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Quoted from moosey_club

i see the telegraph were highlighting the latest plans for the Freeman St revival the other night...which includes the land where the multi stories will be coming down later this year.....social housing, a school, some green space ......if PP doesnt go ahead then this is another potential site & colaboration that will be missed IMO.

This was covered on the Burnsy programme on Friday. They where interviewing a freeman of Grimsby regarding the site involved. A stadium was mentioned and the gent being interviewed stated an approach had not been made, although if it was to recieve an enquiry it would be looked at. The main stumbling block would be the financing of the project.

Quoted from Yoda

The deal is dead this is why Fenty wants out.

You felt it in the Force?

Quoted from wigworld

You felt it in the Force?

So fuckin silly, don’t be.

Quoted from wigworld

You felt it in the Force?

This BP music thing has gone to my head :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbKywAssEcM

Think it would need more land than the 6 tower blocks are built on though. Looking at a map BP, excluding the car park, is about 130 yards wide (back of Findus to back of Main Stand). It's about 160 yards from the back of the Ponny to the back of the Osmond. So 130x160 on a cramped site. You'd need all of the plot where the 6 towers are and that includes the 6 low rise blocks on the west of the plot. Are they coming down as well?

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Think it would need more land than the 6 tower blocks are built on though. Looking at a map BP, excluding the car park, is about 130 yards wide (back of Findus to back of Main Stand). It's about 160 yards from the back of the Ponny to the back of the Osmond. So 130x160 on a cramped site. You'd need all of the plot where the 6 towers are and that includes the 6 low rise blocks on the west of the plot. Are they coming down as well?

I don't know how old the map is that you are looking at but if the low rise you refer to are Comber Place etc. they've been down for ages now..

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Think it would need more land than the 6 tower blocks are built on though. Looking at a map BP, excluding the car park, is about 130 yards wide (back of Findus to back of Main Stand). It's about 160 yards from the back of the Ponny to the back of the Osmond. So 130x160 on a cramped site. You'd need all of the plot where the 6 towers are and that includes the 6 low rise blocks on the west of the plot. Are they coming down as well?

On the plus side....even the dogs daren't hang around to shite around Freemo ;)

Between the Molson centre and Nelson house there are still houses

Quoted from barralad

I don't know how old the map is that you are looking at but if the low rise you refer to are Comber Place etc. they've been down for ages now..

Maps (Apple). I see on Google Maps they're not there.

What about the other low rise blocks between Albert St and Kent St?

Unfortunately I think we have missed the boat while chasing the dream of peakes parkway we have failed to capitalise on the opportunity to be part of the regeneration plans of East Marsh with the grants, euro money, and money from the government. Just my views of course

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Maps (Apple). I see on Google Maps they're not there.

What about the other low rise blocks between Albert St and Kent St?

Yeah still there and staying I think..

I grew up in and around Freemo and my dad used to work on the market when it was buzzing and still lives around there. I usually come into the Town on a Saturday over the flyover and drive into Town that way, what I see on Cleethorpe Rd, Freemo, Victor St. Elinor St etc.. makes me feel really sad.

If and it's a big if this happened and if and this is an even bigger "if" the club got it right this would be great for a touch part of the Town and the football club.

This kind of development could not only provide a football ground but also a community hub for sport and recreation throughout the week. If there was some real imagination you could include a health & education center, kids creche and a Youth club for kids to go to like Shalom and Clee Fields was when I was a kid.

A football club in a community attracting local people, fans and local players, if only!!!

I would love to see it as it would be great for the area and the club but doubt it will ever happen.

BTW if you doubt there is enough space I lived in UULL just as they where building the KFC in West Park and the Freeman S Area of Grimsby has more space than that development.

Like  say it's a pipe dread just like PP.

The stadium will never happen, it's been talked about for over quarter of a century now and not a single brick has been laid, when the stadium happens (if indeed it does) I predict all the posters on this forum would have already gone to meet their maker in the sky.

I think hand on heart GTFC will be relocated within 5 years from the end of the current Season.The history of trying to relocate is soul destroying particularly for John Fenty who has put more time and effort into the project than he should have had to and the lack of support from various Councils and Councillors nothing short of disgraceful. ADF of whom I have been a fierce critic said to me probably 8 years ago the most likely place GTFC will get a stadium is the East Marsh and he was of the opinion the full Council would back that. Great Coates and PP have had no Unity upon the Council and sadly they might be better for the Football Club but as ADF said the Council have to base the decision on present and future.It will happen and it will be the docks,flats,freemo area PP is still a good possibility but it must now be moving into outsider territory?

It won't happen on the docks.  That's ABP land and they've no current appetite to develop it as such, different argument for a different day but that's sad because the potential for that marina area is huge - even in it's current state it looks impressive.

Always favoured the Freeman Site area.  Far more beneficial to the local community as a whole than the Peaks Parkway project.  The area around the flats coming down is absolutely massive, more than big enough to host a football stadium and other infrastructure.

