Does Anybody Believe MJ Can Turn This Around.

If he managed it which ido not think he can it would be the biggest turnaround the club has ever seen,

Biggest turnaround since lat season you mean?

I reckon he just loves a relegation scrap. It's all he's ever known as a manager.

Of course he can. We aren't even 1/4 of the way through the flippin season!

I Certainly Hope He Can But I Can't See It Starting Tomorrow

I believe I can fly

Honestly, no I don't think he can, last year he had a bunch of lads who he didn't know and who didn't know him and were so sick of hoofball under slade I'm not convinced humpty dumpty couldn't have turned it around..plus I'm not sure he has the right man at his side in limbrick.
I do wonder how much losing Warrington and Wilko has affected the results and I have to say it, the attitude of the players....
Can't ignore these are the players he chose to sign....

Quoted from Northbank Mariner

Honestly, no I don't think he can, last year he had a bunch of lads who he didn't know and who didn't know him and were so sick of hoofball under slade I'm not convinced humpty dumpty couldn't have turned it around..plus I'm not sure he has the right man at his side in limbrick.
I do wonder how much losing Warrington and Wilko has affected the results and I have to say it, the attitude of the players....
Can't ignore these are the players he chose to sign....

I'm not sure Wilko brought much to the table in terms of modern coaching from his exercises pre-match

Quoted from Paris Mariner

I'm not sure Wilko brought much to the table in terms of modern coaching from his exercises pre-match

I probably concur with that but the fact that he isn't there to put the senior pro's in their place and make them show some respect to a young manager does make me wonder.....christ the pre-match drills are hardly owt to shout home about, if that's modern coaching, we are all screwed...

i will tell you next week, cos i suspect these next 2 games will be make or break

Yes, Absolutley. We are very quick to sack managers these days.

I think a couple of wins and people will forget this, however a couple more defeats and I think JF and the board will have no choice.

Showed he has the ability to last season, we really where in deep trouble.

Quoted from Northbank Mariner

I probably concur with that but the fact that he isn't there to put the senior pro's in their place and make them show some respect to a young manager does make me wonder.....christ the pre-match drills are hardly owt to shout home about, if that's modern coaching, we are all screwed...

I think it shows a lot about a manager's coaching methods what they do pre-match. Take Lincoln, for example, on the pitch before the game at BP earlier in the season they had 9 back room staff on the pitch (including the Cowley's) and three groups of players warming up (subs, first XI and keepers). OK, they didn't play well that day but they probably do the same routine most weeks and a sitting pretty at the top of League 2. Meanwhile, you want Wilko to come back with his 'chipping it up to four defenders from the half-way line warm up'...

MJ
JF
B.O.D
50% of the support perhaps

outside of that...

Well up to now I have seen town win and draw on I follow,

BUT

Sadly I can not watch tomororror as I have a previous appointment,

So Town will win  mark my words.

We don’t look like a team that can scrape a draw
We tried that at Stevenage
There ain’t any wins coming at the min
I am as lost as MJ with it all
Plus we look so unfit ?
Come on please please prove me wrong Town and get a result somewhere v v soon

When people say he turned us around last season does that mean we suddenly started playing the ball on the deck and passed our way round the opposition, from what my old memory recalls we still hoofed it up front hoping for something.

Quoted from Gaffer58

When people say he turned us around last season does that mean we suddenly started playing the ball on the deck and passed our way round the opposition, from what my old memory recalls we still hoofed it up front hoping for something.

We just played the few teams that were even more crap than us and got lucky with penalties

Quoted from Gaffer58

When people say he turned us around last season does that mean we suddenly started playing the ball on the deck and passed our way round the opposition, from what my old memory recalls we still hoofed it up front hoping for something.

Agreed about the style of football but he did sort of get some spirit/ fight into the team .. which sadly now appears not to be there

Quoted from Northbank Mariner

I probably concur with that but the fact that he isn't there to put the senior pro's in their place and make them show some respect to a young manager does make me wonder.....christ the pre-match drills are hardly owt to shout home about, if that's modern coaching, we are all screwed...

Why would you think Wilko would put senior players in their place, whenever interviewed he didn't seem to know what was going on and if I remember correctly he didn't have much success with getting them playing when he was in charge.

I don't go with the view that we look unfit in any way. I think we're just lacking a bit in pace. Combined with the fact that we're playing poorly and so find ourselves on the back foot, just reacting to what is happening, and so it looks as though we just can't keep up with the opposition.

In our good performance against Lincoln, we didn't look unfit because we were on the front foot. It we can somehow find form from somewhere, we'll suddenly seem a lot fitter.

Quoted from Gaffer58

When people say he turned us around last season does that mean we suddenly started playing the ball on the deck and passed our way round the opposition, from what my old memory recalls we still hoofed it up front hoping for something.

