We urine On Your Fish Yes we do yes we do Special Brew Drinker
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Case on the rise. How many people do you think have covid but not showing symptoms. I reckon a large population, so when people get tested it's classed as rises. How many people are now dying of Covid you don't seem to hear much about the deaths anymore just rises. I could have covid and quarantining isn't going to help until a vaccine is done. It would mean staying indoors permanently until the vaccine but we can't live like that just need to be sensible.
Whats everyones thoughts? Cases on the rise, do you think the Gov might postpone the supposed start date
I would say that’ll depend on the outcome of the trials at the Abbey Stadium.
"Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its students." ..Hector Berlioz, 1856. “I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" ...Voltaire, 1694-1778
Case on the rise. How many people do you think have covid but not showing symptoms. I reckon a large population, so when people get tested it's classed as rises. How many people are now dying of Covid you don't seem to hear much about the deaths anymore just rises. I could have covid and quarantining isn't going to help until a vaccine is done. It would mean staying indoors permanently until the vaccine but we can't live like that just need to be sensible.
You surely understand that cases rise before deaths? So obviously a rise in cases will very likely lead to a rise in deaths in a months time, and they grow exponentially if something doesn't keep them in check.
Sad to see cases are on the rise.Thought we may have been past the worst.Hopefully this is a blip as I want fans to return to the boxing and football as soon as possible. .Interesting to note though that in national geographic magazine last months issue viruses have always killed humans and new ones will most likely appear once Covid is controlled.
Whats everyones thoughts? Cases on the rise, do you think the Gov might postpone the supposed start date
No doubt they will but how does that square with kids back to school, people back in pubs and people being encouraged back to work?
Whilst typing one person on breakfast news says young people should be careful in case they give the virus to granny, the next guest contradicts that by saying young people aren't badly affected and should remain at school. So which one is it, kids carry the virus and potentially give it to granny or kids are unaffected?
It just said on the news that 800 people are hospitalized in the UK with the virus. A good guess would be that the vast majority of those are very elderly and some/most would be in and out of hospital with serious illnesses. The number of deaths is virtually nil, those that do succumb are invariably very poorly anyway.
800 hospital cases out of a population of nearly 70 million seems a reasonable risk to me to go to an outdoor sports event but they seem to want to keep scaring us to death.
If cases rocket and people start getting seriously ill from the virus then we would have to act but until then we should be able to go about our daily lives whilst using reasonable safeguards.
I think we are just going to have to live with it for now. The country cannot survive without people working and earning money, The world banks wont keep lending countrys money there has to be a limit .Football is going to be different along with many things , but sooner or later fans have to be allowed to go back or pro football will end without cash flow. I cant see this season finishing tbh unless fans are allowed back in , too many clubs will fold and it will the end of an era for many sports never mind industry
You surely understand that cases rise before deaths? So obviously a rise in cases will very likely lead to a rise in deaths in a months time, and they grow exponentially if something doesn't keep them in check.
yet another buzzword on the street to instill fear. Our National Game along with many other businesses dying and the figures still are not has bad as a flu season. If you test positive and still feel well what does it tell you. Protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with their lives
You surely understand that cases rise before deaths? So obviously a rise in cases will very likely lead to a rise in deaths in a months time, and they grow exponentially if something doesn't keep them in check.
I can't find the post but I saw a graphic yesterday that showed cases across Europe have been growing considerably over the last month but deaths are still very flat and near zero.
More people are getting tested now so you would expect higher numbers when you consider 99% of people with the virus are perfectly fine. Previously only hospital admissions were tested and then it extended to key workers. Now anyone can get a test. A very low percentage of tests are coming back as positive though which correlates with it being cold and flu season.
On that subject, my son has been back at school since last Thursday and half his class have a cold already!
yet another buzzword on the street to instill fear. Our National Game along with many other businesses dying and the figures still are not has bad as a flu season. If you test positive and still feel well what does it tell you. Protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with their lives
I completely agree with that part. But the virus does spread exponentially, if it didn't then there would never have been a problem. It has 100% been worse than flu season, deaths this year are double a bad flu season and that's with locking down the country for 5 months. A vaccine changes everything, as it has with the flu, but we don't have one.
yet another buzzword on the street to instill fear. Our National Game along with many other businesses dying and the figures still are not has bad as a flu season. If you test positive and still feel well what does it tell you. Protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with their lives
I've said this before and I'll probably say it again but there is no virus, it's a flu bug and yes people are dying. Look at the figures from Jan/Feb/March 2018 and no one batted an eyelid at 150,000 in three months. Thing is we're used to being controlled, it happens every week at football where fans are corralled, herded around, told to do this, do that, walk there, don't walk there etc, etc, etc. Then at the end of the day the police turn around and say.. yes we did order them about but as you can see, there was no trouble so it was for the best.
My mother is 89 and in a care home, we've not been able to visit since March. Since April 7th she's had 16 falls, 11 hospital admissions, a broken upper arm, broken shoulder, smashed face and split head. Humberside police, Bupa head office, the council safeguarding team and social services all involved. Her doctor told me that because they don't enter care homes and do everything by telephone if my mother dies it will be recorded as a covid death.
The landlord of the pub up the road collapsed with a heart attack, took to hospital and died a couple of days later without regaining consciousness. While on a ventilation system he was tested as they do with all hospital admissions and guess what? He died of covid. His widow is battling this by all accounts.
I completely agree with that part. But the virus does spread exponentially, if it didn't then there would never have been a problem. It has 100% been worse than flu season, deaths this year are double a bad flu season and that's with locking down the country for 5 months. A vaccine changes everything, as it has with the flu, but we don't have one.
That is not true I’m afraid. 50000 ish deaths from flu 2015 (44000 excess deaths) and 69000 deaths 1969 or 67 can’t quite remember. No lockdowns and no mention either. There are plenty of research sites out there other MSM
There has been a large reduction in hospital admissions for Covid. Increased knowledge and better treatments have then reduced the number of deaths. Eg, that drug with the long name and clinical decisions taken to delay putting serIously ill patients on mechanical ventilators.
Younger people can generally manage the risks from Covid. Elderly people are likely to die of something (which is often seasonal flu, as mentioned above).
Life has to go as best it can with sensible management of the risks. Otherwise, there will be a bigger, long term disaster.
That is not true I’m afraid. 50000 ish deaths from flu 2015 (44000 excess deaths) and 69000 deaths 1969 or 67 can’t quite remember. No lockdowns and no mention either. There are plenty of research sites out there other MSM
So there were fewer excess deaths in 2015 without shutting down the whole damn country for half of the year. Sounds exactly the same.
Mass flu vaccinations weren't around in the 60's, so slightly more deaths without having shut the country down for half a year (and this year isn't over yet anyway).
Come on, I'm as much in favour of getting back to normal life as anybody. But it doesn't change the fact that this disease IS worse than flu, certainly until a vaccine is found.
We’d be back a lot sooner if the selfish/thick in our society followed basic guidelines, rules and laws.
Much as I would like to believe this, I very much doubt it. When this business is the subject of historical research long after I have left the mortal coil, my bet is that, over the long run, countries with heavy rules will have fared no better in fatalities than those without.
Unfortunately I won’t be around to collect on the bet.
“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.” ― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Batch, Crombie, Moore K, Wiggington, Cumming, Waters, Bonnyman, Ford, Emson, Drinkell, Whymark. Love you all, You are the reason I'm on here. You've had help from Todd, Handyside, Futcher P, Groves, Mendonca, Macca etc etc etc. Up The Mariners!!!!!!!!!
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Four neighbours of mine have had it. I live in a rural area so they are distanced neighbours.
All 4 are well into their seventies with various health problems but all have come through unscathed but two were hospitalized but one had only cold like symptoms.
We are all different and I guess we will all react differently if we caught the virus which is the unpredictable part, but you can see across the country there are very few hospital admissions and deaths, though very sad, are very few indeed.
The virus may mutate, it may not. It may grow stronger or may weaken but however you view it it is not sensible based on current hospital admissions or deaths to ruin the economy or our way of life.
They say the infection rate is rising, yet serious illness is falling which seems at odds if this is the killer virus we were led to believe.
I think the unintended consequences of lockdown will be more deadly than the virus itself but going by the rhetoric of the experts this morning I think we can brace ourselves for more lockdown measures. It would be nice if some pertinent questions were asked of experts as to how deaths are virtually nil yet we still can't go about our normal lives and how long do they expect people to comply until a vaccine is found.
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Anyone parroting the 'it's just like the flu' line hasn't got a clue what they're on about. Here's an article from today on the long term effects experienced by a number of individuals, including young people, infected by the virus - https://www.newstatesman.com/p.....vid-19-last-patients
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
I work in the hospital, and a few people who work in the department next to mine were given the antibody test, it came back that they had antibodies, so more than likely had it at some point but weren’t even aware!
However, on the other hand I know a lady in her early 50’s who is overweight and has breathing issues who got pneumonia in both her lungs back in March, and has only just made a full recovery now.
So I suppose it’s a case of the most vulnerable who suffer the greatest (as we already know).
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Quite a few. Symptoms definitely skew to be worse in the older people. The in laws had it, they're in their 40's and one has now got a blood clot on the lung as a result and is on blood thinners for at least the next 6 months. Somebody that I vaguely knew through work died in their late 50's
Anyone parroting the 'it's just like the flu' line hasn't got a clue what they're on about. Here's an article from today on the long term effects experienced by a number of individuals, including young people, infected by the virus - https://www.newstatesman.com/p.....vid-19-last-patients
Thanks. Chris, that was kind of my point. I’ve just come back from the US where things are much stricter than here (or were around Charlotte) I couldn’t believe the lack of effort around Heathrow on quarantine and other controls. There was basically nothing but some posters. Everyone wants normality but to do it with intercourse all of a plan like this govt seems to be doing is just reckless.
Batch, Crombie, Moore K, Wiggington, Cumming, Waters, Bonnyman, Ford, Emson, Drinkell, Whymark. Love you all, You are the reason I'm on here. You've had help from Todd, Handyside, Futcher P, Groves, Mendonca, Macca etc etc etc. Up The Mariners!!!!!!!!!
I live in Asia so my perspective may be different. The government here acted very quickly and closed schools , bars and sports events. Some people claimed it was an over reaction. Indeed, even some articles in the western media focused on the 'draconian' methods used here. We didn't come out of lock down until we had many days without local transmission. Basically, that's what you have to do. You can't ease lockdown because cases are falling - that means it is working. The virus doesn't just say, "I give up" and sodomist off. Recently we had a second outbreak after 99 days without local transmission. The authorities are flummoxed as to where it came from. They acted swiftly again and with testing and tracing, they seem to have nailed it. We all still have to follow social distancing rules and wear masks. In my opinion the fact that the mask wearing is common place here anyway, has been a factor on it not spreading so rapidly. Still the jury's out on their effectiveness but for me wearing a face covering is no hardship. I find it hard to understand why a lot of European countries are so against it and protest.