The talk I heard a few years back was that NELC were looking to consolidate all of it's buildings into a purpose built super-hub, probably financed by the sale of existing council owned buildings.  This super-hub would need to be somewhere central and on good transportation links, Riby Square end of Freeman Street ticks the boxes on that one.  However that area would simply be too big just for a council super-hub and there's not much desire for new homes in that part of the Town plus the chances of Debenhams coming in and deciding they want a new mega store there is slim to non-existent.  Can anyone think of another building project that would require good transportation links (both within the Town and from outside) and would be of a benefit to the community overall?

I suppose the issue with that idea is that we won't have the option of selling off land for houses?  I dunno, I'm not a developer but I know the location ticked far more boxes for my simple mind than anywhere else not to mention assist the regeneration of the East Marsh.

I also suspect, like mentioned previously in this post, that this ship has now sailed.

When they were looking at sites for relocation, they looked at Freeman Street without the flats and came to the conclusion that the site is not big enough.

It's in the final report.

They deemed the area available as 'uncertain'. Which basically means they didn't know/couldn't be bothered to find out. The regeneration of that end of Freeman Street wouldn't just be where the flats are, it would have to be and needs to be much bigger than that. Probably talking from everything north of Central Hall. Either the council are serious about regeneration of that area or they're not.

Whereas Peaks Parkway had 150 acres available, the exact amount required for the stadium, which unless I'm mistaken includes the extra acres for the housing.

The feasibility study is very poor and lazy in my opinion, example of such. Freeman Street identified as 1.2miles away from Train Station (let's forget the fact it's practically on a train-line and two actual stops) but graded as Average for train access. Peaks Parkway, 1.8 miles away is graded as Good train access.

Quoted from mimma

When they were looking at sites for relocation, they looked at Freeman Street without the flats and came to the conclusion that the site is not big enough.

It's in the final report.

Plenty big enough for a stadium but not for the enabling projects Mr Fenty is so keen on

Quoted from bluebottle

This was covered on the Burnsy programme on Friday. They where interviewing a freeman of Grimsby regarding the site involved. A stadium was mentioned and the gent being interviewed stated an approach had not been made, although if it was to recieve an enquiry it would be looked at. The main stumbling block would be the financing of the project.

It was said that houses in the PP area could be an enabling development for a stadium elsewhere.

Quoted from 1mickylyons

I think hand on heart GTFC will be relocated within 5 years from the end of the current Season.The history of trying to relocate is soul destroying particularly for John Fenty who has put more time and effort into the project than he should have had to and the lack of support from various Councils and Councillors nothing short of disgraceful. ADF of whom I have been a fierce critic said to me probably 8 years ago the most likely place GTFC will get a stadium is the East Marsh and he was of the opinion the full Council would back that. Great Coates and PP have had no Unity upon the Council and sadly they might be better for the Football Club but as ADF said the Council have to base the decision on present and future.It will happen and it will be the docks,flats,freemo area PP is still a good possibility but it must now be moving into outsider territory?

Have the club put years of man hours and tons wasted finance in to two sites that were always undeliverable?

Those at the club don't seem to be interested in any regeneration project at the heart of the Town. Why is this?

I find the whole stadium story a very sad one.

It's dragged on for decades now and I feel like we've been strung along by a succession of people in power who either don't have the foresight or energy to deliver something that could be truly inspirational to the town.

If there was a true appetite for a new stadium then it would've been built by now. The lack of one today speaks volumes about the indecision and inertia of our local council.

Having said that, I'd rather have no new stadium and remain at BP - even if it inhibits our potential in the short term - than move to a new stadium in completely the wrong end of town with no heart and soul.

You can't build a community around something if it's not in the heart of the community.

Quoted from RichMariner

I find the whole stadium story a very sad one.

It's dragged on for decades now and I feel like we've been strung along by a succession of people in power who either don't have the foresight or energy to deliver something that could be truly inspirational to the town.

If there was a true appetite for a new stadium then it would've been built by now. The lack of one today speaks volumes about the indecision and inertia of our local council.

Having said that, I'd rather have no new stadium and remain at BP - even if it inhibits our potential in the short term - than move to a new stadium in completely the wrong end of town with no heart and soul.

You can't build a community around something if it's not in the heart of the community.

Whilst you can't ignore the absolute fiasco around the original Great Coates stadium plans, there have been numerous variations of councils in the last 15 year with god knows how many Councillors coming and going. Same for those in administrative power within NELC. GTFC have had one man sit at the top of the table in that same period.

I'm not sure the council is the issue here, far from it.

Quoted from promotion plaice

On the plus side....even the dogs daren't hang around to shite around Freemo ;)

Have you seen the dogs around Freeman Street!