We played promotion chasing Notts County off the pitch. Some very good football that day. Did the same to Lincoln this season, without getting the win we deserved. When he has got it right, it's been good to watch.

Quoted from Paris Mariner

I think it shows a lot about a manager's coaching methods what they do pre-match. Take Lincoln, for example, on the pitch before the game at BP earlier in the season they had 9 back room staff on the pitch (including the Cowley's) and three groups of players warming up (subs, first XI and keepers). OK, they didn't play well that day but they probably do the same routine most weeks and a sitting pretty at the top of League 2. Meanwhile, you want Wilko to come back with his 'chipping it up to four defenders from the half-way line warm up'...

No I don't wilko back for his coaching methods...all I am saying is that maybe he was the strong hand last season...I have no doubt he kept his trap shut due to slades relationship with Fenty and yes, the games under him were terrible but I think the players probably got more rollockings and were made to listen to what Jolley had to say whereas as now there appears to be a lack of discipline.....

Really want Jolley to get it right and do well for us but unfortunately I just can’t see it.

Think this time next week and after 2 more defeats we could well be manager less.

Now if we had a decent board in charge then talks and contacts would be made right now seeing who is available to come in say next Monday and sort this lot out.

Yes of course he can and hopefully will

Quoted from Maringer

I don't go with the view that we look unfit in any way. I think we're just lacking a bit in pace. Combined with the fact that we're playing poorly and so find ourselves on the back foot, just reacting to what is happening, and so it looks as though we just can't keep up with the opposition.

In our good performance against Lincoln, we didn't look unfit because we were on the front foot. It we can somehow find form from somewhere, we'll suddenly seem a lot fitter.

Good post. We have had the run of luck against us.[ It's never happened to me   ] but I know several golfers who have hit a bad shot,then their next shot is invariably bad because they are trying too hard. A lot of it is a confidence thing that is affecting our players-just a bit of luck and we could turn the tables. At the moment every mistake seems to get punished. I bet they are as drunk off as we are-the tide will soon turn.

Afraid I can’t see him turning it around. He’s full of cliches and soundbites and has demonstrated very little substance.

We’re a terrible team that can’t defend, can’t create chances and certainly can’t score.

Have seen most of pre-season (the little we had of it) and every game this season. I think this is one of the most inept GTFC teams ever.

Quoted from Northbank Mariner

No I don't wilko back for his coaching methods...all I am saying is that maybe he was the strong hand last season...I have no doubt he kept his trap shut due to slades relationship with Fenty and yes, the games under him were terrible but I think the players probably got more rollockings and were made to listen to what Jolley had to say whereas as now there appears to be a lack of discipline.....

A fair proportion of this squad was ever coached by Wilko in fact only 3 of the lads that started on Saturday where here last year,

Is the problem that MJ is just to nice ? We keep hearing stories about what a genuinly good guy with a caring nature he is , people of this temperament are often taken advantage of by fellow humans as they see these as a weakness to be exploited maybe the squad are taking liberties and abusing his deminure .

Quoted from Townee82

Is the problem that MJ is just to nice ? We keep hearing stories about what a genuinly good guy with a caring nature he is , people of this temperament are often taken advantage of by fellow humans as they see these as a weakness to be exploited maybe the squad are taking liberties and abusing his deminure .

I wondered this, is the "modern way" not effective with 4th Division footballers some of whom have been around he circuit for a bit? At school you always respected the stricter teachers more.

A little patience is what's required but after 15 years of fenty rule any sign of trouble puts even the most mild town fan into a flat spin. Patience is thin when even your most successful manager of the last 7 years had a pretty dire home record. What has there to be excited about watching town at home for years?

We can't go on sacking manager after manager and expect things to change. At some point we have to give someone a chance to build.

I believe that given time MJ can do that. It's the first time we have a guy in charge that seems to understand the area. He has brought in players most of us see as decent even if they are not performing presently. Since being back in the league 4 managers have struggled to get a striker in. That means either all four (PH,MB,RS,MJ) have rubbish contacts, all four don't like signing forward, all four don't want to score goals, all four have personality disorders that drive players away or more likely all four have been unable to go for strikers due to budget and location of GTFC.

Fenty is the real problem at our club and he is a very lucky non chairman that the fans are not motivated enough to be calling for his head at every opportunity. That's the kind of silent misery you get when a club has been consistently badly run and alienated fans.



UTM

Yes i think he can BUT the players need to work harder and show us that they are not as bad as we saw on Saturday and the last few matches.  We need pace and width so need to give Akeem Rose and Max Wright a go and get some service to Wes Thomas.
I'm hoping he can as Saturday was awful and ruined my weekend.

Yes.

