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MuddyWaters
August 20, 2019, 10:23pm
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Happy with a point from a game we would have lost last season.

Not sure we have to play every ball through Hanson but...

MoM goes to Hess in spite of his error for their opener, unfortunately one or two others struggled and I’m reserving judgment on Waterfall as he doesn’t look fit. Ring did okay tonight and all three subs livened us up.

Not bad after a long trip away.
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lukeo
August 20, 2019, 10:43pm
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Watched on ifollow and agree.. I think we need to play Green closer to Hanson. I like 433 and use it for my team but hoofing to Hanson isn't going to work. We have some good footballers in this squad.
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MuddyWaters
August 20, 2019, 10:51pm
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Quoted from lukeo
Watched on ifollow and agree.. I think we need to play Green closer to Hanson. I like 433 and use it for my team but hoofing to Hanson isn't going to work. We have some good footballers in this squad.


Thinking on from that, I’d like us to play Hanson and Green with one behind (either Vernam or Cook) and three behind that. Green looks better in a two than wide in a three.
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fishcake63
August 20, 2019, 10:55pm
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good point decent team them in false position
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headingly_mariner
August 20, 2019, 10:57pm

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Thought we were really poor tonight. Whitehouse and Hewitt really struggled in the middle, neither really affected the game positively and both are very onepaced. Hess was great even though he gave the ball away for the goal.

It’s serious percentage football, we lump it and go for the knock downs. Every throw in in the opposition half is a long one. To be fair it seems effective as in a game that we played poorly in we managed to score twice.

Was really surprised Ogbu was taken off, he makes things happen when the ball goes into his feet.
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moosey_club
August 20, 2019, 11:09pm
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Quoted from MuddyWaters
Happy with a point from a game we would have lost last season.

Not sure we have to play every ball through Hanson but...

MoM goes to Hess in spite of his error for their opener, unfortunately one or two others struggled and I’m reserving judgment on Waterfall as he doesn’t look fit. Ring did okay tonight and all three subs livened us up.

Not bad after a long trip away.


Not bad....jeez.
Was hoping to patiently wait and see 6 games in before passing an overall first opinion on the 2019/20 version but think i have seen enough in the 5 games to figure out;
The football we play is horrendous, long punt to Hanson and try to pick up the 2nd ball , long throws and far post delivery on just about every corner/ set piece. Not a tactic or game plan i like, its not entertaining to watch and its not that productive when it comes to overall chances/shots on goal or goals.
Pedestrian players in most areas. Not very exciting other than when Max Wright gets a look in.
Very well disciplined with players seemingly understanding what is required of them.

Missing for me are a couple of vital elements, midfielders to date are not getting up to form a second wave to pick up on 2nd balls around the edge of the box, this maybe as they are that well disciplined in keeping the defensive shape, it doesnt give them time to be up with the strikers when the punt goes up.

I think we could do with a player with a little more guile in the centre or pace to help break through the lines of the opposition, too one dimensional at the moment, even tonight on the rare occassions we passed the ball it was pretty harmless side to side and still ended up with a long diagonal towards Hanson anyway.

There are certainly improvements in some areas compared to last season but i have found it as dull as dishwater to watch us going forward so far.

Battled back well again and credit for rescuing a point which despite pressure looked unlikely as we weren't really hammering their goal or testing their keeper much.







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toontown
August 20, 2019, 11:23pm
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Definitely a point gained as we didn't really deserve to get anything from that game. If it hadn't been for another Macca worldy we would have been 3 down at half time. Abysmal passing from most of the team that first half. Improved second half but we were not as much better than them as they had been over us first half.

Surprised no subs at half time, surprised ogbu came off, but the draw justified jolley's decisions. Very dogged determination from the side to drag that game back from 2-0.

For me in ring we have a definite back up level full back, he can't play wing back but he can 'do a job' at left back - yes he can cover during injury or suspension but we shouldn't be playing him out of choice. To reinforce that Hewitt is poorer in central mid than Clifton, so I don't see why we'd be playing him there out of choice when he seems a decent right back with a good cross and throw. That allows Hendrie to play left back and replace ring who is a weak link. And for me Clifton improves the middle over Hewitt so seems a no brainer.

The style of football tonight was very long ball, think we have to mix it up more, and green either needs to be played more centrally or dropped for Wright. The quality needs to be upped if we are to achieve anything this season.
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Croxton
August 20, 2019, 11:35pm
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Agree with most of that Moosey but Green can't play that role in a three. His movement is poor and he lacks Ogbu's strength in possession. Sorry to see Ogbu go off and Ring stay on. Should have put Hewitt to full back and brought Wright on at 2-0.
We lack pace in thought and deed. Slow to react to their movement and no pace or width.
Vernam or Wright instead of Green for me. Whitehouse was laboured tonight. Combative but left behind by sharper Colchester movement.
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Lincoln Mariner 56
August 21, 2019, 12:08am
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Would concur that we did not play well but as other posters have said Colchester in a false position and Nouble and their number 10 were real quality at this level.

