Does the Trust have the acumen to force Fenty out.

Quoted from lew chaterleys lover

As much as I dislike Fenty running the club, he must have something about him if he has convinced a fans organisation to give him money. He is probably very good at getting the best business deals but terrible transferring those skills to a customer based entity like a football club.

Only to a point though.. easier when he holds all the cards, uses them and adds a little sweet talk into getting what he wants by preying on the goodwill of others. It only lasts so long and eventually falls apart due to the inequity of the initial deal and the control he craves.

It's happened so often over the years with so many good people having to walk away even though they love the club..

The real skill is in negotiating equitable deals that are long lasting, not driving one side eventually into the ground..

Quoted from barralad

It's a totally different argument though to the view that should the club re-take control of the bars Sharon wouldn't continue to run them. As the person who has to balance the Trust's books I'm well aware of outside influences that can affect bar takings. This season has seen a steady decline helped by the misapprehension that people are directly hitting the club by boycotting the bars..
When people talk about the funds the Trust can raise it should never be forgotten that the club were instrumental in providing a means by which the 30K for a seat on the board could be achieved. It is entirely true that at the time the arrangement suited both camps (the bars were losing money because of a lack of expertise in the running of them) but the point Abdul made is entirely correct...it was the club's money in the first place. The Trust have through Shaz and co just made a much better job of maximising it. There are several scenarios around what would happen if the Trust relinquished the place on the Board of GTFC but to assume that we would simply be allowed to carry on and use the bars money for our own purposes may be very wide of the mark.

To my mind it’s a pretty poor deal.

The club get to hand over the hassle of running the bars etc, making more money than if they were running them, all in exchange for a completely ineffectual seat on the board.

The recent survey clearly shows that the fans no longer feel the Trust should be handing any money over for a seat on the board - when is this issue going to be addressed or are you just hoping that given time people will forget about this?

I’d also like to suggest that any funds that the Trust generate and pay to the club should be as share purchases rather than a simple donation - that way the club still gets the money but the Trust get something back too ie increased shareholding in the club.

I totally agree that instead giving the board 30k they should use that to buy shares.

Quoted from Davec

I totally agree that instead giving the board 30k they should use that to buy shares.

It's ok Barra, I'll explain this one (again).  The 30K is not actually the trusts money.  It is the clubs money. The current agreement (as I see it) is that the trust gets the money from the Bars as long as £30k of it is passed to the club in exchange for a seat on the board. The revenue from the bars is always the clubs money, whoever runs them.  By letting the trust run the bars, GTFC (ie JF) gives them the means to earn enough to pay for that seat. It is in the interest of both the club and the trust for the bars to be a success.  So I actually can understand JF wanting that money, it was always Towns money anyway, the trust just helped to maximise it.

The Trust could use other ways to raise money to buy shares if it so wanted. The problem is of course that JF will always want complete control so effectively it would just be a donation to the club.
Any sign of a power shift would result in similar turmoil to the Mike Parker fiasco.  I will quite happily support the trust in raising any funds that they had some kind of control over.  ie improving toilet facilities, or sound proofing the Ponny etc. Hopefully JF wouldn't see that as a disaster !!!!

Quoted from Civvy at last

It's ok Barra, I'll explain this one (again).  The 30K is not actually the trusts money.  It is the clubs money. The current agreement (as I see it) is that the trust gets the money from the Bars as long as £30k of it is passed to the club in exchange for a seat on the board. The revenue from the bars is always the clubs money, whoever runs them.  By letting the trust run the bars, GTFC (ie JF) gives them the means to earn enough to pay for that seat. It is in the interest of both the club and the trust for the bars to be a success.  So I actually can understand JF wanting that money, it was always Towns money anyway, the trust just helped to maximise it.

The Trust could use other ways to raise money to buy shares if it so wanted. The problem is of course that JF will always want complete control so effectively it would just be a donation to the club.
Any sign of a power shift would result in similar turmoil to the Mike Parker fiasco.  I will quite happily support the trust in raising any funds that they had some kind of control over.  ie improving toilet facilities, or sound proofing the Ponny etc. Hopefully JF wouldn't see that as a disaster !!!!

