1878 vindicated?

might get a few red crosses for this, but here goes

Wonder if yesterday vindicated 1878's view that we don't need the expense of a new ground when we haven't or can't exploit Blundell Park to it's maximum potential?
With everything going for it yesterday , weather, new regime, 18 month absence, improved match day experience , near record season ticket sales etc etc etc there were still only about 5000 home fans there, leaving almost 2000 seats unfilled, and that's without exploiting the potential of using the Ossie for home fans

Some fans might be still worried regarding covid I have had 2 jabs but wouldn't feel comfortable going to the stadium without wearing a mask.

BP only makes money 23 weeks of the year.  !!  It’s not about getting a bigger Stadium as such. It’s about generating income.  You are also judging attendance whilst we are in the conference.
I don’t think anybody disagrees with 1878’s priorities. But if we are to move forward then anew ground is still a necessity at some stage in the not too distant future.

Yes I agree, while we are non league, I would rather funds go towards the squad and improving the match day experience.  Once we are back in the league then re-visit it, unless an amazing opportunity should arise.
I loved yesterday  

I think they’re vindicated to some extent, I think they’ve also been clear with their view that exploring a new stadium or building one putting huge financial strain on the club isn’t something they’re interested in…imagine if we hadn’t wasted thousands of pounds previously to get absolutely no where…

I think, with the expertise now at the club, they will work hard to make BP more accessible and feasible to generate income on more than half the weekends through the year…

Quoted from forza ivano

might get a few red crosses for this, but here goes

Wonder if yesterday vindicated 1878's view that we don't need the expense of a new ground when we haven't or can't exploit Blundell Park to it's maximum potential?
With everything going for it yesterday , weather, new regime, 18 month absence, improved match day experience , near record season ticket sales etc etc etc there were still only about 5000 home fans there, leaving almost 2000 seats unfilled, and that's without exploiting the potential of using the Ossie for home fans

Doesn't the Osmond hold about 1800? A "full house" in recent years has been touching 8000 but if we did start filling the park regularly, I'm sure we could get some new green seats.

I get the 7 day income argument but a new stadium, 40-60 minutes away from civilisation isn't going to be used for many business meetings. The best way a stadium is going to generate us extra money is with it having more people in it than BP does 23 times a season.

If it has 3G pitches next to it, you can rent that out each night but the going rate is £12 per hour per third of a full sized pitch. Locally you've got Ormiston, Grimsby Institute and Bradley FDC offering that and none of them are maximised.

So, the best way a stadium can serve us well is by attracting more fans than BP can on a matchday.

The thing is we want a stadium that will last us another 100 years , building one with a small capacity to suit our current position would be a waste of money further down the line .
Historically our club has always been at least a couple of leagues higher and the potential is there so average 2-3 times the gates we currently get.
I’d rather upgrade blundell park with a new main stand and filling the corners in with some kind of terracing or seating ( rather use them as an embarrassing car park for the club staff ) until we’re in a position financially to build the stadium the town and club deserve.

Short sited planning has been the reason we’re where we are now .

is the 5000 + actually correct figure  though seemed alot more people there than that there didnt look like there was that many empty seats

Quoted from fiveallive

Some fans might be still worried regarding covid I have had 2 jabs but wouldn't feel comfortable going to the stadium without wearing a mask.

You do know the mask doesn't protect you? It is so you can supposedly protect others although unless you are wearing a medical grade N95 mask the benefits are dubious at best.

Quoted from gtfcmd

is the 5000 + actually correct figure  though seemed alot more people there than that there didnt look like there was that many empty seats

I'd say that's accurate. The whole Osmond was empty remember.

I’m sure that 1878 are investigating all sorts of possibilities. That said, a new stadium would not be just about match day revenue and would be fit for purpose. They don’t need to be told that improvements to Blundell Park are effectively turd polishing.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

I’m sure that 1878 are investigating all sorts of possibilities. That said, a new stadium would not be just about match day revenue and would be fit for purpose. They don’t need to be told that improvements to Blundell Park are effectively turd polishing.

The issue I’d imagine is that because the previous incumbents were obsessed with building a new stadium which was clearly never really about GTFC, BP was allowed to get worse with only basic stuff being kept up to date…had they kept on top of it perhaps more could be done.

That said, a stadium outside of town would be shite for various reasons, as would a big stadium that’s never close to being filled.

I expect more work to be done at BP that both enhances the experience but also a sustainable piece of work…

the capacity is presently 9052, and Kristine says the home capacity is about 6800 so that would make the capacity of the Osmond 2200

So in reality , even with 5000 home fans  in, you still have 1800 home seats to fill. There is then the additional 1000-1500 seats available  if the Osmond was used judiciously , plus you could always bring back the temporary seating in the 2 open corners , which i'm guessing would be at least another 500

I think long term a new ground in a new location would be the ambition. I think once we've seen the back of the Fenty loans the 1878 board will be looking to additional investors to help make it happen without the cost becoming a millstone.  

