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Posted by: Hagrid, September 9, 2014, 9:51pm
Deserved a point but ultimately give away 2 penos chances are you gonna lose, i dont understand the formation change, but hey ho it was done but we looked better second half, third goal imo was a foul on macca, and the ref lost it in the last 10 mins, fair play to lincoln ( who normally i hate) they played well tonight, its a shame that we have lost but i dont believe we deserved too
Posted by: aldi_01, September 9, 2014, 9:59pm; Reply: 1
Sadly though, a horrible approach to football relying on just hurting the opponents and at one stage looked like they'd settled for a point at home want very entertaining.

The positive is, we know we've got far more to give. That was their all...
Posted by: immariner, September 9, 2014, 10:33pm; Reply: 2
They had the better of the first half, we dominated the second.

We defended poorly tonight, far too deep for the most part. The two tackles for their penalties were bad. Toto scares me on the ball.

John Lewis, John Lewis, John Lewis ahhhh. All round a half decent game but missed two fantastic chances. Neilson also and their keeper made a couple of great saves, as did Macca.

2-2 would have been a satisfactory score line.
Posted by: The Old Codger, September 9, 2014, 10:36pm; Reply: 3
Quoted from aldi_01
Sadly though, a horrible approach to football relying on just hurting the opponents and at one stage looked like they'd settled for a point at home want very entertaining.

The positive is, we know we've got far more to give. That was their all...


The negative is that they got three points and we got none.
Posted by: Theimperialcoroner, September 9, 2014, 10:39pm; Reply: 4
Second pen was never in a million years, didn't see if Macca was fouled, but by that point we should have been home and hosed. LJL that was awful despite another decent game, stupid not to sub Pearson before their pen too. Also what happened to the steward? Looked in a bad way
Posted by: misterx, September 9, 2014, 10:41pm; Reply: 5
Sums our season up they are now above us in the league table
Posted by: RoboCod, September 9, 2014, 10:48pm; Reply: 6
Just back, agree with the op. Glad it's over, never really enjoy these games, even when we win there's a niggly aspect to the games. It's about time red cards were brought in for challenges that are simply dangerous, never mind all this last man nonsense. The tackle on Neilson was disgraceful. The towel/long throw affairs were awful, my son in law is from Hereford and reasonably neutral but was surprised that the 3rd was given. It was nothing resembling football as we know it, indeed the ref gave a good long hard look at the pile of bodies left behind as they celebrated before deciding it was a goal. This guy surely has form now for Town, given the non-pen for Town and the 95th minute pen against in last years Macc game.
As for the game, we'd have won with a half decent left back in and Magnay, who was great, in at RB instead of Bignot. John Lewis did his usual easier-to-score-than-miss with a rubbish lob and faded badly for the final 30 mins. Doig was excellent when replacing Pearson. Macca going up for corners is beyond stupid, and has to stop. Everyone else did ok mostly, two fantastic goals but undone by an aerial ball for the first; so much for Pearson and Toto being unbeatable, a penalty (2nd from Mr England) and a Sunday League clogger-20 men in the box corner. And Town with no width almost throughout.
Not the end of the world and I know who'll be the happier set of fans come Xmas but worrying that we still can't get going for the first 15 minutes when a team come at us.
Should have been 2-2, could have been 4-2 either way. Hurst's team setup back in question again.
Posted by: Tom13, September 9, 2014, 10:54pm; Reply: 7
I'm absolutely convinced McKeown was fouled for their 3rd goal - he was going absolutely mad about it afterwards to Tomlinson and the ref. Another game where we didn't take as many chances as we should have and we've been hit by a sucker punch at the end.

Another game where I thought we missed Aswad, because not only does he provide an excellent attacking outlet on that side (as well as more balance to our attacks), him playing also means we can have Magnay at right back, who IMO is better than Bignot there.
Posted by: Stevie Saunders, September 9, 2014, 10:54pm; Reply: 8
Sloppy at the back and not ruthless in front of goal
Having praised Toto to the hilt thought he was shaky tonight
Both penalties were stupid - particularly the first (why do defenders fly in when the striker is running away from goal?)
Thankfully good set of results tonight means we haven't lost too much ground - proves that the league will be very open this season IMO

Roller coaster game and a draw would have been fair as we should have been 2-0 down

Stupid individual decisions and set pieces have cost us

Lenny - what can you say that hasn't been said; one on one and he can't even hit the target... it's that sort of ruthlessness which we need to develop quickly or it could cost us badly.

Pittman is excellent - creative and lively

Gutted but far from depressed


Posted by: Tom13, September 9, 2014, 10:56pm; Reply: 9
Oh and before LJL is crucified for that miss (which granted he should have scored) the linesman had his flag up anyway so it wouldn't have counted even if he had scored.
Posted by: Perkins, September 9, 2014, 11:05pm; Reply: 10
What's with this diamond formation? Completely overrun in midfield for the first thirty minutes. We were so slow coming out of the blocks, very hesitant. Disley the weak link for me despite scoring. Great goal from Pittman, and a great strike from Neilson that rebounded off the post straight to LJL who should have done better. Hesitancy by Bignot caused him to trip their man for a penalty, (It was straight in front of me). this whilst we were down to 10 men. Looked to me like Macca was impeded for their third. Hope Hurst learns from this and doesn't resort to the formation he started with again.
Posted by: Tom13, September 9, 2014, 11:08pm; Reply: 11
Quoted from Perkins
What's with this diamond formation? Completely overrun in midfield for the first thirty minutes. We were so slow coming out of the blocks, very hesitant. Disley the weak link for me despite scoring. Great goal from Pittman, and a great strike from Neilson that rebounded off the post straight to LJL who should have done better. Hesitancy by Bignot caused him to trip their man for a penalty, (It was straight in front of me). this whilst we were down to 10 men. Looked to me like Macca was impeded for their third. Hope Hurst learns from this and doesn't resort to the formation he started with again.


Neilson hit that rebound over didn't he?
Posted by: Perkins, September 9, 2014, 11:16pm; Reply: 12
Quoted from Tom13


Neilson hit that rebound over didn't he?

Your quite right he did.
Posted by: headingly_mariner, September 9, 2014, 11:19pm; Reply: 13
Quoted from Tom13


Neilson hit that rebound over didn't he?


