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Croxton
March 30, 2019, 6:54pm
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After listening to Jolley's interview on the M67 it's clear that he's either told JT not to question the 'system' or JT is being too delicate. Our wing backs hardly ever take on the last defender, simply playing tippy tappy near the touchline or recycling backwards.
Vernam looks to attack the box but has to start from deep. Supply to front men is dire.
Again, the opposition attack the space behind our wing backs requiring CB's to cover. Even with the right players, this system needs forwards and midfield to move with some fluidity. Movement, control and passing were woeful.
JT is giving Jolley an easy ride but at least probed enough to get MJ to say that he may need to be 'ruthless' in deciding who has done enough to be at the club next season.
77O fans deserved much more leadership and commitment today. A certain degree of feeling sorry for ourselves during and after the game.
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gobby
March 30, 2019, 7:04pm

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Why did they interview Jolley on the M67?😂😎
UTMM


The Icenian Predicition League  CHAMPION 2016/17
Beat The Clock Champion 2020/21 🏆 👏

My old man said follow the Town
And dont dilly dally on the way
We'll take Scunny in half a minute
We'll take Lincoln and all thats in it!

One Step Beyond.

                                   


     
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HertsGTFC
March 30, 2019, 7:14pm

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Quoted from Croxton
After listening to Jolley's interview on the M67 it's clear that he's either told JT not to question the 'system' or JT is being too delicate. Our wing backs hardly ever take on the last defender, simply playing tippy tappy near the touchline or recycling backwards.
Vernam looks to attack the box but has to start from deep. Supply to front men is dire.
Again, the opposition attack the space behind our wing backs requiring CB's to cover. Even with the right players, this system needs forwards and midfield to move with some fluidity. Movement, control and passing were woeful.
JT is giving Jolley an easy ride but at least probed enough to get MJ to say that he may need to be 'ruthless' in deciding who has done enough to be at the club next season.
77O fans deserved much more leadership and commitment today. A certain degree of feeling sorry for ourselves during and after the game.


Have you ever know JT give any manager a hard time?


"Crombie you would have got to that if you weren't such a fat ba%$@rd" - George Kerr, inspiration from the dug out 70s style  
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RichMariner
March 30, 2019, 7:17pm
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Yeah, just a really frustrating game to watch. By no means were we awful, but again, by full time we’re dealing with another defeat in which we can’t score.

I guess it’s easy to criticise the system but our strikers are just feeding off scraps. We looked good in possession but lack ideas in the final third.

It’s like we counter or just die a death passing it round while getting nowhere fast.


"Don't shine that light in my face, mate - I've just lost a pint of blood."
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Croxton
March 30, 2019, 7:26pm
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Quoted from HertsGTFC


Have you ever know JT give any manager a hard time?


True enough!
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FishOutOfWater
March 30, 2019, 7:26pm
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We had a good chance to take the lead before their first

We came pretty close on two occasions to getting the equaliser

The only thing that really disappointed me today was the manner they scored their second goal - it looked way too easy (but that was from the view we had of it from the other end of the ground to where it went in )

All in all I’m not too despondent with what I saw. IF ( maybe that should be a big if ) we’d scored from any of the several chances we had, then the outcome could well have been different

Maybe Jolley is a bit too conservative with this style of play but he can’t be taken to task for the players not putting the ball in the net when the opportunity arises

UTM
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horsforthmariner
March 30, 2019, 7:32pm
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Quoted from HertsGTFC


Have you ever know JT give any manager a hard time?


I've heard him give Hurst and Slade a hard time maybe he's giving Jolley some latitude as the matches are now basically friendlies for town
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headingly_mariner
March 30, 2019, 7:37pm

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We are pretty toothless. We try really hard but just lack a bit of star quality throughout our side.
Recently the starting 11 lacks creativity and Vernam should start. I am worried that Ring might not have the quality to be a starting player at this level.

Also I hate Oldham’s keeper, stunning save from Ohman who i had £15 on to score at 40/1  
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Northbank Mariner
March 30, 2019, 7:40pm
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First 44 minutes we actually looked good and made Oldham look nothing more than ordinary, then for some unknown reason Davis and RHJ swapped sides and they started to destroy down us the right flank!!...
Hate to say it but Ring looks nowhere near quick enough to be a wing back, lacks pace and very seldom puts a decent ball into the box(exception with the whipped ball in that cardwell was unlucky not to get a toe on)..
All in all we've better quality in this squad than last season but needs some serious adjustment in midfield to mount a challenge for promotion next season..
And, dare I say this, macca needs to realise his feet aren't glued to the byeline on crosses!!
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arryarryarry
March 30, 2019, 7:40pm
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Quoted from Croxton
After listening to Jolley's interview on the M67 it's clear that he's either told JT not to question the 'system' or JT is being too delicate.
Our wing backs hardly ever take on the last defender, simply playing tippy tappy near the touchline or recycling backwards.
Vernam looks to attack the box but has to start from deep. Supply to front men is dire.