[img]https://i.imgur.com/0Uomvwo.jpg[/img]

Like people have already said Freemo would be a great area to have a ground from the fans point of view , the pubs and shops would be bouncing on match day but from a commercial pint of view I doubt they’d be able to make it work .
Nobody would want a house around that area and I doubt Franky and Bennys would want to have a restaurant round there with a few spice addicts roaming around outside

I'm all for the PP development if it should ever happen, but I'd love to see it down freemo where visiting fans can experience the Grimsby culture, would be worth building it there just for the reaction of the Stuck up Gimp fans who find the streets of Cleethorpes rough! Seriously though it would be great for the local community the cafe's and the pubs etc it would certainly bring the place to life on a match day.

If it can happen in any way, shape or form, it simply has to happen down Freemo. Great for transport links, in the heart of town, regeneration of the East Marsh, and potentially, a knock-on effect of regeneration of the docks. The thought of a soulless sardine can at PP depresses the hell out of me. All energy for this stadium needs to poured into Freemo before it's too late or it's categorically stated why it can't be there.

But we've already been through the selection process and PP was chosen. Nobody has said it isn't still happening there, so until then...

Maybe just maybe if JF departs in the summer Freemo could be back on the cards. Without a doubt the best option for all concerned if a way can be found to make it viable.

The longer this drags on, the more time it gives fans the chance to fall out of love with PP and in love with Freemo.

The trend of building football stadiums on the outskirts of towns is dead. I know people will have their own opinions, but mine is that a new stadium at PP will not be the all-singing, all-dancing community hub that this town wants and needs.

It needs to be at the heart of the town, physically. So much time has been spent on viability studies but has anyone actually asked where it should be?

I appreciate some sites we love might not be viable but in equal measure I think there are serious practicality issues over PP that will make this potential move a huge mistake.

Freemo needs to be explored further, for sure. It needs vision, passion, belief and - most of all - patience. Bags of it. If any new stadium isn't built here it'll be a monumental miss. It's not just the football club that depends on it - it's the town as a whole.

I can't think of many things other than sport that brings people of a town together as one. Its value is massively underestimated.

Freemo is definitely the place to for it in an ideal world. But no enabling development potential... I would absolutely love it there, I said as much when PP was first mentioned. As has been said it is well connected public transport wise, it would bring much-needed regeneration to the area and the economic benefit to local busness (rather than a massive intercourse-off Tesco or a load of sold-off residential properties with a Sizzler chan pub) would be substantial.

It should be a win-win for NE Lincs Council.

Worry that a Peakes Parkway stadium would end up like the Ricoh: shite away day unless you're planning on driving in and straight out again. I spent next to nothing in Coventry, time nor money wise as there was sod-all near the ground. The Tesco got a few quid mind.

i thought the local freemo councillor was quoted as directly opposing a stadium being built there - so doesnt sound like it would be welcome by the council? i thought a councillor of such an area would be falling over themselves to back such a huge development in their area but sums up our utterly dreadful local council for me. I think its been reviewed several times already hasnt it in the reports and it wasnt suitable, although i can see the appeal i fear it is PP or bust (in more ways than one).

Quoted from MarinerWY

Freemo is definitely the place to for it in an ideal world. But no enabling development potential ... I would absolutely love it there, I said as much when PP was first mentioned. As has been said it is well connected public transport wise, it would bring much-needed regeneration to the area and the economic benefit to local busness (rather than a massive intercourse-off Tesco or a load of sold-off residential properties with a Sizzler chan pub) would be substantial.

It should be a win-win for NE Lincs Council.

Worry that a Peakes Parkway stadium would end up like the Ricoh: shite away day unless you're planning on driving in and straight out again. I spent next to nothing in Coventry, time nor money wise as there was sod-all near the ground. The Tesco got a few quid mind.

I was led to believe the enabling development doesn't have to be on site, can be anywhere.

The notion of the enabling being adjacent to the ground has been smashed already by the developers when they went in search of additional sites. So if it doesn't have to be adjacent it means sites previously rejected as being too small can be reconsidered.

The next issue with the size off the site are the training pitches and any other sports facilities and whether they have to be adjacent (whether its necessary or merely desirable). I can see the argument for personally.

Having looked at the current size of BP and the size shape and plot of land freed up by the demolition of Freemo Flats I don't think there is enough room there unless the other low-rise flats still standing get demolished. You need more space than BP in order to provide adequate circulation space to meet modern standards. Personally I would love it to go there (if not the Docks) but I doubt there's space without much more demolition.

Anyway, has there been any news?

It would take great vision and ambition of course, but there is a huge potential site, roughly in a rectangle between Kent Street, Freeman St, Duncombe Street and Albion Street. Roughly 2.5-3 times the size of the BP site.

Some creative planning would probably be needed for parking, such as multi-story, which, with a park and ride scheme, would also be most welcome for the town centre on non-match days. Obviously there would be a fair number of compulsory purchase orders needed but there is a lot of open space already and the buildings on the east side of Freeman St are either run down or vacant and probably never likely to be filled again.

Quoted from immariner

It would take great vision and ambition of course, but there is a huge potential site, roughly in a rectangle between Kent Street, Freeman St, Duncombe Street and Albion Street. Roughly 2.5-3 times the size of the BP site.