Indeed he did, had he taken a touch he could have rolled it in.
Thought we were alright tonight and if Toto sticks his header away we win the game. The LJL criticism is way off the mark, he did really well in leading the line and put pitman through for his goal, the partnership between LJL, Pittman and neilson should not be tampered with.
Posted by: Stew0_0, September 9, 2014, 11:31pm; Reply: 14
We lost tonights game due to bad defending. Free header for first, Needless pen for second and we were bullied from a corner for the third. Thought Toto had an off day and Bignot is by far the weak link in defence. The sooner Aswad comes back the better then Magnay can move over. Why not give Paul Walker a run out there. On a positive side, again the LJL, Pittman and Neilsen combo look really threatening going forward although I think the formation was wrong tonight. We should have had Pittman up top with LJL and Neilsen on the right but with a bit of license to have a free role.

MOM - Carl Magnay
Overall 2-2 should have been the right result but we move on to Saturday
Posted by: Garth, September 9, 2014, 11:31pm; Reply: 15
Quoted from Perkins
What's with this diamond formation? Completely overrun in midfield for the first thirty minutes. We were so slow coming out of the blocks, very hesitant. Disley the weak link for me despite scoring. Great goal from Pittman, and a great strike from Neilson that rebounded off the post straight to LJL who should have done better. Hesitancy by Bignot caused him to trip their man for a penalty, (It was straight in front of me). this whilst we were down to 10 men. Looked to me like Macca was impeded for their third. Hope Hurst learns from this and doesn't resort to the formation he started with again.


The reason why the midfield was not in the game was due to Lincoln using the long ball tactics to their forwards that sailed over our midfield heads, their manager had done is homework on us and bypassed our strong point, IMO we should have changed it to 442 after thirty minutes with Nielson out lefi and Mackreth (sp) out right and Pitman and LJL uo front, anyway bad day at the office and we go again Saturday
Posted by: timmo, September 9, 2014, 11:39pm; Reply: 16
Well where do we start?

Defence shaky.
Midfield lacked bite or passion, Disley killed what we've built so far. IMO he is a last 10 min regroup player this season.
Attack poor. Scotty tried too much rather pass simple.

LJL - can someone explain what he brings to the team? I cant see it. IMO the worst forward we've had at the club.

Macca looked worried tonight, for their 2nd pen (stone wall) he should have cleaned everyone out and took the ball however Bignot (worst player on the pitch) should have put it over the stand.

Timmo
UTM
Posted by: Mariner Ronnie, September 9, 2014, 11:40pm; Reply: 17
Well balanced views on the just back thread, think we can all honestly say 2-2 would have been fair.

Was listening the humberside on the way home, and I can't help but think that the scapegoating critism aimed at John Lewis needs to stop, it can't be doing any favours at all.

Also fantastic turn out from us (1800) like to see if Lincoln will even match half of that at BP, shame that some people need to grow up!
Posted by: Lincoln Mariner 56, September 9, 2014, 11:48pm; Reply: 18
Just in from the pub and all in all I enjoyed the game but not the result. It was best game v Lincoln for many a season competitive, goal action at both ends, strong tackles and five goals. Once it was two two I thought we should have made a tactical change putting Pitman down the middle and bringing on Hannah to run behind their back four.

Dont agree with comment on LJL thought he struggled to win headers, his hold up play, particularly on the ground, was eratic and he failed to find the net when well placed on a couple of occasions. I thought tonight might suit him but IMO not his best night and the failure to make tactical changes was again apparent and something PH needs to address.

But despite the urine take in the local afterwards a good derby,
Posted by: barralad, September 9, 2014, 11:53pm; Reply: 19
Although we had much the better of the second half we didn't really cope with their aerial bombardment all night. It is difficult when facing six players who are all above 6 feet but thought Macca looked particularly hesitant, flapping at balls into the box. Bignot has got a lot of stick for the second penalty but in his defence I thought he called Macca who didn't come.
I don't get the criticism of Toto who looks so composed on the ball and has some real body strength.
It's hard to be too critical but especially in the first half I thought some of our play was on the over elaborate side and it hardly ever came off (Neilson the worst culprit)
Pittman's goal was unstoppable..
Disley's finish for the first was excellent and required considerable technique given the height and speed of the ball when it came to him.
I cannot find it in me to criticise Lincoln's tactics. They have played that way ever since we regularly started to play them again so it should NEVER come as a surprise.
Pearson's injury looks baddish. Wouldn't expect him to figure on Saturday.
Finally a word about the shenanigans in the corner. Lincoln had imposed a fan free zone on their fans in the corner nearest the Town fans. At the very least anyone who ran the thirty or so yards needed to get in a good bait should have been ejected. If that had happened then the steward (From Town) might not have ended up being stretchered out of the ground. I have no idea where the police were when this was going on and can only hope the ubiquitous "CCTV" will be used to find those responsible. Town should think very carefully before putting volunteers at such risk again.
Posted by: barralad, September 9, 2014, 11:55pm; Reply: 20
Quoted from timmo
Well where do we start?

Defence shaky.
Midfield lacked bite or passion, Disley killed what we've built so far. IMO he is a last 10 min regroup player this season.
Attack poor. Scotty tried too much rather pass simple.

LJL - can someone explain what he brings to the team? I cant see it. IMO the worst forward we've had at the club.

Macca looked worried tonight, for their 2nd pen (stone wall) he should have cleaned everyone out and took the ball however Bignot (worst player on the pitch) should have put it over the stand.

Timmo
UTM


We'd better rub out his goal then eh?
Posted by: Tommy, September 9, 2014, 11:55pm; Reply: 21
Massively frustrating to lose a game we shouldn't have lost. And I always hate to lose to a team that play in a thuggish style and turn the game into a game of set pieces.

First half they came out strong and put pressure on us. They worked a few attacks down their flanks where their full backs had all the time in the world with out lack of wingers closing them down. When we were in possession we were closed down quickly and often before a passing option became available, resulting in us giving the ball away cheaply far too often.

We got back in it with Disley's goal and I was happy with that at half time, thinking we wouldn't be as poor as that in the second half.