Currently we appear one paced and a bit too predictable but if our style is about hitting Hanson then we have to get other forwards much closer to him and at least midfielder in a position where he can pick up a loose ball. That just did not happen tonight. Think Wright should start as one of the front three this Saturday with Green or Cook playing much closer to Hanson. Ogbu was what Ogbu is and that’s a bit of a mystery with a couple of very good openings wasted with senseless passes, a chance in the first half he should have buried and some other touches of quality. Still not sure what we have so await to see how he develops.

Whitehouse struggled tonight and maybe two games in quick succession is a bit too much after twelve months out the game. I understand Harry had a knock that’s why he was rested but surely Cook deserved a run after his performance last week and full backs could have stayed the same although Ring was fine but not pacy enough for me when driving forward.

We have the commitment but in my eyes need a couple of quality additions and Devitt would be someone to add some skill, guile and goals so would be happy for him to arrive.

I know I might be alone voice but once again I was disappointed with contribution Vernam made when he came on with an excellent first touch and then lost the ball every time it went his way. Just don’t see in him what others on here obviously do, hopefully I’m wrong and others are right.

Finally another crap Ref totally inept and that’s being kind.
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arryarryarry
August 21, 2019, 5:12am
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I agree with most of the comments.

Clearly the tactics are lump it forward to Hanson and see what comes of it. Fine if it works pretty horrible when it doesn't.

Lucky to be still in the game at half-time if it wasn't for James McKeown.

We got back into the game with I think the only time we had a player run into their area and Ogbu was brought down for the penalty. He seems to be one of those players who looks like he doesn't know what he is going to do let alone the opposition and that does give us something different.

I like Charles Vernam but for me he is clearly no use in a side that hoofs it forward, he needs the ball at his feet so he can run at the opposition. Glad to see Max Wright brought on although I would like to see him start as he can run at the opposition but also isn't afraid to get stuck in.

I thought Waterfall looked a bit dodgy at times with some of his back passes to James McKeown that looked short.

Still early days but I do wonder if opposition teams can see the way we play and just counteract it.
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A.l.f.
August 21, 2019, 6:47am

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Good point against a good side, who pressed us all game and didn't allow us to settle.  They had more pace all over the pitch than us and i think thats why we were a little route one tonight.  That said, when you have a great physical striker in Hanson, you' d want to play to your strengths.  I too would like to see Max Wright wide and get more advanced crosses in to Hanson.  I'm happy to leave tactics to our manager, who has more information on opposition sides and see's our players on a day to day basis.  I think he's seen whats required to progress and am fairly confident on how the season will pan out.
We showed great character last night and although our passing was far from our best, the lads look to have a good team spirit and work ethic.  Three points against Port Vale would give us a good start to the season and we have some good away days to Walsall and Salford coming up.  Lets see where we go from here and enjoy the ride, as i think it will be a lot better than the last two seasons.  UTM
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marinerrick
August 21, 2019, 6:50am
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I agree with most comments that we were not brilliant however when we tried to not outpace and run past Colchester, which we don't have the pace to do and started playing to our strengthsand played direct football we caused problems. Overall pleased we rescued a point but think we need to play the team in front of us and not how we always wants to play.
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GtfcGarner
August 21, 2019, 7:25am

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Thought it was very one dimensional last night which for a Jolley team surprised me.

McKeown - Made his usual world class save that we have all grown accustomed to at 1-0 and was a commanding voice can't say anything bad about Macca except if I was to have a little grumble his kicks are so flat when we are trying to counter but I suppose he would be at a higher level was that rectified.

Ring - Struggled alot tonight looked lightweight, off the pace and like a lost puppy. Terrible defending for the 2nd goal and got caught out of position quite alot, saw Hess covering him an awful lot.

Waterfall - Pretty much what people have said before he signed, if the ball is in the air he will have a field day. Looked a little unfit and had a moment in the 2nd half were he let the ball bounce near the corner and ended up getting lucky

Davis - Thought he had an OK game barring the goal where the man got between him and ring. Took a good yellow card for the team which would have been another clear cut chance for Colchester

Hendrie - Solid performance at right back, just looks like Mr.Dependable very very calm under pressure and is quite good with the ball

Whitehouse - Looked a little tired which is to be expected after not playing for 12 months and having games in quick succession, his first touch kept bouncing off his foot and although he was ratting in the middle never really got going

Hewitt - Same as Whitehouse really think the effort was there but not the quality, Notts County said he was better in CM than full back but from what I've seen I'd be tempted to stick with him at right back and Hendrie left. Got an early yellow and think that restricted him from putting a foot in again

Hessenthaler - My MOTM tonight, always demanding the ball and so classy on it, can't believe how many interceptions he makes either. Would comfortably slide into a better side and was impressed with how he was tonight looked like one of the only ones who wanted to get it down and play

Ogbu - Confusing player and think he will be so frustrating to watch, for the penalty it was a glimpse of magic how he just left his man for dead with his back towards the area. Looks very strong on the ball and can comfortably run with it. Gives it away cheap some times but I feel that's what he's going to be for us this year.

