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Negative fans attitude and its influence on the te

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tanga_the_indestructible
January 7, 2015, 9:32am
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The point about younger fans is fair enough. Lincoln seem to have a good bunch with the Dambusters.

But support isn't why Town do better away. The side is set up to react to what other sides do. It is based on deep defence first and foremost. If the other side don't want to or are not good enough to push up and leave spaces for us to play behind them we are stuck. Lack of creativity and pace going forward, wingers playing as extra full backs, it just runs us into cul-de-sacs and we end up playing across them or knocking hopeful balls up to LJL. Away from home everything is a bonus and we accept that a result means more than playing well. At home we are not so forgiving.


You're right that the team is set up in a way benefits away performances, but still I think the original poster is right. I've lived almost my whole adult life away from Grimsby so mainly go to away games and the atmosphere on the few occasions I go to home games now is so toxic, I've actually arranged to come home and see the family on occasions when there's not even a home game happening, because it's so depressing being at BP- unthinkable during the Buckley years.

I'd far rather go to away games, where there are always at least 500 Town fans who are committed, back the team, and provide the sort of support we could really do with at home.
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ackomariner
January 7, 2015, 9:42am

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You're right that the team is set up in a way benefits away performances, but still I think the original poster is right. I've lived almost my whole adult life away from Grimsby so mainly go to away games and the atmosphere on the few occasions I go to home games now is so toxic, I've actually arranged to come home and see the family on occasions when there's not even a home game happening, because it's so depressing being at BP- unthinkable during the Buckley years.

I'd far rather go to away games, where there are always at least 500 Town fans who are committed, back the team, and provide the sort of support we could really do with at home.


The support is there at home games but the players and the manager seem so inept to do the simple things that win football matches


UTM
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barralad
January 7, 2015, 9:56am
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We are not a non-league side. We are a league side that by sheer bad management finds itself in the conference. It is defeatist attitudes that got us where we are and defeatist attitudes on the pitch and in the boardroom that are keeping us here. We have every right to be top and every right to demand it.


Delicious irony..   What about the defeatist attitudes on here? Since 4:50 p.m. on New Years Day this whole board has been a very large pot of relentless negativity with each new thread seemingly trying to outdo the previous one for the post apocalyptic depths to which it is prepared to go.. Anyone who challenges this is accused of not living in the real world. Some even concede that they were realists in the days of the Championship knowing we were punching above our weight but cannot, seemingly adapt that realism to our current situation. Despite that, I remember clearly that there were people for whom Championship football wasn't enough. I remember the "vox pop" interviews in the streets when Buckley was sacked in 2000 and there was quite a lot of comment along the lines of "Well he's taken us as far as he can" I was gutted when we were relegated and even more so at the end of our first season because we hadn't gone straight back up. This was because I knew in my heart that season on season it would get harder to get back as budgetary constraints kicked in when parachute payments ended and the funding for our youth system ended.
Instead of "slowly falling out of love with the club" (Where IS FFS when you need him my coping mechanism consisted of trying to do my bit and not treating every defeat/setback as a dagger to my heart. You see if I'd felt as the likes of  PontoonLew do where there is an obvious need to write a heartfelt "Dear John" (no pun intended) letter I know that I'd have just stopped going.That doesn't mean I don't appreciate his feelings but different people deal with things in different ways. I won't be on my own in this but I've had a lot happen to me in the last ten years that really do put football and GTFC into perspective. I live in the perpetual hope that the team will turn the corner but, to be honest, I actually think I'd continue to watch them regardless (ooops! as I write this I have an image of the likes of TAGG building up to spontaneous combustion ) . It won't be a popular view but it is mine and I have no problem sharing it. When I was younger I always had a soft spot for fans who followed teams like Rochdale (given the area they lived in). For years they had nothing to show for their support other than trying to achieve the record for the number of successful applications for re-election). Now they are living the dream. Football fan-ism is a cyclical thing. At least we've been there and there is no reason why we cannot get back-eventually. If not, well there is always the chance to sample the food at Kidderminster....  


The aim of argument or discussion should not be victory but progress.

