What can we do?

Every week in the media there are accounts of horrible racist abuse. In a week we’ve seen Marcus Rashford go public, former icon Peter Beardsley has been disgraced, Hartlepool and Dover nearly abandoned their game due to a significant incident. Blundell Park has not seen this for a while but together with the Club, we need to keep this high on the agenda and promote equality and diversity. Clear to see by the club yesterday with the dragons at half-time and other initiatives in recent months.

I think the racism we are seeing in football today is a result of those at the top attempting to manage the country. Those that govern or want to govern have not been held to account for racist comments disguised as vitriolic bullying aka nationalism. And they have the nerve to make out football supporters are the problem.

On the lunchtime football program yesterday, there were 2 really pleasant young Chelsea players, answering the honesty questions. They were obviously great mates and they bounced humour off each other. One was black and with racism being in the forefront of sport at the moment, my thought went immediately to how could anybody in their right mind, racially abuse a decent boy like that?

Don't equate Nationalism with racism , because I love my country doesn't mean I am a racist?

Quoted from 28195

Every week in the media there are accounts of horrible racist abuse. In a week we’ve seen Marcus Rashford go public, former icon Peter Beardsley has been disgraced, Hartlepool and Dover nearly abandoned their game due to a significant incident. Blundell Park has not seen this for a while but together with the Club, we need to keep this high on the agenda and promote equality and diversity. Clear to see by the club yesterday with the dragons at half-time and other initiatives in recent months.

I think the racism we are seeing in football today is a result of those at the top attempting to manage the country. Those that govern or want to govern have not been held to account for racist comments disguised as vitriolic bullying aka nationalism. And they have the nerve to make out football supporters are the problem.

I think you were posting that to make a non existent political point.

Quoted from hheh2

Don't equate Nationalism with racism , because I love my country doesn't mean I am a racist?

I think you are referring to patriotism, nationalism is at the detriment of others. Patriotism is the support and devotion to ones country.

Quoted from 28195

I think you are referring to patriotism, nationalism is at the detriment of others. Patriotism is the support and devotion to ones country.

Take the left wing excrement to non footy 👍🏿

Quoted from 28195

I think you are referring to patriotism, nationalism is at the detriment of others. Patriotism is the support and devotion to ones country.

I think you are referring to tribalism and that this thread should zoom off into non-footy.

All this diversity and inclusion is boring the bottom off me if I'm honest. On the TV and radio we have men being replaced by women. If it's a black woman, even better. Talksport and Sky employ illiterate chav Clinton Morrison at the expense of articulate proper football people. Alan Brazil is surely on his last legs at Talksport.

It's all balderdash, yes racism is wrong but I don't want to hear about it all day long, every day and that's what I'm getting as a white van driver at work. My mate was shown a straight red card last Sunday for calling someone a homosexual! Christ on a bike, what a load of shite.

To be fair I have not heard any racist remarks at B.P. in a long time. The only thing I did hear yesterday was their manager giving the plastic side pannel on the dug  out a massive thump in anger at the end. Not sure but I there was a massive crack in the perspex and the steward looked like he was reporting it.

Its very simple if a player reports reacila abuse, thats team next home game is played behind closed doors, its unfortunate for the other fans but it might start forcing people in the crowd to start reporting these idiots when they hear them if it means they won't get to see their club play

Quoted from sonofmadeleymariner

Its very simple if a player reports reacila abuse, thats team next home game is played behind closed doors, its unfortunate for the other fans but it might start forcing people in the crowd to start reporting these idiots when they hear them if it means they won't get to see their club play

Couldn’t agree more, similar approach to use of flares has worked at Blundell Park.

Quoted from fishboyUTM

All this diversity and inclusion is boring the bottom off me if I'm honest. On the TV and radio we have men being replaced by women. If it's a black woman, even better. Talksport and Sky employ illiterate chav Clinton Morrison at the expense of articulate proper football people. Alan Brazil is surely on his last legs at Talksport.

It's all balderdash, yes racism is wrong but I don't want to hear about it all day long, every day and that's what I'm getting as a white van driver at work. My mate was shown a straight red card last Sunday for calling someone a homosexual! Christ on a bike, what a load of shite.

Get with the times - you can’t say white van driver any more. It’s ‘van driver’ now.

I have to say it’s been years since I’ve heard anything racist at BP, I think in general our fans are a credit. We’re made out to be some backward little town but actually I think the people of the area are nearly all very decent people.

As for this inclusion nonsense, I do despair at exactly how PC the BBC is. I do think employing Alex Scott as a pundit is ridiculous as she’s never played men’s football, just as it’s daft having someone like Dion Dublin working on the women’s World Cup.

Alex Scott is on Strictly at the minute, and there was a segment where she was at The Emirates and she declared it was her “home”. As far as I know, that stadium is the home to the men’s team and the women don’t play there at all.

It just seems that the men’s game gets criticised at every turn just to improve the profile of the women’s game, and I think the BBC do this as they know they’ll never be able to afford a live Premier League deal.

