Welcome, Guest.
Please login or register.
Fishy Forum Fishy Boards Archive › Statistics
Users Browsing Forum
Googlebot and 171 Guests

Statistics

  This thread currently has 4,229 views. Print
5 Pages 1 2 3 4 5 All Recommend Thread
GollyGTFC
January 11, 2022, 10:11pm

Whiskey Drinker
Posts: 3,863
Posts Per Day: 0.68
Reputation: 67.2%
Rep Score: +19 / -11
Approval: +5,926
Gold Stars: 347
Hurst’s league record as Town manager…
P 46 - W 15 D 11 L 20 - Pts 56 (1.217 per match)

Holloway’s league record as Town manager…
P 33 - W 11 D 7 L 15 - Pts 40 (1.212 per match)

Discuss…
Logged Offline
Private Message Skype
chaos33
January 11, 2022, 10:13pm
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,531
Posts Per Day: 2.58
Reputation: 67.78%
Rep Score: +66 / -33
Location: The mountains
Approval: +17,786
Gold Stars: 349
Discuss what? Your need for attention?


"You should do what you love while you can"
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 1 - 46
smokey111
January 11, 2022, 10:14pm
Fine Wine Drinker
Posts: 1,453
Posts Per Day: 0.27
Reputation: 89.2%
Rep Score: +8 / 0
Approval: +3,315
Gold Stars: 46
Quoted from GollyGTFC
Hurst’s league record as Town manager…
P 46 - W 15 D 11 L 20 - Pts 56 (1.217 per match)

Holloway’s league record as Town manager…
P 33 - W 11 D 7 L 15 - Pts 40 (1.212 per match)

Discuss…


Ermmmm, records look similar? Am I hooked on the line?


"The socialism I believe in is everybody working for the same goal and everybody having a share in the rewards. That’s how I see football, that’s how I see life.” Bill Shankly
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 2 - 46
Swansea_Mariner
January 11, 2022, 10:14pm
Whiskey Drinker
Posts: 3,507
Posts Per Day: 0.61
Reputation: 85.79%
Rep Score: +22 / -3
Approval: +6,387
Gold Stars: 62
Come on this is boring why do people keep bringing this up HOLLOWAY RAN AWAY.

Hursts record being shite speaks for itself quite frankly without any need to reference IH.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 3 - 46
ginnywings
January 11, 2022, 10:30pm

Recovering Alcoholic
Posts: 28,126
Posts Per Day: 5.05
Reputation: 73.79%
Rep Score: +88 / -32
Approval: +55,972
Gold Stars: 538
What was the comparison after 33 games each?
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 4 - 46
GollyGTFC
January 11, 2022, 10:30pm

Whiskey Drinker
Posts: 3,863
Posts Per Day: 0.68
Reputation: 67.2%
Rep Score: +19 / -11
Approval: +5,926
Gold Stars: 347
Quoted from chaos33
Discuss what? Your need for attention?


Odd reply.
Logged Offline
Private Message Skype
Reply: 5 - 46
chaos33
January 11, 2022, 10:44pm
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,531
Posts Per Day: 2.58
Reputation: 67.78%
Rep Score: +66 / -33
Location: The mountains
Approval: +17,786
Gold Stars: 349
Why did you need to start a new thread just to make that tedious point/irrelevant comparison?


"You should do what you love while you can"
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 6 - 46
Hagrid
January 11, 2022, 10:48pm

Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,871
Posts Per Day: 2.79
Reputation: 71.14%
Rep Score: +49 / -21
Approval: +19,987
Gold Stars: 508
Holloways a girl private and id rather never hear his name again

I wanted Paul Back, im frustrated, fed up, tired and drunk off that a excrement club like Halifax who cant fill 1 stand with their male masturbation support have beaten us.

Im still Hurst in. But lose saturday and i cant see his position being viable
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 7 - 46
louth_in_the_south
January 11, 2022, 10:56pm

Exile
Posts: 4,073
Posts Per Day: 0.68
Reputation: 66.38%
Rep Score: +22 / -13
Location: Forest Row
Approval: +5,552
Gold Stars: 94
Boring Golly . No relevance to what’s happening now .


Lower F5
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 8 - 46
Shaymen
January 11, 2022, 11:56pm
Coke Drinker
Posts: 6
Posts Per Day: 0.01
Approval: +69
Quoted from Hagrid
Holloways a girl private and id rather never hear his name again

I wanted Paul Back, im frustrated, fed up, tired and drunk off that a excrement club like Halifax who cant fill 1 stand with their male masturbation support have beaten us.

Im still Hurst in. But lose saturday and i cant see his position being viable


If only how many fans you got mattered even remotely to the outcome of football matches. You. Wrexham. Notts and Stockport and Chesterfield keep wanking yourself off with how big your gates are. We'll just win the games.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 9 - 46
jamesgtfc
January 12, 2022, 12:05am
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,996
Posts Per Day: 1.16
Reputation: 79.95%
Rep Score: +20 / -5
Approval: +12,813
Gold Stars: 187
Quoted from Shaymen


If only how many fans you got mattered even remotely to the outcome of football matches. You. Wrexham. Notts and Stockport and Chesterfield keep wanking yourself off with how big your gates are. We'll just win the games.