Joseph Joubert.
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barralad
January 7, 2015, 9:58am
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Quoted from ackomariner


The support is there at home games but the players and the manager seem so inept to do the simple things that win football matches


1. It's qualified support

2. Patently untrue....we've won considerably more matches than we've lost...


The aim of argument or discussion should not be victory but progress.

Joseph Joubert.
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Les Brechin
January 7, 2015, 10:04am

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Quoted from barralad


Delicious irony..   What about the defeatist attitudes on here? Since 4:50 p.m. on New Years Day this whole board has been a very large pot of relentless negativity with each new thread seemingly trying to outdo the previous one for the post apocalyptic depths to which it is prepared to go.. Anyone who challenges this is accused of not living in the real world. Some even concede that they were realists in the days of the Championship knowing we were punching above our weight but cannot, seemingly adapt that realism to our current situation. Despite that, I remember clearly that there were people for whom Championship football wasn't enough. I remember the "vox pop" interviews in the streets when Buckley was sacked in 2000 and there was quite a lot of comment along the lines of "Well he's taken us as far as he can" I was gutted when we were relegated and even more so at the end of our first season because we hadn't gone straight back up. This was because I knew in my heart that season on season it would get harder to get back as budgetary constraints kicked in when parachute payments ended and the funding for our youth system ended.
Instead of "slowly falling out of love with the club" (Where IS FFS when you need him my coping mechanism consisted of trying to do my bit and not treating every defeat/setback as a dagger to my heart. You see if I'd felt as the likes of  PontoonLew do where there is an obvious need to write a heartfelt "Dear John" (no pun intended) letter I know that I'd have just stopped going.That doesn't mean I don't appreciate his feelings but different people deal with things in different ways. I won't be on my own in this but I've had a lot happen to me in the last ten years that really do put football and GTFC into perspective. I live in the perpetual hope that the team will turn the corner but, to be honest, I actually think I'd continue to watch them regardless (ooops! as I write this I have an image of the likes of TAGG building up to spontaneous combustion ) . It won't be a popular view but it is mine and I have no problem sharing it. When I was younger I always had a soft spot for fans who followed teams like Rochdale (given the area they lived in). For years they had nothing to show for their support other than trying to achieve the record for the number of successful applications for re-election). Now they are living the dream. Football fan-ism is a cyclical thing. At least we've been there and there is no reason why we cannot get back-eventually. If not, well there is always the chance to sample the food at Kidderminster....  

Probably the most sensible sentence in this whole debate!



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TheRonRaffertyFanClub
January 7, 2015, 10:22am
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Quoted from barralad


Delicious irony..   What about the defeatist attitudes on here? Since 4:50 p.m. on New Years Day this whole board has been a very large pot of relentless negativity with each new thread seemingly trying to outdo the previous one for the post apocalyptic depths to which it is prepared to go.. Anyone who challenges this is accused of not living in the real world. Some even concede that they were realists in the days of the Championship knowing we were punching above our weight but cannot, seemingly adapt that realism to our current situation. Despite that, I remember clearly that there were people for whom Championship football wasn't enough. I remember the "vox pop" interviews in the streets when Buckley was sacked in 2000 and there was quite a lot of comment along the lines of "Well he's taken us as far as he can" I was gutted when we were relegated and even more so at the end of our first season because we hadn't gone straight back up. This was because I knew in my heart that season on season it would get harder to get back as budgetary constraints kicked in when parachute payments ended and the funding for our youth system ended.
Instead of "slowly falling out of love with the club" (Where IS FFS when you need him my coping mechanism consisted of trying to do my bit and not treating every defeat/setback as a dagger to my heart. You see if I'd felt as the likes of  PontoonLew do where there is an obvious need to write a heartfelt "Dear John" (no pun intended) letter I know that I'd have just stopped going.That doesn't mean I don't appreciate his feelings but different people deal with things in different ways. I won't be on my own in this but I've had a lot happen to me in the last ten years that really do put football and GTFC into perspective. I live in the perpetual hope that the team will turn the corner but, to be honest, I actually think I'd continue to watch them regardless (ooops! as I write this I have an image of the likes of TAGG building up to spontaneous combustion ) . It won't be a popular view but it is mine and I have no problem sharing it. When I was younger I always had a soft spot for fans who followed teams like Rochdale (given the area they lived in). For years they had nothing to show for their support other than trying to achieve the record for the number of successful applications for re-election). Now they are living the dream. Football fan-ism is a cyclical thing. At least we've been there and there is no reason why we cannot get back-eventually. If not, well there is always the chance to sample the food at Kidderminster....  


