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Don't think there's any need for all the red xs at all, Pete makes a good point, we as fans all want MJ to succeed, he's by far the most forward thinking and most qualified manager we've had but, unless he can show he can put said attributes into practice and get some good results along with consistent performances then how long do we give him before we're on his back and putting pressure on the board to make a change?
I as many town fans( not you swin) backed his appointment with surprise, anticipation but also with open arms and an air of excitement.
So, do your stuff Mr Jolley, get this team firing, going on a winning run and we'll back you all the way....keep losing and expect hell and fire water to come....
Nice bloke, settled into life in Grimsby and hope beyond hope he brings back the good times to GTFC..

More or less what Pete said BUT

The players need to turn up for 90 mins and show a bit of bottle.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

We've got to start playing with a bit of passion - all this stuff out the classroom (to me, anyway) makes the players look like they're thinking too much - it all looks a bit sterile.

Ahh yes "playing with passion" the classic retort of someone who clearly has little knowledge of coaching or managing or making it to the top. I mean, none of these players have had any passion to even get where they are now let alone continue doing it every day.

We need a manager who shows passion on the touch line - what? Like Tim Sherwood? Throwing his arms around and shouting like the cretin he is? Brilliant. Let's get him and and 11 numpties and see where we end up.

How about we show a bit of patience and buy into an actual project for once? Give it time, let it grow and reap the rewards of building something rather than tearing up every springing shoot we sow.

Jesus f***ing wept.

Not concerned about 'passion' either, just about the number of square pegs in round holes we've seen so often this season. Hopefully the injured players will return soon to fill some of those holes, either that or the positioning of the holes changes!

That wasn't intended to sound in any way obscene, incidentally.

Oh yes it was or else you wouldn't have mentioned it

Quoted from Paris Mariner

Ahh yes "playing with passion" the classic retort of someone who clearly has little knowledge of coaching or managing or making it to the top. I mean, none of these players have had any passion to even get where they are now let alone continue doing it every day.

We need a manager who shows passion on the touch line - what? Like Tim Sherwood? Throwing his arms around and shouting like the cretin he is? Brilliant. Let's get him and and 11 numpties and see where we end up.

How about we show a bit of patience and buy into an actual project for once? Give it time, let it grow and reap the rewards of building something rather than tearing up every springing shoot we sow.

Jesus f***ing wept.

I'll try another word then - tempo. I'm not suggesting he throws his arms around like a banshee - I just want to see us play like a team that wants to get the crowd behind them.

You use the word 'project' - great - let's get on with it rather than changing the team every five minutes.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

I'll try another word then - tempo. I'm not suggesting he throws his arms around like a banshee - I just want to see us play like a team that wants to get the crowd behind them.

You use the word 'project' - great - let's get on with it rather than changing the team every five minutes.

Don't we all? The problem is everyone seems to think this will happen overnight. We are 8 games in to a 46 games season following a summer during which we have had a significant squad overhaul. It needs time. People complaining and saying "Jolley out" etc will only see this process start over again.

Don't people remember the years up to and immediately following relegation from the League? We had 10 managers in 10 years. Look where that got us.

Don’t necessarily want passion just players that actually give a intercourse.

His recruitment wasn't good enough and he needs to realise that things need to change quickly (I'm sure he does). No more square pegs in round holes, Michael. Find a system and a style of play that will fit the players you've brought in.

Quoted from Paris Mariner

Don't we all? The problem is everyone seems to think this will happen overnight. We are 8 games in to a 46 games season following a summer during which we have had a significant squad overhaul. It needs time. People complaining and saying "Jolley out" etc will only see this process start over again.

Don't people remember the years up to and immediately following relegation from the League? We had 10 managers in 10 years. Look where that got us.

I don't want Jolley out - far from it. What I would like to see is a Grimsby Town team playing in a way that makes BP a fortress again (until such time as we leave) and gets the fans out of their seats.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

I don't want Jolley out - far from it. What I would like to see is a Grimsby Town team playing in a way that makes BP a fortress again (until such time as we leave) and gets the fans out of their seats.

Yeah, it was more of a general comment. I don't think BP has been a fortress since 98/99 to be honest. Maybe that was because we saw ourselves as a bit of a small fish in a big pond so there was a siege mentality?

I would settle for a couple of goals and a sign of improvement.

Quoted from davmariner

His recruitment wasn't good enough and he needs to realise that things need to change quickly (I'm sure he does). No more square pegs in round holes, Michael. Find a system and a style of play that will fit the players you've brought in.

Could not disagree more, with the exception of Roble(still not sure why on earth anyone would want him, baffles me balls to be honest), Jolley has recruited some decent quality, certainly for league 2 anyway...
Still don't think he's had his preferred 11 on the park as yet due to injuries/suspensions..
Like I've said, I'll judge him properly once I've seen a settled team have a decent run of games...

Quoted from golfer

Am I reading it wrong but I don't understand all the red x's-must be my age and Petes

I had a word with Pete about all the red X's and he told me he was not aware as he does not see them.
He thinks some people just red X him whatever he says because of his views on Fenty,

Well I gave you a big green tick Pete.

Quoted from chrissy

I had a word with Pete about all the red X's and he told me he was not aware as he does not see them.
He thinks some people just red X him whatever he says because of his views on Fenty,

Well I gave you a big green tick Pete.

I think that could well be the reason Chrissy! ::)

Quoted from chrissy

I had a word with Pete about all the red X's and he told me he was not aware as he does not see them.
He thinks some people just red X him whatever he says because of his views on Fenty,

Well I gave you a big green tick Pete.