I read somewhere that the 2018/19 season had the highest attendances outside the top tier for 60 years. Our opening home fixture of the season circa 60 years ago attracted 11k in the 3rd division. Why have other clubs gained fans to reach a 60 yr peak whilst we have gone the other way? Is it all down to what's happened on the pitch? Chesterfield had about 200 more home fans than we did yesterday. Chesterfield at Saltergate never had bigger crowds than GTFC, when at the same level.

Quoted from fishboyUTM

You do know the mask doesn't protect you? It is so you can supposedly protect others although unless you are wearing a medical grade N95 mask the benefits are dubious at best.

Is this really the place for your anti-vax propaganda?

Quoted from Kris2

Is this really the place for your anti-vax propaganda?

You know what his sort are like.

Every opportunity!

Why was the Executive section of the Findus so empty?  Ptime seats wasted.

I noticed that in the footage...I assume because they are selling those seats at a premium with McMenemy's passes so not available to buy just as a seat alone.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

Doesn't the Osmond hold about 1800? A "full house" in recent years has been touching 8000 but if we did start filling the park regularly, I'm sure we could get some new green seats.

I get the 7 day income argument but a new stadium, 40-60 minutes away from civilisation isn't going to be used for many business meetings. The best way a stadium is going to generate us extra money is with it having more people in it than BP does 23 times a season.

If it has 3G pitches next to it, you can rent that out each night but the going rate is £12 per hour per third of a full sized pitch. Locally you've got Ormiston, Grimsby Institute and Bradley FDC offering that and none of them are maximised.

So, the best way a stadium can serve us well is by attracting more fans than BP can on a matchday.

£12!!! Wtf. We pay £32 down south west!!!

A new stadium allows you to profit from having the capacity to safely accommodate 4000 away fans, something that would generate a large amount of cash should we aspire to League one and play a host of decent sized clubs. Look at what we took to Doncaster alone. Plus a decent stadium and surroundings would generate support in itself.  

Quoted from lukeo

£12!!! Wtf. We pay £32 down south west!!!

To be fair, when I've paid the caretaker it's been £12 in summer and £24 in winter for the floodlights. Every hour it's potentially bringing in £36 or £72 but you've got costs to come out of that too. It would take a very long time to generate a payback.

Bash the main down and put a nice big terrace in its place now we’re allowed standing. No need for a new ground .

We’d be better off developing a training and community hub on the outskirts of GY that could be used by a wide range of people and needs to generate ££ . A mix of grass and 3G pitches for sports as well as a building with amenities for recreation and health / training etc would be the way forward.

I’ve been to Norwich City FC this weekend… google NCFC The Nest to see what I’m on about.

Quoted from louth_in_the_south

Bash the main down and put a nice big terrace in its place now we’re allowed standing. No need for a new ground .

We’d be better off developing a training and community hub on the outskirts of GY that could be used by a wide range of people and needs to generate ££ . A mix of grass and 3G pitches for sports as well as a building with amenities for recreation and health / training etc would be the way forward.

I’ve been to Norwich City FC this weekend… google NCFC The Nest to see what I’m on about.

Agreed that could be the place that makes the money, there is no state of the art 4G pitch around here aside from Bradley so that would help. Good business facilities are always needed especially if the renewable economy continues to grow.

Always thought we should slowly buy up the houses behind the Main Stand then rotate the pitch 90 degrees using the Findus as an end stand.

Quoted from louth_in_the_south

Bash the main down and put a nice big terrace in its place now we’re allowed standing. No need for a new ground.

I would actually like to see remaining at BP proper consideration. Extend the Findus first to increase capacity before getting to work on the Main Stand and Osmond when that is complete. Your idea about the terracing is a no go though because teams that were in Division 1 in 1995 can't have standing. Absolute barmy rule but we can't build a new stand/ground with standing yet a team like Wrexham could.

Quoted from Green27

Always thought we should slowly buy up the houses behind the Main Stand then rotate the pitch 90 degrees using the Findus as an end stand.

Wasn't that the plan when the Findus was built? I always got told as a kid that the club started buying up Harrington Street and housed players there.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I would actually like to see remaining at BP proper consideration. Extend the Findus first to increase capacity before getting to work on the Main Stand and Osmond when that is complete. Your idea about the terracing is a no go though because teams that were in Division 1 in 1995 can't have standing. Absolute barmy rule but we can't build a new stand/ground with standing yet a team like Wrexham could.



Wasn't that the plan when the Findus was built? I always got told as a kid that the club started buying up Harrington Street and housed players there.

No! The original idea was to extend the Findus both sides, to the corners, but it never happened. When it was standing in the bottom tier there was what looked like an entrance, on the half way line, which was going to be the players tunnel, when the dressing rooms were going to be moved there.

Quoted from mimma

No! The original idea was to extend the Findus both sides, to the corners, but it never happened. When it was standing in the bottom tier there was what looked like an entrance, on the half way line, which was going to be the players tunnel, when the dressing rooms were going to be moved there.

That's right, I remember reading this when the stand was being built. As for the main stand I seem to recall someone posted that it may become a safety issue soon for the club to get a safety certificate, due to it's construction.

I think it would be better if 1878 planned to replace it sooner rather than waiting until they have to.

Quoted from DB

That's right, I remember reading this when the stand was being built. As for the main stand I seem to recall someone posted that it may become a safety issue soon for the club to get a safety certificate, due to it's construction.

