A word of warning. A member of the Railservice who is rather high up in their Union has been at a national meeting today. From mid May  through to when a deal can be made. There is likely to be Industrial action across all railservices, metro/underground services, all Network rail staff and 16 rail operating companies. Just thought I would share this piece of information as I know a large number will already be plotting trains to Kings Lynn and maybe Barnet.

It may not go ahead, but I thought people would rather know then not.

Cheers mate, do you mean mid April though?

Quoted from out of town

Cheers mate, do you mean mid April though?

Yes sorry, was looking at Mays fixture before typing Dyselxia brain must of kicked in

Barnet is a 3 hour walk for me, bit of springtime sun and some tinnies sounds like a good backup plan to me.

If there is strike action it will target midweek days when commuters travel to work in large numbers. They won’t target Saturdays or Sundays.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

If there is strike action it will target midweek days when commuters travel to work in large numbers. They won’t target Saturdays or Sundays.

The RMT w*nkers are already (and have been since January) striking till June only at the weekend on the Central Line in London in connection with re-establishing the Night Tube service. They don’t give a f*ck it totally screws over us shift workers.

Quoted from Grimsby Is Not In Yorkshire

The RMT w*nkers are already (and have been since January) striking till June only at the weekend on the Central Line in London in connection with re-establishing the Night Tube service. They don’t give a f*ck it totally screws over us shift workers.

Erm…that’s the point of a strike…

Quoted from aldi_01

Erm…that’s the point of a strike…

The point of a strike is blackmail until the union gets what it wants.

Which is what, to keep their jobs & have decent conditions?

Whereas the train operators only want to make profits for shareholders.

Up the workers

Quoted from GollyGTFC

If there is strike action it will target midweek days when commuters travel to work in large numbers. They won’t target Saturdays or Sundays.

They might on the tube/TFL network. They've been threatening full closure of the Victoria Line at weekends and there are currently overnight weekend strikes going on on the Victoria and Central Line until June. Minimal disruption admittedly, but they are willing to go there.

Back on topic.
I’ll be driving to Watford on Friday. Staying in hotel Fri and Sat. Think it’s about £15 in a taxi to Barnet. So with  4,of us it’s a no brainer . As I recall though, not many pubs near the ground.😕

Quoted from Civvy at last

Back on topic.
I’ll be driving to Watford on Friday. Staying in hotel Fri and Sat. Think it’s about £15 in a taxi to Barnet. So with  4,of us it’s a no brainer . As I recall though, not many pubs near the ground.😕

good bar behind the stand mate at Barnet

Quoted from rancido

The point of a strike is blackmail until the union gets what it wants.

Get real!!! It won’t get what it wants. Unions never do.

As a bigger point - the privatisation of the railways has been a real success hasn’t it. Not.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

If there is strike action it will target midweek days when commuters travel to work in large numbers. They won’t target Saturdays or Sundays.

lmao I love it when you do these authoritative posts which are just utterly disprovable nonsense:



Anyway, solidarity with all striking RMT members. If you're not happy about the disruption then blame the managers at the Train Operating Companies. It's entirely their fault workers are having to take industrial action.

Of course it is. No worker wants to strike. Remind yourself of that. Working people are acutely short of money. Who would want to be without wages at this time?!

Employers have all the power. As one example,  in my own area of work, what happens is….unions ask for a cost of living rise in line with inflation (not a pay rise, just to ensure workers are not receiving a real terms cut). So, Union asks for (say 3.75%)….employers says no….can’t afford that….have one percent. Union tries to compromise, employer holds their ground because they know workers can’t afford to strike…..union ballots membership to assess appetite for industrial action….workforce can’t afford to and say no they don’t want to strike. Employers go ‘take it or leave it - 1%’ knowing all along they just had to hold ground as they hold all cards.  

A strike in the railway sectors is a reflection of desperation and the employer’s refusal to bargain and compromise, because they know they don’t have to.

I'm a union member in my line of work and I was balloted about striking for a better pay rise last year. I voted no not because I couldn't afford to strike but because, although my pay rise could be better, at least I've got a secure job.

My pay rise did put me in a higher pension contribution bracket though which took virtually all of my pay rise! Hopefully I live long enough to see the benefit of that.

NON FKING FOOTY YOU BORING BSTARDS.

