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Dear Mr Fenty

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diehardmariner
November 5, 2018, 1:48pm
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Quoted from KingstonMariner


We've got about the 8th best attendances in League 2, yet we're constantly at the bottom end of the division. The situation was similar in the seasons before we got relegated in 2010. We don't need anyone to splash the cash. We need someone to run the club on a much better basis, someone who doesn't alienate all and sundry, someone capable of bringing people together. Crowds will rise. Income will rise. More people will be willing to become engaged in the club.


This sums it up excellently.  

We need to move away from this fear that the club is propped up by the millions and millions of John Fenty.

If I read it correctly, he actually took money out of the club according to the last set of published accounts.  

Accrington and Wycombe were promoted last season.  Collectively they don't have a pot to urine in, but they're run in the right manner.
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drbell
November 5, 2018, 2:16pm
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Quoted from diehardmariner


This sums it up excellently.  

We need to move away from this fear that the club is propped up by the millions and millions of John Fenty.

If I read it correctly, he actually took money out of the club according to the last set of published accounts.  

Accrington and Wycombe were promoted last season.  Collectively they don't have a pot to urine in, but they're run in the right manner.


FWIW, Im really not trying to defend Mr Fenty, just get my head around the situation.
Do we know what our gate receipts less expenditure are? 8th highest attendance doesn't imply we have 8ths highest income if we charge less than most, or if Blundell Park costs a lot more to maintain/run on match day.

Even if we do have the 8th highest income, is it really mostly Mr Fenty's fault if we fail to perform. I don't believe we recruited on the cheap (at least this time around). We appointed a manager that most were pleased with. Recent signings such as Welsh, Hessenthaler wouldn't have come cheap I don't believe. We have given out much longer contracts this time round. It could be argued that Mr Fenty/the board are doing roughly the right things, so now we have to hold tight and see if the manager and players are up to the task.
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ginnywings
November 5, 2018, 2:37pm

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Speculate to accumulate doesn't mean just throwing money at a situation. One has to invest to recoup. I did this in a very small way when i decided i no longer wanted to get up at 7am and go to someone's house/building site to practice my work of being a joiner. I instead invested in a workshop, which was kitted out with the best equipment i could afford, and i now make stuff for a couple of customers on a semi regular basis. In fact, one of my customers has just left with £2000 worth of goods i made for her. It took a while and some effort, but i am now reaping the rewards of my outlay.

In footballing terms, if you speculate on players with potential (Bogle, Dembele) and sell them on for a tidy profit, or you pay better wages to attract a better standard of player, this can lead to better results on the pitch, which in turn brings in more fans and more income. Why wasn't some of the Bogle money invested in the next Bogle? Clubs such as Peterborough for instance have had much success with this model.

Having said all that, sometimes an organisation just needs a change to freshen things up; even successful ones get stale in time and need a fresh pair of eyes and approach. It can be very easy to just do what you have always done, and i think this has what has happened at BP. We are not in the financial mire that some clubs find themselves in and to be fair, the board have to get some praise for that, but the whole club is stale and more likely to go backwards than it is forwards, simply because other clubs are doing better with similar resources and leapfrogging ahead of us. You can't tread water in sport, because you get left behind. Fans are becoming fed up of the same old same old, and have been incredibly patient and loyal to this point, but i feel that there needs to be a change as it's starting to wear thin now, with once loyal fans like my brother giving up. I admit that i am not far behind him and finding it increasingly difficult to drag myself to BP for another boring game that we are more likely to lose than win.