I think it would be better if 1878 planned to replace it sooner rather than waiting until they have to.

I was always under the impression the safety certificate thing was more balderdash from honest John used to build traction for wonderdome creation?

We can go around and around debating this forever. The new crew have made it clear they will explore every avenue and if they can make staying at BP worthwhile they will…I’m sure they won’t spunk the amount if cash honest John did chasing a pipe dream only he was obsessed about.

We don’t want some out of town stadium because they’re always ducking rubbish…either too big, intercourse all near them or just a excrement experience.

Over time I think we’ll see developments at BP which can only be a good thing.

Simple answer to the OP is “It’s too early to say”.

When Fenty was pursuing the Peaks Parkway dream, I kept asking what the business case was, what assumptions had been made about the receipts from developers, non-match day receipts, attendances etc and got point blank ignored by him. (And told by other posters that “it was too soon to say”). My back of a fa g packet calculations was that it was unaffordable. Clearly there was not a business case for it.

I’d expect 1878 to be open about this if they come forward with a scheme. I can’t see a real estate professional like Andrew Pettit pursuing anything that doesn’t stack up.

Personally the only way I can see us getting a new stadium is to be having some serious success on the pitch. To the point were home games are regularly sold out, which I feel is possibly a couple of divisions away. We need to be playing the bigger clubs. I think back to back promotion would help 😉

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Simple answer to the OP is “It’s too early to say”.

When Fenty was pursuing the Peaks Parkway dream, I kept asking what the business case was, what assumptions had been made about the receipts from developers, non-match day receipts, attendances etc and got point blank ignored by him. (And told by other posters that “it was too soon to say”). My back of a fa g packet calculations was that it was unaffordable. Clearly there was not a business case for it.

I’d expect 1878 to be open about this if they come forward with a scheme. I can’t see a real estate professional like Andrew Pettit pursuing anything that doesn’t stack up.

Completely this. I wasn’t close to every boring detail but in terms of “bums on seats” each week then currently we’d be miles off covering the cost, it would have been even worse under Fenty and the ministry of disengagement he ruled over. Yes the odd SME conference, wedding or car boot sale in the car park would have helped with other income.

The only way I could have or do see it happening is if AN Other foots a massive part of the cost.

Yes I agree in terms of current attendance figures. Blundell Park is more than adequate for our needs in terms of capacity.

Personally I also actually love BP. I love older grounds with character etc. But I also recognise that we will have to move on, and all of the financial benefits in doing so when it happens

If its unaffordable how come lots of other clubs,some smaller than us, have built new stadiums? Genuinely question. Presumably they must have faced the same questions about affordability.

Quoted from toontown

If its unaffordable how come lots of other clubs,some smaller than us, have built new stadiums? Genuinely question. Presumably they must have faced the same questions about affordability.

Probably because they inject more capital into the project at the start whether that’s from private, corporate or grant support funding.

Quoted from aldi_01

I was always under the impression the safety certificate thing was more balderdash from honest John used to build traction for wonderdome creation?

We can go around and around debating this forever. The new crew have made it clear they will explore every avenue and if they can make staying at BP worthwhile they will…I’m sure they won’t spunk the amount if cash honest John did chasing a pipe dream only he was obsessed about.

We don’t want some out of town stadium because they’re always ducking rubbish…either too big, intercourse all near them or just a excrement experience.

Over time I think we’ll see developments at BP which can only be a good thing.

This is the post I was refering to :-

https://forum.thefishy.co.uk/Blah.pl?m-1622758626/highlight-safety+certificate/id-1482795#id1482795

Quoted from HertsGTFC

Probably because they inject more capital into the project at the start whether that’s from private, corporate or grant support funding.

With money either from the council (Doncaster), quasi council (Hull and Kingston Communications), or from valuable* residential quality land moving to less valuable urban waste land (Brentford).

* Blundell Park is not

Quoted from Fillipe Noche

Yes I agree in terms of current attendance figures. Blundell Park is more than adequate for our needs in terms of capacity.

Personally I also actually love BP. I love older grounds with character etc. But I also recognise that we will have to move on, and all of the financial benefits in doing so when it happens

We keep hearing about the apparent financial benefits of a new ground, but what exactly are they exactly, how much do you think they will bring in? It’s all theoretical.

If they existed, we would be on our way to having a new ground. Land was made available, with council support for the idea, but there was no developer willing to shell out enough money.

Or do you think Fenty was just sh¡t at exploiting the opportunity?

Quoted from KingstonMariner

With money either from the council (Doncaster), quasi council (Hull and Kingston Communications), or from valuable* residential quality land moving to less valuable urban waste land (Brentford).

* Blundell Park is not

How much do you think the land BP sits on is worth and how many houses do you think it could fit? Realistically, each house would probably fetch a maximum of £175k (but I'm no expert).

The valuable land is Cheapside but we don't own that and any cash NELC had was invested in Iceland.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

How much do you think the land BP sits on is worth and how many houses do you think it could fit? Realistically, each house would probably fetch a maximum of £175k (but I'm no expert).

The valuable land is Cheapside but we don't own that and any cash NELC had was invested in Iceland.