That said, I guess you have factor in the economy and livelihoods. Surely, grounds could manage social distancing and it being open air. it's possible to play games with a limited number of fans. Let's hope the games go ahead. It's an exciting time for Town, shame it's being spoilt by a bloody protein. UTM and stay safe.
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
No and I don't know anybody who knows anybody that has had it.
BUT
We know it effects the elderly and people with other health problems a lot more than the young and fit.
That's why I say why not just isolate the ones most at risk.
Over 36 years living in Suffolk but always a mariner. 68 Years following the Town
Having been sat on a train to work this morning that was rammed full of students returning to college none of whom were attempting to social distance at all and only about 50% of whom were wearing masks, I think it is only a matter of when, not if, we have a huge increase in cases and deaths. I am assuming the situation I saw this morning in Farnborough is being mirrored nationwide. So when that increase happens what comes next? Even local lockdowns are going to mean some teams will be unable to travel and play games leading to a disparity in games played, and will people feel comfortable watching sport whilst people are dying again in large numbers anyway. I think we can forget above crowds being allowed into stadiums again any time soon. Suddenly that COVID clause being inserted into players contracts looks like a very sensible precaution.
The world weighs on my shoulders But what am I to do You sometimes drive me crazy But I worry about you
A chap at my work in his early 50’s died, having had Covid, although I don’t know whether he had other health conditions.
A girl I know who is late 20’s describes it as being like the flu, but could barely walk more than 2-3 steps without stopping and having to gasp for air. She was off work for 4 weeks, but 3 months later still has bad days where she gets very breathless after only a little activity. Her other half caught it and apart from a mild cough for a week had no other symptoms.
I would speculate that the increased testing capacity is picking up more cases that wouldn’t have been identified in the earlier lower testing days, and wonder whether either the warmer weather has suppressed the strength of the virus, or whether it has mutated into a milder form.
Either way, we have no knowledge of the long term effects of this illness as to whether permanent damage is done. I continue to avoid unnecessary contact so as to avoid falling ill myself, or passing it on to loved ones, who are older or who may have weaker immune systems.
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Late April. I’m 29 and it’s the illest I’ve ever felt, was very worried at the time.
Was at times really difficult to just sit and breath normally without pain from coughing. Temperature and the fever was also Ridiculous.
Must admit I felt fatigued for weeks and weeks afterwards.
Regrettably had 3 family friends pass away from this. No underline health conditions and generally fit and well, which is why I have no time for this bullshit of “it’s just flu” from some people.
I have not had it, to my knowledge, but 3 years ago I had the standard flu for the first time in 17 years. I tell you now, I had forgotten how awful it can be. Some brush it off as 'only the flu', but many people haven't had that either. I've probably had the proper flu 3 or 4 times in my life, and it wiped the floor with me. I don't have much weight to lose, but after 5 days I'd lost 8 pounds!!
I have no idea how Covid would affect me (probably not much), but to dismiss the flu as just a sniffle is wrong. THAT is called the common cold. The flu is a whole other matter, there's no wonder it kills old people. I was only 41 and wanted to die right there and then, I couldn't get off the sofa for nearly a week!
We have to get on with things and learn to live alongside it. The media have absolutely revelled in reporting the worst news they can despite their being a whole host of reasons why cases are going up.
Unfortunately if you’re older or vulnerable it’s going to be a long time of isolating and generally being careful but it’s the nature of the beast. If you’re young and fit you simply have to be allowed to get back into the world as safely as possible, it makes absolutely no sense to lock those people away when it poses very little risk to them. I totally get that they could pass it on, but if you are vulnerable you’re going to have to keep away from those people for a good while longer.
Back to the media, they’ve been an absolute flipping disgrace from start to finish.
It ripped through my office in Early March.I somehow managed to avoid it but my mate who is 10 years younger than me said he felt worse than he had ever felt for 48 hours but was fine after that. Two women in their forties are working part time as part of a phased return to work. Neither wen't to hospital, but both say that they are still really struggling. One of them I had to stop for about 5 minutes halfway when walking to her car yesterday. The car park is like 100 meters away. I don't want to catch this fecking thing and be stuffed for six months like them.
I have not had it, to my knowledge, but 3 years ago I had the standard flu for the first time in 17 years. I tell you now, I had forgotten how awful it can be. Some brush it off as 'only the flu', but many people haven't had that either. I've probably had the proper flu 3 or 4 times in my life, and it wiped the floor with me. I don't have much weight to lose, but after 5 days I'd lost 8 pounds!!
I have no idea how Covid would affect me (probably not much), but to dismiss the flu as just a sniffle is wrong. THAT is called the common cold. The flu is a whole other matter, there's no wonder it kills old people. I was only 41 and wanted to die right there and then, I couldn't get off the sofa for nearly a week!
Agreed. The flu is horrendous. In words it is like being attacked internally and it runs amok until your body eventually heats up to molten laver levels to kill the bloody thing!
'I walked in the dressing room. The window was open and I thought that a sea fret had got in. Then I saw smoke billowing from a pipe in the corner of the room...it was my centre-forward. He looked seven stone wet through. He went on to score thirty-odd goals that season.' Lawrie McMenemy on encountering the legend that was Matt Tees.
I have not had it, to my knowledge, but 3 years ago I had the standard flu for the first time in 17 years. I tell you now, I had forgotten how awful it can be. Some brush it off as 'only the flu', but many people haven't had that either. I've probably had the proper flu 3 or 4 times in my life, and it wiped the floor with me. I don't have much weight to lose, but after 5 days I'd lost 8 pounds!!
I have no idea how Covid would affect me (probably not much), but to dismiss the flu as just a sniffle is wrong. THAT is called the common cold. The flu is a whole other matter, there's no wonder it kills old people. I was only 41 and wanted to die right there and then, I couldn't get off the sofa for nearly a week!
I had something similar in early-mid December. Absolutely KOd me for 12 days. I’m a runner and do around 15km a week usually but it took me a month or so to get back out. The closest thing I’ve had to that was around the time Swine Flu was going about and I was signed off work for a week. There’s evidence that Covid was in France in December/January so it’s not unbelieveable to think I might have had it then.
Bolton's pubs are being shut. Until both the Govt stops F***ing the track and trace up and people keep on being wazzocks and not wearing masks I don't think we'll be in a football ground until their is a vaccine. I hope I'm wrong.
I haven't had it, but I've listened to people who have, and read what they've written about it. It varies from 'didn't bother me' to absolute tragedy.
We're all keen to live a 'normal' life, and do what we wanna do, and go out drinking, and go to the footy, etc. But in a few years time, or when my son grows up and can't quite get his head around the magnitude of this pandemic that occurred when he was just 2, I want to be able to hold my head high and say I did everything the government told me to do in order to limit the spread of the virus.
Our generation will be judged on what we do today. This isn't a world war but it's something that will certainly define us in years and decades to come, so we need to unite and do the right thing.
It's been a long six months but we need to decide whether we want to continue making the same sort of sacrifices to sustain what we have today, or not bother with the sacrifices and dip back into more months of lockdown and hardship, where our already fragile economy takes another almighty battering and more jobs (and lives) are lost.
To those who aren't wearing masks or are flouting the rules and regulations in place: stop being selfish. Ride this out for a little while longer and we stand a better chance of coming out of this sooner.
"Don't shine that light in my face, mate - I've just lost a pint of blood."
Quoted from Theimperialcoroner Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Anyone parroting the 'it's just like the flu' line hasn't got a clue what they're on about. Here's an article from today on the long term effects experienced by a number of individuals, including young people, infected by the virus - https://www.newstatesman.com/p.....vid-19-last-patients
This is not just like the flu yes the stats do raise key points about Total shut Down is it justified. Only history will truly have the final say I reside in one of the worst /highest affected ares in the uk and believe me it kills We are all looking at ways to '' Get back to Normal'' I think it's probably at least 6 months
Bizarrely, I had all the symptoms last November having been sat near a coughing Chinese family in a London theatre at the end of October. Hacking cough, raging temperature, breathlessness, loss of taste and smell which lasted at least a month. Would love an antibody test but can't get one - my antibodies have probably gone by now anyway!
If it was Covid, I felt awful and totally different to the flu which I'd had 18 months previous.
One thing that is standing out in all of this...and that is: if you get the flu, you know it is the flu virus because of it's severity. If you get a cold, then you know it's a cold. You are a little rough for couple of days, but it doesn't stop you doing things. Various other ailments come and go, but this covid virus, how come if it is a rip-raging pandemic, some that have it don't know that they have got/had it, whilst others may suffer and die? Is it a clever little fellow/bug that can decide which body to run ragged? Why is it so selective? Does it think 'I don't like this geezer, he can have the full volume,' and 'oh I like this fellow's persona, I'll go easy on this one.' Surely if it is as vicious as it is made out to be, then why does it differentiate, because a virus such as flu treats every body it infects in the same way, as with a cold. And as for vulnerability, well the flu or a cold will still affect you in the same way!
Any virologists out there that can shed light?
'I walked in the dressing room. The window was open and I thought that a sea fret had got in. Then I saw smoke billowing from a pipe in the corner of the room...it was my centre-forward. He looked seven stone wet through. He went on to score thirty-odd goals that season.' Lawrie McMenemy on encountering the legend that was Matt Tees.
Bizarrely, I had all the symptoms last November having been sat near a coughing Chinese family in a London theatre at the end of October. Hacking cough, raging temperature, breathlessness, loss of taste and smell which lasted at least a month. Would love an antibody test but can't get one - my antibodies have probably gone by now anyway!
If it was Covid, I felt awful and totally different to the flu which I'd had 18 months previous.
Me and the wife came down with a really bad cold in January, a few days after I had been to Scotland on a Saturday. I stopped at some services and let some school kids in front of me. They looked like they had been on a skiing trip or something.
I was breathless for a few days and absolutely exhausted. I lost my sense of taste and smell for about 3 weeks and had a hacking cough for a couple of days. It wasn't like flu which I had 11 years ago but it took about 3 months for me to feel 100% again. I rocked up at work every day because that's what you do and a colleague came down with it. A marathon runner in his late 40's, he had a week off and was breathless walking to work when he returned.
We all had an antibody test in June and all of us were negative...
One thing that is standing out in all of this...and that is: if you get the flu, you know it is the flu virus because of it's severity. If you get a cold, then you know it's a cold. You are a little rough for couple of days, but it doesn't stop you doing things. Various other ailments come and go, but this covid virus, how come if it is a rip-raging pandemic, some that have it don't know that they have got/had it, whilst others may suffer and die? Is it a clever little fellow/bug that can decide which body to run ragged? Why is it so selective? Does it think 'I don't like this geezer, he can have the full volume,' and 'oh I like this fellow's persona, I'll go easy on this one.' Surely if it is as vicious as it is made out to be, then why does it differentiate, because a virus such as flu treats every body it infects in the same way, as with a cold. And as for vulnerability, well the flu or a cold will still affect you in the same way!
Any virologists out there that can shed light?
There are lots of reasons that a virus is different for different people, and colds and flu are exactly the same. It can be antibodies from a previous illness or high t-cell count give you a boost. Different blood types can be more resistant and I'm sure a whole host of other genetic traits can help or hinder.
