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So we are 3 games in..

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moosey_club
August 15, 2018, 1:49pm
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Quoted from horsforthmariner
After 3 games this is my take. We are a midtable league 2 team that will probably look over our shoulder at the relegation battle more rather than looking up to the promotion battle.

We've got a good manager, a good keeper and good midfield. This will be enough to keep us up. Our defence is ok but we won't score enough to trouble top teams.


Midfield is suspect in my eyes....Welsh still to convince me by and large... having to slide in to get to the ball more often than not, slow by comparison, sits so deep as he doesn't want to get done by pace, cant do the legwork to close down quickly.......but in his favour very experienced, calm on the ball, positionally disciplined...i think he needs two runners around him to get the best out of him but that in my mind makes him almost a luxury.  

Woolford is past his prime , last season with Summerfield and Rose alongside him he could let them do the physical and chasing side and he could be the luxury ball player, with Welsh sitting deep Woolford now has to provide the physical and chasing side which just isn't his game.

With one suspension the centre mid looks slow and weak, Whitehouse situation obviously hurts us but Harry Clifton wont have a better opportunity to break into that centre mid role than right now so needs to be staking his claim and trying to oust Woolford.

We have what we now have, the manager has had his free reign to rebuild/retain by and large which he has done, win some then  lose some i think will be the pattern for us and then the January window to consolidate whatever position we hold by then.  

We lack pace in key areas and that holds us back on the counter and leaves us susceptible to the counter.  

But any points out of the next two games and we will have had a better start than either of the previous two seasons so not all bad.


2023/24 DLWDDWDLLLWDLLLLWDDDWDLLWLDLLDWDDWL
2022/23LDWDWWDWLLDWWDLLLDLWLLWLWLLWDDLDWWDDDLLWDWLWLW
2021/22 WDWWWWDLWWWWLLLWLLDLWLLWWDWWWLWDLWWDWWWDLWD play offs WWW Promoted 🥳
2020/21  LLDWWLDLDWLWLLLDLWLLDLLDLLLWLLLDDDDWDDDLWLWLWL .. hello darkness my old friend
2019/20  WDLDWWLDLWWLLLDLDLDLDDWWDLLWDDWWL WLLW - ended
2018/19  LWDDLLLLLLWWDWLLLWDWLWWWWLLLLWWWWDLLLDDLLDLWLW Hello Scunny  
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LondonMariner43
August 15, 2018, 2:04pm
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My observation is that MJ would appear to want 1-3 more players in the squad but isn't going to be bounced into signing squad fillers.  Instead, he would rather 'blood' some youngsters and it was very encouraging to see Buckley, Rose and Wright in the squad last night.  We have been crying out for a manager to try out younger players so full marks for that vs signing journeymen.

Secondly, he's been unlucky with the injury to Whitehouse and then some knocks to other players.

He's clearly wanting to play 532 but hasn't got the players signed or fit to do so.  Against FGR it seems like he decided to stick with 532 despite the players at his disposal whereas vs Macc he's adapted tactics to the players he has available.  There was a similar approach at the end of last season where he tried a few things and then settled on 433 to get by.  

What I like is that he is calm and steadily going about his business.  After Bignot and Slade nearly conspired to kill the club, mid table would be progress this season, with a tilt at something better next year.  We can expect continuity not revolution for 2-3 years with some many players on longer contracts and younger players coming through.  All very sensible but patience from the fans is needed.
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GrimRob
August 15, 2018, 2:43pm

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All managers should be given time, but sometimes results spin out of control, forcing the board's hand.

Newell - self-destructed
Woods  - not given time
Hurst - given time, and look what it achieved!
Bignot - NOT given time
Slade - not given time

The only one who can really claim he did not get a chance is Bignot. All MJ has to do is avoid the bottom third and he should be given plenty of time. All Hurst had to do was stay in and around the play-offs, which was a lot harder than many fans thought, but he managed it and he eventually assembled a side which he has built his career since around.


'Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.  
~ Alfred Lord Tennyson

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MuddyWaters
August 15, 2018, 3:07pm
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Quoted from GrimRob
All managers should be given time, but sometimes results spin out of control, forcing the board's hand.

Newell - self-destructed
Woods  - not given time
Hurst - given time, and look what it achieved!
Bignot - NOT given time
Slade - not given time

The only one who can really claim he did not get a chance is Bignot. All MJ has to do is avoid the bottom third and he should be given plenty of time. All Hurst had to do was stay in and around the play-offs, which was a lot harder than many fans thought, but he managed it and he eventually assembled a side which he has built his career since around.


That's very easy to say but not so easy to do if you haven't been given the budget to do so. I'm all for MJ - I think he knows, as many of us do, that the club is in a rut and has done things in the same way, year in, year out. Now, on the basis that the board seems stubborn (for want of a better word), it may be a case of the immovable object versus the irresistible force but, unless & until the club changes, the same frustrating relationship between club & fans will endure.

Like many I feel, I support the club, the manager & the players but not the people who run it.
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GrimRob
August 15, 2018, 3:21pm

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Quoted from MuddyWaters


That's very easy to say but not so easy to do if you haven't been given the budget to do so. I'm all for MJ - I think he knows, as many of us do, that the club is in a rut and has done things in the same way, year in, year out. Now, on the basis that the board seems stubborn (for want of a better word), it may be a case of the immovable object versus the irresistible force but, unless & until the club changes, the same frustrating relationship between club & fans will endure.