I'm pretty certain that he CAN whether he WILL or not remains to be seen and I hope and think he will be given the time to show if he does. He clearly CAN otherwise we'd have been relegated last season. There are mitigating circumstances, injuries to players you'd rather have in the team and frankly restless fans who take no second invitations at throwing uninformed and unwarranted criticism at the team and manager. Obviously this understandable given the depravity of footballing quality since the turn of the century, but the fickleness of our fans is still undoubtedly present and can be overbearing I fear.

The other is that the problem ostensibly lies far deeper than Jolley. Paul Hurst is the only Town manager to have succeeded in my lifetime and it took him enough time to do so. Therefore a root cause is the only plausible explanation, this being John Fenty. He must set pitiful, alleged "competitive budgets" and seemingly expects minor miracles to occur while his dream of "Fentyism" becoming a reality in the vanity project that is the new stadium fails again and again due to his over-inflated ego. In short Jolley has the capability to turning the situation around but I believed he has been equipped with tools that make the task practically impossible.

Our club is intrinsically associated with failure since the "Fenty era" began and it will not abate until there is either a dramatic change in approach from Mr Fenty or he simply moves aside. Does he entertain outside investment as much as he public claims? I have my doubts. Does he want to step aside as much as he claims? Again, it is relatively clear that he doesn't. Thanks to 17-18 years of consistent failure with one promotion and a handful or memorable moments we are now seen as a club that lurks around the gateway to non-league and it wouldn't be surprising if we went back there.

I won't criticise Fenty for Jolley's appointment as pretty much everyone, including me, were absolutely behind this appointment. I can criticise him for appointing Marcus Bignot (when we were actually quite an attractive prospect I suspect because we had momentum in the right direction for once). I can't understand how on you can have a conversation with Bignot and not come to the conclusion that he is a complete "fruit loop". He still appointed him. Had we appointed Jolley (and given him a genuinely competitive budget) we'd probably be in a much better position now.

Jolley isn't particularly burdened by past failures as most of our past managers were and I hope given his relative lack of scars means he can re-energise the club in a way that previously was impossible. I desperately hope he can because I do think that his long term strategy would be ultimately very successful. Another new manager and then another shed load of new signings is the opposite of what is desirable. We are at the stage in the season where we can afford to give him time. If things don't improve (meaning we still get no points and score virtually no goals) by the end of November then I would act as that would be a decent sample to make a judgement upon. Until then I would try to relieve pressure and encourage motivation and belief. Surely positive energy would be more lucrative than this current atmosphere?

I gamble we will see Collins in central defence tomorrow, Woolford ambling down the wing and Walsh winning block tackles then passing to the opposition. Davies at full back where he looks crap and Jordan Cook ruining himself ragged chasing big boots. We have. No pace, no strikers who can score, no wingers at all and a truly diabolical defence.
The players are not unfit just bemused by the set up
2 more games for MJ but I am lost on how he sets a team up. Can he turn this around, appears smart enough but 2 more defeats and he has got to go as his start deserves that. If there were some glimmers and structure fair enough but we have been rubbish from day 1 this season. We competed in only 3 games and that is pitiful. So he selects a logical team and gets a result or I would get rid sooner than later. Fingers crossed as we would all love him to succeed but a loss tomorrow and I will not show on Saturday with him in charge as it is a monumental waste of time and just makes me angry utm

Quoted from Zmariner

I gamble we will see Collins in central defence tomorrow, Woolford ambling down the wing and Walsh winning block tackles then passing to the opposition. Davies at full back where he looks crap and Jordan Cook ruining himself ragged chasing big boots. We have. No pace, no strikers who can score, no wingers at all and a truly diabolical defence.
The players are not unfit just bemused by the set up
2 more games for MJ but I am lost on how he sets a team up. Can he turn this around, appears smart enough but 2 more defeats and he has got to go as his start deserves that. If there were some glimmers and structure fair enough but we have been rubbish from day 1 this season. We competed in only 3 games and that is pitiful. So he selects a logical team and gets a result or I would get rid sooner than later. Fingers crossed as we would all love him to succeed but a loss tomorrow and I will not show on Saturday with him in charge as it is a monumental waste of time and just makes me angry utm

Not much choice really, given that we are down to 2 fit centre backs. Davies won't be at full back because he has joined the growing injury list, and Cook is also carrying a knock. Think Hendrie can play centre back, but we have no left backs fit, so i presume he will play there, as he did Saturday when Davies went off. We really have been unlucky with injuries and suspensions so far, which is why i think we should hang fire a bit longer before changing the manager yet again.

Quoted from Ipswin

We just played the few teams that were even more crap than us and got lucky with penalties

Really how many did you see?

He has the time to do it.

I don’t think the question should be whether MJ has it within him to move this forward as I think he does but I think that question should be posed towards the players.

I’m not sure I’ve seen a group surrender like I have this lot in the last month or so, even at 0-0 it feels like they are waiting for the inevitable to happen rather than putting in a second effort to take the game by the scruff of the neck.