He's going to get lots of red crosses here but he's right.

I actually got talking to one of the Halifax coaches last week at BP and he was telling me how the manager seems to have a knack of identifying players who have fallen off the wagon a bit elsewhere and need to reignite their careers. They did well last season and lost a few in the summer so it's testament to them that they find themselves top.

They will be there or thereabouts because they have a clear game plan and can control the game.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 10 - 46
oochiad
January 12, 2022, 12:18am
Cocktail Drinker
Posts: 1,975
Posts Per Day: 0.62
Reputation: 77.08%
Rep Score: +9 / -3
Approval: +3,647
Gold Stars: 27
I have blind faith in thinking we’ll still come good…….
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 11 - 46
davmariner
January 12, 2022, 1:45am
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,012
Posts Per Day: 1.21
Reputation: 78.9%
Rep Score: +37 / -10
Approval: +4,860
Gold Stars: 75
These stats lack context and are an unhelpful and mischievous comparison.


Up The Mariners!
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 12 - 46
denni266
January 12, 2022, 3:59am

Whiskey Drinker
Posts: 4,234
Posts Per Day: 0.82
Reputation: 47.09%
Rep Score: +13 / -21
Approval: +636
Gold Stars: 129
Quoted from Shaymen


If only how many fans you got mattered even remotely to the outcome of football matches. You. Wrexham. Notts and Stockport and Chesterfield keep wanking yourself off with how big your gates are. We'll just win the games.


Dont pride your self and think your big.. take note  everyone is beating us  so its nothing special is it
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 13 - 46
aldi_01
January 12, 2022, 6:10am

Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 12,008
Posts Per Day: 2.04
Reputation: 73.73%
Rep Score: +54 / -20
Approval: +5,679
Gold Stars: 473
Hurst, here for the job, here to succeed (it isn’t working right now, I’m aware of that), holloway, here for the cash and a shady investment. flipping charlatan…

Got excited about having that Palace thing to watch on Prime, saw/heard holloway, turned it off…


'the poor and the needy are selfish and greedy'...well done Mozza
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 14 - 46
Shaymen
January 12, 2022, 8:32am
Coke Drinker
Posts: 6
Posts Per Day: 0.01
Approval: +69
Quoted from denni266


Dont pride your self and think your big.. take note  everyone is beating us  so its nothing special is it


Wasn't really to do with beating you. More to do with the bigger clubs banging on about their super attendances. Genuinely makes no difference to the outcome of a game
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 15 - 46
MuddyWaters
January 12, 2022, 8:37am
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 14,028
Posts Per Day: 2.60
Reputation: 68.15%
Rep Score: +48 / -24
Approval: +31,883
Gold Stars: 230
Another stat.

Apparently we haven't scored a goal without Alex Hunt on the pitch since McAtee's last minute winner against Yeovil. Worth noting that Hurst left him out of several games in November.
Logged
Private Message
Reply: 16 - 46
Jarmo.Is.God
January 12, 2022, 9:37am

Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,332
Posts Per Day: 0.99
Reputation: 66.38%
Rep Score: +22 / -13
Approval: +6,051
Gold Stars: 86
21 games in, pretty much half way through the season.

First 10 games;
Won 7
Drew 2
Lost 1
Scored 24 (avg 2.4 goals a game)
Conceded 11 (avg 1.1 goals a game)

Last 10 games
Won 2
Drew 1
Lost 7
Scored 7 (avg 0.7 goals a game)
Conceded 12 (avg 1.2 goals a game)

Its easy to see whats changed....

We are still pretty solid at the back, but become terrible going forward

2 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Weymouth on the opening day
Maguire-drew & Waterfall / instead of Hunt & DLK

3 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Wrexham when we won 3-1
Maguire-Drew, Pearson & Fox / Instead of Coke, Towler & Hunt

Is Hunt the missing piece that makes it all fall apart when not put in the middle?

Other than that, not a lot has changed at all, except the results
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 17 - 46
ginnywings
January 12, 2022, 10:29am

Recovering Alcoholic
Posts: 28,126
Posts Per Day: 5.05
Reputation: 73.79%
Rep Score: +88 / -32
Approval: +55,972
Gold Stars: 538
Quoted from Jarmo.Is.God
21 games in, pretty much half way through the season.

First 10 games;
Won 7
Drew 2
Lost 1
Scored 24 (avg 2.4 goals a game)
Conceded 11 (avg 1.1 goals a game)

Last 10 games
Won 2
Drew 1
Lost 7
Scored 7 (avg 0.7 goals a game)
Conceded 12 (avg 1.2 goals a game)

Its easy to see whats changed....