Quoted from fishboyUTM

All this diversity and inclusion is boring the bottom off me if I'm honest. On the TV and radio we have men being replaced by women. If it's a black woman, even better. Talksport and Sky employ illiterate chav Clinton Morrison at the expense of articulate proper football people. Alan Brazil is surely on his last legs at Talksport.

It's all balderdash, yes racism is wrong but I don't want to hear about it all day long, every day and that's what I'm getting as a white van driver at work. My mate was shown a straight red card last Sunday for calling someone a homosexual! Christ on a bike, what a load of shite.

Can you not see how you’ve undermined your own argument with that last sentence?
Fancy not being able to ‘call’ someone a ‘fagg0t’ (your original word) without some form of challenge!! I mean it’s political correctness gone mad. 🤐🤣

Quoted from fishboyUTM

Alan Brazil is surely on his last legs at Talksport.

.

I think he might be on his last legs full stop judging by the fact his face is generally a beetroot colour these days.

Plenty of people on here saying they have heard nothing at BP for years/ages. Unfortunately, it does happen at BP or within Grimsby supporter ranks. I heard two last season - one at Newport away and one at Yeovil Town away. There was also incident at BP.

The bottom line is the sooner the people travelling to games with these idiots call their mates out on it, the sooner it will go away. Until that happens it won't go away.

It would also help if football clubs saying over the tannoy before games saying "racism has no place in football" replaced that with "racism has no place in society."

And to the bloke complaining about his mate getting sent off for using homophobic abuse towards another player. It's 2019 mate, get with the times.

Quoted from mariner91

I think he might be on his last legs full stop judging by the fact his face is generally a beetroot colour these days.

So, is he a white person or a 'person of colour'?

Quoted from Paris Mariner

And to the bloke complaining about his mate getting sent off for using homophobic abuse towards another player. It's 2019 mate, get with the times.

Its the fact that the term 'homosexual' is now regarded as homophobic instead of a really nice meat ball in gravy that's flipping stupid. If that's a sign of the times whatever next?

Quoted from mariner91

I think he might be on his last legs full stop judging by the fact his face is generally a beetroot colour these days.

I’m a big fan of Alan Brazil, and it will be a sad day whenever he does bite the dust, but he makes absolutely no attempt to change his ways and lives life like every day could be his last. It can either be admired, or despaired at!

You would think that when Mike Porky Parry had his heart attack it would have made AB take note, but it didn’t one bit!

Some lefty nonsense that nationalism, wanting your country to be sovereign is racist. When did this suddenly become the case that love of your country is a disgusting act? But Scottish nationalism fine though I guess, just not British and definitely not English. Keep getting spoon-fed your George Soros inspired no borders spiel.

With the comments about the top government I guess you're also alluding to Brexit causing more incidences of racism, also nonsense, unless you listen to the EU funded Biased Broadcasting Corporation with its metropolitan staff force of course.

Things are getting better all the time, not perfect -I think it'll be a gradual process and people should stay vigilant and point out any isolated incidents should they happen at games.

I've heard plenty of racist remarks at Town games over the years, I think we were once pretty backward, maybe that was just because in our isolated little back water there weren't many coloured faces about or immigrants. But we seem to be getting with the times.

I remember when a was a paperboy the newsagent pointing out us on front of national paper with Les Ferdinand claiming BP was the most racist ground he ever played at and that it brought shame on us. Sure enough when I attended shortly after that time there was plenty of monkey noises whenever an opposition black player had the ball etc. But over time it's faded away.

Back then we wouldn't even sign black players but coming to the present day I do believe there is a kind of covert racism still around the stands in the form of a lack of patience for certain players of a darker skin tone. Especially if they genetically blessed with brutish strength and athletiscm (bigger muscles etc) to the level us indigenous Caucasians would struggle to easily achieve.

Examples would be The Shop, even Omar and now Moses Ogbu. It's like some are itching for them to fail, super quick on the trigger to critisce with a short temper over. Just dying for the opportunity to scream out they useless or lambast and my gut tells me this is at least in part because they 'big and black' (if I can say that just to illustrate. Now I'm not saying these kind of players should be immune from critiscm because if you do you racist, it's just a bit of a sense I get.

As for the women and people of colour being shoehorned into positions, I'm all for equality but it's daft when someone far better at the role is replaced just because they not female or of colour. That's not true equality then is it as really its discriminating against a human being for being male, middle aged and white.

Quoted from Ipswin

So, is he a white person or a 'person of colour'?

Is 'white' not racist as its a colour too, shouldn't it be a 'person of no colour' 🤔😅

The BBC is wholly funded by the licence payer. No EU funding.

As far as nationalism goes, it’s not love of your country. That’s patriotism. Nationalism means you set your nation above others. It aims to divide people into nice neat little boxes. It causes trouble because there are always areas where the population is mixed. It caused most of the major wars or was a big factor in it from the late 19th century to the mid20th. Don’t care whether it’s Scottish, English, Russian, German, it sucks.

Quoted from Paris Mariner

Plenty of people on here saying they have heard nothing at BP for years/ages. Unfortunately, it does happen at BP or within Grimsby supporter ranks. I heard two last season - one at Newport away and one at Yeovil Town away. There was also incident at BP.