I think he can and I think the player`s are far better than they are currently performing.Personally and this will upset a few I would start my changes with goalkeeper we need a far more commanding keeper and have done since Promotion.We were at our best when Henderson was in the team however long ago that was.Next Collins get him out and estabilish a partnership and build the spine from there CM and CF are doing ok the weak link is at the back.The decision to let Pearson go looks more baffling by the minute ? Clarke wasn`t anywhere near as good as SP and clearly DC this Season isn`t as good as Clarke was.In my opinion League 2 has been pish poor since we got back up yet we have found it a massive struggle the other ex football league clubs who suffered our fate Bristol,Lincoln and Tranmere and to a degree Cheltenham have had nowhere near our problems.

Quoted from Mariner_09

I'm pretty certain that he CAN whether he WILL or not remains to be seen and I hope and think he will be given the time to show if he does. He clearly CAN otherwise we'd have been relegated last season. There are mitigating circumstances, injuries to players you'd rather have in the team and frankly restless fans who take no second invitations at throwing uninformed and unwarranted criticism at the team and manager. Obviously this understandable given the depravity of footballing quality since the turn of the century, but the fickleness of our fans is still undoubtedly present and can be overbearing I fear.

The other is that the problem ostensibly lies far deeper than Jolley. Paul Hurst is the only Town manager to have succeeded in my lifetime and it took him enough time to do so. Therefore a root cause is the only plausible explanation, this being John Fenty. He must set pitiful, alleged "competitive budgets" and seemingly expects minor miracles to occur while his dream of "Fentyism" becoming a reality in the vanity project that is the new stadium fails again and again due to his over-inflated ego. In short Jolley has the capability to turning the situation around but I believed he has been equipped with tools that make the task practically impossible.

Our club is intrinsically associated with failure since the "Fenty era" began and it will not abate until there is either a dramatic change in approach from Mr Fenty or he simply moves aside. Does he entertain outside investment as much as he public claims? I have my doubts. Does he want to step aside as much as he claims? Again, it is relatively clear that he doesn't. Thanks to 17-18 years of consistent failure with one promotion and a handful or memorable moments we are now seen as a club that lurks around the gateway to non-league and it wouldn't be surprising if we went back there.

I won't criticise Fenty for Jolley's appointment as pretty much everyone, including me, were absolutely behind this appointment. I can criticise him for appointing Marcus Bignot (when we were actually quite an attractive prospect I suspect because we had momentum in the right direction for once). I can't understand how on you can have a conversation with Bignot and not come to the conclusion that he is a complete "fruit loop". He still appointed him. Had we appointed Jolley (and given him a genuinely competitive budget) we'd probably be in a much better position now.

Jolley isn't particularly burdened by past failures as most of our past managers were and I hope given his relative lack of scars means he can re-energise the club in a way that previously was impossible. I desperately hope he can because I do think that his long term strategy would be ultimately very successful. Another new manager and then another shed load of new signings is the opposite of what is desirable. We are at the stage in the season where we can afford to give him time. If things don't improve (meaning we still get no points and score virtually no goals) by the end of November then I would act as that would be a decent sample to make a judgement upon. Until then I would try to relieve pressure and encourage motivation and belief. Surely positive energy would be more lucrative than this current atmosphere?

Yes, the old "it's the fans fault" again.

How about us fans getting a protest together on Saturday shouting "fans out"

Of course he can.

We looked a worse side than this and (amazingly) even less of a goal threat when we had that dry spell under Buckley MkIII before Patto got a consolation goal away at Torquay before we thumped Boston 6-0 the next week.

He has made lots of mistakes this season but I can't see us attracting anyone decent so may as well stick with him another month and hope he comes good.

Quoted from Mariner_09

I'm pretty certain that he CAN whether he WILL or not remains to be seen and I hope and think he will be given the time to show if he does. He clearly CAN otherwise we'd have been relegated last season. There are mitigating circumstances, injuries to players you'd rather have in the team and frankly restless fans who take no second invitations at throwing uninformed and unwarranted criticism at the team and manager. Obviously this understandable given the depravity of footballing quality since the turn of the century, but the fickleness of our fans is still undoubtedly present and can be overbearing I fear.

The other is that the problem ostensibly lies far deeper than Jolley. Paul Hurst is the only Town manager to have succeeded in my lifetime and it took him enough time to do so. Therefore a root cause is the only plausible explanation, this being John Fenty. He must set pitiful, alleged "competitive budgets" and seemingly expects minor miracles to occur while his dream of "Fentyism" becoming a reality in the vanity project that is the new stadium fails again and again due to his over-inflated ego. In short Jolley has the capability to turning the situation around but I believed he has been equipped with tools that make the task practically impossible.