Quoted from Grimsby Is Not In Yorkshire

The RMT w*nkers are already (and have been since January) striking till June only at the weekend on the Central Line in London in connection with re-establishing the Night Tube service. They don’t give a f*ck it totally screws over us shift workers.

It’s attitudes to collective rights like this that means France only has a 5% increase in energy costs and we have a 54% rise. As a nation we meekly accept an erosion of rights whilst others actually bother fighting for them. What a supine, servile bunch we have become.

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

It’s attitudes to collective rights like this that means France only has a 5% increase in energy costs and we have a 54% rise. As a nation we meekly accept an erosion of rights whilst others actually bother fighting for them. What a supine, servile bunch we have become.

nice  to see the mods continue the non footy theme.
What are peoples opinions on Brexit and how do we feel  COVID and the Ukrainian crisis have affected it.
Do you think Labour would have done better ?  

Quoted from Civvy at last

nice  to see the mods continue the non footy theme.
What are peoples opinions on Brexit and how do we feel  COVID and the Ukrainian crisis have affected it.
Do you think Labour would have done better ?  

Actually that's an easy one for me to answer..... YES ;)

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I'm a union member in my line of work and I was balloted about striking for a better pay rise last year. I voted no not because I couldn't afford to strike but because, although my pay rise could be better, at least I've got a secure job.

Jesus wept

Quoted from jamesgtfc

I'm a union member in my line of work and I was balloted about striking for a better pay rise last year. I voted no not because I couldn't afford to strike but because, although my pay rise could be better, at least I've got a secure job.

My pay rise did put me in a higher pension contribution bracket though which took virtually all of my pay rise! Hopefully, I live long enough to see the benefit of that.

I'm alright Jack, intercourse the rest of you.

Quoted from FishOutOfWater

Actually that's an easy one for me to answer..... YES ;)

The choice was Boris or Corbyn. Do you honestly believe Corbyn and Co would have handled Brexit, Covid and now the Ukrainian crisis any better? And don't reply with often quoted glib response "well it couldn't have been worse" because that is something you will never know. I voted Conservative , not because I am a Tory, which I am not, but because the prospect of Corbyn and the rest of his "fantasy world" dream team running the country filled me with dread for the future.

Quoted from TheRealJohnLewis

I'm alright Jack, intercourse the rest of you.

Yeah. Fancy being allowed to have your own opinion and refusing be bullied by the Unions.   Should be hanged at the very least.  Next thing he’ll be telling us is that he spends his hard earned wages on his own family instead of others.  How very dare he. Scum of the earth

Who’s the bully here, the unions in giving their members a democratic vote, or the bosses in paying people well below what they deserve and, in many cases, need to live without relying on other tax payers to plug the gap?

Quoted from rancido

The choice was Boris or Corbyn. Do you honestly believe Corbyn and Co would have handled Brexit, Covid and now the Ukrainian crisis any better? And don't reply with often quoted glib response "well it couldn't have been worse" because that is something you will never know. I voted Conservative , not because I am a Tory, which I am not, but because the prospect of Corbyn and the rest of his "fantasy world" dream team running the country filled me with dread for the future.

I've never voted Tory in my life and I never will... that doesn't make me think that Labour had the answer to all the ills in our society ( if you accept there is such a thing as society )

Johson is just a self-interested shyster who for some reason seems to have a guru like status amongst his many followers.... he's disingenuous, deceitful and imho dangerous  but hey, he's a lad isn't he?

Jeremy on the other hand ..... well he wouldn't be my first choice as a Labour leader but at least he'd have been looking out for the whole of the British public rather than just close mates in his own party. What was it that was bandied around.... for the many and not for the money. I can't argue with that

As to whether or not it couldn't have been worse if Johnson hadn't got in.... as you say, we will never know but what we do know is for the past two years under Johnson and for the previous ten under the previous Tory leaders, it's indisputable that the country has gone backwards and is unlikely to ever improve without a change away from the selfservatives selling us down the river

Quoted from rancido

I voted Conservative , not because I am a Tory, which I am not

Sorry to be the one to break it to you, but that means that's exactly what you are.

Quoted from Chrisblor

lmao I love it when you do these authoritative posts which are just utterly disprovable nonsense:

Tweet 1510495060571402241 will appear here...