And we wasn't. Lincoln seemed to either tire or stop closing us down so quickly and we quickly settled into a few spells of possession, immediately looking more composed on the ball.

The second half was dominated by us really, until a spell near the end when the constant long stoppages every time they wanted to take a long throw or throw a longball set-piece into the box.

Apart from their penalty miss, I can't remember them missing many, if any, chances. I remember McKeown making a good save 1st half and then one from a low free kick that I'd expect him to save. But nothing else.

On the other hand we had LJL's lob over the keeper that he should really have scored. Nielson's cracking shot that cannoned back off the post and then the simpler task of putting the rebound in that he fluffed. Toto had a good header saved too Pittman, Nielson and LJL looked dangerous going forward.

Bignot taking a lot of stick. He didn't deal with the situation for the 2nd penalty very well at all but he did get in the way of a Lincoln player having a 2yard tap in 5 minutes after that. Unfortunately, defensively, he isn't at the level of the other 3 of the back 4 and I'll be happy when we've got Thomas back and shift Magnay over to right back. Magnay was excellent tonight in a system that leaves full backs exposed and often with few options on the ball.

Seen a lot of criticism for LJL and a lot of messages on radio saying he cost us and he's to blame blah blah blah. Him and Pittman worked well and LJL only missed the one chance with that lob. Many saying Hannah should have came on earlier but I'd struggle to choose who should've made way for him.

I can see why Hurst picked Disley today. Maybe not everyone agrees, and I don't think I'd have changed Paddy for him personally.  But there was logic behind it and it's not a decision to batter him for. Disley's good in the air and against a team that put the ball in the air a lot, his spring and timing of jumps helped us in there. And his recent record of scoring at Sincil Bank continued.

The biggest mistake Hurst made, IMO, was not sending Doig on as soon as Pearson came off the pitch. You could see from Pearson hobbling off barely able to stand that he wouldn't be able to carry on. And that cost us their 2nd goal with Bignot covering centre-half.

All in all, drunk off we lost but not worried because we looked dangerous going forward and could've had 4 on another day. And the effort was there from our boys, it wasn't for a lack of trying. Onwards and upwards.
Posted by: TAGG, September 10, 2014, 12:05am; Reply: 22
Quoted from Perkins
What's with this diamond formation? Completely overrun in midfield for the first thirty minutes. We were so slow coming out of the blocks, very hesitant. Disley the weak link for me despite scoring. Great goal from Pittman, and a great strike from Neilson that rebounded off the post straight to LJL who should have done better. Hesitancy by Bignot caused him to trip their man for a penalty, (It was straight in front of me). this whilst we were down to 10 men. Looked to me like Macca was impeded for their third. Hope Hurst learns from this and doesn't resort to the formation he started with again.


Agree

Disappointing game.
Lincoln should have been out of sight in the first half, we were very lucky to go in at half time level.
We were better in the second half but credit to Lincoln for keeping going at it too the end.
Why does Hurst have to tinker with the formation game after game? Why does he seem to worry how the opposition will play rather than concentrate on our game?
  
No chance of promotion with him in charge.
Posted by: timmo, September 10, 2014, 12:08am; Reply: 23
Quoted from barralad


We'd better rub out his goal then eh?



Right place right time, anyone could have been there.

what else did he do?


Timmo
UTM
Posted by: barralad, September 10, 2014, 12:12am; Reply: 24
Quoted from timmo



Right place right time, anyone could have been there.

what else did he do?


Timmo
UTM


Won quite a few headers and got stuck in. Isn't being in the right place at the right time what it is all about? Given some Town players record in front of goal I'd dispute the "anyone" bit....
Posted by: barralad, September 10, 2014, 12:15am; Reply: 25
Quoted from TAGG


Agree

Disappointing game.
Lincoln should have been out of sight in the first half, we were very lucky to go in at half time level.
We were better in the second half but credit to Lincoln for keeping going at it too the end.
Why does Hurst have to tinker with the formation game after game? Why does he seem to worry how the opposition will play rather than concentrate on our game?
  
No chance of promotion with him in charge.


I can see some of where you are coming from but Lincoln offer a different proposition to most of the teams we play with their aerial bombardment which surely merits some consideration. Disley offers more defensively than Paddy
Posted by: timmo, September 10, 2014, 12:16am; Reply: 26
Quoted from barralad


Won quite a few headers and got stuck in. Isn't being in the right place at the right time what it is all about? Given some Town players record in front of goal I'd dispute the "anyone" bit....


Agreed, however we have built a great understanding between the midfield 3 then change it for no apparent reason (not heard any reason apologies if PH explained) 'don't fix what isn't broken'

I thought at 1st Dis experience and calmness however for me it was wrong.

Timmo
UTM
Posted by: barralad, September 10, 2014, 12:17am; Reply: 27
Quoted from timmo


Agreed, however we have built a great understanding between the midfield 3 then change it for no apparent reason (not heard any reason apologies if PH explained) 'don't fix what isn't broken'

I thought at 1st Dis experience and calmness however for me it was wrong.

Timmo
UTM


Fair dos....
Posted by: chicaneuk, September 10, 2014, 12:31am; Reply: 28
A disappointing evening though I really felt we had put up enough of a fight to deserve to walk away with a point. To take nothing from that was pretty un-just.

I guess there were positives to take from it. We know Lincoln are a better team this year and for the last 10-15 mins of the first half and for the majority of the second were in control and looked good. Some great play from key players, and I really am starting to like Magnay as someone who's extremely composed and confident. Neilson was great too - has a real flourish that I think makes him look like a player from a higher league.

But as others have said, you concede two penalties in a game, you're asking for trouble. Certainly the second penalty, conceded by Bignot - pretty much everyone around me didn't protest it and all said they felt it was pretty clear cut. And credit to Lincoln, I think they did have some good spells in the game and seemed like more than a handful on quite a few occasions so I simply can't say that it was just down to us having an off night - they did play pretty well.

I guess one positive was that walking away from the ground afterwards, I heard several different snippets of conversation from Lincoln fans - one lot said something about Grimsby playing really well, and another defending us against a group of their mates saying that they thought our second goal was exceptional.

