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A night to think about it

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Hagrid
September 14, 2014, 10:13am Report to Moderator

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Havent posted since the end of the game, wanted to think in my head and try sum up how i feel ( sorry to those who feel this could have gone on another thread). i've supported Paul all along, like him as a man, want him to do well, but this isnt good enough, yesterdays 1st half perfomance was simply unacceptable, and the more you look at it, with jp and probably LJL injured for tuesday, can you guys honestly see us getting anything than a pasting? Paul needs to bring in 3, yes 3 strikers- ones we should have had in at the start of the season but for reasons unknown we didnt get them. if paul is still here come january he wants to be licking fentys boots to get boyce back, my god how i miss him. Yesterdays performance worried me more than any other because it shows how light we are in reserve and the apparent ease torquay scored both there goals. i feel i owe an apology to those i have slated for calling for pauls head and saying we have been unacceptable, im turning to your way of thinking. I now believe tuesday is an enormous game for our club and for paul, we were all so so excited after those 2 wins a mere few weeks ago, we now look a different team, and that lays at the feet of players and manager. Time to pull yourselves together guys and fast. UTM and morning to all!
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grimsby pete
September 14, 2014, 10:17am Report to Moderator

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Agree with the above post,

I too have had a sleep and I feel no better than I did before I went to bed.


                           Over 33 years living in Suffolk but always a mariner.
                           65 Years following the Town
                            Ian Holloway's  Black and White Army.
                                                UTMM

 
                            
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Tangerine Chris
September 14, 2014, 10:36am Report to Moderator
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As you said, our biggest problem is lack of depth in our squad.  Is that Hurst's fault?  NO It is the boards fault for cutting the budget year after year.  OK a business has to operate within its means, but if you pay peanuts, you will only get monkeys working for you.  

People are saying that on paper, we have a good squad, I do not believe that, there has been some very poor decisions on some of our signings. e.g. JPP came to us with a known dodgy hamstring.  8 games in, and he is out with a hamstring injury!  Does not take a genius to work out that would happen.

All our players are on a one year contract.  What player would give his all for a team where job security is not guaranteed? The only time they seem to play well is when the transfer window is open, and they put themselves in the "shop window" as it were.

Paul is now on very shaky ground, and fans are calling for his head, but I do not think that is the answer to our problem.  Having a revolving door in the mangers office is not good for the club.  Success does not come overnight, it takes time, and if we do not give someone enough time to build a team, then your back to square one.  I do believe that he needs help, either with a striking coach, or with another person at his side as assistant manager.


IF YOU PLAY FOR THE BADGE ON THE FRONT OF YOUR SHIRT
THEY WILL REMEMBER THE NAME ON THE BACK OF IT





You can change your wife, your house, your car, but you can never change your team.
Chairmen come and go, boards come and go, but the fans remain.
They are the one true constant

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grimsby pete
September 14, 2014, 10:43am Report to Moderator

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He has got an assistant manager.


                           Over 33 years living in Suffolk but always a mariner.
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barralad
September 14, 2014, 10:52am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Tangerine Chris
As you said, our biggest problem is lack of depth in our squad.  Is that Hurst's fault?  NO It is the boards fault for cutting the budget year after year.  OK a business has to operate within its means, but if you pay peanuts, you will only get monkeys working for you.  

People are saying that on paper, we have a good squad, I do not believe that, there has been some very poor decisions on some of our signings. e.g. JPP came to us with a known dodgy hamstring.  8 games in, and he is out with a hamstring injury!  Does not take a genius to work out that would happen.

All our players are on a one year contract.  What player would give his all for a team where job security is not guaranteed? The only time they seem to play well is when the transfer window is open, and they put themselves in the "shop window" as it were.

Paul is now on very shaky ground, and fans are calling for his head, but I do not think that is the answer to our problem.  Having a revolving door in the mangers office is not good for the club.  Success does not come overnight, it takes time, and if we do not give someone enough time to build a team, then your back to square one.  I do believe that he needs help, either with a striking coach, or with another person at his side as assistant manager.


Phew! Where to start......