Anyway, solidarity with all striking RMT members. If you're not happy about the disruption then blame the managers at the Train Operating Companies. It's entirely their fault workers are having to take industrial action.

We were talking about going south to places like Barnet & Eastleigh using the commuter network serving London weren’t we? Well I was based on the remaining fixtures. If you were planning on using TPE to get to Barnet I’d check your ticket.

TPE don’t have any exclusive routes serving and between big cities do they? So striking on a Tuesday would just mean travellers using another operator depending on their journey such as Northern, LNER, Avanti,  Cross Country etc… TPE staff don’t hold any real power to disrupt large numbers of commuters.

Even as far north as Grantham, Newark, Lincoln & Retford there are large numbers of commuters who travel down to London by train and the tactic by unions is always to target weekdays when those commuters are wanting to travel in and out of London. But unlike TPE, LNER have total exclusively on direct trains to and from London from all but one of the places I have mentioned.

If you have an interest in the all areas of the railway including industrial relations you should give Rail magazine a read. It’s very interesting. Their editor (Nigel Harris) tweets regularly and is always interesting. He can be found at @Rail

Quoted from TheRealJohnLewis

I'm alright Jack, intercourse the rest of you.

Not at all. I just didn't think a strike would be productive and alternatives weren't being considered such as working to rule, not doing overtime etc.

I've worked in the private sector and my experience is that the only way to get a pay rise is by leaving for a new job so I'm sorry my opinion on industrial action in the public sector differs from yours.

When people are being made redundant elsewhere and haven't had a pay rise for many years dragging them closer and closer to the National Minimum Wage then I think it's a bit rich for public sector workers to demand pay rises in line with inflation.

Quoted from Civvy at last

nice  to see the mods continue the non footy theme.
What are peoples opinions on Brexit and how do we feel  COVID and the Ukrainian crisis have affected it.
Do you think Labour would have done better ?  

So because I moderate on this board I’m not allowed an opinion?
And to answer your question I absolutely do think Labour or even my cat could do a better job than these lying, thieving gets. We are seeing the biggest transfer of wealth and subsequent inequality that we’ve seen for decades and it’s only the fault of the party of Government of the last 12 years and those that nod them through back into power.

Quoted from jamesgtfc

Not at all. I just didn't think a strike would be productive and alternatives weren't being considered such as working to rule, not doing overtime etc.

I've worked in the private sector and my experience is that the only way to get a pay rise is by leaving for a new job so I'm sorry my opinion on industrial action in the public sector differs from yours.

When people are being made redundant elsewhere and haven't had a pay rise for many years dragging them closer and closer to the National Minimum Wage then I think it's a bit rich for public sector workers to demand pay rises in line with inflation.

You’ve just said you couldn’t be bothered to take any action to improve your own (self-admittedly) secure, comfortable job and now you’re having a dig at public sector workers for not being content with poor pay & conditions?

It’s a race to the bottom and we’re being dragged there by selfish people like you! “I didn’t want to improve my lot, why should anyone else want to improve theirs? I’m very comfortable btw”

Quoted from rancido

The choice was Boris or Corbyn. Do you honestly believe Corbyn and Co would have handled Brexit, Covid and now the Ukrainian crisis any better? And don't reply with often quoted glib response "well it couldn't have been worse" because that is something you will never know. I voted Conservative , not because I am a Tory, which I am not, but because the prospect of Corbyn and the rest of his "fantasy world" dream team running the country filled me with dread for the future.

Mate, a f@cking leaking fridge would have done a better job of governing this country than this collection of incompetent, corrupt, dishonourable, privileged, sycophantic self-interested, lying charlatans - by far the worst government in Britain’s history. By a million miles!! Your ad hominem/whataboutery nonsense does you no credit. If I’d voted Tory, and I never would, I’d be utterly, utterly furious and ashamed. Even more than I am.

Quoted from ska face

You’ve just said you couldn’t be bothered to take any action to improve your own (self-admittedly) secure, comfortable job and now you’re having a dig at public sector workers for not being content with poor pay & conditions?

It’s a race to the bottom and we’re being dragged there by selfish people like you! “I didn’t want to improve my lot, why should anyone else want to improve theirs? I’m very comfortable btw”

If the public sector get a pay rise, the state has to fund that somehow. It's also a bit rich in my opinion for the public sector to demand huge pay rises when large sections of the private sector is on its knees and they haven't had a pay rise for years.