The bottom line is the sooner the people travelling to games with these idiots call their mates out on it, the sooner it will go away. Until that happens it won't go away.

It would also help if football clubs saying over the tannoy before games saying "racism has no place in football" replaced that with "racism has no place in society."

And to the bloke complaining about his mate getting sent off for using homophobic abuse towards another player. It's 2019 mate, get with the times.

I would back my common sense against "getting with the times" any day of the week.

Nobody I know is overtly racist or homophobic, but the law of averages tells you some people, including footy fans will be. Once caught, they get punished.

As a more general point, we are seeing increasing cases of the high priests of PC correctness coming down to earth with a very large bump.

Harry and Meghan (don't fly to save the planet, but we will take private jets whenever we like thank you very much); Justin Trudeau (racism  is abhorrent in all its forms, but I can black up at a party) and MP's (I will honour the result but will do everything in my power to thwart it) is eroding trust.

Human beings have failings; they always will have failings and the important thing to me is to acknowledge the improvements we have made over centuries/decades and keep everything in proportion. The crusade that some people are on to make the world perfect is never going to work.

“With the comments about the top government I guess you're also alluding to Brexit causing more incidences of racism, also nonsense, unless you listen to the EU funded Biased Broadcasting Corporation with its metropolitan staff force of course.”

My comment was about the current racist problems reported in the news that are football related. The post is nothing to do with Brexit or Politics. Yes, there is an increase, fact. I was making a connection between our government who have made racist comments, fact. With no recourse this abuse becomes normalized.

Guys football games sometime attract the lowest IQs people in the population. That's all it is.

The UK is one of the least racist place on the planet, if you believe the UK is a little racist you have been reading too many newspapers written by dogmatic political journalists playing the gender and race card for clicks and power.

Quoted from Rik e B

Is 'white' not racist as its a colour too, shouldn't it be a 'person of no colour' 🤔😅

Who gives a intercourse? I'm white and don't mind being called so, Brazil's red and sod all the other shades

The younger ones on here would not have seen the Black + White Minstrel Show.

Now that was racist !!!!!!!!!!

Challenge it always. Be brave. Idiots who spout that excrement are not brave or smart enough to respond.

Quoted from grimsby pete

The younger ones on here would not have seen the Black + White Minstrel Show.

Now that was racist !!!!!!!!!!

It wasn't though Pete because in the days of that show no one thought racially in respect of stuff like that.

It was an innocent show and those producing it or performing in it had no racial thoughts whatsoever.

Its like 'Zwaart Piet' the blacked up character who accompanies Sinterklaas in the Netherlands. There has been a huge argument, protests resulting in arrests in the last few years about the character being a racist insult to black people as its a white bloke blacked up. Its a centuries old tradition, the black face having evolved from a soot smeared face which Santas helper got going down chimneys. In many cities Swaart Piet is now banned or just allowed to dirty his face a bit.

Racism is much stronger and deliberately directed than the Black and White Minstrel Show, no one threw bananas or shouted racial abuse at the telly.

Quoted from Ipswin

Who gives a intercourse? I'm white and don't mind being called so, Brazil's red and sod all the other shades

I believe he identifies as maroon rather than red.

Quoted from sonofmadeleymariner

Its very simple if a player reports reacila abuse, thats team next home game is played behind closed doors, its unfortunate for the other fans but it might start forcing people in the crowd to start reporting these idiots when they hear them if it means they won't get to see their club play

I’d prefer it to be investigated and proven before grounds are closed

Quoted from mariner91

I believe he identifies as maroon rather than red.

There you go ! No doubt some PC twit somewhere would argue whether he's maroon or leaning towards purple while the man himself doesn't give a excrement

There's a woman who is on "Good morning Britain" or whatever it's called who one week is shouting about school uniforms,the next week she's giving her opinion as to what kids should have in their packup--then it's racism and then non genders and last week should mothers breast feed. It is these big mouthed nobodies that cause most of the trouble. Soon we wont have a colour or gender we will all be the " silent invisible things "   You are always going to get a certain amount of racism,sexism,or people saying the wrong word but it's not as prevalent as these nobodies would have us believe.

Let’s be honest the ‘Let’s kick out ‘ campaign has morphed into a big charity funded by all the football authorities .
If there was no racism in the game the hangers on and freeloaders that work for it would all be out of a fantastic job.

It’s the same as the RNLI that’s been in the news this week , they’ve been purging lifeboat crew for having non PC opinions mainly to do with the millions they’re sending overseas .
I suspect that there has never been a case of a lifeboat crew turning around and leaving someone to drown because they was the wrong colour or religion .
I also suspect that the people in the higher echelons of the RNLI have never been lifeboat crew , swanning off around the world on public funding expenses is a good number for them .
It’s amazing how so many of these charity bosses are usually failed politicians, Lawyers from the liberal elite political class clearly  taking the urine and imposing their views on the charities .

Surprise, surprise. A load of white privileged males suggesting that political correctness is a greater threat to society than racism.

Vance Warner, another crap player victimised due to the colour of their skin

Bizarrely - I was abused at a 25 year celebration of a local football club (after not appearing there for a number of years but feeling something for the club - therefore turning up) for looking like Peter Beardsley.