It’s a bit our if date now I suspect, but in the accounts BP was valued c £800k I think. Less than a million. Call it a million with recent rises in property values in Cleethorpes. Only another £21 million to find.

I think you’re right on the maximum price of a house there. Those ones built on the old Darley’s site didn’t shift for ages and I think went for less.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

How much do you think the land BP sits on is worth and how many houses do you think it could fit? Realistically, each house would probably fetch a maximum of £175k (but I'm no expert).

The valuable land is Cheapside but we don't own that and any cash NELC had was invested in Iceland.

I'll have to start buying my frozen chips from them and get their share price up.

Let’s take off the rose tinted spectacles. BP is a sh!thole. The majority of seats are restricted view. Only the Lower Findus (or whatever it’s called now) has no roof supports impeding the view. The facilities are terrible. I appreciate 1878 are making the best of things but space is restricted. And the disabled facilities are an embarrassment.

I am lucky that I’ve had the same season ticket seat since 1998 and have a good (totally unrestricted) view of the pitch. Can anyone buy a new season ticket without it being restricted view? What are the views like for the match by match fans?

Then there’s the parking situation. It doesn’t help when fans know they can’t park anywhere near the ground after 2PM. It puts people off, especially the casual fan who might make a decision at 13:30 to go to the match.

Blundell Park is no longer fit for purpose. We don’t have the space around BP to do a Leyton Orient type redevelopment so a new stadium is the only viable option. We have a highly successful co-owner who has worked in property developer and I fully expect him to be able to find a viable way to deliver a new modern stadium with enough extra income generated to help finance the mortgage we’d need to finance it without damaging the club.

I want a new stadium as much as the next fan but what’s this 7 day income thing based on ?

Quoted from GollyGTFC

Let’s take off the rose tinted spectacles. BP is a sh!thole. The majority of seats are restricted view. Only the Lower Findus (or whatever it’s called now) has no roof supports impeding the view. The facilities are terrible. I appreciate 1878 are making the best of things but space is restricted. And the disabled facilities are an embarrassment.

I am lucky that I’ve had the same season ticket seat since 1998 and have a good (totally unrestricted) view of the pitch. Can anyone buy a new season ticket without it being restricted view? What are the views like for the match by match fans?

Then there’s the parking situation. It doesn’t help when fans know they can’t park anywhere near the ground after 2PM. It puts people off, especially the casual fan who might make a decision at 13:30 to go to the match.

Blundell Park is no longer fit for purpose. We don’t have the space around BP to do a Leyton Orient type redevelopment so a new stadium is the only viable option. We have a highly successful co-owner who has worked in property developer and I fully expect him to be able to find a viable way to deliver a new modern stadium with enough extra income generated to help finance the mortgage we’d need to finance it without damaging the club.

Parking at Lincoln isn't much better and they get 9000. Scunthorpe have a good size car park but it can take an hour or more to get out.

Unusually for me I have an open mind about whether we should move or not.

I love Blundell Park and the memories, and would not mind at all if it could be redeveloped if it was worthwhile.

I am sure 1878 will be looking at innovative ways to get what we need. Do the facilities that would generate more revenue have to be at the stadium site, or could they be sited cheaper away from BP if we were to stay there, effectively meaning BP could be redeveloped just for the benefit of match days?

The only thing I would hate is to go for the identikit soulless stadium just to move so if they do decide it is viable to move then I am hopeful they would give us a stadium to be proud of.

Quoted from dapperz fun pub

I want a new stadium as much as the next fan but what’s this 7 day income thing based on ?

It'll be based on a range of facilities, my wife works in hospitality at Swansea's stadium and she gets shifts working at all kinds of corporate functions. Other stadiums have other facilities in them and act as a corporate landlords, there are loads of options depending on the actual configuration of the space.

I know it's just one example  but Swansea's attendances doubled almost overnight compared to what used to go to the Vetch and that was at league 2 level right at the beginning of their meteoric rise up the divisions. Having frequented the vetch a lot I was quite surprised at the latent demand that had never been tapped into.

Quoted from Swansea_Mariner

It'll be based on a range of facilities, my wife works in hospitality at Swansea's stadium and she gets shifts working at all kinds of corporate functions. Other stadiums have other facilities in them and act as a corporate landlords, there are loads of options depending on the actual configuration of the space.

I know it's just one example  but Swansea's attendances doubled almost overnight compared to what used to go to the Vetch and that was at league 2 level right at the beginning of their meteoric rise up the divisions. Having frequented the vetch a lot I was quite surprised at the latent demand that had never been tapped into.

I think this goes beyond corporate functions in McMenemys. There are many ways to skin a cat so to speak, but the way I would go is to turn the club into a social hub.

look at the likes of Barcelona for example, not only are they a football team but they are a basketball and ice hockey club too amongst other things. So why couldn't the club have darts teams? Pool teams etc. If there were an A & B team alternating at the home venue every week you'd have use of a bar one evening a week. Moreover, it allows people like ourselves to fulfil a dream and say they play for the Mariners (albeit at pub sports)

Yeah its the same with the Liberty as the Ospreys play there too.