Do I want a better pay rise? Yes of course I do. Do I think strike action is the way to go about it? No I don't.

Quoted from chaos33

Mate, a f@cking leaking fridge would have done a better job of governing this country than this collection of incompetent, corrupt, dishonourable, privileged, sycophantic self-interested, lying charlatans - by far the worst government in Britain’s history. By a million miles!! Your ad hominem/whataboutery nonsense does you no credit. If I’d voted Tory, and I never would, I’d be utterly, utterly furious and ashamed. Even more than I am.

What he said 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

intercourse the tories. And all who vote for them

Quoted from jamesgtfc

If the public sector get a pay rise, the state has to fund that somehow. It's also a bit rich in my opinion for the public sector to demand huge pay rises when large sections of the private sector is on its knees and they haven't had a pay rise for years.

Do I want a better pay rise? Yes of course I do. Do I think strike action is the way to go about it? No I don't.

I mean, I’m mostly inclined to ignore this childish reactionary, over simplified guff….but, can you give us an example of where ‘the public sector’ (where to start…?) have ‘demanded a huge pay rise’?

Why do people think public sector workers have worse pay and conditions, had I not been TUPED into a private sector monolith therefore keeping my payscales and conditions from being employed by Govt/local authority I would be paid nearly 4kpa less/non flex hours for the same job as I do now, top managers may gain with perks/shares etc but trust me private sector at the lower levels is the min wage they can get away with. As for top politicians (all parties) just about the whole lot are in it for themselves and dont care one bit about the public they are supposed to serve. Glad I dont rely on rail very often.

How low do we have to go before people stop asking how bad it would have been under Labour? (Which is a leading question as ot suggests that this really is the best we could have hoped for..)

Quoted from jamesgtfc

If the public sector get a pay rise, the state has to fund that somehow. It's also a bit rich in my opinion for the public sector to demand huge pay rises when large sections of the private sector is on its knees and they haven't had a pay rise for years.

Do I want a better pay rise? Yes of course I do. Do I think strike action is the way to go about it? No I don't.

There you go again, blaming public sector workers for problems in the private sector having just admitted to being one of the people responsible for it!

People need to get over the idea that any increase in wages for the public sector is coming straight out of their pocket. We have some of the lowest rates of corporation tax in the developed world, a govt with the ability to create money out of thin air, the City of London is the financial centre of Europe where trillions flow in and out of transactions annually, and we are home to some of the biggest tax evaders on the planet.

Problem is, it’s far easier to punch down.

Quoted from Madeleymariner

Why do people think public sector workers have worse pay and conditions, had I not been TUPED into a private sector monolith therefore keeping my payscales and conditions from being employed by Govt/local authority I would be paid nearly 4kpa less/non flex hours for the same job as I do now, top managers may gain with perks/shares etc but trust me private sector at the lower levels is the min wage they can get away with. As for top politicians (all parties) just about the whole lot are in it for themselves and dont care one bit about the public they are supposed to serve. Glad I dont rely on rail very often.

How do you think TUPE came about? Organisations dreaming it up out of the goodness of their hearts? Or pressure from the unions?

Quoted from chaos33

I mean, I’m mostly inclined to ignore this childish reactionary, over simplified guff….but, can you give us an example of where ‘the public sector’ (where to start…?) have ‘demanded a huge pay rise’?

The unions were demanding everyone in the NHS got a £2k pay rise last year. I would consider that a huge pay rise for those in the lower bands.

Quoted from GollyGTFC

We were talking about going south to places like Barnet & Eastleigh using the commuter network serving London weren’t we? Well I was based on the remaining fixtures. If you were planning on using TPE to get to Barnet I’d check your ticket.

TPE don’t have any exclusive routes serving and between big cities do they? So striking on a Tuesday would just mean travellers using another operator depending on their journey such as Northern, LNER, Avanti,  Cross Country etc… TPE staff don’t hold any real power to disrupt large numbers of commuters.

Even as far north as Grantham, Newark, Lincoln & Retford there are large numbers of commuters who travel down to London by train and the tactic by unions is always to target weekdays when those commuters are wanting to travel in and out of London. But unlike TPE, LNER have total exclusively on direct trains to and from London from all but one of the places I have mentioned.

