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Just Back...on the bus.

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barralad
November 13, 2021, 5:37pm
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And struggling to make any sense of what I've just seen. It would be "nice" if it was just that we are missing Mcatee. Sadly it isn't. Only Taylor could claim today that he missed his partner. Our hopeful punts in his general direction gave him absolutely zero service. Exciting as Sousa is his final ball today was absolutely woeful. The rocks at the back Towler and Waterfall were hesitant and clumsy. No doubt Macca will come in for some real flak elsewhere. I'll restrict my comments to wondering whether it was a good idea to lambast Revan during the game. Judging by the negative effect it had on his play suggests its a rhetorical question.
Four weeks ago I was telling anybody who'd listen about our strength in depth. Sadly there was no-one on the bench today with the skill or application to change the game.
I'm struggling for any positives but will praise Clifton's first half performance...outstanding.
I'm not sure I know what the next step needs to be. I'm praying Hurst does.
Final word for their fans who never stopped singing. These are fans of a team that has lost a total of 11 consecutive home games stretching back to last season. Remarkable support.


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jonnyboy82
November 13, 2021, 5:40pm
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The form is worrying, what's worse for me is how we've gone from looking like we will score for fun to looking like we don't have a clue.

Yea we've lost mcatee but this ain't down to one man, over to you Paul hurst.

Needs sorting and now.


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lew chaterleys lover
November 13, 2021, 5:47pm
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The bookies had it right. You have to spend money to get to the top and we felt spending £250,000 on Tshimanga and paying him the wages to match was too much, even for a player in demand. In that case, you cannot expect to win the league. I was amazed and delighted with our start, and the quality of our play was sublime, but you really do need deep pockets to win any league these days. It is just the way it is.

The owners will be finding out now that the most important investment is in the team, and they have had tremendous support so now is the time to spend some serious money.

I hope we can recover some form next week but we need to be proactive to make sure the good start is not wasted.
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bradzmilne
November 13, 2021, 5:47pm
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Worrying.

Starting to look a little bit more than a temporary blip of form.

Wasn’t overly thrilled with the line up today and lack of recognised attackers on the pitch and was hoping to eat my words with Harry equalised fairly early on. However, again a lack of clear cut chances has cost us.

Like everyone else in NE Lincs I think it’s absolutely criminal we haven’t signed another attacking threat and being completely honest the “it has to be the right person” claim is starting to wear a little bit thin. Since McAtee’s injury (and I’m including Wealdstone in this because he was clearly not fit) we’ve not got a single point/result. You can’t tell that even a short term loan of a well regarded u23 player wouldn’t have achieved more than that.

The one silver lining is we’re still well within touching distance of the front runners. However, if things don’t change quickly that will soon change.


Sleep well Icey, Matty and Richard. Keep each other company up there xx

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pontoonlew
November 13, 2021, 5:49pm
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Can the person who said Sousa was as good as Dembele please stand up?
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forza ivano
November 13, 2021, 5:49pm

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Cant disagree with much of what barra wrote. Efete looked hesitant whilst I continue to be completely underwhelmed by revan. Clifton was excellent first half but disappeared completely 2nd half. Fox wasnt at his best, whilst hunt did well 1st half, but passing went awry 2bd half  sousa was my motm as he was a consistent threat.
God knows where we go from here.suspect we are dependant upon mcatee n grant getting fit
Ps anyone else baffled by our unwillingness to have a shot?
Finally aldershot looked much better than 2nd bottom and massive kudos to their fans who really got behind their team
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barralad
November 13, 2021, 6:06pm
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Quoted from forza ivano
Cant disagree with much of what barra wrote. Efete looked hesitant whilst I continue to be completely underwhelmed by revan. Clifton was excellent first half but disappeared completely 2nd half. Fox wasnt at his best, whilst hunt did well 1st half, but passing went awry 2bd half  sousa was my motm as he was a consistent threat.
God knows where we go from here.suspect we are dependant upon mcatee n grant getting fit
Ps anyone else baffled by our unwillingness to have a shot?
Finally aldershot looked much better than 2nd bottom and massive kudos to their fans who really got behind their team


On the subject of fans I'm not sure of the point of booing the team at the end of the game-if you felt that angry surely the best solution would be to walk away and leave them clapping an empty stand?


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Ipswin
November 13, 2021, 6:09pm
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Quoted from forza ivano


Ps anyone else baffled by our unwillingness to have a shot?


That has been our new craftily designed Hurst tactic for four or five matches now, some days we don't have a shot at all



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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 6:12pm

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Im furious with the performance and result

And the fact Aldershot deserved the 3 points and should have won by more. Full credit to them.

I’d send Revan back, he is out of his depth and i’ve thought that in each game i’ve seen him play bar Bromsgrove. starting him and Khouri was baffling and even more ludicrous was seeing them both come out for the 2nd half. They were both quite frankly awful, and Aldershot exploited it. The 2 CB’s were nervy and the midfield for me non existant with the exception of Clifton. Taylor isolated just as lennie is when he plays, Im flabbergasted by how much we miss 1 player.

Playing a left hand side like that opened us up to trouble, play sousa and bapaga, who cause problems, against a leaky defence, not Khouri who has been nowhere near the First Team picture and surely cant be match fit. No more so than Grant and Or Scannell who have both been back training for weeks yet seem no closer to squad inclusion.

This is more than a blip, this is poor. Today was disgraceful, and by intercourse after Southend we have a run of fixtures to make your skin crawl and play like this we’ll lose the lot. Comfortably.

Coke said in the week we were complacent at Kiddy, well it looked the same today. Half arsed, slow, creative-less dross. Sousa who i do like, has got to work on his end product.

Concerning, frustrating, flipping cold winter nights are coming whilst watching town

Oh, and Paul, i like you, but please for god sake stop waiting for this perfect signing, it aint there, find a bloody striker
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Heisenberg
November 13, 2021, 6:15pm
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The bookies had it right. You have to spend money to get to the top and we felt spending £250,000 on Tshimanga and paying him the wages to match was too much, even for a player in demand. In that case, you cannot expect to win the league. I was amazed and delighted with our start, and the quality of our play was sublime, but you really do need deep pockets to win any league these days. It is just the way it is.

The owners will be finding out now that the most important investment is in the team, and they have had tremendous support so now is the time to spend some serious money.

I hope we can recover some form next week but we need to be proactive to make sure the good start is not wasted.


In life I am often wrong, but a few of us said similar to this pre season, I was astonished at our subsequent form, I didn’t know what to do, it was blissfull. Now, within a month, we’re where we assumed we would be: crap.

I’m not often right, and this time I hate being right.

The honeymoon isn’t just over, divorce proceedings are imminent!
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Ipswin
November 13, 2021, 6:28pm
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Quoted from Hagrid
, play sousa and bapaga, who cause problems, against a leaky defence,


This

Whatever Hurst was thinking when he played then persisted with khouri and Revan I don't know, but never mind 'we kept us shape' (quite what it was supposed to be I don't know)




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headingly_mariner
November 13, 2021, 6:31pm

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Quoted from Heisenberg


In life I am often wrong, but a few of us said similar to this pre season, I was astonished at our subsequent form, I didn’t know what to do, it was blissfull. Now, within a month, we’re where we assumed we would be: crap.

I’m not often right, and this time I hate being right.

The honeymoon isn’t just over, divorce proceedings are imminent!


We are currently 3rd for a bit of perspective.

I’m gutted we lost again today and hopefully 3 league losses in a row will be our worst run of the season. Saw enough in the good run to see we are a very good side.
I would agree that we don’t have amazing strength in depth, but still think this is a blip.
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Marinerdeano
November 13, 2021, 6:45pm
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The bookies had it right. You have to spend money to get to the top and we felt spending £250,000 on Tshimanga and paying him the wages to match was too much, even for a player in demand. In that case, you cannot expect to win the league. I was amazed and delighted with our start, and the quality of our play was sublime, but you really do need deep pockets to win any league these days. It is just the way it is.

The owners will be finding out now that the most important investment is in the team, and they have had tremendous support so now is the time to spend some serious money.

I hope we can recover some form next week but we need to be proactive to make sure the good start is not wasted.


