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I like Jolley, I like the fact he sees us as a project, willing to blood our youth, cares about our community and is a bright guy with hopefully a bright future ahead.

I think his hands are massively tied when it comes to budget, in fact our budget size is probably abouts where we are in the league right now.
We're not a 5,000 a game crowd anymore and I think the wage budget has had to be cut to suit. There's no hiding that we tried to sign X amount of strikers last year and missed out on them all only picking up Thomas as we were 2/3 weeks into the season and he wasnt fixed up with a club. We were always going to be a stepping stone for him. So this pre season he is going to have to stretch every penny to the max to improve us significantly for a push.

What Jolley has this season though is the opportunity to offload some of the highest earners like Collins, use the money also from Welsh and try and get 2 goalscoring strikers and with the rest of the budget can make the midfield more creative.

I think we have a core of players that are decent in this league but need to sign about 5 strong enough to step straight into the 11 to strengthen us further. I am confident we can improve.

Be careful what you wish for....

If we look at the poor response in application forms previously then we can do far worse than Jolley. Maybe Russ Wilcox could apply again and do a job for us :-)

We had to get creative just to get Jolley to apply last time and changing managers all the time doesnt solve anything.
Am sure if Scunthorpe had the opportunity to go back and not sack Alexander when in the play offs then they may not now be staring relegation in the face this term.

In conclusion. Give Jolley more time, more support and if we can more financial support and we can start to look up....
Starting next season.

UTM

Why are we even talking about if we keep him or get rid of him?

Almost unanimously this season was to be written off as one of transition.  It was accepted that this season would be one where building blocks are put in place and it would take a minimum of 3 transfer windows before we saw any fruits.

Whilst I'm disappointed at how this season has gone, despite glimpses of promise at times, what's the point of saying we're going to give time to get it right and then hang him out to dry when we're firing on all cylinders all the time?  He's either got the long-term rebuild job or he hasn't.  If he has and fails, then at least we know we gave him the time to do so.  If he hasn't then we have to accept that we'll forever be in this cycle of appointing managers on the merry-go-round and we'll never get anywhere.

There's no two ways about it, we need to make improvements over the summer.  Quite significant improvements.  But we knew that was going to be the case anyway.

The last time we were in a position where we were faced with a total rebuild and actually gave a manager real time to build something was 2004 under Russell Slade.  Let's forget the absolute shower that he produced in his second spell here and focus just on his first spell. In that first spell Slade built a bang average side in his first season that showed glimpses of promise.  I think we finished about 18th despite flirting briefly with a play-off place in the late winter/early months of spring.   Very few people were excited for his second season.  In his second summer he made some key signings (Paul Bolland, Gary Jones, Steve Mildenhall) and gelled them with the core he had brought in the previous summer (Michael Reddy, Rob Jones, Justin Whittle).  Ultimately it didn't work out quite as hoped but the improvement from one season to another was incredible.

We have to give MJ the start of next season say 15 games.

But if this bad run continues into next season he will be gone.

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

Yes, this does not set some people's hearts racing but the overall age of that 11 is 24. Take into account the bench of next years players and that'll not alter things either.

We are getting there - just think the last manager got rid of Shaun Pearson and replaced him with Nathan Clarke... the only way is up

UTM

Quoted from Nutsy

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

Yes, this does not set some people's hearts racing but the overall age of that 11 is 24. Take into account the bench of next years players and that'll not alter things either.

We are getting there - just think the last manager got rid of Shaun Pearson and replaced him with Nathan Clarke... the only way is up

UTM

Bloody hell. Bravo Neil Woods! ;)

Quoted from SomeSanity

Scunthrope will have the best budget in the league next season. They have a majority shareholder willing to invest, a commercial dept that is effective.. so more money, better run club, although it does pain me to say that.

Just sh*t players and no manager.

Our budget is 200k less than it should be and will be for the next 9 years unless changes at the top happen. Any manager we bring in is going to be severely hamstrung in all that time.