Just took it on the chin - but you don't forget. Not that Peter Beardsley is not good looking!  

Gammons out in force on here today I see. Disgusting levels of intolerance.

Quoted from 28195

“With the comments about the top government I guess you're also alluding to Brexit causing more incidences of racism, also nonsense, unless you listen to the EU funded Biased Broadcasting Corporation with its metropolitan staff force of course.”

My comment was about the current racist problems reported in the news that are football related. The post is nothing to do with Brexit or Politics. Yes, there is an increase, fact. I was making a connection between our government who have made racist comments, fact. With no recourse this abuse becomes normalized.

Let’s pretend we don’t have a openly racist prime minister or a right wing media that supports him

Quoted from Vance Warner

Surprise, surprise. A load of white privileged males suggesting that political correctness is a greater threat to society than racism.

White privileged ?
We’re all from Grimsby , we’ve hardly had it on a plate 😂

Quoted from Chrisblor

Gammons out in force on here today I see. Disgusting levels of intolerance.

I object most strongly to this characterisation. I am not a racist. Some of my best friends are white.

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

I object most strongly to this characterisation. I am not a racist. Some of my best friends are white.

That is the best way to deal with this crap - just mock them. The rest of us just get on with our lives the best we can but these people are obsessed.

Quoted from Chrisblor

Gammons out in force on here today I see. Disgusting levels of intolerance.

Nice comment to add to the discussion.

Tosser.

Quoted from arryarryarry

Nice comment to add to the discussion.

Tosser.

Which bit of his comment is wrong?

Quoted from Vance Warner

Surprise, surprise. A load of white privileged males suggesting that political correctness is a greater threat to society than racism.

Racism is abhorrent but as 'threats to society' go, if you delve into the hidden evils behind the shutting down of freedom of speech under the flowery guise of political correctness then yes it probably is greater.

And I'm sorry is absolutely every person of a white background 'privelaged'? I'd call such sweeping generalisations reverse racism, but apparently anything against white people is fair game under the Liberal agenda.

Sounds like millennial snowflakey tosh to me, Grimsby is a deprived area where most people are working class and scraping by, many in poverty or barely above most their lives... But there skin is white so they all privelaged scum who need to shut up. Ridiculous.

Kingston, the Biased Broadcasting Cabal have received bucketloads from the EU, your claim is a nonsense. There was even meant to be a government enquiry - whatever happened to that I don't know, probably brushed under the carpet.

I'm surprised this little fact passed you by as apparently so well informed and we Brexiteers so bloody dumb.

[url]https://edm.parliament.uk/early-day-motion/34956/eu-funding-of-the-bbc[/url]

[url]https://www.google.com/amp/s/blogs.spectator.co.uk/2014/02/the-millions-in-eu-funding-the-bbc-tried-to-hide/amp/[/url]

Sorry to go non-football folks, the Establishment stitch up and cover ups rile me greatly.

Quoted from Rik e B

Racism is abhorrent but as 'threats to society' go, if you delve into the hidden evils behind the shutting down of freedom of speech under the flowery guise of political correctness then yes it probably is greater.

And I'm sorry is absolutely every person of a white background 'privelaged'? I'd call such sweeping generalisations reverse racism, but apparently anything against white people is fair game under the Liberal agenda.

Sounds like millennial snowflakey tosh to me, Grimsby is a deprived area where most people are working class and scraping by, many in poverty or barely above most their lives... But there skin is white so they all privelaged scum who need to shut up. Ridiculous.

Steady on. You’ve made a lot of assumptions there. Definitely not a millennial and don’t really know what a snowflake is. As for telling people to shut up I’d love to know how you got that. We all know Grimsby’s problems but it’s all relative. We live in one of the richest countries in the world (for now) and the fact that the country is so unequal is purely down to the establishment not some made up ‘liberal agenda.’

Quoted from arryarryarry

Nice comment to add to the discussion.

Tosser.

Fine, I'll ignore the fact you've rudely called me a Tosser and break it down to you then. This is a thread full of old intolerant white blokes moaning about issues which in no way materially affect their lives:

Female and black pundits - some are very good and there's tons of awful white male pundits still on TV?

Irritation about not being able to use 'homosexual' in a derogatory manner - use a different word then, there's tons of alternative swear words to choose from. Many people find this phrase offensive owing to the way it has been used historically as a slur to describe gay people

"Political Correctness" - Asking people to avoid referring to others in a discriminatory manner isn't political correctness, it's politeness. Why would you want to continue using phrases which specific minorities find offensive?

Coverage of women's football in the media - Last time I checked the volume of press, TV and radio coverage still massively favours the men's game. Some people like and are interested in women's football. If you aren't then just ignore it instead of moaning like a big baby about it apparently preventing you from somehow consuming the enormous amount of coverage mens football still receives.

All minor issues, and if they're the things that you get most worked up about in life then it suggests to me you are, as I initially suggested, incredibly privileged, incredibly intolerant, and lack an ability to empathise with people who may not have had a similar life to your own.

Quoted from Rik e B

Kingston, the Biased Broadcasting Cabal have received bucketloads from the EU, your claim is a nonsense. There was even meant to be a government enquiry - whatever happened to that I don't know, probably brushed under the carpet.