Very good post. We need to a bit more Billy big balderdash and nasty about things and stop being so respectful to oppositions - we are Grimsby Town! A couple of extra warriors in the team and a class striker required.
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Northbank Mariner
November 13, 2021, 6:51pm
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It's been glaringly obvious we need another striker, LJL will never be the answer, you can't tell me there isn't a free agent out there that's better than him?..love Lennie's work rate but he can't hit a cows a£se with a banjo...
Hurst needs to go to the owners and ask for the cash, if we don't start winning soon all the good will and patience will go out the window, as fans we'll turn and it'll be boos at BP rather than the sound of clapping, chanting and singing...my head's f&cked and emotions ruined...still, we are 3rd in the league...
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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 6:56pm

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Quoted from Northbank Mariner
It's been glaringly obvious we need another striker, LJL will never be the answer, you can't tell me there isn't a free agent out there that's better than him?..love Lennie's work rate but he can't hit a cows a£se with a banjo...
Hurst needs to go to the owners and ask for the cash, if we don't start winning soon all the good will and patience will go out the window, as fans we'll turn and it'll be boos at BP rather than the sound of clapping, chanting and singing...my head's f&cked and emotions ruined...still, we are 3rd in the league...


Theres more pressing concerns than LJL. We arent giving him or Taylor the chances to miss, and havent for weeks
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Northbank Mariner
November 13, 2021, 7:00pm
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Quoted from Hagrid


Theres more pressing concerns than LJL. We arent giving him or Taylor the chances to miss, and havent for weeks


You're not Oliver but we go route 1 with him up there, completely takes out the midfield...mate I've seen him miss more chances this season than I care to remember, we need something better, honestly kills me to say it but Hereford was his level, we need a Podge like player, not Podge but someone of that Ilk.
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Spurn boy
November 13, 2021, 7:10pm

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As much as we need another Striker we really need someone like the late Paul Futcher, here was a player with a wealth of experience who was able to impose himself in the centre of the defence and give the players around him so much advice and confidence and he made the game look so easy. I’m sure there are players out there that have got so much to offer in the last years of their career.


Dead Eye Dobbin stood motionless waiting, waiting, waiting for the ball to arrive. Back came the right foot, Down came the right foot, Bang ! Headlines around the world as the ball flew into the very top right hand corner of the goal.( Jim Dobbin scoring in the 89th minute for Town against Newcastle United away 24/10/1992 )
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GrimRob
November 13, 2021, 7:19pm

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Sousa often had 2 or 3 players on him as soon as he got the ball, yet we kept giving it to him. It's too predictable, with lots of resources devoted to keeping an eye on him there should be space elsewhere to exploit. We created nothing and they hit the bar twice (and three times in the crossbar challenge at halftime). We're not the new kids on the block anymore, teams have sussed us out, who our dangermen are, and where our weak spots lie. Don't understand the penny pinching with the No 9 position, as that's what it seems to me to be.


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Chrisblor
November 13, 2021, 7:19pm

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Quoted from Hagrid


Theres more pressing concerns than LJL. We arent giving him or Taylor the chances to miss, and havent for weeks


Taylor missed a sitter with about 5 minutes to go today by hitting it low into the player lunging to block instead of lifting it for a goal. Bapaga also missed a sitter (set up by Taylor), and there was another occasion at 1-1 where Clifton pulled a ball back from the left towards the penalty spot but every attacker had overrun it. The chances are there, they've just been bottling them.

We were absolutely inept down the other end today too, which is embarrassing when we had so much possession and they offered very little threat from open play. Didn't matter though because they bullied us from set pieces, and we had to clear another two attempts off the line. Although McKeown made a very good reflex save to tip one of those efforts onto the underside of the bar before we knocked it off the line he was awful today at dealing with crosses and aerial balls. They bullied him and our other defenders on crosses, long throws and free kicks all afternoon (Revan especially - watch the highlights and you'll see he got the assist for their 2nd), and it paid dividends.


gary jones
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MuddyWaters
November 13, 2021, 7:46pm
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If Crookes is fit, Crookes plays. Surely?
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Davec
November 13, 2021, 7:50pm
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Well that was poor wasn't it, Aldershot has lost every single home game this season before today but yet they looked better than us in every single department which is very concerning.

It is plainly obvious we are so reliant on Mcatee and when he is missing we don't even look like scoring a goal let alone winning a game.

I didn't understand the team selection at all and I still am totally baffled by it, our left hand side was totally out of their depth today together and it was absolutely criminal from Hurst to actually put them together down the left.

Defensively we were horrific and looked very shaky and nervous, special mention for Revan who did his best all game to allow them a goal, he finally managed it, absolutely abysmal from him all game today, he's looked so poor in every single game he has played apart from Bromsgrove and look what league they are in.

Midfield got over run despite having 3 in, Clifton first half was good but 2nd half different story, Fox had an indifferent game and Hunt I thought was cack especially in the 2nd half when he gave the ball away everytime he touched it I think and Sousa's end product, well enough said really that is a severe issue.

Taylor misses Mcatee and I thought was isolated as he has been every game since Mcatee got injured.

We urgently need reinforcements this week, a striker different to LJL and Taylor to give oppositon something to think about, we can't afford to sit and wait for this perfect striker as we are dropping point after point now with some very tough fixtures coming up.

Latest run of performances and results are very very concerning and it needs fixing ASAP
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GollyGTFC
November 13, 2021, 7:55pm

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Revan at total fault for both goals. Lost his man for the first goal & his misjudged header for the second. He doesn’t look ready for this level yet. We should be looking to send him back:

But to defend him, Hurst did him no favours pairing him on the left with Khouri. 2 inexperienced players down one flank is never a good idea.

And also… McKeown sprinting after Revan to shout at him after the second is really poor from one of our senior pros against an 18-year-old. Revan was well aware his error caused the goal, he doesn’t need what confidence he had left after the incident being humiliated out of him.

Oh and we need another striker ASAP. Some one quicker, more mobile and who can play off LJL or Taylor in games like today where we go 4-4-2/4-2-4.
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Dave Gilberts Left Peg
November 13, 2021, 8:04pm
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If we don’t beat Southend, hurst out. We have a great feeling around the club, let’s not waste it


Only the dead have seen the end of war
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MuddyWaters
November 13, 2021, 8:09pm
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If we don’t beat Southend, hurst out. We have a great feeling around the club, let’s not waste it


A football club has a good feeling when it’s winning football matches. You can be as well run as you like, it’s still a results based business.
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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 8:12pm

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If we don’t beat Southend, hurst out. We have a great feeling around the club, let’s not waste it


Thats just silly. Despite our shocking form and performance on the pitch, we are 3rd. You cannot sack a manager when you’re 3rd in the league. Nor will we
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Knut Anders Fosters Voles
November 13, 2021, 8:23pm
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If we don’t beat Southend, hurst out. We have a great feeling around the club, let’s not waste it


…or…

If he wins next week, commission a statue.

If he loses on a Tuesday during a vernal equinox, sacrifice him.

You’re right. As you have proved, spouting completely stupid böllocks can be cathartic.
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jamesgtfc
November 13, 2021, 8:26pm
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If we don’t beat Southend, hurst out. We have a great feeling around the club, let’s not waste it


I'm going to give you some attention. Who do you suggest we replace him with?
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dapperz fun pub
November 13, 2021, 8:32pm
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Macca chased after the young lad giving him a volley of abuse 🤔 he might not be ready for this level yet but coming from a keeper who flaps at every cross which un nerves our defenders sort of doesn’t sit well to me, red x away 👍
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denni266
November 13, 2021, 8:35pm

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Not like macca hasnt done anything wrong  in a game like putting the ball in the net
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Heisenberg
November 13, 2021, 8:39pm
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Quoted from Hagrid


Thats just silly. Despite our shocking form and performance on the pitch, we are 3rd. You cannot sack a manager when you’re 3rd in the league. Nor will we


Here’s a parallel - those fans when Holloway left saying “we’re clear of the bottom 2, it’s fine”…….
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MuddyWaters
November 13, 2021, 8:45pm
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Quoted from dapperz fun pub
Macca chased after the young lad giving him a volley of abuse 🤔 he might not be ready for this level yet but coming from a keeper who flaps at every cross which un nerves our defenders sort of doesn’t sit well to me, red x away 👍


You’ll get green tick and gold star from me. McKeown is a weakness not a strength, does not and never has controlled his box but got away with it as a decent shot stopper but any club that does some decent scouting on us will get the ball into our box in the air at every opportunity.