Some creative planning would probably be needed for parking, such as multi-story, which, with a park and ride scheme, would also be most welcome for the town centre on non-match days. Obviously there would be a fair number of compulsory purchase orders needed but there is a lot of open space already and the buildings on the east side of Freeman St are either run down or vacant and probably never likely to be filled again.

Imagine what an extra 5 thousand people once a fortnight would do for businesses down Freemo.

On the Telegraph online today:

https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/grimsby-town-stadium-freeman-street-1463482

Quoted from Tommy

On the Telegraph online today:

https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/grimsby-town-stadium-freeman-street-1463482

Well there you go completely missed the boat if only we had concentrated on building a ground with the help of grants etc there would have been plenty of room but no someone wanted rents and income from the long list of companies that was flooding in to the project

Quoted from crusty ole pie

Well there you go completely missed the boat if only we had concentrated on building a ground with the help of grants etc there would have been plenty of room but no someone wanted rents and income from the long list of companies that was flooding in to the project

I suppose we can expect some improvement at Blundell Park now like the a coat of paint on the other stairwell

Quoted from crusty ole pie

I suppose we can expect some improvement at Blundell Park now like the a coat of paint on the other stairwell

If the other development do not have to be on the same site then why not just update Blundell Park ?

They could knock down one stand at a time fill in the corners and have a 15,000 seater stadium.

Park and ride could be arranged and there should not be all the hassle of getting planning permission somewhere where nobody wants a football ground.

Quoted from crusty ole pie

I suppose we can expect some improvement at Blundell Park now like the a coat of paint on the other stairwell

I thought there was something different to my visit to the toilets at the Pontoon end of the Upper Young’s !
I just thought the usual 40w light bulb had been exchanged for something brighter.

Just need someone to slap a preservation order on the oldest stand in the EFL ( the main stand) and that would scupper a few plans. Then again our Council never give a damn about our heritage.

Quoted from grimsby pete

If the other development do not have to be on the same site then why not just update Blundell Park ?

They could knock down one stand at a time fill in the corners and have a 15,000 seater stadium.

Park and ride could be arranged and there should not be all the hassle of getting planning permission somewhere where nobody wants a football ground.

I've mentioned this before, there is no guarantee that the council would give planning permission for any major developments at BP. Just because there is a ground there already is of no consequence especially if the plan is to increase the capacity of the stadium. The majority of people in the surrounding streets would object especially if they thought it was an opportunity to " get their streets back " on matchdays.
As regards a " park 'n' ride - from where ? If you mean from the A180 then what site would you use as a car park? In effect we do have a "park 'n' ride" in as much as there is loads of town centre parking and numerous buses run from town past BP. I'm not saying this is what I want, just playing Devils' Disciple if any plans come in front of the council. Posters will point out other clubs that have expanded grounds in housing areas but it is N E Lincs Council we are dealing with here and they have previous on getting most things completely wrong.

Quoted from rancido

I've mentioned this before, there is no guarantee that the council would give planning permission for any major developments at BP.

I'm fairly certain it has come up in the past, but the club are not allowed to increase the height of the stands. Hell, if they can stop us playing drums past 8pm, we aren't going to get far with rebuilding the stadium

I am certain that every house owner near the ground bought their house knowing there was a football club there,

We have had 31,000 and plenty of 20,000 + gates in the past,

So a 14/15,000 ground should not be a problem,

In fact it might even be an improvement for them.

Knock down the Findus and put a stand that reaches both corners but not as high,

BUT

There is somebody that are never happy.

If you do your homework into Extreme Leisure it looks very much as though they've never actually developed anything. Sheffield Council have awarded them a contract to develop the old Parkwood ski centre so we'll see what comes of that but the other big project in Ebbw Vale which predates PP has got precisely nowhere and there's nothing else either built, under way or in the pipeline. I've said before that they seem to be all mouth and no trousers much as I'd like to be proved wrong.
There's no doubt that there is a large plot of development land going to be created at Freeman Street when the flats are demolished and with the political will the site could be further enlarged from the current Albion/Garibaldi/Thesiger and Kent Street boundary to Freemo itself north of the market and to include the area of the maisonettes on the corner of Kent Street and Thesiger Street. That really is a significant area of land sufficient to build a stadium and some supporting development (fast food etc). Anyone can see that by looking on Google maps and comparing the size of BP ( which we know is a small site but shows that the footprint of the stadium itself is not a problem).
Just imagine for a minute how fantastic a new stadium at Freemo could be, it fits the spirit and the heritage of the club and its supporters perfectly - frankly done properly it would be the flipping envy of the out of town biscuit tins built in the name of progress. Grimsby Town FC a successful club at a modern stadium in the heart of it's historic community? Practically in the shadow of the Dock Tower. Huge swathes of the support could walk to games, the transport links are just obviously far better, the regeneration aspect would be incredible - I could go on.
And all of the above are the reasons that it'll never happen it would take vision and drive and will and cooperation all of which are in short supply round these parts. It'll take more than John Fenty with his eye on a housing development and a bunch of wannabe southern snowboarders to make it happen. Wasted opportunity if you ask me.