I also don't get why people keep saying there is no one else who could possibly take over and put money into the club, when no-one ( other than the fans) are putting any money into the club now. All the present board are doing is deciding where and how the income from fans pockets is spent. There is the issue of the benign loans, but can someone tell me who owes what to whom? JF took over the club and is the de facto owner/chairman, so it could be argued that he simply owes money to himself. To my mind, no one person can own a football club that has been around for 140 years, with several custodians along the way that took it upon themselves to get involved in the running of said club in whatever way they saw fit, be it financial or not. Football clubs are not like a normal business, and you are taking on the hopes and fears of a generation of supporters, past, present and hopefully future. No amount of money "invested" gives any one person the right to say that they "own" something which is more of a way of life than it is a business. One person (JF) can give a lot of money, or many people (the fans) can give a little money. It all adds up to the same thing in the end. Only difference is that he gets to call the shots and we have to accept it. Upshot is that we have invested more money than he has over the years, yet somehow, we are the villains and he is the saviour of the club.  
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Cloudy
November 5, 2018, 2:55pm
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As drbell  points out, I dont see us getting a wealthty local benefactor with the best interests in the club at heart, anytime soon.
To be frank I dont think we need one (it would be nice if a rich local was prepared to bank roll the club mind ) provided we set out our stall correctly.

With open dialogue I am convinced we can make a better fist of what we have at present. No money has been put into the club for years by Mr Fenty, day to day we do ok. Our debt to JSF is historic but, rightly or wrongly, gives him total and utter control over everything to do with our football club.
By and large we 'wash our face' financially so, if we arent getting investment what do we do?

We try much more harder to increase our income. At present the club are in a rut, have been for years. I received the clubshop christmas catalogue recently. They could have changed the date and sent out the one from 2002. Nothing changes.
On the corporate side the numbers in McMenemys on a match day is dwiddling weekly. Why? Possibly because the same companies are asked to sponsor games each season, ones who have done so for years. What efforts have been made to try and get new sponsors on board, those connected to renewables for example? I arent saying we should be asking them to buy the club but get them to take a table or two for lunch, invite some of their contacts, as a bare minimum you are refreshing things and who knows what may become of such initiatives?

Then communicate with the supporters, tell us the issues we face, tell us where we sit budget wise, ask for ideas to increase the income, ask them openly to get to a game or two. Make an offer for buy 4 tickets for the price of 3 throughout Dec and Jan, market it as a Christmas gift idea, get kids in schools more involved, which school can sell the most tickets? Prize to the winning school of a full training session held with the school teams and Town players, get the girls involved more (girls section of a supporters club/an under 12's supporters club) There are enough people who love GTFC who could come up with better ideas than I. Brainstorm it, an initiative of the week prize? The one with the best scheme or idea gets free shirts/merchandise.

Income could be increased but it needs drive and enthusiasm the likes of which hasnt been near GTFC for decades

Sadly and frustratingly we all know nothing will change, the whole club is tired and repetitive, no new ideas, no communication just JF sat in his tower looking down on us all looking for the next person to blame, 'woe is me', they dont understand!
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drbell
November 5, 2018, 3:22pm
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Hard to argue with a lot of that Cloudy. Can see an argument for a change being good, but still needs to be a change to someone or something. I don't see a queue of volunteers, thats the issue. This would be a very different debate if we were picking between Fenty and an alternative. I maintain it has to be a change to someone/something with a high chance of being better, or at the very least no worse.

Its been great seeing MJ and the players out in the community, but no argument there is so much more that could be done. My suggestion, just get the ground full from the schools, colleges, scouts, brownies, local forces, etc . If we are going to have 3000 empty seats, get get 1000+ school kids/youths each with a family member to come for free for a couple of games. Then give them 1/2 price for a couple of games.

And for goodness sake, we are Grimsby of fish and chips fame, why aren't there fish and chip shops in each part of the ground. Who could resist the smell of decent haddock and chips as the smell wafted by.

It would really help to be be more approachable to the community and to fans willing able to help - someone on the board or employed by GTFC responding to a twitter account or a suggestions forum for example, permanently, not just a one off.

Similarly agree about the shop. I'd love to buy more stuff for me and the family, but there isn't much choice. That said, I guess its hard to offer lots of choice when there is a fairly limited market.
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jock dock tower
November 5, 2018, 3:52pm
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Having looked at the question of why we haven't done any better on the pitch I thought it would be interesting to see how others have done who have also come up during the last five seasons.

