New research on dementia and football shows defenders have the greatest added risk of dementia over the non footballer population, whereas goalkeepers (who virtually never head the ball)have no extra risk.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58060644

Quoted from toontown

New research on dementia and football shows defenders have the greatest added risk of dementia over the non footballer population, whereas goalkeepers (who virtually never head the ball)have no extra risk.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58060644

I can't believe no one has said anything regards boxers being constantly being hit in the head . Trying to stop heading some guy suggested . They have stopped tackling years ago . What next ?

A load of waffle

There has been a lot of high profile cases of ex-professionals been diagnosed with dementia, with heading the ball a possible contributing factor.

There are a lot of things we do in our professional and private lives when we are younger that may have an adverse effect on our health when we get older.

So what?

You usually get a relative coming on the TV or in the press bemoaning the situation, but they seem blissfully unaware that the ex-pro had a wonderful career, loved every minute of it and would never, ever have given up that life even if they could have foretold the future and see that heading the ball could/may/possibly have been a contributing factor to their illness.

Even those players who did not make it as a pro would never have given up the joy, the camaraderie and the pure pleasure of playing including heading the ball regardless of what happened in their later lives.

This happens in all walks of life; my dad used to say the years he spent at sea as a trawlerman were the happiest days of his life, even though one of the hardest jobs going and being shipwrecked in freezing Icelandic waters meant his later years were not blessed with good health. He enjoyed his younger life immensely and would have done anything to be able to go back to sea again.

I suppose the message is to enjoy your life as you see fit, and pay scant attention to what could/may/possibly happen in later life. You could give up all the pleasures you enjoy only to be run over by a bus.

It's one of those things where our culture effectively trumps health concerns. If football was invented today heading would probably not be part of the game. If alcohol was discovered today it would be a Class A drug. But we are used to them, so they are not going to be banned, just attempts/advice to mitigate the damage they do.

There's a good (free) series of podcasts about Jeff Astle on Audible which I listened to a while back. Be interesting to know whether he would have played football had he known what was going to happen to him.

Quoted from GrimRob

It's one of those things where our culture effectively trumps health concerns. If football was invented today heading would probably not be part of the game. If alcohol was discovered today it would be a Class A drug. But we are used to them, so they are not going to be banned, just attempts/advice to mitigate the damage they do.

There's a good (free) series of podcasts about Jeff Astle on Audible which I listened to a while back. Be interesting to know whether he would have played football had he known what was going to happen to him.

Of course he would.

Would he have preferred to have a fantastic football career, being super fit, playing in the top flight of English football, playing for England in the World Cup and being adored by Baggies fans the world over, having a TV career after he finished playing and being famous and being recognised wherever he went- or being, say, a car salesman who's more sedentary lifestyle could have caused other illnesses that would kill him!

The thing is, it is not one or the other is it? A life different to football would have brought different challenges that may or may not have allowed him to live longer. He died aged about 60, didn't he? Would you prefer his life of 60 years to a mundane one of 80? I know which one I would choose.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

Of course he would.

Would he have preferred to have a fantastic football career, being super fit, playing in the top flight of English football, playing for England in the World Cup and being adored by Baggies fans the world over, having a TV career after he finished playing and being famous and being recognised wherever he went- or being, say, a car salesman who's more sedentary lifestyle could have caused other illnesses that would kill him!

The thing is, it is not one or the other is it? A life different to football would have brought different challenges that may or may not have allowed him to live longer. He died aged about 60, didn't he? Would you prefer his life of 60 years to a mundane one of 80? I know which one I would choose.

I'm not so sure he would, if you listen to his wife and daughter speak. To them he was a husband and a dad, a family man. If I remember he didn't bother about football much once he stopped playing until he got involved with Fantasy Football (which I never watched so I don't remember him on it). We see it differently because we think of him almost exclusively as a footballer.

I'd probably make the same choice as you, or I would have done in my 20s anyway!

The Cornish would call you Dickie Opposite, Lew. I had a friend like you who opposes anything new almost as a matter of principle.

Hindsight is brilliant, in all walks of life and occupations. Dementia is a terrible thing and I seem to recall reading somewhere it has overtaken cancer as a cause of death.