Quoted from grimsby pete

BUT

There is somebody that are never happy.

Gosh it is so easy to be critical when it doesn't affect you.

Quoted from Tommy

On the Telegraph online today:

https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/grimsby-town-stadium-freeman-street-1463482

That doesn’t suggest it can’t happen, it just suggests those at the club have no interest in it.

Quoted from headingly_mariner

That doesn’t suggest it can’t happen, it just suggests those at the club have no interest in it.

.....and it's not included in the Freemo redevelopment plans!

Just one point about the Telegraph article.

It states that there isn't the space for the stadium and training pitches. I thought that we already have training pitches in Waltham. Do we need to put them in the stadium site or are they including them to make Freeman Street a non starter?

Quoted from mimma

Just one point about the Telegraph article.

It states that there isn't the space for the stadium and training pitches. I thought that we already have training pitches in Waltham. Do we need to put them in the stadium site or are they including them to make Freeman Street a non starter?

I think it would be prudent if a new site was approved to have all the facilities in one place. Cheapside is barely fit for purpose anyway and, from what I hear, has been out of use for long spells due to the wet weather.

Quoted from grimsby pete

I am certain that every house owner near the ground bought their house knowing there was a football club there,

We have had 31,000 and plenty of 20,000 + gates in the past,

So a 14/15,000 ground should not be a problem,

In fact it might even be an improvement for them.

Knock down the Findus and put a stand that reaches both corners but not as high,

BUT

There is somebody that are never happy.

Like you said, in the past. Times have changed and more people travel to the match by car now. In the same token a lot of people will have bought houses knowing the ground was there but the traffic problem probably wasn't as bad then.

A non-league football club and a second tier rugby club get £3 million towards a new stadium from their local authority...

[url]https://cornwallreports.co.uk/by-69-votes-to-41-cornwall-council-gives-3-million-to-the-truro-stadium-project/#comments[/url]

Only 6k capacity but can be extended. Nice to have local authority support instead of blocking at every stage...

Quoted from Limerick Mariner

A non-league football club and a second tier rugby club get £3 million towards a new stadium from their local authority...

[url]https://cornwallreports.co.uk/by-69-votes-to-41-cornwall-council-gives-3-million-to-the-truro-stadium-project/#comments[/url]

Only 6k capacity but can be extended. Nice to have local authority support instead of blocking at every stage...

Was in Cornwall last week and went past the site - my colleague down there emphasised that it was a community project as opposed to a vanity project.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Was in Cornwall last week and went past the site - my colleague down there emphasised that it was a community project as opposed to a vanity project.

Funding like that is more likely to come if we really were a community club. [cough fan owned. cough Trust].

Quoted from realist

Gosh it is so easy to be critical when it doesn't affect you.

I was not pointing a finger at anybody just stating a fact.

I have an open field at the side of my bungalow which has plans for 200 houses,

Most in the area have objected but I have not,

People need to live somewhere. Half the village did not live here when we moved in I bet they were pleased we did not object then.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Was in Cornwall last week and went past the site - my colleague down there emphasised that it was a community project as opposed to a vanity project.

It is not a vanity project, only the nimbys would say that, it is more for rugby than football though - they are fanatical about it down there - if they got in the rugby prem I could see them getting 8-10k crowds like Exeter.

Quoted from Limerick Mariner

It is not a vanity project, only the nimbys would say that, it is more for rugby than football though - they are fanatical about it down there - if they got in the rugby prem I could see them getting 8-10k crowds like Exeter.

Cornwall's problem from the point of view of producing a good team in a national league (football or the other thing) is there's lots of small towns with their own clubs and identities but nothing big enough to generate the crowds and income to compete nationally.

The massive problem is our "new stadium" is dependent on Retail outlets........Err...... retail is on its knees due to online shopping from massive distribution warehouses like Amazon who can knock goods out at prices high street retailers just can't do.

Grimsby have one of the worse records for shop closures (FACT) even high-end retail shops like Smiths gone.

Quoted from grimsby pete

I was not pointing a finger at anybody just stating a fact.

I have an open field at the side of my bungalow which has plans for 200 houses,

Most in the area have objected but I have not,

People need to live somewhere. Half the village did not live here when we moved in I bet they were pleased we did not object then.

Like you say , you are in the minority when it came to objections.

Would you have the same attitude if it was a small business covering a large site with a large influx of visitors on 26 occasions throughout the year?
Or if there was a similar sized business already there when you moved there and it's impact on the surrounding areas had increased since you moved . If they wanted to increase their business by expanding to allow more " visitors " would you still not object.

Quoted from Mrs Doyle

The massive problem is our "new stadium" is dependent on Retail outlets........Err...... retail is on its knees due to online shopping from massive distribution warehouses like Amazon who can knock goods out at prices high street retailers just can't do.