We are still pretty solid at the back, but become terrible going forward

2 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Weymouth on the opening day
Maguire-drew & Waterfall / instead of Hunt & DLK

3 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Wrexham when we won 3-1
Maguire-Drew, Pearson & Fox / Instead of Coke, Towler & Hunt

Is Hunt the missing piece that makes it all fall apart when not put in the middle?

Other than that, not a lot has changed at all, except the results


Yes, which is why we have tried to sign him permanently.

We clearly need to replace him with someone else this window.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 18 - 46
Zmariner
January 12, 2022, 10:31am
Fine Wine Drinker
Posts: 1,004
Posts Per Day: 0.17
Reputation: 75.95%
Rep Score: +8 / -3
Approval: +2,067
Gold Stars: 43
We are a decent home team and an appalling away team. I feel very very sorry for the away supporters who really deserve much better than this. The loyalty of the away support is staggering and I think they deserve some sort of gesture from the club.
My view is that Hurst should be given the next four games at least.There are three home games and I expect us to win a couple of those and get us back on track. If we do not win any of the next four games then, even as a Hurst supporter , I accept his race is run.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 19 - 46
Poojah
January 12, 2022, 10:35am
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,105
Posts Per Day: 1.23
Reputation: 86.63%
Rep Score: +76 / -11
Approval: +29,153
Gold Stars: 1,490
Quoted from Jarmo.Is.God
21 games in, pretty much half way through the season.

First 10 games;
Won 7
Drew 2
Lost 1
Scored 24 (avg 2.4 goals a game)
Conceded 11 (avg 1.1 goals a game)

Last 10 games
Won 2
Drew 1
Lost 7
Scored 7 (avg 0.7 goals a game)
Conceded 12 (avg 1.2 goals a game)

Its easy to see whats changed....

We are still pretty solid at the back, but become terrible going forward

2 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Weymouth on the opening day
Maguire-drew & Waterfall / instead of Hunt & DLK

3 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Wrexham when we won 3-1
Maguire-Drew, Pearson & Fox / Instead of Coke, Towler & Hunt

Is Hunt the missing piece that makes it all fall apart when not put in the middle?

Other than that, not a lot has changed at all, except the results


The crucial stat for me is that if you look at the 11 games in all competitions since we beat Yeovil 2-0 while top of the league, we have scored 5 goals. That, obviously, isn’t going to be good enough. We’re just not creating enough clear cut chances anymore.

Is anyone clamouring to drop Taylor, or McAtee, or any one player in particular? I’m not seeing a great deal of ire being directed at individuals, because I don’t think individually anyone is doing anything fundamentally awful.

The personnel isn’t the biggest issue here, the system is, and I’m concerned we don’t have the necessary skills amongst our coaching team to go and sort that out.


A smooth sea never made a skillful mariner.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 20 - 46
Maringer
January 12, 2022, 11:11am
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,098
Posts Per Day: 1.86
Reputation: 82.93%
Rep Score: +60 / -12
Approval: +16,140
Gold Stars: 180
We're not creating loads of chances, but we're still creating enough to have scored several more goals during this bad run. I'm thinking of events like Crookes knocking it wide from about 1 foot in the last minute of a game. That sort of thing. Sounds as though we could have scored last night but didn't once again.

The defence is generally playing OK, but it only takes one mistake to lead to a goal and we're making that one mistake in pretty much every game during the bad run.

For what it's worth, I'm still expecting us to finish in the play-offs providing injuries don't hit us too badly, but it might require a couple of decent signings to make this come off.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 21 - 46
Poojah
January 12, 2022, 11:19am
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,105
Posts Per Day: 1.23
Reputation: 86.63%
Rep Score: +76 / -11
Approval: +29,153
Gold Stars: 1,490
Quoted from Maringer
We're not creating loads of chances, but we're still creating enough to have scored several more goals during this bad run. I'm thinking of events like Crookes knocking it wide from about 1 foot in the last minute of a game. That sort of thing. Sounds as though we could have scored last night but didn't once again.

The defence is generally playing OK, but it only takes one mistake to lead to a goal and we're making that one mistake in pretty much every game during the bad run.

For what it's worth, I'm still expecting us to finish in the play-offs providing injuries don't hit us too badly, but it might require a couple of decent signings to make this come off.


We’re currently 6 points off the play-offs with an inferior goal difference, with 7th and 8th position occupied by Wrexham and Stockport respectively, both of whom are improving. If we’re going to make the play-offs, we’re going to have to see an upturn in form and fortunes very, very soon.

If this baron run of PPG continues for another 3 or 4 games, the season is done for us.


A smooth sea never made a skillful mariner.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 22 - 46
Swansea_Mariner
January 12, 2022, 11:57am
Whiskey Drinker
Posts: 3,507
Posts Per Day: 0.61
Reputation: 85.79%
Rep Score: +22 / -3
Approval: +6,387
Gold Stars: 62
Quoted from Poojah


The personnel isn’t the biggest issue here, the system is, and I’m concerned we don’t have the necessary skills amongst our coaching team to go and sort that out.