I'm surprised this little fact passed you by as apparently so well informed and we Brexiteers so bloody dumb.

[url]https://edm.parliament.uk/early-day-motion/34956/eu-funding-of-the-bbc[/url]

[url]https://www.google.com/amp/s/blogs.spectator.co.uk/2014/02/the-millions-in-eu-funding-the-bbc-tried-to-hide/amp/[/url]

Sorry to go non-football folks, the Establishment stitch up and cover ups rile me greatly.

That Spectator (hello, 'kettle calling pot black' alert) article itself admits the money is chicken feed. Absoutely not going to influence any editorial content. Hardly bucketloads in the scheme of things. Or does 0.8% count as 'bucketloads'?

The EDM link doesn't work by the way.

I used to call black people coloured because I thought it sounded more respectful and softer but it looks like I got that wrong.

As for the 'attack on freedom of speech', I don't find political correctness an issue. If I routinely went around calling people 'kunts' in public I'd expect to get walloped and/or done for a breach of the peace because I'd obviously upset someone. Not using terms that gay or people of different races find offensive is just the same. I've been as guilty as anyone in the past, but nudges in the right direction hasn't caused me any harm or discomfort. Some things I've said I've not realised were offensive, but I do now. It's wrong, I shouldn't do it, it's no big deal for me to not be offensive.

It's time people took responsibility for their actions and words and stopped hiding behind 'freedom of speech'.

Personally, I’ve never experienced racist abuse towards myself so I can’t see why racism is a problem. It doesn’t affect me so why do I have to care?

Quoted from Chrisblor

Fine, I'll ignore the fact you've rudely called me a Tosser and break it down to you then. This is a thread full of old intolerant white blokes moaning about issues which in no way materially affect their lives:

Female and black pundits - some are very good and there's tons of awful white male pundits still on TV?

Irritation about not being able to use 'homosexual' in a derogatory manner - use a different word then, there's tons of alternative swear words to choose from. Many people find this phrase offensive owing to the way it has been used historically as a slur to describe gay people

"Political Correctness" - Asking people to avoid referring to others in a discriminatory manner isn't political correctness, it's politeness. Why would you want to continue using phrases which specific minorities find offensive?

Coverage of women's football in the media - Last time I checked the volume of press, TV and radio coverage still massively favours the men's game. Some people like and are interested in women's football. If you aren't then just ignore it instead of moaning like a big baby about it apparently preventing you from somehow consuming the enormous amount of coverage mens football still receives.

All minor issues, and if they're the things that you get most worked up about in life then it suggests to me you are, as I initially suggested, incredibly privileged, incredibly intolerant, and lack an ability to empathise with people who may not have had a similar life to your own.

Cut down on the soy in the mornings.

Quoted from hheh2

Cut down on the soy in the mornings.

Snowflake.

This has been really eye-opening for me. I had always thought the victims of racism were those who were discriminated against and stereotyped or abused. I had never given a thought to those who have to occasionally hear about it happening and their plight. Truly heartbreaking.

Quoted from Chrisblor

Fine, I'll ignore the fact you've rudely called me a Tosser and break it down to you then. This is a thread full of old intolerant white blokes moaning about issues which in no way materially affect their lives:

Female and black pundits - some are very good and there's tons of awful white male pundits still on TV?

Irritation about not being able to use 'homosexual' in a derogatory manner - use a different word then, there's tons of alternative swear words to choose from. Many people find this phrase offensive owing to the way it has been used historically as a slur to describe gay people

"Political Correctness" - Asking people to avoid referring to others in a discriminatory manner isn't political correctness, it's politeness. Why would you want to continue using phrases which specific minorities find offensive?

Coverage of women's football in the media - Last time I checked the volume of press, TV and radio coverage still massively favours the men's game. Some people like and are interested in women's football. If you aren't then just ignore it instead of moaning like a big baby about it apparently preventing you from somehow consuming the enormous amount of coverage mens football still receives.

All minor issues, and if they're the things that you get most worked up about in life then it suggests to me you are, as I initially suggested, incredibly privileged, incredibly intolerant, and lack an ability to empathise with people who may not have had a similar life to your own.

Now hang on, I was the one who brought up the Alex Scott thing but my comments didn’t have anything to do with her skin colour.

There are two things about female commentators and pundits I don't like.

1. The commentators shriek when they pretend to be enthusiastic.

2. They are so obviously not there for their ability or knowledge but as virtue signalling by the broadcaster.

This does not apply to the race issue, we have had good black pundits for years now, but I do get annoyed when we get foreign ex-players on there whose accents make them unintelligible and who do not know enough English to be able to express what they really mean. They are only there for their name.

To a degree the same applies with those stupid PL after match interviews. You have a woman trying to sound knowledgable talking to a man who cannot put two words of English together! How to fill 60 seconds of screen time with nothing.

Quoted from promotion plaice

I used to call black people coloured because I thought it sounded more respectful and softer but it looks like I got that wrong.

