Relocation.

Interesting points made by JF in tonights GET about getting the burgeoning wind-power companies on board as far as commercial support is concerned. The article also mentioned the 295 members of staff employed by GTFC. Obviously a lot of these will be match-day employees and also support staff with the Youth set-up etc. But is does raise the point that if any other local industry that employed that amount of staff was to state that they had to relocate in the area or go bust then I'm sure the council would be jumping through hoops to help them! I don't think a lot of these " nimbys" realise just what the football club contributes to the local economy. It's not just football, it's employment, aspirations for young players wanting to be pro footballers ie have a career and the wealth generated to the support industries.

What a good idea. An Eco friendly football ground that cod be part self sufficient. Solar panels on the roof ?if structurally  sound, rain water recycled, even wind turbines used. It would certainly keep defruityarse and the Eco warriors schtum

Quoted from WOZOFGRIMSBY

What a good idea. An Eco friendly football ground that cod be part self sufficient. Solar panels on the roof ?if structurally  sound, rain water recycled, even wind turbines used. It would certainly keep defruityarse and the Eco warriors schtum

and they could perhaps sell only vegan food and drinks in the shops.....hang on a minute ....this is ringing a bell....

Quoted from WOZOFGRIMSBY

What a good idea. An Eco friendly football ground that cod be part self sufficient. Solar panels on the roof ?if structurally  sound, rain water recycled, even wind turbines used. It would certainly keep defruityarse and the Eco warriors schtum

Stick enough solar panels on it and sell leccy back to the grid after a few years... wind turbines even better.

For me the I was pleased to hear cycling routes to and from the ground to town centre were part of the proposals. Properly secure bike storage as well would be key, something inside part of the ground ideally.

I´ll probably get called an ecowarrier on here but think they´d be great plus-points for any new development.

In the GET it states leisure complex. What would this include? Or should I say what would you like it to include?

You'll never get permission to have wind turbines that close to a residential area, IMO. Too noisy. Wind power is very unreliable so fundamentally relies on gas generation back-up at present in any case so won't be particularly 'green' regardless. Until a cost-effective energy storage technology is developed (other than hydro), renewables are only ever going to provide a fraction of our power. Now, if we tried to build the stadium in conjuction with a nuclear power station, I'd be all for that.  

Not close enough to population centres for that to happen, however.

Solar panels are mostly a waste of time in temperate regions. Very, very poor capacity factor. When the governments drop their subsidies further (as they undoubtedly will in due course), you're looking at an expensive installation which will cost a lot on upkeep with little, if any return.

Greenwashing this proposed development won't do anything but add cost and we really need to keep that to a minimum. By all means try and get sponsorship from Siemens or one of the other big wind turbine companies, but don't muck about trying to 'greenify' the development as that will do nothing but add cost.

Quoted from Maringer

You'll never get permission to have wind turbines that close to a residential area, IMO. Too noisy. Wind power is very unreliable so fundamentally relies on gas generation back-up at present in any case so won't be particularly 'green' regardless. Until a cost-effective energy storage technology is developed (other than hydro), renewables are only ever going to provide a fraction of our power. Now, if we tried to build the stadium in conjuction with a nuclear power station, I'd be all for that.  

Not close enough to population centres for that to happen, however.

Solar panels are mostly a waste of time in temperate regions. Very, very poor capacity factor. When the governments drop their subsidies further (as they undoubtedly will in due course), you're looking at an expensive installation which will cost a lot on upkeep with little, if any return.

Greenwashing this proposed development won't do anything but add cost and we really need to keep that to a minimum. By all means try and get sponsorship from Siemens or one of the other big wind turbine companies, but don't muck about trying to 'greenify' the development as that will do nothing but add cost.

If the energy companies could develop some way of harnessing the hot air on here after an indifferent display they would be quids in.

Quoted from Maringer

Solar panels are mostly a waste of time in temperate regions. Very, very poor capacity factor. When the governments drop their subsidies further (as they undoubtedly will in due course), you're looking at an expensive installation which will cost a lot on upkeep with little, if any return.

Fair enough, interesting that you see it as 'greenwashing' as well. I need to do a bit more reading, it's a word that's increasingly cropping up, from various critics of the approaches towards climate change. Don't really know enough about the technicalities of solar panels etc. to know if it's worth it, obviously it really isn't.

Aside from all that... I still like the idea of being able to bike/walk there traffic free. Asides from environmental factors, health and general accesibility being promoted. Whether you agree or not with this, it seems to be a major plus-points within todays planning/development climate.

Don't get me wrong, having a new stadium with all the possibilities it will bring, will be great, but as a life-saver for the club? Really? There are more questions than answers.

Currently we don't pay our way. Partly that might be down to operating in a knackered old stadium with limited non-matchday revenue opportunities. Partly it's down to poor management. Over years and years. Now a new stadium will address the first part, but I'm not convinced it will be a silver bullet for the other problems. I get all the extra revenue arguments, but what's to stop us overspending at a higher figure?

Then there's the question of what it will actually cost to build. Seen any figures? £20m?

And what will it cost to run. Any ideas?

How much will we get for BP? Best guess £1.3m going by the valuation in the Accounts. Ah, so we've got one (tentative) bit of information.

How much will the land cost?

So what's the funding gap in capital and how much will we make/lose on an ongoing basis? What will the interest payments be?

How realistic are our hopes that the funding gap will be closed? Who knows?

For all we know we could be building a white elephant which will create another millstone round our necks which will kill the club quickly rather than the slow death we appear to be facing. That's before we get on to issues about how we will get 1000s of people in and out of the site every 2 weeks. How are we going to deal with the concerns of residents, allotment holders and mourners? let's be specific about dealing with them one by one.

Faced with the opposition over the years to the two proposed sites, and the apparent lack of a robust business case, the likelihood of success seems remote. Might time and energy and resources not be better placed at dealing with problems that are within your control, rather than taking what appears to be a punt based on what appears to be nothing more than gut reactions and (understandable) emotion about an institution we all love? I think we all need to be a bit more hard-nosed about this.

We've all seen what's happened with the Winter Gardens. Against severe opposition, do you really expect the council to approve a plan that doesn't appear to have a business case? What evidence is there that the business (i.e. the club) has been effectively managed, and therefore what confidence would you have in the delivery of this project? Put cynically would you face the wrath of the NIMBYs in this situation?

Show us the numbers John and let us Get Our Facts Right then we can all get behind the plan.