Which is a terrible indictment of our current set up as we're now fully loaded with all the backroom staff a manager at this level could need.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 23 - 46
Poojah
January 12, 2022, 12:32pm
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,105
Posts Per Day: 1.23
Reputation: 86.63%
Rep Score: +76 / -11
Approval: +29,153
Gold Stars: 1,490
Quoted from Swansea_Mariner


Which is a terrible indictment of our current set up as we're now fully loaded with all the backroom staff a manager at this level could need.


Do we though, have anyone with a proven pedigree of setting teams up offensively? We are predictable and have been sussed out as an attacking force.

When Hurst went to Shrewsbury in 2016 having scored 15 goals in 15 games. They ended up in 18th having scored 46, maintaining that same rate of a goal a game, but having slashed the number of goals they were conceding by more than half. That’s what Hurst does.

They finished third the following season having scored 60, the same as 13th placed Bristol Rovers, but with the second best defensive record in the division. The sides that went up scored 73, 82 and 89 respectively.

Other than signing some players right now, the biggest thing Hurst can do is accept his terminal weakness in his inability to instil attacking flair in sides and bring in someone who is capable of doing so.


A smooth sea never made a skillful mariner.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 24 - 46
Swansea_Mariner
January 12, 2022, 1:02pm
Whiskey Drinker
Posts: 3,507
Posts Per Day: 0.61
Reputation: 85.79%
Rep Score: +22 / -3
Approval: +6,387
Gold Stars: 62
What I meant was we have a range of professionals in a range of disciplines. Now if those professionals don't in combination have the right mix of skills then that is also a terrible indictment of our current manager. It's the same whichever way you cut it up.

Hurst has been given a massive opportunity here in terms of set up. The owners have clearly said is for the manager to decide what he needs to create a functional environment to facilitate change on the pitch. If we don't have that despite employing more people than ever before, then something is really wrong.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 25 - 46
jamesgtfc
January 12, 2022, 1:30pm
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,996
Posts Per Day: 1.16
Reputation: 79.95%
Rep Score: +20 / -5
Approval: +12,813
Gold Stars: 187
Quoted from Poojah


Do we though, have anyone with a proven pedigree of setting teams up offensively? We are predictable and have been sussed out as an attacking force.

When Hurst went to Shrewsbury in 2016 having scored 15 goals in 15 games. They ended up in 18th having scored 46, maintaining that same rate of a goal a game, but having slashed the number of goals they were conceding by more than half. That’s what Hurst does.

They finished third the following season having scored 60, the same as 13th placed Bristol Rovers, but with the second best defensive record in the division. The sides that went up scored 73, 82 and 89 respectively.

Other than signing some players right now, the biggest thing Hurst can do is accept his terminal weakness in his inability to instil attacking flair in sides and bring in someone who is capable of doing so.


Does being a defender mean you can't coach attacking play or set up a team to attack though?

Our 3 coaches were all defenders (although Davies was a central midfielder for at least 10 years) and if Dave Moore has any input into our tactics, he was a defender too.

Mark Hughes was a great striker but I don't ever remember his teams being absolutely lethal up front and terrible defensively.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 26 - 46
mariner91
January 12, 2022, 2:06pm
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 15,431
Posts Per Day: 2.64
Reputation: 86.91%
Rep Score: +78 / -11
Location: Lincs
Approval: +19,249
Gold Stars: 253
Quoted from Jarmo.Is.God
21 games in, pretty much half way through the season.

First 10 games;
Won 7
Drew 2
Lost 1
Scored 24 (avg 2.4 goals a game)
Conceded 11 (avg 1.1 goals a game)

Last 10 games
Won 2
Drew 1
Lost 7
Scored 7 (avg 0.7 goals a game)
Conceded 12 (avg 1.2 goals a game)

Its easy to see whats changed....

We are still pretty solid at the back, but become terrible going forward

2 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Weymouth on the opening day
Maguire-drew & Waterfall / instead of Hunt & DLK

3 outfield players started yesterday that didn't start against Wrexham when we won 3-1
Maguire-Drew, Pearson & Fox / Instead of Coke, Towler & Hunt

Is Hunt the missing piece that makes it all fall apart when not put in the middle?

Other than that, not a lot has changed at all, except the results


Undoubtedly. Yes he had the odd game where he was off the pace but he's a youngster playing non-league football, he isn't going to be Pirlo-esque every game. But the rest of our midfield is too workman-like without the speed of thought or deed to unlock the opposition. Look at the first goal against Wrexham for just how different he is to the rest of the central midfield. Starts the move off with a quick pass round the corner after coming and showing for the ball from the defenders. Then plays an incisive pass through a small gap that's perfectly weighted for Sousa which, frankly, none of the other midfielders would have seen let alone been able to execute.

If he's not coming back, which is a real shame, then he needs replacing or we are going to struggle significantly. No point having players like McAtee and Taylor further up the field if the service to them is slow and inconsistent.


