just back

I remember telling my York supporting mate that we'd signed Brown and that he looked ace in pre-season and he scoffed, laughing and saying that we should wait a while. Evidently they thought him well below par for their promotion seeking team and offloaded him quick sticks. He added that he had come on as a sub at Wembley and just froze, before running around a lot like a scared rabbit, generally hiding.
I told him that I thought he had looked very accomplished for Southport against us and superb in the summer and early part of the season.

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

Spot on Chris.

Don't you feel the signs have been there for a long time though? What you are saying has been happening for weeks/months but disguised by a bit of luck and the old 'sign of a good team if it can win while playing badly' mantra. Seems to me that people have been clutching at straws trying to find good bits to emphasise when the truth has been staring us in the face even in games we have won.

There are some reasonable players in this squad but all of them only seem comfortable in a tight formation away from home where they don't have to make decisions. Is that their natural game, was that what the manager bought them for, or is it the coaching and tactics?

When faced with the need to play a more expansive and perhaps risky game at home or even against lower opposition away, they seem predictable, incapable, lacking in ideas and confidence - almost as though they are afraid and waiting for some Subbuteo move from the manager. If Plan A isn't working they react in the only way players will always react, they just go through the motions.

Agreed.

it is much easier to play in a 'tight' formation, to close down, to cover one another and we are able to break when away from home.

At home when the onus is on us we dont have players with nous and guile. Vitally, in my opinion, we  are crying out for a central midfielder who consistently supports and at times runs beyond the strikers. Clay and Brown play with the game in front of them and Disley has also become more similar. Whether that is instruction or not i dont know.

I appreciate wide players by their nature are often inconsistent but i arent convinced any of them are good enough. Nielson is too indisciplined to play in a 4-4-2 but i do like him behind the striker(s) in a free role.

Not sure if we have the personnel to go 4-2-3-1 but that is a formation that allows you to be solid but equally attack minded if full backs join in.

I expect a flurry of activity with 3 or so ins and outs to fresh things up but equally to give us more impetus and creativity going forward. If we get it right that will help but we must set up to really go out and win games and win them well. PH says he sends them out with the emphasis on tempo and momentum but for whatever reasons that isnt being transferred onto the pitch

This thread contains more sense than every other one put together....but will anyone listen?!

We are only the plebeians making a noise what do we know.

I was originally of the opinion that it was a good sign when the results were coming in OK, even though we weren't playing too well. Surely, I thought, things would improve when we actually began to play better?

However, the number of dreadful performances we have seen from a variety of players over the past month now makes me think we just don't have enough ability in the squad to play well enough most of the time. Our (previously) strong defence has masked the glaring weaknesses in midfield and attacking positions but a couple of injuries/suspensions has meant that we've not even been able to rely on the backline over the past two games and the performances have duly flopped miserably.

You can't win games when only one or two players out of the eleven are putting in a decent shift and the rest of them are playing inadequately and we have seen this much too often this season, especially at home.

I still put most of the blame for these failings on the players themselves but it is certainly Hurst's squad and he's now admitted there are weaknesses there so we need to strengthen. The past couple of years, the unfortunate injuries to Hearn gave Hurst an excuse for not being able to sort out the attack properly as that would have been much of his budget tied up there. No similar excuse this year and, though LJL and Pittman are doing OK, the back-up options up front are pretty much non-existent at the moment. Hannah doesn't look like he'll ever be a threat again and Watson is extremely inexperienced at this level. When you add to this the poor form of Arnold and indifferent form of Mackreth and Neilson, it's amazing we're creating any chances at all but we still seem to miss too many of the ones we do!

Most important is to get Magnay and Toto back to steady the ship at the back. On current form, I'd drop Thomas and play Magnay on the left because Bignot has looked much more solid of the two full-backs over the past game and a half and I think he's less likely to make the errors. 4 out of 5 goals came directly down our left over the past 2 games and it doesn't take a genius to work out there is a reason for this.

If Hurst can sign a powerful, athletic central midfielder to play alongside (and do the legwork and running for) our other lightweight midfielders, we might be able salvage something from the season, but I think at least 2 or 3 decent players are probably required and I simply can't see us finding them.

Quoted from Maringer

I was originally of the opinion that it was a good sign when the results were coming in OK, even though we weren't playing too well. Surely, I thought, things would improve when we actually began to play better?

However, the number of dreadful performances we have seen from a variety of players over the past month now makes me think we just don't have enough ability in the squad to play well enough most of the time. Our (previously) strong defence has masked the glaring weaknesses in midfield and attacking positions but a couple of injuries/suspensions has meant that we've not even been able to rely on the backline over the past two games and the performances have duly flopped miserably.

You can't win games when only one or two players out of the eleven are putting in a decent shift and the rest of them are playing inadequately and we have seen this much too often this season, especially at home.

I still put most of the blame for these failings on the players themselves but it is certainly Hurst's squad and he's now admitted there are weaknesses there so we need to strengthen. The past couple of years, the unfortunate injuries to Hearn gave Hurst an excuse for not being able to sort out the attack properly as that would have been much of his budget tied up there. No similar excuse this year and, though LJL and Pittman are doing OK, the back-up options up front are pretty much non-existent at the moment. Hannah doesn't look like he'll ever be a threat again and Watson is extremely inexperienced at this level. When you add to this the poor form of Arnold and indifferent form of Mackreth and Neilson, it's amazing we're creating any chances at all but we still seem to miss too many of the ones we do!

