like Solihull or Borehamwood but football isn’t that simple and for that weirdo that left the ground for the pub in the playoffs, I hope they don’t go up.

It always makes me laugh when people refer to clubs as "proper clubs" I'm not sure what the definition of that actually is as to me it feels like people just use the terms to describe a club with history. If you're a supporter of a "lesser" club I'm sure you think it's a proper club you follow.

In terms of Wrexham I would expect them to be promoted but if they don't win the league then a play off campaign is never a given as they found last season.  

Personally I'd rather see Solihull come up as they have grown from practically nothing and the possibility of being able to do that and get into the EFL is one that isn't unique in our game but anyone who does it should be respected as a "proper club".

[quote=120845]It always makes me laugh when people refer to clubs as "proper clubs" I'm not sure what the definition of that actually is as to me it feels like people just use the terms to describe a club with history. If you're a supporter of a "lesser" club I'm sure you think it's a proper club you follow.



Proper clubs in that they have the support to take more than ten to an away fixture , clubs like Salford fleetwood forest green are play things for rich people their hardly deep rooted in the community. Without rich benefactors none of the clubs I’ve mentioned survive.

Yeah I get that, but Fleetwood and Forest Green sandwich the much fabled Accrington Stanley in terms of average attendances at home in League One.

No doubt that both Fleetwood and Forest Green owe a signficant chunk of their growth to the investment from Andy Pilley and Dale Vince respectively, but they've achieved and deserved their place at the table they sit at.

I personally find this 'real club' attitude not too dissimilar to when fans of clubs like Sheffield Wednesday and Leeds have always felt they should be in the Premier League just because they're a 'big' club.  If football was won and lost on the number of fans coming through the gate, it would be flipping boring.

On Wrexham, Parkinson is their biggest issue.  All that money and talent available to him, yet he still relies on big boot and a long-throw (not even that great a long throw if truth be told!) as his attacking threat.

You can chuck money at most leagues and get out without needing a tactical genius at the helm.  But the Conference is so unique. Unless you guarantee that 1st place you're in the lottery where literally anything can happen.  There's a strong argument that we peaked at the right time and our conditioning was perfect for the grind of the play-offs.  But bloody hell we rode our luck in those 3 games.  It only would have taken one of those rolls of the dice to fall differently and we would be looking forward to a Boxing Day fixture at Scunny about now.  

I'm not convinced Wrexham will win the title, I think Chesterfield will steal a march in the New Year.  Then it's down to the lottery again.  Then there's also a point as to how sustainable is this Wrexham model?  Will Hank in Cincinnati still be buying a Wrexham shirt in 12 months time when the documentary isn't quite as gripping?  Sports documentaries largely don't follow clubs over a lengthy period of time.  The Amazon All Or Nothing series do it for a year, Sunderland 'Til I Die for 2 years, not much runs a long course.  The Class of '92 is the only one that springs to mind of having any real longevity and that grew very tiresome, very quickly.

Quoted from dapperz fun pub

[quote=120845]It always makes me laugh when people refer to clubs as "proper clubs" I'm not sure what the definition of that actually is as to me it feels like people just use the terms to describe a club with history. If you're a supporter of a "lesser" club I'm sure you think it's a proper club you follow.



Proper clubs in that they have the support to take more than ten to an away fixture , clubs like Salford fleetwood forest green are play things for rich people their hardly deep rooted in the community. Without rich benefactors none of the clubs I’ve mentioned survive.

The bit in bold could be the case with Wrexham, well without the Hollywood boys they may still survive but in reality they'd probably just "exist" for a lot longer in the NL.

Quoted from Hagrid

Stuff Wrexham

Is it because they are Welsh or is it because you don't like seeing animals wearing wellies ?

Quoted from diehardmariner

Yeah I get that, but Fleetwood and Forest Green sandwich the much fabled Accrington Stanley in terms of average attendances at home in League One.

No doubt that both Fleetwood and Forest Green owe a signficant chunk of their growth to the investment from Andy Pilley and Dale Vince respectively, but they've achieved and deserved their place at the table they sit at.