I don't think enough is known about why this virus is so varied, but it's the perfect storm of most people not being badly enough afftected that they spread it about, but enough people get seriously ill that it locks up the health services
People comparing covid to flu as if the flu is just a bit of a cold blatantly have never had the flu, likewise people who claim to feel a bit 'fluey' or saying they have a 'touch of flu'. I've been getting a flu jab every year since I suffered a bout of flu as I never want to feel that ill again.
"Lovelly stuff! not my words but the words of Shakin Stevens."
No and I don't know anybody who knows anybody that has had it.
BUT
We know it effects the elderly and people with other health problems a lot more than the young and fit.
That's why I say why not just isolate the ones most at risk.
I don't have a problem with isolating old farts like us Pete in fact I found my period of shielding (which I have chosen to continue incidentally) was absolutely great, I enjoyed it tremendously but those who are not old farts and who are not isolating MUST observe the rules (social distancing, masks etc) if anything is going to make a difference apart from the much promised (but, like Town's promotion, highly unlikely for years) vaccine. The government took the cork fully out of the bottle when they re-opened pubs bars and restaurants Big mistake and impossible now to reverse on a nationwide basis so please, all you fornicators on the urine in Seaview Street this weekend think of me and Pete !
On bended knee is no way to be free - Peter R de Vries
Out of interest, has anyone on here had Covid or know anyone that has? If so what was their experience? I hear loads of it’s just like the flu, but only from people who have not been close to it.
Yes, my Brothers wife's step dad who cycles everywhere and for someone in he late 50's early 60's has no underlying health conditions and is fit as an ox got covid and nearly died. He ended up at Castle Hill, he got what most experience short breath, fatigue then lungs filled with fluid and somehow bless him, he made it through.
For me it has to be individual immune system related, im sure i have had covid back in February when onsite at clients (Gloucester) when the Cheltenham Festival was on. 2nd day in the week i felt strange, went dizzy for 10 mins, felt sick and had hot flushes (no not the menopause haha) i took some paracetamol and after 30 mins or so i was fine. But i said earlier if you dont get tested you dont know if you have covid, and if you do but not showing symptoms and appear immune to it what can you do, self isolate not to pass it on to others, cos i'd be in permanent lock down if thats the case until a vaccine is found.
Its the deaths from covid we need to keep an eye out, not the rise in cases. If everyone in the country got tested you had a huge rise in cases im sure, but how many of these cases are showing immunity?
I don't have a problem with isolating old farts like us Pete in fact I found my period of shielding (which I have chosen to continue incidentally) was absolutely great, I enjoyed it tremendously but those who are not old farts and who are not isolating MUST observe the rules (social distancing, masks etc) if anything is going to make a difference apart from the much promised (but, like Town's promotion, highly unlikely for years) vaccine. The government took the cork fully out of the bottle when they re-opened pubs bars and restaurants Big mistake and impossible now to reverse on a nationwide basis so please, all you fornicators on the urine in Seaview Street this weekend think of me and Pete !
As another old fart I have to agree Swin. I would say that the government was wrong in its choice of what to open and how to behave in places like bars and pubs. That doesn't mean it is wrong to open other things though. In fact it is essential they do but they have to be opened a bit at a time and rules applied, not because I think rules about masks and distance are particularly effective but because people need to be take some social discipline about it, not just blast back to normality in one go. I can see that being anarchic.
“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.” ― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
As a matter of interest, the St. Ledger weekend is being allowed to go ahead with up to 20,000 people expected to attend.
There seems to be one law for football, and a completely different law for horse racing. Can anyone explain why?
Dido Harding and her connections to Johnson
Batch, Crombie, Moore K, Wiggington, Cumming, Waters, Bonnyman, Ford, Emson, Drinkell, Whymark. Love you all, You are the reason I'm on here. You've had help from Todd, Handyside, Futcher P, Groves, Mendonca, Macca etc etc etc. Up The Mariners!!!!!!!!!
Head of Test and Trace and the new health authority, also ex Talk Talk, on The Jockey Club board and a big mate of Hancock. Also married to some Tory MP who wants to privatise the NHS.
Batch, Crombie, Moore K, Wiggington, Cumming, Waters, Bonnyman, Ford, Emson, Drinkell, Whymark. Love you all, You are the reason I'm on here. You've had help from Todd, Handyside, Futcher P, Groves, Mendonca, Macca etc etc etc. Up The Mariners!!!!!!!!!
Yes, my Brothers wife's step dad who cycles everywhere and for someone in he late 50's early 60's has no underlying health conditions and is fit as an ox got covid and nearly died. He ended up at Castle Hill, he got what most experience short breath, fatigue then lungs filled with fluid and somehow bless him, he made it through.
For me it has to be individual immune system related, im sure i have had covid back in February when onsite at clients (Gloucester) when the Cheltenham Festival was on. 2nd day in the week i felt strange, went dizzy for 10 mins, felt sick and had hot flushes (no not the menopause haha) i took some paracetamol and after 30 mins or so i was fine. But i said earlier if you dont get tested you dont know if you have covid, and if you do but not showing symptoms and appear immune to it what can you do, self isolate not to pass it on to others, cos i'd be in permanent lock down if thats the case until a vaccine is found.
Its the deaths from covid we need to keep an eye out, not the rise in cases. If everyone in the country got tested you had a huge rise in cases im sure, but how many of these cases are showing immunity?
If your tested and are positive u don't have to isolate forever! It's 7 days I think. Or maybe 14 cant recall. The virus ceases to be transmittable after a while.
If your tested and are positive u don't have to isolate forever! It's 7 days I think. Or maybe 14 cant recall. The virus ceases to be transmittable after a while.
then mine would have long gone as i got furloughed for 3 months and never went anywhere, then came off furlough but worked from home. now im back in the office
Head of Test and Trace and the new health authority, also ex Talk Talk, on The Jockey Club board and a big mate of Hancock. Also married to some Tory MP who wants to privatise the NHS.
Bang on Old Codger and when the Tories eventually roll out full privatisation you can catch what you like 'cos if you can't pay for treatment you've had it!
'I walked in the dressing room. The window was open and I thought that a sea fret had got in. Then I saw smoke billowing from a pipe in the corner of the room...it was my centre-forward. He looked seven stone wet through. He went on to score thirty-odd goals that season.' Lawrie McMenemy on encountering the legend that was Matt Tees.
yet another buzzword on the street to instill fear. Our National Game along with many other businesses dying and the figures still are not has bad as a flu season. If you test positive and still feel well what does it tell you. Protect the vulnerable and let everyone else get on with their lives
Errr it’s not the flu season . That’s in the winter .
Well the Woman in charge of track and trace is also the Jockey Club Owner or manager something like that so i bet it does go ahead. Not looking promising in terms of a return for us though
Well the Woman in charge of track and trace is also the Jockey Club Owner or manager something like that so i bet it does go ahead. Not looking promising in terms of a return for us though
This.
“There's nothing wrong with the car except that it's on fire.”- Murray Walker
Am I one of the few that think along the lines of, the more people that get tested, the more people are going to be positive. Bit like speed cameras, the more you put up, the more get caught speeding. They were speeding before but nobody knew about it. There’s been quite a few people tested positive that showed no signs of having it.
Baldrick ! The only impression you can do is that of a man with no talent !! GTFC team 09/10 - Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick, Baldrick.
Genuine question; what does this actually mean for the reopening of football grounds? Obviously the 1,800 to 2,200 capacity mooted is a bigger number than 6 (I’m literally that good at maths), but in the case of Town we’ve been quite clear in limiting ‘bubbles’ to a maximum of 6.
For instance, under these new rules you could easily have many groups of 6 sitting in a pub or restaurant, or walking round a park or zoo - what about sporting arenas?
There are some differences between those scenarios, in particular a large number of people trying to arrive at the same place at the same time, but it doesn’t seem immediately clear what this means for live sport.
You are right Tashee, there is a lot more testing now compared to when the virus first arrived here, so you are not comparing like for like. The other point is that you only get tested if you are showing symptoms, so you are more likely to find it. You cannot get tested if you haven't any symptoms.
You are right Tashee, there is a lot more testing now compared to when the virus first arrived here, so you are not comparing like for like. The other point is that you only get tested if you are showing symptoms, so you are more likely to find it. You cannot get tested if you haven't any symptoms.
Symptoms. There's new symptoms every day. Soon you'll be advised to get tested if you stub your toe or have a wet fart.
Who the intercourse knows? It’s all becoming increasingly wishy washy, more so than it has so far.
I mean I’ll give them some credit, they’ve been consistently clueless throughout the whole thing.
As for sorting events, who knows? I’d imagine the bubbles of no more than 6 is standard across the stadiums so that shouldn’t make a difference. It’s an outdoor event too which, as they’ve told us several times, being outdoors is better than inside.
I find it odd that these things are being enforced at future dates; if the issue is real then enforce it from now, not in a weeks time.
Poojah makes a good point about people arriving at the same time to enter the stadium but I’m sure among that thesis of a ST pack it mentions or suggests a staggered entry time, where ST will be given a time frame they have to arrive by. I’m not sure this is either sensible or worthwhile but it might go a long way to explain how they’ll do it.
From my point of view, assuming you’re given a time frame of sat 2pm to 2:15pm, that’s a long time for someone just to sit and wait. They’ve said bars and food outlets are unlikely to be open. A captive audience and nobody benefits...
'the poor and the needy are selfish and greedy'...well done Mozza
“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.” ― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
There’s been quite a few people tested positive that showed no signs of having it.
That's the worrying bit for me. Incidentally I'm sure you have to display symptoms before you can get a test anyway.
All the drunktwits ignoring social distancing in the pubs, don't have symptoms and therefore don't give a excrement as 'it won't kill me I'm young and fit(tish)' are the problem
As far as the figures are concerned you are right. The increase in numbers getting tested inevitably leads to higher positives. Positive tests as a percentage of tests performed would be a better indicator of the possible re-emergence of the virus
On bended knee is no way to be free - Peter R de Vries
That's the worrying bit for me. Incidentally I'm sure you have to display symptoms before you can get a test anyway.
All the drunktwits ignoring social distancing in the pubs, don't have symptoms and therefore don't give a excrement as 'it won't kill me I'm young and fit(tish)' are the problem
As far as the figures are concerned you are right. The increase in numbers getting tested inevitably leads to higher positives. Positive tests as a percentage of tests performed would be a better indicator of the possible re-emergence of the virus
That's partly true. A month or so ago, I had something that wiped me out. No cough or fever, but I was sleeping all day every day. Don't know if it was or wasn't covid but I couldn't get a test because it wasn't the prime symptoms.
But I had to get a test last week when in the hospital as part of test and trace, even though I had absolutely nothing wrong with me.
I take it you are referring to the (relatively) low numbers in the local area
while you are looking at the GET can I refer you to the series of photographs which appear in the on-line version every Monday showing all the silly drunktwits in the Seaview Street bars totally ignoring any social distancing measures. (some superb ladies legs on view though!)