I think there was some sloppiness - some bad passing, and a real lack of anything decent in midfield - but there were a lot of positives to take away from tonight.
Posted by: pontoonlew, September 10, 2014, 12:38am; Reply: 29
I just wish sometimes Hurst would play to our strengths and not counter the opposition. Tonight looked like we set up to counter their strength, why not set up to exploit their weaknesses instead?!
Posted by: 120797 (Guest), September 10, 2014, 12:45am; Reply: 30
Quoted from RoboCod
As for the game, we'd have won with a half decent left back in and Magnay, who was great, in at RB instead of Bignot.

Sounded like Bignot did generally ok otherwise ?
Not much Hurst could have done about right back anyway.
Walker ? Toto ? No no !

Had he gone 3-5-2 addressing the aerial bombardment (e.g. bringing in Doig), sure some would still say he's tinkering for the sake of it.
Not saying he got it spot on tonight but the bloke just can't win whatever he does...  :-/

Quoted from Perkins
What's with this diamond formation? Completely overrun in midfield for the first thirty minutes. We were so slow coming out of the blocks, very hesitant. Disley the weak link for me despite scoring.

Do you mean in the diamond ?
Must admit, I think he's always better pushed forward.
Especially when we've got Clay there to tackle.
Posted by: grimps, September 10, 2014, 12:47am; Reply: 31
Quoted from barralad


Disley offers more defensively than Paddy


So how come we let 3 goals in then ?
Posted by: 120797 (Guest), September 10, 2014, 1:09am; Reply: 32
intercourse sake !

Lack of marking, Bignot foul (Pearson off), set piece !

But yeah, it's all Disley's fault.
Obviously Paddy would have been the saviour with his defensive qualities.   ::)

Please just stop it.  :o
Posted by: Maringer, September 10, 2014, 6:56am; Reply: 33
Disley is very good in the air so an understandable change though Paddy has otherwise been playing well. Clay is tallish so needed to be in the team, Brown indispensible (though I guess this wasn't his type of game) so this is why Paddy would have been dropped from midfield. We're not the biggest of teams at the moment and it sounds as though we struggled against the aerial bombardment. Just a pity that we cracked under the pressure to concede the goals.

BBC stats indicate that we had more shots and more shots on target than Lincoln so we obviously did OK attacking-wise. Just not good enough in defence.

Disappointing that we don't seem to be grinding results out at the moment. As I said after the Aldershot game, we need to be turning these narrow defeats into draws and the draws into wins.

Hopefully, Pearson won't be out too long but, if he is, we'll need to dip into the loan market, I'd have thought. We could also do with another striker on the books as well.

Edit:  Just listened to the post-match interview and I'm slightly concerned about Pearson's injury. If it's a knee problem, could take some time for him to recover. Fingers-crossed it's nothing too bad.
Posted by: RoboCod, September 10, 2014, 8:03am; Reply: 34
Quoted from 120797

Sounded like Bignot did generally ok otherwise ?




Not really, a yard off the pace until a little reshuffle for the 2nd half when he at least got tighter. Curiously he seemed better after a bang on the head and bandage.
Posted by: arryarryarry, September 10, 2014, 8:14am; Reply: 35
Quoted from Tom13
Oh and before LJL is crucified for that miss (which granted he should have scored) the linesman had his flag up anyway so it wouldn't have counted even if he had scored.



No he didn't, he gave a goal kick.

Posted by: arryarryarry, September 10, 2014, 8:19am; Reply: 36
Quoted from Tommy
Massively frustrating to lose a game we shouldn't have lost. And I always hate to lose to a team that play in a thuggish style and turn the game into a game of set pieces.

First half they came out strong and put pressure on us. They worked a few attacks down their flanks where their full backs had all the time in the world with out lack of wingers closing them down. When we were in possession we were closed down quickly and often before a passing option became available, resulting in us giving the ball away cheaply far too often.

We got back in it with Disley's goal and I was happy with that at half time, thinking we wouldn't be as poor as that in the second half.

And we wasn't. Lincoln seemed to either tire or stop closing us down so quickly and we quickly settled into a few spells of possession, immediately looking more composed on the ball.

The second half was dominated by us really, until a spell near the end when the constant long stoppages every time they wanted to take a long throw or throw a longball set-piece into the box.

Apart from their penalty miss, I can't remember them missing many, if any, chances. I remember McKeown making a good save 1st half and then one from a low free kick that I'd expect him to save. But nothing else.

On the other hand we had LJL's lob over the keeper that he should really have scored. Nielson's cracking shot that cannoned back off the post and then the simpler task of putting the rebound in that he fluffed. Toto had a good header saved too Pittman, Nielson and LJL looked dangerous going forward.

Bignot taking a lot of stick. He didn't deal with the situation for the 2nd penalty very well at all but he did get in the way of a Lincoln player having a 2yard tap in 5 minutes after that. Unfortunately, defensively, he isn't at the level of the other 3 of the back 4 and I'll be happy when we've got Thomas back and shift Magnay over to right back. Magnay was excellent tonight in a system that leaves full backs exposed and often with few options on the ball.

Seen a lot of criticism for LJL and a lot of messages on radio saying he cost us and he's to blame blah blah blah. Him and Pittman worked well and LJL only missed the one chance with that lob. Many saying Hannah should have came on earlier but I'd struggle to choose who should've made way for him.

I can see why Hurst picked Disley today. Maybe not everyone agrees, and I don't think I'd have changed Paddy for him personally.  But there was logic behind it and it's not a decision to batter him for. Disley's good in the air and against a team that put the ball in the air a lot, his spring and timing of jumps helped us in there. And his recent record of scoring at Sincil Bank continued.

The biggest mistake Hurst made, IMO, was not sending Doig on as soon as Pearson came off the pitch. You could see from Pearson hobbling off barely able to stand that he wouldn't be able to carry on. And that cost us their 2nd goal with Bignot covering centre-half.

All in all, drunk off we lost but not worried because we looked dangerous going forward and could've had 4 on another day. And the effort was there from our boys, it wasn't for a lack of trying. Onwards and upwards.


No he didn't, he got into a good position in the first half, took a swing and completely missed the ball, he then had a great chance early in the second half when put through and put it well wide of the goal before he missed that lob.