Grimsby have one of the worse records for shop closures (FACT) even high-end retail shops like Smiths gone.

I think the shop closure figures will be heavily weighted by the ridiculous rent that Freshney Place want to charge. I believe it was well documented that WH Smiths were operating at a profit in Grimsby but weren't prepared to tolerate the rent-hike with no real justification for it.

The Great Coates fields are still empty. Just saying.

Quoted from oldun

The Great Coates fields are still empty. Just saying.

But they're not empty are they ? You just aren't looking closely.
They are absolutely teaming with greater crested, lesser spotted, extremely rare newts.

Apparently ;)

Quoted from oldun

The Great Coates fields are still empty. Just saying.

But Sutton Estates did not actually agree to sell the land , only that they might consider it.

Quoted from Civvy at last

But they're not empty are they ? You just aren't looking closely.
They are absolutely teaming with greater crested, lesser spotted, extremely rare newts.

Apparently ;)

Just the remains of them - that's what happens when a person with a beard goes out and scatters them all over a field the day before the Ecologist's inspection, they die a few days later...

When all's said and done, the club haven't come up with a convincing enough financial plan or framework to make the new stadium happen. It's coming up two years ago this summer from when the council invited a planning application at Peaks Parkway. Where is it?

I think the seemingly single minded approach to Peaks Parkway by the club hasn't helped. Even having a non-chairman who has a seat on the council, which should be a position of influence, seems to work against us. Between the council and the club there seems to be a distinct lack of imagination to create a project that benefits both parties. There's such a plethora of land dotted around central Grimsby that needs regenerating and both parties are missing the chance to present a joined up venture that could solve everything and bring the area into the 21st century. The football club will still need a new stadium in twenty years at this rate and the council's weak proposed plans to regenerate the Marshes with fluffy projects without substance will soon descend those areas into becoming sinkholes once again..

Quoted from Limerick Mariner

It is not a vanity project, only the nimbys would say that, it is more for rugby than football though - they are fanatical about it down there - if they got in the rugby prem I could see them getting 8-10k crowds like Exeter.

I didn't say it was - I was suggesting that ours was/is/will never be.

The problem in trying to get anything passed with this council is Fenty is disliked on there nearly as much as he is on here.

Quoted from Bigdog

When all's said and done, the club haven't come up with a convincing enough financial plan or framework to make the new stadium happen. It's coming up two years ago this summer from when the council invited a planning application at Peaks Parkway. Where is it?

I think the seemingly single minded approach to Peaks Parkway by the club hasn't helped. Even having a non-chairman who has a seat on the council, which should be a position of influence, seems to work against us. Between the council and the club there seems to be a distinct lack of imagination to create a project that benefits both parties. There's such a plethora of land dotted around central Grimsby that needs regenerating and both parties are missing the chance to present a joined up venture that could solve everything and bring the area into the 21st century. The football club will still need a new stadium in twenty years at this rate and the council's weak proposed plans to regenerate the Marshes with fluffy projects without substance, which once built, will soon descend those areas into being sinkholes once again..

The report commissioned by NELC called East Marsh After The Towers (google it) eloquently shows why the Freemo site isn't big enough. The club need 20 acres to produce a stadium with the add ons of training pitches etc. As far as I can see none of that 20 acres is for the enabling housing development which it has been widely accepted doesn't need to be in the vicinity of the stadium development. Perhaps more worrying from the council's point of view is that the report writers have found little interest from the private sector in being involved in redeveloping that part of town.

Quoted from barralad

The report commissioned by NELC called East Marsh After The Towers (google it) eloquently shows why the Freemo site isn't big enough. The club need 20 acres to produce a stadium with the add ons of training pitches etc. As far as I can see none of that 20 acres is for the enabling housing development which it has been widely accepted doesn't need to be in the vicinity of the stadium development. Perhaps more worrying from the council's point of view is that the report writers have found little interest from the private sector in being involved in redeveloping that part of town.

I'm not talking specifically about the Freemo area Barra. I'm looking at the area as a whole. And.. it's an insult to everyone's intelligence for the reports to suggest the training pitches need to be included in that particular site alongside the stadium anyway..

With a bit of joined up blue sky thinking there could be a great many sites dotted around the area that could be improved with a new stadium and enabling developments..

It could take longer and be more complicated but the reward would be long lasting solutions and benefits..

Quoted from grimsby pete

The problem in trying to get anything passed with this council is Fenty is disliked on there nearly as much as he is on here.

For the council to pass something an application has to be made first !!!!!!!!!!

We have fck all to offer, fck all to work with.

Quoted from grimsby pete

The problem in trying to get anything passed with this council is Fenty is disliked on there nearly as much as he is on here.