Looking forward to a brighter future now Fenty has gone.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 27 - 46
rancido
January 12, 2022, 2:32pm

Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,453
Posts Per Day: 1.25
Reputation: 80.3%
Rep Score: +41 / -10
Approval: +6,448
Gold Stars: 91
Quoted from Shaymen


If only how many fans you got mattered even remotely to the outcome of football matches. You. Wrexham. Notts and Stockport and Chesterfield keep wanking yourself off with how big your gates are. We'll just win the games.


Shayman, don't you know who we are? We were in the equivalent of the Premiersh*t as recently as 1948. We went to 2, yes 2 FA Cup semi-finals in the 1930's, one of which still holds the record of attendance at Old Trafford. We are a massive club with a great  history and we shouldn't be down here with all these glorified pub teams 😉.


The Future is Black & White.
"The commonest thing on this planet is not water , as some people believe, but stupidity ". Frank Zappa
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 28 - 46
diehardmariner
January 12, 2022, 2:37pm
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,780
Posts Per Day: 0.97
Reputation: 84.65%
Rep Score: +36 / -6
Approval: +17,093
Gold Stars: 520
Quoted from Poojah




Other than signing some players right now, the biggest thing Hurst can do is accept his terminal weakness in his inability to instil attacking flair in sides and bring in someone who is capable of doing so.


Yet we were almost swashbuckling at times earlier in the season.

No doubt, Hurst's preferred approach is one of caution.  I think he admitted as much during his first spell with a comment along the lines of 'I always preferred those 1-0's when you're defending for your life for 89 minutes than thumping someone 6-0'.   But I think it's unfair to say he can't install attacking flair, nor bring in players who are capable of doing it.  His first spell proved with countless signings that he could bring in genuinely exciting players.  Hearn, Neilson, Arnold, Bogle, Nolan....all players who looked to do something.  Even Conor Townsend is someone who I would count as a player who always looked to go forward.  McAtee and Sousa are both attack minded players who have the first thought of attacking the defence rather than playing safe.  

What I think is evident is that Hurst, his teams too, get more defensive when they don't get the rub of the green.  It becomes a vicious cycle, you've not scored for a few games so you defend deeper...before you know it you've got 10 men parked in front of your own goalkeeper.

The only stat that matters is the points column.   At this minute in time we're struggling on that front.  We need to arrest that decline, get back on track regardless of how we get there.  With the defence still fairly solid, I think there needs to be a bit of unshackling.  However I'm not convinced that we've enough quality to consistently hurt teams.  Sadly, I think a few posters have already summed it up in that we've been sussed out already.  Taylor has been nullified as the focal point, similarly to how Hanson was 2 years ago.  Without him bringing others into play we're down to Sousa and McAtee.  Sousa is erratic and lacks end product, whereas McAtee has barely played for two months. There's not really much creativity in the rest of the team to look at.  A lot of endeavor but few who will change a game.  Huge couple of weeks ahead in terms of recruitment.
Logged
Private Message
Reply: 29 - 46
Poojah
January 12, 2022, 2:45pm
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,105
Posts Per Day: 1.23
Reputation: 86.63%
Rep Score: +76 / -11
Approval: +29,153
Gold Stars: 1,490
Quoted from diehardmariner


Yet we were almost swashbuckling at times earlier in the season.

No doubt, Hurst's preferred approach is one of caution.  I think he admitted as much during his first spell with a comment along the lines of 'I always preferred those 1-0's when you're defending for your life for 89 minutes than thumping someone 6-0'.   But I think it's unfair to say he can't install attacking flair, nor bring in players who are capable of doing it.  His first spell proved with countless signings that he could bring in genuinely exciting players.  Hearn, Neilson, Arnold, Bogle, Nolan....all players who looked to do something.  Even Conor Townsend is someone who I would count as a player who always looked to go forward.  McAtee and Sousa are both attack minded players who have the first thought of attacking the defence rather than playing safe.  

What I think is evident is that Hurst, his teams too, get more defensive when they don't get the rub of the green.  It becomes a vicious cycle, you've not scored for a few games so you defend deeper...before you know it you've got 10 men parked in front of your own goalkeeper.

The only stat that matters is the points column.   At this minute in time we're struggling on that front.  We need to arrest that decline, get back on track regardless of how we get there.  With the defence still fairly solid, I think there needs to be a bit of unshackling.  However I'm not convinced that we've enough quality to consistently hurt teams.  Sadly, I think a few posters have already summed it up in that we've been sussed out already.  Taylor has been nullified as the focal point, similarly to how Hanson was 2 years ago.  Without him bringing others into play we're down to Sousa and McAtee.  Sousa is erratic and lacks end product, whereas McAtee has barely played for two months. There's not really much creativity in the rest of the team to look at.  A lot of endeavor but few who will change a game.  Huge couple of weeks ahead in terms of recruitment.


The trouble is I don’t think he’s systematically very creative in the attacking sense. Early in the season we seemed to have an approach and a new set of players that clicked while other sides were working themselves and us out.