Green - Looked abit of a lost sheep out wide and would prefer him tucking inside to run onto the flick ons of Hanson. Took his goal absolutely brilliantly and was so glad for him to get off the mark considering how much running and closing down he puts into the game.

Hanson - Never seen such a powerful striker. Wins absolutely EVERYTHING. The ref had a woeful game tonight and feel like he gave decisions against Hanson when he was almost having the shirt ripped off his back. Would like to see us just not pump it up to him and see him actually win headers in the area.

All in all a good point which I think we would of all took at 2-0 down but I don't think Colchester looked a great team. Hopefully bounce back to winning ways against Port Vale, enjoyed the comeback though and recent town teams of the past would of crumbled.
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psgmariner
August 21, 2019, 7:50am

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Got to be happy with a draw when 2-0 down. Colchester looked much the better team and was really impressed by nouble and their number 10 who was incredibly skillfull. For us, Hess was outstanding and credit to Hanson for winning so many headers. Max Wright’s cameo was also encouraging.

We are an ugly team to watch. We are more hoofball than under slade. If we keep picking up points then fine but if Jolley has another of his losing streaks it could get messy quickly.


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Croxton
August 21, 2019, 8:14am
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Would agree with most of that Gtfc Garner but I thought it was one of Hendrie's less effective games in an attacking sense. He delayed crosses sometimes and was too cautious in testing the full back. Hewitt is better swinging crosses in from the right and Hendrie is miles better than Ring at left back. There were several occasions when Ring could have made a more determined attempt to drive deeper into the last third or swing a cross in with his natural left foot. Hanson was demanding earlier passes and made many runs between his markers only for a pass to be delayed.
Judging by one of Port Vale's goals against FGR last night they don't hesitate in getting the ball wide and feeding their forwards.
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Jarmo.Is.God
August 21, 2019, 8:16am

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Have I missed something?
Not every attack was through a long ball to Hanson, and when it was, he did his job and won it.

When we passed it about patiently, and waiting for the opportunity to play it forward, some fans moaned!
There was a spell in the first half, and 1 in the second, in which we passed it about nicely, without getting anywhere, but I have no issue with that, they are running to close us down and tiring, and we are keeping possession, and by doing so, they can't score...

2nd time I've seen Ogbu now, and he has so much potential to be a very good player. I like him a lot, strong, physical, and positive in winning the penalty

Wright and Vernam made a difference when they come on, which is something that didn't happen last season, having sub's that changed the game.

Ring looked good with the ball, and wanted to get it forward, not sure if at fault for any of the goals, as had a wonderful post in the way.

I posted yesterday about creating chances without a creative midfielder, and believing it to be a bit of a myth... but I take that back, as we definitely missed someone who could see that pass forward to split the defence.

P.S Nouble caused us too many problems, and that slightly worried me
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lukeo
August 21, 2019, 8:23am
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I hate route one but as someone just commented above I noticed how quick and sharp they where to close down every town player aand cut off any easy passes most of the time
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golfer
August 21, 2019, 8:25am
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I enjoyed the game-real end to end stuff. I think Whitehouse needs a rest and Hendrie should be practising his left foot. Every player gave 100%. Conley has improved immensely since he was here
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Jarmo.Is.God
August 21, 2019, 8:33am

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Quoted from golfer
I enjoyed the game-real end to end stuff. I think Whitehouse needs a rest and Hendrie should be practising his left foot. Every player gave 100%. Conley has improved immensely since he was here


Yeah, looked a good tidy player last night
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buckstown
August 21, 2019, 8:54am
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One dimensional is a good description for us last night and I didn't think we were very effective as the quality of balls into Hanson were generally poor.
It struck me that virtually every ball was played in forwards, and we never got behind them and turned their defenders. That's why I thought Wright could have been on at half time. To be fair we were so bad 1st half MJ gave them the opportunity to sort it out, and the early penalty was crucial. Colchesters centre halves were pretty good against Hanson but it's easy when you're facing the right way and they needed to be turned
We did look tidy when we passed it out of defence but we weren't under any pressure. As soon as they pressed we panicked and gave the ball away so often.
Hess was very important for us, he was everywhere and seemed to be doing 3 jobs. Also liked Ogbu, but as others have said he's an all or nothing player. At this level he gets it right often enough for me and his strength is fantastic
Be interesting to hear what their manager has to say because I thought he threw it away taking Norris off and bringing Sowumni on. Bet he'll be fuming that Hewitt was on the pitch after his two challenges. It looked like the ref was going for a second card but Hanson talked him out of it
Finally, amazing finish from Green
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monkeyboy
August 21, 2019, 8:59am
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Glad to watch us claw it back but my god it was dreadful.