Yes I do understand so no need for the patronising

I understand it is the club's money, my point is I would rather the trust use 30k buying shares rather than give it to the club in return for another Fenty yes man.

I know that the club would in a sense be using their own money to buy the trust shares and Fenty wouldn't be willing, but Fenty and the board always insist they listen to fans (in which they don't) so why don't they back that up by effectively gifting the trust shares, very unlikely i know and maybe I'm being unrealistic but it's better than what we have now.

Quoted from Bigdog

Only to a point though.. easier when he holds all the cards, uses them and adds a little sweet talk into getting what he wants by preying on the goodwill of others. It only lasts so long and eventually falls apart due to the inequity of the initial deal and the control he craves.

It's happened so often over the years with so many good people having to walk away even though they love the club..

The real skill is in negotiating equitable deals that are long lasting, not driving one side eventually into the ground..

Oh I take your point entirely. That was what I was getting at - great if your trying to drive your competition into the ground; great for cutting costs to a bare minimum and great for short term gain from the companies point of view, but absolutely not the way to run a football club that is part of the community.

It is his mindset that is causing a lot of the problems.  

I don't see the point in buying shares (using whatever the Trust can access cash-wise) when it gave away a huge slice of (free) shares that it can never hope to replace.

Quoted from ginnywings

Doesn't that just show, that along with the catering, GTFC were missing out on much needed income by not maximising all possible income streams and it took the Trust to come along and show them how to properly manage them? All the while, the bar and catering (not to mention the toilet facilities) where all the bigwigs dine and drink, are of a much higher standard and seems to be well run. Funny that isn't it?

It's like when JF was asked about the catering facilities at the Fans Forum. He basically said that it was an outside contract so the club had no say on the standard of the food. So, no checks and balances about the food quality before handing out the contracts. It is the club's responsibility to the paying customer when they're handing out contracts to ensure that part of the matchday experience is a great one. Fish finger sandwiches, Lincolnshire sausages and properly brewed tea and coffee anyone? But no, sod the fans, take the money and pass the buck..

The toilet facilities a little different. It could be claimed by JF that there's no need to spend any more money on BP as the new stadium's round the corner. Well, what new stadium for a start. And on top of that, add the toilet facilities to the poor catering at half time and Town losing yet again, a fan might well be pointing percy and looking around and thinking, "this is disgusting". The toilet facilities won't be a prime reason for fans to decide not to attend but may form part of a larger grim view of the matchday experience. JF could then add that if money is spent on BP there would be less money for the playing budget and it could be countered with the fact that he's not attracted outside investment for years and if he had there would be the cash to do both.

Catering and toilets are two very simple problems to sort out, they've been ignored and all filter back to whose ultimate responsibility it is to deliver. It may seem petty of me to have a go about these two subjects when greater problems abound, but these two examples are symptomatic of how the football club is run..

Quoted from Bigdog

It's like when JF was asked about the catering facilities at the Fans Forum. He basically said that it was an outside contract so the club had no say on the standard of the food. So, no checks and balances about the food quality before handing out the contracts. It is the club's responsibility to the paying customer when they're handing out contracts to ensure that part of the matchday experience is a great one. Fish finger sandwiches, Lincolnshire sausages and properly brewed tea and coffee anyone? But no, sod the fans, take the money and pass the buck..

The toilet facilities a little different. It could be claimed by JF that there's no need to spend any more money on BP as the new stadium's round the corner. Well, what new stadium for a start. And on top of that, add the toilet facilities to the poor catering at half time and Town losing yet again, a fan might well be pointing percy and looking around and thinking, "this is disgusting". The toilet facilities won't be a prime reason for fans to decide not to attend but may form part of a larger grim view of the matchday experience. JF could then add that if money is spent on BP there would be less money for the playing budget and it could be countered with the fact that he's not attracted outside investment for years and if he had there would be the cash to do both.

Catering and toilets are two very simple problems to sort out, they've been ignored and all filter back to whose ultimate responsibility it is to deliver. It may seem petty of me to have a go about these two subjects when greater problems abound, but these two examples are symptomatic of how the football club is run..

Customer satisfaction appears to be irrelevant at GTFC, both onfield entertainment and off-field services fall way below an acceptable standard.