Again, the opposition attack the space behind our wing backs requiring CB's to cover. Even with the right players, this system needs forwards and midfield to move with some fluidity. Movement, control and passing were woeful.
JT is giving Jolley an easy ride but at least probed enough to get MJ to say that he may need to be 'ruthless' in deciding who has done enough to be at the club next season.
77O fans deserved much more leadership and commitment today. A certain degree of feeling sorry for ourselves during and after the game.


I agree especially the highlighted part.

Overall I thought two poor sides and in the second half apart from one flurry in their box we were pretty dreadful.

What worries me about MJ is that he spends far too much time analysing the game and worrying about the opposition rather than letting them worry about us.

Too many players today that need to be replaced for next season, with this current squad I don't think we are anywhere near being play-off contenders.

On our current form we could end up with less points than last season and that would certainly have me questioning whether MJ has got what it takes to manage at this level.
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Hagrid
March 30, 2019, 7:50pm

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Also the worst pies at a football ground bar ours
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denni266
March 30, 2019, 7:53pm

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Quoted from Hagrid
Also the worst pies at a football ground bar ours


Our pasties are not too bad  
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promotion plaice
March 30, 2019, 7:54pm

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Quoted from Croxton

77O fans deserved much more leadership and commitment today. A certain degree of feeling sorry for ourselves during and after the game.


Let's just get that right.......777 fans  



When Leeds trainer Les Cocker was once told Norman Hunter had broken a leg, he asked: “Whose is it?”
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TownSNAFU5
March 30, 2019, 8:02pm
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FishOutOfWater:

You said above:

"All in all I’m not too despondent with what I saw. IF ( maybe that should be a big if ) we’d scored from any of the several chances we had, then the outcome could well have been different."


Well, I would say that IS a big "IF".  
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golfer
March 30, 2019, 8:04pm
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How many times do our midfield players enter the opposing teams penalty area other than for corners or free kicks.  Hessentaller is playing a hell of a lot deeper than he used to. I know he has been one of the better players all season and is evidently playing to instructions but I would now have him playing further up the pitch to give our forwards more support.
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GollyGTFC
March 30, 2019, 8:17pm

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Slade’s final 15 league matches...

W 3 - D 4 - L 8 - F 10 - A 23 - Pts 13

Jolley’s last 15 league matches...

W 4 - D 3 - L 8 - F 11 - A 19 - Pts 15

Discuss...

I’ll start. Jolley is underachieving and results and performances need to improve immediately.
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Northbank Mariner
March 30, 2019, 8:21pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC
Slade’s final 15 league matches...

W 3 - D 4 - L 8 - F 10 - A 23 - Pts 13

Jolley’s last 15 league matches...

W 4 - D 3 - L 8 - F 11 - A 19 - Pts 15

Discuss...

I’ll start. Jolley is underachieving and results and performances need to improve immediately.


Simple, Jolleys record is better which equals improvement!!
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Gaffer58
March 30, 2019, 8:25pm
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Not be to long before someone comes on here and writes" in Jolley we trust".
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Laddy89
March 30, 2019, 8:27pm
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Quite clearly we don’t score enough goals.
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HertsGTFC
March 30, 2019, 8:27pm

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Quoted from arryarryarry


I agree especially the highlighted part.

Overall I thought two poor sides and in the second half apart from one flurry in their box we were pretty dreadful.

What worries me about MJ is that he spends far too much time analysing the game and worrying about the opposition rather than letting them worry about us.

Too many players today that need to be replaced for next season, with this current squad I don't think we are anywhere near being play-off contenders.

On our current form we could end up with less points than last season and that would certainly have me questioning whether MJ has got what it takes to manage at this level.


Agree with you & Croxton, we've player 3-5-2 for a while and actually with the personal involved, in reality 2 holding players and wing backs that don't get in behind we're quite easy to play against with a bit of nous from the opposing manager.    

What I don't get is that the odd time we've played 4-3-3 (Carlisle away) we've created chances and also we have some pace sat on the bench, if things aren't working surely you need to try something different.    

               Macca

Hendrie Ludwig Davis,RHJ

   Hess, Woolley, Clifton

   Rose Thomas Charlie
              


"Crombie you would have got to that if you weren't such a fat ba%$@rd" - George Kerr, inspiration from the dug out 70s style  
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GollyGTFC
March 30, 2019, 8:28pm

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Quoted from Northbank Mariner


Simple, Jolleys record is better which equals improvement!!


Great. So Jolley being slightly less shite than Russell Slade is good enough is it?

I was sat at Oldham today wondering what Jolley has actually done to deserve the adulation he receives. It’s certainly not the football. It’s amazing how far a bit of good PR goes. Oh and not being Russell Slade has helped him too.
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promotion plaice
March 30, 2019, 8:30pm

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Quoted from Gaffer58
Not be to long before someone comes on here and writes" in Jolley we trust".