Our club is intrinsically associated with failure since the "Fenty era" began and it will not abate until there is either a dramatic change in approach from Mr Fenty or he simply moves aside. Does he entertain outside investment as much as he public claims? I have my doubts. Does he want to step aside as much as he claims? Again, it is relatively clear that he doesn't. Thanks to 17-18 years of consistent failure with one promotion and a handful or memorable moments we are now seen as a club that lurks around the gateway to non-league and it wouldn't be surprising if we went back there.

I won't criticise Fenty for Jolley's appointment as pretty much everyone, including me, were absolutely behind this appointment. I can criticise him for appointing Marcus Bignot (when we were actually quite an attractive prospect I suspect because we had momentum in the right direction for once). I can't understand how on you can have a conversation with Bignot and not come to the conclusion that he is a complete "fruit loop". He still appointed him. Had we appointed Jolley (and given him a genuinely competitive budget) we'd probably be in a much better position now.

Jolley isn't particularly burdened by past failures as most of our past managers were and I hope given his relative lack of scars means he can re-energise the club in a way that previously was impossible. I desperately hope he can because I do think that his long term strategy would be ultimately very successful. Another new manager and then another shed load of new signings is the opposite of what is desirable. We are at the stage in the season where we can afford to give him time. If things don't improve (meaning we still get no points and score virtually no goals) by the end of November then I would act as that would be a decent sample to make a judgement upon. Until then I would try to relieve pressure and encourage motivation and belief. Surely positive energy would be more lucrative than this current atmosphere?

Thank you Mrs Jolley!

As a sad and restless fan wishing to throw a bit of unwarranted and uniformed criticism, may I just point out that Mr Jolley may not be overburdened by failure but he is not overburdened by success either. Youth coaching, which like Neil Woods is what Jolley has done most of, is not about results but about player development. When tasked with getting grown men in a first team men to achieve in a league his scoreboard in Sweden was not exactly impressive was it? This is a very different world to the training pitch full of eager young lads busting a gut to do as they are told in the hope of making the first team.

All this chuntering about patience, new attitudes and becoming like Crewe used to be and the like is just so much eyewash. Jolley's job is very, very simple - get points on the board in L2 .........now. Not tomorrow, not next season, not in the new stadium but now .... before it's too late.

I cannot believe he got this job on results so he must have had some very influential acquaintances and a brilliant interview technique.

Quoted from ginnywings

Not much choice really, given that we are down to 2 fit centre backs. Davies won't be at full back because he has joined the growing injury list, and Cook is also carrying a knock. Think Hendrie can play centre back, but we have no left backs fit, so i presume he will play there, as he did Saturday when Davies went off. We really have been unlucky with injuries and suspensions so far, which is why i think we should hang fire a bit longer before changing the manager yet again.

Really good point and quite easy to forget that we have had a bloody awful run with injuries.   Obviously when the chips are down it's easy to over analyse everything and in this instance the finger of blame gets pointed at this new approach with the fitness coaches and raises the questions of what is actually going on at the training ground that's causing all these injuries.

But with a fully fit squad to choose from and providing there's no needless tinkering, it's not the worst line-up in the world.  I think defensively it looks a bit weak and it would definitely benefit from a proper No 9 up top but there's an absolute luxury of players who could play as the support strikers/attacking midfielders.  

In Jolley's shoes and based on what I've seen so far, I would be making Famewo and Whitmore my back pairing for now.  Davis looks to be out for the long-term and you need some pace at the heart of the defence.  Hall-Johnson on the right is fine and providing he's got a decent winger in front of him/isn't over exposed I think Fox is fine too, he just needs a run of games to get into this stride (like he did last season).

Midfield depends on what system you're playing.  Personally I would really like to see us go for it and have a 3 of Welsh, Embleton and Pringle.  Welsh anchoring with the other two given licence to push on and be creative, especially in the absence of two rampaging full-backs.  You've then got Rose, Clifton and Hessenthaler who can come in at any point.  

Up top I still maintain we badly miss Cardwell.  He's not a world beater but he was a very effective leader of the line towards the end of last season.  Him fit and leading the line would make a massive difference, any two of Cook, Vernam and Thomas working off his running and hustle would get plenty of opportunities.  That's before even having the option of bringing sheer pace on in the form of Rose and Wright, which I firmly believe would terrify sides in the closing 20 minutes of games.

Working with what we've got doesn't address the lack of balance in the squad but it isn't impossible to pick something that resembles a team.  

Quoted from Northbank Mariner

No I don't wilko back for his coaching methods...all I am saying is that maybe he was the strong hand last season...I have no doubt he kept his trap shut due to slades relationship with Fenty and yes, the games under him were terrible but I think the players probably got more rollockings and were made to listen to what Jolley had to say whereas as now there appears to be a lack of discipline.....

I can see your point.

Yes

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

Thank you Mrs Jolley!