If you have an interest in the all areas of the railway including industrial relations you should give Rail magazine a read. It’s very interesting. Their editor (Nigel Harris) tweets regularly and is always interesting. He can be found at @Rail

Quoted from jamesgtfc

The unions were demanding everyone in the NHS got a £2k pay rise last year. I would consider that a huge pay rise for those in the lower bands.

Well you'd be wrong about that, since most NHS staff have seen their pay fall in real terms over the last decade when you take inflation into account. A £2k pay rise is the least they should be offered when you look at the wider long-term context:



Just so you know, the bosses who negotiate with unions absolutely love it when employees undermine their own bargaining power by swallowing the 'pay rises are unaffordable' argument.

Quoted from Chrisblor

Well you'd be wrong about that, since most NHS staff have seen their pay fall in real terms over the last decade when you take inflation into account. A £2k pay rise is the least they should be offered when you look at the wider long-term context:



Just so you know, the bosses who negotiate with unions absolutely love it when employees undermine their own bargaining power by swallowing the 'pay rises are unaffordable' argument.

You're talking like the private sector have inflation beating pay rises, they don't even have pay rises unless the job suddenly falls under NMW and that's my point. We were asked if we were happy with the pay rise on offer and the options we were given were:
Yes.
No and I will be happy to strike.

Should there not have been another option such as "No but I wish to consider alternatives to strike action?"

A significant number of staff only working their 37.5 hours per week and not going above and beyond is another measure that could be taken for example.

You’re the only person making any comparison with the private sector. You will note it is ONLY you doing so because it’s an utterly pointless and irrelevant comparison.

NHS staff, who the government applauded on doorsteps every Thursday night during COVID were offered f@cking 1%!!! 1% as a ‘pay rise’! Another utter con and disgrace. A huge pay cut in a life and death job as a ‘reward’. The Tories got way with that one too. Inflation was what, in 2020/21? 3% maybe?

Workers/unions don’t demand anything. They ask. It’s a negotiation. Had it actually have even been true that unions demanded a 2k pay rise for staff in the NHS, it would have actually only meant a take home amount of about £20-£30 a week in their salary. What’s that…maybe 80p an hour?!?! And the price of everything has been rising way above that for some time. I do wish people would actually think more before posting utter twaddle.

All the bull.excrement political crap spouted by all the usuals above confirms why I went self employed years ago .

Mods please move this to non footy ffs

Quoted from louth_in_the_south

All the bull.excrement political crap spouted by all the usuals above confirms why I went self employed years ago .

Mods please move this to non footy ffs

I was just about to anyway, done.

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

So because I moderate on this board I’m not allowed an opinion?
And to answer your question I absolutely do think Labour or even my cat could do a better job than these lying, thieving gets. We are seeing the biggest transfer of wealth and subsequent inequality that we’ve seen for decades and it’s only the fault of the party of Government of the last 12 years and those that nod them through back into power.

FFS, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, David Cameron, Theresa May, Boris Johnson are all bunch of proven lying girl privates.

Quoted from Civvy at last

nice  to see the mods continue the non footy theme.
What are peoples opinions on Brexit and how do we feel  COVID and the Ukrainian crisis have affected it.
Do you think Labour would have done better ?  

Well, seen as Jeremy Corbyn has basically been an EU sceptic his whole career, and Boris Johnson decided to be one when he saw an opportunity to use it as a way of getting into power, yes i imagine Labour would have done a better job with Brexit.

Corbyn's stance on Brexit divided a lot of  Labour voters. Conservative does not equal Brexit and Labour does not equal remain.

Quoted from Son of Cod

Sorry to be the one to break it to you, but that means that's exactly what you are.

Have you never heard of disillusioned or floating voters?

Quoted from arryarryarry

FFS, Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, David Cameron, Theresa May, Boris Johnson are all bunch of proven lying girl privates.

One is proving to have taken it to new levels.

Also as if to prove my point Blair and Brown have now been in Govt for 12 years now so why are we still blaming them for the failings of the nation we have seen recently?

[quote=40]

One is proving to have taken it to new levels.

Blair and Brown have now been in Govt for 12 years ) quote]

No they haven’t (thankfully).

But in answer to your earlier question. Of course as a Mod you are entitled to your opinion and to voice it on here.
But my dig was that despite me saying it was descending into non footy you still continued in a non footy vein. You eventually took action when someone else also pointed it out !!  