Last night was worse than sladeball im sorry to say and i certainly do not like this lump it up mentality.
We are really really poor in the midfield area creative wise and this is why the lump it up aproach is being taken as im sure Jolley knows our problems but probably does not have the funds to get a playmaker in.

i dont see devit being the answer as yes he is skilful but is not a great passer.
Think we need 2 mids that are different from what we have now.
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sam gy
August 21, 2019, 9:36am
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Struggling to remember the last time we got a goal from a good strike, rather than a set piece or a scramble in the box! Morenof that please, Matt.

Came from a long ball into the box and a knock down too....who’d have thunk it?  


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marinerdazza
August 21, 2019, 9:39am
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Couple of points, yes it was one dimensional but we’ve seen from other games that it’s not the only way we can play and I’m presuming we were set up like it to counter what was a big Colchester side. Last season they’d have won that 0-3. Colchester much stronger side than their position suggests.

Team spirit superb as everyone else has said.

Waterfall thrown straight into it and I think is coping well in the circumstances. He’ll only get better. I don’t think we missed out on Sowunmi...

Got back at midnight last night. Definitely worth it.
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mariner91
August 21, 2019, 9:45am
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We desperately need another central midfielder in, not only because we're light in numbers but also because we don't have enough footballing ability in there. Clifton and Whitehouse are strong runners but neither are particularly technically brilliant, Hewitt looks slow and ponderous in both thought and deed when in the middle and is much better at right back when he has more time and the sideline behind him. When a team presses us like Colchester did, only Hess is really capable of moving the ball quickly and accurately consistently. I'm not saying we should sign someone like Pirlo but just somebody who's an improvement technically on what we already have.

Unlike last season we have a threat up front and so long as Hanson is available then we may well get some luck from knocking it long, as horrible as it is to watch. And we haven't been purely hoofball all pre-season or in league games. In games where we've not been pressed as hard we've gone long some times but also looked to work the ball out wide before putting crosses in from further up the pitch which is when we have looked the most dangerous, particularly against Bradford. My concern is if we don't get a midfielder who is an improvement on what we have, teams will work out that we can't deal with a press very well and will set up to nullify Hanson with the long balls.


Looking forward to a brighter future now Fenty has gone.
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sam gy
August 21, 2019, 10:15am
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Maybe, just maybe....we played 'hoofball' last night, because management thought (rightly or wrongly) that it was the best way to play against Colchester.

I've only seen the Bradford match so far, and i don't think we particularly played hoofball then.


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Mariner_501
August 21, 2019, 10:17am
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At half time it looked like we could play all night and not score one goal, so to score two was a nice surprise.

Town look pretty terrible, the first half was one of the worst I’ve ever seen. But to play that bad and still get a draw can only be a good sign.

Ring looks lost and isn’t good enough. Need to go back to Hendrie (who is brilliant) at left back and Hewitt at right back.

Do not look good/creative enough to create anything from open play, so have to hoof it to Hanson. I think only 1 of the last 9 goals(?) have come from open play, and that was a break away with an open goal. Concerning.
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mariner91
August 21, 2019, 10:21am
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Quoted from sam gy
Maybe, just maybe....we played 'hoofball' last night, because management thought (rightly or wrongly) that it was the best way to play against Colchester.

I've only seen the Bradford match so far, and i don't think we particularly played hoofball then.


We didn't hoof it against Bradford. But against Bradford the midfield weren't pressed as much and were generally on top.


Looking forward to a brighter future now Fenty has gone.
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Mallyner
August 21, 2019, 10:47am
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Quoted from mariner91


We didn't hoof it against Bradford. But against Bradford the midfield weren't pressed as much and were generally on top.


I think that was the answer and as others have said, I too think Colchester were better than their previous results. They pressed and harried well and left little space for interpassing.

Nouble was immense and showed tremendous skill and awareness for such a big man; although looking at his goals for career, we will be better off with our James.



Supporting Town for 65 years.  
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sam gy
August 21, 2019, 10:55am
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Quoted from mariner91


We didn't hoof it against Bradford. But against Bradford the midfield weren't pressed as much and were generally on top.


Aye thats kinda my point. Think we’re too early in the season to have a settled style of play yet, and no doubt it’ll be tweaked depending on who the opponent is.

With Hanson up top, who on his day is better than this league, we’d be silly to not play to his strengths. But I’m not ready to label us as long ball merchants just yet.


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The Boys Paddock
August 21, 2019, 12:41pm
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Really poor, and a lucky point.