Which means they'll mostly all go through the wars with regular calls for their heads.

Unless a miracle worker.

Is that our five year plan, hope to stumble across footballing fortune?

On that note I'd love to see Shut Up's detailed plan for us to be in the Championship in five, four three years...

Quoted from Rik e B

Our budget is 200k less than it should be and will be for the next 9 years unless changes at the top happen. Any manager we bring in is going to be severely hamstrung in all that time.

Which means they'll mostly all go through the wars with regular calls for their heads.

Unless a miracle worker.

Is that our five year plan, hope to stumble across footballing fortune?

On that note I'd love to see Shut Up's detailed plan for us to be in the Championship in five, four three years...

Much as I'm not a Stephen Marley fan, it was Mr Day that had us promoted to the Championship in 5 years during one of Mr Fenty's media 'sabbaticals'.

Given that MJ has brought much-needed youth to the squad, he deserves the opportunity to build a squad in the next window and develop its' style of play. Let's hope that the budget has been boosted by some saved wages, FA Cup money and the Humberston Avenue money tree!

Quoted from diehardmariner

In his second summer he made some key signings (Paul Bolland, Gary Jones, Steve Mildenhall) and gelled them with the core he had brought in the previous summer (Michael Reddy, Rob Jones, Justin Whittle). Ultimately it didn't work out quite as hoped but the improvement from one season to another was incredible.

In his first season I remember thinking that Rob Jones was one of the most inept defenders I'd ever seen at BP...

Quoted from Yoda

We have to give MJ the start of next season say 15 games.

But if this bad run continues into next season he will be gone.

Right I think you are.

Quoted from Nutsy

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

UTM

Hall-Johnson instead of Ring for me and let's not expect too much of Whitehouse, he hasn't kicked a ball for us yet but otherwise it looks promising

Quoted from Nutsy

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

Yes, this does not set some people's hearts racing but the overall age of that 11 is 24. Take into account the bench of next years players and that'll not alter things either.

We are getting there - just think the last manager got rid of Shaun Pearson and replaced him with Nathan Clarke... the only way is up

UTM

Okey dokey, looks okay apart from:
1- where are the goals coming from?
2- Ring, needs to improve massively otherwise it's RHJ or Pollock in there imo
3- Macca needs to work on commanding his box better and improve distribution/ball release..
All in all not an awful looking line up but not a promotion chasing one, certainly not in league 2...
Think we've seen this season that you need height, strength and bullish behaviour to succeed...which I don't see enough of in 90% of your proposed line up...

Quoted from Nutsy

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

Yes, this does not set some people's hearts racing but the overall age of that 11 is 24. Take into account the bench of next years players and that'll not alter things either.

We are getting there - just think the last manager got rid of Shaun Pearson and replaced him with Nathan Clarke... the only way is up

UTM

There’s 4 or 5 in your team that wouldn’t be good enough for a team challenging for promotion.

Quoted from Ipswin

Hall-Johnson instead of Ring for me and let's not expect too much of Whitehouse, he hasn't kicked a ball for us yet but otherwise it looks promising

Are you feeling well Swin? ;D

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Are you feeling well Swin? ;D

Well if he’d been to a few more games, he’d know that RHJ is neither a full back nor left footed 🤨

I feel that Jolley had Whitehouse penciled in as an essential member of the 11 in pre season and his was a massive loss for us in hindsight. An all action link between midfield and attack. We had to replace him with an England under 21 midfielder who in the short term filled the void.
When he also had his season cut short along with our top scorer its no surprise our season has tailed off.
Lets face it, Our squad is threadbare and/or been playing for nothing for weeks except pride.
Despite all this we have improved and our acerage squad age has dropped again.

Been listening to Peter Swan on Sportstalk and Scunny spent £750,000 in January and they are all but down.
I know theres a balance between financial report and ambition but glad we are entering a new season with a steady balance rather than unsure future.

In the current state of the club, it will be a miracle if we sign 2 decent strikers.