As a major recipient of red crosses myself, I'm sure that, like me Pete doesn't give a excrement

Ironic really that Pete may be getting red crosses because he dislikes Fenty and I get 'em for sticking up for him!

Badge of pride Pete mate - see you at Cambridge!

8 games played.

Drew with 1st, 9th.

Lost to 3rd, 5th, 6th, 7th & a still unbeaten 12th.

Beat 23rd.

Still to play our first game against every other side in the bottom half apart form 23rd.

Let's have a little perspective huh? At least until Christmas.

Quoted from MarinerMal

8 games played.

Drew with 1st, 9th.

Lost to 3rd, 5th, 6th, 7th & a still unbeaten 12th.

Beat 23rd.

Still to play our first game against every other side in the bottom half apart form 23rd.

Let's have a little perspective huh? At least until Christmas.

I honestly don't think we'll be in a relegation battle but..

Grimsby Town FC have lost to the following giants of English (and Welsh) football in their first eight games this season..

Forest Green Rovers
Newport County
Yeovil
Bury
Oldham

And only beaten Conference side in waiting Macclesfield..

Putting it into my perspective huh.. it's nowhere near good enough and completely unacceptable..

Quoted from Bigdog

I honestly don't think we'll be in a relegation battle but..

Grimsby Town FC have lost to the following giants of English (and Welsh) football in their first eight games this season..

Forest Green Rovers (12th - unbeaten)
Newport County ( 3rd)
Yeovil (5th)
Bury (7th) - league one side last season
Oldham (6th) - league one side last seasom

And only beaten Conference side in waiting Macclesfield..and only bottom half team we've played so far...

.

Added the perspective you seem to have inadvertently missed out...

behave... it's only 8 games

Quoted from Paris Mariner

Don't we all? The problem is everyone seems to think this will happen overnight. We are 8 games in to a 46 games season following a summer during which we have had a significant squad overhaul. It needs time. People complaining and saying "Jolley out" etc will only see this process start over again.

Don't people remember the years up to and immediately following relegation from the League? We had 10 managers in 10 years. Look where that got us.

I am in no way suggesting MJ should be sacked but if we are in or around the bottom 2 come Christmas then his position has to be looked at.

As regards remembering the time up to getting relegated out of the League, I remember JF keeping faith with Neil Woods and we know where that got us.

Quoted from arryarryarry

I am in no way suggesting MJ should be sacked but if we are in or around the bottom 2 come Christmas then his position has to be looked at.

As regards remembering the time up to getting relegated out of the League, I remember JF keeping faith with Neil Woods and we know where that got us.

He was 10th in a line of 10. He was picking up very fragmented pieces.

If we get to Christmas, yes, I agree, it needs a review but not after 8 games.

Quoted from chrissy

I had a word with Pete about all the red X's and he told me he was not aware as he does not see them.
He thinks some people just red X him whatever he says because of his views on Fenty,

Well I gave you a big green tick Pete.

And I give you a big green tick Chrissy

Way too earlier to panic (even if it's currently taking all week to get over each game), but those clubs may all be higher up the table because it's the season's only a few games old and the others haven't had a chance to play us yet...

Let's not forget though, we almost certainly wouldn't still be in the league if Jolley hadn't come in. New squad, time to gel, key injuries, suspensions, etc.

Fingers crossed for tomorrow. UTM

Quoted from golfer

Am I reading it wrong but I don't understand all the red x's-must be my age and Petes

Nothing to do with age Golfer,

I turned that system off ages ago so they can red cross me all they like I do not care,

If they replied and said why they disagreed I could accept that but just being able to put a cross just shows what wimps they are.

Stand up and debate you little cowards.

Now look what I have gone and done I have given them another chance to red cross me ;D ;D

BUT.---what time can I call round for tea Dad ?

It doesn't matter whether you like Michael Jolley or not; whether you think he is the nicest guy in football or whether we took too much of a gamble on an untried youngish manager. What does matter is that he get results... or he will be sacked.

There is no room for sentiment; there is certainly no long term plan if you cannot buy a result and keep us out of trouble,and he will know that better than anyone.

All clubs suffer bad luck with injuries and suspensions, but it is his job to get a squad together to cope.

I want him to succeed as I think 99% of us do, but results have to improve quickly unless he is to become another managerial statistic.

In my opinion, he seems to have something right as by and large and I'm sure lots will agree. This season we have looked OK if not good in the first half but then poor or very poor in second half. If it was all about how he sets up etc then surely we would be poor all game.

Quoted from golfer

BUT.---what time can I call round for tea Dad ?

I would give you a green tick for that son,

BUT

I have switched that mode off so I cant ;D

Quoted from marinerrick

In my opinion, he seems to have something right as by and large and I'm sure lots will agree. This season we have looked OK if not good in the first half but then poor or very poor in second half. If it was all about how he sets up etc then surely we would be poor all game.

I'm brimming with confidence now that Jolley will come good in the end 8)

The thing about square pegs in round holes is bourne due to having to cover injuries and suspensions sometimes this needs to be tried in order to strike a balance.

We look at it from outside whereas Jolley has to quickly try things in training. His squad is not so big that he as numerous naturally gifted players in EVERY position,

Recent injuries and suspensions have had a detrimental effect on the squad

Harry Clifton, for instance, is still learning his trade so is going to find it tough to adapt to playing different roles.

Defensively with Collins out it as meant trying various players in that position bringing Collins back might not have been the best decision mainly because at his age he has struggled to get back to MATCH FITNESS.

Personally, I would have liked to see more of Akeem Roses pace being used but maybe Jolley thinks he is not ready yet.