Midfield are a disgrace, and its hoofball and hope stuff.
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Mariner Timsky
August 21, 2019, 1:20pm

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Tbh it wasn’t all that bad - and they hit it long just as much as we did - but once we had the ball we knocked it around ok - they had one stand out player who scored a a cracker and made another but we managed to keep him quiet second half - but yeh it’s not all hoof ball from town and I’ve defo seen worse from town


Stand Up For The Mariners!!!!!
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devs
August 21, 2019, 2:16pm
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Seen worse but we need more of a blend in midfield
Three of Clifton, Whitehouse, Hess and Hewitt is not going to get you to the top 7 of L2 IMO
I agree that a lot of L2 is about grit, hard running, stamina and physicality but Bury and Tranny proved last season you can play really good footy and succeed (not that it has done Bury much good).

I think Vernam/Cook should be one of the midfield - poss Vernam cos he has the pace and fitness but also a lot more potential trickery and pace

Teams will eventually suss that if you stop Hanson you stop GTFC - so we do need more subtle options

Cant' fault the 100% work rate and attitude and there have been many times in recent past we would not have come back from 2-0 down

Bit less brawn and more brain is needed if we are to challenge the top places
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essexexile
August 21, 2019, 3:02pm
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Saw it on Ifollow and agree with a lot of what's been said
First half they were like a boxer getting inside and giving you a bit of a hiding and we couldn't get away from em to play our game' whatever that is!
Disappointed with Whitehouse, thought he was our new Waters/Groves to bind it all together but on that showing we desperately need a pivot in midfield or some sort of diamond to string it all together
When you play 4 3 3 you have no pace to get behind em on the flanks and surely Hanson needs service from there
But got back and that deserves credit
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Limerick Mariner
August 21, 2019, 3:44pm
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Quoted from essexexile
Saw it on Ifollow and agree with a lot of what's been said
First half they were like a boxer getting inside and giving you a bit of a hiding and we couldn't get away from em to play our game' whatever that is!
Disappointed with Whitehouse, thought he was our new Waters/Groves to bind it all together but on that showing we desperately need a pivot in midfield or some sort of diamond to string it all together
When you play 4 3 3 you have no pace to get behind em on the flanks and surely Hanson needs service from there
But got back and that deserves credit


Saw enough of Whitehouse against Bradford to see he can be an important player for us. A couple of competitive games close together will be hard after being out for a full season - top notch match fitness can't be gained on the training park or in friendlies. If he gets anywhere near what the two players you mention brought to GTFC we'll all be overjoyed...

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MarinersOnTheUp
August 21, 2019, 3:57pm
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Started brightly and was the better side up until their first goal. Seemed to fall apart after they scored and was very poor until half time. Pulled one back early and once both side had settled again after that goal we seemed to grow into the game and looked the better side in the second half without being spectacular but it was pleasing to see us dig in and do what was needed. Thought we gave away too many set pieces for the first 60 minutes too and was maybe lucky to have not been punished more for that. I was disappointed to see ogbu taken off because I thought he looked threatening and caused problems, think he was annoyed about it too but to be fair Town continued to push forwards with Vernam coming on who put one or two decent balls in. Looking back now I understand the substitution, keeping Moses fresh for Saturday is probably a good move and sometimes even if someone is playing well, some fresh legs on the pitch are more beneficial. Seemed like we went with two up front after the substitution too which benefited Matt Green, who scored a fantastic goal to make it 2-2, definitely a deserved equaliser after our second half performance. Looked a bit nervous after the equaliser but soon settled. Disappointed to see the free kick given against cook because although it was a mistimed tackle, it didn’t result in any contact at all so no foul for me, the ref should’ve just had a word at the next stoppage in play. Very good run then form Max Wright which led to a foul and a free kick. Harry Davis then fouled in the box after the ball was put in yet the officials gave nothing, should’ve been a penalty.

Other than the poor 25 minutes after their first goal we looked pretty solid for the most part, without being world beaters. Maybe could’ve used the ball a bit better and seemed to miss Clifton’s energy in the middle for large parts of the game. Could’ve done with someone a bit more creative in the middle to pick out attacking pass at times, I think Whitehosue has the potential to offer us something in terms of that but after his ACL injury it could understandably be a few months of regular game time before he's back to his best. Maybe Max Wright could fill that role if needed, he's definitely got energy and flair going forwards.

I thought the Ref and linesman made some poor decisions for both sides too. Shown be both Town and Colchester staff giving the officials an earful at full time. 

A draw was probably a fair result although I felt we could’ve won if it weren’t for that disastrous 25 minutes and that actually for 60/65 minutes we were the better side, without being spectacular. It'd have been a different game and I think we'd have won 2/3-0 if we'd have scored in that 20 minutes we were on top in the first half. The players and management deserve a lot of credit for pulling that back to earn a point though because it’s never easy once you go 2 down. No way near as bad overall as some are making out and disappointing to hear one or two boos at half time but I think the last two games have brought some back down to earth because there’s still work to be done, which we all knew and I'm confident we'll continue to improve albeit with some lows along the way.