Like many I feel, I support the club, the manager & the players but not the people who run it.


We don't know that he hasn't been given the budget though do we? I think it's fair to say that we still have a budget for more players, so we haven't seen what he has decided to spend it on yet.


'Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.  
~ Alfred Lord Tennyson

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chaos33
August 15, 2018, 4:03pm
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If I was going to guess where we are in the budget league table, I'd go somewhere between 15 - 24th, so maybe that's where we'll bobble about in the table. For me, we've got two or three good players and the rest look only decent at this level. One or two are actually short of it IMO.

What we need is continuing/improving investment and time for Jolley to assemble a squad and team that can make a mark in the top half.

Personally, I'll find it easier to be patient now we are in the EFL as we were continually asked to be so in the conference, and the lack of conviction and ambition used to grate massively, so I'll look for improvements and at least some good performances and results whilst all that comes together.

We must stay clear of the bottom 2 or things will get tense and nasty, and nobody likes or wants that. Which leads me to say that we need at least 2 or 3 good signings, especially a striker ASAP as I suspect we might struggle a bit until we do and that's hard to endure. We should be aspiring to be a genuine play off team as soon as possible, and that objective needs backing up.


"You should do what you love while you can"
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RoboCod
August 15, 2018, 4:21pm
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Quoted from chaos33
If I was going to guess where we are in the budget league table, I'd go somewhere between 15 - 24th, so maybe that's where we'll bobble about in the table. For me, we've got two or three good players and the rest look only decent at this level. One or two are actually short of it IMO.

What we need is continuing/improving investment and time for Jolley to assemble a squad and team that can make a mark in the top half.

Personally, I'll find it easier to be patient now we are in the EFL as were continually asked to be so in the conference, and the lack of conviction and ambition used to grate massively, so I'll look for improvements and at least some good performances and results whilst all that comes together.

We must stay clear of the bottom 2 or things will get tense and nasty, and nobody likes or wants that. Which leads me to say that we need at least 2 or 3 good signings, especially a striker ASAP as I suspect we might struggle a bit until we do and that's hard to endure. We should be aspiring to be a genuine play off team as soon as possible, and that objective needs backing up.


Good summary, especially the last paragraph. I'm pretty sure we're 2-3 players away from being a decent team. We have time to build up to that and whereas normally the problem may be in that turning into complacency I don't see it as a problem because of Jolley.
Yes, it hurts that we're basically building towards making a 'decent' team that can safely hold its own in mid-table of League 2 but in the bigger picture, if Jolley can achieve that by around Xmas then it'll be a remarkable achievement in (technically) less than one season in charge.


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lew chaterleys lover
August 15, 2018, 4:21pm
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Quoted from GrimRob
All managers should be given time, but sometimes results spin out of control, forcing the board's hand.

Newell - self-destructed
Woods  - not given time
Hurst - given time, and look what it achieved!
Bignot - NOT given time
Slade - not given time

The only one who can really claim he did not get a chance is Bignot. All MJ has to do is avoid the bottom third and he should be given plenty of time. All Hurst had to do was stay in and around the play-offs, which was a lot harder than many fans thought, but he managed it and he eventually assembled a side which he has built his career since around.


All managers should certainly NOT be given more time!

It just does not happen anymore, and when it does it is the result of the law of averages more than anything else. Had we dispensed with Hurst much sooner, we may have won promotion earlier. I liked Hurst, but keeping him meant he just had several goes at getting a good enough team together to win a play off. He didn't "build" anything as such.

Most supporters these days want results, and they want them quickly. Our case is slightly flawed because the club is not run properly, it hasn't got the investment it needs, and has been punching BELOW its weight for nearly two decades and for modern day players we are just a struggling League 2 club flirting with the Conference.

We are in a pickle, mainly due to Fenty's incompetence for events on and off the field. If he is staying come what may, could I ask the obvious question...why? He has achieved the square root of f**k all up to now, and what makes him think anything will change?

Michael Jolley seemed our best hope for some time, but if the two home games are anything to go by he might be struggling; I don't blame him I blame the man at the top who has presided over a serious decline which is really hitting home the longer it drags on.

A heavy defeat on Saturday will be the start of more rumblings of discontent from the long suffering fans and it should all be aimed at the boardroom.
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LondonMariner43
August 15, 2018, 4:52pm
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Why do people think our budget is not proportionate to our gate receipts?  For League 2 clubs this is the main source of income and we are in the top third for home attendance and I would imagine we have a good income from selling shirts etc relative to some.

I would imagine our budget is top third.  The club doesn't make money so we are spending on wages what we get in income.

There may be some clubs with owners who are willing to fund losses but they are relatively scarce at this level and, in the long run, I'd rather we build a club that lives within its means.  Then we aren't vulnerable to a plug being pulled and going bankrupt.  It means we have to wait around for golden periods of great management and maybe great youth talent coming through but that is better than a flash in the pan followed by death.
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psgmariner
August 15, 2018, 5:01pm

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Our signings certainly suggest we have a lower end budget.


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