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That's cost us promotion

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MeanwoodMariner
April 18, 2015, 10:11pm

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Quoted from Civvy at last


You have NEVER heard me compare Hurst with other managers.

You sound like you are happy to stay in this tinpot league as long as we get most club points etc etc. well not for me, I want GTFC back in the league. Where they belong.


First point I completely accept and I wasn't singling you out. It was a far more general point.

As for the second point, Vance Warner said it perfectly. It's a simply ridiculous comment.
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TheRonRaffertyFanClub
April 18, 2015, 10:18pm
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Quoted from MeanwoodMariner


This sentence seems to sum up what Hurst is up against. Surely the whole season counts? Yes, it ultimately comes down to a 4 way shoot out, but that doesn't mean that 46 league games that preceded it should be considered as something that any old manager could have done.  We only have about a 25% chance of going up so by phrasing it like that you're stacking the odds heavily in favour of being proved right that Hurst isn't up to it. It's a false conclusion in my opinion, it's just not as black and white as: promotion = genius, defeat = clueless. Even if that is correct, we are still in with a chance of going up yet the stick keeps coming.

There is a seemingly relentless effort on here to find reasons to criticise the guy. We've lost one in 12 and after that one defeat there were loads of posts on here saying it was proof that we bottle it, or mess up when it really counts. Why didn't the other 11 "really count"? We equal the club's all time record for points in a season and does Hurst get a "well done" from anyone here? No, everyone immediately says that it doesn't count as a worthwhile achievement because this is only the conference.

I hate writing posts like this because I don't want to be labelled as blindly following Hurst. I think that entertainment is an important part of the game, and if Hurst's teams are too dull, then that is reasonable grounds for getting rid. I also think it was infuriating the way we started the season with so few options upfront - that was Hurst's fault and it probably cost us a chance of winning this league.

Hurst is relatively new to professional management. He certainly has his flaws, but I think many people are being needlessly hostile and simply refusing to acknowledge he is improving.

The likes of Gary Mills and Steve Burr have often been raised as more talented managers but neither has done any good this year. But nobody previously calling for those 2 to take charge has to retract it, it's just forgotten. There's not been one person saying "it's a good thing we stuck with Hurst because Mills is clearly clueless now". Nope, what happens is other names come in instead. I read a post earlier today saying that if Martin Allen had been in charge we would have won the league. It just feels like a one way street to me and there is virtually nothing Hurst can do to turn it round.


Some good points there Meanwood. In some ways it has felt churlish to criticise Hurst when the points have been coming in and it is true what you say, he has improved as a manager.

I think the problem of Hurst's image is not a simple one to answer. The performances have not matched the results for one thing and for a good part of the season the issue of gates and atmosphere has been a big one. While many of us would accept grinding our way out of this league any way we can, there is still the point that performances at home have not encouraged supporters to get behind them. It has been more about mental attitude than playing ability and the manager's interviews have not helped a lot.

If we accept that Hurst is more interested in points than plaudits we can indeed congratulate him on the best total we have achieved in the Conference. However there has been more than one occasion when the manager has cost us points through tactics, substitutions and team selection. That record total could easily have been several points higher and we could be looking at automatic promotion tonight. This isn't hindsight, the comments were made at the time of the games. Of course football is a game of "if's" and "buts" and if my aunt had spherical objects she'd be my uncle. But nevertheless those comments were valid.

Should we get through the playoffs and find ourselves reading Town's name in the Div 2 fixture list for August, I will be happy to nominate Hurst for manager of the year, the Nobel Peace Prize and a knighthood. But we have had so many false dawns and disappointments that he will have to wait until the final whistle at Wembley.




“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.”
― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
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moosey_club
April 18, 2015, 10:41pm
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Quoted from RichMariner


But I'm not sure 'that' other manager would've been able to build the squad Hurst has done.


Anyway, all we can do is trust Hurst. He hasn't got a great track record with us in the Conference, but he has improved our squad from the one we had this time last year.

.


Hurst has built an unbalanced squad as our attacking options are limited, is it stronger/ better than last years...time will tell.  Is the league weaker this year as many think or conversely is the league getting stronger? so much so easy games are getting rarer.