I think some got too carried away after some good performances against Morecambe, Bradford and Doncaster and are now overacting to these last two results (up until we equalised tonight anyway). Roll on Saturday. (my last game at BP for a while)


UTM
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grimsby pete
August 21, 2019, 4:48pm

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Dont want to say anything negative about any of our players so all I will say is  , what a cracker from Matt !!!


                             Over 36 years living in Suffolk but always a mariner.
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lew chaterleys lover
August 21, 2019, 5:44pm
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I don't agree with all this talk of hoofball. Some posters seem obsessed wtih it - nearly as much as i am obsessed with wanting Fenty out.

We have a great target man in Hanson, who seems to go for every ball in the air, but what is wrong with that? I thought we were crying out for a target man?

Hoofball to me is when all the defenders just wallop it up to the front and hope for the best. We do that sometimes of course, this is division 4 after all, but  where possible they try to find a midfield player.

We didn't play nearly as well last night as we did against Bradford, but to come back from two goals down takes some doing in any division, so great credit to them for that.

I think Vernam is our most skilful player, and should be a shoe in for this team but he is so frustrating. As often happens when he comes on his first touch of the ball is sublime; beats a couple of players on a jinking run and lays it off nicely and then...nothing. He never seems to get the ball after that. He should impose himself much more on the game.
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MuddyWaters
August 21, 2019, 5:50pm
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I don't agree with all this talk of hoofball. Some posters seem obsessed wtih it - nearly as much as i am obsessed with wanting Fenty out.

We have a great target man in Hanson, who seems to go for every ball in the air, but what is wrong with that? I thought we were crying out for a target man?

Hoofball to me is when all the defenders just wallop it up to the front and hope for the best. We do that sometimes of course, this is division 4 after all, but  where possible they try to find a midfield player.

We didn't play nearly as well last night as we did against Bradford, but to come back from two goals down takes some doing in any division, so great credit to them for that.

I think Vernam is our most skilful player, and should be a shoe in for this team but he is so frustrating. As often happens when he comes on his first touch of the ball is sublime; beats a couple of players on a jinking run and lays it off nicely and then...nothing. He never seems to get the ball after that. He should impose himself much more on the game.


I agree about Vernam but maybe he needs a certain system to play in. Not professing to be a manager and i would certainly acknowledge that he barely had a pre-season but I would certainly be tempted to play him behind Hanson & Green in a 4-3-1-2 or a 3-4-1-2 which might be better as the wide players in a midfield 4 would be more advanced.

Possibly as follows?

Mckeown

Hendrie Ohman Davis
Hewitt Hess Whitehouse Gibson
Vernam
Hanson Green
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lew chaterleys lover
August 21, 2019, 6:05pm
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Quoted from MuddyWaters


I agree about Vernam but maybe he needs a certain system to play in. Not professing to be a manager and i would certainly acknowledge that he barely had a pre-season but I would certainly be tempted to play him behind Hanson & Green in a 4-3-1-2 or a 3-4-1-2 which might be better as the wide players in a midfield 4 would be more advanced.

Possibly as follows?

Mckeown

Hendrie Ohman Davis
Hewitt Hess Whitehouse Gibson
Vernam
Hanson Green


Interesting ideas for sure, but you would think the management team would have looked at all ways of accomodating him to best efffect.

I think part of the problem lies with the player himself. Half joking, it always seems to me that he thinks a little jinking run with a lay off is job done. Where is the desire to take the game by the scruff of the neck, to score, to create goals and to play for 90 mins? If he is not careful he will be another talented player whose potential was unfullfilled.
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RonMariner
August 21, 2019, 6:14pm

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Can’t fault the effort, but our passing was very poor and our lack of a midfield play maker was very evident.

A couple of the Colchester players showed how it should be done and in terms of distribution and movement they were the better side.

Though Waterfall looked good in the air at both ends of the pitch.

We just couldn’t put together that killer final ball and appeared to be pumping high balls into the box in the hope that it would break to one of our players, but most of the time their centre backs dealt with things pretty easily.

Ogbu was hit and miss but showed glimpses to suggest there is more to come.

Overall I think we just about deserved our point against a well organised side.
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123614
August 21, 2019, 7:38pm
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Yes, although Hanson is 6' 4", both their centre halves were 6' 3", so it was always going to be a tough night for him in the air.
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monkeyboy
August 21, 2019, 7:59pm
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Notice Nolan not getting a game at Ipswich , he could be the creative player we need.
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GollyGTFC
August 21, 2019, 7:59pm

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Quoted from monkeyboy
Notice Nolan not getting a game at Ipswich , he could be the creative player we need.


I'd rather have Craig Clay.
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MuddyWaters
August 21, 2019, 8:03pm
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Quoted from monkeyboy
Notice Nolan not getting a game at Ipswich , he could be the creative player we need.


Or Scunny?
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KingstonMariner
August 21, 2019, 8:10pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC


I'd rather have Craig Clay.