The jury is still out....six month rolling contract works for both.



When Leeds trainer Les Cocker was once told Norman Hunter had broken a leg, he asked: “Whose is it?”
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Marinerz93
March 30, 2019, 8:30pm

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I thought we were lacking in ideas and our passing is poor. Still waiting for Jolley's pressing and attacking football.


Supporting the Mighty Mariners for over 30 years, home town club is were the heart and soul is and it's great to be a part of it.

Jesus’ disciple Peter, picked up a fish to get the tribute money from it, Jesus left his thumb print on the fish, bless'ed is the Haddock.
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MuddyWaters
March 30, 2019, 8:35pm
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Quoted from Marinerz93
I thought we were lacking in ideas and our passing is poor. Still waiting for Jolley's pressing and attacking football.


Athleticism and pace was what was promised, seems a long time ago.
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Grantley
March 30, 2019, 8:37pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC
Slade’s final 15 league matches...

W 3 - D 4 - L 8 - F 10 - A 23 - Pts 13

Jolley’s last 15 league matches...

W 4 - D 3 - L 8 - F 11 - A 19 - Pts 15

Discuss...

I’ll start. Jolley is underachieving and results and performances need to improve immediately.

15 is an oddly specific number to use...


Jordan Magrew
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MuddyWaters
March 30, 2019, 8:39pm
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Quoted from Grantley

15 is an oddly specific number to use...


What about 16? The number of league games we’ve failed to score in.
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Northbank Mariner
March 30, 2019, 8:40pm
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Quoted from GollyGTFC


Great. So Jolley being slightly less shite than Russell Slade is good enough is it?

I was sat at Oldham today wondering what Jolley has actually done to deserve the adulation he receives. It’s certainly not the football. It’s amazing how far a bit of good PR goes. Oh and not being Russell Slade has helped him too.


Sorry?..little lass shite than Slade??....there's no comparison between the 2!!..we went on a 21 game run of utter dross with a squad if has beens and journeyman under Slade..
Jolley has brought in some quality and  has brought down the average by 4 years!!...
Rome wasn't built in a day and I was there myself today and thought that if the first 44 minutes was anything to go by the futures looking bright, then it all fell apart ..
Given 2 more windows I'll gladly revisit this thread as I do believe he has a way he wants to play and given 4-5 more players we'll reap the rewards and actually get to see the high press, attacking game he speaks off.
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Tommy
March 30, 2019, 8:57pm
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Clifton was ineffective in Embleton's advanced midfield role. Much more suited to a normal midfield role where he can get around the pitch and arrive late in the box.

Don't think we need two sitting midfielders when we've got 3 centre backs. Even if we play the tactic of RHJ bombing forward. One is enough, especially if it is Hessentahler, who can cover ground quickly. 1 deeper with 2 ahead of him, rather than the opposite, would allow us to get an extra player further forward to help us reduce the numerical advantage of the defending team and help us keep and progress possession in areas higher up the pitch.

I think we still suffer from having quite a few players that are decent enough technically, but don't effect games at this level or don't have the physical make-up to be able to use their technical ability to effect a game. These players probably look decent in training and in 5-a-sides, but out on the big pitches against competitive opposition is a different world.

Vernam certainly offered something in the 2nd half but went quiet as the game died out. Just someone who can carry the ball and run at players makes us less predictable. If we dont have any pace or anyone who can run with the ball, the opposition know they can just either let us have the ball in front of them if they're organised, or close us down quick in 1v1s knowing we'll panic and either play a hopeful punt forward or play it back until someone else does. It's no coincidence our best spell of the season came with both Embleton AND Vernam starting in the team.

There's no point us playing Thomas any more I dont think. Even if he's staying, we know what he can do anyway, so give some other partnerships a try. And he's not in great form either.

If it was me, I'd go 4-3-3 the last few games.or if we're insistent on 3 at the back. I'd change it to 3-4-3 with Clifton and Hess in midfield, and Vernam and Rose starting wide of Dennis or even Cardwell who offers a decent target to play to if not a goal threat.


"The greatest mistake you can make in life is to continually be afraid you will make one."
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MuddyWaters
March 30, 2019, 9:02pm
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Quoted from Tommy
Clifton was ineffective in Embleton's advanced midfield role. Much more suited to a normal midfield role where he can get around the pitch and arrive late in the box.

Don't think we need two sitting midfielders when we've got 3 centre backs. Even if we play the tactic of RHJ bombing forward. One is enough, especially if it is Hessentahler, who can cover ground quickly. 1 deeper with 2 ahead of him, rather than the opposite, would allow us to get an extra player further forward to help us reduce the numerical advantage of the defending team and help us keep and progress possession in areas higher up the pitch.

I think we still suffer from having quite a few players that are decent enough technically, but don't effect games at this level or don't have the physical make-up to be able to use their technical ability to effect a game. These players probably look decent in training and in 5-a-sides, but out on the big pitches against competitive opposition is a different world.