Vernam is very workmanlike but plays to deep and seems less effective.

Would like to see him higher up he has enough skill and pace to cause problems but needs a bigger player LIKE Thomas around him on paper this looks good but what do we know?

Pringle looked really unfit one can only hope he gets better he as the pedigree to be up there with the best.

A couple of wins could put an entirely different complexion on the situation UTM.

have heard that mj has got 3 games, oldham was 1 of them.

Quoted from sisapon

have heard that mj has got 3 games, oldham was 1 of them.

Post of the week....well most stupid post at leat!!!

Quoted from sisapon

have heard that mj has got 3 games, oldham was 1 of them.

Nothing surprises me nowadays at GTFC.......if true......losing our next game away at Stevenage probably wouldn't surprise most people but losing our next game after that at home to Morecambe would be really hard to take for me, especially if we get trounced again.

But it's not going to happen and we're going on a 10 game winning run :)

Quoted from Yoda

I would settle for a couple of goals and a sign of improvement.

greedy tw@t....lets start with one goal :)

Quoted from MarinerMal

Added the perspective you seem to have inadvertently missed out...

behave... it's only 8 games

I got your point first time Mal, I think the one I was making has gone totally over you're head..

Nothing to do with league position and I did say I don't think we'll be in a relegation battle and in other threads I've said that MJ needs plenty of time..

Barring a few clubs, the top half of the table will bear no resemblance come May. Your argument still hold sway in March if we lose to the seven or eight new teams in the top half?

Just to make it clear.. my point was look at the size and stature of clubs we're now supposed to accept to lose to because some people feel the need to look all reasonable and patient..

Those clubs built new sides in the summer too..

The acceptance of mediocrity and swiftness to offer excuses for it is staggering on here sometimes..

We are no more than an average club at best so realistically all we can at the moment expect are average results-which I would be satisfied with but even these we are not getting

Quoted from sisapon

have heard that mj has got 3 games, oldham was 1 of them.

That is some 1st post .

And there I was thinking the Fishy was full of Town “supporters” I’m not the first one I’m sure to be vexed by the ability some have for destruction from within.

Quoted from Ipswin

As a major recipient of red crosses myself, I'm sure that, like me Pete doesn't give a excrement

Ironic really that Pete may be getting red crosses because he dislikes Fenty and I get 'em for sticking up for him!

Badge of pride Pete mate - see you at Cambridge!

Well you did see him in the bogs at Braintree. Maybe you were impressed by his, erm, stature.

Quoted from grimsby pete

That is some 1st post .

Is it? I wonder where Getyourfactsright has gone. ;D

Quoted from Bigdog

I got your point first time Mal, I think the one I was making has gone totally over you're head..

Nothing to do with league position and I did say I don't think we'll be in a relegation battle and in other threads I've said that MJ needs plenty of time..

Barring a few clubs, the top half of the table will bear no resemblance come May. Your argument still hold sway in March if we lose to the seven or eight new teams in the top half?

Just to make it clear.. my point was look at the size and stature of clubs we're now supposed to accept to lose to because some people feel the need to look all reasonable and patient..

Those clubs built new sides in the summer too..

The acceptance of mediocrity and swiftness to offer excuses for it is staggering on here sometimes..

No, it really didn't.

If you think MJ needs plenty of time, then what on earth are you wittering on about after 8 games?

Well if the top half bears no resemblence come May, hopefully the bottom half won't either (meaning we won't be in the bottom half, hopefully). You don't seem to get my argument which is... 8 GAMES IS TOO EARLY TO BE MAKING JUDGEMENT ON A SEASON!!!!

I think you need to do a retake on the size and stature of our football club. Yes in the 80's/90's we swung way above our level but we've just come from 6 years in the non-league. We have fallen behind many teams, even locally. Rebuilding from that mess will take more than a season or two.

We need to give Jolley some time, certainly more than 8 games ffs. We have had a really tough start, yes I think there is plenty of work to be done but I really don't see what we would gain by putting pressure on the manager at this point.

Looking back at your posts, you seemed to think we would be top half pushing for promotion. That was hopeful. Mid table was always our aim this season. Even a bottom half finish away from a relegation scrap is progress.

If your hope were too high at the beginning of the season, that is not Jolley's fault. You must have had faith in him then, why abandon that faith after 8 games against sides in form, towards the top end of the table. I really believe this will, in the end come good this season, a mid table finish would be a hell of an achievement.

Unless, we are really struggling in the bottom 2 come Christmas, we need to give this guy a season and maybe another to help rebuild this football club.

We are all GTFC fans and supporters. Let's start acting that way and give the team the support it needs currently.

Quoted from MarinerMal

No, it really didn't.

If you think MJ needs plenty of time, then what on earth are you wittering on about after 8 games? Wittering? Charming..

Well if the top half bears no resemblence come May, hopefully the bottom half won't either (meaning we won't be in the bottom half, hopefully). You don't seem to get my argument which is... 8 GAMES IS TOO EARLY TO BE MAKING JUDGEMENT ON A SEASON!!!!

I was making a judgement on the start we've made not on the season. No need to shout or put words in my mouth to re-emphasise your point..

I think you need to do a retake on the size and stature of our football club. Yes in the 80's/90's we swung way above our level but we've just come from 6 years in the non-league. We have fallen behind many teams, even locally. Rebuilding from that mess will take more than a season or two.

You build a mindset like this and you can create problems and mental blocks that in fact may not exist..

We need to give Jolley some time, certainly more than 8 games ffs. Ffs? Calm the fook down, because I am.. We have had a really tough start, yes I think there is plenty of work to be done but I really don't see what we would gain by putting pressure on the manager at this point.