I had my works xmas doo in one of their function suites about a decade ago, and there were multiple of those all going off on the same night, so they must have at least the equivalent of a few McMenemys within the stadium footprint.

Short term BP is good enough to build fan base back up to 1980’s levels, but can we realistically rely on crowds of less than 8,000 fans.

But the future has to be a sustainable solution with a facility that can be used more than 23 days a year. For too long we have had no real investment in the stadium, once by an ex mayor of Grimsby in the 1930’s and the Findus stand in the 1980’s. All we have had is the odd job man doing the whitewash where needed since.

Great Coates was always a non starter due to the Sydney College estate, others were just pipe dreams, those on the bored of the club were unable to get any funding to implement building a new ground. Not a sod has been turned since the Findus stand was completed.

For the future, Freeman Street has to be considered, this needs the will of the fans, funding and regeneration money to get the spades to dig. I’m sure the new owners would be somewhat aware of this, and now have the acumen to see the project to fruition.

Otherwise, IMO, we are stuck with 6,000 home fans and forever in the lower reaches of the Football League.  

Quoted from exiledmeggie

Short term BP is good enough to build fan base back up to 1980’s levels, but can we realistically rely on crowds of less than 8,000 fans.

But the future has to be a sustainable solution with a facility that can be used more than 23 days a year. For too long we have had no real investment in the stadium, once by an ex mayor of Grimsby in the 1930’s and the Findus stand in the 1980’s. All we have had is the odd job man doing the whitewash where needed since.

Great Coates was always a non starter due to the Sydney College estate, others were just pipe dreams, those on the bored of the club were unable to get any funding to implement building a new ground. Not a sod has been turned since the Findus stand was completed.

For the future, Freeman Street has to be considered, this needs the will of the fans, funding and regeneration money to get the spades to dig. I’m sure the new owners would be somewhat aware of this, and now have the acumen to see the project to fruition.

Otherwise, IMO, we are stuck with 6,000 home fans and forever in the lower reaches of the Football League.  

The funding has to work for the club too. Many clubs that move don't actually own their new stadium. I know many are owned by local councils but what is to stop them raising the rent in 10-15 years?

We need to own any new ground and it needs to be financed in a way that doesn't risk the future of the club.

I do think a proper evaluation of what exactly can be done with Blundell Park should be conducted though because it can be done at a pace to suit us. The old regime always dismissed it because it didn't include nice little earners for themselves. Isn't the land at Peaks Parkway owned by the Casswell family? That would be the Casswell family that one of Fentys' daughters is married to...

Quoted from jamesgtfc

The funding has to work for the club too. Many clubs that move don't actually own their new stadium. I know many are owned by local councils but what is to stop them raising the rent in 10-15 years?

We need to own any new ground and it needs to be financed in a way that doesn't risk the future of the club.

I do think a proper evaluation of what exactly can be done with Blundell Park should be conducted though because it can be done at a pace to suit us. The old regime always dismissed it because it didn't include nice little earners for themselves. Isn't the land at Peaks Parkway owned by the Casswell family? That would be the Casswell family that one of Fentys' daughters is married to...

I don’t think a council owned stadium, such as fool city in Kingston is the way forward. The owners of Hull City are hindered in progress due to only appearing at the stadium, rather than benefiting for more than the 23 days they pay rent.

I would say that round where I live, FGR are about to move to another new stadium, in a facility that has other uses to provide an income for the football, but again no sod has been dug, nor does the intricacies of who actually now owns the club clear!

Quoted from exiledmeggie

I don’t think a council owned stadium, such as fool city in Kingston is the way forward. The owners of Hull City are hindered in progress due to only appearing at the stadium, rather than benefiting for more than the 23 days they pay rent.

I would say that round where I live, FGR are about to move to another new stadium, in a facility that has other uses to provide an income for the football, but again no sod has been dug, nor does the intricacies of who actually now owns the club clear!

Town sold more season tickets than the full attendance at the last FGR match. I think the owner might want more supporters to fill his existing ground than want to move to a new one.

Parking is a problem everywhere nowadays. I live on a 1960’s estate and everyone has 3 cars
I decided to go to Wycombe v Lincoln 2 weeks ago but couldn’t find a parking space anywhere within a mile of the ground so gave up and came home
Think clubs have to work with local authorities and sort effective public transport

Quoted from buckstown

Parking is a problem everywhere nowadays. I live on a 1960’s estate and everyone has 3 cars
I decided to go to Wycombe v Lincoln 2 weeks ago but couldn’t find a parking space anywhere within a mile of the ground so gave up and came home
Think clubs have to work with local authorities and sort effective public transport

It's one thing having an effective public transport system to a football ground and another getting Joe Public to use it. BP is well served with buses from Grimsby and Cleethorpes Town centres but it will be hard convincing a lot of fans to use them.

Quoted from DB

Town sold more season tickets than the full attendance at the last FGR match. I think the owner might want more supporters to fill his existing ground than want to move to a new one.

I have already commented on this fact in the season ticket thread! In fact, we get double what they get! But their owner has the impetus and funds to further the course, whether the locals agree with him, or not!

Wild dream I know, but I always imagined a new stand being built behind the main stand, to rise above it - effectively making the main stand the lower tier, and a larger upper tier to mirror what's opposite.