If we are not to end up like the Darlingtons and Stockports of this world then we need to get a grip on our finances. I and I suspect many others do not want to be on the continual tightrope of being dependent on one man for the financial security of this club. The budget for this season once you factor in that we are no longer paying for Hearn's contract is very little different to last years. I find it impossible to reconcile your statements accepting that we have to rein ourselves in and then saying if you pay peanuts you get monkeys. I have no idea what constitutes a decent wage in our league but I'd have thought the wages are better than most of the other teams we come up against with possibly the exception of FGR and quite frankly I wouldn't want to see us go down the route they have allegedly taken.
I'd argue that one of the reasons that we are where we are financially is that in the past we gave long contracts to players who were not worthy of them-some as long as 3/4 years. One year contracts are a fact of life in the lower reaches of professional football. We benefit when players we want to sign are out of contract at their previous club. That is how it is.
As for the depth of squad-only a well off Premiership club could cope with the number of injuries we have at the moment. JPP may well have been a gamble but I'd argue-up to now it's one worth taking as he looks a different class when fit.

I agree that sacking him would do no good at the moment


I have an inferiority complex-It's not a very good one though.
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The Old Codger
September 14, 2014, 11:06am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Tangerine Chris


Paul is now on very shaky ground, and fans are calling for his head, but I do not think that is the answer to our problem. Having a revolving door in the mangers office is not good for the club.  Success does not come overnight, it takes time, and if we do not give someone enough time to build a team, then your back to square one.  I do believe that he needs help, either with a striking coach, or with another person at his side as assistant manager.


Hardly a revolving door though. He's one of the longest serving managers (albeit as part of a double act) in this league or any other.
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timmo
September 14, 2014, 11:06am Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Tangerine Chris
As you said, our biggest problem is lack of depth in our squad.  Is that Hurst's fault?  NO It is the boards fault for cutting the budget year after year.


I may be wrong however I believe JF has said there was funds available and still are.

[/quote]Having a revolving door in the mangers office is not good for the club.  Success does not come overnight, it takes time, and if we do not give someone enough time to build a team, then your back to square one.  I do believe that he needs help, either with a striking coach, or with another person at his side as assistant manager.[/quote]

Agreed about an attacking coach.
His had nearly 4years at the club and this is his team without Scott, its been going down hill since January.

I think his time has come...

Timmo
UTM


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marinerjase
September 14, 2014, 11:15am Report to Moderator

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nothing against Paul Hurst personally, but I honestly feel we won't get out this league with him at the helm. Quite simply the Conference this season is going to be harder than previous seasons, 8/9 clubs fighting for 2 spots. Hurst has an annoying way of setting up a side to combat others, rather than concentrating on how we can hurt others. At home we shouldn't be setting up worrying about others.

The changing of a system and tinkering, for no reason, has cost us and will continue to do so. Hoe many times does he need to see that 4-3-3 or whatever doesn't work, and 4-4-2 is the only way we are able to compete. Why spend all summer chasing Makreth etc and then take any width out the side? Why reintroduce Disley when Clay has done nothing wrong? Like Tuesday, when Paddy dropped to put Disley in, knowing Lincoln have physical presence up top surely you should think of cutting the supply?

having said all that, not Hurst fault that people are not concentrating, taking risks in stupid areas. Nsala needs to get back to basics and just defend, Pearson needs to step up.

won't go into reasons why but we won't ever win this league, play offs only option, and you need a winning mentality and strength of mind to get through them. That's missing from our club for 10 years or so.

Chris Hargreaves had been a manager for around or just under a year, his team yesterday had a plan, and we're better than us all over. They looked decent, and if he can produce a side to perform like that, on a lesser budget etc then why hasn't it happened here? Yes we get the odd freak result, but consistency and character, and leadership, are lacking. Yes, I still think play offs will be reached. We can win them, whether that can turns into a will is another matter. With Hurst in charge, and I know he is and will be, I'd question that can into will even more.