Quoted from marinerdazza

In his first season I remember thinking that Rob Jones was one of the most inept defenders I'd ever seen at BP...

Oh he was dire. On his best day he was like Bambi on ice. Towards the end of that season he started to improve and then the next season he was just an absolute beast. Like most of that team he peaked in the winter and struggled a bit towards the end of the season but there was a significant period where he just looked unbeatable.

Quoted from barralad

I suspect Scunny's decline might have a fair bit to do with the fact that their benefactor has decided that enough is enough

It’s not technically his money it’s his wife who holds the purse strings. That said, their budget was the third highest in L1 this year so I suspect that may not be the case.

Quoted from diehardmariner

Why are we even talking about if we keep him or get rid of him?

Almost unanimously this season was to be written off as one of transition.  It was accepted that this season would be one where building blocks are put in place and it would take a minimum of 3 transfer windows before we saw any fruits.

Whilst I'm disappointed at how this season has gone, despite glimpses of promise at times, what's the point of saying we're going to give time to get it right and then hang him out to dry when we're firing on all cylinders all the time?  He's either got the long-term rebuild job or he hasn't.  If he has and fails, then at least we know we gave him the time to do so.  If he hasn't then we have to accept that we'll forever be in this cycle of appointing managers on the merry-go-round and we'll never get anywhere.

There's no two ways about it, we need to make improvements over the summer.  Quite significant improvements.  But we knew that was going to be the case anyway.

The last time we were in a position where we were faced with a total rebuild and actually gave a manager real time to build something was 2004 under Russell Slade.  Let's forget the absolute shower that he produced in his second spell here and focus just on his first spell. In that first spell Slade built a bang average side in his first season that showed glimpses of promise.  I think we finished about 18th despite flirting briefly with a play-off place in the late winter/early months of spring.   Very few people were excited for his second season.  In his second summer he made some key signings (Paul Bolland, Gary Jones, Steve Mildenhall) and gelled them with the core he had brought in the previous summer (Michael Reddy, Rob Jones, Justin Whittle).  Ultimately it didn't work out quite as hoped but the improvement from one season to another was incredible.

The centre mids were great that year Bolland, Kalala, Toner scored great goals against Lincoln and Carlisle, Woodhouse added quality from set pieces who 4 years early moved to Birmingham for 1 million.

Jones and Reddy upfront, Parkinson on the wing, Jones and Whittle at the back.

Fenty had a relegation budget again that year, and Slade worked miracles getting the team together but since then it's proved you can't do it every year.

Relying on free transfers and loans.

Quoted from Stew0_0

Lets face it, Our squad is threadbare and/or been playing for nothing for weeks except pride.

So you must be implying they have very little pride then !!

Quoted from fiveallive

The centre mids were great that year Bolland, Kalala, Toner scored great goals against Lincoln and Carlisle, Woodhouse added quality from set pieces who 4 years early moved to Birmingham for 1 million.

Jones and Reddy upfront, Parkinson on the wing, Jones and Whittle at the back.

Fenty had a relegation budget again that year, and Slade worked miracles getting the team together but since then it's proved you can't do it every year.

Relying on free transfers and loans.

Out of interest , what was the playing budget that season?

Quoted from Nutsy

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

Yes, this does not set some people's hearts racing but the overall age of that 11 is 24. Take into account the bench of next years players and that'll not alter things either.

We are getting there - just think the last manager got rid of Shaun Pearson and replaced him with Nathan Clarke... the only way is up

UTM

Definitely not good enough-doubt if that team would score a goal before xmas

Quoted from Nutsy

We have the bones of a promotion chasing side:

Macc
Hendrie Ohman Davis Ring
Clifton Whitehouse Hessenthaler
Vernam Cook Wright

There is a back to bones XI that will get better with a good pre season, plus additions in for the forwards

Yes, this does not set some people's hearts racing but the overall age of that 11 is 24. Take into account the bench of next years players and that'll not alter things either.

We are getting there - just think the last manager got rid of Shaun Pearson and replaced him with Nathan Clarke... the only way is up

UTM

I think that is just wishful thinking to be honest.

