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lew chaterleys lover
December 1, 2019, 12:01pm
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Quoted from mariner91
Oh so anti-semitism is fine if it was a while back then? And it’s not a big issue if you achieved something else in your life whilst being a horrible racist? Hypocrite.


You asked me to comment on it which I did.

I merely pointed out the facts that it was a very long time ago,when we are discussing the current racism in the Labour party, and the statue was unveiled because she was our first female MP.

I made no inference whatsoever of the interpretation you have put on it.

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lew chaterleys lover
December 1, 2019, 12:07pm
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Quoted from Chrisblor
You Johnson lovers seen this website? (created by Conservative leaning journalist Peter Oborne before you start whining about it being some left wing stitch up) - https://boris-johnson-lies.com/

You're being taken for a ride by a self interested posh boy who wouldn't give the tiniest excrement about you. Don't fall for it.


Its a good job for you we can't trawl through endless hours of Corbyn footage through the years.Corbyn went to prep school, and was brought up in Yew Tree manor house, and is sometimes called the poshest man in politics. A real man of the people.
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mariner91
December 1, 2019, 12:22pm
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You asked me to comment on it which I did.

I merely pointed out the facts that it was a very long time ago,when we are discussing the current racism in the Labour party, and the statue was unveiled because she was our first female MP.

I made no inference whatsoever of the interpretation you have put on it.



And, of course, had it been Jeremy Corbyn unveiling the statue of someone who declared the nazis were the ‘solution’ to the ‘worldwide problem with Judaism’ you wouldn’t have passed comment on it or used it as a stick to beat him with.

Happy to use supposed racism in a party or from an individual as an issue when it suits your narrative and only then. Conveniently forgetting the rampant Islamophobia in the Conservative party, the Windrush scandal, the ‘hostile environment’, their support for Viktor Orbán who is an actual anti-Semite and numerous deplorable comments by Johnson himself. Plus many others. Either racism is a big issue for you in which case you’ll speak out against the perpetrators whichever side of the political spectrum they sit on. Or it isn’t and it’s lazy, unfounded rhetoric you use because you’re too stupid and lazy to find reasons to denigrate Labour other than what the populist, right wing press tell you. You’re beyond contempt.


Looking forward to a brighter future now Fenty has gone.
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lew chaterleys lover
December 1, 2019, 12:29pm
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Quoted from mariner91


And, of course, had it been Jeremy Corbyn unveiling the statue of someone who declared the nazis were the ‘solution’ to the ‘worldwide problem with Judaism’ you wouldn’t have passed comment on it or used it as a stick to beat him with.

Happy to use supposed racism in a party or from an individual as an issue when it suits your narrative and only then. Conveniently forgetting the rampant Islamophobia in the Conservative party, the Windrush scandal, the ‘hostile environment’, their support for Viktor Orbán who is an actual anti-Semite and numerous deplorable comments by Johnson himself. Plus many others. Either racism is a big issue for you in which case you’ll speak out against the perpetrators whichever side of the political spectrum they sit on. Or it isn’t and it’s lazy, unfounded rhetoric you use because you’re too stupid and lazy to find reasons to denigrate Labour other than what the populist, right wing press tell you. You’re beyond contempt.


I am quite happy to condemn racism from whatever quarter. What on earth gave you the idea I wouldn't?
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barralad
December 1, 2019, 9:16pm
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It is nigh on impossible to have any conversation with any of them as they always, but always revert to Labour is great, the Tories are evil, worse than vermin and have not done anything for anybody, ever.

It is absolutely risible, by any sensible measure to put the Labour party on such a pedestal whilst denigrating the Tories.

Even todays Labour party is riddled with racism, will not respect nor would implement the result of a democratic national vote when they promised to respect the result, and cannot seem to understand why lots of leave voting seats in the north and midlands are in danger of going blue.

They no longer represent the normal working man and woman of this country, seemingly preferring the Islington social set wringing their hands at every percieved injustice on the planet and see no bounds to immigration which is making life difficult for some.

They have a hopeless leader, and an even worse front bench. The only time since the early 70's they had any electoral success was when Blair created "new" Labour and made them look more like the Conservative party.

Yes I am right wing in my views, but I can see mistakes on all sides, and never take anything any politician says on face value, and like all sides to be given a fair hearing; some of these Labour supporting posters are beyond the pale with their cult like devotion.


This stance on Brexit interests me greatly.