Quoted from ska face

You’re the only person making any comparison with the private sector. You will note it is ONLY you doing so because it’s an utterly pointless and irrelevant comparison.

The public sector get pay rises (however measly) and the private sector in my experience don't get pay rises is not an utterly pointless and irrelevant comparison.

If everyone got pay rises in line with or in excess of inflation, there is also the small matter of that pushing costs and inflation up further.

Cheers for the economics lesson.

The level of delusion in this thread is frightening.

And to keep on topic for Civvy  ::), I once biked from Kings Lynn to Clee and it took me fooking hours. All day in fact.

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

So because I moderate on this board I’m not allowed an opinion?
And to answer your question I absolutely do think Labour or even my cat could do a better job than these lying, thieving gets. We are seeing the biggest transfer of wealth and subsequent inequality that we’ve seen for decades and it’s only the fault of the party of Government of the last 12 years and those that nod them through back into power.

The best outcome would have been not having an election in Dec 2019. A first past the post election with the choice of Johnson or Corbyn was neither of these for me. After the poroging of Parliament and lieing to the Queen, I was praying for Labour MPs to break ranks and talk to people like Ken Clark and the Tory left, the Liberals, the SNP and SDLP and forming some kind of coalition. I would even have countenanced trying to bring in Sinn Fein, although that would never happen from their point of view. Dream on sadly...

I hope you’re suitably ashamed.

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

One is proving to have taken it to new levels.

Also as if to prove my point Blair and Brown have now been in Govt for 12 years now so why are we still blaming them for the failings of the nation we have seen recently?

Because Bliar and Brown changed the nation forever with social engineering, setting the ball rolling with uncontrolled immigration, attempting to destroy the union, leaving the nation bankrupt, illegal wars that have taken a generation to get over, trying to drag us deeper into the EU, changing laws to line Blairs wifes pockets, I could go on and on but we will be feeling the effects of the Blair Brown years forever.

Quoted from ginnywings

The level of delusion in this thread is frightening.

And to keep on topic for Civvy  ::), I once biked from Kings Lynn to Clee and it took me fooking hours. All day in fact.

You don’t have to stay on topic any more mate. It’s now in the non footy section.  👏 👏👏   In fact, by mentioning  footy related you are now off topic. FFS 😉

Quoted from Civvy at last

You don’t have to stay on topic any more mate. It’s now in the non footy section.  👏 👏👏   In fact, by mentioning  footy related you are now off topic. FFS 😉

That's typical of me. A dollar short and a day late.

Quoted from Azimuth

Because Bliar and Brown changed the nation forever with social engineering, setting the ball rolling with uncontrolled immigration, attempting to destroy the union, leaving the nation bankrupt, illegal wars that have taken a generation to get over, trying to drag us deeper into the EU, changing laws to line Blairs wifes pockets, I could go on and on but we will be feeling the effects of the Blair Brown years forever.

Another one perpetuating the lie that Labour bankrupted the country. Had it not been for Brown's speedy intervention not only here but around the world during the banking crisis caused by completely out of control capitalism we could have been looking at what real bankruptcy looked like.

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

One is proving to have taken it to new levels.

Also as if to prove my point Blair and Brown have now been in Govt for 12 years now so why are we still blaming them for the failings of the nation we have seen recently?

I wasn't specifically saying Blair and Brown were responsible for the current failings just pointing out that most Prime Ministers don't give a toss and will say and do anything to get voted in.

Having said that some suggest that Brexit is part of our problems but much of the vote for Brexit was based on people being drunk off with EU (specifically from Eastern Europe) immigration which was compounded by Tony Blair's decision to open the flood gates in 2004 when most of the other EU nations didn't open their borders until several years later, Germany and Austria not until 2011. His decision was clearly to hope that the majority would be low skilled low paid immigrants that would help to keep down wages in the rest of the UK.

Blair's decision also helped the rise of Nigel Farage and UKIP whose results in EU elections specifically led to David Cameron promising an EU referendum because he was shitting himself he would lose millions of votes to UKIP.

So you could say that Tony Blair's legacy is still current.

Quoted from arryarryarry

I wasn't specifically saying Blair and Brown were responsible for the current failings just pointing out that most Prime Ministers don't give a toss and will say and do anything to get voted in.