You may have a point but at the moment NELC is a hung council so it hasn't been beyond the realms of possibility that Labour and the Tories did a deal over this in exchange for other deals....it's the reality of having no-one in overall control. Much as I dislike Tories they have been behind Peaks Parkway from Day 1. You also have to remember that the council have already voted in favour of the site.
I'm no expert on house-building but I do know that the developers of the housing developments currently under construction i.e. the four off Humberston Avenue are having trouble selling them and a hold has been put on more development on those sites. It is a possibility that interested parties are looking at that and thinking twice about committing to the Parkway development but I must stress I'm only guessing.

Quoted from Bigdog

I'm not talking specifically about the Freemo area Barra. I'm looking at the area as a whole. And.. it's an insult to everyone's intelligence for the reports to suggest the training pitches need to be included in that particular site alongside the stadium anyway..

With a bit of joined up blue sky thinking there could be a great many sites dotted around the area that could be improved with a new stadium and enabling developments..

It could take longer and be more complicated but the reward would be long lasting solutions and benefits..

Oh I'm not really arguing with you. It is the report that says that the spec GTFC presented wanted to see the training pitches attached. I'm not "In the know" but maybe they see them as an income earner as part of the move to a seven day usage model. I kind of agree about the availability of other sites but there might be other concerns (business rates etc.) meaning a one site set up gives the best option. Surely someone on here can advise??

Quoted from barralad

You may have a point but at the moment NELC is a hung council so it hasn't been beyond the realms of possibility that Labour and the Tories did a deal over this in exchange for other deals....it's the reality of having no-one in overall control. Much as I dislike Tories they have been behind Peaks Parkway from Day 1. You also have to remember that the council have already voted in favour of the site.
I'm no expert on house-building but I do know that the developers of the housing developments currently under construction i.e. the four off Humberston Avenue are having trouble selling them and a hold has been put on more development on those sites. It is a possibility that interested parties are looking at that and thinking twice about committing to the Parkway development but I must stress I'm only guessing.

My first thought when the plans were announced were.. "Where are they going to find 5000 extra people that want to live in Grimsby?". Even if the houses were sold to people moving out of the central areas of town into the suburbs, what happens to the central areas? Certainly can't be knocked down for retail or leisure because the demand isn't there. There are a lot of problems that aren't easily solved, but trying to dovetail a new stadium into run down central Grimsby and scattering enabling developments around existing run down areas might have a chance of creating a final solution rather than maybe Peaks Parkway just shuffling the problems around..

Quoted from barralad

Oh I'm not really arguing with you. It is the report that says that the spec GTFC presented wanted to see the training pitches attached. I'm not "In the know" but maybe they see them as an income earner as part of the move to a seven day usage model. I kind of agree about the availability of other sites but there might be other concerns (business rates etc.) meaning a one site set up gives the best option. Surely someone on here can advise??

It stands to reason that having all facilities on one site makes sense logistically & financially but the real reason might be that Cheapside is a. barely fit for purpose, b. probably as developed as it's ever going to be and c. not exactly a glowing advert for prospective intake.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

It stands to reason that having all facilities on one site makes sense logistically & financially but the real reason might be that Cheapside is a. barely fit for purpose, b. probably as developed as it's ever going to be and c. not exactly a glowing advert for prospective intake.

And...mark this...I agree with you 100% ;D

Quoted from Bigdog

My first thought when the plans were announced were.. "Where are they going to find 5000 extra people that want to live in Grimsby?". Even if the houses were sold to people moving out of the central areas of town into the suburbs, what happens to the central areas? Certainly can't be knocked down for retail or leisure because the demand isn't there. There are a lot of problems that aren't easily solved, but trying to dovetail a new stadium into run down central Grimsby and scattering enabling developments around existing run down areas might have a chance of creating a final solution rather than maybe Peaks Parkway just shuffling the problems around..

I might have misread the report but I thought it also said there is a surplus of privately rented accommodation across the area meaning rent returns are depressed meaning in turn developers of rental developments are reticent about committing!

Quoted from grimsby pete

The problem in trying to get anything passed with this council is Fenty is disliked on there nearly as much as he is on here.

You may be right. If you cannot deal effectively with people - fans, media, the Trust - then you would imagine it would also be difficult  with your peers and sometimes betters at the council. It is perhaps irritating to Mr. Fenty that he is only one of elected representatives and has to go through due process with people who have more say.

I sometimes muse how the council would react to other people putting forward the proposals for a GTFC stadium, with the community at the heart of it (not just in the title)  and I guess the way things are going we will get to know in the years ahead...

This may have been mentioned before but why cannot the stadium be the centre piece of a Freemo redevelopment with the enabling developments (housing estates) on other sites?

In any event for many years I have been in favour of a new stadium for all the obvious reasons, but I now hope it doesn't happen till Mr. Fenty has left GTFC altogether so that we have a new start in more ways than one, and can all get behind a real vision for a new stadium with the community at its heart, and includes the heritage of the club and Grimsby as its main theme.

Quoted from Bigdog

When all's said and done, the club haven't come up with a convincing enough financial plan or framework to make the new stadium happen. It's coming up two years ago this summer from when the council invited a planning application at Peaks Parkway. Where is it?

