Is the United Kingdom a free country anymore?

Quoted from barralad

Our justice system that has its roots in the laws of Ancient Rome and the canonical diktats of the church of the Middle Ages??

Hey  area I’m no barrister but I’d hazard a guess it’s been tweaked a few times since the Roman days.

Quoted from ska face

So the thing that radicalised this person was a speech by one preacher, delivered 5 days before the bombing, where nobody even knows if Salman Abedi was even present - especially as this was during a period where he’d been widely reported as being a recluse and going off the radar of the security services?

But being part of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group, along with his father and brother (who is still out there, btw), taking part in armed combat during the Libyan civil war as part of a western-backed “rebel” militia group, growing up in a household with a father who’d been part UK-facilitated plots to assassinate Gaddafi...that had no part in his radicalisation? Part of an armed group likely trained by British security forces, allowed to travel to and from the area without question and then finally rescued by the British Navy in Libya and allowed to catch a flight back to Manchester with nobody blinking an eye. This had no bearing on his actions whatsoever? It was a sermon by one imam that Abedi might not have even heard.

Do us a favour.

likely trained by British security forces, what cadre course was he on, I'll search for his troop picture  

Are you really claiming that hate preaching only occurs once before a Muslim goes off on his jihadiholidays.

[youtube]pUqWAs9jZK8[/youtube]

erm...no...can you read?

Quoted from ska face

erm...no...can you read?

Lina Ahmed, 21, said: “They are a Libyan family and they have been acting strangely. A couple of months ago he [Salman] was chanting the first kalma [Islamic prayer] really loudly in the street. He was chanting in Arabic.

“He was saying ‘There is only one God and the prophet Mohammed is his messenger’.’

Months later he goes off on his Jihadiholdiays to meet up with his family, pretty much in the zone before he goes I would say. He was radicalised long before he went on his Jihadiholidays, all he did was learn the extremist skills when he got there.

Thousands of British Muslims have traveled to their Jihadiholdays, do you think we have the resources to watch every one of them every minute of the day. Muslims are told to pray 5 times a day before they can read. The brainwashing starts at an early age. The scrutiny from the security services goes on each case and what risk they put them at. Also the French and US security services knew about him.

I think a few of you Muslim apologists need to watch a few of Maajid Nawaz's videos.

[youtube]LVR_WxWWLek[/youtube]

Quoted from barralad

Or of course 500 million might live in peace because, you know, they might just want to get on with their lives like to millions of people who live in this country somehow manage to avoid getting on the wrong side of our laws..
The changes in Turkey by the way have far more to do with Erdogans concerns for his own regime than any religious context and as such are essentially secular.

Thought this may be of interest to you Ian, regarding Sharia.

[youtube]cPh3kFCg2pk[/youtube]

Straight from the horses mouth.......now wait for the Barra twist 😆

The absolute state of some of our city’s now did you vote for this Barra? Because I sure as hell didn’t. Well there’s no going back now that’s for sure.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-visit-to-islamic-england-1535581583

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Quoted from Grim74

The absolute state of some of our city’s now did you vote for this Barra? Because I sure as hell didn’t. Well there’s no going back now that’s for sure.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-visit-to-islamic-england-1535581583

Unless somehow you can print the article in full I cannot read it without subscribing. All I see is one persons opinion of his first visit to London as a teenager? I'm not suggesting that the Wall Street Journal (where I assume that this article came from based solely on the initials wsj) is rabidly right wing or islamophobic but it is a personal view of an individual experience.
I spend a great deal of my time in the East Midlands and see first hand the integration of different faiths including Islam in Nottingham, Leicester, Loughborough etc. For some reason this discussion seems to have mutated into both you and Dave thinking that I'm a supporter of Sharia Law. I only got involved in the first place because I wanted to offer an alternative view to your quite frankly ridiculous assertion that every Muslim is a disciple for Sharia Law. Just perhaps those followers of Islam who are so well integrated into  British society in those aforementioned cities/towns are there because they are far more forward thinking than to accept the literal meaning of the Koran and British society offers them the conditions where they can flourish.

Quoted from barralad

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Unless somehow you can print the article in full I cannot read it without subscribing. All I see is one persons opinion of his first visit to London as a teenager? I'm not suggesting that the Wall Street Journal (where I assume that this article came from based solely on the initials wsj) is rabidly right wing or islamophobic but it is a personal view of an individual experience.
I spend a great deal of my time in the East Midlands and see first hand the integration of different faiths including Islam in Nottingham, Leicester, Loughborough etc. For some reason this discussion seems to have mutated into both you and Dave thinking that I'm a supporter of Sharia Law. I only got involved in the first place because I wanted to offer an alternative view to your quite frankly ridiculous assertion that every Muslim is a disciple for Sharia Law. Just perhaps those followers of Islam who are so well integrated into  British society in those aforementioned cities/towns are there because they are far more forward thinking than to accept the literal meaning of the Koran and British society offers them the conditions where they can flourish.

First off! there is nowhere I have posted anywhere that I ascertain that every Muslim is a disciple for Sharia Law, Ridiculous.
I have worked and been in contact with many Muslims who are only Muslim in name, being a passive or even moderate Muslim. Of course many are just ordinary people who do not have a lot of interaction with islam and live their lives much like anybody else. ( you need to understand I totally get that).
But You need to understand Being “against islam” IS NOT THE SAME as being against all Muslims.

Like you I’ve worked around the East Midlands also Birmingham, Coventry, Luton, Stoke, most of West Yorkshire, Manchester, North and East London and I’ve got to say that my take on the Muslim community (interaction) is somewhat different from yours as there isn’t any. In fact SOME places I am made to feel like a stranger in my own country, SOME place resemble a third world City, and others like Nelson lancs  are basically Muslim enclaves.