I personally find this 'real club' attitude not too dissimilar to when fans of clubs like Sheffield Wednesday and Leeds have always felt they should be in the Premier League just because they're a 'big' club.  If football was won and lost on the number of fans coming through the gate, it would be flipping boring.

Accrington Stanley although a proper club name they are a phoenix club created in late 60s a couple of years after the original club folded, so no different to the others you mention other than not a lot of money or rich benefactor.  

Quoted from Madeleymariner

Accrington Stanley although a proper club name they are a phoenix club created in late 60s a couple of years after the original club folded, so no different to the others you mention other than not a lot of money or rich benefactor.  

I wouldn't mind being a £1 behind their owner.

It would of been tough for us this season if we hadn't of beaten Solihull in the final keeping up with the top 3.

When we got out of non league last time, I wasn't in any way interested in the goings on in that league and thought we would never grace it again. Of course, we didn't learn our lesson and ended up back there, but again, now we are out of it, I've gone back to not caring who the hell comes up from that league.

If Wrexham come up and chuck more money at it to sail through league 2, then so be it. There are still 3 other promotion slots.

Quoted from Ashby mariner

It would of been tough for us this season if we hadn't of beaten Solihull in the final keeping up with the top 3.

After last season I thought you'd realise you only need to finish in the top 7 to have a chance of going up!  

Barnet must've had one hell of a summer as well. Even though we only just managed to draw there, I thought Barnet were awful at the back end of April. If the game had lasted another 5 minutes, or even if our fans hadn't bust the net after the equaliser, they'd have lost having been 2-0 up in the 83rd minute. They even managed to somehow lose against us when 3-1 up at BP in September. Now they're 5th and in tremendous form.

Quoted from Ashby mariner

It would of been tough for us this season if we hadn't of beaten Solihull in the final keeping up with the top 3.

It is an incredibly tough league to escape from, just as tough this year as last. The more I think about how we got promoted last year, the more amazing the achievement becomes.

Winning three tough games in extra time, all against teams who finished above us, two away from home, after going behind in all three matches. It’s astounding really.

That is why, I think that fortnight was the most amazing I can remember as a Town fan.

Well said Ron.  I also think our triple achievement gets better the more you look back.  Would be very difficult to still be back in NL this season.

Losing to Braintree 5-0; was also amazing and equally unexpected. For totally different reasons. 😢😢😢😢😢

We lived every minute of it so it probably feels different but when you look back, our playoff campaign will forever be the most amazing thing.

I wouldn’t say the conference is any harder or easier this year; two clubs with some cash and the usual suspects with well balanced hard working squads propping up the rest. Still means intercourse all though. We clearly had something too, perhaps we didn’t feel it because you don’t always when it’s your club, perhaps we had realistic expectations which kept a lid on everything?

Who knows.

I don’t see Wrexham going up this year and as I’ve already said, I hope they stay down, for keeping Parkinson and for Mr Magnolia who went to the pub during extra time, the big flipping melt.

Don't get the rhetoric about rich owners chucking money at clubs. The only reason to dislike it is because no one has come to us with a shed load of cash and said waste that on a team. If for instance I won very big on the lottery and donated a large portion of money to Town, many fans of other clubs would turn on us in the same manner. Would it change your standpoint?

Quoted from mimma

Don't get the rhetoric about rich owners chucking money at clubs. The only reason to dislike it is because no one has come to us with a shed load of cash and said waste that on a team. If for instance I won very big on the lottery and donated a large portion of money to Town, many fans of other clubs would turn on us in the same manner. Would it change your standpoint?

But when most owners throw money at the clubs they don’t donate it they loan it which most fans don’t know or care about then when it goes pear shaped they want it back

Beware the 'Investor' ultimately they are only interested in one thing...a return on their investment, they don't really care about football, or the club, or the town, their sole motivation is money.

Looking at the NL table today, I realised that Woking are doing very well.  They lost 0-2 at home to struggling York last Sat.  If they had won 2-0 then wthey would have gone third, above Chesterfield.

Woking are a small club punching above their weight. Like Solihull Moors last season, a smaller club can do very well if their club is well managed and run, and their player recruitment and development is extremely good.  (Brighton and Brentford are good PL examples here).