Having said that some suggest that Brexit is part of our problems but much of the vote for Brexit was based on people being drunk off with EU (specifically from Eastern Europe) immigration which was compounded by Tony Blair's decision to open the flood gates in 2004 when most of the other EU nations didn't open their borders until several years later, Germany and Austria not until 2011. His decision was clearly to hope that the majority would be low skilled low paid immigrants that would help to keep down wages in the rest of the UK.

Blair's decision also helped the rise of Nigel Farage and UKIP whose results in EU elections specifically led to David Cameron promising an EU referendum because he was shitting himself he would lose millions of votes to UKIP.

So you could say that Tony Blair's legacy is still current.

If we want to keep looking back then we’ll talk about Thatcher and her rampant desire for deregulation and privatisation.
For me around the point of immigration, it was needed and still is as we are struggling to fill roles with UK workers. Add to this our aging population, it makes sense to bring younger workers here. However it was done in such a way as those benefits were simply not explained and the flag shaggers have had a field day.
Above all this, we are in a position where national debt is spiraling out of control and was doing well before Covid. This debt is not benefitting the whole nation one little bit but those with the most are sat on the biggest gravy train ever and are being massively enabled by the most corrupt bunch of male masturbators we’ve ever had the misfortune to have in power. All the while being cheered on by 30 odd percent of the electorate who are either too thick, or selfish to care.

Quoted from barralad

Another one perpetuating the lie that Labour bankrupted the country. Had it not been for Brown's speedy intervention not only here but around the world during the banking crisis caused by completely out of control capitalism we could have been looking at what real bankruptcy looked like.

You could say it was the UK tax payers that saved us from real bankruptcy.

He also stole from UK pension savers by scrapping dividend tax credit and he was that thick he had no idea that scrapping the 10% lower income tax rate would double the tax liablilty of low paid workers. I was working in the financial side of my Company at that time listening to his budget and knew within 30 seconds that that would be the result, Brown was clueless.

And don't get me going about his "British jobs for British workers" or his downright lie about giving the UK a referendum on the  Lisbon Treaty.

Quoted from chaos33

NHS staff, who the government applauded on doorsteps every Thursday night during COVID were offered f@cking 1%!!! 1% as a ‘pay rise’! Another utter con and disgrace. A huge pay cut in a life and death job as a ‘reward’. The Tories got way with that one too. Inflation was what, in 2020/21? 3% maybe?

Workers/unions don’t demand anything. They ask. It’s a negotiation. Had it actually have even been true that unions demanded a 2k pay rise for staff in the NHS, it would have actually only meant a take home amount of about £20-£30 a week in their salary. What’s that…maybe 80p an hour?!?! And the price of everything has been rising way above that for some time. I do wish people would actually think more before posting utter twaddle.

The emails I have from Unison last year about a minimum £2k pay rise for everyone are made up then are they?

And did they find their ‘demands’ were met?

Quoted from Theimperialcoroner

If we want to keep looking back then we’ll talk about Thatcher and her rampant desire for deregulation and privatisation.
For me around the point of immigration, it was needed and still is as we are struggling to fill roles with UK workers. Add to this our aging population, it makes sense to bring younger workers here. However it was done in such a way as those benefits were simply not explained and the flag shaggers have had a field day.
Above all this, we are in a position where national debt is spiraling out of control and was doing well before Covid. This debt is not benefitting the whole nation one little bit but those with the most are sat on the biggest gravy train ever and are being massively enabled by the most corrupt bunch of male masturbators we’ve ever had the misfortune to have in power. All the while being cheered on by 30 odd percent of the electorate who are either too thick, or selfish to care.

You don't get it do you. At no point were the British electorate asked if they wanted to accept millions of Eastern European migrants that flooded many northern Towns putting pressure on housing, schools and doctors surgeries etc.

That lying illegitimate Blair said just a few thousand would come in in the first year when tens of thousands landed.

The British people had their say in EU elections when Ukip drunk the main parties, and finally had their say in the EU referendum.

‘Millions of Eastern Europeans’? Is that right?
Has brexit sorted that then? Have they all been sent back?

Can you think of any other benefits of brexit?

Farage maths again I see.

Pressure on the system has come from years of austerity, trust me, I’ve seen it first hand in my profession.

Nobody actually did complain about the legitimate immigration from Eastern Europe until the euro sceptics and flag shaggers f exuded they wanted to be a bit more racist.