Posted by: bradzmilne, September 10, 2014, 8:32am; Reply: 37
A defeat again the gimps is going to hurt, only natural. But when you get past local pride and all of that, its only 3 points.
We can't keep making stupid fouls, it will be our biggest downfall. That's now 2 games in my honest opinion we've ruined ourself by seeing players sent off or giving away penalties (almost 3 after Dover game!). There is only a very fine line between 'roughing' teams up and just giving away stupid, petty fouls.
When it comes down to it, we've beat the gimps at Sincil Bank the last 3 years and not won promotion... Its not a game that makes or breaks our season.
Lets dust ourselves off and get going again on Saturday.
UTM
Posted by: barralad, September 10, 2014, 8:59am; Reply: 38
Quoted from grimps


So how come we let 3 goals in then ?


80's got there before me....I assure you I can offer no further explanation...

Whilst we are on the subject of defenders last night showed what a huge miss Boyce is.
Posted by: barralad, September 10, 2014, 9:00am; Reply: 39
Quoted from arryarryarry



No he didn't, he gave a goal kick.



If you want to be pedantic about it the ref. acknowledged the linesman's flag....
Posted by: arryarryarry, September 10, 2014, 9:24am; Reply: 40
Quoted from barralad


If you want to be pedantic about it the ref. acknowledged the linesman's flag....



Not being pedantic about anything, as LJL ran through the linesman clearly kept his flag down as I was sat right in line and when he missed he pointed for a goal kick.

If the linesman had flagged for off-side then the ref would have given it.
Posted by: highcliff mariner, September 10, 2014, 9:37am; Reply: 41
Having slept on it , i agree with the OP , game could have gone either way , thought there could of been 2 straight reds for some really fierce dangerous tackles (suprised to see neilson stay on the pitch from the one on the halfway line .They had more desire than we did and thats what won them the game (not pretty tho). Macca ? his faliure to command his box is the reason (for me) that he hasnt moved up the divisions ,great shot stopper though, Bignot had an off day, lenny missed his usual quota , Disley was pedestrian , and after all that the result could still have gone either way.I also agreee with the posters with regards to Hurst worrying  about ,and adjusting the side in reaction to what the oppositions supposed strengths are.

Oh and LCFC's Idea of crowd control/segregation is pap, but well done to the Gimps for some great backing for their side.
Posted by: maxfox44, September 10, 2014, 9:47am; Reply: 42
Now that I have slept on it.  I very annoyed that our manager insists on setting up the team to counter the opposition.  We should have had enough big lads to deal with usual aerial stuff.  You can see why Macca is a non-league keeper, just isn't commanding enough, but he will play well more times than he struggles.
I personally wouldn't have played Disley, as he slows the play down too much and likes a backward safe pass at times.  But having said that his goals are valuable.  I'm afraid Bignot is not good enough and seems to have certain basic defending errors, like letting the ball bounce, marking too close or clearing the ball across the goal.  But I do agree that our options were limited and not getting a loan left back looks a bad decision in hindsight.  Also, Bignot doesn't offer too much going forward either.

If I were PH, I'd be building my team around a front pairing of Hannah and Pitman.  With Neilson and Brown providing the creativity for them.  LJL, provides what I call a false target man.  He works hard, gets a few balls and hold it up, but rarely does a lot with those moments.  His lack of goal scoring I don't see a problem, but he doesn't seem to offer too much else either.

I guess we'll find out about this team in the coming matches, starting on Saturday.

UTM
Posted by: arryarryarry, September 10, 2014, 9:52am; Reply: 43
Last two posts about spot on for me.
Posted by: TownSNAFU5, September 10, 2014, 9:59am; Reply: 44
The (clear) RH view was that we should have been well-beaten by HT.  This could have been for a number of reasons. A dominant second half just leaves too much to do.  This is also worrying for future games.

RH also called it right for when Doig should have come on sooner for Pearson. Why the delay when Pearson clearly could not continue?
Posted by: RoboCod, September 10, 2014, 10:04am; Reply: 45
Pearson's a battler, he clearly knows what these matches mean and after limping off he took some quick treatment and began jogging down the touchline, almost convinced us (and himself) that he'd run it off. As usual fate conspires and we concede.
Posted by: Maringer, September 10, 2014, 10:33am; Reply: 46
Quoted from TownSNAFU5
The (clear) RH view was that we should have been well-beaten by HT.  This could have been for a number of reasons. A dominant second half just leaves too much to do.


Hang on a minute. We were level at half-time, weren't we? A dominant second half would have been good enough if we'd defended better and Hurst seemed to think we should have scored a couple at the very least in his post-match interview.

Despite our height in the centre-half areas, we're not a particularly tall team in general so will tend to find it difficult against teams full of 6-footers such as Lincoln. Fundamentally, if you give away soft goals and don't take good chances you're going to be losing points against even long-ball teams.

Improve these two areas and the results will start to come in.
Posted by: AndyGTFC, September 10, 2014, 1:44pm; Reply: 47
Disappointing, a draw would've been a fair result but we move on. Think they're better than in recent years but they're still not anything special. We're usually reliable defensively but weren't last night and that cost us the game.

We were lucky to go in level at the break, they were up for it more than us and could've been 2 or 3 up but it was a great finish from Disley just before HT. In the second half, they didn't do too much other than their goals. Bignot gave away a really daft penalty and then we defended a corner really poorly for their winner.      

Also, a lot of people seem to have missed the linesman putting his flag up during LJL's lob. Wouldn't have counted anyway.
Posted by: moosey_club, September 10, 2014, 3:07pm; Reply: 48
Quoted from Maringer


Hang on a minute. We were level at half-time, weren't we? A dominant second half would have been good enough if we'd defended better and Hurst seemed to think we should have scored a couple at the very least in his post-match interview.

Despite our height in the centre-half areas, we're not a particularly tall team in general so will tend to find it difficult against teams full of 6-footers such as Lincoln. Fundamentally, if you give away soft goals and don't take good chances you're going to be losing points against even long-ball teams.

Improve these two areas and the results will start to come in.