On bended knee is no way to be free - Peter R de Vries
I take it you are referring to the (relatively) low numbers in the local area
while you are looking at the GET can I refer you to the series of photographs which appear in the on-line version every Monday showing all the silly drunktwits in the Seaview Street bars totally ignoring any social distancing measures. (some superb ladies legs on view though!)
Saw those Swin, the legs anyway. Yes it’s true what you say but I’m just saying that the local situation is different to the National figures that seem to drive the government. Incidentally, this is the first time the individual hospital stats have been published. I asked for these in April and the GT said they had asked already but the Trust refused to release them. Why would it take a FIA request to get some information like that I wonder, why did the Trust not want people to know that Scunthorpe had by far the most infections?
“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.” ― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
Saw those Swin, the legs anyway. Yes it’s true what you say but I’m just saying that the local situation is different to the National figures that seem to drive the government. Incidentally, this is the first time the individual hospital stats have been published. I asked for these in April and the GT said they had asked already but the Trust refused to release them. Why would it take a FIA request to get some information like that I wonder, why did the Trust not want people to know that Scunthorpe had by far the most infections?
I think, bearing in mind the total stupidity of those ignoring social distancing, that finding out Scunthorpe was worse than Grimsby would only have led to an even greater 'it's all alright we don't have to worry about it' feeling amongst the idiots. Shame the figures have come out now I reckon.
On bended knee is no way to be free - Peter R de Vries
So what do these new rules from Monday mean for football crowds? Is that not considered a large public gathering?
Highly unlikely considering it seems they don't think a racecourse with a large expanse and a lot of social distancing measures put in place are safe enough. But you can still go to an enclosed pub/club, no social distancing and no face masks, so all is good
I think, bearing in mind the total stupidity of those ignoring social distancing, that finding out Scunthorpe was worse than Grimsby would only have led to an even greater 'it's all alright we don't have to worry about it' feeling amongst the idiots. Shame the figures have come out now I reckon.
Why do you say that Swin? Just because some are idiots doesn't mean we all are and I would want to know what the situation is near me. Like you I'm not in GY now but it's the same principle round here. Stupid big media headline last week about huge rise in Breckland cases when in fact they were connected with one factory and restricted to one small area but they have to try and terrify the rest of us until eventually we see the truth in the small print.
“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.” ― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
Why do you say that Swin? Just because some are idiots doesn't mean we all are and I would want to know what the situation is near me. Like you I'm not in GY now but it's the same principle round here. Stupid big media headline last week about huge rise in Breckland cases when in fact they were connected with one factory and restricted to one small area but they have to try and terrify the rest of us until eventually we see the truth in the small print.
I just think, in respect of areas with low numbers like Grimsby Norfolk and Suffolk, it only adds to the complacency factor amongst the stupid ones
A little bit of President Trump's 'fake news' about the numbers might not go amiss in an effort to wake some folk up!
On bended knee is no way to be free - Peter R de Vries
"Plans to pilot larger audiences in stadiums and to allow conferences to go ahead from October will be put on hold."
So yeah commiserations to anyone who applied for a season ticket on the basis that we'd all be allowed back in by October with only the Salford game being played behind closed doors (lol this includes me lol)
Was gonna get mine friday, not now. Cant throw money away
Same here, was planning on holding off until the last minute and glad I did. That being said I have my fingers crossed for those that have renewed already that the situation improves and crowds are back asap.
You can red cross all you like . I've been very consistent in my thoughts that Football crowds wont be back this season . I was told the prognosis back in early April. I hope I'm wrong but just can't see it . The kids are back at school , most of us are back at work . That's all the government want for the next 12 months imo
You can red cross all you like . I've been very consistent in my thoughts that Football crowds wont be back this season . I was told the prognosis back in early April. I hope I'm wrong but just can't see it . The kids are back at school , most of us are back at work . That's all the government want for the next 12 months imo
By whom may I ask?
“There's nothing wrong with the car except that it's on fire.”- Murray Walker
By who? If you were watching and listening carefully back then you would know . The government hide nothing , they tell us everything . You just have to be listening when they do
By who? If you were watching and listening carefully back then you would know . The government hide nothing , they tell us everything . You just have to be listening when they do
Ah I see. No evidence whatsoever then unless you can provide otherwise?
“There's nothing wrong with the car except that it's on fire.”- Murray Walker
As we all know, the government don’t know their bottom from their elbow.
They’re reintroducing another bodge job, so important it can wait almost a week to be implemented.
It’s all becoming farcical.
There’s absolutely zero evidence to suggest fans won’t be allowed in to sporting events, much like there’s little evidence to the contrary.
The whole thing is becoming even more of a farce than it already was. People are fed up listening to and being told to take advice from a clusterfuck personified and then there are those almost paranoid to an extent that they’ve shut down everything in their life.
Then there’s the rest, many know it isn’t perhaps as bad as being said, they’ve listened, they’ve made their own mind up but realise that if they want any sort of return to acruslly normality rather than this bullshit ‘new normal’ then perhaps we just have to crack on...
But as I say, when things are so desperately important we have to wait a week for it to come in to force it does make even then least cynical person question the validity.
'the poor and the needy are selfish and greedy'...well done Mozza
People you say ? . That's a sweeping statement isn't it . I know alot of "people" that a very happy to do as they are told to help deal with this pandemic . Have you lived through a pandemic before if the answer is No then just do as you're told . Stop wining and moaning about missing football or not been able to go to Majorca this year . Don't tell me people are suffering I know that , it's a pandemic FFS , it will cause pain and suffering and Death .
I’ve got a feeling that the Cambridge experiment took place there was the proximity to the drugs companies in the city who are attempting to find a vaccine .
All 3 of us had it in our household end March/April. First Son Of who was very ill for a week several days with a temp and hardly moved and could well have been admitted to hospital as he could hardly breath but wouldn't go. Wife Of and I caught it off him, Wife Of was half as ill as Son Of (like him has asthma) and also really struggled with breathing but not much of a temperature, I had it light touch, a bad cough for a week or so, with a little fever just over one night. The main thing was we were all absolutely knackered for weeks afterwards with no energy or umph to do anything other than basic household tasks. It certainly affects people in different ways and easy to transmit. Myself I think unfortuneately we need to shut indoor spaces like pubs/restaurants and flights again to get on top of it once and for all, football crowds ? not sure, will people act responsibly ? a lot havn't managed to in other social settings so I doubt they will at a football match where certain groups of peoples behaviour is generally worse.
The government is more frightened of us than it is of the virus. They and the “experts” are terrified of underestimating deaths and infections. They would rather be accused of exaggeration because this can be explained away. But if there are more fatalities than estimated then the blame game comes down on them.
In that sense all this Boristalk yesterday is not a deliberate denial of civil liberties but it is using fear and panic to make people accept measures they would have rebelled against. Using emotive terms like “it’s a pandemic so we must ..... “ it’s a world crisis so we must .....”. Pandemic is simply a term for a worldwide spread of a virus, it does not mean a worldwide spread of a virus that kills everyone. That is panic not pandemic.
We know the groups most likely to spread the virus so deal with them specifically. This ARP lark and the other rules for Monday is like a teacher punishing the whole class for one person talking.
“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.” ― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
The government is more frightened of us than it is of the virus. They and the “experts” are terrified of underestimating deaths and infections. They would rather be accused of exaggeration because this can be explained away. But if there are more fatalities than estimated then the blame game comes down on them.
In that sense all this Boristalk yesterday is not a deliberate denial of civil liberties but it is using fear and panic to make people accept measures they would have rebelled against. Using emotive terms like “it’s a pandemic so we must ..... “ it’s a world crisis so we must .....”. Pandemic is simply a term for a worldwide spread of a virus, it does not mean a worldwide spread of a virus that kills everyone. That is panic not pandemic.
We know the groups most likely to spread the virus so deal with them specifically. This ARP lark and the other rules for Monday is like a teacher punishing the whole class for one person talking.
I agree with that analysis.
Whilst listening yesterday that ghastly phrase "risk averse" was the overriding impression I got.
They are terrified of anything they can be accused of by their critics.
So called experts can blindly say do this or that without any regard for the wider implications- in the case of this particular forum the likely demise of our precious football clubs unless fans are let in soon.
It is a difficult situation to manage but I can't see people taking a blind bit of notice of any new restrictions.
Tinkering around the edges wont work. it may have a very small affect but that is it. Too many not wearing masks in shops and there will be few that stick to 6 in a group. Only another full lockdown will halt it , but it wont cure it . It is here untill a vaccine is found . I still dont think the season will run its full course without a stopage at some point
Tinkering around the edges wont work. it may have a very small affect but that is it. Too many not wearing masks in shops and there will be few that stick to 6 in a group. Only another full lockdown will halt it , but it wont cure it . It is here untill a vaccine is found . I still dont think the season will run its full course without a stopage at some point
I actually think the season can be completed in full, but the chances of us being allowed back in to watch football are decreasing all the time. I think the best we can do for the club is pay for iFollow every week, and I intend to do that. Unless Phillip Day tells us we have to attend or the club will fold, I'll stay away until things are completely back to normal. I have no interest in visiting a socially distanced Blundell Park, I'd much rather stay away.
Despite what it says in their FAQ section, I think the club need to really review what their approach is on this.
Regardless of how badly they need the money, it's fundamentally wrong to expect anyone to pay £340 for a season ticket if a return to action never happens.
If anyone wishes to give that money up, fair enough.
Despite what it says in their FAQ section, I think the club need to really review what their approach is on this.
Regardless of how badly they need the money, it's fundamentally wrong to expect anyone to pay £340 for a season ticket if a return to action never happens.
If anyone wishes to give that money up, fair enough.
Well whether they wish to/are able to review it is one thing, but they are covered as they explicitly stated no refunds under any circumstances.
What doesn’t sit right is that they are continuing to process postal renewal payments and have taken the phones off the hooks so people don’t have that small glimmer of hope of getting in touch to cancel their renewal now the guidelines are seemingly changing.
I get that the club are struggling massively but that is a pretty underhand move IMO.
...cue the red cross brigade who never have had and never will have season tickets endorsing what is quite shitty and alienating behaviour ha haa.
Whilst listening yesterday that ghastly phrase "risk averse" was the overriding impression I got.
They are terrified of anything they can be accused of by their critics.
So called experts can blindly say do this or that without any regard for the wider implications- in the case of this particular forum the likely demise of our precious football clubs unless fans are let in soon.
It is a difficult situation to manage but I can't see people taking a blind bit of notice of any new restrictions.
They will have to take notice, BJ marshals will enforce it £100 BILLION bonus for his mates in charge of the failing testing in his latest moonshine idea
Well whether they wish to/are able to review it is one thing, but they are covered as they explicitly stated no refunds under any circumstances.
What doesn’t sit right is that they are continuing to process postal renewal payments and have taken the phones off the hooks so people don’t have that small glimmer of hope of getting in touch to cancel their renewal now the guidelines are seemingly changing.
I get that the club are struggling massively but that is a pretty underhand move IMO.
...cue the red cross brigade who never have had and never will have season tickets endorsing what is quite shitty and alienating behaviour ha haa.