We have seen most of those players most of the season, and they have produced very little.

We (me included) always think our players are going to be real deal, but the facts do not bear it out. We are in a lowly position in the table, and even when we were a little bit better we didn't create much. On paper the players don't look too bad, but when they are facing other teams in the division they aren't. The same will happen in the summer - those with the bigger budgets will sign the better players and although we will be "excited" by our signings compared to others they will not be as good as we think.

Think back to the first game of the season. We all had high hopes and FGR took us to the cleaners. I thought they would win the league on that performance but they have only made the play offs I think so it shows just how difficult it is to put a good team together.

Perhaps another manager might have got more out of our players, but this is what Fenty always relies on - somebody somewhere making a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

Quoted from fiveallive

The centre mids were great that year Bolland, Kalala, Toner scored great goals against Lincoln and Carlisle, Woodhouse added quality from set pieces who 4 years early moved to Birmingham for 1 million.

Jones and Reddy upfront, Parkinson on the wing, Jones and Whittle at the back.

Fenty had a relegation budget again that year, and Slade worked miracles getting the team together but since then it's proved you can't do it every year.

Relying on free transfers and loans.

Garry Cohen was good that season too, before getting injured. Loved that CB pairing of Jones and Whittle. Mildenhall was quality as well.

Carlisle were great that season though. Bridges was a cut above anyone else in the division and made Karl Hawley's job of banging the goals in a piece of pish.

Frustrating season in that I don't think there was a right lot of difference between us, Orient and Northampton. We were comfortably better than all the other playoff teams too in my opinion, we just failed to show up at Cardiff.

Quoted from golfer

Definitely not good enough-doubt if that team would score a goal before xmas

Would not disagree that team listed is not good enough but provides a reasonable starting point. Talking to some ardent long-term Lincoln fans on Sunday who enquired about Whitehouse and said that he was missed this season ( not that much given their title win) as gets from box to box very well and scores goals. A midfield player who actually contributes goals is not something we have had for a while and let’s hope upon his return to fitness he can attain the form he showed at Lincoln last year.

For me we need a new left back, a more “cultured” centre back who preferably is left footed, 2 additional midfield players, one with some “beef &muscle” about him and one with some guile & vision. A good wide player who can also help Wright’s development and 2 central strikers who firstly can score some goals, secondly, can add some physicality and thirdly are capable of holding the ball up and waiting for support.

Rose & Vernam give the squad pace as will hopefully Wright and the new winger. At the back I would keep both Davis & Whitmore but accept better options may be out there so one may be released.

Cardwell needs season long loan to Conference side and this should confirm what most of us think but if there is true potential hidden allows him the opportunity to develop and demonstrate this.

Think this recipe if applied should see us well in top half and hopefully the play offs.

The problem with the failure to get promoted under Slade Mk. I came down pretty much to the signings made after Christmas who were poor pretty much to a man.

Junior Mendes was signed as a striker/winger and scored no goals in 18 appearances which included 11 starts and Goodfellow played a lot without doing anything very much.

I'd argue that the signing of Ben Futcher was a poor one as well because it meant we spent all our time looking to whack set pieces into the opposition box for our two 6'7" defenders. Less football played, more hoof ball.

At the end of the day, the non-performance in Cardiff didn't really matter as much as our failure to keep things going after Christmas.

Quoted from Maringer

The problem with the failure to get promoted under Slade Mk. I came down pretty much to the signings made after Christmas who were poor pretty much to a man.

Junior Mendes was signed as a striker/winger and scored no goals in 18 appearances which included 11 starts and Goodfellow played a lot without doing anything very much.

I'd argue that the signing of Ben Futcher was a poor one as well because it meant we spent all our time looking to whack set pieces into the opposition box for our two 6'7" defenders. Less football played, more hoof ball.

At the end of the day, the non-performance in Cardiff didn't really matter as much as our failure to keep things going after Christmas.