The point is that you cant only turn up for 45 mins and expect to win matches, we dont have lethal strikers who gobble up every opportunity that comes their way so you need to maximise your chances of scoring (we did for 2 games over the bank holiday but otherwise..). The 2 or 3 good chances created for and missed by our strikers,who probably have a 1 in 8 success rate at best when it comes to shot/goal ratio, isnt high enough.
A wasted/substandard first 45 mins was typical of last season, plenty of 0-0 half times and that just doesnt maximise your chances.
Posted by: Maringer, September 10, 2014, 4:46pm; Reply: 49
Quoted from moosey_club


The point is that you cant only turn up for 45 mins and expect to win matches, we dont have lethal strikers who gobble up every opportunity that comes their way so you need to maximise your chances of scoring (we did for 2 games over the bank holiday but otherwise..). The 2 or 3 good chances created for and missed by our strikers,who probably have a 1 in 8 success rate at best when it comes to shot/goal ratio, isnt high enough.
A wasted/substandard first 45 mins was typical of last season, plenty of 0-0 half times and that just doesnt maximise your chances.


I think we must have slightly better than 1 in 8 success rate. We are, after all, top scorers in the division!

The one encouraging fact is that we've only lost the two games very narrowly - on a different day, we'd have had at least a point in those two games. As I've said in the past, we need to start getting (or stopping) that extra goal here and there to win the points that our play has generally deserved.

I don't think you can really complain too much about the partnership between Pittman and LJL as they've scored 6 goals in 5 games together so far (including Aldershot). By far the best partnership we've had for some time so hopefully they will continue to stay fit and play well together. If you add Neilson into the equation and consider them as a front 3, that's 10 goals between the 3 of them in 5 games which is excellent.

I don't disagree that you can't always get away with a really poor performance in one half, but it's by no means an unusual thing. In the first couple of Buckley eras, I remember many occasions where we were rubbish in the first half but were able to come out firing in the second (after an almighty bollocking, I expect!). Even the best teams have poor performances on occasion, but they have the knack of winning points when they do and we're just not quite there yet.
Posted by: Helgy, September 10, 2014, 6:06pm; Reply: 50
Thought we had the 1st half gave us too much room, could have been game over but for the penalty miss.
2nd half your manager clearly changed things pressed us more and denied us space.
Little midfielder impressed me went on a few runs seemed to skip round people with ease.
Thought is was a good derby atmosphere ,Bristol Rovers Saturday after that back to 29 away fans.
Posted by: cmackenzie4, September 10, 2014, 6:38pm; Reply: 51
That midfielder would be Brown, our best signing of the season for me!
Posted by: arryarryarry, September 10, 2014, 7:05pm; Reply: 52
Quoted from AndyGTFC
Disappointing, a draw would've been a fair result but we move on. Think they're better than in recent years but they're still not anything special. We're usually reliable defensively but weren't last night and that cost us the game.

We were lucky to go in level at the break, they were up for it more than us and could've been 2 or 3 up but it was a great finish from Disley just before HT. In the second half, they didn't do too much other than their goals. Bignot gave away a really daft penalty and then we defended a corner really poorly for their winner.      

Also, a lot of people seem to have missed the linesman putting his flag up during LJL's lob. Wouldn't have counted anyway.




Incorrect I'm afraid the linesman clearly signalled he was onside by running down the pitch with his flag clearly pointing to the floor, he then signalled a goal kick, as confirmed on the highlights.

Posted by: pontoonlew, September 10, 2014, 7:10pm; Reply: 53
Lob is being kind too, it was a flipping awful finish.
Posted by: ackomariner, September 10, 2014, 7:12pm; Reply: 54
Quoted from pontoonlew
Lob is being kind too, it was a flipping awful finish.


I'm saying nowt  ;)
Posted by: pontoonlew, September 10, 2014, 7:30pm; Reply: 55
Quoted from ackomariner


I'm saying nowt  ;)


I'd say the same thing if any player did that. Through on goal, sits up on the volley nicely for you and of all the things to do you decide that one is the best idea. That goes in, we win the game, fine margins.
Posted by: TownSNAFU5, September 10, 2014, 7:39pm; Reply: 56
The point about the first half was that we "should" have been behind by at least a couple of goals.  We were very fortunate to go in at 1-1.  RH thought that we should reasonably have been 4 goals down, which is stretching it a bit.

The wider issue is that a team who have lost their last 3 games were dominant.  If we play like that in future games in the first half then we are likely to be chasing a lost cause. What we did in the second half is not the point.  
Posted by: AndyGTFC, September 10, 2014, 7:52pm; Reply: 57
Quoted from arryarryarry


Incorrect I'm afraid the linesman clearly signalled he was onside by running down the pitch with his flag clearly pointing to the floor, he then signalled a goal kick, as confirmed on the highlights.



Ah, fair enough. I stand corrected. Was an awful finish then  ;D
Posted by: TAGG, September 10, 2014, 8:48pm; Reply: 58
Quoted from barralad


I can see some of where you are coming from but Lincoln offer a different proposition to most of the teams we play with their aerial bombardment which surely merits some consideration. Disley offers more defensively than Paddy


For "aerial bombardment" to me it would stand to reason to play two up front to put more pressure on there CBs so they cant bomb them over the top so much but no it seem like Hurst thinks it best to pack the midfield so they can all watch the ball flying over there heads all game.
Posted by: barralad, September 10, 2014, 10:36pm; Reply: 59
Quoted from pontoonlew
Lob is being kind too, it was a flipping awful finish.


It was worse than awful. I don't think he knew what he wanted to do with it. It just needed a cool head-Neilson or The Pope would have stuck it away without a problem.
Posted by: 120797 (Guest), September 11, 2014, 12:05am; Reply: 60
Quoted from barralad
or The Pope would have stuck it away without a problem.

You mean John Paul ?  :)
Posted by: mimma, September 11, 2014, 12:57am; Reply: 61
What I don't understand is we knew what was coming, big players, lots of crosses.

If you give a team like Lincoln time out wide to deliver crosses they will hurt you.

Answer is to stop them getting in good crosses from wide areas, make the rush, or pass it back.

Tall players are no good if they don't get good delivery.
Posted by: 120797 (Guest), September 11, 2014, 1:17am; Reply: 62
Great point !
What's the point running over if you're not gonna stop the ball coming in ?