Vernam certainly offered something in the 2nd half but went quiet as the game died out. Just someone who can carry the ball and run at players makes us less predictable. If we dont have any pace or anyone who can run with the ball, the opposition know they can just either let us have the ball in front of them if they're organised, or close us down quick in 1v1s knowing we'll panic and either play a hopeful punt forward or play it back until someone else does. It's no coincidence our best spell of the season came with both Embleton AND Vernam starting in the team.

There's no point us playing Thomas any more I dont think. Even if he's staying, we know what he can do anyway, so give some other partnerships a try. And he's not in great form either.

If it was me, I'd go 4-3-3 the last few games.or if we're insistent on 3 at the back. I'd change it to 3-4-3 with Clifton and Hess in midfield, and Vernam and Rose starting wide of Dennis or even Cardwell who offers a decent target to play to if not a goal threat.


I’d give Burrell a go before Cardwell. We know how limited he is already.
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sydney
March 30, 2019, 9:02pm
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Matched them first half and was unlucky to be behind
Second half we where poor and miles behind a cobbled together Oldham side who are in turmoil ( and sometimes don’t get paid for weeks)
Where is our fight?
As soon as games change up a knotch and we need to find extra bite, zip, aggression, we are very much lacking
There fans sang at us today that they where winning 2-0 how excrement must we be !!
Oldham fans we spoke to said we looked clueless in last third
And gave the ball away way to much
I am still yet to be convinced by this current set up (and jeez do I want to be after the last few seasons since Wembley)
But if this is “”It”” then next season will be more of the same
Sad Tonight as u don’t get many games in footie where u can experiment and go for it with youngsters in the mix etc
And we have half a dozen or so
Expected so much more today than I saw
Come on Town!!
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jamesgtfc
March 30, 2019, 9:03pm
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Quoted from Croxton
After listening to Jolley's interview on the M67 it's clear that he's either told JT not to question the 'system' or JT is being too delicate. Our wing backs hardly ever take on the last defender, simply playing tippy tappy near the touchline or recycling backwards.
Vernam looks to attack the box but has to start from deep. Supply to front men is dire.
Again, the opposition attack the space behind our wing backs requiring CB's to cover. Even with the right players, this system needs forwards and midfield to move with some fluidity. Movement, control and passing were woeful.
JT is giving Jolley an easy ride but at least probed enough to get MJ to say that he may need to be 'ruthless' in deciding who has done enough to be at the club next season.
77O fans deserved much more leadership and commitment today. A certain degree of feeling sorry for ourselves during and after the game.


Hendrie has delivered some great crosses from deep so I can see the thinking behind it down the right, particularly if RHJ is overlapping but our weak link is the left hand side. I want to reserve judgement on Ring after a full pre-season but he doesn't look good enough so far. He has played left of a back 3 before so that may be a better position for him.

Currently we seem to be playing a back 5 which is preventing us dominating the midfield. I want to see goals and currently we aren't creating much of note. Davis has played his better football in a back 4 but I would like to see the following given a go:

McKeown
Hendrie Davis Öhman Ring
Hessenthaler
Vernam Clifton Rose
Dennis

I want to see us attacking teams, getting the ball into the box with players arriving late. The pace of Vernam and Rose should cause havoc.

Clifton has the energy to get box to box but Vernam and Rose would ideally provide a link between midfield and attack or as an out ball wide.
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chaos33
March 30, 2019, 9:06pm
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Some good points Tommy. I'm going to be controversial, but Clifton is utterly overrated. Always talk of his 'energy', but where are his assists? Goals? Match winning performances.? Same for Hesenthaler, and Cook, and Embleton and Vernam and so on. They've all done far too little of decisive quality over the season. Not one player with the sort of indisputable stats that Bogle or Amond produced, for example. Too many of our defenders are average too, and we have no dangerous wide players at all. Look at the current squad.....Woolford, Cardwell, Cook, Clifton, Hesenthaler, Grayson, etc....offensively, weak.
If we want to see real progress as a club and team we'll need to do much better in all areas.


"You should do what you love while you can"
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Northbank Mariner
March 30, 2019, 9:15pm
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Quoted from chaos33
Some good points Tommy. I'm going to be controversial, but Clifton is utterly overrated. Always talk of his 'energy', but where are his assists? Goals? Match winning performances.? Same for Hesenthaler, and Cook, and Embleton and Vernam and so on. They've all done far too little of decisive quality over the season. Not one player with the sort of indisputable stats that Bogle or Amond produced, for example. Too many of our defenders are average too, and we have no dangerous wide players at all. Look at the current squad.....Woolford, Cardwell, Cook, Clifton, Hesenthaler, Grayson, etc....offensively, weak.
If we want to see real progress as a club and team we'll need to do much better in all areas.