Add in low gates and smaller budgets, then their progress is admirable when matched against some of the big money clubs in the last 2 seasons.  The problem is sustaining this level of performance season after season.  

Quoted from TownSNAFU5

Looking at the NL table today, I realised that Woking are doing very well.  They lost 0-2 at home to struggling York last Sat.  If they had won 2-0 then wthey would have gone third, above Chesterfield.

Woking are a small club punching above their weight. Like Solihull Moors last season, a smaller club can do very well if their club is well managed and run, and their player recruitment and development is extremely good.  (Brighton and Brentford are good PL examples here).

Add in low gates and smaller budgets, then their progress is admirable when matched against some of the big money clubs in the last 2 seasons.  The problem is sustaining this level of performance season after season.  

Woking have the biggest crowds at that level beyond the ex-league clubs, so I guess that helps. They had a decentish side once or twice when we were down the first time too, seem to flirt with the playoffs every once in a while but never quite make it and then slip back down. I enjoyed our trip there last season, was great to be in a full stadium with the sunshining on a big Town following.

Not sure I'd agree that Solihull are well ran though, they're definitely doing well but relatively speaking I'd say they're second only to Wrexham in terms of being bankrolled beyond their means.

Looks like time in the National League is costing Notts County financially:

https://footballeconomyv2.blogspot.com/2022/12/notts-county-lose-17m.html

Quoted from promotion plaice

Looks like time in the National League is costing Notts County financially:

https://footballeconomyv2.blogspot.com/2022/12/notts-county-lose-17m.html

Similar figures to last season, I seem to remember. Don't really like how he's posted that saying they're basically insolvent, bit sensationalist when it's essentially the same news as last time he posted about Notts. They're spending beyond their means but if the owners are fine with that then they're not in trouble.

Quoted from Son of Cod

Similar figures to last season, I seem to remember. Don't really like how he's posted that saying they're basically insolvent, bit sensationalist when it's essentially the same news as last time he posted about Notts. They're spending beyond their means but if the owners are fine with that then they're not in trouble.

This is the issue, though, they are currently fine though the owners might not be OK with funding in two years time. The club is insolvent, the owners are having to pump money in to sustain it. If the owners start to feel the pinch, then the club can go to the wall.

The gamble for the Manx owners is that if the club get promoted and reach, say, championship level in a few years then they will eventually be in the money. If they don't get promoted this year it could be the end of Notts County.

I feel sorry for Chalky and his mates.

The Scunthorpe scenario in reverse.

Quoted from DB

The gamble for the Manx owners is that if the club get promoted and reach, say, championship level in a few years then they will eventually be in the money. If they don't get promoted this year it could be the end of Notts County.

I feel sorry for Chalky and his mates.

The Scunthorpe scenario in reverse.

Notts County seem to have been in this situation constantly for at least 10 years. They always seem to be about to go to the wall and somebody steps in to save them.

They're not going to get to the Championship in a few years, that's almost as ridiculous as thinking we're going to get there. Best realistic case is L1 and they won't get back anywhere near what they're putting in.

Quoted from pen penfras

Notts County seem to have been in this situation constantly for at least 10 years. They always seem to be about to go to the wall and somebody steps in to save them.

They're not going to get to the Championship in a few years, that's almost as ridiculous as thinking we're going to get there. Best realistic case is L1 and they won't get back anywhere near what they're putting in.

In August 2021, and for the rest of the season I kept posting " Going UP ". Sometimes I was ridiculed but you know what happened. What you call ridiculous does come true and it makes you look ridiculous making such statements.

Town will reach the Championship in the next few years. They now have the ownership and management structure to do this, unlike the old regime which took us from the Championship and dumped into the NL .

Quoted from DB

In August 2021, and for the rest of the season I kept posting " Going UP ". Sometimes I was ridiculed but you know what happened. What you call ridiculous does come true and it makes you look ridiculous making such statements.

Town will reach the Championship in the next few years. They now have the ownership and management structure to do this, unlike the old regime which took us from the Championship and dumped into the NL .