This theory of yours that the Muslim community even wants to (genuinely) intergrate into British society falls flat on its bottom when you consider a recent ICM poll that suggest far from the normal pattern of integration. The following statements are taken from the channel 4 documentary following up from the poll-

Some 23% told ICM they would like there to be areas of Britain where Sharia law is introduced instead of laws laid down by Parliament.

The constant reassurances that only a “tiny” number of Muslims hold any of those dreadful views are swiftly revealed to be dangerous wishful thinking. One in three British Muslims thinks that taking a second wife is acceptable while 52% say that homosexuality should be illegal. (And, no, this is not a product of “Asian” culture because Sikhs and Hindus are among the strongest supporters of same-sex marriage.)

Anyone hoping that more liberal voices will emerge from younger Muslims can dream on: 35% of 18-to-24-year-olds think it’s cool to keep more than one wife.

39% of British Muslims believe that women should always obey their husbands.
As for the place of women, 39% of British Muslims believe that women should always obey their husbands. Ah, so that would account for the extremely low rate of Muslim inter-marriage: no self-respecting female would hook up with that kind of honking chauvinist piggery.

The part of the programme that upset me most is an interview with Elham Manea, a Muslim academic from Zurich who sat in on Sharia courts in the UK for four years. Elham was shocked to encounter “the most fundamentalist reading of Islam” you can find outside of the Taliban.

She says ruefully: “I did not expect to see segregated communities living by their own rules in the UK with grave consequences for the rights of women”. Nor did we, Elham, nor did we.

As I’ve already said Barra many Muslims in the U.K. do not think this way I’m not that blinkered but the concern for me is the numbers! because this in depth poll suggests that the passives and moderates may just be in the minority. Weather you like it or not the isslamification of the UK is growing but this is where you are blinkered in my opinion more Islam is a going to be a terrible thing for all of us.

Quoted from Grim74

First off! there is nowhere I have posted anywhere that I ascertain that every Muslim is a disciple for Sharia Law, Ridiculous.
I have worked and been in contact with many Muslims who are only Muslim in name, being a passive or even moderate Muslim. Of course many are just ordinary people who do not have a lot of interaction with islam and live their lives much like anybody else. ( you need to understand I totally get that).
But You need to understand Being “against islam” IS NOT THE SAME as being against all Muslims.

Like you I’ve worked around the East Midlands also Birmingham, Coventry, Luton, Stoke, most of West Yorkshire, Manchester, North and East London and I’ve got to say that my take on the Muslim community (interaction) is somewhat different from yours as there isn’t any. In fact SOME places I am made to feel like a stranger in my own country, SOME place resemble a third world City, and others like Nelson lancs  are basically Muslim enclaves.

This theory of yours that the Muslim community even wants to (genuinely) intergrate into British society falls flat on its bottom when you consider a recent ICM poll that suggest far from the normal pattern of integration. The following statements are taken from the channel 4 documentary following up from the poll-

Some 23% told ICM they would like there to be areas of Britain where Sharia law is introduced instead of laws laid down by Parliament.

The constant reassurances that only a “tiny” number of Muslims hold any of those dreadful views are swiftly revealed to be dangerous wishful thinking. One in three British Muslims thinks that taking a second wife is acceptable while 52% say that homosexuality should be illegal. (And, no, this is not a product of “Asian” culture because Sikhs and Hindus are among the strongest supporters of same-sex marriage.)

Anyone hoping that more liberal voices will emerge from younger Muslims can dream on: 35% of 18-to-24-year-olds think it’s cool to keep more than one wife.

39% of British Muslims believe that women should always obey their husbands.
As for the place of women, 39% of British Muslims believe that women should always obey their husbands. Ah, so that would account for the extremely low rate of Muslim inter-marriage: no self-respecting female would hook up with that kind of honking chauvinist piggery.

The part of the programme that upset me most is an interview with Elham Manea, a Muslim academic from Zurich who sat in on Sharia courts in the UK for four years. Elham was shocked to encounter “the most fundamentalist reading of Islam” you can find outside of the Taliban.

She says ruefully: “I did not expect to see segregated communities living by their own rules in the UK with grave consequences for the rights of women”. Nor did we, Elham, nor did we.

As I’ve already said Barra many Muslims in the U.K. do not think this way I’m not that blinkered but the concern for me is the numbers! because this in depth poll suggests that the passives and moderates may just be in the minority. Weather you like it or not the isslamification of the UK is growing but this is where you are blinkered in my opinion more Islam is a going to be a terrible thing for all of us.

Firstly (well actually possibly fifthly or sixthly by now) I am not a supporter of or an apologist for (copyright Marinerz93) Sharia Law. I don't believe in any form of capital punishment and am somewhat bemused by the desire of Muslims to have more than one spouse. The treatment of women in general under Sharia disgusts me. I cannot do copy and paste on my phone but some of the issues you raise in this latest post deserve closer examination.
23% of Muslims think Britain should have areas set aside for Sharia Law. So to introduce some sortvof perspective that's 23% of a group that make up less than 10% of the British population. It's not even a majority (or anywhere near) of Muslims!
Do we allow polygamy in this country? No of course we do not. Why? because the laws are rightly made by the majority. Not one British mainstream party has ever included polygamy in its election manifesto. For the legalisation of polygamous marriages to take place groups supporting it would have to have a very considerable majority...who knows what will happen in the distant future but I cannot speak for you but it ain't happening in my lifetime.
I can think of quite a few "Christian" groups who think that homosexuality should be illegal and these are people far closer to power and don't even get me started on fundamentalist right wing American Christian groups.  FFS it WAS illegal in this country until well into my lifetime. It isn't now because over time a majority believed that the law should change...it really isn't rocket science...