Highlights make for uncomfortable viewing and Bignot, dear me...
Might be ok getting forward but wondering if we need a full back sooner rather than later.
Walker is very promising but not convinced he's the best defender at RB.
Posted by: chaos33, September 11, 2014, 6:20am; Reply: 63
Quoted from mimma
What I don't understand is we knew what was coming, big players, lots of crosses.

If you give a team like Lincoln time out wide to deliver crosses they will hurt you.

Answer is to stop them getting in good crosses from wide areas, make the rush, or pass it back.

Tall players are no good if they don't get good delivery.


Indeed. Said the same thing elsewhere.
Posted by: jamesgtfc, September 11, 2014, 8:00am; Reply: 64
Maybe McKeown should have come for the ball but as a defender Bignot should not have slowed down until the ball was won so he gets all the blame from me. Can't wait until Aswad is back so Magnay can play there.
Posted by: brad_gtfc, September 11, 2014, 8:35am; Reply: 65
Just watched the highlights, so heres my view.
1st goal Toto gets caught ball watching but the goalscorer seems to come from deep with no midfield player tracking him, poor goal to concede.
I'm a fan of LJL but his two one on one finishes are absolutely pathetic from a professional footballer.
Bignot has had a shocker for the penalty (that they scored) expecting Macca to come all that way and claim is ridiculous, get rid of it.
Superb finish from Pittman, we've got one hell of a player on our hands.

As for the rest of the performance, the formation and the managers decision I can't really comment.
Posted by: friskneymariner, September 11, 2014, 9:48am; Reply: 66
Sitting right behind where Bignot gave the penalty away,he was shielding the ball waiting for McKeown to come for it,it was when the Lincoln player got past him he brought him down.
Posted by: diehardmariner, September 11, 2014, 10:14am; Reply: 67
In terms of tactics/selections, I'm afraid Hurst got it wrong.   Yes he scored and yes he's our captain but Disley hasn't looked on song for the last 6-8 months.  The four of Brown, Clay, McLaughlin and Neilson have showed the tempo and intensity we need to succeed in this division, unfortunately Disley can't offer that at present.  By all means a good player for the squad and to bring on late to steady the ship but definitely not at the levels of the previously mentioned four other midfielders.

For me we lost it not when Pearson went off but when we took Clay off.  His work and graft in the middle is so under-rated.  As good as Brown is, he doesn't seem half as effective without Clay.  They seem to have developed a great understanding in there and work so well together.  

Can't argue with any of the very valid points made about giving them too much width.  Neilson naturally comes inside so I'm not sure there's a need to go with an actual diamond.  If anything when he's told to play central he's more restricted than when he floats in off the wing.  When cutting inside from the wing he drags players with him to upset the opposition balance.  When central it's easier to just put a holding midfielder on him.

Worst we've been at the back all season.  We missed Boyce, did on Saturday too.  Sooner we can arrange a loan return with permanent deal to follow the better for me.  As good as Toto and Pearson are, we're better with Boyce in the side.

Tactically we got it wrong, we were sloppy at the back and we missed great chances at the other end.  Overall we were pretty poor but form generally goes out the window in a derby fixture and it's often a battle of the wills.  Like it or not, Tuesday night Lincoln deserved the win as they wanted it more than us.
They won't keep that tempo up all season and we won't be so poor many times either.
Posted by: RoboCod, September 11, 2014, 11:31am; Reply: 68
Agree with that DH, though I think we were unlucky to lose. Yes they could have been out of sight at H/T after hitting the woodwork and missing a pen, but then the same could be said if Neilsons effort had gone inside the post as we were in total control for that period.
In the end it took a goal that most refs wouldn't have allowed to separate the teams. I don't think anyone would have complained at a 2-2 draw such was the amount of incidents and chances at either end.

And I'll avoid any future Town games with Mr D England in charge.
Posted by: chaos33, September 11, 2014, 2:00pm; Reply: 69
Quoted from diehardmariner
In terms of tactics/selections, I'm afraid Hurst got it wrong.   Yes he scored and yes he's our captain but Disley hasn't looked on song for the last 6-8 months.  The four of Brown, Clay, McLaughlin and Neilson have showed the tempo and intensity we need to succeed in this division, unfortunately Disley can't offer that at present.  By all means a good player for the squad and to bring on late to steady the ship but definitely not at the levels of the previously mentioned four other midfielders.

For me we lost it not when Pearson went off but when we took Clay off.  His work and graft in the middle is so under-rated.  As good as Brown is, he doesn't seem half as effective without Clay.  They seem to have developed a great understanding in there and work so well together.  

Can't argue with any of the very valid points made about giving them too much width.  Neilson naturally comes inside so I'm not sure there's a need to go with an actual diamond.  If anything when he's told to play central he's more restricted than when he floats in off the wing.  When cutting inside from the wing he drags players with him to upset the opposition balance.  When central it's easier to just put a holding midfielder on him.

Worst we've been at the back all season.  We missed Boyce, did on Saturday too.  Sooner we can arrange a loan return with permanent deal to follow the better for me.  As good as Toto and Pearson are, we're better with Boyce in the side.

Tactically we got it wrong, we were sloppy at the back and we missed great chances at the other end.  Overall we were pretty poor but form generally goes out the window in a derby fixture and it's often a battle of the wills.  Like it or not, Tuesday night Lincoln deserved the win as they wanted it more than us.
They won't keep that tempo up all season and we won't be so poor many times either.


Agree DHM.
Posted by: barralad, September 11, 2014, 10:32pm; Reply: 70
Quoted from diehardmariner
In terms of tactics/selections, I'm afraid Hurst got it wrong.   Yes he scored and yes he's our captain but Disley hasn't looked on song for the last 6-8 months.  The four of Brown, Clay, McLaughlin and Neilson have showed the tempo and intensity we need to succeed in this division, unfortunately Disley can't offer that at present.  By all means a good player for the squad and to bring on late to steady the ship but definitely not at the levels of the previously mentioned four other midfielders.

Worst we've been at the back all season.  We missed Boyce, did on Saturday too.  Sooner we can arrange a loan return with permanent deal to follow the better for me.  As good as Toto and Pearson are, we're better with Boyce in the side
.