In August 2021, it wasn't ridiculous to think that we'd get promoted to L2 as one of the biggest clubs in that division. It did seem less likely by January, but never ridiculous when we were still high up the league.

It is ridiculous to think we'll be in the Championship in a few years. We're so, so far away from having the money, facilities and infrastructure to compete at even the top end of L1. Spending a few grand polishing the turd that is Blundell Park isn't going to do it. We need serious investment and there's absolutely no sign that it will be forthcoming.

I know how JS intended to fund the investments they plan to make, and it'll go down like a lead balloon unless they've changed their mind. And even if they have, I don't see where the money is coming from when we're a 'sustainable' club with about 5k fans and an ever growing contingent of office staff.

Quoted from pen penfras

I know how JS intended to fund the investments they plan to make, and it'll go down like a lead balloon unless they've changed their mind. And even if they have, I don't see where the money is coming from when we're a 'sustainable' club with about 5k fans and an ever growing contingent of office staff.

How do you know now? Cos you certainly didn’t about a fortnight back.

Quoted from DB

In August 2021, and for the rest of the season I kept posting " Going UP ". Sometimes I was ridiculed but you know what happened. What you call ridiculous does come true and it makes you look ridiculous making such statements.

Town will reach the Championship in the next few years. They now have the ownership and management structure to do this, unlike the old regime which took us from the Championship and dumped into the NL .

To be fair in 20/21 you kept saying we would win every game and that we would stay up

Seeing all of these latest figures from other clubs oweing millions to people, I'll take a mid table club that's run well and almost debt free.
Yes it's supposed to be a result based business but id much prefer to see my team hovering around league 2 play offs every now and then, than going up to league 1 getting into loads of debt and plummeting down into the depths of non league again...

Quoted from arryarryarry

To be fair in 20/21 you kept saying we would win every game and that we would stay up

I still believe that we can get promoted again to L1. When you look at our opening game against Orient, now flying top of the league, there was not a vast amount of difference. We are now in a similar position to last year and a good run in the new year would see us in the playoff places.

I have never been to a Town league match and thought we would lose or scrape a draw. I do realise we will not win every league game but a win in the league is always my first hope.

Quoted from pen penfras

In August 2021, it wasn't ridiculous to think that we'd get promoted to L2 as one of the biggest clubs in that division. It did seem less likely by January, but never ridiculous when we were still high up the league.

It is ridiculous to think we'll be in the Championship in a few years. We're so, so far away from having the money, facilities and infrastructure to compete at even the top end of L1. Spending a few grand polishing the turd that is Blundell Park isn't going to do it. We need serious investment and there's absolutely no sign that it will be forthcoming.

I know how JS intended to fund the investments they plan to make, and it'll go down like a lead balloon unless they've changed their mind. And even if they have, I don't see where the money is coming from when we're a 'sustainable' club with about 5k fans and an ever growing contingent of office staff.

Can you enlighten the rest of us how it's going to happen, after all we are now a club of clarity and not the old dark days of trust me I know a man who swindled pensioners and can raise the cash ( providing no questions asked).

Come clean PP stop hiding behind a cloak, tell us how?

Quoted from DB

Can you enlighten the rest of us how it's going to happen, after all we are now a club of clarity and not the old dark days of trust me I know a man who swindled pensioners and can raise the cash ( providing no questions asked).

Come clean PP stop hiding behind a cloak, tell us how?

I know somebody who used to work at the club that was there when JS said he wanted to use crowd funding from the fans to fund the club in the long term. It was before they bought the club, so about 2 years ago.

Quoted from pen penfras

I know somebody who used to work at the club that was there when JS said he wanted to use crowd funding from the fans to fund the club in the long term. It was before they bought the club, so about 2 years ago.

Not sure how much money they would raise in the current economic climate.

Quoted from pen penfras

I know somebody who used to work at the club that was there when JS said he wanted to use crowd funding from the fans to fund the club in the long term. It was before they bought the club, so about 2 years ago.