As much as the future of the club really concerns me, let's admit it, you'd have to be mental to actually buy a season ticket for this campaign, and the club know it.
If the season is wiped and those with a ST can view all games, home and away, on IFollow, then i suppose it is worth the investment to some. Otherwise, for them to still be processing applications after yesterdays news, is pretty diabolical really.
A completely unnecessary spike in cases which will have big impacts elsewhere. Can’t understand the desire to force everyone together in restaurants when a massive number were able to do a delivery or takeout service that worked fine, certainly can’t understand why the tax payer was paying half of Jeremy Hunt’s £120 pub lunch with pals.
You can’t just lash everyone together at the same time without any consequences. Things like schools or increased capacity for a working track & trace system could have been prioritised, but Harvester and Wetherspoons got the money. Odd that.
Anyway, the new lockdown and more delays to sporting events like this are the consequence.
me brother has disabilities and the minute chance of town returning was enough to convince, we spoke with him this morning about it. His clubs etc and social bits he goes too throughout the week have all stopped so this will at least give him something to focus on ! he's, of course, not able to go on his own so me mams going to be his carer at the games along with myself when she cant make it
Well i must be mental coz ive just gone and bought mine and me brothers. Thought club need this more than i do
Did you go to the ticket office? If so, was anyone answering the phone? I just wanted to check my renewal form had arrived, posted over a week ago. I wasn't comfortable putting the three digit security code down on paper and chucking it in one of those quaint red boxes on the pavement! I'll keep trying I guess.
me brother has disabilities and the minute chance of town returning was enough to convince, we spoke with him this morning about it. His clubs etc and social bits he goes too throughout the week have all stopped so this will at least give him something to focus on ! he's, of course, not able to go on his own so me mams going to be his carer at the games along with myself when she cant make it
Fair play to you then, Hagrid. It does show incredible loyalty, and I've always been loyal myself, but I've sort of accepted that I'll probably be paying near to £460 this season for iFollow games; after deductions, that can't be too far from the club effectively getting season ticket money from me.
Of course, if fans are allowed back in at some point, iFollow streams may well stop in the UK, so my plan is not 100% perfect. Its a case of suck it and see.
After reading your post above, I really hope the fans are allowed back in, stuff like this really isn't fair for people like your brother who've had stuff taken from them when it's doubly important to them.
They will have to take notice, BJ marshals will enforce it £100 BILLION bonus for his mates in charge of the failing testing in his latest moonshine idea
Oh dont be gormless- how the hell are groups of more than 6 people meeting throughout the UK going to be "policed"?
Marshalls indeed. Are they going to wear a star shaped badge and a Stetson? The whole thing is ridiculous.
Did the government actually say that crowds were not allowed in from the start of October? The article I read, and I'm not reading much about this anymore, said that they would review the situation but no decision has been made.
I fully expect it to be stopped, and always assumed people buying tickets expected this. Like people booking holidays knew there's a risk of getting stuck or stuck at home quarantining, but it seems everybody just goes along with ignorant bliss thinking "it's ok today, so it will be tomorrow"...
BJ said the pilot games and plans for fans returning would be reviewed and 'abridged'. Best we can hope for is moving forward later in Oct/Nov with even smaller crowds and keeping an eye on local rates. At least we are in a favourable place there as things stand.
They've just cancelled the 2000 spectator pilot planned for Cambridge's home game on Saturday, which strongly suggests the likelihood of season ticket holders getting in to Blundell Park by early October is significantly less now - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/54102205
Guess I’m mental too. If the season doesn’t start, or is behind closed doors, then I see my season ticket monies as a contribution to the clubs survival.
Guess I’m mental too. If the season doesn’t start, or is behind closed doors, then I see my season ticket monies as a contribution to the clubs survival.
That's the way I see it. I spend my ST money every season and this year is no different. If I don't actually see any of games then obviously I will be very disappointed. But if that money helps to ensure that I have a football club to support then so be it. These are unusual times but I want a a football club to support when it is over.
The Future is Black & White. "The commonest thing on this planet is not water , as some people believe, but stupidity ". Frank Zappa
That's the way I see it. I spend my ST money every season and this year is no different. If I don't actually see any of games then obviously I will be very disappointed. But if that money helps to ensure that I have a football club to support then so be it. These are unusual times but I want a a football club to support when it is over.
Same - we've renewed our three as we want a club at the end of this. That said, it's time those in authority stuck with decisions they've made rather than this flip flopping from one week to the next which is helping nobody.
Same - we've renewed our three as we want a club at the end of this. That said, it's time those in authority stuck with decisions they've made rather than this flip flopping from one week to the next which is helping nobody.
I agree but the reaction from our Government is not dissimilar to many other European and worldwide countries. Restrictions have been lifted or relaxed and then re-imposed when the infection rate has risen.
The Future is Black & White. "The commonest thing on this planet is not water , as some people believe, but stupidity ". Frank Zappa
Well as an exile who doesn’t get to that many home games (and a few away), the club will make more out of me under the current restrictions, as I’ll probably watch most games on iFollow
My understanding is away games are full price for everyone, even STHs much like a normal season.
I believe that when ST are issued, you’ll be given a code which allows you to watch home games on iFollow for free - or so my mum was told in the club shop on Monday.
'the poor and the needy are selfish and greedy'...well done Mozza
I'd love to help the club out more but for me it's not realistic with my money situation. Although ii have bought both the home and away kit which usually I onlly ever buy one t shirt a season not full strips along with my club shop purchases last month.. If we all continue to do our bit, however big or small it all comes together to help
The fact we’re allowing the downfall of football clubs, theatres and small businesses for a virus with a death rate of around 0.2% is a tragedy in itself. The sooner we can learn to live with it and the media stop their hypocritical circus, the better.
The fact we’re allowing the downfall of football clubs, theatres and small businesses for a virus with a death rate of around 0.2% is a tragedy in itself. The sooner we can learn to live with it and the media stop their hypocritical circus, the better.
The problem is that the death rate is so low because most people behaved throughout spring and summer, which meant that the virus didn't spread as badly as feared.
The indications are that in winter the virus will be even more dangerous. Yes, the death rate is low which is a positive. I fully accept the argument between hospital admissions/deaths against the numbers of people testing positive for the virus. I'm actually becoming more and more favourable to a herd immunity argument which is something I never thought I'd hear myself saying.
But if the much talked about second wave comes back and is twice, three, four....times as hard as the first, our health infrastructure will not cope. We don't have enough Doctors, Nurses, Porters, HCA's to cope. We don't have the equipment or estate to cope either.
I totally get the argument about a collapsed economy having a greater potential to kill far more than the virus itself. I don't even pretend to know what I would do if I was given the card of making these decisions. But I'm not sure 'just getting on with it' is going to work. I hate saying this, but life as we knew it may not return for a long, long time. If at all. Business, including our beloved football clubs, may fall victim to this.
Regards Season Tickets - I'm still right now torn between getting a season ticket or not. I can top my glass up as much as I want, but I can't see how fans will be let in in October, if at all for the season itself. Beyond that, is it reasonable to expect that the season will even get close to completion? Say you've got a squad of 20 players. Add to that the vast majority of those players will have partners with their own bubbles (be it work, social, other family etc.) The bubble is getting bigger. Then it's a fair assumption that a lot of the players will have young children. Having one child increases the already growing bubble by 30 at least, but also has to factor in the existing bubbles those 30 other people are already in.
Within a small family, the reach of the bubble is ridiculous. Footballers are then going onto a field for face-to-face physical contact with other people in identical situations from completely different parts of the country.
How can you control that?
£340 for no live games and 20ish (at the absolute best) average streamed games isn't value at all. I've said before that I actually feel for whoever is trying to do the best for the club (all clubs in fact) throughout this. I don't like the mixed messages that have come from the club but trying to put that aside, I just don't see the value at all.
Even reading my message back I'm still undecided. Under no other circumstance would I even consider getting one. But it's Town!
Right now I'm looking at it on the above of paying the £340 for 23 streamed games. Works out about £15 a game....Part of me says you'd pay more than that for a Boxing PPV etc. Does anyone know what cut Town get off the iFollow money or should I say what they have to pay to iFollow for the passes they'll be allocating? If it's not in the clubs favour I'd rather pay on a game by game basis and give the other £110 directly to the club.
The fact we’re allowing the downfall of football clubs, theatres and small businesses for a virus with a death rate of around 0.2% is a tragedy in itself. The sooner we can learn to live with it and the media stop their hypocritical circus, the better.
Just out of interest, how many people are you willing to have die so you can sit and watch GTFC for 90 mins once a week?
Just out of interest, how many people are you willing to have die so you can sit and watch GTFC for 90 mins once a week?
And how far into the pits are you willing to see the world go for a virus that isn’t deadly for almost all of the people it comes into contact with?
Judging by your annoyance at how ‘low paid Nandos workers’ (your words, not mine) are back in work, I’d presume the answer to that is pretty far.
Striking a balance is absolutely key to getting back to normal. Those denying it’s a problem need to accept that it is and those like yourself, who seemingly want to stay indoors forever also need a reality check. You’re at risk every single day of your life, you’re far more likely to die in an RTA on the way to the match than you are to die of the virus at it, are you going to stop going when the virus has gone?
My old mans in a strange situation, he has renewed his season ticket, but does not have access to a streaming device (if he did he wouldn't have a clue how to set it up with his TV) so wouldn't be able to watch on ifollow, So for him its important that he can get to games eventually or its a load of money he can hardly afford to spend down the drain for him
Striking a balance is absolutely key to getting back to normal.
This fixation with going to a football match above all other considerations is hardly 'striking a balance' in fact it's pretty low down on the list of things that might do anything to return things to normal whilst still attempting to eliminate the virus, it's not that important.
On bended knee is no way to be free - Peter R de Vries
The problem is that the death rate is so low because most people behaved throughout spring and summer, which meant that the virus didn't spread as badly as feared.
The indications are that in winter the virus will be even more dangerous. Yes, the death rate is low which is a positive. I fully accept the argument between hospital admissions/deaths against the numbers of people testing positive for the virus. I'm actually becoming more and more favourable to a herd immunity argument which is something I never thought I'd hear myself saying.
But if the much talked about second wave comes back and is twice, three, four....times as hard as the first, our health infrastructure will not cope. We don't have enough Doctors, Nurses, Porters, HCA's to cope. We don't have the equipment or estate to cope either.
I totally get the argument about a collapsed economy having a greater potential to kill far more than the virus itself. I don't even pretend to know what I would do if I was given the card of making these decisions. But I'm not sure 'just getting on with it' is going to work. I hate saying this, but life as we knew it may not return for a long, long time. If at all. Business, including our beloved football clubs, may fall victim to this.
Regards Season Tickets - I'm still right now torn between getting a season ticket or not. I can top my glass up as much as I want, but I can't see how fans will be let in in October, if at all for the season itself. Beyond that, is it reasonable to expect that the season will even get close to completion? Say you've got a squad of 20 players. Add to that the vast majority of those players will have partners with their own bubbles (be it work, social, other family etc.) The bubble is getting bigger. Then it's a fair assumption that a lot of the players will have young children. Having one child increases the already growing bubble by 30 at least, but also has to factor in the existing bubbles those 30 other people are already in.