Disagree completely about Hess, he oozes class and is by far our stand out player, but he's being played too deep at the moment and as for Woolie, he is technically very good but his legs have gone, Clifton is far from overated, if you watched the warm up he pulled up and you could see he'd injured something, he should've been put on the on the bench from the start ..
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MuddyWaters
March 30, 2019, 9:19pm
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Quoted from chaos33
Some good points Tommy. I'm going to be controversial, but Clifton is utterly overrated. Always talk of his 'energy', but where are his assists? Goals? Match winning performances.? Same for Hesenthaler, and Cook, and Embleton and Vernam and so on. They've all done far too little of decisive quality over the season. Not one player with the sort of indisputable stats that Bogle or Amond produced, for example. Too many of our defenders are average too, and we have no dangerous wide players at all. Look at the current squad.....Woolford, Cardwell, Cook, Clifton, Hesenthaler, Grayson, etc....offensively, weak.
If we want to see real progress as a club and team we'll need to do much better in all areas.


In essence I agree. We’ve got too many players that are ‘alright ‘ but very little match winning quality. The only part of the season we looked potent was when Vernam and Embo played alongside Thomas in a 433. Ironically it coincided with a good run of form by Mitch Rose and culminated in good wins against Tranmere and Notts. We scored 9 of our 40 goals in two home wins.
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jamesgtfc
March 30, 2019, 9:25pm
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Quoted from MuddyWaters


In essence I agree. We’ve got too many players that are ‘alright ‘ but very little match winning quality. The only part of the season we looked potent was when Vernam and Embo played alongside Thomas in a 433. Ironically it coincided with a good run of form by Mitch Rose and culminated in good wins against Tranmere and Notts. We scored 9 of our 40 goals in two home wins.


2 games providing a quarter of our goals is disgraceful and further highlights our goalscoring problems.
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chaos33
March 30, 2019, 9:34pm
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Quoted from Northbank Mariner


Disagree completely about Hess, he oozes class and is by far our stand out player, but he's being played too deep at the moment and as for Woolie, he is technically very good but his legs have gone, Clifton is far from overated, if you watched the warm up he pulled up and you could see he'd injured something, he should've been put on the on the bench from the start ..


Hess and Clifton are honest decent pro's, but where are the match saving,match turning or match winning performances? They're just not there. It's ok praising players for having great energy, and covering lots of ground etc, but they have to to affect games. Change games. Win games, with a goal or tackle, or set piece delivery, or free kick etc. Look at the stats for these two and plenty of others and it just hasn't happened. Or if it has, it hasn't happened with any sort of regularity at all.
There's no point in overstating the value of a player's energy, or commitment, or enthusiasm if it doesn't actually affect games. If that was all that mattered, we could stick supporters in the centre of midfield, or up front.

Nobody has really done enough, and that's pretty much indisputable. I think we have players that toil, and are honest and have some other qualities, but we don't have enough (or any) that have shown they can control, turn or boss a game. Nobody who will scare the opposition with their offensive threat. Until we instill that, we are going to be 17th best in L2.


"You should do what you love while you can"
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barralad
March 30, 2019, 9:47pm
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Couldn't be bothered to start the "Just Back" thread but pleased (if that is the right word) that a lot of posters whose views I respect seem to have seen it as I did.
I thought we missed Embleton badly today. There is nobody who has his energy or awareness and, I think he brings/brought out the best in Clifton.
For me the major issue and it simply shouldn't be one is our unfailing ability to pass the ball to someone wearing the same colour shirt with enough consistency. RHJ and the much maligned Ring were most guilty but in all honesty none of them really got to grips with the ball in pretty decent footballing conditions.
When you don't create many chances it puts the ones you miss in much sharper focus. Just our luck to come up against a keeper in really good form. Thomas's diving first half header was superbly touched over the bar and the save from Ohman's header just after we rattled the bar was Maccaesque. Apart from that all we had was Dennis's pass back to the keeper in the one on one and Cardwell's total misjudgement when found with a decent ball not long after he came on. At one point we had Cardwell, Vernam, Thomas, Dennis and Akheem all playing forward but without a hope in hell of anything like service from what was left of the midfield. Cardwell won a couple of headers but there was no-one within ten yards of him to make use of them. Vernam was fired up when he came on and instigated Town's most exciting ten minutes of the ninety but for whatever reason he couldn't maintain it.
The day was summed up by their second goal when possibly the smallest person in the box at the time was given an entirely free header...
It might take some getting used to this "nothing to play for" situation.


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Joseph Joubert.
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HertsGTFC
March 30, 2019, 9:47pm

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I don’t think Clifton is over rated but I just think he’s developing and I’m 100% convinced that if he was playing amongst a bit more dynamism in midfield he’d come on quicker.

MJ did say he uses a lot of data and we do look like a team with decent work rate covering a lot of ground but at the same time one without mid field creativity. This squad lacks balance which is a massive issue considering that MJ is determined to play in a certain shape.

We have a core of “good footballers” we need to add a few more in the summer and a couple “good players” to give us an identity as well as a heartbeat.

