Ins and outs

Quoted from jimgtfc

There’s plenty of movement of strikers in the leagues above like Scott Hogan going to Sheffield United and Leon Clarke leaving to go to Wigan in the Championship, League one Walsall have loaned a QPR striker and Rochdale have got Rekeil Pike who was on loan at Wrexham. It’s likely that deals trigger other deals in a housing chain sort of way. Sadly we’re bottom of the food chain and may have to wait until the last minute tomorrow to get anyone if at all.

Sobering thought that we have to wait our turn until Walsall and Rochdale get their bits of business done..

Quoted from Bigdog

Sobering thought that we have to wait our turn until Walsall and Rochdale get their bits of business done..

But here's one piece of business news

https://www.humberbusiness.com.....y-11303-detail/story

Quoted from Bigdog

Sobering thought that we have to wait our turn until Walsall and Rochdale get their bits of business done..

Why? Football has been very cyclic for quite a time now , with some clubs having purple patches and others barren years. It was exactly 30 years last June that AB was appointed manager for his first spell. The previous season we had finished 3rd from bottom of the old third division and were relegated to the level we are at now. The club was on a real low and certainly no Chairman or Directors throwing cash to prop the club up. I don't think we were a particularly great attraction for getting new signings and AB brought in 7 players from non-league or free transfers. I recall a lot of the comments at the time " he is bringing in non-league players because the club is preparing for non-league football "! We had a shoe string budget then but AB had a vision of how he wanted to play and the kind of players he needed to achieve that. It wasn't all plain sailing and that first season wasn't great but progress was being made. MJ is very similar in his approach to AB - he knows how he wants his team to play and is slowly assembling the kind of players needed to achieve that. Whether MJ is as successful as AB remains to be seen but he could just do that. A few interesting stats from that first AB season. At this stage of the season( end of January ) we had played 21 games and amassed 24 points ie 1.14 points /game. This season we have played 30 games and amassed 37 points ie 1.23 points/game. The club's attendances were very poor with only 2,889 turning out for the first home league game to Torquay. In fact we had to wait until January 2 ( home to Colchester ) before the gate exceeded 4,000. As a final point about that season , 1988/89 , of the 24 clubs in Division 4 , 11 are now non-league. Now that is a sobering thought!

Quoted from rancido

Why? Football has been very cyclic for quite a time now , with some clubs having purple patches and others barren years. It was exactly 30 years last June that AB was appointed manager for his first spell. The previous season we had finished 3rd from bottom of the old third division and were relegated to the level we are at now. The club was on a real low and certainly no Chairman or Directors throwing cash to prop the club up. I don't think we were a particularly great attraction for getting new signings and AB brought in 7 players from non-league or free transfers. I recall a lot of the comments at the time " he is bringing in non-league players because the club is preparing for non-league football "! We had a shoe string budget then but AB had a vision of how he wanted to play and the kind of players he needed to achieve that. It wasn't all plain sailing and that first season wasn't great but progress was being made. MJ is very similar in his approach to AB - he knows how he wants his team to play and is slowly assembling the kind of players needed to achieve that. Whether MJ is as successful as AB remains to be seen but he could just do that. A few interesting stats from that first AB season. At this stage of the season( end of January ) we had played 21 games and amassed 24 points ie 1.14 points /game. This season we have played 30 games and amassed 37 points ie 1.23 points/game. The club's attendances were very poor with only 2,889 turning out for the first home league game to Torquay. In fact we had to wait until January 2 ( home to Colchester ) before the gate exceeded 4,000. As a final point about that season , 1988/89 , of the 24 clubs in Division 4 , 11 are now non-league. Now that is a sobering thought!

I don't disagree with your analysis using a single snapshot in time and your hopefulness that MJ will replicate what AB did. We could also take many other snapshots in time that provide very different facts and figures to prove points too. But we are where we are, some fans saying it's ok because it's comparable to the very few times in my lifetime that we were at our lowest ebb. Let's all keep giving ourselves doses of reality and wake up every morning and thank our lucky stars we're not Stockport. Always comparing ourselves downwards never comparing ourselves upwards. My point still remains, it's a sobering thought that we have to wait our turn behind Walsall and Rochdale and have done so for a cycle that's lasted nearly half my supporting lifetime. Doesn't seem very cyclical to me as it spans nearly one seventh of the club's history. These footballing cycles now seem to last a lot longer at the end of the A180.

Twenty years ago our average historical position for final position standings in the football pyramid was 49th, it's now 65th. So that's a net figure of 16 clubs that have gone above us in that table. That's a net figure so it accounts for all of the clubs that have fallen from grace too. So taking into account the current administration's performance we have to compare to the 49th position surely? And the average historical final position of the current administration's tenure is more likely to be not far off 90th, nowhere near as high as the 65th let alone the 49th average that all the other administrations had achieved between them in the rest of the club's history  The drop from 49th and operating at an average of nearly 40 places lower has been down to them. The sick thing is that if we continue performing as we are, our historical position will drop further and further and some time in the future we could end up with the administration using the statistics to say, well we're not far from the then historical position anyway, yet they had overseen the drop from 49th themselves. Facts, figures and statistics can be used in many ways to prove points that the user wants to make..