It feels like we’ve been sussed out tactically and have struggled to correct the issue. In previous spells when we’ve scored goals under Hurst we were still often predictable, but had out and out goal scorers in the side like Hearn and Amond, and / or creative players with an end product - Neilson, Arnold, Disley, Nolan and so on.

I’m not sure we’ve got enough of that right now, and so our offensive rigidity and predictability is badly exposed.


A smooth sea never made a skillful mariner.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 30 - 46
Maringer
January 12, 2022, 2:49pm
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,098
Posts Per Day: 1.86
Reputation: 82.93%
Rep Score: +60 / -12
Approval: +16,140
Gold Stars: 180
Biggest issue is a lack of pace for me. Admittedly, this has long been my complaint about GTFC teams, probably ever since the Slade Mk. I era!

Right now, we've got no real pace amongst the defenders - Efete probably the quickest we've got, but he's a strong runner as opposed to a quick one. Clifton and Fox not slow, but not exactly fast and the same went for Hunt while he was still here. Coke definitely looking a bit slow these days. Sousa is quick, Wright is quick but rarely fit, Bapaga was quickish. JML doesn't appear to have any real pace. Does Scannell have any pace these days? Who knows? McAtee and Taylor are fast enough but not quick, LJL looking slow compared to his previous spell with us.

There's no doubt that an addition of pace makes a huge difference at any level and the options off the bench for Taylor/LJL/McAtee have been very limited indeed. Bell looked distinctly nippy but never really had the chance of a run in a settled team.

On the assumption that we're going to sign a few more players this month, I'd hope that one or two of them can pep things up by adding that extra yard of pace in the important areas of the field as that could make a real difference.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 31 - 46
Jarmo.Is.God
January 12, 2022, 2:50pm

Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,332
Posts Per Day: 0.99
Reputation: 66.38%
Rep Score: +22 / -13
Approval: +6,051
Gold Stars: 86
Missing a Jamey Osborne type player
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 32 - 46
Knut Anders Fosters Voles
January 12, 2022, 3:04pm
Brandy Drinker
Posts: 2,877
Posts Per Day: 1.89
Reputation: 91.64%
Rep Score: +24 / -1
Location: League 2
Approval: +8,784
Gold Stars: 548
Quoted from diehardmariner

What I think is evident is that Hurst, his teams too, get more defensive when they don't get the rub of the green.  It becomes a vicious cycle, you've not scored for a few games so you defend deeper...before you know it you've got 10 men parked in front of your own goalkeeper.


This is a very good point.

Do Hurst teams (or certainly Hurst led Grimsby sides) get stuck in a rut of winless streaks? More so than other teams? Jolley, Buckley III and certainly Neil Woods all showed the same trait.

Looking at post-Christmas 2013/14, we only won 2 out of the next 10 and pre-Christmas 2014/15, it appears we only won 3/10 (5/15, before then winning the next five on the bounce), which is always likely to ruin any chance of automatic promotion when there is only one spot available.

Chesterfield have had some average results and have struggled against their rivals but appear to recover quickly to thrash the lesser sides.



Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 33 - 46
Mrbump53
January 12, 2022, 3:33pm
Beer Drinker
Posts: 144
Posts Per Day: 0.05
Reputation: 79.87%
Rep Score: +4 / -1
Approval: +335
Gold Stars: 11
It was interesting to listen to PH post match when I got back last night from the game. He raised an issue about choices that being made in some situations which is not what these players are making in training. In some instances last night we broke quickly to expose their defense but then stopped to get a "safer" pass option. This allowed their players to get back in numbers and stifle the attack on the training ground they probably would have taken a risk to get players in. This what people may call "flair" in taking a riskier approach but if the confidence is not there then players may looking for safer options. This looked to be the case in some instances last night when a shooting opportunity arose but the player chose to pass it and the space was closed off.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 34 - 46
Zmariner
January 12, 2022, 3:42pm
Fine Wine Drinker
Posts: 1,004
Posts Per Day: 0.17
Reputation: 75.95%
Rep Score: +8 / -3
Approval: +2,067
Gold Stars: 43
Quoted from Maringer
Biggest issue is a lack of pace for me. Admittedly, this has long been my complaint about GTFC teams, probably ever since the Slade Mk. I era!

Right now, we've got no real pace amongst the defenders - Efete probably the quickest we've got, but he's a strong runner as opposed to a quick one. Clifton and Fox not slow, but not exactly fast and the same went for Hunt while he was still here. Coke definitely looking a bit slow these days. Sousa is quick, Wright is quick but rarely fit, Bapaga was quickish. JML doesn't appear to have any real pace. Does Scannell have any pace these days? Who knows? McAtee and Taylor are fast enough but not quick, LJL looking slow compared to his previous spell with us.

There's no doubt that an addition of pace makes a huge difference at any level and the options off the bench for Taylor/LJL/McAtee have been very limited indeed. Bell looked distinctly nippy but never really had the chance of a run in a settled team.

On the assumption that we're going to sign a few more players this month, I'd hope that one or two of them can pep things up by adding that extra yard of pace in the important areas of the field as that could make a real difference.