I'm posting on a forum not shouting in his lughole and not calling for his head..

Looking at the standard of teams we've played, I don't think we've had a tough start. MK Dons (second half), Lincoln (for how they hung on in the game) and Yeovil impressed me, the others, we made them look better than they are..

Looking back at your posts, you seemed to think we would be top half pushing for promotion. I said top half pushing for play offs, but hey why not misquote me to try to justify yourself further..That was hopeful. Mid table was always our aim this season.Was it? Never heard any target being set or is it another one of those fan self-appointed targets? Even a bottom half finish away from a relegation scrap is progress. Yes, that would be a Jolley Revolution..

If your hope were too high at the beginning of the season, that is not Jolley's fault. You must have had faith in him then, why abandon that faith after 8 games against sides in form, towards the top end of the table.Who says I've abandoned the faith? Like you quoted me, he needs to be given more time, but I'm a little disappointed with how he's set up the team at the minute, I expected better than this dross we've been serving up.. I really believe this will, in the end come good this season, a mid table finish would be a hell of an achievement. Mid-table League Two is meh and not hell of an acheivement no matter where we finished last season. The vast majority of the teams in this division are pretty poor tbh and I don't think we need to be handing out gold stars for mediocrity..

Unless, we are really struggling in the bottom 2 come Christmas, we need to give this guy a season and maybe another to help rebuild this football club. I've said three seasons to get us out of this league, minimum two, so does that make me more patient than you?

We are all GTFC fans and supporters. Let's start acting that way and give the team the support it needs currently.Were you a school teacher or a copper? Because all I've done is make a point that is different to yours and I've been lectured, shouted at, ffs ed at, called a witterer and been told to behave. I don't believe in your weak-minded fuzzy logic, get over it and move on. This acceptance of being little old Grimsby with an uphill task season after season creates a self-inducing nightmare season after season.. but then again you can't see that and I accept you may have a different view to mine that I don't agree with, but I don't put up with being misquoted or mis-represented..

I still support Jolly but it wearing very thin.
I can see some mad Bignot traits creeping in not knowing his best 11, formation or tactics.

I'm sure he will get it right but please hurry up.

UTM

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Well you did see him in the bogs at Braintree. Maybe you were impressed by his, erm, stature.

Well he was a right handful, or maybe it was the left. I just wish he'd washed them before shaking hands :)

Quoted from Ipswin

Well he was a right handful, or maybe it was the left. :)

I’m confused doesn’t everyone else need both then ? 😄

Quoted from Bigdog

Were you a school teacher or a copper? Because all I've done is make a point that is different to yours and I've been lectured, shouted at, ffs ed at, called a witterer and been told to behave. I don't believe in your weak-minded fuzzy logic, get over it and move on. This acceptance of being little old Grimsby with an uphill task season after season creates a self-inducing nightmare season after season.. but then again you can't see that and I accept you may have a different view to mine that I don't agree with, but I don't put up with being misquoted or mis-represented..

A little touchy are we?

All my "weak-minded fuzzy logic" says is it's too early to be making any judgements. Not sure what there is to get over or move on from.

Maybe you could take a little of your own advice.

Sadly the man is out of his depth. What a terrible start to the season. Think he’ll be sacked soon.

Quoted from davmariner

Sadly the man is out of his depth. What a terrible start to the season. Think he’ll be sacked soon.

Does it matter? We'll just get another no mark, who will bring in the next batch of sh1t players. The board need to fook off.

Quoted from ginnywings

Does it matter? We'll just get another no mark, who will bring in the next batch of sh1t players. The board need to fook off.

Yes agree.

Quoted from ginnywings

Does it matter? We'll just get another no mark, who will bring in the next batch of sh1t players. The board need to fook off.

Indeed they do but they won't, will they?

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Indeed they do but they won't, will they?

Nope. Fenty has already put a dampener on the prospect of a community stadium at Freemo. We couldn't even have that glimmer of hope for more than a day. His way or no way. Unfortunately, his way is failure upon failure.

Another 400 down the pissing drain watching a nothing side doing excrement week after week. Just play 4-4 flipping 2 stop playing them out of position, its not hard

Quoted from grimsby pete

That is some 1st post .

maybe 1 game left.

Quoted from ginnywings

Nope. Fenty has already put a dampener on the prospect of a community stadium at Freemo. We couldn't even have that glimmer of hope for more than a day. His way or no way. Unfortunately, his way is failure upon failure.

As I said earlier - Freemo represents a development led by the Council not the club. Let's face it, if the club still proceeded with PP ahead of Freemo, the councillors could block planning permission anyway. He needs to get on board with Freemo or fook off.

Quoted from Hagrid

Another 400 down the pissing drain watching a nothing side doing excrement week after week. Just play 4-4 flipping 2 stop playing them out of position, its not hard

I would agree, but Jolley failed to bring in any out-and-out strikers other than Thomas. This is in spite of the fact that it should have been a priority area to be strengthened.

This is as bad as it was under Slade.

He`s not learning from defeat to defeat in fact I believe panic has set in, 442 every player in their rightful position and go all out from the start to finish for three points.
I believe we have the players but are being poorly coached and need a big change, lose the next two and he`s gone

Quoted from Garth

442 every player in their rightful position

And out of current squad available to M.J, who plays left back and the 2 wide positions..in their rightful position?

Don't know how you can leave Famewo out and play Davis or Collins, don't know how you can leave Vernam out and play Woolford or Clifton, don't know why you would sign Robles, don't know why you would send Rose & Wright out on loan and keep Hooper in your matchday squad. Other than that.............