Regardless of Revan’s error, that sort of thing doesn’t ever look good.
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ska face
November 13, 2021, 8:46pm

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McKeown’s an absolute clown, always first to point the finger.
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Northbank Mariner
November 13, 2021, 8:59pm
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Quoted from dapperz fun pub
Macca chased after the young lad giving him a volley of abuse 🤔 he might not be ready for this level yet but coming from a keeper who flaps at every cross which un nerves our defenders sort of doesn’t sit well to me, red x away 👍


I can't red cross that because you're spot on... Macca is a great shot stopper, as proved today, but 10 years in his ability to come from crosses and delivery have not improved one bit.
In the 2 games I've watched Crocombe play he's quicker at the releasing ball and come off his line to command the ball, time for a change in goal imo
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Kris2
November 13, 2021, 9:13pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC
Revan at total fault for both goals. Lost his man for the first goal & his misjudged header for the second. He doesn’t look ready for this level yet. We should be looking to send him back:

But to defend him, Hurst did him no favours pairing him on the left with Khouri. 2 inexperienced players down one flank is never a good idea.

And also… McKeown sprinting after Revan to shout at him after the second is really poor from one of our senior pros against an 18-year-old. Revan was well aware his error caused the goal, he doesn’t need what confidence he had left after the incident being humiliated out of him.

.


Macca needs to stop doing that in general, it's the single aspect that I really dislike about him and it's his overreactions and temper, I don't like goalkeepers doing it in general. He often does it where he chases the linesman claiming offside and sprints off at him screaming his head off, it's a bit embarrassing to watch like how those old coaches in baseball come running off the bench to yell at the officials when a decision goes against them. Main difference in baseball is officials can throw players and coaches out of the game instantly for shouting at them lol.

The inexperience down that side showed and was exploited, Revan is very much an attacking option too as he's much better going forward and needs somebody who can cover him. He's a young kid though and will probably learn from his mistakes. I imagine if he was an 18 year old local lad people would be a lot kinder about him screwing up defensively, I guess more pressure on his back since he's not "one of our own" and from a bigger club so people expect him to be better but he's still a first or second year pro playing his first season of first team football. I don't think any of our own were at their best in the first year either, Clifton became good more recently with a few seasons under his belt and properly defining his role in the team. Hurst is probably dropping players to make a point but sticking two young lads next to each other on one side was not the greatest of choices. I don't really blame either for being thrown in the deep end there in a physical game.

The coaches need to figure out what our best team is with the players we have available and play them without chopping and changing the system too much and start building confidence in what we are doing back up. We looked incredibly lopsided today in quality on the pitch.
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hampshiremariner
November 13, 2021, 9:33pm
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McKeown sprinting after Revan to shout at him after the second is really poor from one of our senior pros against an 18-year-old.

Absolutely correct. It does not suggest a strong team spirit to me.
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rancido
November 13, 2021, 9:37pm

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If we don’t beat Southend, hurst out. We have a great feeling around the club, let’s not waste it


It was Hurst who put together the squad and picked the players/tactics that had us top of the league 3 league matches ago.


The Future is Black & White.
"The commonest thing on this planet is not water , as some people believe, but stupidity ". Frank Zappa
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dapperz fun pub
November 13, 2021, 9:44pm
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Macca needs to be dropped for every good stop theirs a mistake just around the corner. He’s a level 5 keeper he’s always been a level 5 keeper yeah I know his shot stopping is better than level 5 but unfortunately his commanding of his box and distribution is Sunday league level. He’s comfortable here to fooking comfortable imo and what did he do when he lost his spot to a far superior keeper fooking had a right paddy.
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Northbank Mariner
November 13, 2021, 9:46pm
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Quoted from rancido


It was Hurst who put together the squad and picked the players/tactics that had us top of the league 3 league matches ago.


And it's Hurst who's fiddled about with the team over the last 4 games and got it wrong...no ifs or buts, he's got it wrong..
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GollyGTFC
November 13, 2021, 9:54pm

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Quoted from hampshiremariner


McKeown sprinting after Revan to shout at him after the second is really poor from one of our senior pros against an 18-year-old.

Absolutely correct. It does not suggest a strong team spirit to me.


The funny thing is Hurst constantly bangs on about wanting to bring in the right character to fit into the group. Yet he tolerates a goalkeeper with form for shouting at/bullying/humiliating a teammate. It would be bad enough shouting at an experienced pro, but shouting at an 18-year-old like Revan is inexcusable.

Hurst needs to send a message by dropping him.
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Bigdog
November 13, 2021, 9:55pm
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First things first.. Is Crookes not fit? If so, why is he on the bench? If not, how is he not playing in front of Revan? Secondly, I've seen nothing from Khouri to suggest that he won't be playing anything higher than Gainsborough or Clee Town level when his contracts up. It was like playing with ten men and Revan is just not ready for men's football. Yet Hurst in his wisdom chose this left hand side instead of Crookes and Bapaga. Absolutely barmy, pushing snow uphill from the start.

We need a sharp pacy forward. One that can play on the half turn and run the channels so we can get teams defending facing their own goal. That's where danger lies. Not playing three or four clever triangles when the end result is ponderous balls into our wide men or centre forward with their backs to the goal in front of a bank of defenders.. especially balls ending up being lumped forward by Waterfall after a twenty pass move that goes nowhere. Plenty of time for the oppo to get their shape and have a breather. Pretty little passing patterns that achieve nothing. We criminally lack someone who can get onto little clipped balls into space before their defenders. If Waterfall ends up lumping it why do we need three in centre midfield?

I don't agree with you Hagrid mate, Aldershot are shite. Hardly got in our box second half yet still scored and hit the bar. There's not one of their players that I'd like us to sign to improve us. Judging by their strong and sometimes reckless challenges, they just wanted it more. A team with very little talent that just hoofs it clear beat us fair and square, and they weren't that good in chasing their long balls down either. We just got outmuscled and outnumbered in the areas where they wanted to defend to the point where our brains were frazzled when we had the ball. Mix that in with a lack in confidence, a lack of thought, a lack of composure in the final third, and the three points have gone. Easy to keep the ball playing across the back and deep in midfield, but where was the bravery at the business end? Full backs checking and starting again every time, very little clever movement. I did feel sorry for Hunt and Fox at times because there was fook all on and there should have been.

Thought Clifton was excellent first half then disappeared. his midfield partners had no outlets, Sousa was always a threat but needs more composure, Towler improved after a very shaky start and Efete was ok but needs more game time. Other than that, I thought the rest were shocking, even Taylor, whose movement consisted of just backing into his nearest marker, no clever darts or half turns.

For Southend? A new left hand side, change of keeper and maybe give Waterfall a rest for Longe-King next game. we're far too chaotic when the ball arrives in our own box and we're far too reluctant to throw midfield bodies forward in case we get caught on the break. For me, Waterfall's remarkable heading ability overshadows clear deficiences in other areas of his game. We have to break these defences down by getting more bodies in amongst them, not playing thirty yards in front of them. Ideally a new pacy striker in and we'll have to dispense with one of the midfield three and be a little more direct and play percentage balls forward quicker. This ponderous tippy tappy safety first shite isn't working. The National League has worked us out, especially without the class, unpredictability and guile of McAtee.

Been to four games, Bromley, Wealdstone, Maidenhead and Aldershot. Planning to go to Solihull. Am I a Jonah or just a sucker for awayday punishment? Fook knows, but Hurst has to do a lot better than this for us to stay in the promotion race and £££s need to be spent in January, or hopefully even earlier..
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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 9:59pm

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Quoted from GollyGTFC


The funny thing is Hurst constantly bangs on about wanting to bring in the right character to fit into the group. Yet he tolerates a goalkeeper with form for shouting at/bullying/humiliating a teammate. It would be bad enough shouting at an experienced pro, but shouting at an 18-year-old like Revan is inexcusable.

Hurst needs to send a message by dropping him.


Im sorry i disagree. Revan was absolutely diabolical today, this isnt a creche, this is mens football and its not bullying a teammate at all. I play Sunday league and if i make an error leading to a goal i tolerate my teammates getting on at me.

I blame hurst for playing him and then not taking him offf when he was clearly out his depth
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MuddyWaters
November 13, 2021, 9:59pm
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Quoted from Bigdog
First things first.. Is Crookes not fit? If so, why is he on the bench? If not, how is he not playing in front of Revan? Secondly, I've seen nothing from Khouri to suggest that he won't be playing anything higher than Gainsborough or Clee Town level when his contracts up. It was like playing with ten men and Revan is just not ready for men's football. Yet Hurst in his wisdom chose this left hand side instead of Crookes and Bapaga. Absolutely barmy, pushing snow uphill from the start.