As a sad and restless fan wishing to throw a bit of unwarranted and uniformed criticism, may I just point out that Mr Jolley may not be overburdened by failure but he is not overburdened by success either. Youth coaching, which like Neil Woods is what Jolley has done most of, is not about results but about player development. When tasked with getting grown men in a first team men to achieve in a league his scoreboard in Sweden was not exactly impressive was it? This is a very different world to the training pitch full of eager young lads busting a gut to do as they are told in the hope of making the first team.

All this chuntering about patience, new attitudes and becoming like Crewe used to be and the like is just so much eyewash. Jolley's job is very, very simple - get points on the board in L2 .........now. Not tomorrow, not next season, not in the new stadium but now .... before it's too late.

I cannot believe he got this job on results so he must have had some very influential acquaintances and a brilliant interview technique.

Jolley was the under 23 team coach at Burnley for three years - hardly youth coaching! I would imagine quite a few of the players he was working with were in the 20 -23 year old bracket and could be described as " grown men ". These would all be players who were on the cusp of playing for the first team and certainly not raw novices.

i think we need to sign that canadian goose
last seen at macc not seen or won since  

If a man deserves to keep his job because of his hard work and commitment then its Jolley.

Whether he does or not depends on results and I for one hopes he can get them.

Starting with beating Carlisle then Port Vale.

Quoted from rancido

Jolley was the under 23 team coach at Burnley for three years - hardly youth coaching! I would imagine quite a few of the players he was working with were in the 20 -23 year old bracket and could be described as " grown men ". These would all be players who were on the cusp of playing for the first team and certainly not raw novices.

I am not saying he is a useless coach, far from it. But the job is completely different. To the first team manager at Burnley the priority he would give Jolley would be to develop players. That is totally different to being the first team manager. That job is about responsibility for the first team squad and getting results to progress the club. In L2 these are largely mature blokes with homes and families to support on wages that may be reasonable but will not be massive and contracts which are short term. There is a world of difference between dealing with a Burnley U-23 player on the way up and sorting out Danny Collins on his way down. Getting players to buy in to what the manager wants to see as a team on the park is the key factor. Yes, there is an element of player development but the guts of the job is to get results week on week, especially these days where a managerial position can be very short-lived.

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

I am not saying he is a useless coach, far from it. But the job is completely different. To the first team manager at Burnley the priority he would give Jolley would be to develop players. That is totally different to being the first team manager. That job is about responsibility for the first team squad and getting results to progress the club. In L2 these are largely mature blokes with homes and families to support on wages that may be reasonable but will not be massive and contracts which are short term. There is a world of difference between dealing with a Burnley U-23 player on the way up and sorting out Danny Collins on his way down. Getting players to buy in to what the manager wants to see as a team on the park is the key factor. Yes, there is an element of player development but the guts of the job is to get results week on week, especially these days where a managerial position can be very short-lived.

I agree.

I think you make a very pertinent point RRFC.

I do a bit more now after tonight's confidence boosting win at Carlisle.

I’d decided I didn’t after the morecambe game, but one games past and he’s taken a big step in proving me wrong, and i’ll be more than ecstatic to be made to look silly

Delighted to be eating  humble pie after comments expressing my doubts. Very brave team selections from Michael jolly tonight and huge respect for this. Absolutely delighted and some pride restored, we must follow it up on Saturday. Utm

Yes but if we don’t follow it up on Saturday let’s not all jump on his back! Things will come good but it may take time.........

Quoted from Zmariner

Delighted to be eating  humble pie after comments expressing my doubts. Very brave team selections from Michael jolly tonight and huge respect for this. Absolutely delighted and some pride restored, we must follow it up on Saturday. Utm

No humble pie to be eaten. We have won a game, and no one is more delighted about that than me; however, Saturday and the weeks before still happened and we can only comment on what is put before us.

I am very pleased for MJ tonight, he will be feeling a whole lot better but there is a mountain of work still to do.

Well done MJ most of the fan`s have tried to stick with him but this excellent win needs backing up with another Saturday or at the very least a draw.Keep it going fella.UTM

1 win doesn't make MJ a great manager, just like the 6 defeats didn't make him a dreadful manager IMO

Town fans need to remember that sometimes things don't go your way.
We've had injuries
Red cards
Played good teams
And had 0 momentum and 0 confidence.

We are Grimsby town, with a young, inexperienced manager, and people need to give him time when things don't go well, just like they need to not get too excited after a win.


MJ had a plan with a team and formation and instantly lost Whitehouse for the season before it even started.
He then lost Hall-Johnson, who is a very good wing back IMO


So despite only being 11 games in, weve had a lot of changes that he's been forced into, and played some good teams


Basically, give him time when its not going great, and stay grounded when we win.

We won't go up, and we won't go down, i'm sure of that

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

No humble pie to be eaten. We have won a game, and no one is more delighted about that than me; however, Saturday and the weeks before still happened and we can only comment on what is put before us.