Within a small family, the reach of the bubble is ridiculous. Footballers are then going onto a field for face-to-face physical contact with other people in identical situations from completely different parts of the country.
How can you control that?
£340 for no live games and 20ish (at the absolute best) average streamed games isn't value at all. I've said before that I actually feel for whoever is trying to do the best for the club (all clubs in fact) throughout this. I don't like the mixed messages that have come from the club but trying to put that aside, I just don't see the value at all.
Even reading my message back I'm still undecided. Under no other circumstance would I even consider getting one. But it's Town!
Right now I'm looking at it on the above of paying the £340 for 23 streamed games. Works out about £15 a game....Part of me says you'd pay more than that for a Boxing PPV etc. Does anyone know what cut Town get off the iFollow money or should I say what they have to pay to iFollow for the passes they'll be allocating? If it's not in the clubs favour I'd rather pay on a game by game basis and give the other £110 directly to the club.
The club will get more than they would through one off passes, but I've not seen any information about if the club have to pay or how much. But ifollow match pass was supposedly £8 last season and they're reducing it to do a gate sharing this season.
This fixation with going to a football match above all other considerations is hardly 'striking a balance' in fact it's pretty low down on the list of things that might do anything to return things to normal whilst still attempting to eliminate the virus, it's not that important.
Who said it’s ‘above all considerations’? The fact it can be socially distanced, coupled with the fact it’s outside which makes it difficult for the virus to spread makes it daft for people to shut down the idea that we can address the idea of allowing fans in. We’ve actually gone backwards on that view despite deaths remaining low.
And how far into the pits are you willing to see the world go for a virus that isn’t deadly for almost all of the people it comes into contact with?
Judging by your annoyance at how ‘low paid Nandos workers’ (your words, not mine) are back in work, I’d presume the answer to that is pretty far.
Striking a balance is absolutely key to getting back to normal. Those denying it’s a problem need to accept that it is and those like yourself, who seemingly want to stay indoors forever also need a reality check. You’re at risk every single day of your life, you’re far more likely to die in an RTA on the way to the match than you are to die of the virus at it, are you going to stop going when the virus has gone?
So is that...what, one or more dead people so you can watch lower league football once a fortnight? Couldn’t quite make it out from your post. 500 more maybe? 1000 fathers and mothers?
It’s all well and good talking about low mortality rates, but the issue is the fact that those who require hospital treatment require fairly intensive treatment and resources - beds, ventilators, monitoring etc - which we don’t have the capacity for. This is why whole hospitals and entire wards had to be cleared of sick people, and other illnesses like cancer treatment were put on the back burner. “Protect The NHS” and all that - the measures in place are to stop the total collapse of the health service.
Thanks for (almost) quoting my words back to me but you seem to have missed the point. People were being forced into jobs, subsidised by the tax payer, where the spread of the disease was likely and there was a fairly well established alternative business model available. The impact is that larger gatherings that could be better managed, like football matches, now can’t go ahead. People are now going to be effectively starved back to work, with no legal requirement for workplaces to be Covid secure, when the furlough scheme is stopped. Other European countries have extended theirs well into next year.
Interesting stat on road traffic accidents, though perhaps not relevant unless you can spread car crashes by coughing on people...
So is that...what, one or more dead people so you can watch lower league football once a fortnight? Couldn’t quite make it out from your post. 500 more maybe? 1000 fathers and mothers?
It’s all well and good talking about low mortality rates, but the issue is the fact that those who require hospital treatment require fairly intensive treatment and resources - beds, ventilators, monitoring etc - which we don’t have the capacity for. This is why whole hospitals and entire wards had to be cleared of sick people, and other illnesses like cancer treatment were put on the back burner. “Protect The NHS” and all that - the measures in place are to stop the total collapse of the health service.
Thanks for (almost) quoting my words back to me but you seem to have missed the point. People were being forced into jobs, subsidised by the tax payer, where the spread of the disease was likely and there was a fairly well established alternative business model available. The impact is that larger gatherings that could be better managed, like football matches, now can’t go ahead. People are now going to be effectively starved back to work, with no legal requirement for workplaces to be Covid secure, when the furlough scheme is stopped. Other European countries have extended theirs well into next year.
Interesting stat on road traffic accidents, though perhaps not relevant unless you can spread car crashes by coughing on people...
Where are you getting this fantasy of hospitals being overrun from? They weren’t overrun at its peak and they aren’t rising now, despite the fact cases are rising. Medical professionals urged people back into hospitals for routine illness because the media terrified people into thinking the virus was far more deadly than it is.
You say it’s ‘all well and good talking about low mortality rates’ but that’s an absolutely crucial point is it not? The damage this fear mongering has done is going to have far wider reaching impact than the virus ever will.
Where are you getting this fantasy of hospitals being overrun from? They weren’t overrun at its peak and they aren’t rising now, despite the fact cases are rising. Medical professionals urged people back into hospitals for routine illness because the media terrified people into thinking the virus was far more deadly than it is.
You say it’s ‘all well and good talking about low mortality rates’ but that’s an absolutely crucial point is it not? The damage this fear mongering has done is going to have far wider reaching impact than the virus ever will.
Hospitals didn't get overrun because we went into lockdown. Heading into the flu season and opening up society completely is a disaster waiting to happen for the NHS. If things are pushed too far, we'll end up with another 3 months not able to leave the house.
Hospitals didn't get overrun because we went into lockdown. Heading into the flu season and opening up society completely is a disaster waiting to happen for the NHS. If things are pushed too far, we'll end up with another 3 months not able to leave the house.
Cases are currently at about 1/3 of what they were at its peak yet hospitals admissions are way down and deaths are incredibly low. The fact is most of society will be absolutely fine with the virus and efforts need to be made to allow that part of society to open up whilst protecting the vulnerable. It’s really not a difficult concept.
Where are you getting this fantasy of hospitals being overrun from? They weren’t overrun at its peak and they aren’t rising now, despite the fact cases are rising. Medical professionals urged people back into hospitals for routine illness because the media terrified people into thinking the virus was far more deadly than it is.
I mean they were very close to being overrun in Spring and you've now got tons of doctors wanting to quit because of how overworked they've felt over the last 6 months (https://www.theguardian.com/so.....handling-of-pandemic). Service levels and waiting times are now improving since hospitals did actually have to cancel loads of scheduled operations and appointments.
You're banging on about the media scaring people into avoiding hospitals in your tin-foil hat, but you're actually confusing reduced A&E admissions (which were as a result of people staying away from hospitals because they didn't want to contract covid) with cancellations of routine and scheduled appointments which were caused by hospitals having to massively shift focus onto treating covid patients in the spring to the detriment of other types of treatment. Here's a quote from the medical director of NHS England, who I imagine has far more expertise on this subject than whoever you're getting your news from:
“Pleasingly, cancer radiotherapy treatments are now fully back to their pre-Covid levels. The success of these service expansions depends on keeping Covid under control, so continued public action on hands-face-space, an effective test-and-trace service, and rapid action to control local outbreaks all continue to be vital.”
Yes, hospitalisations and death rates are now lower, and this is partially due to the increase in cases at present being driven by younger people who are less likely to die or need hospital treatment, but they're still contagious. The more young people that have the disease, the more old people will contract it from them, and the more badly affected hospitals will be as those older people end up needing treatment. There's a timelag to all of this, give it a few weeks and we likely will see higher rates of hospitalisations and deaths again (but possibly not quite at Spring levels because medical understanding of the virus has improved since then and doctors now understand how to treat it better).
None of this means it's not still a very dangerous and contagious disease that can really negatively impact even young & fit people. You keep saying how most of society will be absolutely fine with the virus - that isn't true. I'm a 32 year old who runs 10-15 miles a week. I don't want to get covid because everything I've heard from people who have had it makes it sound completely excrement and there's tons of evidence it has a nasty impact on your long term health and physical condition.
Where are you getting this fantasy of hospitals being overrun from? They weren’t overrun at its peak and they aren’t rising now, despite the fact cases are rising. Medical professionals urged people back into hospitals for routine illness because the media terrified people into thinking the virus was far more deadly than it is.
There was a very interesting documentary on the BBC over 2 or 3 nights that showed you how overrun hospitals were, I imagine it’d still on iPlayer. That any my wife works in Covid wards. And the fact that elderly patients were forced into care homes just to clear beds, which lead to thousands of unnecessary deaths of their residents. Up to 20% of Covid cases were contracted whilst in hospital, so not sure who these medical professionals are that we’re “urging people back into hospital for routine illness” when a lot of these services were cancelled and the govt guidance was to avoid hospitals unless you had Covid. Still, maybe that’s all a fantasy as you have suggested...
Quoted Text
You say it’s ‘all well and good talking about low mortality rates’ but that’s an absolutely crucial point is it not? The damage this fear mongering has done is going to have far wider reaching impact than the virus ever will.
The crucial point is to view figures in context, which you appear to struggle with.
The rise in cases might be cases in their early stage. In two or three weeks we might see a steep rise is hospitalisations. This all just a month after being encouraged to cram into pubs and restaurants to eat cheap by the Chancellor and people still want more. 🤪
So here's the problem, in as simple terms as I can make it.
We're facing an increase in the number of people with the virus. Very simply, the more people that have the virus, the more people will suffer severe symptoms. Granted, there is a large proportion who it will probably pass through unnoticed, but still the pressure on our health system is going to be increased as the virus interacts with more people.
As per the link, the vast majority of GP Practices aren't able to cope currently, never mind when a second wave hits. It was bad enough trying to get an appointment anyway but you try now. So what happens when people don't get an appointment at their GP Practice? One of three things: 1) They'll get frustrated and annoyed, their pain or ailment will go away naturally and all is well. 2) They'll not know what to do, the route cause of their problem won't be identified and as a result it's far more difficult to treat later on 3) they'll rock up at A&E.
So more poorly people in the system, not able to get their treatment from a GP - those who will now go and sit in A&E are a further strain on an already stretched system.
Ok, let's look at the hospital then. Hospitals were split at the height of the initial wave to make sure that Covid patients were kept away from non-Covid patients. This is common practice and is not to dissimilar to what happens when there's any outbreak, such as D&V, in any health or social care setting. You contain the virus to prevent it spreading. Sectioning off areas of the hospitals came at the cost of not urgent elective and non-elective procedures. For some people that would be a case that their hip operation hasn't bee done, on the face of it no biggy (actually it is, but this is a different argument for a different day but you'll have to work with me when I say that long term this is big problem and causes many, many complications down the line). But for a lot of people that could be a cancer treatment, it could be the identification of a growth that could have been cut out before causing damage. These services that are designed to nip issues in the bud as early as possible had the brakes put on them.
That creates a perfect storm:
1) Patients not getting minor treatments at their GP Practice - poorly and untreated people in the wider population plus increased pressure on A&E Depts. 2) Lack of staff, equipment and resource to deal with a significant outbreak 3) Long term effects of cancelling routine procedures to cope with the above issues. 4) A workforce that has been flogged to death and is now at breaking point, to the actual point where there are concerns that staff will commit suicide!