The 2017 G.E. was notable for BOTH main parties saying they would uphold the result of the Referendum. The Labour manifesto talked about about ensuring that any deal did not compromise working conditions and wouldn't make people worse off. As a non-Tory voter I'm not privy (and cannot be bothered to look) at what THEY said they would do although it surely had to say that they would legislate to leave the E.U. May had put all of her eggs in the dubious basket of trying to get a comfortable majority in the 2017 election. She knew she needed it because she couldn't control the hard right of her party for whom anything other than a clean break wasn't going to be enough.  What she didn't reckon with was her innate inability to campaign to achieve that aim. It is well recorded that at the start of the 2017 campaign the Tories had a 20% lead...what could possibly go wrong? It took until late 2018 for the Tories to get their acts together and produce "something" that could at least be debated. The deal negotiated by May was put to parliament and was soundly rejected. Since that very moment Labour have been accused of stopping Brexit. Even in 2018 it wouldn't have been possible for that deal to fail had May convinced her own party to back the deal. Simple mathematics suggests that having paid the DUP vast sums of money for their support their Brexit votes plus those of the party in government would have been enough to get her deal over the line. I actually had someone say to me that Labour should have backed May's deal-a deal that over 100 of her own M.P.s elected in 2017 on the platform of leaving the E.U. with a deal-voted against. It really does beg the question that why should Labour support a deal that many on the Government benches were against. I actually "get" that people are p1ssed off with Labour's stance but those same people find no criticism of the very Tories who had far more control over the outcome of the debate. Shows how utterly broken the country's political system is.


The aim of argument or discussion should not be victory but progress.

Joseph Joubert.
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chaos33
December 1, 2019, 11:16pm
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It’s a great post Ian and absolutely correct.


"You should do what you love while you can"
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lew chaterleys lover
December 2, 2019, 11:59am
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Quoted from barralad


This stance on Brexit interests me greatly.

The 2017 G.E. was notable for BOTH main parties saying they would uphold the result of the Referendum. The Labour manifesto talked about about ensuring that any deal did not compromise working conditions and wouldn't make people worse off. As a non-Tory voter I'm not privy (and cannot be bothered to look) at what THEY said they would do although it surely had to say that they would legislate to leave the E.U. May had put all of her eggs in the dubious basket of trying to get a comfortable majority in the 2017 election. She knew she needed it because she couldn't control the hard right of her party for whom anything other than a clean break wasn't going to be enough.  What she didn't reckon with was her innate inability to campaign to achieve that aim. It is well recorded that at the start of the 2017 campaign the Tories had a 20% lead...what could possibly go wrong? It took until late 2018 for the Tories to get their acts together and produce "something" that could at least be debated. The deal negotiated by May was put to parliament and was soundly rejected. Since that very moment Labour have been accused of stopping Brexit. Even in 2018 it wouldn't have been possible for that deal to fail had May convinced her own party to back the deal. Simple mathematics suggests that having paid the DUP vast sums of money for their support their Brexit votes plus those of the party in government would have been enough to get her deal over the line. I actually had someone say to me that Labour should have backed May's deal-a deal that over 100 of her own M.P.s elected in 2017 on the platform of leaving the E.U. with a deal-voted against. It really does beg the question that why should Labour support a deal that many on the Government benches were against. I actually "get" that people are p1ssed off with Labour's stance but those same people find no criticism of the very Tories who had far more control over the outcome of the debate. Shows how utterly broken the country's political system is.


Thank you for your reply, which was a pleasant change from the usual barage of insults hurtling the way of anybody with more of a right wing outlook.

Regarding your substantive point, I am disappointed that more MP's of all parties did not honour their manifesto pledges of leaving the EU. It is certainly true that the Conservative party had a lot of MP's that campaigned for remain, voted for remain and opposed leaving the EU whilst in Parliament, contrary to the manifesto pledge and the referendum result.

On the other side of the coin, a lot of Conservative leave MP's did not vote for Mays deal because it was BRINO

Where we differ more is that the labour party has never been (despite their manfesto pledge) keen to leave. Their version of leaving is not really leaving at all, and if they get their way on a second referendum the choice would be remain versus just about remain.

The Conservative party have made a mess of everything Brexit related, once they put Mrs May in charge, no one can dispute that.

However the people do now have a choice at this election. Vote for a Conservative majority which will ensure we leave on the 31st January and then get a trading arrangement agreed, or vote Labour which will give us a second referendum with a choice of remain and er, remain.
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Chrisblor
December 2, 2019, 10:11pm

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Its a good job for you we can't trawl through endless hours of Corbyn footage through the years.Corbyn went to prep school, and was brought up in Yew Tree manor house, and is sometimes called the poshest man in politics. A real man of the people.


What would your thoughts be if a prime ministerial candidate in this election had suggested they'd been censored by the New York Times because it was 'a Jewish owned paper' and later went on to claim we should 'Give Iran the bomb', just out of interest?


gary jones
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lew chaterleys lover
December 2, 2019, 10:47pm
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Quoted from Chrisblor


What would your thoughts be if a prime ministerial candidate in this election had suggested they'd been censored by the New York Times because it was 'a Jewish owned paper' and later went on to claim we should 'Give Iran the bomb', just out of interest?


Oh look, a squirrel.  
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grimsby pete
December 2, 2019, 11:22pm

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What Labour say they will do in government and what they actually do are two different things.

If they kept all the promises they would stay in government would they not ?I

Corbyn coming out with more freebies every day a third off rail fares and free transport for under 16.

If I believed him I would vote for him but like thousands of others I cant.


                             Over 36 years living in Suffolk but always a mariner.
                             68 Years following the Town

                              Life member of Trust

                               First game   April 1955
                               
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