Through the door there came familiar laughter,
I saw your face and heard you call my name.
Oh my friend we're older but no wiser,
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same.
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GollyGTFC
August 21, 2019, 8:11pm

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I don't think Scunny have any problems creating & scoring goals. Only 5 clubs have scored more goals than them. Their problem is that they have conceded 11 goals in 4 games. The next worst is 8.
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Mariner_09
August 21, 2019, 10:01pm
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Very un-Hurst that. Looks like Scunny needs some shape.

I expect Hurst to turn it round in due course, he’ll get them solid, hard to beat and able to pinch games 1-0 at some point. I just fear, for his sake, that Swann won’t give him sufficient time to sort it out.


I've wasted my life in black and white, a pathetic act for a worthless cause
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Abdul19
August 21, 2019, 10:28pm

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Quoted from monkeyboy
Notice Nolan not getting a game at Ipswich , he could be the creative player we need.


Injured his calf at the end of last season, not fit yet, I think.


JESUS AT THE CENTRE
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chaos33
August 21, 2019, 10:55pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC


I'd rather have Craig Clay.


I presume this is a joke. Nolan is a much better player than Clay.


"You should do what you love while you can"
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Abdul19
August 22, 2019, 7:31am

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I assumed it was bantz based on the popular opinion of the era.

Epic bantz aside, Rob Atkinson is better than Ryan Bennett.


JESUS AT THE CENTRE
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RonMariner
August 22, 2019, 8:48am

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WTF?
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diehardmariner
August 22, 2019, 10:00am
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Thought the first half was a definitive lesson that we can't just hope to go through Hanson.  I don't agree that it's hoofball either.  Hoofball is just that, aimless punts up front hoping that something will happen.  It's quite clear that we're putting our longer balls into two areas; 1) in and around Hanson to win the flick-on or 2) into the corners for Green to chase onto.  

The problem was that Green wasn't at the races which totally ruled out one option.  The second problem came midway through the second half, around the time they scored (when I thought we were slightly on top) and they put a defender in front and behind Hanson.  Wasn't helped by some poor refereeing but they nullified his threat.  The only way Hanson could work around it was to come deeper, which he did, but that then left no-one in the middle for the crosses.

Second half we switched it up a bit and utilised Ogbu and his unpredictability a lot more.  He's a real enigma and you don't know if he's going to skin a man or fall over his own feet, but he causes problems and I think he's more than strong enough to act as a suitable alternative to Hanson as a direct outlet if we need it.  Disappointed he went off as he looked the one who was most likely to change the game, especially when he got chance to turn and run at them.

The midfield was poor, exception of the excellent Hessenthaler who we really need to look at pinning down on a longer contract.  Whitehouse looked tired and Hewitt isn't half as good in midfield as he is at right-back.  At half-time I wanted to see Cook come into the midfield and operate at the top of it, supporting Hanson in attack.  Felt it needed his energy but also a more attacking mindset.

Wright and Vernam added something when they came on, namely pace and direct running.  Got to get both of them involved more as they will create problems.

At the back Waterfall looked exactly like a guy who hasn't played much and is then asked to play Saturday-Tuesday.  I like Ring's work ethic but I still see nothing in him to suggest he's good enough for this level.  

Ultimately though great character shown to get it back and had Wright managed to escape the last ditch foul or the referee seen the man handling of Davis at the death, could have been a different story altogether.  Colchester will be up there come the end of the season, as will Bradford and FGR.  As a side still finding our feet, it's a decent start I think.
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drbell
August 22, 2019, 10:28am
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Quoted from diehardmariner
Thought the first half was a definitive lesson that we can't just hope to go through Hanson.  I don't agree that it's hoofball either.  Hoofball is just that, aimless punts up front hoping that something will happen.  It's quite clear that we're putting our longer balls into two areas; 1) in and around Hanson to win the flick-on or 2) into the corners for Green to chase onto.  

The problem was that Green wasn't at the races which totally ruled out one option.  The second problem came midway through the second half, around the time they scored (when I thought we were slightly on top) and they put a defender in front and behind Hanson.  Wasn't helped by some poor refereeing but they nullified his threat.  The only way Hanson could work around it was to come deeper, which he did, but that then left no-one in the middle for the crosses.

Second half we switched it up a bit and utilised Ogbu and his unpredictability a lot more.  He's a real enigma and you don't know if he's going to skin a man or fall over his own feet, but he causes problems and I think he's more than strong enough to act as a suitable alternative to Hanson as a direct outlet if we need it.  Disappointed he went off as he looked the one who was most likely to change the game, especially when he got chance to turn and run at them.

The midfield was poor, exception of the excellent Hessenthaler who we really need to look at pinning down on a longer contract.  Whitehouse looked tired and Hewitt isn't half as good in midfield as he is at right-back.  At half-time I wanted to see Cook come into the midfield and operate at the top of it, supporting Hanson in attack.  Felt it needed his energy but also a more attacking mindset.