Nice post Barra and I appreciate your points.

Negativity? I plead guilty but there is no irony. I'm only negative about the self-evident lack of positivity in the club and on the pitch. Perhaps not negativity then, just moaning. I'm negative about the way the club is run and the way the team is managed because I know that something could be done about both issues given the will power and determination. Promotion per se is not necessarily about money either though it obviously helps. It is about getting rid of silly ideas like for example keeping the bench warm with players who are never played or given 10 minutes here and there. We should have been signing players who offer immediate benefits to a promotion push.

Realistic? I am a confessed unrealistic in the sense of not accepting where we are as a status quo but I am completely realistic about where we should be and how to get there. It is possible if the club really puts all the energy into it. Put aside the time and cash being spent on a new stadium for a bit and concentrate 100% on getting the club back where it belongs.

Cyclical? Totally agree. I learned that lesson as a kid in the old boys paddock in 1957 when we were about to be relegated and 1962 when we stormed back into Div 2 only to sink again 3 years later. Two relegations and a promotion in 7 years. But the lesson we learn from that is that you cannot stand still in football either on the pitch or in the boardroom. You either go up or you go down. There is no happy medium.

My bottom line in this is that I would accept the club oscillating between Leagues 1 & 2 but not between L2 and the conference. We are a league club and we need to get in there fast before things get worse. This issue is about money as well though, in the long term as gates decline further and a new ground becomes essential rather than just desirable.


“If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.”
― John Stuart Mill, On Liberty."
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lew chaterleys lover
January 7, 2015, 11:42am
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Quoted from barralad


Delicious irony..   What about the defeatist attitudes on here? Since 4:50 p.m. on New Years Day this whole board has been a very large pot of relentless negativity with each new thread seemingly trying to outdo the previous one for the post apocalyptic depths to which it is prepared to go.. Anyone who challenges this is accused of not living in the real world. Some even concede that they were realists in the days of the Championship knowing we were punching above our weight but cannot, seemingly adapt that realism to our current situation. Despite that, I remember clearly that there were people for whom Championship football wasn't enough. I remember the "vox pop" interviews in the streets when Buckley was sacked in 2000 and there was quite a lot of comment along the lines of "Well he's taken us as far as he can" I was gutted when we were relegated and even more so at the end of our first season because we hadn't gone straight back up. This was because I knew in my heart that season on season it would get harder to get back as budgetary constraints kicked in when parachute payments ended and the funding for our youth system ended.
Instead of "slowly falling out of love with the club" (Where IS FFS when you need him my coping mechanism consisted of trying to do my bit and not treating every defeat/setback as a dagger to my heart. You see if I'd felt as the likes of  PontoonLew do where there is an obvious need to write a heartfelt "Dear John" (no pun intended) letter I know that I'd have just stopped going.That doesn't mean I don't appreciate his feelings but different people deal with things in different ways. I won't be on my own in this but I've had a lot happen to me in the last ten years that really do put football and GTFC into perspective. I live in the perpetual hope that the team will turn the corner but, to be honest, I actually think I'd continue to watch them regardless (ooops! as I write this I have an image of the likes of TAGG building up to spontaneous combustion ) . It won't be a popular view but it is mine and I have no problem sharing it. When I was younger I always had a soft spot for fans who followed teams like Rochdale (given the area they lived in). For years they had nothing to show for their support other than trying to achieve the record for the number of successful applications for re-election). Now they are living the dream. Football fan-ism is a cyclical thing. At least we've been there and there is no reason why we cannot get back-eventually. If not, well there is always the chance to sample the food at Kidderminster....  

Yes we ( well most) diehard fans still continue to go; some of us for 50 years or more, and yes I suppose if things got even worse we would still continue to go.