We need a sharp pacy forward. One that can play on the half turn and run the channels so we can get teams defending facing their own goal. That's where danger lies. Not playing three or four clever triangles when the end result is ponderous balls into our wide men or centre forward with their backs to the goal in front of a bank of defenders.. especially balls ending up being lumped forward by Waterfall at the end of a twenty pass move that goes nowhere. Plenty of time for the oppo to get their shape and have a breather. Pretty little passing patterns that achieve nothing. We criminally lack someone who can get onto little clipped balls into space before their defenders. If Waterfall ends up lumping it why do we need three in centre midfield?

I don't agree with you Hagrid mate, Aldershot are shite. Hardly got in our box second half yet still scored and hit the bar. There's not one of their players that I'd like us to sign to improve us. Judging by their strong and sometimes reckless challenges, they just wanted it more. A team with very little talent that just hoofs it clear beat us fair and square, and they weren't that good in chasing their long balls down either. We just got outmuscled and outnumbered to the point where our brains were frazzled when we had the ball. Mix that in with a lack in confidence, a lack of thought, a lack of composure in the final third, and the three points have gone. Easy to keep the ball playing across the back and deep in midfield, but where was the bravery at the business end? Full backs checking and starting again every time, very little clever movement. I did feel sorry for Hunt and Fox at times because there was fook all on and there should have been.

Thought Clifton was excellent first half then disappeared. his midfield partners had no outlets, Sousa was always a threat but needs more composure, Towler improved after a very shaky start and Efete was ok but needs more game time. Other than that, I thought the rest were shocking, even Taylor whose movement consisted of just backing into his nearest marker, no clever darts or half turns.

New left hand side, change of keeper and maybe give Waterfall a rest for Longe-King next game. we're far too chaotic when the ball arrives in our own box and we're far too reluctant to throw midfield bodies forward in case we get caught on the break. We have to break these defences down by getting more bodies in amongst them, not playing thirty yards in front of them. Ideally a new pacy striker in and e'll have to dispense with one of the midfield three and be a little more direct and play percentage balls forward quicker. This ponderous tippy tappy safety first shite isn't working. The National League has worked us out, especially without the class, unpredictability and guile of McAtee.

Been to four games, Bromley, Wealdstone, Maidenhead and Aldershot. Planning to go to Solihull. Am I a Jonah or just a sucker for awayday punishment? Fook knows, but Hurst has to do a lot better than this for us to stay in the promotion race and £££s need to be spent in January, or hopefully even earlier..


Apparently Crookes barely trained this week according to John Tondeur.
Regards your choice of games, perhaps ask the powers that be for a fee to stay away?
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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 10:00pm

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Quoted from Bigdog
First things first.. Is Crookes not fit? If so, why is he on the bench? If not, how is he not playing in front of Revan? Secondly, I've seen nothing from Khouri to suggest that he won't be playing anything higher than Gainsborough or Clee Town level when his contracts up. It was like playing with ten men and Revan is just not ready for men's football. Yet Hurst in his wisdom chose this left hand side instead of Crookes and Bapaga. Absolutely barmy, pushing snow uphill from the start.

We need a sharp pacy forward. One that can play on the half turn and run the channels so we can get teams defending facing their own goal. That's where danger lies. Not playing three or four clever triangles when the end result is ponderous balls into our wide men or centre forward with their backs to the goal in front of a bank of defenders.. especially balls ending up being lumped forward by Waterfall after a twenty pass move that goes nowhere. Plenty of time for the oppo to get their shape and have a breather. Pretty little passing patterns that achieve nothing. We criminally lack someone who can get onto little clipped balls into space before their defenders. If Waterfall ends up lumping it why do we need three in centre midfield?

I don't agree with you Hagrid mate, Aldershot are shite. Hardly got in our box second half yet still scored and hit the bar. There's not one of their players that I'd like us to sign to improve us. Judging by their strong and sometimes reckless challenges, they just wanted it more. A team with very little talent that just hoofs it clear beat us fair and square, and they weren't that good in chasing their long balls down either. We just got outmuscled and outnumbered to the point where our brains were frazzled when we had the ball. Mix that in with a lack in confidence, a lack of thought, a lack of composure in the final third, and the three points have gone. Easy to keep the ball playing across the back and deep in midfield, but where was the bravery at the business end? Full backs checking and starting again every time, very little clever movement. I did feel sorry for Hunt and Fox at times because there was fook all on and there should have been.

Thought Clifton was excellent first half then disappeared. his midfield partners had no outlets, Sousa was always a threat but needs more composure, Towler improved after a very shaky start and Efete was ok but needs more game time. Other than that, I thought the rest were shocking, even Taylor whose movement consisted of just backing into his nearest marker, no clever darts or half turns.

New left hand side, change of keeper and maybe give Waterfall a rest for Longe-King next game. we're far too chaotic when the ball arrives in our own box and we're far too reluctant to throw midfield bodies forward in case we get caught on the break. We have to break these defences down by getting more bodies in amongst them, not playing thirty yards in front of them. Ideally a new pacy striker in and e'll have to dispense with one of the midfield three and be a little more direct and play percentage balls forward quicker. This ponderous tippy tappy safety first shite isn't working. The National League has worked us out, especially without the class, unpredictability and guile of McAtee.

Been to four games, Bromley, Wealdstone, Maidenhead and Aldershot. Planning to go to Solihull. Am I a Jonah or just a sucker for awayday punishment? Fook knows, but Hurst has to do a lot better than this for us to stay in the promotion race and £££s need to be spent in January, or hopefully even earlier..



Thats my point mate, they were shite, and we made them look good. They hit the bar twice, wanted it more, battled.


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TownSNAFU5
November 13, 2021, 10:00pm
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Frustrating to see over the years that Macca has not improved his clear weaknesses.  His kicking into touch every game is a very minor illustrative example.  It is not too difficult is it?


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GollyGTFC
November 13, 2021, 10:02pm

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Quoted from Hagrid


Im sorry i disagree. Revan was absolutely diabolical today, this isnt a creche, this is mens football and its not bullying a teammate at all. I play Sunday league and if i make an error leading to a goal i tolerate my teammates getting on at me.

I blame hurst for playing him and then not taking him offf when he was clearly out his depth


Sorry, but it’s 2021. Young footballers aren’t brought up in the old ways of being bullied by older YTs, senior pros and coaching staff to “toughen them up”.

In this day and age it’s bang out of order. No excuses.
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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 10:04pm

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Quoted from GollyGTFC


Sorry, but it’s 2021. Young footballers aren’t brought up in the old ways of being bullied by older YTs, senior pros and coaching staff to “toughen them up”.

In this day and age it’s bang out of order. No excuses.



The snowflake generation? In which everyone is offended by everything?

This is Mens football, and if you are consistently  not doing your job despite repeated instruction, i dont think its out of line to lose your temper at that player? Unprofessional possibly, but we’re all human.

What it possibly does show is that the Team Spirit PH is so keen on is not there yet
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MuddyWaters
November 13, 2021, 10:07pm
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Quoted from Hagrid


Im sorry i disagree. Revan was absolutely diabolical today, this isnt a creche, this is mens football and its not bullying a teammate at all. I play Sunday league and if i make an error leading to a goal i tolerate my teammates getting on at me.

I blame hurst for playing him and then not taking him offf when he was clearly out his depth


I’m seriously underwhelmed by Revan but that doesn’t excuse an alleged ‘club legend’ bawling him out after a glaring error. Let’s face it, McKeown isn’t exactly squeaky clean in the points costing error department.
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DB
November 13, 2021, 10:07pm
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Quoted from MuddyWaters


You’ll get green tick and gold star from me. McKeown is a weakness not a strength, does not and never has controlled his box but got away with it as a decent shot stopper but any club that does some decent scouting on us will get the ball into our box in the air at every opportunity.

Regardless of Revan’s error, that sort of thing doesn’t ever look good.


So it's Revan's error but Macca's fault for the goals, being the last man standing! Sounds logical, not.



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MuddyWaters
November 13, 2021, 10:10pm
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Quoted from DB


So it's Revan's error but Macca's fault for the goals, being the last man standing! Sounds logical, not.