We were not set up to win today. WHY ?!?!

Quoted from sisapon

maybe 1 game left.

Are you John Fenty in disguise ?

Quoted from Grantham_Mariner

We were not set up to win today. WHY ?!?!

Because we can not score the only thing is we can not defend either.

Quoted from grimsby pete

Because we can not score the only thing is we can not defend either.

That would make us crap then ;)

Sorry Michael time to go you are not ready for this pressureised job

Quoted from OllieGTFC

Sorry Michael time to go you are not ready for this pressureised job

Just think if the job was really pressurised
Obvioulsly a wind up- you really want the manger sacked now??

Jolley has got one chance of saving his job.

Starting next week he has got to throw his coaching manuals away and realise we are L2 not premiere league,

Start playing players in their right positions and play on the front foot

Give Thomas support and play a winger ( Pringle ) on the right wing which h for him is on the left wing. ;)

At least if we are going to lose lets do by trying to win the bloody thing.

The clock is ticking as our EU friends like to keep telling us.

He says it was an even game, they had 18 shots to our 6 - 5 on target to our nil. Not good enough.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

He says it was an even game, they had 18 shots to our 6 - 5 on target to our nil. Not good enough.

Interesting interview especially when he mentioned their half a dozen 6 foot plus players so why did we did we keep throwing into into the box for a near post flick on when it didn't work time after time.

Also talked about bringing Pringle on and his attacking ability but it was far too late IMHO

There was a big clamour for this modern thinking type of manager with a scientific approach and manuals sticking out his bottom. I said it then and I will say it again load of bollox! it’s not going to work in this league if we ever win then stick with that team FFS.

I still want him to turn it around regardless but he needs to go back to basics and play players in their natural positions. Maybe sack the coaches off he’s brought in no doubt filling his head with excrement and stick with Dave Moore, tell you what Jolley you coach and just let Dave pick the team we will be winning in no time.

Nobody wants to see a man lose his job but I want to see my team win, see my team play attacking football, see my team be the pride of my life rather than the laughing stock it is right now...christ I'm engaged to a hully gully and even she's taking the urine now!!..and unfortunately jolley isn't doing a good job, it's like get a plasterer in to do my plumbing...maybe he was a great banker, a good academy coach but he's falling well short of being a football manager...I don't want us to be the english equivalent of the swedish team he managed and got relegated...
In all honesty we have a manager and assistant who's track record ain't the best...I so, so wanted jolley to succeed, to see a young english manager cut his teeth at Grimsby, to take us to the next level before he moved on to bigger and better things but would always look back and say "thank you GTFC, you gave me this chance to become a brilliant manager and I leave you as a championship team playing great football"....alas unless something changes very quickly hell leave us a national league team and he'll return to banking...

Hereford sacked a manager with three promotions and a 70 odd per cent win rate.

Football management is a very fickle occupation, and Jolley knows he is under pressure.

How long is enough games? We've been here before, shall we wait until February again? We've hired a man that talks all the right words, means well and is great with the fans.

Ultimately, he has no proven success in the game and positive words only takes you so far. I want Jolley to succeed but if it's not working then ffs change it and accept it. He has brought in the players so you can't say he's not had an influence on the team this season.

Quoted from GTFCChris

How long is enough games? We've been here before, shall we wait until February again? We've hired a man that talks all the right words, means well and is great with the fans.

Ultimately, he has no proven success in the game and positive words only takes you so far. I want Jolley to succeed but if it's not working then ffs change it and accept it. He has brought in the players so you can't say he's not had an influence on the team this season.

Are you talking about Bignot??

Quoted from Stadium

Are you talking about Bignot??

No.

no i am not fenty ,i am a s/t holder the 3 games came from a very good soure. wait and see.

Quoted from arryarryarry

I am in no way suggesting MJ should be sacked but if we are in or around the bottom 2 come Christmas then his position has to be looked at.

As regards remembering the time up to getting relegated out of the League, I remember JF keeping faith with Neil Woods and we know where that got us.

But he wasn't JF's choice . It was the other members of the Board including Mike Parker who wanted Woods as manager.

Quoted from Bigdog

I got your point first time Mal, I think the one I was making has gone totally over you're head..

Nothing to do with league position and I did say I don't think we'll be in a relegation battle and in other threads I've said that MJ needs plenty of time..

Barring a few clubs, the top half of the table will bear no resemblance come May. Your argument still hold sway in March if we lose to the seven or eight new teams in the top half?

Just to make it clear.. my point was look at the size and stature of clubs we're now supposed to accept to lose to because some people feel the need to look all reasonable and patient..

Those clubs built new sides in the summer too..

The acceptance of mediocrity and swiftness to offer excuses for it is staggering on here sometimes..

It's got nothing to do with accepting defeat , just accepting that a defeat has occurred. As far as bringing into question the " stature " of the clubs we have lost to then all that demonstrates is a " billy big b*llox " attitude by the poster. Just because a club has a " low status " doesn't mean they are doomed to carry that mantle all their lives. Who would have thought Accrington could achieve what they have done, especially considering the kind of budget they must work to. No club has a divine right to beat another team based on their " stature " - we did enough " giant killing " when we were at Championship level.

Quoted from rancido

It's got nothing to do with accepting defeat , just accepting that a defeat has occurred. As far as bringing into question the " stature " of the clubs we have lost to then all that demonstrates is a " billy big b*llox " attitude by the poster. Just because a club has a " low status " doesn't mean they are doomed to carry that mantle all their lives. Who would have thought Accrington could achieve what they have done, especially considering the kind of budget they must work to. No club has a divine right to beat another team based on their " stature " - we did enough " giant killing " when we were at Championship level.