I think the seemingly single minded approach to Peaks Parkway by the club hasn't helped. Even having a non-chairman who has a seat on the council, which should be a position of influence, seems to work against us. Between the council and the club there seems to be a distinct lack of imagination to create a project that benefits both parties. There's such a plethora of land dotted around central Grimsby that needs regenerating and both parties are missing the chance to present a joined up venture that could solve everything and bring the area into the 21st century. The football club will still need a new stadium in twenty years at this rate and the council's weak proposed plans to regenerate the Marshes with fluffy projects without substance will soon descend those areas into being sinkholes once again..

Years ago I asked on here what the cost of the new stadium would be, what the expected revenue for BP would be, what the capital funding gap was, what the relative operating costs of BP and PP would be and what the expected non-football income from PP would be. And how much was needed from enabling development (and what the likelihood of that was). In other words what the business case was. It was bloody obvious there was a big gap. I always doubted that enough of a subsidy would be forthcoming from enabling development. The club must have either known that and just hoped that a white knight would ride into town, or the club had no idea what the numbers where. It's wasted years of time on this, after the money down the drain on Great Coates. It's raised hopes when there really was little hope. You can add to the funding gap a credibility gap.

Look at the plots of land Hull, Rotherham and Chesterfield have built their stadiums on. Not huge. Genuine question, why are our perceived needs different to theirs?

Must say freemo seems to make more sense than PP...... if it takes longer for it to happen then I'm still all for it.

Having said that I'm not against PP if that's the only option.

Quoted from Limerick Mariner

It is not a vanity project, only the nimbys would say that, it is more for rugby than football though - they are fanatical about it down there - if they got in the rugby prem I could see them getting 8-10k crowds like Exeter.

And there's one team that have got it spot on imho great set up

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Park

Quoted from immariner

Look at the plots of land Hull, Rotherham and Chesterfield have built their stadiums on. Not huge. Genuine question, why are our perceived needs different to theirs?

I've not been to Rotherham or Chesterfield's new grounds but I'll wager Hull's site is larger than 20 acres.

Quoted from barralad

I've not been to Rotherham or Chesterfield's new grounds but I'll wager Hull's site is larger than 20 acres.

KC Stadium 34.2 acres

Rotherham's training facility measures 14 acres without including the stadium

Quoted from barralad

I've not been to Rotherham or Chesterfield's new grounds but I'll wager Hull's site is larger than 20 acres.

Sutprised by that, from roadside and Google maps, did not appear that large. Happy to be proved wrong.

Quoted from Bigdog

KC Stadium 34.2 acres

Rotherham's training facility measures 14 acres without including the stadium

Rotherham's training ground is away from the stadium isn't it?

Quoted from immariner

Rotherham's training ground is away from the stadium isn't it?

Yes, as are most clubs in the League..

Quoted from barralad

I've not been to Rotherham or Chesterfield's new grounds but I'll wager Hull's site is larger than 20 acres.

The new ground site I find most baffling is Brentford's. Griffin Park, famous for having a pub on each corner holds nearly 13,000. The club are moving to a 7.6 acre site at Lionel Road. The initial capacity was going to be over 20,000 but has now been reduced to 17,500, with no possible expansion I'd presume. Brentford could well be a Premier League club soon. We all know finding land for a new stadium in London is hard but I cannot understand how the owner or supporters can be excited by such a move.
Moving from a ground that has been your club's home for a century is necessary if the new stadium will give a much higher capacity and income. The Bees are shifting for an increase of under 5,000. If I was a Brentford supporter I think I'd be very disappointed. They're going to have a rugby team sharing the new stadium too, which although being another source of income can bring problems with the pitch of course.

Quoted from immariner

Look at the plots of land Hull, Rotherham and Chesterfield have built their stadiums on. Not huge. Genuine question, why are our perceived needs different to theirs?

Probably backed by council funding and also the clubs own money in the first place......the club need to generate the money to actually build a ground as we have none of our own, hence why an enabling development is needed...hence why the club are saying that they need all the space and no coincidence that PP is towards arguably a more attractive area of town to attract housing developers who will get more £££ per house = more profit = greater incentive.

It all comes back to us not having the money to independently build our our ground, otherwise we could easily have been sat watching footy in a new stadium years ago.

Quoted from moosey_club

Probably backed by council funding and also the clubs own money in the first place......the club need to generate the money to actually build a ground as we have none of our own, hence why an enabling development is needed...hence why the club are saying that they need all the space and no coincidence that PP is towards arguably a more attractive area of town to attract housing developers who will get more £££ per house = more profit = greater incentive.

It all comes back to us not having the money to independently build our our ground, otherwise we could easily have been sat watching footy in a new stadium years ago.

Alas all true. It's going back a bit now but I THINK that the K.C. was part of the funding Hull City council provided out of the windfall they got from selling off their city owned telephone network.