I’d love to know in which part of my post did I blame McKeown for today’s goals. It was a general point regarding his goalkeeping and a specific point regarding Revan.
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DB
November 13, 2021, 10:13pm
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Quoted from Hagrid


Im sorry i disagree. Revan was absolutely diabolical today, this isnt a creche, this is mens football and its not bullying a teammate at all. I play Sunday league and if i make an error leading to a goal i tolerate my teammates getting on at me.

I blame hurst for playing him and then not taking him offf when he was clearly out his depth


Totally agree with you, from the early part of the 1st half Revan needed replacing, but wasn't. For what reason he wasn't out of his depth he had sunk but Hurst didn't or couldn't see it.



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DB
November 13, 2021, 10:15pm
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Quoted from MuddyWaters


I’d love to know in which part of my post did I blame McKeown for today’s goals. It was a general point regarding his goalkeeping and a specific point regarding Revan.


I think the above answers your question.



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Bigdog
November 13, 2021, 10:15pm
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Quoted from DB


So it's Revan's error but Macca's fault for the goals, being the last man standing! Sounds logical, not.



Macca was out of order. Right in front of our fans too. He should know better. Arm round the shoulder and a quiet word of encouragement would have been better for an 18yo. Lost count of how many balls under his crossbar Macca didn't go for early in the game, unlike the Aldershot keeper. Time for Crocombe to be given a go, or else why the hell have we signed him?
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dapperz fun pub
November 13, 2021, 10:19pm
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Quoted from Hagrid



The snowflake generation? In which everyone is offended by everything?

This is Mens football, and if you are consistently  not doing your job despite repeated instruction, i dont think its out of line to lose your temper at that player? Unprofessional possibly, but we’re all human.

What it possibly does show is that the Team Spirit PH is so keen on is not there yet


Do you think Jason & Andrew would approve of this behaviour ? I thought they were trying to promote equality inclusiveness fairness understanding in all aspects of the club. A senior pro humiliated the boy probably in front of family members and if I was a coach from his parent club I’d be cancelling the agreement pronto
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DB
November 13, 2021, 10:21pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC


Sorry, but it’s 2021. Young footballers aren’t brought up in the old ways of being bullied by older YTs, senior pros and coaching staff to “toughen them up”.

In this day and age it’s bang out of order. No excuses.


Now which is the correct way to approach such a situation:-

A/ Look here sonny you'll have to do better, I know it's not your fault and you're doing your best. We've just gone a goal down and might lose the game. Tell you what they can blame me for your error' if that will help.

B/ What effing hell were you doing.

It's all a matter of choice but for me and 3 points lost I'll take B



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Hagrid
November 13, 2021, 10:23pm

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Quoted from dapperz fun pub


Do you think Jason & Andrew would approve of this behaviour ? I thought they were trying to promote equality inclusiveness fairness understanding in all aspects of the club



Well they’ve already stated they wont get involved in the playing side. Thats for PH to deal with, if Mckeown was out of order then i expect PH to deal with it.

Having just listened to the post match interview reading between the lines id be surprised if we see Revan or Khouri again for a while
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dapperz fun pub
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Quoted from DB


Now which is the correct way to approach such a situation:-

A/ Look here sonny you'll have to do better, I know it's not your fault and you're doing your best. We've just gone a goal down and might lose the game. Tell you what they can blame me for your error' if that will help.

B/ What effing hell were you doing.

It's all a matter of choice but for me and 3 points lost I'll take B



Is this to macca ?
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DB
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Quoted from Hagrid



The snowflake generation? In which everyone is offended by everything?

This is Mens football, and if you are consistently  not doing your job despite repeated instruction, i dont think its out of line to lose your temper at that player? Unprofessional possibly, but we’re all human.

What it possibly does show is that the Team Spirit PH is so keen on is not there yet



Quoted from dapperz fun pub


Do you think Jason & Andrew would approve of this behaviour ? I thought they were trying to promote equality inclusiveness fairness understanding in all aspects of the club. A senior pro humiliated the boy probably in front of family members and if I was a coach from his parent club I’d be cancelling the agreement pronto


Jason and Andrew may own the club but it is the fans who pay the wages!




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Maringer
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McKeown has always bickered with his defenders. I can remember many a barney with Pearson during his previous spell at the club. I'd imagine he'd have been the same if Waterfall had been the one making the errors.

Doesn't make it right, but that's the way it is. Hopefully he apologised to Revan after the game.
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Poojah
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Well, well, well; what to make of all this? Not just today, but this now somewhat concerning run of results. Have we ever had four straight defeats before at any point in our non-league journey?

It’s difficult to make sense of our current situation. We are, after all, still 3rd in the league and in touching distance of top spot. But much like I didn’t see our undeniably brilliant start to the season coming, nor had I anticipated this sudden, sharp decline in form. Even ignoring the fact we initially started so well, Wealdstone, Kidderminster and Aldershot aren’t games I’d have been expecting us to lose before the season started.

I felt a few weeks ago that this run of games, up to and including the Southend game, was one we had to be taking close to maximum points from. After Southend, 8 out of our next 9 games are against the current top 9. Regardless of form, that always looked to be a patch of games fraught with opportunities to drop points, and it looks even more treacherous this evening.

As we’re learning right now, things can change very quickly in football, but as it stands we all of a sudden look in real danger of falling out of the promotion picture altogether. We’re currently only 3 points clear of 8th place Solihull who we play a week on Tuesday. Lose 5 or 6 of those games against our promotion rivals, and we will be out of touch.

I can’t bring myself to be melodramatic about Hurst just yet - I’d have been delighted with where we are after 15 games back in the summer. However, I also can’t deny that this sequence of results is deeply concerning, particularly in light of what’s immediately in front of us.

We can’t blame injuries for today. Even without McAtee, we should have had enough in us not to lose to an Aldershot side with an absolutely dire home record, almost as bad as it could have been going into the game.

There’s something deeper at play, certainly. Have we been worked out? Has something gone on behind the scenes? Were we in a false position?

I don’t know the answer, but I do know that this next few weeks will be a big test for the new, chipper Hurst. The games between now and mid January will be season-defining.


A smooth sea never made a skillful mariner.
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mariner91
November 13, 2021, 10:56pm
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Playing Khouri today was the weirdest selection decision Hurst has ever made in however many hundreds of games he has been in charge of us.


Looking forward to a brighter future now Fenty has gone.
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Zmariner
November 13, 2021, 11:02pm
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Some positives, we seem to have been decent at home this season. Away from home we are clearly rubbish.
I expect to see all guns blazing against Southend, nothing less will be acceptable and hurst will realise this.
Honeymoon period truly over as personally I thought he was a bit lucky to get the gig this season given the abysmal job he did last season. Usually what I find With hurst is that he’s a good learner and I expect a completely different show on Friday night and I predict a very comfortable home win.
In addition, he now needs to gamble on a striker fairly soon so he’s own neck could be on the line. Personally I would go for a very robust defence in these away games as it is clear that we are defensively poor in the away games.

I still think there is a place for Pearson and longe king
Towler is a great prospect and in home games where you are dominant very good. In these away games I would go for blockers. Revan as many have said it is clearly out of his depth and should’ve been pulled off after 20 minutes today.
It is a man’s game The commentators on the radio saw him as a weak link. in a few minutes why on earth did hurst not utm
Utm
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Limerick Mariner
November 14, 2021, 12:55am
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Quoted from Poojah
Well, well, well; what to make of all this? Not just today, but this now somewhat concerning run of results. Have we ever had four straight defeats before at any point in our non-league journey?

It’s difficult to make sense of our current situation. We are, after all, still 3rd in the league and in touching distance of top spot. But much like I didn’t see our undeniably brilliant start to the season coming, nor had I anticipated this sudden, sharp decline in form. Even ignoring the fact we initially started so well, Wealdstone, Kidderminster and Aldershot aren’t games I’d have been expecting us to lose before the season started.

I felt a few weeks ago that this run of games, up to and including the Southend game, was one we had to be taking close to maximum points from. After Southend, 8 out of our next 9 games are against the current top 9. Regardless of form, that always looked to be a patch of games fraught with opportunities to drop points, and it looks even more treacherous this evening.

As we’re learning right now, things can change very quickly in football, but as it stands we all of a sudden look in real danger of falling out of the promotion picture altogether. We’re currently only 3 points clear of 8th place Solihull who we play a week on Tuesday. Lose 5 or 6 of those games against our promotion rivals, and we will be out of touch.