Take your point. Mendes seemed to disrupt the side. Futcher was such a letdown after his uncle. Yet we came so close to automatic promotion it still hurts.

Hitting the cross bar very late on at Orient. 2 more points for us. 1 less for them. I'm sure others have other tipping points.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Much as I'm not a Stephen Marley fan, it was Mr Day that had us promoted to the Championship in 5 years during one of Mr Fenty's media 'sabbaticals'.

Given that MJ has brought much-needed youth to the squad, he deserves the opportunity to build a squad in the next window and develop its' style of play. Let's hope that the budget has been boosted by some saved wages, FA Cup money and the Humberston Avenue money tree!

Sorry the Yes-men all seem so alike to me...

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Well if he’d been to a few more games, he’d know that RHJ is neither a full back nor left footed 🤨

So what, Jolley plays every fornicator out of position anyway in his ever changing but failed attempts to construct a team that can actually play to his tactics. Either that or they really are shite players

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Are you feeling well Swin? ;D

My positive comment was made in respect of the list of players, it did not include the manager or his ill planned tactics

Nutsy is spot on IMO... and I think the word 'bones' is key
Needs some quality flesh on those bones

GK and defence is solid and as good as most in L2

Midfield has energy - Hess and Harry

Average age of squad is mid 20s with lots of young players coming through

Fact - Bury win promotion and we had only conceded one more goal than them... OK, they had scored 38 more and... that is obviously where the problem lies

We know that; MJ knows that; the board knows that

I think the signs are very encouraging from the way MJ has basically sorted out defence for next season and what he is saying in interviews

In a nutshell he's going to spend a huge part of the budget on attacking/creative players and there are a couple close to coming off already...he's got the money I would think to get deals done and dusted

This tells me that him and the board know 100% that to attract this type of player you need to push the boat out on wages etc

So... follow that to its logical end...if we can get in 2 creative players in midfield and a couple of strikers (even an Olly Palmer type would be better than what we have) then the squad suddenly looks capable of challenging for play offs IMO

There's a lot of things to be really positive about with the current squad other than the most vital areas - creativity and goals; I think MJ is on the case!

Quoted from devs

Nutsy is spot on IMO... and I think the word 'bones' is key
Needs some quality flesh on those bones

GK and defence is solid and as good as most in L2

Midfield has energy - Hess and Harry

Average age of squad is mid 20s with lots of young players coming through

Fact - Bury win promotion and we had only conceded one more goal than them... OK, they had scored 38 more and... that is obviously where the problem lies

We know that; MJ knows that; the board knows that

I think the signs are very encouraging from the way MJ has basically sorted out defence for next season and what he is saying in interviews

In a nutshell he's going to spend a huge part of the budget on attacking/creative players and there are a couple close to coming off already...he's got the money I would think to get deals done and dusted

This tells me that him and the board know 100% that to attract this type of player you need to push the boat out on wages etc

So... follow that to its logical end...if we can get in 2 creative players in midfield and a couple of strikers (even an Olly Palmer type would be better than what we have) then the squad suddenly looks capable of challenging for play offs IMO

There's a lot of things to be really positive about with the current squad other than the most vital areas - creativity and goals; I think MJ is on the case!

I like the glass half full attitude, but don't see it that way. The only reason the defence was solid was because we offered nothing going forward. If we played a more expansive type of football, like Bury, then we'd have been carved open at the other end. That's what happened at the start of the season when we played decent football but didn't take any of the chances, then got hit on the counter.

I don't see Hess and Clifton in the same midfield working. I like them both, but both are busy players that get around a lot but don't offer too much creativity to the team. Hess is probably less mobile but better on the ball.

If Wes Thomas was playing in a decent team, he probably would have scored 20 goals this season. He got a decent return with pretty poor service and scored some goals that you couldn't really expect a player to do.

I'm really not sure we're good enough in any area of the pitch to challenge for the playoffs, but hopefully this time Jolley's marquee signings will be thoroughly scouted and still have the legs to play professional football and hopefully the striker will be match fit before November this time.