I am very pleased for MJ tonight, he will be feeling a whole lot better but there is a mountain of work still to do.

Absolutely. I think the manager will have learned from this win more than from the defeats. What did he do right? He picked players in positions to give of their best and they did. There has to be a place for Vernam in the side though I would say neither he nor Hooper will ever be a true striker. At times Vernam reminds me of a young Kevin Keegan but his finishing is poor. The lack of a potent striker once again almost cost us dearly because we could have had Carlisle dead and buried by half time and instead were backs to the wall.

I am chuffed to ribbons with the 3 points though, especially as at one stage we were propping up the whole EFL. Let’s see what Saturday brings. Can we break the BP poor form  hoodoo? Hope so. UTM

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

I am not saying he is a useless coach, far from it. But the job is completely different. To the first team manager at Burnley the priority he would give Jolley would be to develop players. That is totally different to being the first team manager. That job is about responsibility for the first team squad and getting results to progress the club. In L2 these are largely mature blokes with homes and families to support on wages that may be reasonable but will not be massive and contracts which are short term. There is a world of difference between dealing with a Burnley U-23 player on the way up and sorting out Danny Collins on his way down. Getting players to buy in to what the manager wants to see as a team on the park is the key factor. Yes, there is an element of player development but the guts of the job is to get results week on week, especially these days where a managerial position can be very short-lived.

You make some good points but all coaches/managers have to have some kind of basic knowledge to work from including relevant qualifications. Even the older players will have gone through some kind of development work in their early careers and worked under coaches, like Jolley, who have the necessary coaching qualifications. MJ also has the League Managers Association Diploma In Football Management. This qualification covers subjects such as Influencing and Negotiation, Mental Toughness and Resilience,  Football Finance, Diversity , Equality and Inclusion, Sports Science and Performance Analytics and focused on leadership, personal development and well being. These are all areas that in the past managers would have acquired by years of experience but the Football League have managed to put them in course form. His qualifications in the world of finance and his financial employment demonstrates that he is able to transfer the theoretical side into the practical side.

Quoted from arryarryarry

Yes, the old "it's the fans fault" again.

How about us fans getting a protest together on Saturday shouting "fans out"

Nobody is blaming the fans and the post doesn't say that. The fans though can influence the mood in the dressing room and on the pitch,especially if there are lots of negative, personal and unconstructive comments directed at the management/players.

Dont often agree with Rancido but the last two posts above are spot on IMHO

I feel that managers like Jolley will become the norm rather than the exception eventually. He has all the qualifications, but like a lot of people fresh out of school, he has to acquire the on the job experience. That will only come with time, and time will only be allowed if the results are sufficient to keep the axe from hovering. Some clubs will be more patient than others, and some clubs will be better able to support fledgling managers than others.

Some feel that our board are way behind the times and should Jolley fail, can the blame be solely attached to him and him alone? There is also the fan equation. Will the fans stay patient when they have seen no progress from the team since we returned to the football league?

I think Jolley can turn it around given time and support from the board and the fans. As ever, only time will tell.

I missed the last home game but I haven`t heard anything other than individual comments or conversations that have been anything but supportive of MJ. I think the overwhelming majority want him to succeed and it was always going to take time BUT nobody expected such a dreadful start.Mr Fenty would have been well within his rights to have fired him after Saturday given the run of results and should we lose this Saturday it will heap the pressure back on.A win Saturday buys some breathing space for a few week`s and we will be another 2 weeks nearer January and some much needed reinforcements.Keep it going MJ

Quoted from rancido

You make some good points but all coaches/managers have to have some kind of basic knowledge to work from including relevant qualifications. Even the older players will have gone through some kind of development work in their early careers and worked under coaches, like Jolley, who have the necessary coaching qualifications. MJ also has the League Managers Association Diploma In Football Management. This qualification covers subjects such as Influencing and Negotiation, Mental Toughness and Resilience,  Football Finance, Diversity , Equality and Inclusion, Sports Science and Performance Analytics and focused on leadership, personal development and well being. These are all areas that in the past managers would have acquired by years of experience but the Football League have managed to put them in course form. His qualifications in the world of finance and his financial employment demonstrates that he is able to transfer the theoretical side into the practical side.

I have read the curriculum and I know what he will have studied for his Business qualifications. Most of the FIFA classroom stuff is about as much use as a chocolate teapot in the real world because it tries to use models from other disciplines of work to create a football industry qualification. In fact it is part of the attempt to create an industry out of a sport.

There are plenty of alternative theories on how the game should be played but the one key factor in football management is the management of people and in particular people who have more experience and/or knowledge than the manager does. In general that matters little at youth level but once you get into the first team slot it is absolutely crucial. Some of it is a personal quality and some of it is a matter of common sense. I remember finding this out in my first managerial level job being promoted over older blokes. Not easy. You have to prove yourself every day. All my academic qualifications counted for zilch until I could give proof positive I could do the job.