It is not however just for ex-footballers but for all. Heading the ball does seem to have cause dementia for ex-players. Figures about the number of ex-players with dementia (or dementia related illness) compared to the total number of ex-players in all football competitions would be interesting to see.

My best wishes do go to all relatives who have loved ones with dementia and I just don't know how they cope. The person they are nursing now is not the person they had before the disease.

Surely, given modern technology and modern footballs the risks are somewhat lower than with the older balls from yesteryear.

Have players been involved in this? What will the game look like? A big 5 a side with no over head height? Lots of balls sailing over the top straight through to goalkeepers from free kicks?

I have no issue with looking at reviewing it and changes are usually important to keep something going but before they make a sweeping ban perhaps a lot more extensive research and work with the people actually playing needs to be done?

I’m sure someone will say that that could mean more end up with dementia etc but I’d stand by the fact making a sweeping ban isn’t necessarily the right action straight away…

It’s sad that Jeff Astle’s daughter has obsessively pursued this over the years looking for blame . It’s going to have bad consequences for the game we love if we’re not careful.
I coached an under 8s team last year and one of the parents told me their child wasn’t going to head the ball a anymore!!

Is anybody saying that heading should be banned in football? It's not about that, it's about reducing risk where possible. Reducing the amount of heading in training and stopping young children from heading is sensible.

If your company didn't reduce your risk where reasonably practicable, you'd be taking them to court if you got hurt. Why should football be any different. Risk is never zero, but it can be reduced and hopefully stop some people from having an absolutely horrible condition that ruins people's lives.

Quoted from louth_in_the_south

It’s sad that Jeff Astle’s daughter has obsessively pursued this over the years looking for blame . It’s going to have bad consequences for the game we love if we’re not careful.
I coached an under 8s team last year and one of the parents told me their child wasn’t going to head the ball a anymore!!

It is sad, and the relatives are naturally distraught, but they are so personally involved they cannot see the bigger picture of a great life well lived.

I loved to watch Jeff Astle play, apart from when he missed that open goal in the 1970 World Cup (!) and even if we had the knowledge we have now back then, and a club doctor advised him to quit the game, does anybody think he would have listened?

I don't know Jeff Astle's personal life, but presumably, the life he led as a teenage footballer growing up in a certain way would have resulted in him making all sorts of decisions in his life, including his fitness regime, looking after himself in other ways, eating habits, perhaps even who he met and married - in other words had his life been different who knows what might have befallen him, and would he even have the daughter who is now obsessed? It is a bit like Sliding Doors - life takes you a certain way and you cannot turn back time.

I do agree however to take sensible precautions in the future, but the lighter balls today will certainly help.

This debate reminds me of that Will Smith film regarding head injuries and American football;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concussion_(2015_film)

I know its a different sport, but what has happened with the NFL has likely impacted other sports in how they approach an issue previously ignored.

I can see heading being banned in a few years, it is not only heading the ball but the collision of heads that comes with challenging for a high ball or corner.  The game will evolve and people in 50 years will think it’s strange heading was ever allowed, ( similar to barging the keeping into the goal) as Brian Clough said football is a game for playing on the grass not in the air. Look at the Buckley years to see what even a lower league team can accomplish without booting it up in the air all the time. It will mean the end for brick out-house defenders and big physical forwards and mean more skilful players will succeed more often and height will not be such a big factor .

So what about other sports?  Are we going to ban horseracing because jockeys fall off and hurt themselves, what about Rugby, a full on contact sport,, cricket are we going to ban bouncers from fast bowlers, also boxing, can't get much more violent than that.  base jumping!

It's getting ridiculous, how the hell can you play a football match without heading!!

Quoted from 123614

So what about other sports?  Are we going to ban horseracing because jockeys fall off and hurt themselves, what about Rugby, a full on contact sport,, cricket are we going to ban bouncers from fast bowlers, also boxing, can't get much more violent than that.  base jumping!

It's getting ridiculous, how the hell can you play a football match without heading!!

Just use 5-a-side rules and be done with it. Watch the sponsors disappear.

It is so bloody stupid. The people who want it banned for this H&S reason have no concept of the game.

I wonder if we’ll see head protection come into the game…like the Chelsea keeper who fractured his skull. It happens in boxing and that appears to be the comparator here. Just a thought.