The team and the manager are a work in progress within a club that has regressed so if you look at the overall picture it’s better than it has been and only time will tell if it gets as good as we’d all like it to be.

Mid table for a couple of seasons yet I’m afraid but I’m still confident MJ will make us competitive if not dominant.


"Crombie you would have got to that if you weren't such a fat ba%$@rd" - George Kerr, inspiration from the dug out 70s style  
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moosey_club
March 30, 2019, 10:13pm
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Quoted from HertsGTFC
I don’t think Clifton is over rated but I just think he’s developing and I’m 100% convinced that if he was playing amongst a bit more dynamism in midfield he’d come on quicker.

MJ did say he uses a lot of data and we do look like a team with decent work rate covering a lot of ground but at the same time one without mid field creativity. This squad lacks balance which is a massive issue considering that MJ is determined to play in a certain shape.
t.


the only data he needs is in the "goals for" column.
In my perception Kev Drinkell moved about a total of 50 yds in a game, didn't tackle anyone, didnt track back but nobody looks at that data when you are scoring the goals.  
Staring at data can make you blind to the obvious....our strikers arent ruthless enough for the minimal amount of chances they get in a game. Simple.
Solution -  either increase the number of chances ..or improve the quality of the striker.

Thomas wasnt our first choice or probably our second or third ....... we "just missed out" on a huge signing in the Jan window..... Fenty has admitted the budget needs improving ....doesnt take a genius to work out that Jolley faces the same hindrances that other managers have faced, the budget isnt competetive which means we arent a powerhouse when it comes to the open market.
Under Hurst i think we ended up with about the 22nd choice striker one year didnt we ?

Until JF relinquishes the stranglehold on the budget we just wont recruit a stellar striker...therefore Jolley will have to effect the "create more chances" plan if we are to start winning more regularly.


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2022/23LDWDWWDWLLDWWDLLLDLWLLWLWLLWDDLDWWDDDLLWDWLWLW
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2019/20  WDLDWWLDLWWLLLDLDLDLDDWWDLLWDDWWL WLLW - ended
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RichMariner
March 30, 2019, 11:00pm
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I'm really not one for getting involved in discussions about formations and systems and pining for 4-4-2 (or even 4-3-3) but this 3-5-2 we're using at the moment isn't incisive or dynamic enough to unpick the opposition.

I'm aware we've had some good results using it but, really, some of them have been by the odd goal with one piece of quality play - usually a Hendrie cross - being the difference.

I'm a Jolley advocate and I'm by no means suggesting he's seriously under pressure but the bloke has had more than a season in charge and quite honestly we don't look as good as the group of misfits he got firing on all cylinders last season.

The Notts County game in particular stands out for me. They were gunning for automatic promotion and we really gave them a game that day. Matt's winner in injury time was just rewards for our efforts, and those were players that I would say were inferior to what we have now, playing in a bog-standard formation.

It just concerns me that we're almost a year on from that game - and the game when JJ Hooper of all people dismantled Forest Green in their own back yard - and we don't look any better.

If this season finishes with a whimper then Jolley puts himself under a lot of pressure at the start of next season. Because, if we start 19/20 poorly, patience will be thin and he could find himself in trouble by September.

A slow start to next season might be tolerated more if we can finish this season in a bit of form - just as we did last season. The only reason he wasn't sacked in the autumn when we were in the bottom three was because of the way we got out of jail at the end of last season.


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Bigdog
March 30, 2019, 11:44pm
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We have a huge problem in central midfield and we've only got three to choose from for three positions in this formation. Hessenthaler is an above average League Two footballer, Clifton is sometimes above and sometimes below the required level while still developing and Woolford is consistently below the level required. All three as a unit are not a good mix and lack power, pace, physicality and creativity in total output for a midfield three and is well below average for the division. Add to it that we probably have the weakest left hand side in the division as well as the weakest formation for the players available for selection in any squad, then we're not going to win games are we?

As forwards go.. I prefer A Rose, Vernam and Dennis to Thomas, Cook and Cardwell and I think we've got three or four decent young defenders and a decent wing back in Hendrie along with a good keeper in Macca. We're about half way to having a decent team with a huge question mark in whether our board is capable of generating enough income to provide the budget required to secure the services of four or five regular starters that will improve our starting eleven. And I'm sorry to say this.. question marks over whether our manager is the real deal or not.

Oldham are poor and didn't even need to play that well to beat us and that has to be a worry. We definitely weren't second best for large parts of the game today but we often lose out due to deficiencies in key areas. Our points haul this season has masked how many times we've played below average or poorly so often in games and thank god for those games where we've hung in and won points when not playing well.

One more transfer window or season at the most to see if Jolley can deliver this more physical pacy, higher pressing game that he's promised.. and looking forward to seeing if the "takeover when we get to 50 points" is more than a myth because yet again it's been proved that a John Fenty led GTFC can never be better than a bottom third League Two club, so a modest increase in budget next season isn't going to cut it. Any board of GTFC is going to have to come up with a plan to sell 5000 season tickets or put their hands in their pockets to fund a promotion chasing season or else we're going to be saying the same thing April after April or even worse..