Anyway, let's hope the players step up, the manager changes mentality a bit and we improve, still long way to go.
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grimps
September 14, 2014, 1:01pm Report to Moderator
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Same mistakes every season , same crap football , the guys just not learned anything .
He's been here for 4 years now , if he announced at the start of his tenure here that we would still be in the same division in 4 years would anyone have wanted him as our manager ?
Woods might have improved into a decent manager given the time Hursts had , In fact even I might have  
It's time to go ,Ive been saying since last February he'snot up to it and it finally looks like its dawning on the rest of you.
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hook line and sinker
September 14, 2014, 1:33pm Report to Moderator
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I beleive we have a good enough squad here for promotion,thing is we r just not utilising n getting the best out of them and that is surely the managements fault.we need someone to come in with there own backroom staff n fire us back into the league playing football the right way attacking and on the floor.
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arryarryarry
September 14, 2014, 1:45pm Report to Moderator
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I beleive we have a good enough squad here for promotion,thing is we r just not utilising n getting the best out of them and that is surely the managements fault.we need someone to come in with there own backroom staff n fire us back into the league playing football the right way attacking and on the floor.


Whilst I despair at some of his team selections, continually making mistakes at the back and missing relatively easy chances are down to the players not being good enough, something I have been saying since the pre-season friendlies but I was continually "red crossed" for these comments.
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hook line and sinker
September 14, 2014, 2:10pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from arryarryarry


Whilst I despair at some of his team selections, continually making mistakes at the back and missing relatively easy chances are down to the players not being good enough, something I have been saying since the pre-season friendlies but I was continually "red crossed" for these comments.


regarding the forwards not scoring i agree.us the fans knew last seasons problems was not having that man to naturally put the ball in the net. It should of been our first and main priority to sign or buy someone to do this but we didnt we left it till the final few weeks of pre season and signed a player on a free transfer (to me it doesnt really fill me with of confidence for the season to come) having known this was the position that needs the boat pushing out for. As it turns out pittman seems a good player and its a shame he got injured yesterday but i still dont think he is the one who was going to lead the line and be top of the goalscoring charts come the end of the season.
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TheRonRaffertyFanClub
September 14, 2014, 2:37pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from barralad


Phew! Where to start......

If we are not to end up like the Darlingtons and Stockports of this world then we need to get a grip on our finances. I and I suspect many others do not want to be on the continual tightrope of being dependent on one man for the financial security of this club. The budget for this season once you factor in that we are no longer paying for Hearn's contract is very little different to last years. I find it impossible to reconcile your statements accepting that we have to rein ourselves in and then saying if you pay peanuts you get monkeys. I have no idea what constitutes a decent wage in our league but I'd have thought the wages are better than most of the other teams we come up against with possibly the exception of FGR and quite frankly I wouldn't want to see us go down the route they have allegedly taken.
I'd argue that one of the reasons that we are where we are financially is that in the past we gave long contracts to players who were not worthy of them-some as long as 3/4 years. One year contracts are a fact of life in the lower reaches of professional football. We benefit when players we want to sign are out of contract at their previous club. That is how it is.
As for the depth of squad-only a well off Premiership club could cope with the number of injuries we have at the moment. JPP may well have been a gamble but I'd argue-up to now it's one worth taking as he looks a different class when fit.

I agree that sacking him would do no good at the moment


All this stuff about finances for players is irrelevant to the position of the club. The side is in mid-table and likely to slide a bit further down this week. Whether the players are on one year or ten year contracts makes no difference whatsoever. A good manager would have them playing their hearts out ....... 1. for the fans who help pay their wages and 2. to get a renewed contract at a club with ambition.

The fact is that we are now heading back where we were last season. Hanging around and waiting to see if we can beg and borrow enough points to squeak into the play-offs, and that is no good. Even a play-off final is no good. The club needs promotion, not cups or trophies or runners up spots. Are we going to get it with the present management? Not a hope, whatever the playing budget.

Sacking PH in the morning would be the single best thing JF could do for all concerned. Otherwise he is condemning the supporters and the club to yet another lingering and disappointing season of lethargy because if he leaves it much longer a new manager couldn't start to do much before Christmas.

But, would JF do it anyway? No he won't. Not until it's too late for this season. Stringing it out as long as possible looks like his number one strategy. For one thing he would have to find somebody who is out of work or (heaven forbid) pay compensation. Plus a manager of the calibre we really need will cost money. That cuts the field down to people of the abilities of erm  ...... Paul Hurst! Or, we have a caretaker until the end of the season and ........... you know the rest.