Exactly the point I made before the loss against Halifax yesterday. I do not like the lack of pace in this team And I really hope it is something that Hurst addresses
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 35 - 46
ginnywings
January 12, 2022, 4:58pm

Recovering Alcoholic
Posts: 28,126
Posts Per Day: 5.05
Reputation: 73.79%
Rep Score: +88 / -32
Approval: +55,972
Gold Stars: 538
Quoted from Mrbump53
It was interesting to listen to PH post match when I got back last night from the game. He raised an issue about choices that being made in some situations which is not what these players are making in training. In some instances last night we broke quickly to expose their defense but then stopped to get a "safer" pass option. This allowed their players to get back in numbers and stifle the attack on the training ground they probably would have taken a risk to get players in. This what people may call "flair" in taking a riskier approach but if the confidence is not there then players may looking for safer options. This looked to be the case in some instances last night when a shooting opportunity arose but the player chose to pass it and the space was closed off.


This is the nub of it for me. There are many posts by many different posters trying to figure out what has gone wrong and for me it is simply a lack of confidence stemming from some poor results that weren't expected. Not beating Wealdstone and Aldershot for instance was not what was expected and suddenly the games start piling up where wins are not materialising.

Players start to take the safe option or hesitate just that fraction too long. Chances get snatched at and opportunities missed. It becomes more and more frustrating and starts to play on the mind.

Decisions in games start to go against you and the players start to feel sorry for themselves and second guessing instead of just acting on instinct. Halfax aren't any better than we are, they're just going out expecting to win, instead of hoping to win.

I've not seen a side that are demonstrably better than us yet this season.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 36 - 46
Knut Anders Fosters Voles
January 12, 2022, 5:48pm
Brandy Drinker
Posts: 2,877
Posts Per Day: 1.89
Reputation: 91.64%
Rep Score: +24 / -1
Location: League 2
Approval: +8,784
Gold Stars: 548
Quoted from ginnywings

I've not seen a side that are demonstrably better than us yet this season.


It wouldn’t surprise me if the champions fail to break the 90 point barrier this season (or even 86 with two fewer matches than usual).
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 37 - 46
Azimuth
January 12, 2022, 9:33pm
Snakebite drinker
Posts: 401
Posts Per Day: 0.17
Reputation: 63.84%
Rep Score: +3 / -4
Approval: +686
Gold Stars: 58
Quoted from davmariner
These stats lack context and are an unhelpful and mischievous comparison.


They are factual and dont lie, both managers have been a failure.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 38 - 46
pen penfras
January 13, 2022, 9:18am

Cocktail Drinker
Posts: 1,677
Posts Per Day: 0.67
Reputation: 58.56%
Rep Score: +8 / -9
Approval: -137
Gold Stars: 71


It wouldn’t surprise me if the champions fail to break the 90 point barrier this season (or even 86 with two fewer matches than usual).


Seems that way at the moment, but I wouldn't be surprised to see one team go on a 7 or 8 game winning streak and pull away from the others. The fact that Halifax are top when they don't look anything special is evidence that the league isn't as strong as some have made out. An effective game plan with some nice shithousery has been enough for them
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 39 - 46
jamesgtfc
January 13, 2022, 9:37am
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,996
Posts Per Day: 1.16
Reputation: 79.95%
Rep Score: +20 / -5
Approval: +12,813
Gold Stars: 187
Quoted from pen penfras


Seems that way at the moment, but I wouldn't be surprised to see one team go on a 7 or 8 game winning streak and pull away from the others. The fact that Halifax are top when they don't look anything special is evidence that the league isn't as strong as some have made out. An effective game plan with some nice shithousery has been enough for them


I've said it before but we are too nice. We all sit here moaning that opposition players are pulling our players shirts but it seems to work for them. At this level where referees are poor you need to play that to your advantage. Get a horrible box to box midfielder in who just stays within 5 yards of the referee all game.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 40 - 46
ska face
January 13, 2022, 9:47am

Vodka Drinker
Posts: 7,147
Posts Per Day: 1.21
Reputation: 80.94%
Rep Score: +60 / -14
Approval: +21,340
Gold Stars: 824
Quoted from Zmariner


Exactly the point I made before the loss against Halifax yesterday. I do not like the lack of pace in this team And I really hope it is something that Hurst addresses


I don’t think we’re a particularly slow team, but just fail to get into situations where the faster players can take advantage of it.

Sousa, Efete, McAtee, Wright, Clifton are all fairly quick, then you look at Bell, Revan, Bapaga who were the same but have now gone. When did we ever make the most of that pace? How often have we got into positions where wingers have a chance to knock it past their fullback & get after it?

Since probably late-Oct, the play has been slow & ponderous. Quality of passing isn’t there from anyone but Hunt which limits the use of faster players. Compare that with Halifax, who spent the first half clipping good balls over our back 4 for Slew & others to chase.