Depressing watching this shower of shite at the minute, and most teams that are beating us aren't much better which makes it all the more frustrating..
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The Boys Paddock
March 31, 2019, 12:41am
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Very poor imo today.  We just look so weak and lightweight, and game's are over the minute we go behind.

So little creativity, Ring is nothing more than Sunday league, and Im beginning to think that Jolley is not much better.

Players are capable of good games, but stringing consistent performances together as a team?.

Think the Dennis move has been poor, and poorly handled by Jolly. Be interesting to see if we go for him permanently, but with such lack of creativity he might not want to sign for us anyway.  Done enough to be safe this season. but as to long term progress, its really minimal.  there is certainly no way this current squad will challenge at the top end of the league, and given there all virtually Jolley's players, this is deeply worrying.  

Will give Jolley 10 games into next season, but if no improvement then he should be sacked.
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arryarryarry
March 31, 2019, 12:42am
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Quoted from Bigdog


We have a huge problem in central midfield and we've only got three to choose from for three positions in this formation. Hessenthaler is an above average League Two footballer, Clifton is sometimes and sometimes below the required level while still developing and Woolford is consistently below the level required. All three as a unit are not a good mix and lack power, pace, physicality and creativity in total output for a midfield three and is well below average for the division. Add to it that we probably have the weakest left hand side in the division as well as the weakest formation for the players available for selection in any squad, then we're not going to win games are we?

..


I'm sorry but I don't think he is, doesn't create much and certainly doesn't help stop poor teams scoring against us.
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promotion plaice
March 31, 2019, 12:43am

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Quoted from Bigdog
We have a huge problem in central midfield and we've only got three to choose from for three positions in this formation. Hessenthaler is an above average League Two footballer, Clifton is sometimes and sometimes below the required level while still developing and Woolford is consistently below the level required. All three as a unit are not a good mix and lack power, pace, physicality and creativity in total output for a midfield three and is well below average for the division. Add to it that we probably have the weakest left hand side in the division as well as the weakest formation for the players available for selection in any squad, then we're not going to win games are we?

As forwards go.. I prefer A Rose, Vernam and Dennis to Thomas, Cook and Cardwell and I think we've got three or four decent young defenders and a decent wing back in Hendrie along with a good keeper in Macca. We're about half way to having a decent team with a huge question mark in whether our board is capable of generating enough income to provide the budget required to secure the services of four or five regular starters that will improve our starting eleven. And I'm sorry to say this.. question marks over whether our manager is the real deal or not.

Oldham are poor and didn't even need to play that well to beat us and that has to be a worry. We definitely weren't second best for large parts of the game today but we often lose out due to deficiencies in key areas. Our points haul this season has masked how many times we've played below average or poorly so often in games and thank god for those games where we've hung in and won points when not playing well.

One more transfer window or season at the most to see if Jolley can deliver this more physical pacy, higher pressing game that he's promised.. and looking forward to seeing if the "takeover when we get to 50 points" is more than a myth because yet again it's been proved that a John Fenty led GTFC can never be better than a bottom third League Two club, so a modest increase in budget next season isn't going to cut it. Any board of GTFC is going to have to come up with a plan to sell 5000 season tickets or put their hands in their pockets to fund a promotion chasing season or else we're going to be saying the same thing April after April or even worse..

Depressing watching this shower of shite at the minute, and most teams that are beating us aren't much better which makes it all the more frustrating..


Excellent post as usual.......the truth hurts.



When Leeds trainer Les Cocker was once told Norman Hunter had broken a leg, he asked: “Whose is it?”
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chaos33
March 31, 2019, 2:34am
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Yep Bigdog has it spot on.


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hheh2
March 31, 2019, 4:22am
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                            Macca
Hendrie       Davis        Öhman          Ring
                     Hess         Clifton
Rose                   Dennis                    Vernam
                           Thomas


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MuddyWaters
March 31, 2019, 8:00am
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Quoted from hheh2
                            Macca
Hendrie       Davis        Öhman          Ring
                     Hess         Clifton
Rose                   Dennis                    Vernam
                           Thomas


I think you've got to play RHJ & Hendrie as full backs - Ring simply isn't good enough.
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Vance Warner
March 31, 2019, 8:22am
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Quoted from MuddyWaters


In essence I agree. We’ve got too many players that are ‘alright ‘ but very little match winning quality. The only part of the season we looked potent was when Vernam and Embo played alongside Thomas in a 433. Ironically it coincided with a good run of form by Mitch Rose and culminated in good wins against Tranmere and Notts. We scored 9 of our 40 goals in two home wins.