Of course there are other factors to consider but my personal opinion is that this is still Jolley’s biggest problem just now. He has to prove himself as a practical winner of games, show the dressing room that his decisions will get them results and he is not just a fancy-dan with a smart suit, laptop and letters after his name.

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

I have read the curriculum and I know what he will have studied for his Business qualifications. Most of the FIFA classroom stuff is about as much use as a chocolate teapot in the real world because it tries to use models from other disciplines of work to create a football industry qualification. In fact it is part of the attempt to create an industry out of a sport.

There are plenty of alternative theories on how the game should be played but the one key factor in football management is the management of people and in particular people who have more experience and/or knowledge than the manager does. In general that matters little at youth level but once you get into the first team slot it is absolutely crucial. Some of it is a personal quality and some of it is a matter of common sense. I remember finding this out in my first managerial level job being promoted over older blokes. Not easy. You have to prove yourself every day. All my academic qualifications counted for zilch until I could give proof positive I could do the job.

Of course there are other factors to consider but my personal opinion is that this is still Jolley’s biggest problem just now. He has to prove himself as a practical winner of games, show the dressing room that his decisions will get them results and he is not just a fancy-dan with a smart suit, laptop and letters after his name.

A lot of the points you make are valid and indeed I agree with. The one part I do disagree on is the highlighted part. Football is indeed a sport but the world of " organised sport " as football is through FIFA is an industry. It might not fit into your perceived model of what an industry is but nevertheless it is and business models for industry are relevant.

Quoted from rancido

Nobody is blaming the fans and the post doesn't say that. The fans though can influence the mood in the dressing room and on the pitch,especially if there are lots of negative, personal and unconstructive comments directed at the management/players.

I've already said elsewhere but last night we saw the undoubted benefits of fans getting behind the team from the first minute. The singing and chanting didn't just start after we scored.

Quoted from barralad

I've already said elsewhere but last night we saw the undoubted benefits of fans getting behind the team from the first minute. The singing and chanting didn't just start after we scored.

It's always like that away. The away support is almost always brilliant. It's at home where the miserable gits seem to drag the tone down from early on in a game almost weekly. And this isn't a new thing, it's been a constant ever since I started going even under Laws and Buckley II. For some reason, if we're not winning or playing very well after 15-20 minutes, the shouts of rubbish etc are ringing out. This is a very small minority of people, you can probably count them on your fingers, but they seem to bring the whole atmosphere down to me.

I don't think it's any coincidence that when Jolley came in last season and it was literally get behind the team or we go down, that the fans turned out in numbers, got behind the team like I've never seen before and the performances followed. I remember us going behind (Port Vale iirc) and the fans actually got behind the team and encouraged rather than moaned and it felt like a totally different place to be.

Quoted from barralad

I've already said elsewhere but last night we saw the undoubted benefits of fans getting behind the team from the first minute. The singing and chanting didn't just start after we scored.

I have to say I think that is just a reaction to a win.

Especially away from home our support is great, but usually makes no difference to the result whatsoever.

It is totally unrealistic to expect fans to sing and chant for 90 minutes if the result is going against you.

I don't expect BP will be a cauldron on Saturday but I don't expect us to meekly surrender just because the crowd are quiet .

Quoted from barralad

I've already said elsewhere but last night we saw the undoubted benefits of fans getting behind the team from the first minute. The singing and chanting didn't just start after we scored.

It's a two-way thing though isn't it? The crowd at BP have, for time immemorial, always taken some stirring. I hoped - and still hope - that MJ will deliver what he said pre-season and produce a team that plays with pace, a high tempo and on the front foot. That would certainly please a miserable old curmudgeon like me.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

I have to say I think that is just a reaction to a win.

Especially away from home our support is great, but usually makes no difference to the result whatsoever.

It is totally unrealistic to expect fans to sing and chant for 90 minutes if the result is going against you.

I don't expect BP will be a cauldron on Saturday but I don't expect us to meekly surrender just because the crowd are quiet .

Well we didn't go behind so you may be right. It just struck me that there seemed to be a concerted effort from the first minute led by a small group in the front couple of rows. It wasn't something I experienced at Macclesfield where we also won. I've tried to think of similar matches and off the top of my head the only time I can remember thinking the same was a game at Bury (possibly in Mike Newell's spell) where the late, great Trumpeter Rich and a drummer created the same conditions...we won that day as well. Trust me Brunton Park was like a morgue last night and the players would have heard every word..especially in the second half. I

Only been to Brunton park once during Slade1, I think we took close to a thousand fans and were chasing promotion. Difficult place to make noise due to it being open? So the 150 last night did very well to create some noise