Anything that's done to deal with Covid is merely moving the hump in the carpet. We're hoping to push issues away that simply won't go away. What happens if we don't find a vaccine for 3 years? 5 years? 10 years? How the hell are we going to cope when we can't cope now. Are we going to cancel all cancer treatments for that long? Imagine the sheer impact from a health structure perspective. More importantly, add the human factor into that.
You might be fine with the virus. The virus may have well passed through you with absolutely no consequence at all. But in the perfect storm scenario above, I would be willing to bet a fair amount of money that either you or someone you love gets caught up in it.
Being reported on BBC that the R number has gone back above 1, so I am expecting measures to be tightened if anything. The R number will have to be brought back below 1 sharpish, or I can see another lockdown looming. Football is irrelevant at the moment.
We'll have a vaccine by early next year. Everything I hear about the Oxford one suggests it'll do the job once they've finished the Phase 3 trials (and my source for this is my brother who is actually working on it and listed as one of the authors here - https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31604-4/fulltext)
Several school children and teachers in Grimsby schools appear to have symptoms - they have been told the nearest testing stations that they can attend are in Hull,Lincoln or Sheffield , i.e. none in Grimsby What the Fxs going on - don't we matter - they most likely think we are a small fishing village in Yorkshire.
We'll have a vaccine by early next year. Everything I hear about the Oxford one suggests it'll do the job once they've finished the Phase 3 trials (and my source for this is my brother who is actually working on it and listed as one of the authors here - https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31604-4/fulltext)
Isn't that the one they've suspended because one of the volunteers took ill on the third phase of the trial?
No attempt at ethical or social seduction can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred of the Tory party. So far as I'm concerned they're lower than vermin. Aneurin Bevan.
Isn't that the one they've suspended because one of the volunteers took ill on the third phase of the trial?
It is, but dont listen to the doom mongers of the media..Its a normal thing for vaccine testing and its the 2nd time this particular vaccine has been PAUSED to do a check.
Isn't that the one they've suspended because one of the volunteers took ill on the third phase of the trial?
If you've got a 50,000 person strong vaccine trial running over several months it's not that unlikely one of your volunteers will end up in hospital for some unexplained reason during it. For safety and public confidence it makes complete sense to investigate the circumstances fully before resuming the trial, but it's not exactly a sign the vaccine is unsafe when you've got 49.99k others who've so far taken it without issue.
If you've got a 50,000 person strong vaccine trial running over several months it's not that unlikely one of your volunteers will end up in hospital for some unexplained reason during it. For safety and public confidence it makes complete sense to investigate the circumstances fully before resuming the trial, but it's not exactly a sign the vaccine is unsafe when you've got 49.99k others who've so far taken it without issue.
Problem is public perception though. The general public takes zero interest in clinical trials of new medicines or vaccines so are unaware of the "normal" pitfalls. There's bound to be a significant section of the population who won't take it - or any other vaccine - which has been "rushed out".
'Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all. ~ Alfred Lord Tennyson
Go do your own research . It takes a bit of your time but it's worth it
Well please point me in the right direction as it was never stated that crowds wouldn't return this forthcoming season. Obviously if you've found those government comments please make them available. It would have been useful for people deciding whether to renew.
"holds breath"
“There's nothing wrong with the car except that it's on fire.”- Murray Walker
I can't see crowds returning for a long time. Cases in Grimsby rising rapidly and these are only the ones who have been able to get a test - must be far more because if you have symptoms you still can't get tested so you are not counted in the figures. They say you can order test kits on line but none available. How many really have the virus - nobody will ever know. I know of loads of people self isolating but not included in any figures. I am getting worried again.
I completely agree with that part. But the virus does spread exponentially, if it didn't then there would never have been a problem. It has 100% been worse than flu season, deaths this year are double a bad flu season and that's with locking down the country for 5 months. A vaccine changes everything, as it has with the flu, but we don't have one.
We've been waiting 10 years for a vaccine for hepatitis C. Why does everybody think we'll have a COVID virus soon?
We've been waiting 10 years for a vaccine for hepatitis C. Why does everybody think we'll have a COVID virus soon?
Where did I say I expect a vaccine? Given the short time antibodies seem to be present, it does seem like a vaccine might be difficult, since you might have to have multiple doses every year.
It is a different situation though, hep C hasn't devastated the world in the same way as Covid. There has never been such an effort to produce a vaccine, and progress is likely to be better because it is needed more.
Late April. I’m 29 and it’s the illest I’ve ever felt, was very worried at the time.
Was at times really difficult to just sit and breath normally without pain from coughing. Temperature and the fever was also Ridiculous.
Must admit I felt fatigued for weeks and weeks afterwards.
Regrettably had 3 family friends pass away from this. No underline health conditions and generally fit and well, which is why I have no time for this bullshit of “it’s just flu” from some people.
Covid facts. The average age of people in UK dying from Covid = 77. (Average world life expectancy = 74)
Only 2% of UK deaths are in people under 50. Most deaths were of people who had underlying health conditions.
So of the 40,000 or so deaths so far you personally know 3 fit and healthy people who died? I'm sorry for your loss(es) but you must be the unluckiest man in the UK. Or not quite telling the whole truth.
Anyone parroting the 'it's just like the flu' line hasn't got a clue what they're on about. Here's an article from today on the long term effects experienced by a number of individuals, including young people, infected by the virus - https://www.newstatesman.com/p.....vid-19-last-patients
Very left wing magazine which will try to pick stories that show the Government in a bad light. I apply the same rules when I am listening to Government statements as well - they have handled this appallingly and I don't believe half of what they say either.
Agreed. The flu is horrendous. In words it is like being attacked internally and it runs amok until your body eventually heats up to molten lava levels to kill the bloody thing!
That's how nature works. We have been fighting viruses for millions of years in this exact way. You do realise Covid doesn't want to kill us? It would then also die. It wants us to feel ill, cough and sneeze and spread it around so it can survive.
Very left wing magazine which will try to pick stories that show the Government in a bad light. I apply the same rules when I am listening to Government statements as well - they have handled this appallingly and I don't believe half of what they say either.
Have they? They're not doing much differently to most countries in the world. We were probably a bit slow to react early on, when nobody knew how bad the virus was, but since then we've done the same things that virtually every other country has done.
I can't think of anything that they could have done that people would praise them for. Lock down more and pro business people moan, lock down less and socialists moan. Whatever they do, more people will moan than be happy.
Saw those Swin, the legs anyway. Yes it’s true what you say but I’m just saying that the local situation is different to the National figures that seem to drive the government. Incidentally, this is the first time the individual hospital stats have been published. I asked for these in April and the GT said they had asked already but the Trust refused to release them. Why would it take a FIA request to get some information like that I wonder, why did the Trust not want people to know that Scunthorpe had by far the most infections?
Why would they not want you to know the number of cases is so low? Because they want everyone to panic? Sweden has kept open throughout and they seem to have stabilised. Admittedly Swedish people are generally more intelligent and socially aware than the Brits!
Why would they not want you to know the number of cases is so low? Because they want everyone to panic? Sweden has kept open throughout and they seem to have stabilised. Admittedly Swedish people are generally more intelligent and socially aware than the Brits!
I think it’s hard to draw on comparisons with Sweden, as I understand it, their population density is only 10 % of the UK and that must be a factor I guess?
The problem is that the death rate is so low because most people behaved throughout spring and summer, which meant that the virus didn't spread as badly as feared.
The indications are that in winter the virus will be even more dangerous. Yes, the death rate is low which is a positive. I fully accept the argument between hospital admissions/deaths against the numbers of people testing positive for the virus. I'm actually becoming more and more favourable to a herd immunity argument which is something I never thought I'd hear myself saying.
But if the much talked about second wave comes back and is twice, three, four....times as hard as the first, our health infrastructure will not cope. We don't have enough Doctors, Nurses, Porters, HCA's to cope. We don't have the equipment or estate to cope either. {quote}
The hospitals were busy in April and May and have been virtually empty since. The recent rise in positive tests has not led to a corresponding rise in hospital admissions. I thought the reason we were locking down was to save the NHS. But we have managed to create 1 million extra unemployed people and close down lots of businesses.
Why would they not want you to know the number of cases is so low? Because they want everyone to panic? Sweden has kept open throughout and they seem to have stabilised. Admittedly Swedish people are generally more intelligent and socially aware than the Brits!
Sweden as a country has the benefit of being extremely sparsely populated. England has one of the highest densities of population in the world, double that of even Germany and three or four times greater than France.
Sweden average IQ, 99.. UK average IQ 100.. let's continue the theme of bashing everything that is British shall we? Although I have to agree on the Swedes being more socially aware..
Just out of interest, how many people are you willing to have die so you can sit and watch GTFC for 90 mins once a week?
You do realise that in an 'average' year 10,000 people a week die in the UK?. So in the six months since lockdown 260,000 people would have normally died anyway
So is that...what, one or more dead people so you can watch lower league football once a fortnight? Couldn’t quite make it out from your post. 500 more maybe? 1000 fathers and mothers?
It’s all well and good talking about low mortality rates, but the issue is the fact that those who require hospital treatment require fairly intensive treatment and resources - beds, ventilators, monitoring etc - which we don’t have the capacity for. This is why whole hospitals and entire wards had to be cleared of sick people, and other illnesses like cancer treatment were put on the back burner. “Protect The NHS” and all that - the measures in place are to stop the total collapse of the health service.
Interesting stat on road traffic accidents, though perhaps not relevant unless you can spread car crashes by coughing on people...
We also (with great fanfare and expense) built a 4000 bed hospital at the Excel centre - it had zero patients and was then quietly closed.
Hospitals didn't get overrun because we went into lockdown. Heading into the flu season and opening up society completely is a disaster waiting to happen for the NHS. If things are pushed too far, we'll end up with another 3 months not able to leave the house.
Sweden didn't go into lockdown and their hospitals weren't overrun.
We'll have a vaccine by early next year. Everything I hear about the Oxford one suggests it'll do the job once they've finished the Phase 3 trials (and my source for this is my brother who is actually working on it and listed as one of the authors here - https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31604-4/fulltext)
Let's hope so. We've been trying to get a vaccine for hepatitis C for 10 years without success so who knows for sure.
If you've got a 50,000 person strong vaccine trial running over several months it's not that unlikely one of your volunteers will end up in hospital for some unexplained reason during it. For safety and public confidence it makes complete sense to investigate the circumstances fully before resuming the trial, but it's not exactly a sign the vaccine is unsafe when you've got 49.99k others who've so far taken it without issue.
If you've got 66,000,000 people in a country and 0.06% of them die of a new virus, it does however make sense to spend £350 billion pounds and create 1 million unemployed and fill the papers every day with horror stories?
Where did I say I expect a vaccine? Given the short time antibodies seem to be present, it does seem like a vaccine might be difficult, since you might have to have multiple doses every year.