How about we try to beat more teams in our Football League division than we lose to? That would be a refreshing change - it hasn't happened since 2005/6.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

How about we try to beat more teams in our Football League division than we lose to? That would be a refreshing change - it hasn't happened since 2005/6.

I agree but my post was in response to the statement that we lose to " low stature teams". The reality is that we are a medium sized town with a medium sized budget based on our finances. What kind of " stature " does that make us. Forget the fact that some time , certainly before mine, we graced the old First division. Football has altered enormously in the last 50 years and we do not have some divine right to think we are a big club or that other clubs with a more humble history than ours are " lower in stature ".

Quoted from MuddyWaters

How about we try to beat more teams in our Football League division than we lose to? That would be a refreshing change - it hasn't happened since 2005/6.

That would suggest it isn't entirely down to the current manager. Or might explain why we can't get better.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

That would suggest it isn't entirely down to the current manager. Or might explain why we can't get better.

It clearly isn't down to the current manager - but it's OK, I'm expecting Championship football in 5 years - because a director said so! :B :B

Quoted from rancido

It's got nothing to do with accepting defeat , just accepting that a defeat has occurred. As far as bringing into question the " stature " of the clubs we have lost to then all that demonstrates is a " billy big b*llox " attitude by the poster. Just because a club has a " low status " doesn't mean they are doomed to carry that mantle all their lives. Who would have thought Accrington could achieve what they have done, especially considering the kind of budget they must work to. No club has a divine right to beat another team based on their " stature " - we did enough " giant killing " when we were at Championship level.

I get what you're saying. Regardless of what supporters think and it had to be recognised that as "supporters" by nature are usually bias toward their team/club a clubs stature is surely based upon recent league position?

So for us what was it last season 18th, the first season back was about14th? in the 4th tier. After a long stint in non league? After a period of decline as others moved forward.

Some posters have referred to us as a "once great club" yeah we punched above our weight for decent periods in the 80's and 90's but post war our "stature" has been 3rd and 4th Division. The difference is in the modern age of agents, social media, Bosman, Sky, academies, loyalty bonuses instead of 10 year testimonials and player power hitting the heady heights of the 3rd tier needs many things most of which we lack as a football club.

In recent times I'm not even sure you can associate GTFC with and real EFL stature. Yes we are an old club with a long history but in reality our stature is 90th in the pyramid something that the current regime need to take full accountability for, I doubt they will though as their Teflon will always protect them.

Quoted from rancido

But he wasn't JF's choice . It was the other members of the Board including Mike Parker who wanted Woods as manager.

So I had heard but that was not the point, he should have pulled the trigger halfway through that terrible run because I think 3 or 4 more points would have kept us up.

JF was probably listening to the numpties on here who kept saying he would keep us up.

Quoted from rancido

It's got nothing to do with accepting defeat , just accepting that a defeat has occurred. As far as bringing into question the " stature " of the clubs we have lost to then all that demonstrates is a " billy big b*llox " attitude by the poster. Just because a club has a " low status " doesn't mean they are doomed to carry that mantle all their lives. Who would have thought Accrington could achieve what they have done, especially considering the kind of budget they must work to. No club has a divine right to beat another team based on their " stature " - we did enough " giant killing " when we were at Championship level.

Not my point at all. And thanks for second guessing my "billy big bollox" attitude. My point was, all of those sides have a lower turnover than us but seem to organise themselves better every summer as do similar clubs in the division above. No, we don't have a divine right to beat anyone based upon size but also they don't have the divine right to beat us either, yet still manage to do it season after season decade after decade and some of our fans are so conditioned to it that they think it's ok, normal and make any old excuse for it. If it's your opinion that I have a "billy big bollox" attitude in being cheesed off to not pick a single point off Yeovil, Newport, FGR, Stevenage, Oldham and Bury, then god help our club and god help your miniscule expectations. It's like you've walked in on six blokes having a go on your missus for the upteenth time and for the upteenth time you immediately look for excuses to prove that they've got every right to. As you've brought bollox up, it's maybe time you should grow a pair and start demanding more off our club rather than just trotting out the Accrington line which I'm sure you'll be using that and maybe Leicester too to justify abject failure from a club that should on the balance of probabilities be doing better than it is at least more than once in the past twenty seasons ..

Quoted from Bigdog

Not my point at all. And thanks for second guessing my "billy big bollox" attitude. My point was, all of those sides have a lower turnover than us but seem to organise themselves better every summer as do similar clubs in the division above. No, we don't have a divine right to beat anyone based upon size but also they don't have the divine right to beat us either, yet still manage to do it season after season decade after decade and some of our fans are so conditioned to it that they think it's ok, normal and make any old excuse for it. If it's your opinion that I have a "billy big bollox" attitude in being cheesed off to not pick a single point off Yeovil, Newport, FGR, Stevenage, Oldham and Bury, then god help our club and god help your miniscule expectations. It's like you've walked in on six blokes having a go on your missus for the upteenth time and for the upteenth time you immediately look for excuses to prove that they've got every right to. As you've brought bollox up, it's maybe time you should grow a pair and start demanding more off our club rather than just trotting out the Accrington line which I'm sure you'll be using that and maybe Leicester too to justify abject failure from a club that should on the balance of probabilities be doing better than it is at least more than once in the past twenty seasons ..

You really need a reassessment of were we are as a football club.