The trouble is the more you get used to it (being non league) the harder it will be to get back. We have a history and tradition that clubs like Rochdale can only dream about ( and I too very much respect Rochdale and their fans) but I can see us being another Accrington and it taking decades to get back if we are not careful.

You may argue that being in division 5 isn't all bad, there are  some professional clubs in there and we have a better chance than Accrington ever did to get back due to the pyramid system, but we have been saying these things for many years now. We thought we would bounce back after relegation from the Championship, from League 1, League 2 so who is say we have reached the bottom yet?

The truth is, however anybody dresses it up, is that we have been appallingly led by those who own the club for many years. I cannot do anything about it. You can't do anything about it. They say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result, and I just don't see any way to break the cycle until/unless the club is run differently by some new people; but that scenario looks years away unless a minor miracle occurs and the new stadium is actually built and BP is sold .

So, I will continue to go to the games, as I assume the majority on here will, but with less passion than in previous times, hoping we might be able to win the play offs if we get there; but new generations of fans will not put up with that I don't think. They will need to see a club with ambition and one that is geared for success.

Previous generations have ensured that the foundations are there for success really - a good fan base, history, tradition and a stadium that when rocking still looks the part, but whereas a lot of smaller clubs have through a combination of money/strategy/infrastructure/investment have made great strides that have left some traditional clubs trapped in the dark ages.  

It is a terrible shame, but I guess each of us will have to react to current circumstances in our different ways.      
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ginnywings
January 7, 2015, 12:18pm

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Do you know what? The fact that people are still "moaning" as some put it is actually a good sign. A sign that people still care enough about this club and want to see a change. When people stop moaning and just accept it, then that's when the club will seriously be in the excrement.

I hear more and more comments along the lines of " i'm past caring" or " i just don't want to go anymore" or " it's fooking boring".  That is the scary bit.

Someone , somewhere needs to shake this club out of it's lethargy before it's too late. We can only keep plodding along so long with the diehard 3000 fans. Something has to be done to get those floating fans back at BP before they are gone forever and we need to do everything in our power to keep the ones that still go every week before they too start drifting away too.
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MuddyWaters
January 7, 2015, 3:21pm
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Quoted from ginnywings
Do you know what? The fact that people are still "moaning" as some put it is actually a good sign. A sign that people still care enough about this club and want to see a change. When people stop moaning and just accept it, then that's when the club will seriously be in the excrement.

I hear more and more comments along the lines of " i'm past caring" or " i just don't want to go anymore" or " it's fooking boring".  That is the scary bit.

Someone , somewhere needs to shake this club out of it's lethargy before it's too late. We can only keep plodding along so long with the diehard 3000 fans. Something has to be done to get those floating fans back at BP before they are gone forever and we need to do everything in our power to keep the ones that still go every week before they too start drifting away too.


As usual Ginny, you've hit the nail on the head. If I was past caring, I wouldn't spend so long on here moaning about what has befallen our club. I'm proud of GTFC but I'm not proud of where we are or how we're run.

I read on Facebook when Skint was on that one of my 'friends' was ashamed of Grimsby - how can you be ashamed of your own heritage which, in my case, meant going to Blundell Park when I was 4, having a junior season ticket etc. This is where it hurts, when you see supposed professionals pulling on the same colours that have been worn by so many with so much pride and then playing like they've been paid yesterday and now don't give a excrement till next payday.

Is it because the players don't allow themselves to connect with the fans? I can understand why due to the duration of the contract but even the manager still lives in Rotherham, so how can he understand the pride and tradition that the fans feel?

There are far more questions than answers and I'll always be a Mariner, I wouldn't have it any other way.
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psgmariner
January 7, 2015, 3:37pm

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Quoted from Vance Warner


I really hope the mentality of 'give your all and we'll get behind you' still exists but the criticism of Lenny earlier in the season suggests not.  


Excellent point. It is absolute bollox to suggest Town fans get behind players who try their hardest. The treatment of LJL proves this.

Fans DO have to take some responsibility here. It certainly IS a problem and it certainly DOES have an effect on player performance.


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