Obviously the main stand is made of wood and needs restructuring, but it'd be ace to retain some sense of history and build around it. There aren't many houses behind the main stand to 'buy up'.

Please don't get on my case and say this is ridiculous. I know it is. We're all allowed an imagination though!

Quoted from RichMariner

Wild dream I know, but I always imagined a new stand being built behind the main stand, to rise above it - effectively making the main stand the lower tier, and a larger upper tier to mirror what's opposite.

Obviously the main stand is made of wood and needs restructuring, but it'd be ace to retain some sense of history and build around it. There aren't many houses behind the main stand to 'buy up'.

Please don't get on my case and say this is ridiculous. I know it is. We're all allowed an imagination though!

There are around 15 houses behind the Main Stand. I have no idea what their market value would be but I doubt it’s less than £150,000 each and that’s before a compulsory purchase premium.

Never going to happen.

Quoted from exiledmeggie

I have already commented on this fact in the season ticket thread! In fact, we get double what they get! But their owner has the impetus and funds to further the course, whether the locals agree with him, or not!

Apologies my friend, just took the info from Saturdays result.

From what you are saying the owner is more of a dictator if he's not interested in the locals.

Quoted from DB

Apologies my friend, just took the info from Saturdays result.

From what you are saying the owner is more of a dictator if he's not interested in the locals.

A benign dictator maybe. And not in the sense of ‘benign loans’.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

A benign dictator maybe. And not in the sense of ‘benign loans’.

Very similar though!

Quoted from DB

Very similar though!

Both got bad dress sense I suppose. But one has a vision that doesn’t just involve his own enrichment. And on that front he was actually more successful than our one.

I don't know what Stockwood or Pettit are worth but I believe they are both a lot wealthier than Fenty.

As many teams are finding out, pumping money at it only gets you so far up the pyramid before you need a business plan or to take your funding up considerably. Look at Peterborough and Brentford. Yes they've both spent money but there is a method to their spending. You don't see either of them spending silly money for the level (£200k in our case) on a 31 year old defender that probably has no resale value.

I think we will look to build on the success of the youth team and sign some saleable assets which we can than reinvest into our squad once the shackles are off.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

There are around 15 houses behind the Main Stand. I have no idea what their market value would be but I doubt it’s less than £150,000 each and that’s before a compulsory purchase premium.

Never going to happen.

£150,000 Each?    i would half that to be fair. 80 grand a house is very realistic and that would be aproaching top end valuation i would have thought. but still £1.2 million just to get them and thats without demolition or building etc.  
By the time thats done you probably could have built half a brand new stadium.

I think the key is to trust the new group.

People may point to Fenty achieving in his life and somehow, he did make himself a few Bob but on a success and money making level it is clear the the new owners have gained more than just cash and have been operating on levels Fenty can only dream of.

We have to trust them that they have a plan, they have ideas and won’t chase after a dream to simply massage their own egos or generate cash for them. Of course, should we to get a new stadium I’d imagine they would stand to make something from it but I think they’ve made it clear that enhancing their  lives isn’t really their motive for owning the club.

Pettit has been involved in significant development project and along with experience, he will have gained friends and knowledge. I’ve no doubt they will put this to good use. As we’ve already seen, the pair of them aren’t interested in being despot leaders who want to everything themselves, unlike the previous idiot.

Time will tell but for now I’m enjoying the transparency and honesty without it being sickly or hyperbolic and on a personal level, I’m enjoying going back to footy, travelling to games and being involved in the way fans can be.

Quoted from aldi_01

I think the key is to trust the new group.

People may point to Fenty achieving in his life and somehow, he did make himself a few Bob but on a success and money making level it is clear the the new owners have gained more than just cash and have been operating on levels Fenty can only dream of.

We have to trust them that they have a plan, they have ideas and won’t chase after a dream to simply massage their own egos or generate cash for them. Of course, should we to get a new stadium I’d imagine they would stand to make something from it but I think they’ve made it clear that enhancing their  lives isn’t really their motive for owning the club.

Pettit has been involved in significant development project and along with experience, he will have gained friends and knowledge. I’ve no doubt they will put this to good use. As we’ve already seen, the pair of them aren’t interested in being despot leaders who want to everything themselves, unlike the previous idiot.

Time will tell but for now I’m enjoying the transparency and honesty without it being sickly or hyperbolic and on a personal level, I’m enjoying going back to footy, travelling to games and being involved in the way fans can be.

I agree with you. We have to have faith and trust in their vision. They have done what they said they would do and, apart from the fixture changes for Stockport and Southend, we have little else to complain about. They are still learning but want the best for the club and community, not the best for them unlike the old regime.

Quoted from aldi_01

Pettit has been involved in significant development project and along with experience, he will have gained friends and knowledge. I’ve no doubt they will put this to good use..

Just out of curiosity what developments has Petit been involved in?

Quoted from Simon

Just out of curiosity what developments has Petit been involved in?

He was part of a sausage development team which gained legendary status to the deepest-flung parts of Lincolnshire and beyond...

On the stadium point, I've always believed we needed to move.  