Quoted from ginnywings

Not a Main Stander just yet. Still have my own hair and teeth.

they have their teeth...they just keep them in their pocket instead  

Quoted from moosey_club

they have their teeth...they just keep them in their pocket instead  

Some of us don’t!  

Quoted from ginnywings

Easily offended, old folk. Mind you, it's the big 6-0 for me in August, just in time for the new season, so i should accept my fate, and join the Werthers posse.

In days gone by you would have got yourself a tartan rug and matching flask. Times have moved on, with breathable, thin thermals and banned flasks.

Another point to add to the incomings and outgoings is the emergence of A.Rose and Pollock.  Whilst Rose is on a professional contract and was at the start of the season, he has since moved up the pecking order.  In the case of Pollock, he wouldn't have been considered for a first team place back in August, but has since moved on and probably taken the place of Famewo in terms of numbers at the back.

I know there's a big desire for signings galore in the transfer windows but I don't think we need that much.  We definitely needed a dominant centre-back and add a bit more height, which we've done with Ohman.  With the departure of Dixon and pending departure of Fox, the move to bring Ring in was essential - I think it's probably fair to say it was also a look to up the quality too.  

In terms of further up field, I think it's more important that we get another creative influence in the side than an actual goalscorer.  Thomas has shown he's got goals in him and when Vernam's had a run in the side and up top, he's not done too badly in front of goal.  But at the minute we're just not creating chances, especially if Embleton isn't available or is marked out the game.  I also get the impression that Jolley is keen on having goals spread throughout the side rather than an all eggs in one basket approach.

Quoted from diehardmariner

  I also get the impression that Jolley is keen on having goals spread throughout the side rather than an all eggs in one basket approach.

All managers say that, especially ones who do not have a potent strike force up front.

It looks doubtful we are going to be ambitious this window so I hope Rose is going to get more game time and Jolley will settle into a system that allows him to play. His pace could be what we are looking for.

Quoted from Bigdog

I don't disagree with your analysis using a single snapshot in time and your hopefulness that MJ will replicate what AB did. We could also take many other snapshots in time that provide very different facts and figures to prove points too. But we are where we are, some fans saying it's ok because it's comparable to the very few times in my lifetime that we were at our lowest ebb. Let's all keep giving ourselves doses of reality and wake up every morning and thank our lucky stars we're not Stockport. Always comparing ourselves downwards never comparing ourselves upwards. My point still remains, it's a sobering thought that we have to wait our turn behind Walsall and Rochdale and have done so for a cycle that's lasted nearly half my supporting lifetime. Doesn't seem very cyclical to me as it spans nearly one seventh of the club's history. These footballing cycles now seem to last a lot longer at the end of the A180.

Twenty years ago our average historical position for final position standings in the football pyramid was 49th, it's now 65th. So that's a net figure of 16 clubs that have gone above us in that table. That's a net figure so it accounts for all of the clubs that have fallen from grace too. So taking into account the current administration's performance we have to compare to the 49th position surely? And the average historical final position of the current administration's tenure is more likely to be not far off 90th, nowhere near as high as the 65th let alone the 49th average that all the other administrations had achieved between them in the rest of the club's history  The drop from 49th and operating at an average of nearly 40 places lower has been down to them. The sick thing is that if we continue performing as we are, our historical position will drop further and further and some time in the future we could end up with the administration using the statistics to say, well we're not far from the then historical position anyway, yet they had overseen the drop from 49th themselves. Facts, figures and statistics can be used in many ways to prove points that the user wants to make..

As you say , I was using a snapshot in time, but that was just to compare what AB achieved to what MJ could achieve ,seeing as the club was in similar situations on both occasions. Also, like you say, facts , figures and statistics can be used and interpreted in many ways. You have also taken a snapshot in time comparing the club's current administration's historical performance to it's historical performance for the whole period prior to 20 years ago. Hardly a fair comparison. During my time watching town I have seen the club at FL level 2 for 18 seasons, level 3 for 12 seasons, level 4 for 15 and non-league for 5 (?) so I also have witnessed many ups and downs. It's easy to quote our " historical final league position" but surely you must admit the whole dynamic of football, especially financially, has altered dramatically in the last 50 years and especially since the Premiersh*t was formed.
I do find your comparison to Rochdale and Walsall , condescending and with more than a hint of the " billy big boll*x " attitude. Both these clubs play in a level higher than us so would be both financially and career wise a more attractive option. They are also in close proximity to very large cities and such are more attractive places to live. I know a lot of posters poo poo this point but for any young single footballer or even a married one with a young family, close proximity to all the advantages a large city has can be a very compelling decision as to what club they sign for.