I find it strange that everyone we used (rightly or wrongly) to refer to as 'coloured' now actually wants to be called 'black' and get drunk off if that term is not used. Not all people of colour are 'black' at all and also what should we, to avoid upsetting them, call Asians and those from the Middle east with non-white skin? Not 'black' surely?

Call me a snowflake but I genuinely think Alex Scott is quite good. Much rather listen to her than have Jamie Redknapp talk a load of balls.

Quoted from mariner91

Call me a snowflake but I genuinely think Alex Scott is quite good. Much rather listen to her than have Jamie Redknapp talk a load of balls.

Yes, maybe. But what people cannot seem to see is that in TAOW we have totally dispensed with any notion of meritocracy.  How good she is does not matter anymore to the people who count. Therefore this encourages rather than solves racism or sexism.

A black person achieves so they must have had positive discrimination. A black person fails so they must have suffered racism. The same applies to women in this context. Alex Scott cannot be good because she is a token. Whether she actually is any good is now irrelevant, she is a woman so she must be good or she must be awful depending on your standpoint. The polarising has been encouraged by political correctness as it was called.

This rush to the lowest common denominator, levelling down the field, dumbing down the presentation so that nobody should feel left out has worked against people with talent in every single ethnic group in every walk of life. It gives the racist/sexist/whateverist the perfect set of excuses, plays straight into their hands.

So we cannot kill racism while perceived imbalance and unfairness exists. We can drive it underground (maybe) with laws and media liberalism, we can play with quotas and salary caps, but kill it? No. We have given it fresh life. I was always a believer in equal opportunity but I just can’t see how that can happen now.

Alex Scott featuring regularly as a TV pundit IS an example of meritocracy because she's good at her job - it has nothing at all to do with her being A. a woman or B. black.

The suggestion that punditry in the 90s and early 2000s was actually meritocratic is laughable. The whole thing was a massive boys club where any old dipsomaniac was welcome to spout their views on air because they'd knocked a football about in their younger days.

Quoted from Chrisblor

Alex Scott featuring regularly as a TV pundit IS an example of meritocracy because she's good at her job - it has nothing at all to do with her being A. a woman or B. black.

The suggestion that punditry in the 90s and early 2000s was actually meritocratic is laughable. The whole thing was a massive boys club where any old dipsomaniac was welcome to spout their views on air because they'd knocked a football about in their younger days.

Please read what I put before getting on your high horse. I said she may be good but it is irrelevant now whether she is good, bad or indifferent. That does not matter. Her gender is all that matters to the people who employ her. You may not think so but to the broadcasters it is everything. Perception and quota filling matters so much more than ability. Also I never said or implied punditry had any meritocracy but I do say it now has absolutely no chance of achieving it.

Quoted from Rodley Mariner

This has been really eye-opening for me. I had always thought the victims of racism were those who were discriminated against and stereotyped or abused. I had never given a thought to those who have to occasionally hear about it happening and their plight. Truly heartbreaking.

....is the best post on this thread.

Quoted from Chrisblor

Alex Scott featuring regularly as a TV pundit IS an example of meritocracy because she's good at her job - it has nothing at all to do with her being A. a woman or B. black.

The suggestion that punditry in the 90s and early 2000s was actually meritocratic is laughable. The whole thing was a massive boys club where any old dipsomaniac was welcome to spout their views on air because they'd knocked a football about in their younger days.

You obviously missed the so called 'expert panel' commenting on the Man U and Chelsea games yesterday then Old pissheads who knocked a football about years ago are still getting job and the regular crowd who appear on Jeff Stelling's Saturday show are no better

And if lady commenators 'shriek' where does that leave that idiot Stelling?

I note that twit Jim White is absolutely creaming himself with excitement about the racism at the Hartlepool v Dover game this weekend. He absolutely loves a crisis (a la Bury) and incidents like the one this weekend. Report it of course, milk it and look for members of the public to inflame the event / give him more drama, no.

Jim White's no different to anyone else on Talksport. They spout stupid things or sensationalise trivia in the hope of getting stupid people to call in and pay 13p a minute. He's does happen to be good at that though and appears to have an endless stream of the stupid ones prepared to pay!
By the way the Hartlepool thing isn't trivia and the poolie bunker is full of it as you would imagine. Seems 98% decent supporters are deeply embarrassed by the 2% idiots, same as all clubs

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

There are two things about female commentators and pundits I don't like.

1. The commentators shriek when they pretend to be enthusiastic.

2. They are so obviously not there for their ability or knowledge but as virtue signalling by the broadcaster.

This does not apply to the race issue, we have had good black pundits for years now, but I do get annoyed when we get foreign ex-players on there whose accents make them unintelligible and who do not know enough English to be able to express what they really mean. They are only there for their name.

To a degree the same applies with those stupid PL after match interviews. You have a woman trying to sound knowledgable talking to a man who cannot put two words of English together! How to fill 60 seconds of screen time with nothing.

Just to be clear, RonRafferty isn't sexist, he just hates every female commentator or pundits screechy voice and thinks none of them as are good as men.

Admittedly I've not watched it for along time but i was always annoyed with Sky Sports always employing really attractive women as their news readers - what about the ugly men & women?