Where's ffs when you need him? You been out wining n dining with JSF again? You do talk some shiite pen. You REALLY think a hugely successful businessman like JS would seriously consider crowdfunding as a source of income?
Also just for your info 1)we are averaging 6k crowds this year , not 5k   2) scunny n wycombe with similar crowds managed to get to the championship, so its not the impossible ask that you make out.

The championship isn’t out of reach but it does require significant investment in key areas, and no, I don’t mean spaffing millions on a ground. More on increased wages, training facilities and bringing in additional sponsorship.

The problem our Welsh friend has is it’s GTFC, not Man Utd, and with the comes the fact that many a person ‘knows someone at the club’. Thing is, some of the folk that have worked at the club in the past have been as useless as the previous owner/chairman/de facto chairman/non chairman/non non chairman. They were arguably as complicit in the dreadful running of the club as he was. Not sure I’d take everything they say as gospel.

They’ve probably overheard the word ‘crowd funding’ but that’s it. There are grants and various funding streams to tap in to which I’ve no doubt they’re exploring, like any half sensible person would. Over the last 18 months the club has generated a significant amount of income from various means, income that wasn’t likely factored in to any budgeting etc. average gates have gone up well beyond anything we saw under Fenty, we shifted more ST than I’ve ever known (irrelevant whether they turn up or not) and we’re currently in the third round of the cup.

Back to the original debate, I expect Notts County to bottle it to be honest, that said, if, and it’s a big if, Wrexham don’t buy their way out in January, I’d fancy them to bottle it in the playoffs again. They’ve still got the idiot in charge and quite frankly, with the squad they’ve got, they should be playing much better football and be sat top of the tree.

The Championship is just an out of reach fantasy without huge and continuous investment,  in the team the facilities and the stadium.

Sustainable development can only take you so far, and if that model gets us into league 1 we will have done well.

Football is in such a different place to when we last competed against the bigger clubs. Nobody knows the future but it seems the current owners wish to put the club on a decent footing with decent facilities and have the club viewed in a better light which is all to be commended but I don't see them funding the colossal amounts needed above that.

If and when we ever get to league1 then things might look different again but I think the immediate future looks solid rather than spectacular.

There are ways to climb to League 1, and possibly the Championship without pumping in massive amounts of private wealth. I would rather we run the club ethically and sustainably, even if that means not being able to compete with a Wrexham or a Notts County in financial terms, if that means we have a club that isn't under threat from the plug being pulled. We have seen what has happened to Scunny with them spending well beyond their means and well beyond what their crowd numbers can support. Financially sound in League 2 is preferable to getting into debt to reach higher.

We need to get the recruitment right and develop young players into saleable assets. If we can unearth a gem or two from the football scrap heap and sell them on for a big profit, then that is the way to move up the leagues sustainably. There are signs that the club are thinking along the same lines with the recruitment recently of the guy whose name escapes me, and whose remit is to find suitable players.

There is also a definite reluctance on the part of PH to go out and spend big on a striker as some fans think should happen because we have sold a lot of season tickets. So a lot of it boils down to patience on the part of the fans. Slow and steady growth is fine by me, but others think differently.

I've waited almost 2 decades for us to get moving in the right direction. I can wait a little longer.

No idea if there's any substance in this story but....

https://therealefl.co.uk/2022/12/23/efl-could-hand-promotion-green-light-to-national-league-clubs/

Quoted from forza ivano

Where's ffs when you need him? You been out wining n dining with JSF again? You do talk some shiite pen. You REALLY think a hugely successful businessman like JS would seriously consider crowdfunding as a source of income?
Also just for your info 1)we are averaging 6k crowds this year , not 5k   2) scunny n wycombe with similar crowds managed to get to the championship, so its not the impossible ask that you make out.

Please don’t quote scunny as a model to follow Forza 😱

Quoted from promotion plaice

No idea if there's any substance in this story but....

https://therealefl.co.uk/2022/12/23/efl-could-hand-promotion-green-light-to-national-league-clubs/

I hope it happens but I highly doubt it will. Turkeys voting for Christmas, comes to mind.

I think it’s potentially time for the top 5 divisions to have a uniformed agreement on promotion/relegation. If all leagues became 3 up, 3 down… Surely, that makes sense?