It is a different situation though, hep C hasn't devastated the world in the same way as Covid. There has never been such an effort to produce a vaccine, and progress is likely to be better because it is needed more.
Apologies for misquoting. I've read a few messages along the lines of 'We ought to stay locked up until there's a vaccine'. I'm just worried the vaccine won't be quite so simple.
Happy to accept you didn't say that and I apologise again.
Have they? They're not doing much differently to most countries in the world. We were probably a bit slow to react early on, when nobody knew how bad the virus was, but since then we've done the same things that virtually every other country has done.
I can't think of anything that they could have done that people would praise them for. Lock down more and pro business people moan, lock down less and socialists moan. Whatever they do, more people will moan than be happy.
I certainly don't blame the Government for reacting the way they did when we saw what was happening in Italy at the start of this. I can't say I'm very impressed with the Track and Trace system or the phone app they tried to introduce. My IT mate told me it would never work as Apple and Google have their software working the way they want. For some reason we believed Serco government contractors had better IT staff than Apple and Google. Bizarre. .
Have they? They're not doing much differently to most countries in the world. We were probably a bit slow to react early on, when nobody knew how bad the virus was, but since then we've done the same things that virtually every other country has done.
I can't think of anything that they could have done that people would praise them for. Lock down more and pro business people moan, lock down less and socialists moan. Whatever they do, more people will moan than be happy.
Probably because their health service wasn't as underfunded and unprepared as ours
Possibly so. I know few people who work in the NHS and I always say that we spend £130 billion a year and employ 1.5 million people (the largest employers in Europe)
How much money and how many staff will make them happy?
Head of Test and Trace and the new health authority, also ex Talk Talk, on The Jockey Club board and a big mate of Hancock. Also married to some Tory MP who wants to privatise the NHS.
Dido Harding has experience of running a mass communications and technology company. That is ideal experience......oh hang on a minute, that company was TalkTalk and they got a record fine for a massive data breach.
You could not make it up could you.
Through the door there came familiar laughter, I saw your face and heard you call my name. Oh my friend we're older but no wiser, For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
I think it’s hard to draw on comparisons with Sweden, as I understand it, their population density is only 10 % of the UK and that must be a factor I guess?
Indeed. When they got the advice on social distancing by 2metres the Swedes were up in arms. 'There's no way I'm going to stand that close to someone.'
Through the door there came familiar laughter, I saw your face and heard you call my name. Oh my friend we're older but no wiser, For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
And how far into the pits are you willing to see the world go for a virus that isn’t deadly for almost all of the people it comes into contact with?
Judging by your annoyance at how ‘low paid Nandos workers’ (your words, not mine) are back in work, I’d presume the answer to that is pretty far.
Striking a balance is absolutely key to getting back to normal. Those denying it’s a problem need to accept that it is and those like yourself, who seemingly want to stay indoors forever also need a reality check. You’re at risk every single day of your life, you’re far more likely to die in an RTA on the way to the match than you are to die of the virus at it, are you going to stop going when the virus has gone?
The reason the death rate isn't higher is because we have had lockdown and taken precautions to prevent it spreading. Your argument is a bit like saying "we don't have many deaths from gunfire in this country, so let's liberalise our gun laws" [and end up like the US].
Through the door there came familiar laughter, I saw your face and heard you call my name. Oh my friend we're older but no wiser, For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
Let's hope so. We've been trying to get a vaccine for hepatitis C for 10 years without success so who knows for sure.
Coronvirus is the same family as the common cold and we have been years trying to develop a vaccine for that.
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day,teach a man to fish and you give him an excuse for him to escape from the wife and kids for the weekend and drink lots of beer.
Back on The Fishy for the first time in, ooh, months. Too much other stuff to deal with during the lockdown and aftermath to spend time on here.
I received my ST pack through the post from the club the other week, opened it, glanced at it briefly and then shoved it in the drawer where it remains untouched. As much as I'd like an excuse to get out of the house to see some games every couple of weeks, I can't see it being likely for a while yet and can't justify the expense when chances of me watching games even streaming are slim. Will be the first time I've not had a season ticket for thirty-something years.
As to how I see the season progressing, it depends on how things go as regards hospital admissions in the coming 'second wave'. Despite the recent and escalating increases in positive tests, we're obviously a long way below the actual undiagnosed/uncounted numbers which were occurring when the lockdown was imposed in March so we're not in an immediately dire situation and I don't think we're unlikely to get back to the same place again for several reasons.
Most people are now taking the virus seriously (which is sensible, given that an uncertain proportion of those infected even mildly seem to suffer heart damage while ill). Added to this, the likelihood seems to be that those already infected have some immunity to the disease (as is the case with the original SARS virus) which is why there have been relatively few discoveries of reinfection. The problem is that we don't know yet if people who have already had the disease often catch it again but usually remain asymptomatic. If so, they may still be able to infect others so sensible to keep wearing the masks in shops and indoor public areas. The widespread use of masks seems likely to reduce severity of infection even if they don't stop you catching it. With all these factors in place and people acting responsibly, it will hopefully be possible to keep infections to a low enough level that society can continue to function, albeit in the current 'new normal' with limited social interaction and a massive increase in unemployment which will kick in when furlough ends. That would hopefully give time for the absolutely mind-boggling amount of scientific research into the virus to bear some fruit in both prevention and treatment.
The news is always breathlessly talking about the vaccines in development (over 130 of them I believe!), but the virus is so new and there is so much to learn about it, that we shouldn't necessarily expect any of them to provide the sterilising immunity which we are used to from all the vaccines kids get today. One of the issues is that those involved in the vaccine trials will always be younger and healthier than those at most risk from the virus but there is obviously no way to directly test efficacy in higher risk groups. From what I've read, which is a lot (and probably too much), it is quite likely that the earliest vaccines will just reduce the severity of symptoms in the event of infection, but will only give weaker protection to the elderly who are most at risk. Still enough to make them worthwhile, but we're not likely to see a silver bullet which will suddenly make life go back to normal within a few months. Knowing just how infectious people with asymptomatic infections are likely to be would be helpful, but there isn't any evidence about this as yet and it's not something which can easily be discovered.
I personally think we're likely to see advances in treaments before we see effective vaccines. Dexamethasone can help a proportion of those most seriously ill but nowhere near all of them. Wouldn't surprise me if one or two other currently available drugs could also help further in severe cases which would be a very good discovery. A few companies have trials of monoclonal antibodies taking place as well - they've screened the thousands of antibodies naturally generated against Covid-19 by the immune system, selected a couple of of the strongest and most stable which attack different areas of the virus (to reduce the chance of mutations nullifying their effect) and then mass produce them to be given together as a treatment. If these were to work, it would be something you could give to somebody who was diagnosed as infected to hopefully clear the virus quickly.
My hope is that the club will ultimately be able to allow the limited numbers and spacing as originally planned before the new 'rule of 6' stuff. If some of the vaccines/treatments do have some helpful effect then we could hopefully reduce restrictions later in the season. Wouldn't surprise me if those who are elderly or with other risk factors are advised to give it a miss for now even with additional treatments, however. I'm sort of hoping that I'll be able to see one or two games during the latter stages of the season.
Incidentally, I hope everyone is taking a Vitamin D supplement, especially if you don't get out into the sunshine too much. Take via fish oils if you can as the body can use them better than Vit D from plants. The correlation between low Vitamin D levels and fatality rates is surely too high for it to be a coincidence so worth a punt to keep your levels up, especially when you consider so many people are Vit D deficient in the first place. Extra Vitamin D will be good for your overall health, even if it was to turn out that there wasn't actually any reduction in risk of severe Covid-19 infection.
Incidentally, I hope everyone is taking a Vitamin D supplement, especially if you don't get out into the sunshine too much. Take via fish oils if you can as the body can use them better than Vit D from plants. The correlation between low Vitamin D levels and fatality rates is surely too high for it to be a coincidence so worth a punt to keep your levels up, especially when you consider so many people are Vit D deficient in the first place. Extra Vitamin D will be good for your overall health, even if it was to turn out that there wasn't actually any reduction in risk of severe Covid-19 infection.
I have taken Vit D for years so thanks for saying that, there'll be none frigging left when I go for some.
Not sure why this has been moved. My post was about fans returning. Football related
Cos the moderation on this forum is completely facile. As soon as a thread veers onto a topic which combines football and politics (such as this), they have a massive meltdown about it and punt the discussion over to the lesser read subforum. It's pathetic, especially considering we're still in the dark over the arrangements for fans returning to blundell park. Just because the decision on fans returning is a political (or "non-football") one, it's still a massively important discussion worthy of the main football forum.
Cos the moderation on this forum is completely facile. As soon as a thread veers onto a topic which combines football and politics (such as this), they have a massive meltdown about it and punt the discussion over to the lesser read subforum. It's pathetic, especially considering we're still in the dark over the arrangements for fans returning to blundell park. Just because the decision on fans returning is a political (or "non-football") one, it's still a massively important discussion worthy of the main football forum.
I'm loathe to criticise the administration who do a grand job of managing this board in sometimes trying circumstances but find myself in total agreement with you here. It's hard to imagine a more important/relevant football related subject at the moment.
The aim of argument or discussion should not be victory but progress.
I think we understand the political implications surrounding the decision to allow football fans to return to stadiums but in truth it is a a football decisions.
Whilst political opinion can sway the thinking of some, football, especially at the level in which GTFC fond themselves is very much reliant on fans, therefore I believe it is a pertinent discussion about football.
One could argue that discussions surrounding the ineptitude of our board are somewhat political...will they be moved on the future?
I understand that some folk on here have clearly shown their true colours so to speak and are happy to follow or support political ideologies that should be reserved only for the bin but nevertheless, the political discussion in this thread links wholeheartedly to the main topic, football.
Moving this discussion only seeks to minimise the potential conflicting political opinions and bury it within, as said, a lesser visited part of the fishy...
'the poor and the needy are selfish and greedy'...well done Mozza
I don’t disagree that this started as football related and even partially agree with those points that reason it should remain so. However, the ‘feel’ of the thread to me suggests it’s morphed into something different entirely. This is a common occurrence with threads on forums and you could argue it’s the ‘nature of the beast’.
Whatever the rights and wrongs of it, it’s not like it’s been deleted or the right to debate removed (it’s simply been moved) if people are that passionate about the subject, the fact it’s moved a couple of clicks away (A modern day problem if ever there is one) won’t matter one iota.
Personally speaking if the relocation acts as a filter I’m not too unhappy about it considering some of the posts on there.
“I know writers who use subtext and they’re all cowards.” –Garth Marenghi
This is not an official forum of Grimsby Town Football Club, the opinions expressed are those of the individual authors. If you see an offensive post then click "Report" on the relevant post. Posts will be deleted at the discretion of the moderators whose decision is final. Posts should abide by the Forum Rules. IP addresses of contributors together with dates and times of access are stored. The opinions and viewpoints expressed by contributors to The Fishy are their own and not necessarily those of The Fishy. The Fishy makes no claims that information dispersed through this forum is accurate or reliable. Also The Fishy cannot be held liable for any statements made by contributors of The Fishy.
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