Barnet - back into the National League

Grimsby, Cheltenham, Cambridge and Macclesfield currently occupying four out of the bottom six slots in Division Two.

Lincoln, Forest Green and Tranmere all appear to have a good chance of getting promoted this season.

Bristol Rovers and Luton currently in Division One.

Clearly, if a club is well run - or has the finances -  the impetus of carrying on the form that sees clubs getting promoted works for exactly half of those clubs, whilst the others are currently struggling. The disparity is enormous. Cambridge get reasonable attendances as do ourselves. Macclesfield. Cheltenham and Barnet struggle to reach 2,000 so their plight is perhaps easier to understand.

Had we held onto the squad that saw us come up I think most of us believe that we would now be at least mid table Division One. The fact that that team, and the management side of things were allowed to go was down to the direction of the Board, nobody else. Whatever they've done this year with extended contracts, and signing potentially good players for MJ, belies their earlier errors. We are where we are because of them, and the guy in charge, JF.


No attempt at ethical or social seduction can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred of the Tory party. So far as I'm concerned they're lower than vermin. Aneurin Bevan.
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Cloudy
November 5, 2018, 3:55pm
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Quoted from jock dock tower
Having looked at the question of why we haven't done any better on the pitch I thought it would be interesting to see how others have done who have also come up during the last five seasons.

Barnet - back into the National League

Grimsby, Cheltenham, Cambridge and Macclesfield currently occupying four out of the bottom six slots in Division Two.

Lincoln, Forest Green and Tranmere all appear to have a good chance of getting promoted this season.

Bristol Rovers and Luton currently in Division One.

Clearly, if a club is well run - or has the finances -  the impetus of carrying on the form that sees clubs getting promoted works for exactly half of those clubs, whilst the others are currently struggling. The disparity is enormous. Cambridge get reasonable attendances as do ourselves. Macclesfield. Cheltenham and Barnet struggle to reach 2,000 so their plight is perhaps easier to understand.

Had we held onto the squad that saw us come up I think most of us believe that we would now be at least mid table Division One
[b][/b]. The fact that that team, and the management side of things were allowed to go was down to the direction of the Board, nobody else. Whatever they've done this year with extended contracts, and signing potentially good players for MJ, belies their earlier errors. We are where we are because of them, and the guy in charge, JF.



REALLY???
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grimsby pete
November 5, 2018, 4:12pm

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If we had a forward thinking board they would have capitalized on the feel good factor,

They would have given Hurst what was promised to him and he would have stayed,

We might have got another promotion or Wembley appearance and the gates would have gone up just like Lincolns have,

Hurst would have had more money to spend.

BUT

That did not happen did it ?

No one to blame apart from one man.


                             Over 36 years living in Suffolk but always a mariner.
                             68 Years following the Town

                              Life member of Trust

                               First game   April 1955
                               
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Ipswin
November 5, 2018, 4:12pm
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Quoted from KingstonMariner

We don't need anyone to splash the cash..


So why is every fornicator bitching and moaning that once again we have bought players on the cheap due to lack of funds and that Fenty hasn't put any money in lately

I think a huge cash investment would be a great start, we sure as hell will never raise enough money through attendances to sign anyone other than our current level of player



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Bigdog
November 5, 2018, 4:22pm
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Quoted from Cloudy
As drbell  points out, I dont see us getting a wealthty local benefactor with the best interests in the club at heart, anytime soon.
To be frank I dont think we need one (it would be nice if a rich local was prepared to bank roll the club mind ) provided we set out our stall correctly.

With open dialogue I am convinced we can make a better fist of what we have at present. No money has been put into the club for years by Mr Fenty, day to day we do ok. Our debt to JSF is historic but, rightly or wrongly, gives him total and utter control over everything to do with our football club.
By and large we 'wash our face' financially so, if we arent getting investment what do we do?