Quoted from mariner91

Call me a snowflake but I genuinely think Alex Scott is quite good. Much rather listen to her than have Jamie Redknapp talk a load of balls.

I dont like Alex Scott.

I love her.  

Quoted from nightrider

Admittedly I've not watched it for along time but i was always annoyed with Sky Sports always employing really attractive women as their news readers - what about the ugly men & women?

It's because ugly people have unpleasant voices. Haven't you noticed before now?

Quoted from Rodley Mariner

Just to be clear, RonRafferty isn't sexist, he just hates every female commentator or pundits screechy voice and thinks none of them as are good as men.

Just to be clear, Rodley. Those female presenters, commentators etc. are there to fill a quota. Trying to watch Quest highlights is a pain in the eardrums when you get the volume and the treble both whizzing up and down. The only aural experience at football I can think of that was worse was a schoolboy international at Wmberlee many moons ago.

If they happen to be good then that is a nice happy coincidence. I would be delighted to go through the names of male pundits etc. who are crap and irritating to me or you but they are theoretically picked for their knowledge/ability, not there to fill a quota.

To be fair, the woman on MOTD2 last night was pretty eloquent, compared to one of two of the others who pretty lame in my eyes. I couldn't give you their names though.

For me the whole idea of ex players bring on is that they've played the game at that level with inside knowledge on matters. Imo they should be put out to pasture every few years for dome fresh insight from newly retired players as the game changes rapidly. Instead of old clingers on like Hansen and Lawrence who even I never saw play.

The women's game is a seperate entity with totally different stresses and strains and they can't give that insider knowledge. Yes they can comment on tactical plays etc but for me they token seat fillers without the requisite experience of men's football.

But in todays world you not allowed to hold such views no matter how innocently founded. Anything that could be misconstrued as slightly sexist or whatever is judge, jury and executioner style guilty with no consideration of the reasoning behind. Triggered butthurt liberals.

Take Gabby Logan, she been around for ages and does a good job because she the presenter and doesn't pretend to know the ins and outs. She is knowledgeable and perfectly free to express her thoughts as someone who not played the game (and these views are respected) but mainly she hosts and asks the questions -I can't remember ever us old supposed sexist, racist, whatever-ists ever having a go at her. If a quota needs to be filled they should ditch Linekar et al and have women hosting the programmes and questioning the male ex-pros as they know the male game.

For parity they should then have male hosts with a female panel for the women's game.

Labels on race are over-rated and probably misleading.  Years ago CPS guidance advised that the term “black” should be used, not “coloured”.

At the same time the official guidance in The Prison Service was to use “coloured”  not “black”.  What does it matter?

In the Forces every person worked together in teams successfully.  Any differences irrelevant.

...........

If fans want another issue to debate:  we are off to London.  Which (from memory) has 25% of the world’s CCTV cameras.  GB has more  CCTV cameras that any other country.  Is this 1984-style surveillance on individuals justified?  

And facial recognition technology, and taking data from all your Facebook posts and Google photos etc. And monitoring your every transaction as we push for an ever more cashless society 🧐🤔

Quoted from Rik e B

To be fair, the woman on MOTD2 last night was pretty eloquent, compared to one of two of the others who pretty lame in my eyes. I couldn't give you their names though.

For me the whole idea of ex players bring on is that they've played the game at that level with inside knowledge on matters. Imo they should be put out to pasture every few years for dome fresh insight from newly retired players as the game changes rapidly. Instead of old clingers on like Hansen and Lawrence who even I never saw play.

The women's game is a seperate entity with totally different stresses and strains and they can't give that insider knowledge. Yes they can comment on tactical plays etc but for me they token seat fillers without the requisite experience of men's football.

But in todays world you not allowed to hold such views no matter how innocently founded. Anything that could be misconstrued as slightly sexist or whatever is judge, jury and executioner style guilty with no consideration of the reasoning behind. Triggered butthurt liberals.

Take Gabby Logan, she been around for ages and does a good job because she the presenter and doesn't pretend to know the ins and outs. She is knowledgeable and perfectly free to express her thoughts as someone who not played the game (and these views are respected) but mainly she hosts and asks the questions -I can't remember ever us old supposed sexist, racist, whatever-ists ever having a go at her. If a quota needs to be filled they should ditch Linekar et al and have women hosting the programmes and questioning the male ex-pros as they know the male game.

For parity they should then have male hosts with a female panel for the women's game.

Gabby Logan/Yorath is one of the best women presenters and is indeed better than many of the men. No doubt this is helped by her being steeped in the game from birth and having experienced things like her Dad being involved with the Bradford fire. She also has a much more intelligent way with questions and comments than the usual “How does it feel ..........?” tripe.

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

Gabby Logan/Yorath is one of the best women presenters and is indeed better than many of the men. No doubt this is helped by her being steeped in the game from birth and having experienced things like her Dad being involved with the Bradford fire. She also has a much more intelligent way with questions and comments than the usual “How does it feel ..........?” tripe.

I quite like the other footballers' daughters' approach too

Kelly Cates  ( Kenny Dalglish's daughter )

and

Hayley McQueen ( Gordon McQueen's daughter )

Both of them have an easy going style and neither pretends to be an expert on the game, a bit like Gabby

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

having experienced things like her Dad being involved with the Bradford fire.