Taking jobs away from English people, jobs that English people didn’t want to do…or are we going to ignore the businesses exploiting migrant workers to save a few bob?

Anyway, privatised trains are shite, costly and unreliable. Getting to Kings Lynn on the train will be a challenge…

Quoted from arryarryarry

You don't get it do you. At no point were the British electorate asked if they wanted to accept millions of Eastern European migrants that flooded many northern Towns putting pressure on housing, schools and doctors surgeries etc.

That lying illegitimate Blair said just a few thousand would come in in the first year when tens of thousands landed.

The British people had their say in EU elections when Ukip drunk the main parties, and finally had their say in the EU referendum.

You do realise that 'Eastern European migrants' are net contributors to the economy (i.e. they pay more tax in the UK and create more economic benefit than they cost in government spending on things like housing, schools and healthcare), don't you? Because surely you wouldn't want to be relying on an utterly nonsensical argument which seems entirely based on xenophobia as opposed to reality, right?

As aldi_01 has rightly pointed out above, the cause of that pressure on public services is unnecessary government austerity, not a load of mostly working age migrants, primarily doing jobs British workers don't have the skills or simply can't be arsed to do. We've got a massive load of baby boomers who in the next couple of decades are going to put an enormous strain upon this country's health and social care systems. Who, if not migrants, will wipe all their arses when their lead fumed brains have turned to mush?

And all those boomers are the only ones with loads of money, and who, in a large proportion, voted brexit and support the Conservatives.
When those boomers were growing up, houses were plentiful and affordable, jobs were secure and well paid, pensions were much better than they are today, and the cost of living was eminently manageable. When there were spikes, governments acted to ease burdens. In 1974, when there was a global oil price crisis, Labour Chancellor Dennis Healy cut VAT, increased benefits and pensions payments, subsidised essential foods, and increased taxes on incomes over £4000 (equivalent today to £44,000). This appalling collection of corrupt, dispicable and incompetent tories prefer record levels of poverty.

This is the way to travel to King's Lynn https://pelicanyutong.co.uk/coaches/tce12-electric-coach/. Enough range - recharge during the match.

Would get some points for the BCorp assessment if 1878 had the team travelling in one of these.

I think it’s worth remembering, that when governments claim that an intervention or non intervention (like raising NI contributions) is ‘all they can afford’ that this is, in fact, a lie. These are political and ideological choices. There’s money. If we were so bankrupt, and couldn’t avoid raising various taxes on working Britain, then where did the money for Ukrainian aid and supply of weapons come from? Or furlough? Down the back of the sofa?

Make no mistake - this government are ok with millions of people struggling with the cost of living. It’s no impact on them. They’re all rich and detached, and able to make these political choices without conscience.

Quoted from chaos33

I think it’s worth remembering, that when governments claim that an intervention or non intervention (like raising NI contributions) is ‘all they can afford’ that this is, in fact, a lie. These are political and ideological choices. There’s money. If we were so bankrupt, and couldn’t avoid raising various taxes on working Britain, then where did the money for Ukrainian aid and supply of weapons come from? Or furlough? Down the back of the sofa?

Make no mistake - this government are ok with millions of people struggling with the cost of living. It’s no impact on them. They’re all rich and detached, and able to make these political choices without conscience.

You're wasting your breath mate.

Despite being one of the richest nations in the world, people are happy to keep the status quo, be overworked and underpaid and just keep struggling with massive cost of living rises in the belief that the nation will somehow be alright in the future when the Brexit benefit kicks in and the Tories find it in their heart to reward us with a fair share of the wealth.

12 years of cuts, austerity and a massive shift in wealth disparity has taught them nothing.

Quoted from chaos33

I think it’s worth remembering, that when governments claim that an intervention or non intervention (like raising NI contributions) is ‘all they can afford’ that this is, in fact, a lie. These are political and ideological choices. There’s money. If we were so bankrupt, and couldn’t avoid raising various taxes on working Britain, then where did the money for Ukrainian aid and supply of weapons come from? Or furlough? Down the back of the sofa?

Make no mistake - this government are ok with millions of people struggling with the cost of living. It’s no impact on them. They’re all rich and detached, and able to make these political choices without conscience.

We can only hope and pray people have good memories next time they are in the voting booth.