2023/24 DLWDDWDLLLWDLLLLWDDDWDLLWLDLLDWDDWL
2022/23LDWDWWDWLLDWWDLLLDLWLLWLWLLWDDLDWWDDDLLWDWLWLW
2021/22 WDWWWWDLWWWWLLLWLLDLWLLWWDWWWLWDLWWDWWWDLWD play offs WWW Promoted 🥳
2020/21  LLDWWLDLDWLWLLLDLWLLDLLDLLLWLLLDDDDWDDDLWLWLWL .. hello darkness my old friend
2019/20  WDLDWWLDLWWLLLDLDLDLDDWWDLLWDDWWL WLLW - ended
2018/19  LWDDLLLLLLWWDWLLLWDWLWWWWLLLLWWWWDLLLDDLLDLWLW Hello Scunny  
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GrimRob
April 19, 2015, 12:08am

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Quoted from The Grim Reaper
Dover's late equaliser against Bristol Rovers. Mark my words.


We were written off by people like you when we played Fulham in 1998 and look what happened!


'Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.  
~ Alfred Lord Tennyson

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rancido
April 19, 2015, 8:54am

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You only have to look back at how long it took Luton to get back into the League to realise it's not that simple. They had greater resources than us and tried several managers before they got promoted.


The Future is Black & White.
"The commonest thing on this planet is not water , as some people believe, but stupidity ". Frank Zappa
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HertsGTFC
April 19, 2015, 12:41pm

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Quoted from rancido
You only have to look back at how long it took Luton to get back into the League to realise it's not that simple. They had greater resources than us and tried several managers before they got promoted.


Good point that...... and it was the same with Cambridge, last year too as well . The thing Luton also had was that everyone fans, players, staff, directors where united and all focussed and on the same object - Promotion. Reading some posts I am not sure we are as the doom and gloom merchants will always be negative towards the club, players and manager regardless of who we have.

  



"Crombie you would have got to that if you weren't such a fat ba%$@rd" - George Kerr, inspiration from the dug out 70s style  
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TheRonRaffertyFanClub
April 19, 2015, 1:40pm
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Quoted from HertsGTFC


Good point that...... and it was the same with Cambridge, last year too as well . The thing Luton also had was that everyone fans, players, staff, directors where united and all focussed and on the same object - Promotion. Reading some posts I am not sure we are as the doom and gloom merchants will always be negative towards the club, players and manager regardless of who we have.

  



Doom and gloom would be negativity about everything, everybody and at every time for no good reason. That's not what you see on the Fishy. Or very rarely at least. You see criticism of team selection, substitutions, tactics, attitudes ....... some of it right and some of it wrong depending on how you feel.

But at the root of this is history. For so many years supporters have been disappointed. It's as simple as that and it goes back to well before relegation. Bad decisions in the boardroom, bad decisions in the dressing room and bad performances on the pitch mean that people find it hard to be as optimistic as they used to be in their younger days and perhaps younger supporters are today. That sort of experience cannot be instantly erased by a few good results, a play off place and some exhortations to get behind the team.

So maybe not gloom and doom, more like cynicism over the hype and a genuine desire for the proof of the pudding.


“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.”
― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
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oldun
April 19, 2015, 2:51pm

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I admit I have only seen home games this season, but I can honestly say that the quality generally in the conference this season is the worst since we came down. Lots of average or mediocre teams. As for town there have been times when we have played pretty well, times when we played poorly but managed to win and too many occasions when we looked second best to poor teams. Finally it will be no surprise if Bristol fail to get promoted. Relegated teams rarely go straight back up.
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arryarryarry
April 19, 2015, 8:06pm
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Quoted from HertsGTFC


Good point that...... and it was the same with Cambridge, last year too as well . The thing Luton also had was that everyone fans, players, staff, directors where united and all focussed and on the same object - Promotion. Reading some posts I am not sure we are as the doom and gloom merchants will always be negative towards the club, players and manager regardless of who we have.

  



Another one blaming the fans?

You clearly never went on the Luton Outlaws site because if comments could kill, several of the managers prior to John Still would now be dead.

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HertsGTFC
April 19, 2015, 8:31pm

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Quoted from arryarryarry


Another one blaming the fans?

You clearly never went on the Luton Outlaws site because if comments could kill, several of the managers prior to John Still would now be dead.



Nah...... never saw the site just live 18 miles away from Luton and work in North London/Beds/Bucks so have had to put up with it last year and also this year with Barnet and their average 1800 gate.  


"Crombie you would have got to that if you weren't such a fat ba%$@rd" - George Kerr, inspiration from the dug out 70s style  
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