Blundell Park holds a romantic pull for many of us but it is, in all honesty, a shithole.  A crumbling shithole at that.  There's little scope for development, no scope for expansion (that I can imagine anyway), parking is a nightmare and, to my mind, is incredibly difficult to market it as a 365 day a year operation.

Even if we were to somehow develop the ground beyond belief, I still struggle to see how it could be marketed as a place where people would use other than the 23+ home games a season.  Unfortunately it's in an area of Cleethorpes that doesn't hold a great amount of appeal to the average person.  Would you book a conference there?  Or a wedding?  I've attended weddings and parties there before but largely it's because one of the hosting party is a Town fan.  

This may be the pure naivety of me but I thought the benefit of moving to a bespoke community ground was that it would have something to pull everyone in from all areas.  4G pitches, gym/leisure centre, community hub, conference facilities etc etc.  I completely accept that 1878 have a level of knowledge and experience that I can't even begin to dream of, just more thinking out loud as to how BP could ever be sustainable as our home in the medium-to-long term future.

I also wonder if they've set out this expectation that they'll look to see what they can do with BP to buy a little bit of time to get things moving for a new ground.   Smart move if so.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

There are around 15 houses behind the Main Stand. I have no idea what their market value would be but I doubt it’s less than £150,000 each and that’s before a compulsory purchase premium.

Never going to happen.

I doubt any of those houses are worth much more than £80000

Whatever the actual market value you can basically double it as the owners essentially have the club over the barrel if the intention was to buy up all the houses on the street. It also only takes one hold out to make the viability of the project collapse.

Not to mention  whether the club would even get planning consent for such a scheme?

As the old saying goes, “Blundell Park may be a shithole, but it’s our shithole”. Seriously though I would love us to move into a new stadium, if you look at most clubs that have new stadiums their attendances usually increase hence their spending power increases,the exception being our “friends” down the A18.

Quoted from grimps

I doubt any of those houses are worth much more than £80000

https://www.zoopla.co.uk/house-prices/cleethorpes/harrington-street/

It all comes down to money. We rarely fill the home seating of BP. There is no rent or loan to pay on BP. We could move to a new stadium, stick a thousand on the gate (let’s assume that will happen) and that extra £300k worth of revenue will be immediately swallowed up by the cost of the debt/rent.

At a conservative estimate, £20m borrowed x 1.5% interest = £300,000. Rate will probably be higher than that and there’s capital repayments. Over 40 years that’s another £500k. OK, amount of interest will go down each year so we’re probably closer to £600k p.a. (I haven’t done the proper maths but we’re in that sort of territory.)

Genuine question. How much profit can we expect to make on functions, conferences and gyms?

I guess the real benefit will come when/if we get regular big crowds/‘football fortune’.

Quoted from Simon

Just out of curiosity what developments has Petit been involved in?

https://www.revcap.co.uk/       He is one of the founders
https://riverstonedevelopments.com/    Is also involved with these developers

Quoted from grimps

I doubt any of those houses are worth much more than £80000

The moment the club tries to buy them the price will shoot up.

Quoted from forza ivano

https://www.revcap.co.uk/       He is one of the founders
https://riverstonedevelopments.com/    Is also involved with these developers

Yes, but when has having an in-depth knowledge, understanding and prior success of the mechanisms of property development and capital generation ever got you a new ground?  

Quoted from LN8Mariner

Yes, but when has having an in-depth knowledge, understanding and prior success of the mechanisms of property development and capital generation ever got you a new ground?  

😆

Or stopped you pursuing a pipe dream

Here's a different approach to the question:

Which lower-league "new" stadiums have people been to that:

(a) aren't still a bit of a sh!thole
(b) aren't next to some fvcking carpet warehouse on a retail estate near nothing
(c) don't have a car park that takes 7 hours to get out of
(d) have anything inside the ground worth eating/drinking
(e) don't give you an existential crisis just by their sheer existence

Quoted from EvilFish

Here's a different approach to the question:

Which lower-league "new" stadiums have people been to that:

(a) aren't still a bit of a sh!thole
(b) aren't next to some fvcking carpet warehouse on a retail estate near nothing
(c) don't have a car park that takes 7 hours to get out of
(d) have anything inside the ground worth eating/drinking
(e) don't give you an existential crisis just by their sheer existence

Meadow Lane - think you can count it as new as totally rebuilt...

Quoted from LN8Mariner

Yes, but when has having an in-depth knowledge, understanding and prior success of the mechanisms of property development and capital generation ever got you a new ground?  

I read this and it makes you realise the reasons why NELC is in such a state. For a start, they appointed a man in charge of regeneration who has failed in all his previous regeneration attempts and ended up leaving with a legacy of severe degeneration.

Quoted from Swansea_Mariner

Whatever the actual market value you can basically double it as the owners essentially have the club over the barrel if the intention was to buy up all the houses on the street. It also only takes one hold out to make the viability of the project collapse.

Not to mention  whether the club would even get planning consent for such a scheme?

I seem to remember when Liverpool wanted to expand Anfield, they wanted to buy some surrounding houses and it cost them above their market value.