Most important is to get Magnay and Toto back to steady the ship at the back. On current form, I'd drop Thomas and play Magnay on the left because Bignot has looked much more solid of the two full-backs over the past game and a half and I think he's less likely to make the errors. 4 out of 5 goals came directly down our left over the past 2 games and it doesn't take a genius to work out there is a reason for this.

If Hurst can sign a powerful, athletic central midfielder to play alongside (and do the legwork and running for) our other lightweight midfielders, we might be able salvage something from the season, but I think at least 2 or 3 decent players are probably required and I simply can't see us finding them.

well that will go one of two ways ..

1. He will sign him and then never play him.

2. He wont sign anyone.

Quoted from chaos33

I remember telling my York supporting mate that we'd signed Brown and that he looked ace in pre-season and he scoffed, laughing and saying that we should wait a while. Evidently they thought him well below par for their promotion seeking team and offloaded him quick sticks. He added that he had come on as a sub at Wembley and just froze, before running around a lot like a scared rabbit, generally hiding.
I told him that I thought he had looked very accomplished for Southport against us and superb in the summer and early part of the season.

There are far too many on here who see a good performance against us and then say "let's sign him" then when we do they pleasure themselves.

Unfortunately playing well against us doesn't make someone a great player, Mackreth immediately springs to mind, I cannot remember if he has had one outstanding game for us and to me offers no more than Joe Colbeck did.

I didn't f@cking sign him did I?!

Summed up for me by the fact I couldn't think of a genuine candidate for Man of the Match.  In the end I thought probably Mackreth on the basis he wasn't as bad as the rest of them and at least had a go at running at them a couple of times.  Next up was Bignot!

From the back to the front, we don't look good enough.  A left hand side with an uninterested Arnold and a off form Aswad is up there with the worst I've seen in 25 years supporting Town.  Brown has done a Kerr and gone backwards after a great start, Clay looks half the player he was earlier in the summer, Pittman doesn't seem anywhere near as dynamic, Pearson looks more like the donkey we first signed than the dominant centre-half of the last two years.

I don't mind losing, I don't mind having crap players.  What I can't stomach is players putting in half arsed displays and a manager on the sideline who doesn't have a clue tactically.    It doesn't matter who we're playing, if we're home/away or what the conditions are, our tactics are the same every game.  Hurst says he doesn't send his teams out to play long ball and he wants them to play high tempo......if the players aren't playing as per his instructions why does he still pick them?  Be that the fault of the player hoofing it or the players in front of them who aren't giving options, MAKE A CHANGE!!!!  Drop one of your favourites for a player who will benefit the team.  Hell, even change the formation away from the most rigid 4-4-2 known to mankind.  

For the whole of the second half, we created absolutely nothing.  The strikers didn't get a sniff.  Hurst's response, throw on two guys from the bench who have barely kicked a ball in anger for the last two months and have played together once (?) in a friendly game against Boston's kids team.  How many opportunities has Hurst had in recent weeks to give Watson (to a lesser extent Hannah too) 20 minutes at the end of games?  Instead he chucks them both in when the chips are down, service is crap and we're struggling.  One on maybe, maybe both alongside a match-fit striker if we're really pushing for it.  Not both together as a pairing.    The fact they're rusty didn't half show.  Watson looks useful and a handful but he was a bit like a rabbit in headlights at times.  Hannah on the other hand looked like he had never played the game before.

For me we've got 3 genuinely explosive players who can create something from nothing.  Neilson through his sheer craft and guile, Pittman through his physical attributes and Arnold as a combination of both technical and physical attributes.  This season Hurst has stifled Neilson beyond belief, even more frustrating when he was actually given a licence to roam earlier in the season.  Pittman made the error of showing he can head  the ball as he's now become a target-man to lump the ball up to, occasionally getting the opportunity to use his pace when a hoof is over hit into the channels.  Arnold has gone off the boil badly and may need a bollocking or an arm round the shoulder, I don't see Hurst delivering either.  

Those three players should be what our system is based around.  Everyone else compliments them.  Not building it round a utility man on loan from York who can play multiple positions (some better than others), not a 5'10" striker to not win headers, not around a lightweight winger who doesn't have quite enough pace to go past a man but has enough to cut in and cause the odd problem with direct running.

Lincoln game - Not enough tempo.  Awkward yet pretty average striker causes us too much problems at the back, especially Parslow.  Advanced midfielder sits off the frontman/men and completely controls play.  Left wing exposed too often.

Bad enough we did sod all to counter any of the above factors during the game, but to then be undone by the exact same thing four days later.  That's either lazy, stupid or just down right arrogant.  If Hurst is that easily undone, he's not going to get us out the league.  Even if he does perform a miracle and get us up, then what?  Does anyone actually think he has the potential to mastermind victories at a higher level?


The same thing will happen again, we'll go unbeaten for five before bottling the chances we have to make up ground on the leaders.  We'll finish fourth/fifth before falling at the first play-off hurdle which is simply not good enough with the sheer quality of players in this squad.    Any other side in this league (indeed a fair few in the one above) would build their team around a Scott Neilson.  We've had him on the bench for the last two months.

Quoted from jonnyboy82

well that will go one of two ways ..

1. He will sign him and then never play him.

2. He wont sign anyone.

There is a number 3 -

PH will sign someone, he will look the part for a game, then the runs into the box will stop and he will become the same as the others and play behind the ball.