What seemed like a decent partnership between Sousa & Efete down the right has dropped off through injury, suspension, loss of form and Sousa moving over to the left at times. There’s no pace from left back, as we know.

When we have managed to break down the wings, Sousa & Bapaga have tended to cut inside, or haven’t been able to put a decent cross over.

If we need a pacey option anywhere, it’s at left back & as another option up top. But it’s not just as simple as getting quicker players in, the system needs to support them.
Logged
Private Message
Reply: 41 - 46
chaos33
January 13, 2022, 10:22am
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,531
Posts Per Day: 2.58
Reputation: 67.78%
Rep Score: +66 / -33
Location: The mountains
Approval: +17,786
Gold Stars: 349
Great post.


"You should do what you love while you can"
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 42 - 46
TownSNAFU5
January 13, 2022, 11:02am
Vodka Drinker
Posts: 5,917
Posts Per Day: 1.13
Reputation: 62.03%
Rep Score: +30 / -21
Location: York
Approval: +6,773
Gold Stars: 41
I remember teams (NL winners) like Crawley and Fleetwood being dirty, ruthless, nasty and doing everything to win. Conning and influencing the referee being the norm.  Experts in timewasting etc.

Yes, we have been too nice over the years.  Maybe playing in an honourable way and not always streetwise in managing a game..  

We could be meaner and still play the game in the right way.  As someone said, we probably need a nastier, astute manager to do achieve this.  (We are starting off with nice, decent owners.  They are more likely to keep, relate and appoint a manager in their own image).  
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 43 - 46
Maringer
January 13, 2022, 2:03pm
Barley Wine Drinker
Posts: 11,098
Posts Per Day: 1.86
Reputation: 82.93%
Rep Score: +60 / -12
Approval: +16,140
Gold Stars: 180
I don't want to see us become a team reliant on shitehousery. I've just about got around to accepting that our players will sometimes commit a 'professional' foul to pick up a booking and break up play, but it still doesn't sit well with me.

It would be nice if the referees were a bit more capable so did something about the teams who do little but wrestle players at set pieces (e.g. Halifax), but I don't have any confidence that the referees won't just start awarding penalties against us if we attempted to copy this tactic.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 44 - 46
gtfc_chris
January 13, 2022, 2:52pm
Snakebite drinker
Posts: 392
Posts Per Day: 0.49
Reputation: 90.32%
Rep Score: +10 / 0
Location: Laceby
Approval: +1,446
Gold Stars: 110
I think when you look back at PH Mk1, he had us playing a manner of football that didn't warrant a 'quick route' back to the EFL (if such a thing exists), and instead stuck to his guns in building a team that - in his eyes - played football.

Although that position saw us take a few years to get to the standard good enough to beat enough teams to take us up, once he had and at the point he left for Shrewsbury we were in the play off positions in L2.

To me that suggests he looks beyond using dirty tricks to try and fast track our way because he'd rather build a way of playing and a team that is capable of competing once promoted, and can maintain progression based on understanding rather than sh1thousery.

The huge downside to that both before and currently is whether you're patient enough to ride out the rough patches that inevitably go with it.
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 45 - 46
FishGY
January 13, 2022, 6:42pm
Shandy Drinker
Posts: 51
Posts Per Day: 0.02
Reputation: 78.35%
Rep Score: +3 / -1
Approval: +65
Gold Stars: 1


It wouldn’t surprise me if the champions fail to break the 90 point barrier this season (or even 86 with two fewer matches than usual).


Interesting you say that and people agree. The top 3 teams are all on track to finish on 90+ and yes maybe one or two may slow up, but all of them are on fine form.. Even 4th place Notts County are one point shy of what would be 2 points a game, and they were slow starters.

It's a very harsh league with one automatic promotion spot. Normally 2 points a game is a yardstick for promotion but in this league it's likely not enough.

That said, I agree the league isn't very strong, but there is a split with teams that are much weaker than the others. Generally that's between the ex-league/professional clubs and clubs that you read and think non-league (slightly disrespectful maybe). The teams at the top presumably are winning against the easier teams hence their high points tallies, something we were doing as consistently until we weren't.

Still, there's no excuse for how far down the table we have fallen, especially with the headstart we gave ourselves. But I don't think this is an easy league to win like some imply it should be (sadly)
Logged Offline
Private Message
Reply: 46 - 46
5 Pages 1 2 3 4 5 All Recommend Thread
Print

Fishy Forum Fishy Boards Archive › Statistics

Back to top of page

This is not an official forum of Grimsby Town Football Club, the opinions expressed are those of the individual authors. If you see an offensive post then click "Report" on the relevant post. Posts will be deleted at the discretion of the moderators whose decision is final. Posts should abide by the Forum Rules. IP addresses of contributors together with dates and times of access are stored. The opinions and viewpoints expressed by contributors to The Fishy are their own and not necessarily those of The Fishy. The Fishy makes no claims that information dispersed through this forum is accurate or reliable. Also The Fishy cannot be held liable for any statements made by contributors of The Fishy.