You keep mentioning Yeovil, Newport, FGR, Stevenage, Oldham and Bury as if all we need to do is turn up to beat these clubs. Yeovil, Stevenege, Oldham and Bury were all playing League One while we were non-league. We all know about FGR and their owner and Newport are just a much better run club than we are and have been back in the League longer than we have. All these clubs have good reason to think they have overtaken us. You need to move out of the 80's/90's.

It will take us quite awhile to get back to anywhere near we used to be. This is made much much harder by probably one of the poorest boards in the football league pyramid and a Chairman (in everything but name) who either doesn't have the faintest idea of how to run a football club or has given up caring. If we go down to non-league again, it will be because we are run like a non-league club (and many of them are run better).

Some of us realise this and have altered our expectations accordingly. We don't like defeat anymore than yourself but don't expect all this to be fixed overnight. I can't see us rebuilding as a football club until we are either in a new stadium or someone replaces Fenty and it may well need both things to happen.

Quoted from MarinerMal

You really need a reassessment of were we are as a football club.

You keep mentioning Yeovil, Newport, FGR, Stevenage, Oldham and Bury as if all we need to do is turn up to beat these clubs. Yeovil, Stevenege, Oldham and Bury were all playing League One while we were non-league. We all know about FGR and their owner and Newport are just a much better run club than we are and have been back in the League longer than we have. All these clubs have good reason to think they have overtaken us. You need to move out of the 80's/90's.

It will take us quite awhile to get back to anywhere near we used to be. This is made much much harder by probably one of the poorest boards in the football league pyramid and a Chairman (in everything but name) who either doesn't have the faintest idea of how to run a football club or has given up caring. If we go down to non-league again, it will be because we are run like a non-league club (and many of them are run better).

Some of us realise this and have altered our expectations accordingly. We don't like defeat anymore than yourself but don't expect all this to be fixed overnight. I can't see us rebuilding as a football club until we are either in a new stadium or someone replaces Fenty and it may well need both things to happen.

What Mal said and....... maybe we could keep a manager for more than a season since returning to the EFL, four in two seasons tells you all you need to know IMHO.

Quoted from HertsGTFC

What Mal said and....... maybe we could keep a manager for more than a season since returning to the EFL, four in two seasons tells you all you need to know IMHO.

That should happen if/when we make a decent appointment.

Quoted from MarinerMal

You really need a reassessment of were we are as a football club.

You keep mentioning Yeovil, Newport, FGR, Stevenage, Oldham and Bury as if all we need to do is turn up to beat these clubs. Yeovil, Stevenege, Oldham and Bury were all playing League One while we were non-league. We all know about FGR and their owner and Newport are just a much better run club than we are and have been back in the League longer than we have. All these clubs have good reason to think they have overtaken us. You need to move out of the 80's/90's.

It will take us quite awhile to get back to anywhere near we used to be. This is made much much harder by probably one of the poorest boards in the football league pyramid and a Chairman (in everything but name) who either doesn't have the faintest idea of how to run a football club or has given up caring. If we go down to non-league again, it will be because we are run like a non-league club (and many of them are run better).

Some of us realise this and have altered our expectations accordingly. We don't like defeat anymore than yourself but don't expect all this to be fixed overnight. I can't see us rebuilding as a football club until we are either in a new stadium or someone replaces Fenty and it may well need both things to happen.

I agree with this 100% - but should really have to accept being fifth rate?

I think a reasonable (maybe even modest) expectation for club and supporters to have is that we should be able to compete at this level. To at least hold our own in L2. Seems an acceptable baseline to me. Last season we were below this and we are so far this.

Objectives and ambitions are a separate thing in my mind. We should be striving to compete at the top and trying to get promoted over the medium to longer term, with associated off field improvements, shall we say.

What we had last season (barring the Jolley phase at the end), and now this season isn't acceptable to anyone I shouldn't think.

Just to make it clear, I don't think recent performances are acceptable and I don't and never have thought they Jolley would be the answer to all our problems.

I did think at the start of the season we would have a tough start and, being honest, it's gone even worse than I anticipated. However, I also thought we would improve as the season wore on, possibly looking at mid table. Looking how things stand at this moment in time even that may look too high but that is the beauty of football, it can all change very quickly.

I am not saying those who don't think Jolley can cut it are wrong, just that, IMO, it is still too early to say, despite the worrying current form. The season is still young and there will be plenty of time later to ponder a change in management if needed. That time is just not yet and to my mind people are just panicking a little.

Quoted from MarinerMal

Just to make it clear, I don't think recent performances are acceptable and I don't and never have thought they Jolley would be the answer to all our problems.

I did think at the start of the season we would have a tough start and, being honest, it's gone even worse than I anticipated. However, I also thought we would improve as the season wore on, possibly looking at mid table. Looking how things stand at this moment in time even that may look too high but that is the beauty of football, it can all change very quickly.

I am not saying those who don't think Jolley can cut it are wrong, just that, IMO, it is still too early to say, despite the worrying current form. The season is still young and there will be plenty of time later to ponder a change in management if needed. That time is just not yet and to my mind people are just panicking a little.

Panicking, concerned or worried, the problem is that we’ve seen it way too often for far too long

Quoted from GollyGTFC

That should happen if/when we make a decent appointment.

Or give a manager enough to attract the right talent?

Quoted from MarinerMal

You really need a reassessment of were we are as a football club.

You keep mentioning Yeovil, Newport, FGR, Stevenage, Oldham and Bury as if all we need to do is turn up to beat these clubs. Yeovil, Stevenege, Oldham and Bury were all playing League One while we were non-league. We all know about FGR and their owner and Newport are just a much better run club than we are and have been back in the League longer than we have. All these clubs have good reason to think they have overtaken us. You need to move out of the 80's/90's.