I can’t bring myself to be melodramatic about Hurst just yet - I’d have been delighted with where we are after 15 games back in the summer. However, I also can’t deny that this sequence of results is deeply concerning, particularly in light of what’s immediately in front of us.

We can’t blame injuries for today. Even without McAtee, we should have had enough in us not to lose to an Aldershot side with an absolutely dire home record, almost as bad as it could have been going into the game.

There’s something deeper at play[/b], certainly. Have we been worked out? Has something gone on behind the scenes? Were we in a false position?

I don’t know the answer, but I do know that this next few weeks will be a big test for the new, chipper Hurst. The games between now and mid January will be season-defining.


Clearly, even with a patched up side we should have got something from today. I think the deeper thing at play is yes we were in a false position. Look at the squad in the cold light of 4 defeats on the bounce and it really doesn't look good enough. 4 young lads in todays match day squad - no matter what their potential they are still young lads and one of them probably isn't ready at all. We've have one 33 year old striker with a moderate League 2 scoring record and one 32 year old forward with no sort of scoring record, save for previous spell with us at this level, when this league was undoubtedly weaker. The bookies had us fringe play-offs and with this squad that looks about right. What PH has done thus far is get this squad to outperform, with us looking pretty solid defensively, but now it's only just (3 points above 8th place). When all was going well I still thought we'd need the no. 9. but now I think we need two players to be solid play-off candidates.

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Mayaman
November 14, 2021, 1:13am
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The whole situation baffles me.  McAtee has been a key player this season already but we've won games when he hasn't participated.   The issue is either tactics or a psychological one.  What has happened to the team spirit?  Why have players changed from 'solid' to 'nervy' overnight?  The root needs to be addressed. We are till calling for a number 9 but we can't create chances for the strike force. Five games ago, we had the most goals scored in the league with contributions from all over the pitch.
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Mayaman
November 14, 2021, 5:13am
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Quoted from DB


Now which is the correct way to approach such a situation:-

A/ Look here sonny you'll have to do better, I know it's not your fault and you're doing your best. We've just gone a goal down and might lose the game. Tell you what they can blame me for your error' if that will help.

B/ What effing hell were you doing.

It's all a matter of choice but for me and 3 points lost I'll take B



It depends on the person surely.  Some people like B as it galvanizes them.  Some get demotivated by B and therefore A would be a better option.  I remember recently JT was saying that we scored a good goal.  He laughed and replied, "it wasn't good, it was decent."  No matter how roughty toughty and northern we are, we all need praise from time to time.  It's a human trait.   It doesn't have to be gushing, schmaltzy American style stuff but acknowledgment of a job well done goes a long way.  When we've won convincingly in the past, he has focused on the X amount of minutes we lost focus.  
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blundellpork
November 14, 2021, 6:09am

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Quoted from mariner91
Playing Khouri today was the weirdest selection decision Hurst has ever made in however many hundreds of games he has been in charge of us.


Bold statement. Damien Spencer? Louis Soares? Tomlinson ahead of Bogle/ Amond, loaning Dean Henderson but then leaving him on the bench, despite being head and shoulders above that level. There are plenty of comparables.
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pen penfras
November 14, 2021, 6:58am

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Quoted from Mayaman


It depends on the person surely.  Some people like B as it galvanizes them.  Some get demotivated by B and therefore A would be a better option.  I remember recently JT was saying that we scored a good goal.  He laughed and replied, "it wasn't good, it was decent."  No matter how roughty toughty and northern we are, we all need praise from time to time.  It's a human trait.   It doesn't have to be gushing, schmaltzy American style stuff but acknowledgment of a job well done goes a long way.  When we've won convincingly in the past, he has focused on the X amount of minutes we lost focus.  


I remember playing in Sunday league and being berated for making a mistake, not even one that led to a goal. I knew more than anybody that I'd made that mistake and didn't need it pointing out to me. As a 17 year old being singled out put me in my shell and made me want to hide away, but an arm around the shoulder and encouragement would have been a much better approach. Now I'm a lot older, I'd probably just tell him to do one and it might even fire me up, but it's still not the right thing to do.
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Abdul19
November 14, 2021, 7:45am

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Quoted from Poojah
Have we ever had four straight defeats before at any point in our non-league journey?



The 4 games before the Wrexham trophy final (yes weather fans, we know it was cold).

Kidderminster, Mansfield, Cambridge and Nuneaton.


JESUS AT THE CENTRE
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easypeersy
November 14, 2021, 8:02am
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McKeown is well past his sell by date.
Hurst is winding us all up again!
So frustrating as a supporter!
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Humbercod
November 14, 2021, 8:11am
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Quoted from easypeersy
McKeown is well past his sell by date.
Hurst is winding us all up again!
So frustrating as a supporter!


His all round game has been questioned for a while now but listening on the radio sounded like he pulled off a worldly save?
These save’s he makes have been the difference between 1 point or 3 so I wouldn’t write him off.

Saying that I would bring in Cracombe now he’s another one who deserves his chance, and Mckeown has come back looking a better player after a touch on the sidelines.
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mariner91
November 14, 2021, 8:16am
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Quoted from blundellpork


Bold statement. Damien Spencer? Louis Soares? Tomlinson ahead of Bogle/ Amond, loaning Dean Henderson but then leaving him on the bench, despite being head and shoulders above that level. There are plenty of comparables.


Damian Spencer was rubbish but was never played out of position as far as I’m aware.

Soares was an underwhelming signing but playing him in his normal position ahead of our other players at the time, particularly given how well he’d played that season before we signed him, was not baffling.

Tomlinson wasn’t as good as Bogle or Amond but was played in his correct position and I think it was done to make a point that they weren’t doing enough defending from the front.

Not playing Henderson was odd given how good he is but McKeown was/is an adequate keeper ahead of him.

Playing a young lad who has barely played all season in a position he is not used to in front of another very young player who has been questionable at times is bizarre. Even more bizarre when Bapaga was on the bench and came on so was presumably fit enough and although has been a bit hit and miss, he has at times been our best attacking threat. Hell, Clifton has played out on the left and done well at times so it would have even made more sense to put Clifton there and at least have Khouri in the middle in a position he’s comfortable in. Add in the fact it had clearly been identified by Aldershot as being a major weak point and was targeted from early in the first half yet it was inexplicably not changed at half time and it is, your honour, convincingly the weirdest selection decision Hurst has ever made whilst in charge of us.


Looking forward to a brighter future now Fenty has gone.
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rancido
November 14, 2021, 9:27am

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Quoted from Northbank Mariner


And it's Hurst who's fiddled about with the team over the last 4 games and got it wrong...no ifs or buts, he's got it wrong..


In hindsight, yes he got it wrong yesterday but he picks a team that he thinks will get a result. This has been his approach all season. I know it is hypothetical but if we had had the same results this season but in a different sequence would there would still be this reaction? If we had lost to Aldershot in the first game of the season and these losses had been spread throughout the season thus far but still sat so high in the league would the fans be pleased with our progress or disappointed?


The Future is Black & White.
"The commonest thing on this planet is not water , as some people believe, but stupidity ". Frank Zappa
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TheRealJohnLewis
November 14, 2021, 9:29am
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Quoted from Mayaman


It depends on the person surely.  Some people like B as it galvanizes them.  Some get demotivated by B and therefore A would be a better option.  I remember recently JT was saying that we scored a good goal.  He laughed and replied, "it wasn't good, it was decent."  No matter how roughty toughty and northern we are, we all need praise from time to time.  It's a human trait.   It doesn't have to be gushing, schmaltzy American style stuff but acknowledgment of a job well done goes a long way.  When we've won convincingly in the past, he has focused on the X amount of minutes we lost focus.  


Absolutely.  A good leader will know his troops, and what makes them tick, and how to get the best out of them. Only Revan and those in the dressing room will know whether Macca's rant had the desired effect.
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MuddyWaters
November 14, 2021, 9:40am
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Unfortunately, Revan isn’t ready for men’s football yet. He was poor when he replaced Sears at right back v County and obviously the same yesterday. Which underlines how good Crookes has been and that it’s another position where we’re light on cover. As well as up front and in midfield.
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KingstonMariner
November 14, 2021, 9:45am
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Agree totally with this extract from Bigdog’s post

“Not playing three or four clever triangles when the end result is ponderous balls into our wide men or centre forward with their backs to the goal in front of a bank of defenders.. especially balls ending up being lumped forward by Waterfall after a twenty pass move that goes nowhere. Plenty of time for the oppo to get their shape and have a breather.”