Hardly surprising given the budget that Jolley is working with.
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golfer
March 31, 2019, 9:31am
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I think we have got worse down the left since JJ Hooper left,and that's saying something.
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Bigdog
March 31, 2019, 9:41am
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Quoted from golfer
I think we have got worse down the left since JJ Hooper left,and that's saying something.


It's a sorry list of players who have played there since Danny Andrew left. Fox was ok but probably just about competent at best, DJ was learning his trade and forever in and out of the side, Dixon, Hooper, Woolford, Ring, Kelly..
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Maringer
March 31, 2019, 10:01am
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I don't think RHJ is good enough at full-back, personally. He seems to do decently as one of a back three as he's quickish and quite strong, but I'm not convinced by his positioning as full-back.
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MuddyWaters
March 31, 2019, 10:11am
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Quoted from Maringer
I don't think RHJ is good enough at full-back, personally. He seems to do decently as one of a back three as he's quickish and quite strong, but I'm not convinced by his positioning as full-back.


I'm not convinced either but RHJ right back & Hendrie left is a better option that Hendrie right and Ring left IMHO.
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Lincoln Mariner 56
March 31, 2019, 10:42am
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Think we kid ourselves on the prospective quality of our forwards as yet to be convinced by any of them. Do not understand giving Cardwell an extended contract as clearly not good enough, Cook tries hard but that alone is not sufficient to be a regular starter, Thomas has a reasonable goal return but whilst he will chase a few lost causes not a player who holds up the ball and yet to see him form any kind of relationship with a fellow striker or even the midfield. Vernam has bags of ability butI have commented more than once he appears to have really good twenty minute spells than completely disappears from the game. Ahkeem has some good pace and control but I have seen nothing to make me believe he is a serious scorer of goals. Early days for him and he could well be an excellent strike partner who scores around ten to twelve a year which is fine if we get a proven striker.

Add to this a need for at least three new midfield players, Whitehouse may be one, plus a left sided player and the building job is still pretty major IMO.

Agree with others that MJ is too big on the alleged quality of the opposition, reminds me of PH to be honest, and needs to focus more on town and making other teams worry about us.
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hheh2
April 1, 2019, 9:50am
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A summer transfer window to reassess our qualities and build on our squad. We may not be lighting up the league at the end of the season but at least we're not in the position of last season.


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arryarryarry
April 1, 2019, 9:54am
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Quoted from hheh2
A summer transfer window to reassess our qualities and build on our squad. We may not be lighting up the league at the end of the season but at least we're not in the position of last season.


Isn't that what he did last summer?
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louth_in_the_south
April 1, 2019, 10:16am

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I’m sure the managers can see where our deficiencies are and are already actively seeking replacements. They are ambitious forward thinking blokes who are relying on being successful here to further their careers so I’m not too worried about our performances now we’re safe . They were always going to need 2or 3 windows at least to turn things round . I think some people expect miracles over night but tbf to fenty he wasn’t going to be able to make a huge war chest available straight away as the books have to be balanced at the end of the day - hence it’s going to take a while to see the success we all want .
I’m looking forward to this summer as I can see some decent players coming in mixed with the young kids such as max wright and rose coming into the picture more .

*im basing a lot of the above on blind optimism


Lower F5
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Mariner Timsky
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Quoted from louth_in_the_south
I’m sure the managers can see where our deficiencies are and are already actively seeking replacements. They are ambitious forward thinking blokes who are relying on being successful here to further their careers so I’m not too worried about our performances now we’re safe . They were always going to need 2or 3 windows at least to turn things round . I think some people expect miracles over night but tbf to fenty he wasn’t going to be able to make a huge war chest available straight away as the books have to be balanced at the end of the day - hence it’s going to take a while to see the success we all want .
I’m looking forward to this summer as I can see some decent players coming in mixed with the young kids such as max wright and rose coming into the picture more .

*im basing a lot of the above on blind optimism


Did you hear about the blind optimistic funambulist??



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RichMariner
April 1, 2019, 12:58pm
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Let's not forget that Jolley is learning his trade. We knew what we were getting when we appointed him manager because he came with very little first-team management experience.

Now that he's almost got a full season under his belt, I reckon he'll know more about the club, the league and the overall conditions required to be a successful manager at this level than he did this time last year.

Whether he can implement this knowledge and make changes for the better will soon become clear.

One thing I will say is that Scott and Hurst didn't really achieve much in their first full season. They signed what was to be the backbone of our side for the next few years in McKeown, Pearson and Disley (plus Hearn, who'd have been great had his injury not ruined his time here). We finished 11th in 2011/12 and looked short of being a side that could push for promotion.

I think we're having that season. Jolley has probably tried and tested a lot of things since last summer (while keeping us clear of relegation). He's slowly cleared the clutter away, and I expect a few more will leave in May.

For me, he needs to bring in players who have games under their belt. The likes of Robles, Welsh and, dare I say, Cook haven't worked out because they just hadn't played enough games in the seasons before they joined us.


"Don't shine that light in my face, mate - I've just lost a pint of blood."
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