It will take us quite awhile to get back to anywhere near we used to be. This is made much much harder by probably one of the poorest boards in the football league pyramid and a Chairman (in everything but name) who either doesn't have the faintest idea of how to run a football club or has given up caring. If we go down to non-league again, it will be because we are run like a non-league club (and many of them are run better).

Some of us realise this and have altered our expectations accordingly. We don't like defeat anymore than yourself but don't expect all this to be fixed overnight. I can't see us rebuilding as a football club until we are either in a new stadium or someone replaces Fenty and it may well need both things to happen.

I don't need any condescending advice from you about reassessing exactly where we are, as I know who we are and why, nor am I stuck in the 80s and 90s..

Again.. putting words in my mouth. I didn't say all we had to do was turn up to beat them, what I indicated was that we haven't even competed well against these clubs in the past twenty years and should have picked up more than 0 points out of 18 if something wasn't so seriously wrong at our club. If you look through my posts in no uncertain terms do I think we should be competing higher than this division with how we are set up but however badly managed I do think we have enough tools to compete better than we are. And then you've answered yourself the root cause of the key theme in my original post which I was alluding to. Took you a while for you to get there and you should have done so without misquoting me or putting words in my mouth or jumping on my back as you always seem to do. My question to you is.. do you personally carry on keep shrugging your shoulders saying we are where we are and handing out sage lectures about what we all know and feel already, or do you raise your voice and say this is unacceptable?

Quoted from Bigdog

I don't need any condescending advice from you about reassessing exactly where we are, as I know who we are and why, nor am I stuck in the 80s and 90s..

Again.. putting words in my mouth. I didn't say all we had to do was turn up to beat them, what I indicated was that we haven't even competed well against these clubs in the past twenty years and should have picked up more than 0 points out of 18 if something wasn't so seriously wrong at our club. If you look through my posts in no uncertain terms do I think we should be competing higher than this division with how we are set up but however badly managed I do think we have enough tools to compete better than we are. And then you've answered yourself the root cause of the key theme in my original post which I was alluding to. Took you a while for you to get there and you should have done so without misquoting me or putting words in my mouth or jumping on my back as you always seem to do. My question to you is.. do you personally carry on keep shrugging your shoulders saying we are where we are and handing out sage lectures about what we all know and feel already, or do you raise your voice and say this is unacceptable?

Again... I wasn't putting any words in your mouth it was just the inference from your the words in your posts and I wasn't the only one who inferred such meaning given rancido's post. But I don't want to get in a t1t-4-tat exchange on who said what. If I misrepresenting what you were trying to say, I apologise.

We all know the root cause of the issue with this club, I think we are in agreement there and we can agree that results certainly haven't been acceptable as they haven't for the past 12 months. However, the club made a decision to appoint a young, hungry, possibly up and coming manager to help build a side. However much we may want to change our status now, the truth is it is going to take a while to do that. Hence, IMO, we need more patience and a little less gnashing of teeth after each defeat.

Quoted from MarinerMal

Again... I wasn't putting any words in your mouth it was just the inference from your the words in your posts and I wasn't the only one who inferred such meaning given rancido's post. But I don't want to get in a t1t-4-tat exchange on who said what. If I misrepresenting what you were trying to say, I apologise.

We all know the root cause of the issue with this club, I think we are in agreement there and we can agree that results certainly haven't been acceptable as they haven't for the past 12 months. However, the club made a decision to appoint a young, hungry, possibly up and coming manager to help build a side. However much we may want to change our status now, the truth is it is going to take a while to do that. Hence, IMO, we need more patience and a little less gnashing of teeth after each defeat.

You can't just go on losing lamely though can you? I like Jolley in many ways but the Team News thread on Saturday once the team was announced basically predicted the outcome and it was always going to be Grimsby nil.

Quoted from MarinerMal

Again... I wasn't putting any words in your mouth it was just the inference from your the words in your posts and I wasn't the only one who inferred such meaning given rancido's post. But I don't want to get in a t1t-4-tat exchange on who said what. If I misrepresenting what you were trying to say, I apologise.

We all know the root cause of the issue with this club, I think we are in agreement there and we can agree that results certainly haven't been acceptable as they haven't for the past 12 months. However, the club made a decision to appoint a young, hungry, possibly up and coming manager to help build a side. However much we may want to change our status now, the truth is it is going to take a while to do that. Hence, IMO, we need more patience and a little less gnashing of teeth after each defeat.

I've also posted in agreement with you that we have to give MJ more patience (as thin as it's wearing when looking at the team sheet at 2-15 on a Saturday) and i don't actually think (as I've posted before) we'll be in a relegation battle, but if we project forward a season and say we finish lower mid-table as probably both you and I suspect due to the bad start, it hardly helps attracting players in 2019/20 and so the vicious circle continues and the bit I really bother about is the disappearance of the floating fans earlier and earlier every season as that affects budget too going forward. I'm not sure what works better.. downright outrage at our plight or solemn acceptance. Fenty never listens to one because he's got skin as thick as a rhino and the other he takes as non-criticism or support. Either way he's staying put even though he's stated he wants to leave, and those loans remain on the books even though he's written them off in his head. It's a crying shame what's happened to the club and I'm more worried about the thousands that used to go because they don't care anymore rather than the ones who post on here because they've got a lot more patience and loyalty. If we are to take a step forward, every fan counts not just the diehards. Anyway, we all want the same thing. I apologise too for being a bit shirty with you, here's to a good weekend Mal and I hope it brings you the three points we all want and need..