We try much more harder to increase our income. At present the club are in a rut, have been for years. I received the clubshop christmas catalogue recently. They could have changed the date and sent out the one from 2002. Nothing changes.
On the corporate side the numbers in McMenemys on a match day is dwiddling weekly. Why? Possibly because the same companies are asked to sponsor games each season, ones who have done so for years. What efforts have been made to try and get new sponsors on board, those connected to renewables for example? I arent saying we should be asking them to buy the club but get them to take a table or two for lunch, invite some of their contacts, as a bare minimum you are refreshing things and who knows what may become of such initiatives?

Then communicate with the supporters, tell us the issues we face, tell us where we sit budget wise, ask for ideas to increase the income, ask them openly to get to a game or two. Make an offer for buy 4 tickets for the price of 3 throughout Dec and Jan, market it as a Christmas gift idea, get kids in schools more involved, which school can sell the most tickets? Prize to the winning school of a full training session held with the school teams and Town players, get the girls involved more (girls section of a supporters club/an under 12's supporters club) There are enough people who love GTFC who could come up with better ideas than I. Brainstorm it, an initiative of the week prize? The one with the best scheme or idea gets free shirts/merchandise.

Income could be increased but it needs drive and enthusiasm the likes of which hasnt been near GTFC for decades

Sadly and frustratingly we all know nothing will change, the whole club is tired and repetitive, no new ideas, no communication just JF sat in his tower looking down on us all looking for the next person to blame, 'woe is me', they dont understand!


There's a lot of sense in this post Cloudy but I feel it is flawed by several points of cold economic reality that make its sentiments a pipe dream. I agree that there is a very slim chance of a local wealthy benefactor and an even slimmer chance of an outside investor because who the heck would know that Fenty wants out outside the confines of BP and a diminishing fanbase?

Secondly, I don't think there's the will for any kind of local fan led organisation to carry out any of the laudable small improvements that you've set out in your posts. Apathy has already well and truly set in. It will be proven by the numbers we take to Mansfield tomorrow night and other home and away followings throughout the season.

Thirdly, even if a local fan led organisation did take over, without a substantial injection of cash, how much more could it realistically achieve than the status quo? Higher up in League Two? The odd promotion to League One every decade or so? I wouldn't even write off a drop into non-league again. Because, as the years go by, the clubs who already haven't had a significant benefactor will get one and one by one they will pass us however hard that fan led organisation works. This is the reality of modern day football and if we don't get with the program, whoever leads this club without significant investment will eventually lead it to a slow death.

I take no enjoyment in writing these words at all and it stinks that we're in an unfashionable part of the country with an unfashionable owner who won't openly put up the club for sale to a publicly wider audience than the three thousand diehards that are left. We have a fanbase who are generally inward looking although with very laudable ideals and even though the ideas you have written about come from a good place and carry a lot of credence, when I read them it seemed to me to be a list of futile efforts like pushing snow up a hill if measured against other clubs' advances over a long period of time.

If it were a fan led takeover to make the improvements you laid out to make the club more attractive for significant investment I'd buy into that. If a fan led group did the club's marketing for them to try and attract a benefactor from somewhere in the world I'd buy into that too. But long term, for our club to survive, compete and actually excite and engage the lost thousands across NE Lincs we've got to hold our breath and be prepared to accept that we need to take a massive step up sooner rather than later. Anything less and all that would be achieved would be a frittering around the edges while in the next five, ten or twenty years other clubs in our position will either pass us by on the way up or fall by the wayside along with us to make way for the Salfords of this world. It's alright a few diehards having a dream or two about fan led engagement but it would be a virtually impossible model to deliver in the real world in my opinion. Like I said,  I don't like what I'm writing but taking a macroeconomic view, I believe I'm being realistic about what needs to be done for our club to be anything significantly better than it is now in five, ten or twenty years time..
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