Wright and Vernam added something when they came on, namely pace and direct running.  Got to get both of them involved more as they will create problems.

At the back Waterfall looked exactly like a guy who hasn't played much and is then asked to play Saturday-Tuesday.  I like Ring's work ethic but I still see nothing in him to suggest he's good enough for this level.  

Ultimately though great character shown to get it back and had Wright managed to escape the last ditch foul or the referee seen the man handling of Davis at the death, could have been a different story altogether.  Colchester will be up there come the end of the season, as will Bradford and FGR.  As a side still finding our feet, it's a decent start I think.


Think thats a pretty spot on summary DHM.
Watching my first game this season on iFollow, I thought Hanson was unbelievable. He won absolutely everything in both boxes, no matter how well marked he was. One of the most dominant target men performances I have seen anywhere, and certainly in a Town shirt. However, only a fairly small number of his flick on or layoffs led to anything. I thought both Green and Ogbu were poor in this regard, and no-one from the midfield made themselves available for knockdowns or ran past for flick ons. Green in particular I was incredibly disappointed with. He offered absolutely nothing all game, and like Mr T and Mr Buckley on the commentary, I was shocked when Ogbu went off instead of Green. With 3 minutes to go I happily had to hold my hand up and say well played Mr Jolley. Ogbu is certainly unpredictable, but has something about him. He makes things happen, even if his decision making is questionable at times.

I thought Ring started ok, great cross we could have scored from early doors, but then did look a bit above his level for the rest of the game. The midfield looked poor, but not helped by having so few options. We seemed set up to play it long so the supporting 2 were heading up to be vaguely near Hanson, rather than providing easier short passing options.

I continue to be so disappointed with Vernam. When we signed him permanently I genuinely thought it was a real coup - signing someone who was probably to good for our level. It must be hard not getting starts, so who knows what he would be like with a run of games, but he made one run to win a corner when he first came on, then was back to his recent self of running straight at the first defender with no hint of skill or pace to be able to get past him.

Cant argue is was a horrible game to watch, nothing to get excited about, nothing entertaining, but you have to be happy with the spirit that gets a point from 2-0 down at half time and a sucker punch at the end of the first half.

I think we need a lot more from Green or a replacement (Max, Vernam?) if we are to have a good season and dont bring in a controlling, creative midfielder. But I actually don't think we are far off. Hanson was great, Ogbu offered something. The workmanlike midfield are solid and would improve massively if given a few more easy options for passes. If the Green position had shown short a few times, collected flick ons a few times, and showed the ability to run at defenders just occasionally and get them turned and win the odd corner and cause a bit of excitement occasionally, I think the whole game would have been different. Time will tell I guess....


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AndyGTFC
August 22, 2019, 10:36am

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First game I’ve watched so far and yeah, Hanson wins everything in the air but if nobody is going to win his flick ins and we’re not getting in good crosses towards him it makes the style of play a bit painful to watch at times.

Definitely need more of a plan B too. With how poor the performance was you’ve gotta be happy with coming back from 2-0 down though!
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Malta_Mariner_90
August 22, 2019, 10:46am
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Quoted from AndyGTFC
First game I’ve watched so far and yeah, Hanson wins everything in the air but if nobody is going to win his flick ins and we’re not getting in good crosses towards him it makes the style of play a bit painful to watch at times.

Definitely need more of a plan B too. With how poor the performance was you’ve gotta be happy with coming back from 2-0 down though!


Exactly this for me, would love to know how many crosses we have put in to Hanson so far over the first 4 games but it it is not enough for sure.

And actual crosses not some long range punt from out wide near the half way line. The Full backs still seem to be being held back by Jolley in terms of getting forward to support and put in the crosses.

Needs to let them have more freedom for me to get forward and get balls in the box. Theoretically if you are playing three in midfield one of them should be able to drop in and cover for the FB when needed. I remember Summerfield used to do that pretty well at times.
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friskneymariner
August 22, 2019, 2:38pm

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Think both Green and Moses need to develop an understanding with Hansen,it will come with time.


Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day,teach a man to fish and you give him an excuse for him to escape from the wife and kids for the weekend and drink lots of beer.
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Rik e B
August 22, 2019, 3:47pm

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If we could pass it about to get into positions to whip a curling ball into the box from an angle it would be better than long punts as Plan A.
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Rik e B
August 22, 2019, 3:48pm

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I grew to love Clay but sorry Nolan a cut above.
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Jarmo.Is.God
August 23, 2019, 8:21am

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MJ has always said he picks his team based on who we are playing.

So if a team has 2 huge CB with a good record of winning stuff in the air, we will try pass it around a lot more.

He obviously felt Hanson would be effective, which he was, but there is still an understanding to gain from the wide 2, and a centre mid to latch onto his knock on's, or knock downs for an attacking CM
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