WTF has that got to do with her knowledge about and / or ability to comment on football ?

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

Gabby Logan/Yorath is one of the best women presenters and is indeed better than many of the men. No doubt this is helped by her being steeped in the game from birth and having experienced things like her Dad being involved with the Bradford fire. She also has a much more intelligent way with questions and comments than the usual “How does it feel ..........?” tripe.

AAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Gabby Logan is tolerated as a presenter because her old man was present at the Bradford fire 30-odd years ago? You need your head testing.

You reckon she didn’t get the same treatment as today’s female pundits & presenters when she started out? Maybe she’s good because she’s been doing it nigh on 20 years and people are used to her?

Quoted from Ipswin

WTF has that got to do with her knowledge about and / or ability to comment on football ?

As a match analyst, very little. As a presenter/ interviewer a great deal as she has lived in the football family for over 40 years and through her own career as a performer at elite level knows the stresses of training and competing in the public eye. If only Emily Maitlis had her poise and dignity.

Quoted from nightrider

Admittedly I've not watched it for along time but i was always annoyed with Sky Sports always employing really attractive women as their news readers - what about the ugly men & women?

They get work in radio

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

There are two things about female commentators and pundits I don't like.

1. The commentators shriek when they pretend to be enthusiastic.

2. They are so obviously not there for their ability or knowledge but as virtue signalling by the broadcaster.

This does not apply to the race issue, we have had good black pundits for years now, but I do get annoyed when we get foreign ex-players on there whose accents make them unintelligible and who do not know enough English to be able to express what they really mean. They are only there for their name.

To a degree the same applies with those stupid PL after match interviews. You have a woman trying to sound knowledgable talking to a man who cannot put two words of English together! How to fill 60 seconds of screen time with nothing.

How do most of the halwits who get that gig get the job? What virtue are the broadcatsers signalling when they employ inarticulate middle aged men?

Quoted from Rik e B

And facial recognition technology, and taking data from all your Facebook posts and Google photos etc. And monitoring your every transaction as we push for an ever more cashless society 🧐🤔

So hardly signs of a liberal establishment is it?  Big Brother was not noted for his liberality, unless you think Joseph Stalin was 'a butt hurt liberal'.

Quoted from Croxton

As a match analyst, very little. As a presenter/ interviewer a great deal as she has lived in the football family for over 40 years and through her own career as a performer at elite level knows the stresses of training and competing in the public eye. If only Emily Maitlis had her poise and dignity.

I'd say EM is on a par with Gaby Yorath. In her own sphere. Remember seeing her on BBC London News years ago and thinking, she is the complete package.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

How do most of the halwits who get that gig get the job? What virtue are the broadcatser signalling when they employ inarticulate middle aged men?

Fcuks sake.

Quoted from Ipswin

I find it strange that everyone we used (rightly or wrongly) to refer to as 'coloured' now actually wants to be called 'black' and get drunk off if that term is not used. Not all people of colour are 'black' at all and also what should we, to avoid upsetting them, call Asians and those from the Middle east with non-white skin? Not 'black' surely?

Calling someone by their name is a big help.

'Asian' is the commonly accepted English term for Asians.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

So hardly signs of a liberal establishment is it?  Big Brother was not noted for his liberality, unless you think Joseph Stalin was 'a butt hurt liberal'.

The Liberal no borders agenda, useful idiots of the left mere pawns for a more sinister Globalist One World Government plot (dons tinfoil hat). Flowers and bells for the 'we all one' fairytale which actually means even more untouchable unelected super-elites presiding over all of us. The nation state is a pain in the bottom they need to get rid of.

Can I just say as a youngster I loved the black and white minstrel show they were brilliant singers/entertainers./Banjo players.

One of my all time favorite movies was the Al Jolson story and Larry Parks potrail of the great Al Jolson.

Never ever did I think it was any way racist I am sure the majority of grown up people didn't either.

Some people like to find agenda's where they don't exist just to get noticed.

Those PC loonies will be claiming that apartheid and lynching's were racist next!

Quoted from KingstonMariner

I'd say EM is on a par with Gaby Yorath. In her own sphere. Remember seeing her on BBC London News years ago and thinking, she is the complete package.

Not questioning her brains and televisual talents. Her emotions/ irritations towards her interview subject become the story rather than incisive questioning. It's not her fault that TV/social media has become the message but appearing on glossy front covers seems a tad American to me . She's not the first. Paxo, Evan Davies, Kirsty Wark ,and many more, embrace the publicity.  
Davies used to become over intrusive in TV interviews but is now excellent in his radio slot. Less heat and more light.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

Calling someone by their name is a big help.

'Asian' is the commonly accepted English term for Asians.

I can't remember my family's names never mind the names of those in the most populous region of the world!

and for 'coloured' Asians ?

The worse female (can't remember her name) she was reporting on Clee Town vs Melton town fa cup and she couldn't even get the score right.  That's basic stuff right there.  Talentless if you ask me, pretty she might be a commentator she is definitely not lol.

Disgusting. Just because she's some attractive woman she's getting all the big games.