I think this is where McAtee makes all the difference. When he’s playing we are much more incisive in our attack, and we attack more frequently, and he battles for the ball as soon as we lose it in their half. As a result we see less of the ball in our half. Our defensive frailties are less exposed.

I’d disagree with Barra on one thing. I thought the Town fans were poor yesterday. We lost heart too easily. No sustained singing in the second half. A few scattered efforts.


Through the door there came familiar laughter,
I saw your face and heard you call my name.
Oh my friend we're older but no wiser,
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
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quebec38
November 14, 2021, 9:49am
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Not gonna lie I looked at the team yesterday and was pleased to see Khouri in there. I thought it might be the freshener in midfield that I’ve been asking for but it sounds like it didn’t work out.

Revan was a head-scratcher but you can only assume Crookes wasn’t fit enough. For me if your left-back isn’t fit enough to play then he’s a waste of a spot on a 5 man bench so that has to go down as an error on Hurst’s part.

I think it is fair to say McAtee being unavailable is having the impact we all thought it might. He really is head and shoulders above this division both technically and industriously. McAtee being injured isn’t Hurst’s fault, but the fact there is absolutely no plan in place to cover for it, is.

We are now asking anyone to fill in the hole behind Taylor when they can’t do it, which is no slight on them because it isn’t what they do. There isn’t a single other central midfielder in the squad who you would say often makes runs in to the box and that is down to the manager. Fair enough, you could argue that there is nobody available but at what point do you have to take the hit ability-wise and get someone in who at least plays that role in order to bolster the squad.

Same applies to the centre forward position. Taylor is great and Lenny is Lenny. Surely there must be someone available that offers pace, even if they take 1 in 10 chances. We need either more options from the beginning or coming on off the bench. Grant and Scannell might help here yet but neither can be relied on.

On the whole still more than happy with how we’ve started and right behind the manager and team. We can still be top of the league on Friday night let us remember. There are definitely a few red marks against Hurst’s name however but hopefully he’ll learn from his mistakes and we will improve as a result.
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GollyGTFC
November 14, 2021, 9:53am

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Quoted from KingstonMariner
Agree totally with this extract from Bigdog’s post

“Not playing three or four clever triangles when the end result is ponderous balls into our wide men or centre forward with their backs to the goal in front of a bank of defenders.. especially balls ending up being lumped forward by Waterfall after a twenty pass move that goes nowhere. Plenty of time for the oppo to get their shape and have a breather.”

I think this is where McAtee makes all the difference. When he’s playing we are much more incisive in our attack, and we attack more frequently, and he battles for the ball as soon as we lose it in their half. As a result we see less of the ball in our half. Our defensive frailties are less exposed.

I’d disagree with Barra on one thing. I thought the Town fans were poor yesterday. We lost heart too easily. No sustained singing in the second half. A few scattered efforts.


McAtee links everything. He drifts wide to give an extra option to full backs in possession and makes space for other players by dragging opposition players out of position to deal with him. But he’s injured and we’re playing the same system without an adequate replacement. But what can we do when we’ve got 2 similar strikers at the club and that’s it? If we go 2 upfront we don’t have an attacking option on the bench apart from a YT (Essel).
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MuddyWaters
November 14, 2021, 10:15am
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Quoted from GollyGTFC


McAtee links everything. He drifts wide to give an extra option to full backs in possession and makes space for other players by dragging opposition players out of position to deal with him. But he’s injured and we’re playing the same system without an adequate replacement. But what can we do when we’ve got 2 similar strikers at the club and that’s it? If we go 2 upfront we don’t have an attacking option on the bench apart from a YT (Essel).


Lenny isn’t at all similar to Taylor either in terms of playing style or ability.
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forza ivano
November 14, 2021, 11:38am

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Everyone criticising Hurst's decision to play Khouri and Revan, but if Crookes wasn't fir then what choice did he have? Yes there was Bapaga, but imho he's gone off the boil and been very disappoitning the last 3 times ive seen him. Bapaga and revan would've left us even more exposed on that side. he presumably played Khouri because he's more solid and can tackle

On reflection i'd be interested to see the game again because w eactually looked ok in the first half i thought. Sousa was causing them real problems, clifton was outstanding and hunt was pinging the ball around and was moving it far more quickly than Coke does. There were several passages of play where we looked like the GTFC of Septemeber.
But 2nd half everyone seemed to go into their shell - clifton disappeared, hunt's passing went completely awry and we just seemed to rely on Waterfall's diagonals

I think Golly said McAtee is the difference - he's the fulcrum of the side. Taylor has looked  a shadow of himself since McAtee got injured - he doesn't get the service and is completely isolated. McAtee's chasing down is ahuge miss and his movement gives the midfield something to pass to. Without him the only options are a square ball, try and get it to Taylor or give it to Sousa who always has 2 or 3 men of him.
Add to that teams having sussed out Sousa and the Hunt/Waterfall combo and we are stunted in our attacking options

ps have to laugh about posters moaning about Hurst's tinkering and then picking a completely revised team to play v Sarfend
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MuddyWaters
November 14, 2021, 11:40am
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Quoted from forza ivano
Everyone criticising Hurst's decision to play Khouri and Revan, but if Crookes wasn't fir then what choice did he have? Yes there was Bapaga, but imho he's gone off the boil and been very disappoitning the last 3 times ive seen him. Bapaga and revan would've left us even more exposed on that side. he presumably played Khouri because he's more solid and can tackle

On reflection i'd be interested to see the game again because w eactually looked ok in the first half i thought. Sousa was causing them real problems, clifton was outstanding and hunt was pinging the ball around and was moving it far more quickly than Coke does. There were several passages of play where we looked like the GTFC of Septemeber.
But 2nd half everyone seemed to go into their shell - clifton disappeared, hunt's passing went completely awry and we just seemed to rely on Waterfall's diagonals

I think Golly said McAtee is the difference - he's the fulcrum of the side. Taylor has looked  a shadow of himself since McAtee got injured - he doesn't get the service and is completely isolated. McAtee's chasing down is ahuge miss and his movement gives the midfield something to pass to. Without him the only options are a square ball, try and get it to Taylor or give it to Sousa who always has 2 or 3 men of him.
Add to that teams having sussed out Sousa and the Hunt/Waterfall combo and we are stunted in our attacking options

ps have to laugh about posters moaning about Hurst's tinkering and then picking a completely revised team to play v Sarfend


Crookes was on the bench, wasn’t he?
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HertsGTFC
November 14, 2021, 12:14pm

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My view is quite simplistic if McAtee and Taylor had been together we’d have beaten Notts County.

The away losses exposes a few things,

- Lack of quality away from the first 11

- The mix of inexperienced players and experience, there are too few players in these selections who know how to get themselves out of a spot of bother away from home.

-  Not enough “never say die” Dis like players to pop up with a late run headed goal to rescue a point.

- Some odd selections to be fair mainly driven by injuries/knocks and the in my view right reluctance to risk players. When we played a settled side we did well.

I didn’t expect to lose to Aldershot, Kiddy and Wealdstone and I think the players need to take some accountability for that as well as the manager.

The main thing this exposes is where still a big work in progress and to be truly serious contenders we need to bring in at least 2 or 3 maybe 4 experienced credible performance similar to the level Chesterfield, Wrexham, Stockport and Notts have.

For a number of reasons many not down to the manager I don’t expect an influx of the type described above to arrive in January.

In reality we all knew it would be a bumpy ride, this feels like a big bump that if not ridden over starting Friday
could define our season.  






"Crombie you would have got to that if you weren't such a fat ba%$@rd" - George Kerr, inspiration from the dug out 70s style  
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Limerick Mariner
November 14, 2021, 12:44pm
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Quoted from HertsGTFC
My view is quite simplistic if McAtee and Taylor had been together we’d have beaten Notts County.

The away losses exposes a few things,

- Lack of quality away from the first 11

- The mix of inexperienced players and experience, there are too few players in these selections who know how to get themselves out of a spot of bother away from home.

-  Not enough “never say die” Dis like players to pop up with a late run headed goal to rescue a point.

- Some odd selections to be fair mainly driven by injuries/knocks and the in my view right reluctance to risk players. When we played a settled side we did well.

