|
|
 BeijingMariner |
| October 14, 2021, 12:54pm |
|
Cocktail Drinker  Posts: 1,620
Posts Per Day: 0.43
Reputation: 80.9%
Rep Score: +9 / -2
Location: Phuket, Thailand
Approval: +1,677
Gold Stars: 40
|
The barrier is there for a reason though. It’s ABP’s land and they quite rightly don’t just let any one in. The docks area can’t be an option for 365 day a year new stadium whilst it is owned and managed by ABP.
I know and I agree, but that's not where the conversation has to end, which seems like your argument. Jackal's post is full of ideas and positivity, but you seem to just dismiss it. I mean, each to his own, of course, but what's wrong with talking about what is possible? All I am saying is that things can change, but change cannot happen if people only accept things the way they are. If that were the case, the club would have folded a long time ago, surely? People believe in the football club and the fact that it's situation can be improved, they believed in it to the tune of 100,000 GBP not so long back, right? Change can happen, ABP doesn't need or use all of that land and to be honest, it doesn't look like it is doing a great job of looking after what it does have, anyway. |
|
|
|
|
|
| psgmariner |
| October 14, 2021, 12:59pm |
|
|
Posts: 10,122
Posts Per Day: 1.69
Reputation: 73.33%
Rep Score: +39 / -15
Approval: +5,480
Gold Stars: 33
|
Fair points and I agree it’s worth exploring the docks as an option but it seems one of the less likely to happen in my opinion.
|
| |
|
 Logged |
|
|
|
|
| Jackal |
|
Shandy Drinker  Posts: 62
Posts Per Day: 0.04
Reputation: 83.41%
Rep Score: +2 / 0
Approval: +211
Gold Stars: 15
|
ABP are a landlord and property developer as much as a port operator.
That land is not going to be useful to them in any great form. More car storage?
Looking at ABP’s financial performance they aren’t ripping up any trees for their investors.
They will be more than happy to sell and if not then a 999 year lease please.
My thoughts aren’t focused on the docks I’m thinking development from at least Kent street straight back to the docks. Be radical .
Re route the road around the new development. Close the railway line. Sorry but the reality is Grimsby and Cleethorpes doesn’t need two stations and tourists tend to drive in. Keep the docks station for visiting fans.
Anyway I’ve ranted enough so will stop. I just wanted to initially respond to why I stopped going to the ground.
I got a bit sidetracked . Sorry 😊
Great to see so much hope at Blundell Park.
UTM
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Knut Anders Fosters Voles |
|
Brandy Drinker  Posts: 2,884
Posts Per Day: 1.86
Reputation: 91.64%
Rep Score: +24 / -1
Location: League 2
Approval: +8,824
Gold Stars: 553
|
Close the railway line. Sorry but the reality is Grimsby and Cleethorpes doesn’t need two stations and tourists tend to drive in. Keep the docks station for visiting fans.
UTM
You've gone all Beeching again!  |
|
|
|
|
|
| BobbyCummingsTackle |
|
Champagne Drinker  Posts: 2,384
Posts Per Day: 1.54
Reputation: 72.37%
Rep Score: +8 / -4
Location: Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right, stuck in the middle...
Approval: +7,268
Gold Stars: 295
|
I'm an exile and I agree with so much that has been suggested here. Grimsby needs to think big and be radical.
I visit a lot of places that have regenerated grim areas and often think 'Grimsby could be like this...'
And Grimsby has one massive advantage: people love being by the water.
|
| Miss Scunthorpe. Not a beauty pageant, just sound advice. |
|
|
|
|
|
| Bigdog |
|
Whiskey Drinker  Posts: 3,383
Posts Per Day: 1.13
Reputation: 93.81%
Rep Score: +36 / -1
Approval: +11,802
Gold Stars: 162
|
Many stadiums are designed to manipulate atmosphere, either by amplifying the noise of the vocal home section or limiting the away crowd's impact. Home crowd advantage and all that...
For me it does make a difference when say, the Pontoon noise escapes to the North Sea cos there's no sides, and conversely chants at Stockport away were really disjointed as we were in an open stand.
You may disagree with the idea of encouraging areas that are more vocal and ensuring the acoustics of the stadium support that, but I'm sure many at BP do consider atmosphere as a factor when picking their seats, amongst other things.
Not sure that wanting us to try and fully harness a loud, vocal home crowd if we get a new stadium suggests not being 'grown up' tbh...
Yeah. Sorry about that comment. Posting while tired and pisssed off never goes well.. I know what you're saying about new stadium acoustic design, especially in ones that cost over half a billion quid, but going through the faff of opening up a stadium section by section seems a bit convoluted and may deter fans buying tickets as they often prefer differing visual and vocal positions and experiences to others. I would think that if we were ever to get a new stadium, I would expect one end behind the goal would be where the most vocal of fans would sit, one side would be for families and fans who like to wine and dine before a game, and the other side would have a Barrett Stand sort of vibe to it. A new stadium and it's configuration will create it's own style of atmosphere organically in a short space of time without having to manipulate fans into packing in together unnecessarily. People don't like being manipulated. I don't know the physics, but crowding the same number of people together compared to them being a little spread out, I'm not sure it would make any difference to noise levels. To my mind anyway, if a stadium was say 50% full, it would look better with one fan on every other seat than half the sections completely empty.. |
|
|
|
|
|
 DB |
|
Barley Wine Drinker  Posts: 18,803
Posts Per Day: 15.49
Reputation: 57.79%
Rep Score: +13 / -13
Approval: +3,998
Gold Stars: 386
|
Jackal has made some very good points and ideas. Unfortunately the red & blue parties in Grimsby both want to preserve the Victoria Street 'shopping experience'. Drunken lamp posts, grey dismal slabs, and now a new cinema and market!