Quoted from rancido

I seem to remember when Liverpool wanted to expand Anfield, they wanted to buy some surrounding houses and it cost them above their market value.

Lidl did this a few years ago on Cromwell Road and Marklew Avenue. They couldn't extend the store until they increased parking capacity but they couldn't increase parking capacity until they demolished a block of houses on Marklew Avenue.

One house was more stubborn than the others. Lidl paid for every single legal cost and they eventually settled for a very inflated price.

Our homes are our castles. If I want to move, it's only worth what someone wants to pay for it but if I don't want to move and a private individual or business wants it, then it's worth whatever I tell you it's worth.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

How much do you think the land BP sits on is worth and how many houses do you think it could fit? Realistically, each house would probably fetch a maximum of £175k (but I'm no expert).

Looking at Google satellite images, I reckon you could fit 100 terraced houses on BP.

Quoted from mimma

The original idea was to extend the Findus both sides, to the corners, but it never happened. When it was standing in the bottom tier there was what looked like an entrance, on the half way line, which was going to be the players tunnel, when the dressing rooms were going to be moved there.

Are you absolutely sure about that, Mimma? You're saying the club built 'half' a stand with the intention of extending it by purchasing and demolishing some houses on Imperial and Constitutional Avenues? What, the board were hoping to bully residents into selling up by erecting a monstrosity on their doorstep?

I agree about the players tunnel in the lower tier. I don't know why new changing rooms didn't happen.

Sooner or later the Main Stand will come up as an issue. Probably not in the NL but Teir 4 ?
Also, it may be that the insurance will tip the balance. Either way, something has to be done. Also if a preservation order is put onto it, then Blundell Park will have the oldest stand in the league, but not allowed to take it down or use it.

For the Anoraks, (pulled from official GTFC Tickets site)  The Pontoon all-seater 1995yr capacity =1,808
Youngs built 1980yr  capacity = 1,982 upper + 826 lower, Osmond built 1939yr capacity 1,884, Main built 1901yr capacity =1,884.         Total of 8,777 seated.
Another point is that the Premier League is seriously looking at, and the gov is bending, to bring back standing areas.

Quoted from RobDef1

I'd say that's accurate. The whole Osmond was empty remember.

That's actually good attendance probably, 30 Barnet and 5,000 Mariners. Against Barnet, not exactly category 1 interest.
When playing Scunny, Lincoln, Barnsley of old the figures were distorted by high attendance by away fans.
If Town can build on what it has done, bearing in mind the reluctance of people to come due to covid, historically poor numbers for away fans in the NL, then 5K is very good indeed. Bordering on excellent actually.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

Parking at Lincoln isn't much better and they get 9000. Scunthorpe have a good size car park but it can take an hour or more to get out.

Is that really true, James? You're not exaggerating? That is worse than I imagined for a single exit car park and one of the reasons I think Freemo would be better than Grimsby West or Peaks Parkway.

Quoted from White_shorts

Is that really true, James? You're not exaggerating? That is worse than I imagined for a single exit car park and one of the reasons I think Freemo would be better than Grimsby West or Peaks Parkway.

Whilst I do prefer the Freeman Street option it's downside ,as opposed the the other sites you mention, is that it brings traffic into an area that is already busy on a Saturday due to the market.

Absolutely relentless this bloke. Drags up a 4-month old thread just to plug Freemo once again.

What’s the interest, White Shorts? How much do you stand to make (or lose?) off the back of a stadium being built at Freemo or not?

Quoted from exiledmeggie

Short term BP is good enough to build fan base back up to 1980’s levels, but can we realistically rely on crowds of less than 8,000 fans.

But the future has to be a sustainable solution with a facility that can be used more than 23 days a year. For too long we have had no real investment in the stadium, once by an ex mayor of Grimsby in the 1930’s and the Findus stand in the 1980’s. All we have had is the odd job man doing the whitewash where needed since.

Great Coates was always a non starter due to the Sydney College estate, others were just pipe dreams, those on the bored of the club were unable to get any funding to implement building a new ground. Not a sod has been turned since the Findus stand was completed.

For the future, Freeman Street has to be considered, this needs the will of the fans, funding and regeneration money to get the spades to dig. I’m sure the new owners would be somewhat aware of this, and now have the acumen to see the project to fruition.

Otherwise, IMO, we are stuck with 6,000 home fans and forever in the lower reaches of the Football League.  

What is the Sydney College estate? I can't find any mention on the internet. It's a shame the old non-chairman wasn't aware of it after wasting so much time on Great Coates.

Quoted from White_shorts

What is the Sydney College estate? I can't find any mention on the internet. It's a shame the old non-chairman wasn't aware of it after wasting so much time on Great Coates.

The land is owned by Sutton Estates and there is no record that they actually agreed to sell the land at Great Coates, only consider it.

Quoted from White_shorts

Is that really true, James? You're not exaggerating? That is worse than I imagined for a single exit car park and one of the reasons I think Freemo would be better than Grimsby West or Peaks Parkway.

I've sat in it myself before so I'm definitely not exaggerating.

Just talked to a scunny supporter mate and he says it only takes him 3 minutes to get out of their car park, did then say that that’s the usual time for their support but when Town are there then yes it’s up to an hour.