Ultimately then, the budget issue is not about players, it's about the manager. We have one who was the easy and relatively cheap option but he isn't going to get us where we want to go. We have a (sort of) chairman who won't spend what's needed on another manager but will spend a bit of cash on players who won't actually get us promoted but will probably get enough points to justify keeping the manager we've got until it's late enough in the season to find an unemployed replacement.

In other words we are shafted.

See you on here,  same thread, same time, next year?



"Ah but I was so much older then, I’m younger than that now.” Bob Dylan, My Back Pages
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barralad
September 14, 2014, 4:04pm Report to Moderator
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All this stuff about finances for players is irrelevant to the position of the club. The side is in mid-table and likely to slide a bit further down this week. Whether the players are on one year or ten year contracts makes no difference whatsoever. A good manager would have them playing their hearts out ....... 1. for the fans who help pay their wages and 2. to get a renewed contract at a club with ambition.

The fact is that we are now heading back where we were last season. Hanging around and waiting to see if we can beg and borrow enough points to squeak into the play-offs, and that is no good. Even a play-off final is no good. The club needs promotion, not cups or trophies or runners up spots. Are we going to get it with the present management? Not a hope, whatever the playing budget.

Sacking PH in the morning would be the single best thing JF could do for all concerned. Otherwise he is condemning the supporters and the club to yet another lingering and disappointing season of lethargy because if he leaves it much longer a new manager couldn't start to do much before Christmas.

But, would JF do it anyway? No he won't. Not until it's too late for this season. Stringing it out as long as possible looks like his number one strategy. For one thing he would have to find somebody who is out of work or (heaven forbid) pay compensation. Plus a manager of the calibre we really need will cost money. That cuts the field down to people of the abilities of erm  ...... Paul Hurst! Or, we have a caretaker until the end of the season and ........... you know the rest.

Ultimately then, the budget issue is not about players, it's about the manager. We have one who was the easy and relatively cheap option but he isn't going to get us where we want to go. We have a (sort of) chairman who won't spend what's needed on another manager but will spend a bit of cash on players who won't actually get us promoted but will probably get enough points to justify keeping the manager we've got until it's late enough in the season to find an unemployed replacement.

In other words we are shafted.

See you on here,  same thread, same time, next year?



I wouldn't argue too much with much of that. I would point out however that the part of my post you mention was a direct response to T.C's talk about budget slashed year on year and peanuts/monkeys.


I have an inferiority complex-It's not a very good one though.
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TheRonRaffertyFanClub
September 14, 2014, 4:17pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from barralad


I wouldn't argue too much with much of that. I would point out however that the part of my post you mention was a direct response to T.C's talk about budget slashed year on year and peanuts/monkeys.


Yes I appreciate that, I was just using your post as my starting point for a rant.


"Ah but I was so much older then, I’m younger than that now.” Bob Dylan, My Back Pages
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DocTower
September 14, 2014, 6:39pm Report to Moderator
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Quoted from arryarryarry


Whilst I despair at some of his team selections, continually making mistakes at the back and missing relatively easy chances are down to the players not being good enough, something I have been saying since the pre-season friendlies but I was continually "red crossed" for these comments.


Frustrates me too , I have got red crosses to regarding my comments , but it's nice to see our constructive criticism is now being accepted and looked upon as a positive .
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ackomariner
September 14, 2014, 7:40pm Report to Moderator

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Sounds like this is all my fault because I started a thread last January stating that hurst needs to go if we didn't get promoted......well I think it's time for him to go ASAP so a new man can sort the team out and have the transfer window in January and still have a chance at promotion.

I got enough red crosses when I started the thread, so come on , now give me the green ticks  


UTM
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TownSNAFU5
September 14, 2014, 7:46pm Report to Moderator
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IF PH was sacked tomorrow, would Torquay fans say that it is the curse of losing to Torquay and quote other similar clubs?
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barralad
September 14, 2014, 8:41pm Report to Moderator
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Yes I appreciate that, I was just using your post as my starting point for a rant.


Pax....


I have an inferiority complex-It's not a very good one though.
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