Freeman St is dead, Freshney place has become a third world centre and Victoria St serves no purpose. A new proposal for a £10 million pound bus station, but not in the town centre.
Your vision Jackal is hampered by the blinkers worn by our bureaucrats. A new stadium on the docks could rejuvenate the shopping experience but you have to contend with cast iron old attitudes set in stone, who want to keep the status quo.
We need a visionary ( Jackal? ) the council, ABP ( show them some money to attract their attention ), local retailers and some national chains, Tom Shutes? and of course 1878. What they all need to do is work together for the community and forget about Fresney Place, it's had its day.
As old as I am and love the past the future is tomorrow, not yesterday.
|
| You can please some of the forumites some of the time but not all the forumites all of the time |
|
| Logged |
Online |
|
|
|
| Bigdog |
|
Whiskey Drinker Posts: 3,383
Posts Per Day: 1.13
Reputation: 93.81%
Rep Score: +36 / -1
Approval: +11,802
Gold Stars: 162
|
Well a couple of reasons
5% of such a huge cost is still a big sum. 20 mill is often given as a ballpark figure so 5% extra is 1million. When adding the interest on the extra 1 million we would be borrowing that we wouldn't otherwise be, that is hundreds of thousands in interest too over a loan lifetime. That money makes the finances even harder to achieve (its hard enough already). It also means the club have to lose that money from the playing budget each year to pay for it.
The second thing is that my worst ever ground experience wasn't at some old crumbling football ground, it was at Darlingtons shiny over massive stadium. 3 or 4k rattling around in a 20k stadium was such a pitiful atmosphere. The main point of live football is atmosphere and if that is degraded you make it a less desirable experience,and fewer people will want to come. It can be a vicious cycle. 16k in my opinion would be too big and be a detriment. 12 thousand and a fee hundred odd seats would virtually always be enough for us and mean almost doubling the number of good view seats that we have. Room for improvement on what we have now for when times are good, not being detrimental to the experience when times are not so good.
The attendances in the 90s, in the championship, which were pre fenty and pre the all seater were even then only 5k ish once we'd been there a while. Attendances seem to slide off once the novelty of the championship dissipates with town, rather than be relative to position in that league when you look.
Going on your figure of £1m then, even though it would probably be less than 5%.. With a stadium life of 100 years..only 12 sell outs of 16k in that time, a century, the extra capacity would pay for itself. If you look at the past 100 years, through good times and bad times, good home cup draws etc, it runs into hundreds of games of over 12k. Darlington is the worst example of a new stadium possibly ever and the attendances in the 90s were terrible for just about everyone..They can't be used sound analysis for a huge investment as much as the 20k plus attendances pre war and in the 50s. We've been beaten down for far too long these past twenty years. There's more potential there than most think. The secret is into harnessing it and keeping it, and the new board have done a great job up until now. They'll analyse our needs in detail and I bet you, if we get one, the new stadium capacity will be greater than 12k, because that's the way the numbers will stack up.. |
|
|
|
|
|
| Jackal |
|
Shandy Drinker Posts: 62
Posts Per Day: 0.04
Reputation: 83.41%
Rep Score: +2 / 0
Approval: +211
Gold Stars: 15
|
Ok I lied I will post a bit more .  Unfortunately you have hit it on the head re the attitude of the council. No disrespect but unfortunately it has to be said most councillors are councillors because they have the time not the ability. I don’t so not claiming I do. My own relative was a councillor in Grimsby and she actually had dementia while being paid to be a councillor and attend meetings. Her children eventually persuaded her to stop but the rest of the council didn’t seem to notice. True story. I don’t know any councillors today so my apologies if I have offended anyone. It was a cruel generalisation and based on my own dealings with councils. The same can be said for a lot of government ministers so I’m not picking on anyone specifically. I’m sure there are a few with more than enough ability. Have I grovelled enough? Also the chief exec and their team have to be up for this as the task will be very challenging. |
|
|
|
|
|
| forza ivano |
|
 Exile Posts: 14,724
Posts Per Day: 2.46
Reputation: 78.4%
Rep Score: +72 / -20
Approval: +15,168
Gold Stars: 265
|
Good thread this - couple of points
1) Think Bedders makes an excellent point that a car parking facility could be used by Comfort Day Yorkies in the summer and Town fans in the winter, as he said, very little overlap
2) MK was designed for the car, Gy grew up piecemeal in horse and cart days so you are already starting at a disadvatage
3) i was told that there is fresh management at ABP who are looking to get value from the acres of derelict/unused land
4) If ABP are that worried about who accesses the docks, then surely Shutes' plans are dead in the water before he even starts?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Site Home
News
Football
Season
Database
Club
POM
Contact
Home
Calendar
Search
Register
Login
BeijingMariner
DB
Logged