Obviously I am not party to what was in Hurst's head when he picked the side-you may be entirely right. Personally I think Disley played to help counter the threat of their (SIX) players over six feet tall. Given that we gave away far too many throws, corners and free kicks in areas where they could "launch" the ball into the middle this appears to me to be a reasonable selection to make.
IMO your point about Boyce is excellent. I thought he would be a big "miss" when he went back-I didn't think it would be proven quite so quickly.
Posted by: mariner91, September 11, 2014, 10:49pm; Reply: 71
Quoted from barralad


Obviously I am not party to what was in Hurst's head when he picked the side-you may be entirely right. Personally I think Disley played to help counter the threat of their (SIX) players over six feet tall. Given that we gave away far too many throws, corners and free kicks in areas where they could "launch" the ball into the middle this appears to me to be a reasonable selection to make.
IMO your point about Boyce is excellent. I thought he would be a big "miss" when he went back-I didn't think it would be proven quite so quickly.


If we thought Lincoln were a superior side to us then I'd agree with that selection. However, I'm still of the genuine belief that we're a much better outfit than them overall (they're cloggers who launch the ball forward to their big front line) and the reason we lost was they wanted it more and upped their game accordingly. Even then, we could count ourselves unfortunate to not get a point. And because I think we're a better outfit than they are, it comes back to what others have said about Hurst (wrongly IMO) changing our tactics and line up to counter other team's strengths instead of sending teams out to cause them problems. My opinion in football is that you play to your own strengths first and foremost unless a team is vastly superior to you or your own strengths blatantly don't work against that particular side. If we're as good as some of our play this season has led me to believe then we shouldn't be trying to nullify teams who probably won't be troubling the top end of the table. If we'd played with the line up and in the same way that we did against Gateshead then we'd have won, I'm certain of that.

Disley is a good player but he slows the play down too much and although he scores quite a few goals, we are at our best when moving the ball forward quickly which he rarely does.
Posted by: Maringer, September 11, 2014, 11:31pm; Reply: 72
The problem is, whether you're better than the opposition or not, if they are willing to pack their team with tall players and punt/lob it into your box at every given opportunity, you have to try and deal with this the best you can. We're not a tall team and Disley is good in the air so putting him in the team seems a pretty obvious choice to me.

The alternative view seems to be that we should have just taken the game to them and outscored them but this is easier said than done. It's always easier to stop a goal than score one and we still had more shots overall and efforts on target than them, so it wasn't exactly an enormously defensive move. Especially as Disley scored!

Though I didn't go (and haven't seen the highlights), reports are pretty clear that we lost because of a combination of poor defending and missed chances. They aren't Hurst's fault, are they? The players need to take responsibility for the mistakes which lost us the game. The team selected was good enough to win but failed too often at both ends of the pitch (as we have done several times this season), so the squad as a whole needs to buck their ideas up and start grinding out the results. We've got the ability, they just need to perform.
Posted by: brad_gtfc, September 12, 2014, 11:33am; Reply: 73
As much as Hurst could've changed tactics or formation. He can't legislate for sloppy defending and poor finishing. I know ultimately the book stops with the manager but these players have to take responsibility.
Posted by: moosey_club, September 12, 2014, 1:27pm; Reply: 74
Quoted from brad_gtfc
As much as Hurst could've changed tactics or formation. He can't legislate for sloppy defending and poor finishing. I know ultimately the book stops with the manager but these players have to take responsibility.


watching the post match interview i think Hurst agrees with you, commented that LJL knows he should have scored, and that Nsiala should have done better with late header, Bignot should not have waited for Mckeown to move but just dealt with it himself ie row z and that he wouldnt comment on Mckeowns claim of a foul only saying it was inside the 6 yd box and he would expect it to be dealt with...got the impression some players will be getting a hard time this week in training
Posted by: diehardmariner, September 12, 2014, 1:38pm; Reply: 75
Regards Disley's inclusion for his aerial ability, that's a fair point.  Not sure I agree we're not a tall team though, take Neilson and Brown out of the equation and we're a fairly physical bunch.  Considering Brown goes on the post for corners and Neilson is left as the attacking outlet, we really shouldn't be conceding goals at set-pieces.

Anyway, Disley's good in the air I agree but if we were picking our team to counter their aerial game, I can't disagree with points made higher up the thread about nullifying the threat from wide.  Cut off the threat at the source, in this case the wings.  Keeping McLaughlin-Brown-Clay-Neilson as the four across the middle would have done so.  Going with a diamond left us exposed wide and, for me, broke up that wonderful pack hunting we've seen in recent weeks by Brown and Clay.  One goes in for the tackle, knowing he can't get the ball but does enough to force the attacker to push the ball further in front so the other can sweep up.  

It's done now. 3 points lost and a bit of local pride gone.  I maintain we'll have much more to shout about by next April.
Posted by: barralad, September 12, 2014, 10:22pm; Reply: 76
Quoted from diehardmariner
Regards Disley's inclusion for his aerial ability, that's a fair point.  Not sure I agree we're not a tall team though, take Neilson and Brown out of the equation and we're a fairly physical bunch.  Considering Brown goes on the post for corners and Neilson is left as the attacking outlet, we really shouldn't be conceding goals at set-pieces.

Anyway, Disley's good in the air I agree but if we were picking our team to counter their aerial game, I can't disagree with points made higher up the thread about nullifying the threat from wide.  Cut off the threat at the source, in this case the wings.  Keeping McLaughlin-Brown-Clay-Neilson as the four across the middle would have done so.  Going with a diamond left us exposed wide and, for me, broke up that wonderful pack hunting we've seen in recent weeks by Brown and Clay.  One goes in for the tackle, knowing he can't get the ball but does enough to force the attacker to push the ball further in front so the other can sweep up.  

It's done now. 3 points lost and a bit of local pride gone.  I maintain we'll have much more to shout about by next April.


I do see where you are coming from but their threat came from the "big boot" down the middle and from set pieces especially throw-ins. The first goal I think came from a free kick, the first penalty came from a ball over the top and the winner came from a corner. Perhaps I'm being more obtuse than normal but I cannot see how somebody of McLoughlin's stature would have improved the situation...but as we are constantly reminded by certain board celebrities it's all about opinions. UTM.
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