I didn’t expect to lose to Aldershot, Kiddy and Wealdstone and I think the players need to take some accountability for that as well as the manager.

The main thing this exposes is where still a big work in progress and to be truly serious contenders we need to bring in at least 2 or 3 maybe 4 experienced credible performance similar to the level Chesterfield, Wrexham, Stockport and Notts have.

For a number of reasons many not down to the manager I don’t expect an influx of the type described above to arrive in January.

In reality we all knew it would be a bumpy ride, this feels like a big bump that if not ridden over starting Friday
could define our season.  



Another point from Poojah's post above - have teams worked as out? When opposition managers look at our likely matchday squad they can wind up their feisty lads - some nice little youths for you to bully today. The total commitment to close down and harass is proving a winner against us away from home. We don't have midfield enforcer - McAtee is the player with the right kind physicality. That's why I'd like to see the no. 9 signing so we can play two up front and give McAtee free reign to impose himself behind the front two, especially against these southern pub sides that are turning us over on their own turf.

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louth_in_the_south
November 14, 2021, 2:02pm

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Difficult to come up with answers for yesterday’s performance really because it was a game we should be getting 3 points from .  
It’s easy to single out players for criticism but the number of players who have been criticised says to me that all the players have to take more personal responsibility and be better .
I don’t get the criticism of Sousa from some people. The one really creative and dangerous player we have who can beat 2 players at once and get a cross in . Shame our strikers are unable to get on the end of them .
2 strikers and a left mid on my January shopping list please .


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Hagrid
November 14, 2021, 2:32pm

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Quoted from louth_in_the_south
Difficult to come up with answers for yesterday’s performance really because it was a game we should be getting 3 points from .  
It’s easy to single out players for criticism but the number of players who have been criticised says to me that all the players have to take more personal responsibility and be better .
I don’t get the criticism of Sousa from some people. The one really creative and dangerous player we have who can beat 2 players at once and get a cross in . Shame our strikers are unable to get on the end of them .
2 strikers and a left mid on my January shopping list please .



Ah cmon his end product has been very poor for a number of games. He’s an exciting player but lets not pretend we are creating guilt edge chances.
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louth_in_the_south
November 14, 2021, 2:45pm

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I’d rather have him in the team than not .


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MuddyWaters
November 14, 2021, 2:47pm
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Quoted from louth_in_the_south
Difficult to come up with answers for yesterday’s performance really because it was a game we should be getting 3 points from .  
It’s easy to single out players for criticism but the number of players who have been criticised says to me that all the players have to take more personal responsibility and be better .
I don’t get the criticism of Sousa from some people. The one really creative and dangerous player we have who can beat 2 players at once and get a cross in . Shame our strikers are unable to get on the end of them .
2 strikers and a left mid on my January shopping list please .


My January shopping list depends on the ongoing fitness of Grant, Scannell and Wright. That said, we certainly need cover at left back, another midfield option and one striker minimum.
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Limerick Mariner
November 14, 2021, 3:01pm
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Quoted from Hagrid



Ah cmon his end product has been very poor for a number of games. He’s an exciting player but lets not pretend we are creating guilt edge chances.


Slightly goes against what I said above about this league being better than 6 years ago, but if you look at some of the comedy goals scored yesterday you don't always need to create chances you just need to create mistakes and have the right player to pounce on them. Chesterfield and Wrexham didn't really create the goals they scored yesterday they just created a bit of chaotic defending by the opposition...

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barralad
November 14, 2021, 3:22pm
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Quoted from KingstonMariner
Agree totally with this extract from Bigdog’s post

“Not playing three or four clever triangles when the end result is ponderous balls into our wide men or centre forward with their backs to the goal in front of a bank of defenders.. especially balls ending up being lumped forward by Waterfall after a twenty pass move that goes nowhere. Plenty of time for the oppo to get their shape and have a breather.”

I think this is where McAtee makes all the difference. When he’s playing we are much more incisive in our attack, and we attack more frequently, and he battles for the ball as soon as we lose it in their half. As a result we see less of the ball in our half. Our defensive frailties are less exposed.

I’d disagree with Barra on one thing. I thought the Town fans were poor yesterday. We lost heart too easily. No sustained singing in the second half. A few scattered efforts.


I think you've misread my post. We were outsung and out shouted by fans of a team which has lost 11 home games on the bounce.


The aim of argument or discussion should not be victory but progress.

Joseph Joubert.
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TheRealJohnLewis
November 14, 2021, 3:35pm
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The Aldershot fans were brilliant and killed off most of the town songs with their noise.  It goes to show that a drummer who can hold the beat and keep the speed down it adds to the atmosphere. There were a couple of times when we sang along to the beat of their drum and the songs lasted a lot longer than they would have normally where the songs just get faster and faster
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KingstonMariner
November 14, 2021, 3:50pm
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Quoted from barralad


I think you've misread my post. We were outsung and out shouted by fans of a team which has lost 11 home games on the bounce.


I did misread it. Apologies. I agree with what you said.


Through the door there came familiar laughter,
I saw your face and heard you call my name.
Oh my friend we're older but no wiser,
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
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KingstonMariner
November 14, 2021, 3:54pm
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Quoted from TheRealJohnLewis
The Aldershot fans were brilliant and killed off most of the town songs with their noise.  It goes to show that a drummer who can hold the beat and keep the speed down it adds to the atmosphere. There were a couple of times when we sang along to the beat of their drum and the songs lasted a lot longer than they would have normally where the songs just get faster and faster


I don’t remember this need for speed being a thing in the old days. Is it because more contemporary music has faster beats? Or were older generations more used to community singing or drill?

It’s amazing how one word chants like ‘fish’ and ‘maaariners’ can soon run out of steam.


Through the door there came familiar laughter,
I saw your face and heard you call my name.
Oh my friend we're older but no wiser,
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
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jamesgtfc
November 14, 2021, 3:54pm
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McAtee is clearly a big miss and Taylor has been a shadow of himself without him too, although some of that may be the Covid interruption. The 3 questions I have are:

How long is it going to be until he's back up to speed?
Who can we sign that will offer what McAtee does?
What is an alternative style that we can play effectively without McAtee?
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Hants.Mariner
November 14, 2021, 5:06pm
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Two struggling teams on current form but the one who wanted it more got the win they deserved. Despite having played in midweek Aldershot looked better prepared than us, had good set pieces that had clearly been worked on, and despite their recent record looked still to have more confidence to try and play than us. Therefore you have to wonder about our preparation it’s almost like we didn’t know what to expect and couldn’t react.

Surely we knew Aldershot had a long throw weapon and had given some thought to how to defend it? Crookes was surely a better option defensively than Revan, I can’t imagine he would have given such a quality assist from the near post on that throw? Although I also wonder if some of the defensive frailty stems from a lack of confidence in McKeown. We seem to look like we are going to concede a goal from any set piece at present, compare his performance with the Aldershot keeper who collected everything put into his area with confidence.

Thought when we went forward with pace we still looked a threat it’s just we are misplacing or over hitting passes that earlier in the season we’re on target. We are not that far away it’s just a lack of confidence a scruffy win may be all it takes to turn things round again. Problem yesterday was everything was static on the left side and there was no threat so Aldershot could afford to gang up on Sousa. I didn’t think Efete played too badly actually, again it was more a lack of confidence which probably stopped him taking too much responsibility. Taylor is clearly not yet fit and should have buried his chance near the end, I was getting ready to celebrate as he pulled his foot back and I can’t believe he hit the ball low and not lift it into an empty net. Unfortunately at the moment there is no alternative to him.

Clifton was excellent first half but for some reason disappeared in the second whilst Fox seemed to have difficulty passing the ball forward. All just so frustrating, you cannot win this league if you’re not good enough to win at the likes of Aldershot, and you can’t even compete with them when they’ve lost their last eleven home games.

I think we need new blood. A left sided player so we can stretch the pitch and stop defences putting numbers on Sousa because there is another threat to worry about. And obviously a striker who will score the type of chances Taylor and Bapaga missed late on yesterday. I still think there is a team there but we know Hurst reverts to type too quickly and all the tinkering is clearly messing with the players minds. If he keeps on stubbornly on the current trajectory I fear even for our chances of making the playoffs but if he realises what needs to be done, and it’s looking pretty obvious now, we can still get the season back on track.


The world weighs on my shoulders
But what am I to do
You sometimes drive me crazy
But I worry about you
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